Everyone knows the rule: Trust no one, never fear and never forgive

[TibetanMonkey, the Beach Cruiser Philosopher]

That's reality for two young ladies, members of 'Pussy of Riot,' the
Russian punk band that hurt the feeling of the believers. Are these
believers the same folks who believed in communism until recently? Are
believers always dangerous? Is it being a rebel dangerous?

I want to put myself through reeducation in a Buddhist Camp. Life is
the way it is. No sense in changing the world. And what's the
difference between a Buddhist Camp and a labor camp? Is it the
intensity of the labor? Is it the people? Is it the enlightenment?

Sorry, the philosopher has more questions than answers.

Pussy Riot members face tough life in penal colony

MOSCOW (AP) — It's a far cry from Stalin's gulag, but the guiding
principle of the Russian penal colony -- the destination of two
members of punk band Pussy Riot -- remains the same: isolate inmates
and wear them down through "corrective labor."

The women insisted their protest was political. But many believers
said they were deeply offended by the sight of the band members
dancing on the altar in balaclavas.

http://news.yahoo.com/pussy-riot-members-face-tough-life-penal-colony-103422387.html


---------------------------------------------------------------------

http://webspawner.com/users/BANANAREVOLUTION

[TibetanMonkey, the Beach Cruiser Philosopher]

On Oct 14, 8:20 pm, half-russian <being@.... --- -- .> wrote:

> TibetanMonkey wrote:
> >That's reality for two young ladies, members of 'Pussy of Riot,' the
> >Russian punk band that hurt the feeling of the believers. Are these
> >believers the same folks who believed in communism until recently?
>

> I don't know. I'm only half Russian.
>
> > Are believers always dangerous?
>
> What do you believe?

>
> > Is it being a rebel dangerous?
>

> Is English your second language?

Just tell me the way it should be in "Queen's English" so I can
improve upon myself.

>
> >I want to put myself through reeducation in a Buddhist Camp.
>

> Sounds like a good idea.
> You can try to improve upon the unimprovable.

That's rather improbable.

>
> > Life is the way it is.
>

> Then why try to change it?

Because you may land in prison or in the grave. But I don't care about
the grave. Eternal peace awaits there.

>
> > No sense in changing the world.
>

> Are you saying that your nonsense is nonsense?

No sense when the people themselves are the offended party. But
there's always nice people around the world.
>
> That makes sense in a strange way.

The situation in which people are offended is strange. They can't take
some criticism from some punks?

>
> > And what's the
> >difference between a Buddhist Camp and a labor camp?
>

> Does a labor camp have Buddha nature?

Why don't they teach Buddhism at the labor camp?

>
> > Is it the
> >intensity of the labor?
>

> Guess it depends on how intense one is.

I guess it is.
>
> > Is it the people?
>
> Not if they are the same people.
>
> If they are different people
> that would make a difference.

People make the jungle. Notice the title is the law of the jungle.

>
> > Is it the enlightenment?
>
> The labor camp might be more enlightening
> in various ways. Then again, perhaps not.

True. Maybe you learn to obedience instead of enlightenment. Either
way it's all about not getting in trouble. That's why the Three Wise
Monkeys are wise.

>
> Never having been to either, I really don't know.
>
> Why don't you ask around in a Buddhist Camp
> and in a labor camp? That would make more sense.

I thought some in our audience be so enlightened. You must be to a
labor camp before appreciating a Buddhist camp.

>
> Posting off-topic questions makes little sense.

Those punks in prison should worry us no matter where we are.

>
> >Sorry, the philosopher has more questions than answers.
>

> Without questions there may be no answers.

Thank you.

[Wet Paper Bag]

On Oct 15, 8:45 am, "TibetanMonkey, the Beach Cruiser Philosopher"

<thetibetanmon...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > Is English your second language?

oh... that is unique and new monkey... you know what he means... time
to listen...

> > >I want to put myself through reeducation in a Buddhist Camp.
>
> > Sounds like a good idea.
> > You can try to improve upon the unimprovable.

the way is perfect, but you are not the way. you must learn to
navigate the way as a traveler or become just a stone along the road.

> Because you may land in prison or in the grave. But I don't care about
> the grave. Eternal peace awaits there.

tut. tut. do you know that for certain? or is that some utopian dream.
seeing the word as it really is, is the foundation on which changes
can be made. seeing it not, there is nothing you can do. btw... when
you take about heave and next life nirvana bullshit, it points to the
fact that this place really really sucks and it is not getting any
better...

as for death and your certainty that it is heaven... jump... go there
now... why not?

> > That makes sense in a strange way.
>
> The situation in which people are offended is strange. They can't take
> some criticism from some punks?

perhaps it strikes deeper because it is true... being called an
asshole by and asshole is no great event, but when it comes from
someone you respect and admire it is not the same thing...politicians
have taught a whole new breed of losers that the only game here is not
whether or not you can fool some of the people some of the time... not
whether or not one is moral or corrupt... they have reduced themselves
to the saving face game...

can either of you tell me why they sit in their back rooms of Jews and
glorify themselves and demand the praise of others, brag about the
things they have done, the abuses of power and trust, celebrating
temporal victories?... and yet, show it in the open and suddenly they
crumble like children and start making excuses... pointing fingers,
playing the blame game... they are ashamed and embarrassed and will
seek to hurt you for exposing them...

if it was as nothing as they say... why do they get antsy and
defensive, need armies of police to protect them... it seems to me i
have been quite successful with the truth which inspires their
instinctive "superstitions" over the current philosophy of the month.

it is because it is truth that i am and for no other reason.

> Those punks in prison should worry us no matter where we are.

in spite of all the american propaganda we all fail to see that pussy
riot was not labor camped because of their revolutionary views, they
have been around for years and have a large and growing following,
rather, it was because they put on a show in a church...

> > >Sorry, the philosopher has more questions than answers.
>
> > Without questions there may be no answers.
>
> Thank you.

next on topic question...

where ideas enter, where thoughts are formed... same place?

[uncited]

Wet Paper Bag appeared to wonder:
> TibetanMonkey wrote:
>> uncited asked:

>>
>> > Is English your second language?
>>>

>> > ... snip ...

>>>
>> > That makes sense in a strange way.
>>
>> The situation in which people are offended is strange. They can't take
>> some criticism from some punks?
>
>perhaps it strikes deeper because it is true... being called an
>asshole by and asshole is no great event, but when it comes from
>someone you respect and admire it is not the same thing...politicians
>have taught a whole new breed of losers that the only game here is not
>whether or not you can fool some of the people some of the time... not
>whether or not one is moral or corrupt... they have reduced themselves
>to the saving face game...
>
>can either of you tell me why they sit in their back rooms of Jews and
>glorify themselves and demand the praise of others, brag about the
>things they have done, the abuses of power and trust, celebrating
>temporal victories?

I could say they are possessed
or in bondage to various spirits, principalities,
and powers in high places.

>... and yet, show it in the open and suddenly they
>crumble like children and start making excuses... pointing fingers,
>playing the blame game... they are ashamed and embarrassed and will
>seek to hurt you for exposing them...

A doctrine can be that the process is one
of out-growing behavior patterns.

Once a pattern is realized,
embarassment may lead to denial, etc.

If they are not on a spiritual path,
don't see things from those povs,
then they may continue as they are.

>if it was as nothing as they say... why do they get antsy and
>defensive, need armies of police to protect them...

Insecurity perhaps.

>it seems to me i
>have been quite successful with the truth which inspires their
>instinctive "superstitions" over the current philosophy of the month.
>
>it is because it is truth that i am and for no other reason.

You are introspective to a great degree.
Not everyone, especially politicians, are seeking
beyond the level of the 3rd chakra.

Their calling is such as it is.
Tho they touch upon the heart and mind levels,
their level tends to center on the body politic.

Tho they may reach cosmic or mystical
realms of awareness, they may be powerless
over that which binds them, such as they are.

