Questions for everyone is alt.os.development
prizark
Some questions for everyone in the alt.os.development group
1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
own Operating System.
2.If you are developing your own OS
a.What is the name of your OS?
b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
stage.
c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
the OS follow.
d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
what other things do you like to implement in the future.
4.In what language or you designing your OS.
5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
like them and what are your comments on the books
8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
a.Related to OS Development.
b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
it in the future.
10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
novice.
11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
OS
a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
after you get into more serious work.
b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
about it.
c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
work on it for more than 2 years or so.
All the above questions are asked because if we get to know each other
more than we can help each other more.
Though there are so many questions.Please be more descriptive so that
everyone can know about you and your OS more.
Thank you for your patience for reading from the top till here
prizark
Daniel Camp
| HI guys
|
| Some questions for everyone in the alt.os.development group
|
| 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
| Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
| own Operating System.
both.
| 2.If you are developing your own OS
| a.What is the name of your OS?
: coughs :: I've actually forgotten
| c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
| the OS follow.
BSD
| 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
Still design, but probably a mix of languages...
asm/C/pascal/the-scripting-language-I-intend-to-integrate
| 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
I am Daniel Camp, 18, currently a labourer for BT...
thinking of becoming a forest ranger, depending on what is
involved in that and required.
| 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Full time in head design, I may look like I'm daydreaming,
but I'm thinking hard :)
| 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
| Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
| like them and what are your comments on the books
I intend to read them, they are apparently highly rated by many
| 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
| a.Related to OS Development.
ww.eBay.co.uk www.google.com
that's pretty much it.
| 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
| it in the future.
x86 PPC SPARC
| 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
| OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
| novice.
myself initially, the world tomorrow.
| 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
| want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
| the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
myself, then others.
| 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
| OS
| a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
Looks like by the time any implementation occurs I'll have switched
to NT4, I'm currently on Win98, and dabble a bit in BSD (but not for dev yet)
| b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
I've fiddled with Bochs, I think it is required that you pay for VMWare,
and I'm unaware of any others.
| c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
At this point all I could do is speculate, but I reckon it'll
be my own.
| 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
| a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
| after you get into more serious work.
yep, but I don't intend to dump it.
end
Remember: Your work email may be monitored if sending sensitive material.
Sending >500KB attachments is forbidden by the Geneva Convention.
Your country may be at risk if you fail to comply.
daniel <Motty> camp <CatSatOnTheMat> btopenworld <Motty> com
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
But Xpyd^WDR_Buddha isn't, he'll steal
your noodles, and eat them!
i.e. check your mails for viruses yerselz.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.381 / Virus Database: 214 - Release Date: 02/08/02
Jeff Weeks
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
Already develop[ed/ing] by own OS.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
Wrote an OS in the past, called PolyOS. Source code was lost in an HD
crash, and I haven't bothered rewritting.
Current OS in development is called NDK.
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
Past booting stage... working on v0.05, v0.03 is released.
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
Probably a BSD license... I'm still not totally sure.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
Stable:
timer
all exception and trap gates
tss multitasking
run-time kernel object (rdoff) linking
basic paging
In development:
vm86
stack based, page allocator & malloc/free memory management
In the future:
Dynamically sized stacks (a la KOS)
Software-/Virtually paged TSS- based multitasking (docs to come)
etc, etc, etc...
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
C/ASM
Applications will be developed using my "inCode" compiler, also in
development, also at www.neuraldk.org
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
21 years old. Sadly, I work for WalMart Canada, and hate it with every
pore of my body!!! I intend to apply to QNX (www.qnx.com) withen the next
couple months.
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Part time.
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
Nope. 6 yrs C experience, 4 years asm + "Protected Mode Software
Architecture" by Tom Shanley (MindShare, Inc) ISBN: 0-201-55447-X
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
www.osdev.org
osdev.neopages.net
www.nondot.org/sabre/os/articles
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
Aside from random porn sites, www.google.ca, www.sccoa.com, www.linux.org,
and www.kde.org
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
68k, PPC
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
Simply for my own enjoyment at the moment. In time I'll release all docs
related to driver development, etc, and see what the general public thinks
of it.
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
I've already begun development of the "Late 486/Pentium+" PMode Kernel and
object oriented programming language, and plan to continue both projects
myself. Help writting drivers is always a good thing, though :)
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
Linux 2.4.15, GCC 2.95.3, Nasm 0.98.32, KDE 2.2. Who says Linux isn't
ready for the desktop?
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
VmWare Workstation 3.0 (well worth the money!!!), and also Bochs (sometimes
provides more debugging information than VmWare). In time, I'd also like
to check out Plex86.
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others
GRUB.
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
Currently a hobby project, but I wont leave it once I get a real job.
> b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
> about it.
I plan to continually develop for it. I wont be happy unless I can (and
will) use it as my home operating system.
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
Similarly, yes.
> All the above questions are asked because if we get to know each other
> more than we can help each other more.
>
> Though there are so many questions.Please be more descriptive so that
> everyone can know about you and your OS more.
Cheers,
Jeff
Tim Taylor
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
Both.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
i386IOS
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
No releases, its past Booting tho hehe.
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
GNUGPL most likely
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
no releases yet. sorry.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
Sigh. Not answering as I haven't tested stability yet =)
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
ASM/C/Pascal combinations...
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
Tim, 21, Web Design
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Spare time
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
No. I don't like reading books, I prefer to learn by example.
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
OSDev Journal
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
www.google.ca and um.... I guess thats it
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
mac 68k (for 68kIOS)
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
For me, for a hobby.
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
Me, unless I think of a reason for a team.
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
Win2k/Linux/Dos6.11/FASM compiled for my OS
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
VMWare and Bochs
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
Mine
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
Until it loses its fun... When there is nothing left for me to learn about
my project, I'll probably start a new OS with a different "end result" in
mind to learn other aspects I may not learn developing mine.
> All the above questions are asked because if we get to know each other
> more than we can help each other more.
Then answer your own questionairre before expecting us to =)
Cya
~tim
Chewy509
"prizark" wrote in message...
> HI guys
>
> Some questions for everyone in the alt.os.development group
>
> 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
Both
>
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
No official name yet... But the name in all the docs is Lost... because I
always feel lost when coding this stuff...
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
No release yet, waiting until at the DOS level of operation... ie cli, most
disk function implemented and stable, etc
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
Since I haven't released yet, I haven't decided... but most likely a BSD
dirivative.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
Not yet...
>
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
Stable - Memory/task management, device driver interface, file i/o and
redirection services. Keyboard, VGA (Text) drivers.
Unstable/incomplete - most hardware drivers, FAT driver. Kernel debugging
support.
Want - Other filesystem drivers, ie ext2fs/ext3fs, reiserFS, HPFS, NTFS,
etc...
>
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
Kernel and drivers, x86 asm. I will keep the kernel in asm, but future
driver will be migrated to a HLL at a later date...
Apps , currently asm, but most likely Pascal, as I'm having trouble finding
a C compiler that supports the Segmented model on the IA-32. I have found a
C derived compiler on Simtel.net called bflat, that should be easy to modify
to support the model. Else I'm going to write a pascal or basic compiler in
pascal or basic to support the model...
If anyone knows of any C or Pascal or Basic compiler thats supports the
IA-32 segmented model, please let me know...
>
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
Chewy509... 25 years young - Systems Engineer/Administrator, mainly on Win32
and a few Linux systems.
>
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Hobby, part time...
>
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
Would like to... but I think I start writing their type of OS (the
previously tried models used for education), rather than coming up with my
own ideas...
>
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
www.google.com, www.simtel.net, www.programmersheaven.com, www.osnews.com,
www.slashdot.org, www.anandtech.com, and www.arstechnica.com.
> 9. What other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
None. I'm keeping my project an IA-32 only project...
>
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
Only for me, as a hobby, and learning experience...
>
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
Looking at the state of other hobby OS projects out there, the single person
projects tend to be more focused and driven. So for now, myself only, but my
let others develop when the project gets more mature... The other team
projects seem to stagnate over indecisions, so not for me...
>
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
Win2K, and DOS 6.22
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
Bochs 1.4.1
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
MS-DOS 6.22... my kernel is a *.COM executable...
>
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
Hobby, but my wife thinks it's an obsession.
> b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
> about it.
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
See above...
>
> Though there are so many questions.Please be more descriptive so that
> everyone can know about you and your OS more.
What about your pet project?
Chewy509...
Marven Lee
Prizark wrote...
> 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
Develop my own.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
The current name is WildMagnolia, it sounds like the name of a boat or
other vessel. Had picked female names before that, wanted to sound
slightly Amiga-like with the names of its custom chips but decided upon
the above name. Someone already owns that .com domain name so
I might change it.
GPL, I think this manger is quite warm and comfortable. <G>
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
The memory management is the most stable, The kernel allocator is quite
fast, though may need some tweaking. Can easily access page tables
and map pages of other processes.
User memory is managed by a linked list of MemRegion structs, has
functions such as Map() and Unmap(), more or less the same functionality
as Unix mmap(). Shared memory objects can be created and handles
passed to other processes so they may map them into their address space.
No support for swapping, might be a bit difficult to fit in, also no support
for a dynamically sized buffer cache, the buffer cache will have to be a
fixed size. Once the kernel is complete I may go back and improve it.
The shared memory objects and Map() support lazy allocation and
copy-on-write, still needs some work done on the exception handler.
Basic scheduler written, code to push and pop a thread's context is
used by many kernel functions, that is stable.
Semaphores, Mutexes and Condvars written, may need a few tweaks.
Exception handler mechanism works, though it will need to be tied in
with my message passing code to handle client and server page faults.
Exception handler will also server as a reaper, destroying terminated
threads.
Processes and Threads are being rewritten along with the IPC functions.
Processes, Threads, IPC and exception handling are all linked in
some way or other. At the moment it is a big mess. I'm finding it hard
to structure my code, in which source code files should I put certain
functions, dividing larger functions into smaller functions that are called
from several places, that sort of thing.
About a month ago before I started rewritting things I got the initial IPC
code working and test application sending messages to the executive.
Now I'm rewritting things, nothing works !
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
C and x86 assembler.
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
Me, myself and I.
Twenty something.
Involuntarily Leisured.
Okay, I'm a bit lazy, it seems their is very little in the way of programming
or computer related jobs in the North East of England, we don't seem
to have left the dark ages yet. Maybe I could find some dull office work,
doing whatever people do in an office, I dunno. The North East seems
to be booming with call centre jobs, telesales, cold calling, that sort of
thing.
I don't think I could do that, I don't know why that seems to be booming
up here, maybe it is because we've all got warm, friendly accents which
puts customers at ease.
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Full time, though most of the time I sit around thinking. I've got
nothing better to do, well perhaps search for jobs.
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation
Yes.
It is also useful to read research papers, most can be found
through http://citeseer.nj.nec.com/cs
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
Cygwin on XP. I use it as a i386-elf cross-compiler. I use the
Newlib library also compiled for i386-elf. It required some
patch, forgot what it was called, something to do with ecos IIRC,
to allow gcc to be built for the i386-elf target.
I use GRUB as the bootloader.
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
About 500 feet. :)
Been working on it for just over 2 years, nowhere near complete.
It is currently only an incomplete microkernel, no drivers or apps.
I have to get the microkernel working before anything else, don't
know how long that'll take.
Marv
George Morrison
> Some questions for everyone in the alt.os.development group
>
> 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
Want to develop my own OS.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
Sinapse (Sinapse Is Not A Perfect Stack Engine)
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
Still mainly in the daydreaming stage ;) although I have had my
bootloader and Forth interpreter/compiler running.
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
Probably public domain.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
None yet.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
Nothing's stable yet.