>> Those punks in prison should worry us no matter where we are.
>
>in spite of all the american propaganda we all fail to see that pussy
>riot was not labor camped because of their revolutionary views, they
>have been around for years and have a large and growing following,
>rather, it was because they put on a show in a church...
>
>
>> > >Sorry, the philosopher has more questions than answers.
>>
>> > Without questions there may be no answers.
>>
>> Thank you.
>
>next on topic question...
>
>where ideas enter, where thoughts are formed... same place?

We appear to be on a similar wave-length.
I'd posted something along the same lines.

Hiking this morning, pondering nothing,
how when nothing goes wrong
everything might be okay.

Emptiness may be located
beyond what is left
and right.

From One arises Two.
This may be a natural process.
From Two, Three and 10k.

Water may appear as dew.
It forms where there is a differential.

Ideas and thoughts may do
something, down the stream,
merrily, as they go, after a fashion
along similar tracks, of reason.

Currents of water in water
underwater, have been known to occur.

Chopping up ideas and thoughts,
to see of what they consist,
eventually there may appear
something that is not-thought
and is no-idea.

Similar to how when water
is divided until there is only one molecule,
simply hydrogens and oxygen atoms, it then
is no longer water when divided once again.

Perhaps the skandhas, the aggregates,
are where a source can be located.

Configurations. Go figure.

I'm not sure if nothing can be wrong
even when everything is right.

Emptiness is always left
beyond right and wrong
behind the scenes,
so to speak.

Everything arises from Being
and Being from Nonbeing.

- wu/mu

[SG]

On Oct 15, 5:19 pm, uncited <being@.... --- -- .> wrote:

> Chopping up ideas and thoughts,
> to see of what they consist,
> eventually there may appear
> something that is not-thought
> and is no-idea.

Like dismantling a car made of lego blocks. It takes no time at all to
go from car to no-car.

> Similar to how when water
> is divided until there is only one molecule,
> simply hydrogens and oxygen atoms, it then
> is no longer water when divided once again.
>
> Perhaps the skandhas, the aggregates,
> are where a source can be located.

I find joy in identifying with sense perceptions such as a sound, a
touch or a taste.

> Configurations. Go figure.
>
> I'm not sure if nothing can be wrong
> even when everything is right.
>
> Emptiness is always left
> beyond right and wrong
> behind the scenes,
> so to speak.
>
> Everything arises from Being
> and Being from Nonbeing.
>
> - wu/mu

How did you figure out the truth of the last sentence? Don't be cheap
with the details, buster.

[Tim]

On Oct 15, 6:19 pm, uncited <being@.... --- -- .> wrote:

> I could say they are possessed
> or in bondage to various spirits, principalities,
> and powers in high places.

well, fuck. you heard the priest. absolution was granted to me... so
where the hell do we start the exorcisms? can i have brad wall?

> A doctrine can be that the process is one
> of out-growing behavior patterns.

the doctrine is wrong. the doctrine is formulated by first determining
the objective than manipulating the dogma to fit.

> Once a pattern is realized,
> embarassment may lead to denial, etc.

yes, child psychology. a child breaks a vase and mommy and daddy walk
in. the seem upset. they lie. the accuse the cat. the dog. the bird.
then like you said... but my favorite part are the promises... if you
get me out of this kind of stuff... and i do... and they fuck you at
the drive thru...

> If they are not on a spiritual path,
> don't see things from those povs,
> then they may continue as they are.

bullshit. now you are in denial. their core values were raped but
being weak, inferior, defective they decided to keep the chain going.
they bitch and whine and complain about how tough they had it then
while abusing others around them now. they use what happened then to
justify what they do now... so it is bullshit theatrics. doesn't wash,
what else do you have councilor?

> >if it was as nothing as they say... why do they get antsy and
> >defensive, need armies of police to protect them...
>
> Insecurity perhaps.

yeah maybe. of self knowledge. what happens when i threaten them with
the same actions that were maliciously and mercilessly applied to
their victims. not good enough councilor. next issue.

> You are introspective to a great degree.
> Not everyone, especially politicians, are seeking
> beyond the level of the 3rd chakra.

bullshit. the prying into chakras prematurely releases very intense
repressed energies that yield very specific changes.

> Their calling is such as it is.
> Tho they touch upon the heart and mind levels,
> their level tends to center on the body politic.

touch councilor? no sir. play. they play on others hearts and minds.
big difference.

> Tho they may reach cosmic or mystical
> realms of awareness, they may be powerless
> over that which binds them, such as they are.

really? you know this for certain? it seems that the shoot breaks the
shell and is released. such as it is. it is the pattern that appears
every where in nature.

<snip> non-being is awareness without object. object and consciousness
arise as one thing and you still believe that there is nothing inside.
objects do not exist in space or time. they create space and time.

get this fucking case out of my court and go find some bleeding heart
forum to post it.

[Tim]

On Oct 15, 10:11 pm, SG <sgman0...@gmail.com> wrote:

> How did you figure out the truth of the last sentence? Don't be cheap
> with the details, buster.

more details? ok... that is why i started the thread asking whether or
not if hell and the devil are superstitious nonsense then their
opposites must also be equally superstitious yes? and walking under a
ladder, safety first right... but then not walking under the ladder
would also be supersticious nonsense... because if you think no you
are not ready for this class... but you know me, a least a year ahead
in this set up...

the question then comes one of hypocrisy, the truth the binds the
snare... then i baited, just to prove i do, with the canada
investigation on cyber bullying...

the case was, a girl posted a nude picture of herself on the net which
"then" translated to her being bullied in school. she killed herself.
happened in BC...

"then" the bullying started on the ground. real life. losers who do
not know that they consent to this place then take their defeat to the
ground where they bully... get the case? if the feds break ground...
you are fucked cranbrook... and we already have our deal... you see,
all that you have taken from me, for all that i gave to you to bail
you out... and the pursuit.. well it seems to me that none of your
stuff has been touched... but look how you all reacted to the
suggestion... so, is my reaction to your stupidity, what you did real
life, real time, to people not names on a screen debating, discussing
in a forum, arguing, "philosophy" and "enlightenment"... out of line?

... and brad ready to take sask independent like that twat quebec? i
hope so because you directly are guilty, not only a street level punk,
but someone that used and abuse his position of trust bringing a whole
social network down on the head of one man who you knew was innocent
but it was about saving face... are those your children on your
facebook? i hit like to let you know i was there... i had a son
once...

you see, hypocrisy and ego are the issue... do unto others as you
would have done unto you. and it is the ego that decides what you do
willfully but not every ego maniac is an asshole, some are more like
jesus and buddha...

in other words... the more you expose my hypocrisy, the looser the
noose becomes... savvy? i am sure it has the same effect on you...

[uncited]

Truth. Hmm.

The saying is a saying.
Some old guy or guys said it.

It's akin to seeing
how all the words in this post
are found within the blank screen
upon which they are written.

Or, another way to phrase it, cans be,
all spoken words arise from sound,
and sounds emerge from silence.

I figure there is truth in that.

Figuring out the truth
might be another story in itself.
The how of a figure

- ground reversal

[uncited]

Tim <8.tim....@gmail.com> wrote:
> uncited <being@.... --- -- .> wrote:
>
>> I could say they are possessed
>> or in bondage to various spirits, principalities,
>> and powers in high places.
>
>well, fuck. you heard the priest. absolution was granted to me... so
>where the hell do we start the exorcisms? can i have brad wall?

I don't think I know brad wall.

Exorcism might seem like a plan.

Probably lots of prayerful people
are preforming their rituals. Ultimately,
adopting that paradigm, it will
be up to a Will greater than
the will of those who will
do as they will do.

Other paradigms could be invoked
to explain why the politicians are as they are.

Psychological, bio-neurological, evolutionary
genetic-selection by environments over time.

They find their niche and fill it, complete
with whatever worked for their predecessors.

That we find their behaviors insane today
doesn't mean it didn't have survival value
a million years ago.

That many find their platforms acceptable
may suggest there are many forms
of what some see as insanity.

>> A doctrine can be that the process is one
>> of out-growing behavior patterns.
>
>the doctrine is wrong. the doctrine is formulated by first determining
>the objective than manipulating the dogma to fit.

A question might have many answers.
The first one I presented simply came to mind
in response to what was asked.

Doctrines, explanations, maps and theories
tend to be limited in their range and domain.