The plan is for something simple - kinda like the home computers of
yesteryear i.e. BBC micro, C64 that sort of thing. Complexity makes my
head hurt.
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
Forth and assembler.
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
37, currently unemployed.
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Whenever it occurs to me to work on it.
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
Haven't read them.
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
http://my.execpc.com/~geezer/osd/index.htm
http://www.nondot.org/sabre/os/articles
http://citeseer.nj.nec.com/cs (although I usually search it through
google)
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
http://www.google.co.uk
http://www.slashdot.org
http://www.theregister.co.uk
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
x86 currently, but I have an Atari ST sitting next to me; it would be
nice if I could get it to work on that as well.
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
For my own use.
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
All my own work :)
>
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
Linux
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
Bochs was useful for testing my boot loader.
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
I'd like to be able to use it as my main OS, but at the rate I'm going
that won't happen for some time :(
--
George Morrison
Aberdeen, Scotland
Tim Robinson
| 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
| Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
| own Operating System.
Both of these, and because I want to help other people.
| 2.If you are developing your own OS
| a.What is the name of your OS?
The Moebius, or just Mobius if I'm being lazy.
| b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
| stage.
Hmm... I'm well past the booting stage, but I'm not going to release it
properly until the system is somewhat useful (although you can download the
source and various versions of the binaries if you want).
| c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
| the OS follow.
MIT, I think.
| d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
http://mobius.sourceforge.net/
| 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
| what other things do you like to implement in the future.
Implemented:
- Demand-paged PE loader
- Device manager with asynchronous I/O support
- Virtual file system
- Loadable file system drivers
- File cacheing and memory-mapped files
- A partial V86 monitor
- Hardware drivers: ATA/ATAPI, CMOS RAM, floppy drive, PnP ISA bus,
keyboard, ES1371 sound card (partly), PS/2 moouse, serial mouse, VGA+S3
video
- File system drivers: ext2, FAT12+FAT16, ISO9660
In the future:
- Multiprocessor support
- Ports of lots of useful software (especially one or more compilers)
- A proper shell with scripting
- An install program
- A native file system (possibly)
- Ports to other architectures
- A network stack
| 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
Virtually all C, with bits of assembly and C++
| 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
I'm 21 and currently unemployed :/ having just finished university.
| 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Heh, full-time at the moment... but it should be part-time.
| 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
| Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
| like them and what are your comments on the books
I have "OS: D&I", 2nd ed., which I think is very useful, although I don't
agree with some of the arguments in the text.
| 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
| a.Related to OS Development.
| b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
| 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
| it in the future.
Currently: x86
In the future: whatever hardware I can get my hands on
| 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
| OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
| novice.
I'd like to think that anyone could start using a Mobius system and 'get'
it. At the moment it's strictly for OS hackers, though.
| 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
| want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
| the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
Up until now I've done all the code and design myself. I have several people
who've said they'd like to start designing and coding other parts, though,
so we'll see what they come up with.
| 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
| OS
| a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
Windows 2000
| b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
Bochs occasionally. In the last couple of days I've started a port of my
kernel to Win32, to make testing some of the code easier.
| c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
GRUB
| 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
As long as it takes -- probably until I get bored of it, or I have to stop
it against my will.
| a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
| after you get into more serious work.
I haven't stopped yet, and I've been through some fairly serious work in the
mean time...
| b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
| about it.
No; no OS is ever really finished, except maybe Minix.
| c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
| form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
| work on it for more than 2 years or so.
It would be nice if I could get this version to a state where it could be
released and function as a useful OS; then a team of developers could spring
up around it which would take workload off me.
--
Tim Robinson
http://www.themoebius.org.uk/
cr88192
> HI guys
>
> Some questions for everyone in the alt.os.development group
>
> 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
>
I have done a bit of work over about 5 months coding my os. some of the
code is a lot older, it was from a time I tried writing an os sometime
between 1-2 years ago.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
no real decision has been made yet, I had considered calling it "headroom"
and the language "special k", I may change this later if I can think up
something better. another possibility is "navitron" for the os name.
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
it has not really been released, but there are a few older source images
around. my newer kernel code doesn't add any real functionality, and
development has been quite slow recently. mostly I have been trying to
develop a few larger features but the fact that I have been quite
distracted doesn't help...
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
public domain, except a few borrowed parts which are gpl by the original
authors. at present this involves the floppy and keyboard drivers.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
>
given in my signature.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
>
I have a working scheme interpreter, though not obvious you just enter
scheme code in the shell. there are plenty of things that are missing which
were defined in r5rs, most notably: ports don't work, also read and eval
have not been implemented.
force and delay have also not been implemented, along with case.
some of the control flow features are missing, ie: dynamic-wind.
otherwise it has most of r5rs.
I am working on persistence (mostly written, just a few types will not
swizzle correctly and a means by which to refer to some objects in the
store has not been implemented).
eventually I plan to write a kind of distributed os (attempting to make
distributed computing quite convinient for both users and programmers).
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
>
most of the code is written in c and assembly. with a worthwhile scheme
compiler written scheme will probably also be creeping into the mix.
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
>
18, high school student.
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
>
what time I am not doing something else...
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
>
no.
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
>
don't really keep track.
probably hotmail and altavista are high on the list...
I go around enough randomly and I don't really keep track of sites that
well...
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
>
currently I am aiming for x86 but later hope to support other architectures.
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
>
I wan't to try to create an os that would inspire novices to become
programmers. in my mind a good aim here is to have programming facilities
generally available and have them positioned as a logical extension to
basic data manipulation.
a lispy syntax really doesn't help with this aim, but otherwise scheme is
quite logical for my project...
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
>
I want to try to develop the basic framework for most of the system before
letting others loose on it so that I have allready generally established
how I want development to procede before people start making stuff...
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
linux.
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
nope...
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
>
I am using my own boot loader, I had considered using grub but I have
decided that in general it is not sensible for either my short or long term
goals.
it is mostly that I plan to eventually load the kernel from store volumes
and I do not think this is a job for grub.
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
it is a hobby, I will continue work unless I can find something greatly
better to do.
> b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
> about it.
not really...
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
>
I may eventually let it under team control once it is a lot further along.
--
<cr88192[at]hotmail[dot]com>
<http://bgb1.hypermart.net/>
Aaron Gray
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
Own OS design and learning the holes in my knowledge.
Maintaining an online os and language development links lists.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
OOOS - for Object Oriented Opeating System
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
I am mainly concerned with the concept and design stages, although I do bits
of coding in my head and on paper.
I intend to get a generalized boot mechanism together in the not too distant
future.
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
The Public Anarchy Licence, this is my own extension of the GPL.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
Non yet.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
The design is very stable, a well tested design :)
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
Intel x86 with Intel2gas, GCC, and hopefully my own SOOL
(Simple/Sophisticated OOL) and OOA (OO Assembler)
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
Aaron Gray, 30 something, unemployable
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Part time, I phase between OS and language design.
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
Yep, all of 20 years ago :)
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
VA Softwares, OSDN - Open Source Developers Network, NewsForge and
SourceForge daily news, SourceForge projects. www.soureceforge.org
www.newsforge.org
My own web space aarongray.members.beeb.net links
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
Just oddities on odd occations, Nasa, ecological and green sites. Not often
enough really.
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
Power PC
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
Its a ten year old obsession :)
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
Hopefully it will get some momentum when I realease some documentation and
get coding, and others may be interested.
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
Windows XP/2000 at the moment and Linux soon. I hope to exokernel Linux and
"SideSaddle" it :)
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
Bochs, for certain.
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
My own and GRUB for netboot, until I "eat" this functionality.
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
Another 10 years or so.
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
> b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
> about it.
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
Hopefully it shall become an entity in its own right like Linux. We need
another _modern_ mainstream OS.
> All the above questions are asked because if we get to know each other
> more than we can help each other more.
There is a lot of knowledge sharing on alt.os.development, but everyone
seems to be doing their own thing.
> Though there are so many questions.Please be more descriptive so that
> everyone can know about you and your OS more.
Okay, OOOS and OOL, SOOL (Simple/Sophisticated OOL) being its prototype, and
OOA (OO Assembler) all implement OOF, the Object Oriented Framework. This
framework describes a general OO system that is both abstract and concrete,
there are multiple implementations of it, but these should all be
compatible. So both MS'es COM and hopefully CORBA could co exist within one
project.
OOF has its own native component archetecture as well. It is simular to COM
but more powerful, both at the bottom in its basic implementation and in its
modular system archetecture. Basically at the top level we have Units,
Modules, and Packages. Packages may be an Application (at any stage), a/the
Kernel, a Disk Volume, or even a directory tree, or a native Package.
Modules may be an executable, a DLL, a library or a directory tree, or a
native Module. Packages are Modules are Units :)
Packages may have certification and authentification. They are
"aximatically" founded. Know where they belong, where they came from (web,
CD, etc) and who they are connected to. They also have a host of other
mechanisms.
In order to implement OOOS my idea is to attack the problem from two fronts.
From the top there is GOOSE, the Generic Object Oriented System Environment.
This is an implementation of OOF that should ideally be able to be run on
any Unix. It will provide both GUI and CLI environments, with common
libraries and command sets that can be converted on to the native OS.
And from the bottom, to exokernel Linux and the "Side Saddle" it. Basically
for the exokernel to take over resource management, and provide and
coordinate resources for both Linux and OOOS, allowing them to run together
side by side, or OOOS on the side of Linux anyway. So Linux will still
provide FS support through the VFS interface which will be wrappered in a
modern wrapper interface and be part of GOOSE, same for the networking and
most devices, wrapping them in a modern interface. Hopefully over time
devices will be picked off one by one and the support will be turned the
otherway around, and eventually GOOSE will lay the golden egg, OOOS.
OOOS will have all three, a exokernel kernel, an nano kernel and a micro
kernel. No one has even though about this or done this to my knowledge.
So I will be taking and learning a lot from Linux, and from BSD, as well as
Windows.
> Thank you for your patience for reading from the top till here
Nice, lets hope others take the time to answer too :)
> prizark
Cheers,
Aaron
Chris Fallin
> HI guys
>
> Some questions for everyone in the alt.os.development group
>
> 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about Operating
> Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your own Operating
> System.
Originally the first, now the second.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
speck - small, portable, efficiently-coded kernel (more of a list of goals
for now, except for 'small' :-)
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
I 'release' fairly often, even though it doesn't do much yet - just to
keep track of milestones. Currently at 0.1.1.
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
BSD license
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
Subversion repository at http://svn.cfallin.org:8000/svn/speck - source,
no binaries yet. Browse online, or download an SVN client to download it.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
stable:
- booting :-)
- physical page allocation, kernel space allocation
- kernel heap
- spinlocks, mutexes, and CPU levels
- multitasking (just kernel threads for now)
- messages
Currently working on:
- IRQ messages
- stability
Dreaming of:
- POSIX
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
C, with assembly stubs for startup and interrupts
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
It's a single digit in hex :-) High school student (well, in two weeks),
doing perl CGI stuff for some extra money.
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Part-time hobby.
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
Nope, never got around to those. I learned all the OS theory I know from
online resources, with ideas from "Linux Core Kernel Commentary" by Scott
Maxwell.
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet. a.Related
> to OS Development.
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
www.google.com, again :-) and slashdot.org
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port it
> in the future.
Currently x86, maybe PPC in the future (I've been investigating PSIM).
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in OS
> development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any novice.
Currently just me, but if you can figure it out you can use it too :-)
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
It's a one-developer project right now, and will probably stay like that
for a while (at least until it's useful).
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
Currently Debian GNU/Linux 'sid', occasionally Cygwin on XP, and
previously FreeBSD 4.6-RELEASE.
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
Bochs and VMware.