They may be right, and they may be wrong,
each in their own ways. One may use what's right
and ignore what's left. If one so desires.

>> Once a pattern is realized,
>> embarassment may lead to denial, etc.
>
>yes, child psychology. a child breaks a vase and mommy and daddy walk
>in. the seem upset. they lie. the accuse the cat. the dog. the bird.
>then like you said... but my favorite part are the promises... if you
>get me out of this kind of stuff... and i do... and they fuck you at
>the drive thru...

To lie might have been a good thing
back a million years ago. If so, that got stuck
into their DNA and remains to this day,
according to an eco-map.

>> If they are not on a spiritual path,
>> don't see things from those povs,
>> then they may continue as they are.
>
>bullshit. now you are in denial.

You are projecting.

I'm not saying I cling to any doctrine.

It was simply a response to the question
asking why they are as they are.

> their core values were raped but
>being weak, inferior, defective they decided to keep the chain going.
>they bitch and whine and complain about how tough they had it then
>while abusing others around them now. they use what happened then to
>justify what they do now... so it is bullshit theatrics. doesn't wash,
>what else do you have councilor?

I'm not sure at present
what to present you with
at the moment.

You seem to have made up your mind,
based upon what you see as their core values ... .

Perhaps the question was rhetorical to begin with.

The present unfolds itself.

>> >if it was as nothing as they say... why do they get antsy and
>> >defensive, need armies of police to protect them...
>>
>> Insecurity perhaps.
>
>yeah maybe. of self knowledge. what happens when i threaten them with
>the same actions that were maliciously and mercilessly applied to
>their victims. not good enough councilor. next issue.

Well, before going on to the next issue,
I think you know what happens with threats
made to those who hold power. Some are taken
seriously and have consequences.

>> You are introspective to a great degree.
>> Not everyone, especially politicians, are seeking
>> beyond the level of the 3rd chakra.
>
>bullshit. the prying into chakras prematurely releases very intense
>repressed energies that yield very specific changes.

Perhaps that is what happens with politicians.
They seek power but can't handle it.

>> Their calling is such as it is.
>> Tho they touch upon the heart and mind levels,
>> their level tends to center on the body politic.
>
>touch councilor? no sir. play. they play on others hearts and minds.
>big difference.

Sure. Cuz if power is their driving motive.
They want to lead. They think they have
solutions to problems, etc. They are out to
change the world, to make it better, etc.

>> Tho they may reach cosmic or mystical
>> realms of awareness, they may be powerless
>> over that which binds them, such as they are.
>
>really? you know this for certain?

Not at all.

I try to phrase my explanations, maps,
answers, etc., with words such as "may"
and provide contingent hypotheticals
such as, "if ... then ... ."

> it seems that the shoot breaks the
>shell and is released. such as it is. it is the pattern that appears
>every where in nature.
>
><snip> non-being is awareness without object. object and consciousness
>arise as one thing and you still believe that there is nothing inside.

If there was something inside the hub
then the axle would have a problem
to begin with. It'd be a no-go.

If there was no tolerance, no emptiness
between the bearings, the wheel would bind.

From the pov of arising, ontologically,
that which is differentiated arises from
that which is undifferentiated. Yu from Wu.

From the pov of already differentiating Wu,
Wu and Yu are two sides of a coin.

I believe there are many povs.

>objects do not exist in space or time. they create space and time.

Neo-Taoists, supposedly, fathomed Tao as nothing.
As Wu. Nonbeing. As such, in their view, things
could not arise from it. Things, rather,
arise from themselves. Ziran, or tzu-jan.

>get this fucking case out of my court and go find some bleeding heart
>forum to post it.

Apparently you have things in mind
which are creating space and time
in the forum where you are at.

If you object,
that object is yours.

[Wet Paper Bag]

On Oct 16, 7:24 am, uncited <being@.... --- -- .> wrote:

> I don't think I know brad wall.

you must. he is an US american dirty oil lobbiest here in saskatchewan
posing as a premier. he will be speaking here in saskatoon today.
thinks i care. i don't take individual cases and his is already
closed.

> Exorcism might seem like a plan.

why? to feed his delusion that he is some bad ass demon? hahaha...
pencil neck geek with a price tag. things like people, province and
country mean nothing to him. in fact, recently steve (harper)... sent
up a red flag that a couple of chinese communication firms which have
a deal with sasktel are a security risk to national defense. brad told
steve to fuck off.

assassinations in canada do not take much skill. they just walk
around, cluck, cluck, cluck... chase them off the road and these
brainless birds just pop up a few feet down the road. so there is
really no thought to it very little planning needed.

<snip> probably...

> Other paradigms could be invoked
> to explain why the politicians are as they are.

stands to reason they can not all be right. do you like my hat? it
looks better on you....

> Psychological, bio-neurological, evolutionary
> genetic-selection by environments over time.

excellent point directing to the defect. i heard this morning that the
US is now going to start using drugs to force their students into
education. the doctor said... we have two choices, change the
environment or change the student... students, people, are products
now. by any standard, but i will use the egyptian negative confession
here, that is a country admitting it is too fucking stupid to compete
and it is only getting stupider, a genetic defect and in decline.

the whole idea is hilarious since it boils down to their students
figuring out that there elders are fucking losers and they will
provide the same torture in the years to come. why not give the drugs
to your teachers too? but will it really matter since your basis of
education, the laws, principles, sciences, the whole ball of wax is a
Jew. false. so they will be smarter at learning but still learning the
same old bullshit. it will only speed up the US decline.

bottom line, God's chosen people have nothing to do with religion or
culture but those Jews among us that feel they are God's gift. the so-
called elite. the bio-chemically superior based on (oddly) mere
physical attributes...but in the end, if it is God's perfect and
ultimate creations, i do not understand how they could fall so far
behind to the point where they actually need false ego building and
driven sciences to improve upon themselves... hahaha...

it is natural process and yet they seem in such a rush and no one
knows why...

> They find their niche and fill it, complete
> with whatever worked for their predecessors.

precisely why they fail just as their predecessors. and now it has
literally taken hold and become a decrepit mental, spiritual and
physical cancer with all the signs of desperation... if they can't
have it no one can...

> That we find their behaviors insane today
> doesn't mean it didn't have survival value
> a million years ago.

it didn't... those are plastic ideas not based on natural law.

> That many find their platforms acceptable
> may suggest there are many forms
> of what some see as insanity.

yes, generations of retards. excellent.

> A question might have many answers.
> The first one I presented simply came to mind
> in response to what was asked.

yes but then how many times do you get answered with something you do
not want to hear only to end up labeling it wrong and throwing it
away? you are trying to fit the truth into your paradigm and it
doesn't work that way. that is an survival response to the stimulus
that if wrong, you are fucked. it is easier to pretend in a world that
is ignorant.

> Doctrines, explanations, maps and theories
> tend to be limited in their range and domain.

i just addressed that directly above.

> They may be right, and they may be wrong,
> each in their own ways. One may use what's right
> and ignore what's left. If one so desires.

but that is not the default desire rather one that is evolved over
time and karma. you will keep telling yourself you are right until
enlightenment or death. but even now you say that is a good thing,the
inevitable end for all and thus there is no ultimate consequence for
any singular answer or action... of course another way of looking at
it is writing an exam. you put it all down and then you walk away
confident you passed. enlightenment might also mean the truth that you
failed.

> To lie might have been a good thing
> back a million years ago. If so, that got stuck
> into their DNA and remains to this day,
> according to an eco-map.

they had no motivation to lie. being closer to animals they had no
ego. simply alchemical instincts. fire it up it boils. it gets hungry
it kills, it gets tired it rests. a trait that the superior animal;
kingdom has kept in its gene pool proving its validity over time. it
would be like all the rabbits having a vote to say wolves commit
murder and thus, they are guilty and sentenced to life imprisonment...
no rabbit teeth...

> You are projecting.
>
> I'm not saying I cling to any doctrine.

no. i am not interpreting or adapting... your entire post reeks of
your doctrine. please, before you decay any further, stay on topic.

> It was simply a response to the question
> asking why they are as they are.

so then you do not ascribe to any particular doctrine just whatever
one seems convenient at the time since any two side by side disagree
on points.