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
GRUB.
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS. a.Is it a hobby project
> working on it for time being and leave it after you get into more
> serious work. b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence
> and forget about it.
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
It's a hobby, I'll keep going until it gets boring, but I may pick it up
again later if I do stop. But why would OS Dev ever become boring? :-)
--
Chris Fallin
Email: ch...@cfallin.org
AIM : ProgrammerNerd1
URL : http://www.cfallin.org/
Paul Edwards
> > c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> > the OS follow.
> public domain, except a few borrowed parts which are gpl by the original
> authors. at present this involves the floppy and keyboard drivers.
Could you please provide an explicit PD notice in your
code?
Thanks. Paul.
Paul Edwards
> 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
Developed own.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
PDOS.
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
Released.
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
public domain.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
www.kerravon.w3.to, click on programming, then pdos.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
Not sure what you call "stable". Probably nothing.
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
Make it stable. :-)
It is meant to be a replacement for DOS. ie boot sector,
loader, os and command processor. Except it comes in
bother 16 and 32-bit versions.
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
C with a smattering of assembler when no choice.
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
Paul, 34, programmer.
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
irregular.
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
No.
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
www.google.com and this newsgroup and alt.lang.asm.
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
www.bbc.com
www.expandnato.org
www.afghannews.net
www.mfa.gov.yu
www.cdi.org
I was going to say some porn sites, but in the first week
of download porn, I quickly realised that with what I
had already got, which was very likely every sort of
woman, combined with every sort of animal/plant/mineral,
I could probably spend the rest of my life just looking at
what I already had. At which point I decided I wanted
to actually create something, that couldn't be undone in
human history.
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
None. I "intend" for it to be as portable as possible. I am a
great believer in ISO/IEC 9899:1990 and can't stand the
thought of my code not working on a machine with 36-bit
shorts and 36-bit longs. Or MVS with EBCDIC. Or the C64.
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
"novice" at what? I intend to have some public domain operating
system code "in the market" so that anyone who wants to start
their own operating system, for any reason (including commercial),
does not have to start from scratch due to licencing restrictions.
There are some secondary purposes too, like actually being
useful as is.
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
I am happy to receive public domain contributions from other
sources, but am not particularly expecting them. Also happy
to take other people's public domain code I happen to find,
and incorporate it. Not particularly looking though.
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
MSDOS 5.0.
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
No.
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
MSDOS 5.0 boot sector normally. My own loader.
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
Hobby. Nothing more serious than this project, but
usually overtaken by other less serious things that
happen to have grabbed my interest at the time.
> b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
> about it.
Never forget class struggle.
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
I think you'll find it is near impossible to develop a team.
Been working on it for more than 2 years already, I think
I will work on it until I die. On whatever PC I happen to
be using at the time.
> All the above questions are asked because if we get to know each other
> more than we can help each other more.
I think you're barking up the wrong tree there.
> Though there are so many questions.Please be more descriptive so that
> everyone can know about you and your OS more.
I think most people are interested in help in solving problems
with their own OS.
> Thank you for your patience for reading from the top till here
It was an obvious place to start from.
BFN. Paul.
Paul Edwards
> > the OS follow.
> public domain, except a few borrowed parts which are gpl by the original
> authors. at present this involves the floppy and keyboard drivers.
Could you please provide an explicit PD notice in your
code?
Thanks. Paul.
ByrdKernel
> 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
Writing my own.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
None yet. Several under consideration.
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
Haven't released yet.
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
Unsure. Thinking BSD if it's Open Source, if it's not, my own.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
None yet.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
Um...my boot sector reports the size of the boot disk (any type) in sectors.
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
Kernel and drivers, assembly (using NASM). API, depends on sanity level at end
of kernel/driver development, probably ASM but possibly C. GUI & included
utils/apps, probably C.
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
My name is Mike, I'm 32, and I'm currently doing a desktop support job several
levels below my capabilities. Hey, the job market sucks right now. :)
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Very much part time.
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
Yes. Both editions are magnificent, and in my opinion, necessary, especially for
the theory.
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
http://www.nondot.org/sabre/os/articles
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
Will be strictly 32-bit x86 (Pentium & up) until I get a handle on x86-64, then
I'll port it to 64-bit native mode.
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
I want to take over the world from Microsoft. *waits for the laughter to die
down* No, really.
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
Myself right now...hope to have a team later...after digging into the kernel and
drivers, trying to readjust my thoughts for a GUI would suck.
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
Mostly Win2K, with some DOS thrown in.
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
Bochs, although much of what I want to do (EDD, ACPI, etc) isn't supported.
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
My own. I want every byte of code to be mine.
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
Definitely c. (I wish to take it more seriously, release my first version,
form a team and continue working until it gets better and better and
work on it for more than 2 years or so.)
ByrdKernel (Mike)
-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
-----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----
Paul Edwards
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
Developed own.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
PDOS.
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
Released.
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
public domain.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
www.kerravon.w3.to, click on programming, then pdos.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
Not sure what you call "stable". Probably nothing.
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
Make it stable. :-)
It is meant to be a replacement for DOS. ie boot sector,
loader, os and command processor. Except it comes in
bother 16 and 32-bit versions.
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
C with a smattering of assembler when no choice.
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
Paul, 34, programmer.
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
irregular.
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
No.
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
www.google.com and this newsgroup and alt.lang.asm.
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
www.bbc.com
www.expandnato.org
www.afghannews.net
www.mfa.gov.yu
www.cdi.org
I was going to say some porn sites, but in the first week
of download porn, I quickly realised that with what I
had already got, which was very likely every sort of
woman, combined with every sort of animal/plant/mineral,
I could probably spend the rest of my life just looking at
what I already had. At which point I decided I wanted
to actually create something, that couldn't be undone in
human history.
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
None. I "intend" for it to be as portable as possible. I am a
great believer in ISO/IEC 9899:1990 and can't stand the
thought of my code not working on a machine with 36-bit
shorts and 36-bit longs. Or MVS with EBCDIC. Or the C64.
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
"novice" at what? I intend to have some public domain operating
system code "in the market" so that anyone who wants to start
their own operating system, for any reason (including commercial),
does not have to start from scratch due to licencing restrictions.
There are some secondary purposes too, like actually being
useful as is.
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
I am happy to receive public domain contributions from other
sources, but am not particularly expecting them. Also happy
to take other people's public domain code I happen to find,
and incorporate it. Not particularly looking though.
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
MSDOS 5.0.
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
No.
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
MSDOS 5.0 boot sector normally. My own loader.
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
Hobby. Nothing more serious than this project, but
usually overtaken by other less serious things that
happen to have grabbed my interest at the time.
> b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
> about it.
Never forget class struggle.
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
I think you'll find it is near impossible to develop a team.
Been working on it for more than 2 years already, I think
I will work on it until I die. On whatever PC I happen to
be using at the time.
> All the above questions are asked because if we get to know each other
> more than we can help each other more.
I think you're barking up the wrong tree there.
> Though there are so many questions.Please be more descriptive so that
> everyone can know about you and your OS more.
I think most people are interested in help in solving problems
with their own OS.
> Thank you for your patience for reading from the top till here
It was an obvious place to start from.
BFN. Paul.
res19j1c
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
Develop my own.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
None at the moment.
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
No releases yet.
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
Probably BSD.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
Website under construction, offline.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
At this stage, pretty much nothing is stable.
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
Mostly C but some ASM when needed.
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
John, highschool student.
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
part time, main compting project
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
I did and I found it very helpful.
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
http://www.osjournal.hopto.org/
http://osdev.neopages.net/
http://www.nondot.org/sabre/os/articles
http://osdev.berlios.de/
http://www.mega-tokyo.com/os/os-faq.html
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
IA-32 at first, then possibly IA-64 and PPC
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
It should be simple enuogh for most people to understand but provide
features geared towards developers.
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
By my self, at least for the kernel and other core components.
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
Mainly Windows 2000, but sometimes BSD and Linux.
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
Both VMware Workstation and Bochs. I mainly use VMware but Bochs helps more
for debugging.
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
My bootloader is currently GRUB although I plan to eventually write my own.
I use both System Commander 7 and XOSL as boot menus on various other
computer systems.
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
I wish to take it more seriously,release my first version form a team and
Francis Rounds
> HI guys
Hi,
>
> Some questions for everyone in the alt.os.development group
Well, since just about everyone else is answering...
>
> 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
I want to develop my own OS.
>
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
None yet.
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
Still in the design stage (and probably will be for quite a bit of
time). I don't want to rush things, and I definitely don't want to have
to re-write a whole kernel from scratch :)
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
Probably BSD or MIT or one of those less restrictive licenses.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
None yet.
>
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
None at the moment, but I would like to have:
Pre-emptive multitasking
Demand paging
Support for dynamic libraries
Support for the Universal Driver Interface
My own filesystem implemented (until then, I'll probably be happy with ext2)
Decent and polished drivers for the basic stuff (keyboard, video etc)
(Maybe) a nice functional GUI with the X Window System client/server approach
The kernel will most likely be a microkernel.
>
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
It will be mostly C, with little bits of asm thrown into the mix :)
>
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
Francis Rounds, nearly 15 and I attend school of course! :)
>
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Part time, with GCSEs and stuff, I won't have much time for OS dev
>
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
Well, funnily enough, I do own that book (I ordered it about two weeks
ago) but I haven't got round to reading it yet. But from what I've seen,
it looks very good and it looks as if it covers OS theory very well.
>
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
http://www.nondot.org/sabre/os/articles
http://my.execpc.com/CE/AC/geezer/os/
http://www.osdev.org
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
http://www.slashdot.org
http://www.linux.org
http://www.sourceforge.net
http://www.google.com
http://www.programmersheaven.com - A remnant of my BASIC days :)
>
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
I will develop it primarily for the x86 architecture (386 and up,
probably) and I'm not sure if it will ever be ported to different
platforms. I would like it to, but if that did happen, I'd probably have
to get someone else to do it (too much work! ;)
>
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
Hmm...I'm developing it mainly for other people who are interested in OS
dev; I want my kernel to be easily hackable, and relatively easy to
understand for the programmer. Although, I might make a U-turn and start
devving it for the 'average'-'dummy' audience.
>
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
Probably by myself at the beginning, but when I get onto things like the
GUI then I'll probably recruit others to help me out. I'd stay working
on my kernel.
>
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
Win32 (Cygwin), Red Hat Linux 7.0 (will be Debian Woody soon) and I
might go back to good ol' DOS for devving ;)
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
VMware & Bochs 1.4 for Linux, and Bochs 1.4 for Windows. I'm keeping a
close eye on Plex86 though - it looks very interesting.
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
I'll most likely use GRUB.
>
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
No...I'll never get out of this OS dev quandary alive! :) Seriously
though, I won't abandon OS dev...maybe, if my new OS is a total (and I
mean *total*) failiure, then I might have to abandon it and go back to
the drawing board. That's why I'm designing carefully and reading up on
OS theory first: it helps to reduce the chance of buggering up your OS IMO.
> b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
> about it.
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
I'd like my OS to become like Minix sort of (with a different design),
helping students and people who want to start Operating System
Development from scratch. Although I can see myself changing my mind and
try making my OS mainstream :) (If only, if only...) But, at the end of
the day, if those two targets become too far out of reach, I'll just
develop it primarily for myself, upto a point where I can use it for
daily work on a 386.
>
> All the above questions are asked because if we get to know each other
> more than we can help each other more.
Like Aaron said, we all go our own way on this subject (IMO, that is how
it should be...I wouldn't like a big a.o.d OS being developed or
anything *shudder* :)
>
> Though there are so many questions.Please be more descriptive so that
> everyone can know about you and your OS more.