> You seem to have made up your mind,
> based upon what you see as their core values ... .

blah blah blah, drop the play book will you? yes. i have drawn a
conclusion and made a judgement. guilty. sentence, massive crop
failure. you are out of the loop becasue you can not decide. you know
you are fucked and looking for the best deal and thus, like liaM, you
flip flop around like a landed fish looking for air. you will find
none here.

> Well, before going on to the next issue,
> I think you know what happens with threats
> made to those who hold power. Some are taken
> seriously and have consequences.

no i don't. show me.

> Perhaps that is what happens with politicians.
> They seek power but can't handle it.

wow. you just hooped your last statement with the next one. not such a
rare fuck up as you can imagine but i try to keep in mind your defect.

> Sure. Cuz if power is their driving motive.
> They want to lead. They think they have
> solutions to problems, etc. They are out to
> change the world, to make it better, etc.

yeah well, the solution they say is to pump their kids with drugs to
force them into compliance. where does it stop once they get what they
want?

> >really? you know this for certain?
>
> Not at all.

stick with what you know then. this sort of projecting is prone to
errors, there is no weaker link to be exploited than the seeker.

> I try to phrase my explanations, maps,
> answers, etc., with words such as "may"
> and provide contingent hypotheticals
> such as, "if ... then ... ."

if then what? if you fuck with my family, i will then bring your
cruddy Jew world to its knees and take its empty head. could have been
clearer...

> If there was something inside the hub
> then the axle would have a problem
> to begin with. It'd be a no-go.

yeah, that is exactly how it works. can you read sarcasim yet? or will
you take that statement literally? either way it suggests a complete
and utter lack of independent thinking function.

> If there was no tolerance, no emptiness
> between the bearings, the wheel would bind.
>
> From the pov of arising, ontologically,
> that which is differentiated arises from
> that which is undifferentiated. Yu from Wu.
>
> From the pov of already differentiating Wu,
> Wu and Yu are two sides of a coin.

yes, so if not walking under a ladder is superstitious, so too is
walking under one equally so. there are no opposites. and when one
side of the coin appears, the other side appears mentally only as its
potential, however it is not the reality. it is what it is and it is
heads. else what you be the point of flipping for coffee?

> I believe there are many povs.

yes. and like a defective Jew you are trying to accommodate them all
like your wheel analogy above. however, the direction heads one way of
the other be it heaven or hell. you hit the rim and get ground into
the one road or you hit the one center. not many centers. not many
rims. the greatest chance of seeking and finding the center is when
the wheel is still, else you have all the forces of nature pushing you
out... to death.

in other words, if you have not accomplished yoga concentration by
now, the days, weeks months and years to come will make it almost
impossible for you to calm down enough to release and burn off those
accumulated karmas you are holding onto more tightly than truth.

> Neo-Taoists, supposedly, fathomed Tao as nothing.
> As Wu. Nonbeing. As such, in their view, things
> could not arise from it. Things, rather,
> arise from themselves. Ziran, or tzu-jan.

yes. but he could not do so without awareness else it was just a
guess. awareness without object. object and consciousness arise
together. thus, no object. nothingness. awareness without object is
the dharma-consciousness. the mind must be developed to remain awake
and out of the body to see it.

> Apparently you have things in mind
> which are creating space and time
> in the forum where you are at.

again. you are projecting. is it hypocrisy then?

> If you object,
> that object is yours.

i do not object. what is, is... first discipline on the path... to see
the world as it really is...

in fact i think romney is the better choice since the paranoid
republicans are much easier to draw into the threat of terror and
pulling that martial law trigger which sets it all in motion...

[Wet Paper Bag]

On 16 Oct, 11:19, Wet Paper Bag <ultimate.henchman....@gmail.com>
wrote:

> why? to feed his delusion that he is some bad ass demon? hahaha...
> pencil neck geek with a price tag. things like people, province and
> country mean nothing to him. in fact, recently steve (harper)... sent
> up a red flag that a couple of chinese communication firms which have
> a deal with sasktel are a security risk to national defense. brad told
> steve to fuck off.

steve harper? oh. the leader of canada in which saskatchewan is a mere
province with... barely 2M people... well, that is obviously treason
by any countries standard.

give me some time with the rest. it is only slightly more than i can
chew.

[Wet Paper Bag]

On 16 Oct, 12:29, Wet Paper Bag <ultimate.henchman....@gmail.com>
wrote:

> give me some time with the rest. it is only slightly more than i can
> chew.

here is some dessert for when you are finished. the province of
saskatchewan, under wall, just made a deal to sell weapons grade
urainium to china. go get em' mitt... that is more evidence than you
have had in the past... and you know how china feels about the causes
of karma rather then the effect karma...

[Wet Paper Bag]

i mean let's face it. romney's comment was a shock even to me who
temporarily fell back to re-assess what may have been the perception
aimed at people such as myself who live with a label and a part of
that discrimination is being lazy.

but then having some time to think about what mitt said, shed some new
light on what i have been saying all along.

the democrats, including the sask party, are bureaucrats who employ
friends who get paid $50 up to a few hundred thousand dollars of tax
payers money a year to sit at a computer to wait for a letter to poop
out and sign. they do not even have to walk to the mailbox to send
it... someone gets paid $35,000 to pick it up from their office and
deliver it to the mail room where someone else who gets paid $50k
takes it to the post office.

in that sense, yes, it is easy to substantiate 47% of the country are
lazy fuckers who do not even do their job of relating to people
strengthening the bond people the people and their govrenment, rather,
they leave it up to the war of attrition and the fact that most
people, the other 53% can not afford to fight a traffic ticket much
less a claim of being denied entitled benefits.

now before you make another miss take mitt, the first step in that
trap of african children starving is to set up a foundation that when
the same context is applied to the children in your streets who really
have no other options but abuse leading to crime... see the mechanism?

just as the next step, albeit rosie quit, would be an explanation of
why canadian jails are full of native americans and US jails blacks...
explain it there where distance makes it easy to condemn and ignore
then apply it here and watch the reaction...

[SG]

On Oct 16, 5:57 am, uncited <being@.... --- -- .> wrote:

Thanks for responding. Do you find any truth in the biblical
assertion, "In the beginning was the word and the word was with God
and the word was God"?

[uncited]

SG wrote:

>Thanks for responding.

It was a pleasure.
Thanks for the asking.

> Do you find any truth in the biblical
>assertion, "In the beginning was the word and the word was with God
>and the word was God"?

Joseph Campbell once wrote
about how mythological truths are
deeper than factual types of truth.

The logos, principle, dao
can be seen as an essence.

There's a connotation of ground.
Another is of reason.

A term's might be full of meanings.

As far as the story goes, to begin with,
substituting various meanings for logos,
"In the beginning was the reason,
and the reason with with God
and the reason was God."

Ore, " ... ground ... "

The context however, continues.
Flesh was included, and, dwelling among us.

I find much truth in that story as wells.
Wells of the deep, abiding.

As far a paradigms may go.
As far as maps can chart.

Legends suggest
migrations of tribes. Of the Joes.
There could be many grains
of truth found. Yes.

- eye dew

[uncited]

Wet Paper Bag wrote:

> uncited wrote:
>
>> I don't think I know brad wall.
>
>you must.

Well then.

> he is an US american dirty oil lobbiest here in saskatchewan
>posing as a premier. he will be speaking here in saskatoon today.
>thinks i care. i don't take individual cases and his is already
>closed.
>
>> Exorcism might seem like a plan.
>
>why?

Because that's how some folks think.

> to feed his delusion that he is some bad ass demon?

Those who believe in the paradigm
would perform the ritual to free him
from whatever demons they discern.

Not that he is a demon
but that his behavior would suggest
that his pattern is entrenched, that he was
born into it, and is possessed by it.

><snip>

>
>> Other paradigms could be invoked
>> to explain why the politicians are as they are.
>
>stands to reason they can not all be right.

Separating what is undivided
into what is right and wrong, reason
might be a tool.

A topological map, a street map,
a weather map, and other maps
might not all be right in many ways
while not being all wrong in other ways.