And, like Paul said, I think we all want to get on developing our
operating systems...although a.o.d does have a nice community feel to it .
>
>
> Thank you for your patience for reading from the top till here
>
Well, why not? :)
> prizark
Francis Rounds
w m r
> HI guys
>
> Some questions for everyone in the alt.os.development group
>
> 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
I am developing my own OS. I come here for new ideas to improve stuff
and to answer others questions.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
OZONE
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
I have released it I suppose
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
GPL, if someone wanted it (or parts of) for commercial purposes, I
would be willing to do otherwise.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
see webpages
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
C and assembler
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
Mike Rieker, 44, computer programming
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
hobby part time
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.
no
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
alt.os.development
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
I like sites relating to UFOs and extraordinary technology such as
disclosureproject.org and cheniere.org
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
maybe someday alpha or amd 64bit, but intel 32 can keep me busy for a
lifetime as it is
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
probably won't ever be used by anyone else
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
most of core os parts you mention are already designed and
implemented. major stuff left would be along the lines of gui, maybe
making a posix networking library.
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
linux
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
bochs because it is open source and can be debugged and hacked.
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
It has its own bootblock, I didn't know about grub (it may not have
even existed then).
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
It's been 5+ yrs (on and off) already and may last 'forever'
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
> b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
> about it.
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
I will add stuff to it as inspiration moves me, I don't think it will
ever be a commercial product as such.
It would take a lot of money to make a commercially successful OS to
compete with what's out there now. IMO, Linux is successful because
it is Unix/Posix and many computer science people were exposed to Unix
of some sort in college, so it is familiar for them to program.
Windows is successful because there are so many apps available and it
supports almost all hardware. A new OS would have to compete on both
fronts.
Mike
cr88192
I put a pd notice in the file "COPYING" in the source dir, but it will not
be noticable until a later time when a new source image is uploaded.
I guess I can also put a notice on my site and in my scheme compiler as
well...
Sean E. Kelleher
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
I want to write my own OS. But I enjoy reading about theory and
other designs so much that often I do that for days without producing
a single line of code for my own system.
> a.What is the name of your OS?
I'd like to call it TheOS but that name is used by several lame
companies, so.... I may fall back on Halo (but, damn Bungee
associations) or some classical Greek reference.
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
Still booting. Will probably never release the thing, unless I put
together a stable .ZIP and send it to my best friend to play with.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
Uh...it boots. :-) It goes into pmode, inits kprint(), inits
interrupts, and then spins. The keyboard ISR works -- it just echos
characters to the console for now. The timer ISR also works -- it
animates a throbbing ASCII ball in the corner of
the screen. It's not much but it was very satisfying to write. ;-)
What I hope to implement soon:
Full keyboard and VGA drivers.
TSS multitasking.
Message-passing.
Simple memory management.
Kernel objects (I'm gonna use the capabilities model from
Amoeba/Paramecium)
Object namespace -- every resource in the OS will be accessed via a
CORBA/DCOM/whatever style
namespace: "//local/kernel/drivers/floppy/floppy0"
The object model/namespace is the only part that I'm nervous
about.
What I will probably never implement:
Filesystems (though they would merge seamlessly into the kernel
namespace)
GUI (I hope to someday support a 3rd party product like FLTK).
Paging. I'm not actually writing a desktop OS. I wish to write a
PDA/cellphone OS. So x86 for now, but ARM later. So I'm using
as little
of the x86 as possible and assuming a target machine of
~200MHz/32megs
RAM/no disk (or a flashdisk).
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
I'm 27, an unemployed software engineer (I used to work for a major
cellular phone company here in the states -- AT&T). Might I add,
after reading these responses I feel really damn old and
behind-the-curve.
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
It's whenever I get around to it. I would like to work full-time
until I go back to work but lost much motivation once I stopped coding
in asm. Heh. Implementing terminal driver/ANSI escape sequences is
BORING. ;-)
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
Tanenbaum is OK. /shrug/ A great place to start, certainly. Maybe
not so useful for advanced work because his UNIX ideas are really old
and sort of ugly IMHO. I'm extremely interested in extensible
distributed object-based systems and unfortunately, there is no text
book for that. ;-) But Andy and his grad students are doing great
research in this area, so I now read whitepapers more than OS:D&I,
etc.
I find it valuable to read the Microsoft books to provide balance --
NT has some terrific architecture underneath the win32 bullshit.
This is an AWESOME search engine for technical research papers:
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
I hope to port to ARM or even 68k (ColdFire) because I'm more
interested in mobile computing. Desktops are so boring!! ;-) I code
for x86 for now because there's such a wealth of information on it.
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
It's all for me. Writing a first OS with the intention of other
people using it is, IMHO, fool-hardy. I want to be successful,
therefore my goals are a bit smaller. ;-) My second OS will be to
give away and my third OS will be a commercial product, I hope.
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
One person can only do so little. I will write the kernel and basic
drivers, then maybe my friends will contribute. I would consider it
insane to reinvent so many wheels, so GNU all the way for
compilers/shells/tools.
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
Windows 98 and Bochs, with a Linux SSH window for compiling. I'd
do the whole thing under Linux but I don't want to reboot to play
games and such. One of these days I'll get CVS working with my
Windows machine too.
I use my own boot loader for matters of pride/learning, but will
probably use GRUB eventually.
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
Forever, or until I get a job as a professional kernel developer at
Microsoft/Apple/PalmOS/WindRiver.
cheers,
Sean
Paul Edwards
> Paul Edwards wrote:
>
> > "cr88192" <cr8...@hotmail.nospam.com> wrote in message
> > news:ulde7ie...@corp.supernews.com...
> >> > c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> >> > the OS follow.
> >> public domain, except a few borrowed parts which are gpl by the original
> >> authors. at present this involves the floppy and keyboard drivers.
> >
> > Could you please provide an explicit PD notice in your
> > code?
> >
> I put a pd notice in the file "COPYING" in the source dir, but it will not
> be noticable until a later time when a new source image is uploaded.