> ... snip ...

>
>> A question might have many answers.
>> The first one I presented simply came to mind
>> in response to what was asked.
>
>yes but then how many times do you get answered with something you do
>not want to hear only to end up labeling it wrong and throwing it
>away?

Probably a great many.

> ... snip something about denial ...

>
>> You are projecting.
>>
>> I'm not saying I cling to any doctrine.
>
>no. i am not interpreting or adapting... your entire post reeks of
>your doctrine.

That a doctrine can be a doctrine
but is not always, The Doctrine.

Which is not to say that there is
any such doctrine as, The Doctrine.

>please, before you decay any further, stay on topic.

Not knowing where you are in this,
I'm guessing in alt.zen, what is the topic?

For me, where I'm at, it's Taoism.

>> It was simply a response to the question
>> asking why they are as they are.
>
>so then you do not ascribe to any particular doctrine just whatever
>one seems convenient at the time since any two side by side disagree
>on points.

Whatever works can be of use.

I was offerring an answer or answers
to questions you had posed.

I did not mean to suggest
that any of those responses
were some final answer on the question.

>> You seem to have made up your mind,
>> based upon what you see as their core values ... .
>
>blah blah blah, drop the play book will you?

I'm not sure what to say.

> yes. i have drawn a
>conclusion and made a judgement. guilty. sentence, massive crop
>failure. you are out of the loop becasue you can not decide.

Not being able to decide
is not the same as not deciding.

> you know
>you are fucked and looking for the best deal

I'm not looking for anything.

> and thus, like liaM, you
>flip flop around like a landed fish looking for air. you will find
>none here.

Were I a landed fish,
probably it would be water
that would quench my gills.

And getting rid of the hook
or the net.

Once the fish has landed
the net can be set aside.

>> Well, before going on to the next issue,
>> I think you know what happens with threats
>> made to those who hold power. Some are taken
>> seriously and have consequences.
>
>no i don't. show me.

I'm not sure what you're saying here.

If you go and threaten the guy you mentioned,
brad wall, just walk right up to his face and
get into it, real menacing like, you may find
what you appear to be seeking.

I really don't know tho.
Like I said, I don't think I know the guy
even though you say I must.

>> Perhaps that is what happens with politicians.
>> They seek power but can't handle it.
>
>wow. you just hooped your last statement with the next one. not such a
>rare fuck up as you can imagine but i try to keep in mind your defect.

I have no idea what you're talking about.

I think you may have snipped a passage or so.

>> Sure. Cuz if power is their driving motive.
>> They want to lead. They think they have
>> solutions to problems, etc. They are out to
>> change the world, to make it better, etc.
>
>yeah well, the solution they say is to pump their kids with drugs to
>force them into compliance. where does it stop once they get what they
>want?

I don't know. World domination?
I have no idea what you're talking about.

>> >really? you know this for certain?
>>
>> Not at all.
>
>stick with what you know then. this sort of projecting is prone to
>errors, there is no weaker link to be exploited than the seeker.
>
>> I try to phrase my explanations, maps,
>> answers, etc., with words such as "may"
>> and provide contingent hypotheticals
>> such as, "if ... then ... ."
>
>if then what?

If you go back and reread the post,
that was prior to what you snipped out,
and look for all the if-then statements
then you may see what I meant.

> if you fuck with my family, i will then bring your
>cruddy Jew world to its knees and take its empty head. could have been
>clearer...

I have no idea what you're talking about.

You appear to be of the mind that Jews
are to blame for something, the world,
all or some of what you see as problems.

>> If there was something inside the hub
>> then the axle would have a problem
>> to begin with. It'd be a no-go.
>
>yeah, that is exactly how it works. can you read sarcasim yet? or will
>you take that statement literally? either way it suggests a complete
>and utter lack of independent thinking function.

I have no idea what your point is.

I had responded to a question you'd asked.
Perhaps you weren't asking what I'd thought.
Or, maybe your mind changed somewhen
between the lines I can't read.

>> If there was no tolerance, no emptiness
>> between the bearings, the wheel would bind.
>>
>> From the pov of arising, ontologically,
>> that which is differentiated arises from
>> that which is undifferentiated. Yu from Wu.
>>
>> From the pov of already differentiating Wu,
>> Wu and Yu are two sides of a coin.
>
>yes, so if not walking under a ladder is superstitious, so too is
>walking under one equally so. there are no opposites. and when one
>side of the coin appears, the other side appears mentally only as its
>potential, however it is not the reality. it is what it is and it is
>heads. else what you be the point of flipping for coffee?

A mirror can reveal much.
Both sides can be seen in one.

>> I believe there are many povs.
>
>yes. and like a defective Jew you are trying to accommodate them all
>like your wheel analogy above.

I don't know about what appears to be
an obsession with Jews.

My responses to your questions
were simply possible reasons why
things might be as they are.

If you think it's all the Jews
then that's maybe your doctrine.

If the map makes sense,
if your paradigm works for you,
then that can be your faith, your view
of how the world is.

> however, the direction heads one way of
>the other be it heaven or hell. you hit the rim and get ground into
>the one road or you hit the one center. not many centers. not many
>rims. the greatest chance of seeking and finding the center is when
>the wheel is still, else you have all the forces of nature pushing you
>out... to death.

The Zone is Way cool. For sure.

>in other words, if you have not accomplished yoga concentration by
>now, the days, weeks months and years to come will make it almost
>impossible for you to calm down enough to release and burn off those
>accumulated karmas you are holding onto more tightly than truth.

Sounds bleak.

>> Neo-Taoists, supposedly, fathomed Tao as nothing.
>> As Wu. Nonbeing. As such, in their view, things
>> could not arise from it. Things, rather,
>> arise from themselves. Ziran, or tzu-jan.
>
>yes. but he could not do so without awareness else it was just a
>guess. awareness without object. object and consciousness arise
>together. thus, no object. nothingness. awareness without object is
>the dharma-consciousness. the mind must be developed to remain awake
>and out of the body to see it.
>
>
>> Apparently you have things in mind
>> which are creating space and time
>> in the forum where you are at.
>
>again. you are projecting. is it hypocrisy then?

Probably.
Definitely possible.
But, I don't know what it is
that you are referring to.

Something about objects
creating space and time.

>> If you object,
>> that object is yours.
>
>i do not object.

You snipped out a passage.

Basically, you snipped what you said
and responded to what I said
which left a great deal unsaid
about what you said.

> what is, is... first discipline on the path... to see
>the world as it really is...

As if it is.

To think one's perception, what one sees,
can be as the world really is, is a thought.

[Tim]

> As if it is.
>
> To think one's perception, what one sees,
> can be as the world really is, is a thought.

buddha dharma ...

i am not in my eyes.

[Tim]

On Oct 16, 1:56 pm, SG <sgman0...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > - ground reversal
>
> Thanks for responding. Do you find any truth in the biblical
> assertion, "In the beginning was the word and the word was with God
> and the word was God"?

before moses? yes. plenty of assertions.

[Tim]

i invited brad wall and his staff here for a fight. they have been
here as a part of the second part of the federal investigation into
cyber bullying. you must be aware of the problem by now being that you
are a part of its prestigious history.

[Tim]

me and my side kick atch. we want a hotel out at the casino.

[Wet Paper Bag]

> me and my side kick atch. we want a hotel out at the casino.

i think we would be willing to consider a modern american made
franchise in exchange for some additional consideration to the lots
assigned for that building downtown. obviously for one we would have
to insure that all local buildings and renovation be handled downtown
while, for expediences sake, a faster american build at the casino.

[Tim]

On Oct 16, 11:30 pm, Wet Paper Bag <ultimate.henchman....@gmail.com>
wrote:

fuck. now i am going to have to insist. i said no negotiating.

there are a particular form of attractive art along the sides of those
buildings dt. the tees and peerse is but one examples... well, oh
yeah ... the ones harley painted over...? that would be an awesome
inner city revitalization project.

[Tim]

and donnie says... the angels get security from hub to the casino.

[uncited]

Tim wrote:
> Tim wrote:

>> uncited wrote:
>
>> > As if it is.
>>
>> > To think one's perception, what one sees,
>> > can be as the world really is, is a thought.
>>
>> buddha dharma ...

Buddha dharma, as jargon,
is unfamiliar to me. Is it written in stone?

Maybe it's to be found on the Net.
Written in vitual ink. So to speak.

Buddha dharma,
is that how the world really is,
in your view?

Or is that some dogma?
Hmm. Now curiosity is involved.

>> i am not in my eyes.

My impression is that one is a coagulation.

That was the doctrine. It was an anti-thesis
to the Hindu, permanent-self, doctrine
which got folks caught up in the Wheel of 84.

Without a permanent self, there is nothing,
no one, to be reincarnated. A freedom results.

Where Hinduism bogged down, as do many
philosophies and religions, a reformer appeared.

A product of any number of factors. Take five
for instance. That may have been a common
denominator between Buddhism and Daoism.

Not sure tho.
This brain tends to forget.

Skandhas and five-element theory
might only be stretched so far.

Dao are dao, yet none are Chang Dao.
Chang Dao may or may not be said to be.
Depends on the pov.

To assert that the world really is xyz
is an assertion. It could be an axiom.
A premise. A presupposition. As one
may choose, think, or wish it to be.

>i invited brad wall and his staff here for a fight.

Where is here? Alt.zen? Absfg?
A physical town where you reside?

> they have been
>here as a part of the second part of the federal investigation into
>cyber bullying.

Those parts are unfamiliar to me.
Mostly there is a touch I am out of.

> you must be aware of the problem by now being that you
>are a part of its prestigious history.

There was a problem, back a while a go.
Cat got the best of rick tho
and it's not been the same here since.

She basically bullied the bully.
Told his wife and his job on him.

I'm not aware of any problem now
in particular. Altho, probably I tend to be
a bully of sorts. Sorting thru the sorts
of the likes of the Monkey-dude.

This being unmoderated Usenet however,
a bit of banter is natural for trolls to elicit.
That is often a spirit about them. Flames
are what the Monkey-dude wanted
when once asked about it.

He'd said if he didn't provoke people
then they'd not respond to him.
Perhaps he craves attention.

Maybe that's his dharma.
His law of his own jungle
he found in his head
written while in stone.

[TibetanMonkey, the Beach Cruiser Philosopher]

MAKING NOISE IS THE STRATEGY...

http://mybignoise.blogspot.com/2007/08/solidarity-law-of-jungle.html

SOLIDARITY IS THE NEW LAW OF THE JUNGLE!

[Wet Paper Bag]

On Oct 17, 7:42 am, uncited <being@.... --- -- .> wrote:

> Buddha dharma, as jargon,
> is unfamiliar to me. Is it written in stone?

it is a book.

> Maybe it's to be found on the Net.
> Written in vitual ink. So to speak.

yes. it was written a few years back. got posted around but mostly
ignored.

> Buddha dharma,
> is that how the world really is,
> in your view?
>
> Or is that some dogma?
> Hmm. Now curiosity is involved.
>
> >> i am not in my eyes.
>
> My impression is that one is a coagulation.

is that how the world really is,

in your view? or is that some dogma?

> That was the doctrine. It was an anti-thesis
> to the Hindu, permanent-self, doctrine
> which got folks caught up in the Wheel of 84.
>
> Without a permanent self, there is nothing,
> no one, to be reincarnated. A freedom results.

let me know when you find it. in fact, why not find it now?

> Where Hinduism bogged down, as do many
> philosophies and religions, a reformer appeared.

a yes. a reformer. let's see if he found anything new... without the
introduction of something old. did you know that everything you know
someone has told you? but of course you don't see it that way.

> A product of any number of factors. Take five
> for instance. That may have been a common
> denominator between Buddhism and Daoism.

is that how the world really is,

in your view? or is that some dogma?

> Not sure tho.
> This brain tends to forget.

yes. that is one of those funny human tricks that is so adorable. how
they forget. makes this bait rather special. yup. my lucky bait.

> Skandhas and five-element theory
> might only be stretched so far.
>
> Dao are dao, yet none are Chang Dao.
> Chang Dao may or may not be said to be.
> Depends on the pov.

is that how the world really is,

in your view? or is that some dogma?

> To assert that the world really is xyz
> is an assertion. It could be an axiom.
> A premise. A presupposition. As one
> may choose, think, or wish it to be.

is that how the world really is,

in your view? or is that some dogma?

> Where is here? Alt.zen? Absfg?
> A physical town where you reside?

where is this happening? you must accept that there is no other way.

> > they have been
> >here as a part of the second part of the federal investigation into
> >cyber bullying.
>
> Those parts are unfamiliar to me.
> Mostly there is a touch I am out of.

i know. it is what has kept you blind and stupid while nourishing
your illusion of hipness.

> > you must be aware of the problem by now being that you
> >are a part of its prestigious history.
>
> There was a problem, back a while a go.
> Cat got the best of rick tho
> and it's not been the same here since.

yes. i was there. they day rick crashed and confessed my name. he went
no where. he was one of the few who could change. but let us not lose
focus here...

> She basically bullied the bully.
> Told his wife and his job on him.
>
> I'm not aware of any problem now
> in particular. Altho, probably I tend to be
> a bully of sorts. Sorting thru the sorts
> of the likes of the Monkey-dude.

mmm... i love how this snare works. my banana is getting green.

> This being unmoderated Usenet however,
> a bit of banter is natural for trolls to elicit.
> That is often a spirit about them. Flames
> are what the Monkey-dude wanted
> when once asked about it.

really? i never got that impression. flames are flames but correction
is correction. you take it personally or you don't. the not taking it
personally seems to be the point of the ego and its restraint. the
removal of triggers be they words or feelings is one method of
instruction, the method that seems to work best here... well, not
really here, where is here... you see? who is typing else, how else
does it appear no where? fucking loser.

> He'd said if he didn't provoke people
> then they'd not respond to him.
> Perhaps he craves attention.

perhaps he does. or perhaps, like you, he thought he had it all tied
up.

> Maybe that's his dharma.
> His law of his own jungle
> he found in his head
> written while in stone.

tsk. tsk... i had hope for you but alas old chap, i think you can see
now for yourself there is none. falling back into what got you killed
because... alas, you forgot. what is that now... three days content
and debate... not bad but not really an improvement. things are
getting worse. come back when you think something up all on your own.

Jesus Christ

[uncited]

Wet Paper Bag <ultimate.h...@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Oct 17, 7:42 am, uncited <being@.... --- -- .> wrote:
>
>> Buddha dharma, as jargon,
>> is unfamiliar to me. Is it written in stone?
>
>it is a book.
>
>> Maybe it's to be found on the Net.
>> Written in vitual ink. So to speak.
>
>yes. it was written a few years back. got posted around but mostly
>ignored.

I'm hoping to search for it
and take a look inside.

>> Buddha dharma,
>> is that how the world really is,
>> in your view?
>>
>> Or is that some dogma?
>> Hmm. Now curiosity is involved.
>>
>> >> i am not in my eyes.
>>
>> My impression is that one is a coagulation.
>
>is that how the world really is,
>in your view? or is that some dogma?

It was my impression about the no-self doctrine.

I don't imagine a Buddha would cling to it tho.

>> That was the doctrine. It was an anti-thesis
>> to the Hindu, permanent-self, doctrine
>> which got folks caught up in the Wheel of 84.
>>
>> Without a permanent self, there is nothing,
>> no one, to be reincarnated. A freedom results.
>
>let me know when you find it. in fact, why not find it now?

Find what now?
Maybe if I knew what you were referring to.

You mean, the no-self doctrine?
I might be able to google it, if you'd like.

>> Where Hinduism bogged down, as do many
>> philosophies and religions, a reformer appeared.
>
>a yes. a reformer. let's see if he found anything new... without the
>introduction of something old. did you know that everything you know
>someone has told you?

I don't know. Epistemology cans
be an interesting thing two knows about.

> but of course you don't see it that way.

A thought about infinite stupidity
and how it arises with infinite wisdom
arose within, earlier today.

I don't recall anyone ever telling me exactly that
but it certainly isn't altogether original
if that's what you mean.

How do I know they arise mutually?
I suppose it's an obvious type of knowledge.

The Tao Te Ching may articulate or suggest
such a form of knowing, of realizing how things are.

It's an interesting question.
How could I know? Fun quest-ion. Thanks!

>> A product of any number of factors. Take five
>> for instance. That may have been a common
>> denominator between Buddhism and Daoism.
>
>is that how the world really is,
>in your view? or is that some dogma?

My impression was it was way of seeing things.
If not a doctrine, perhaps a theory. Five elements.
Five aggregates.

The world, seams to me, appears.

How it appears, from being a large sphere,
to being a pale blue dot, to being flat, or
in some other fashion, is how it appears.

To think it really is, would be a thought.

To imagine I can conceive of the world
in all of its diverse radiances, ultra-violets,
infra-reds, visual, auditory, tactile, etc., as it is
sensed by all the many organisms sensing it,
as well as beyond any of those perceptions,
tends to be outside my scope, not contained
within my imagination.

The world as it really is,
assuming it really is, in some way,
or in many or all ways,
would be unimaginable to me.

In my view, such assumptions,
or presumptions, are more of an assertion, or
assumption or presumption, made
for whatever reason or reasons it is made.

In this case, in response to posts.

>> Not sure tho.
>> This brain tends to forget.
>
>yes. that is one of those funny human tricks that is so adorable. how
>they forget. makes this bait rather special. yup. my lucky bait.
>
>> Skandhas and five-element theory
>> might only be stretched so far.
>>
>> Dao are dao, yet none are Chang Dao.
>> Chang Dao may or may not be said to be.
>> Depends on the pov.
>
>is that how the world really is,
>in your view? or is that some dogma?

Those would be interpretations
of what the "topic" of the newsgroup
might have something to do width
at length and in depth.

Poetry, for me, has its own forms
of intrinsic motivation, providing layers
upon layers and lines upon lines of
interpretations, as plays
on words may go
without going.

>> To assert that the world really is xyz
>> is an assertion. It could be an axiom.
>> A premise. A presupposition. As one
>> may choose, think, or wish it to be.
>
>is that how the world really is,
>in your view? or is that some dogma?

I'd say it's a view, and can be my view.

To think the world really is xyz,
or that a view is always a view,
tends to be a thought.

It could become dogma
if one wanted to be dogmatic.

>> Where is here? Alt.zen? Absfg?
>> A physical town where you reside?
>
>where is this happening?

For me, over here.
For you, over there.
For me, now.
For you, now.

Are they all the same?
If so stipulated.

Are they all different?
That can be a way
to see things
as they appear
to appear.

> you must accept that there is no other way.

I can accept that,
using a rear-view mirror view.

By adopting a cause-effect paradigm,
determinism rules the haps.

I'm not sure if I must, why I must.

Being able to and needing to
can be two types of to also.

Prepositions may pre-
position one in a sentence
consisting of words made up
for a spell, prehaps.

Words. Fun toys.
Valuable tools.
Some make sense.
Some comprise nonsense.

>> > they have been
>> >here as a part of the second part of the federal investigation into
>> >cyber bullying.
>>
>> Those parts are unfamiliar to me.
>> Mostly there is a touch I am out of.
>
> i know. it is what has kept you blind and stupid while nourishing
>your illusion of hipness.

I always wondered what kept me blind and stupid.
While nourishing my illusion of hipness.
Now I know! Aye has been
sew t'old.

>> > you must be aware of the problem by now being that you
>> >are a part of its prestigious history.
>>
>> There was a problem, back a while a go.
>> Cat got the best of rick tho
>> and it's not been the same here since.
>
>yes. i was there. they day rick crashed and confessed my name. he went
>no where. he was one of the few who could change. but let us not lose
>focus here...

Uh. Okay.
Maybe if the little wheel
that adjusts the magnification power
is turned a bit, what's on the slide
will return into view.

That would be magnificent.
One of seven, or nine, may be.

>> She basically bullied the bully.
>> Told his wife and his job on him.
>>
>> I'm not aware of any problem now
>> in particular. Altho, probably I tend to be
>> a bully of sorts. Sorting thru the sorts
>> of the likes of the Monkey-dude.
>
>mmm... i love how this snare works. my banana is getting green.
>
>> This being unmoderated Usenet however,
>> a bit of banter is natural for trolls to elicit.
>> That is often a spirit about them. Flames
>> are what the Monkey-dude wanted
>> when once asked about it.
>
>really?

That was my impression.

> i never got that impression.

Okay.

> flames are flames but correction
>is correction. you take it personally or you don't.

I don't think he stands corrected
nor corrected, altho he says he is all
about correction and correcting things.

He appears, to me, to complain a lot.
I like to complain too. About him complaining.
It's a Way-cool feed-back loop. Sorta.

> the not taking it
>personally seems to be the point of the ego and its restraint. the
>removal of triggers be they words or feelings is one method of
>instruction, the method that seems to work best here... well, not
>really here, where is here... you see?

Alt.zen?

> who is typing else,

Well. You were, and I am, or was.

> how else
>does it appear no where? fucking loser.

I don't understand what you're saying.

Of course, words appear on your screen,
assuming all goes well, when you type them.

Your here, over there, where you were,
and maybe now are again, may be, for you,
without any ego, or with triggers, or some other
white horses, so to speak.

>> He'd said if he didn't provoke people
>> then they'd not respond to him.
>> Perhaps he craves attention.
>
>perhaps he does. or perhaps, like you, he thought he had it all tied
>up.

A method can be to untie.
A solution may dissolve
matters that matter.

Such a way might be a Tao.
It could be useful, but not always.

>> Maybe that's his dharma.
>> His law of his own jungle
>> he found in his head
>> written while in stone.
>
>tsk. tsk... i had hope for you but alas old chap, i think you can see
>now for yourself there is none.

That could be good.
Or of no value.

Without hope
all may be lost.

When all is lost
nothing is left.

That sounds about right.

Nothing, for me, is great!
Nothing to do. Nowhere to go.
Perfect. Awesome. Fantastic.

It's kinda like, if not exactly
the same as Tao.

Usually it doesn't last very long tho.
There's always something.

> falling back into what got you killed
>because... alas, you forgot. what is that now... three days content
>and debate... not bad but not really an improvement. things are
>getting worse. come back when you think something up all on your own.
>
>Jesus Christ

Normally I tend to post responses
when folks have questions in their
responses to my responses.

If something original originates
from this point of origin
I'll try to remember to include it.

[Wet Paper Bag]

On Oct 17, 4:44 pm, uncited <being@.... --- -- .> wrote:

> I'm hoping to search for it
> and take a look inside.

not worth the look. it was a series that pavestone wrote on a side bar
with a few of us.

> >is that how the world really is,
> >in your view? or is that some dogma?
>
> It was my impression about the no-self doctrine.

oh. so you are an artist now.

> I don't imagine a Buddha would cling to it tho.

that is not the point but inside the point. what if the fulfillment
meant that i use to ego to be arrogant about compassion? proud that i
strive to the highest ideals for all mankind. angry to accept that
some people are not going to make it. some people i am going to miss
and sorrow.

> Find what now?
> Maybe if I knew what you were referring to.

nothing you would understand.

> You mean, the no-self doctrine?
> I might be able to google it, if you'd like.

dig in.

> I don't know. Epistemology cans
> be an interesting thing two knows about.
>
> > but of course you don't see it that way.


> A thought about infinite stupidity
> and how it arises with infinite wisdom
> arose within, earlier today.


> I don't recall anyone ever telling me exactly that
> but it certainly isn't altogether original
> if that's what you mean.

it doesn't have to be original. just different. it weeds out petty
disputes later while breaking the ice... for the patient. new ground.

> How do I know they arise mutually?
> I suppose it's an obvious type of knowledge.

close your eyes. red what? can you see it?

>
> The Tao Te Ching may articulate or suggest
> such a form of knowing, of realizing how things are.

naw. not that way.

> The world, seams to me, appears.

this way. how do you know it is a world? do you have a point? was the
world that it might be always there before? seams to me a pizza.

>
> How it appears, from being a large sphere,
> to being a pale blue dot, to being flat, or
> in some other fashion, is how it appears.

you might not know what a God is human, but you do know what jumping
and falling is don't you.

>
> To think it really is, would be a thought.

no, no, no... not just to think my friend... a special offer. right
now.

> >Jesus Christ
>
> Normally I tend to post responses
> when folks have questions in their
> responses to my responses.

what could we possibly be questioning? don't we all see the same
ching?

> If something original originates
> from this point of origin
> I'll try to remember to include it.

hope you do not need help with that originality. you might have to
tell someone about it.

after all, since there is no you, some told you... do you need more
time to say you?

[uncited]

Wet Paper Bag <ultimate.h...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Oct 17, 4:44 pm, uncited <being@.... --- -- .> wrote:
>
>> I'm hoping to search for it
>> and take a look inside.
>
>not worth the look. it was a series that pavestone wrote on a side bar
>with a few of us.

Cool.
Haven't heard of Jack for a while.

>> >is that how the world really is,
>> >in your view? or is that some dogma?
>>
>> It was my impression about the no-self doctrine.
>
>oh. so you are an artist now.

When else mites be One?

>> I don't imagine a Buddha would cling to it tho.
>
>that is not the point but inside the point. what if the fulfillment
>meant that i use to ego to be arrogant about compassion? proud that i
>strive to the highest ideals for all mankind. angry to accept that
>some people are not going to make it. some people i am going to miss
>and sorrow.

If that's where you're at
then that would be your path.

As I understand Buddhism, it's a process.

>> Find what now?
>> Maybe if I knew what you were referring to.
>
>nothing you would understand.
>
>> You mean, the no-self doctrine?
>> I might be able to google it, if you'd like.
>
>dig in.
>
>> I don't know. Epistemology cans
>> be an interesting thing two knows about.
>>
>> > but of course you don't see it that way.
>
>
>> A thought about infinite stupidity
>> and how it arises with infinite wisdom
>> arose within, earlier today.
>
>
>> I don't recall anyone ever telling me exactly that
>> but it certainly isn't altogether original
>> if that's what you mean.
>
>
>it doesn't have to be original. just different. it weeds out petty
>disputes later while breaking the ice... for the patient. new ground.
>
>
>> How do I know they arise mutually?
>> I suppose it's an obvious type of knowledge.
>
>close your eyes. red what? can you see it?

See red?
Sort of. I can envision colour.

>> The Tao Te Ching may articulate or suggest
>> such a form of knowing, of realizing how things are.
>
>naw. not that way.
>
>
>> The world, seams to me, appears.
>
>this way. how do you know it is a world?

World is a word.
Words have meanings.
When using the term, world,
I know what I mean by the word's meaning.

> do you have a point?

Nothing in particular.
Mostly it's contextual.

> was the
>world that it might be always there before? seams to me a pizza.

All of, "the world"
would be in a sense, hypothetical.

The world that might be
might have been there before.
Or not. Depending on what one means.

>> How it appears, from being a large sphere,
>> to being a pale blue dot, to being flat, or
>> in some other fashion, is how it appears.
>
>you might not know what a God is human, but you do know what jumping
>and falling is don't you.

I have fallen even without jumping.
Running has been my downfall before.
I do know what jumping is.
I do know what falling is. Yes.

>> To think it really is, would be a thought.
>
>
>no, no, no... not just to think my friend... a special offer. right
>now.
>
>
>> >Jesus Christ
>>
>> Normally I tend to post responses
>> when folks have questions in their
>> responses to my responses.
>
>what could we possibly be questioning?

Anything we care to.
I've forgotten how this began.
Probably a Monkey cross-post of sum sorts.

>don't we all see the same ching?

I'd say we don't all see the same sacred text.
We all see the same one thru our own eyes,
filtered thru our own experiences. What suit
cases we wear determines the spacial cases.

>> If something original originates
>> from this point of origin
>> I'll try to remember to include it.
>
>hope you do not need help with that originality. you might have to
>tell someone about it.
>
>after all, since there is no you, some told you... do you need more
>time to say you?

There being no permanent me
does not entail there being no temporary files.

There are many which think of themselves as me.
The one before the first drink. The one after.
The one at night. The one upon awakening.

Ones are able to be ones
None may be the One

[Tim]

On 18 Oct, 07:40, uncited <being@.... --- -- .> wrote:

<snipped for its original content.>

> Ones are able to be ones
> None may be the One

awareness without object and consciousness is in everything. we are
all that. and each other.

when you see a red fire truck, do you think of the same thing i do...

or only most of the time?

is that one-ness?

where was the awareness?

last thought.

[uncited]

Tim wrote:

> uncited wrote:
>
><snipped for its original content.>
>
>> Ones are able to be ones
>> None may be the One
>
>awareness without object and consciousness is in everything. we are
>all that. and each other.
>
>when you see a red fire truck, do you think of the same thing i do...

In some ways, probably.
In other ways, probably not.

>or only most of the time?

Probably.

>is that one-ness?

If I'm thinking about it,
it's most likely three-ness at least
and more than likely a many-ness
of greater than three.

>where was the awareness?

In the perceptions and the thoughts.

>last thought.

To be aware
without being aware of being aware
might be how and what consciousness is
prior to reflecting.

When second-nature is congruent
with whatever is being done,
then what is being done
may be done without doing.

[linuxgal]

SG wrote:
> On Oct 15, 5:19 pm, uncited <being@.... --- -- .> wrote:
>
>> Chopping up ideas and thoughts,
>> to see of what they consist,
>> eventually there may appear
>> something that is not-thought
>> and is no-idea.
>
> Like dismantling a car made of lego blocks. It takes no time at all to
> go from car to no-car.
>

Still, we say the car "passed on" to avoid offending sensibilities.

--
Monopolistic Ignominious Corporation Resolute On Squeezing Out Fair Trade

[uncited]

linuxgal wrote:
> SG wrote:

>> uncited wrote:
>>
>>> Chopping up ideas and thoughts,
>>> to see of what they consist,
>>> eventually there may appear
>>> something that is not-thought
>>> and is no-idea.
>>
>> Like dismantling a car made of lego blocks. It takes no time at all to
>> go from car to no-car.
>>
>
>Still, we say the car "passed on" to avoid offending sensibilities.

Reminds me of Zz's wife.

Except the lego car was more
of a white horse kinda fabrication.

Were an atom of gold to be divided
what remains would no longer be gold.

.................

'When Chuang Tzu’s wife died, his friend Hui Tzu came to offer his
condolences and found Chuang Tzu hunkered down, drumming on a potter
pan and singing.

Hui Tzu said, “You lived with her, raised children with her, and grew
old together. Even weeping is not enough, but now you are drumming and
singing. Is it a bit too much?”
Chuang Tzu said, “That is not how it is. When she just
died, how could I not feel grief? But I looked deeply into it and saw
that she was lifeless before she was born. She was also formless and
there was not any energy. Somewhere in the vast imperceptible universe
there was a change, an infusion of energy, and then she was born into
form, and into life. Now the form has changed again, and she is dead.
Such death and life are like the natural cycle of the four seasons. My
dead wife is now resting between heaven and earth. If I wail at the
top of my voice to express my grief, it would certainly show a failure
to understand what is fated. Therefore I stopped.” (Chapter 18)'

..........

Metaphorically Zz's wife was golden.
She was stardust. Still, she is.

In a garden of ideas
many seeds of thought may take root.
Some have thorns. Some are creepy,
like little kitten feet in a fog.

[linuxgal]

uncited wrote:

> Were an atom of gold to be divided
> what remains would no longer be gold.

Even before that, when you had just one atom of gold, it wouldn't be
gold as you know it. And your girlfriend would kill you if you tried to
give it to her.

[uncited]

linuxgal wrote:
> uncited wrote:
>
>> Were an atom of gold to be divided
>> what remains would no longer be gold.
>
>Even before that, when you had just one atom of gold, it wouldn't be
>gold as you know it. And your girlfriend would kill you if you tried to
>give it to her.

And then my wife would kill me.

And then they would both torture me.

Good thing I don't have either,
a gold atom nor a girlfriend.

- whew