Ok, thanks.
> I guess I can also put a notice on my site and in my scheme compiler as
> well...
I'd certainly be more comfortable if each source file had your
name in it and the fact that it was public domain, so that I
know I'm not using copyrighted-by-default code that may
have been written by someone else.
BFN. Paul.
Paul Edwards
> Paul Edwards wrote:
>
> > "cr88192" <cr8...@hotmail.nospam.com> wrote in message
> > news:ulde7ie...@corp.supernews.com...
> >> > c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> >> > the OS follow.
> >> public domain, except a few borrowed parts which are gpl by the original
> >> authors. at present this involves the floppy and keyboard drivers.
> >
> > Could you please provide an explicit PD notice in your
> > code?
> >
> I put a pd notice in the file "COPYING" in the source dir, but it will not
> be noticable until a later time when a new source image is uploaded.
Ok, thanks.
> I guess I can also put a notice on my site and in my scheme compiler as
> well...
I'd certainly be more comfortable if each source file had your
Paul Edwards
> Paul Edwards wrote:
>
> > "cr88192" <cr8...@hotmail.nospam.com> wrote in message
> > news:ulde7ie...@corp.supernews.com...
> >> > c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> >> > the OS follow.
> >> public domain, except a few borrowed parts which are gpl by the original
> >> authors. at present this involves the floppy and keyboard drivers.
> >
> > Could you please provide an explicit PD notice in your
> > code?
> >
> I put a pd notice in the file "COPYING" in the source dir, but it will not
> be noticable until a later time when a new source image is uploaded.
Ok, thanks.
> I guess I can also put a notice on my site and in my scheme compiler as
> well...
I'd certainly be more comfortable if each source file had your
Paul Edwards
> Paul Edwards wrote:
>
> > "cr88192" <cr8...@hotmail.nospam.com> wrote in message
> > news:ulde7ie...@corp.supernews.com...
> >> > c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> >> > the OS follow.
> >> public domain, except a few borrowed parts which are gpl by the original
> >> authors. at present this involves the floppy and keyboard drivers.
> >
> > Could you please provide an explicit PD notice in your
> > code?
> >
> I put a pd notice in the file "COPYING" in the source dir, but it will not
> be noticable until a later time when a new source image is uploaded.
Ok, thanks.
> I guess I can also put a notice on my site and in my scheme compiler as
> well...
I'd certainly be more comfortable if each source file had your
Stéphane Martineau
Why not!
> 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
Both!
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
a) BadOS
b) Not release, not even decided if i'll do it.
c) No idea, i don't think there's a chance to make money with it, so
probably something free, GPL can be a bit restrictive, imo.
d) null
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
If i do it, there's no question that it's gonna be deeply object-oriented,
independant of C++ though, don't want to tie it too much to a specific
language.
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
C++ all the way with bits of good old x86 assembly when necessary.
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
A living death, too old, not much for now, but always interested to work
on projects that have the potential to generate $$$.
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Will be part time.
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
No!
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
Mostly beyond3D forums, a bit of hardware sites like anandtech and
emulations site. The rest is essentially any site with the documentation
i need as a programmers.
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
Doubtful, but not impossible.
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
If i make it public it's gonna be easy to use and install by anyone that
know
what an os is.
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
A team would be great, but that's not easy to find. If i make it public
anyone
will be allowed to use it, change it, make their own version, work with me
or against me, whatever :)
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
WinXP / DOS, doesn't work with bochs, didn't take the time to check why,
I have my own boot manager BadBOOT :)))
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
> b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
> about it.
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
If i do it and release it, i'll probably support it until i become too old
or
too busy, but who tell the futur anyway :)
Frank M
> HI guys
>
>
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
I visit to help others with what I know, to learn more, and I am
currently developing my own OS. I discovered AOD less than a year ago.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
Cottontail
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
Have not released yet, but way, way past the booting stage.
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
Initially I would release binaries for free. I don't feel comfortable
giving _all_ the source out, but I could give out most of it under a
BSD-style license I suppose. If there was any commercial application
for my OS, I could consider changing the license, but I don't forsee
that happening. It's just a hobby, and a great power trip knowing that
my code is the only code running on the machine.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
Site's down right now. No binaries available right now anyway.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
SMP, threads, processes, multitasking, PCI, floppy, keyboard, PS/2
mouse, realtek 8139 ethernet, hard drives, APM, so much more I can't
remember it all....
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
Mostly C, some asm.
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
Frank Millea, 17, student.
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Depends on what kind of mood I'm in. Sometimes I'll work 16 hours a
day on it. Other days I'll just play Warcraft III all day 'cause I'm
so burned out.
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
Didn't read it. Taught myself most by logic and learned the rest here.
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
http://groups.google.com (alt.os.development)
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
http://www.investors.com. Stocks are my other hobby.
>
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
IA32/x86, but I am making it easily portable to just about any old
arch.
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
I'd like as many people to enjoy it as possible, but right now only
programmer types could appreciate it.
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
Haven't found anyone willing to help me with it (or smart enough) yet,
so this question is moot ;-). I would like some help, though.
Developing a good, commercial-grade OS is very time-consuming and
frustrating.
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
Mostly Win2000. Test on various 486's, my Celeron laptop, AMD Athlons,
whatever is available.
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
Tried Bochs. Hate it. Crashes out of my bootloader, which works fine
on *real* systems.
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
My own, written from scratch 2-3 years ago.
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
As long as it takes and as long as it interests me.
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
This is true at the moment, since I am very burned out from working
too much on it.
> b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
> about it.
No way! My OS will never be *done* and will always be a work in
progress.
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
Yes.
> All the above questions are asked because if we get to know each other
> more than we can help each other more.
>
> Though there are so many questions.Please be more descriptive so that
> everyone can know about you and your OS more.
>
>
> Thank you for your patience for reading from the top till here
>
> prizark
Frank Millea
---------------------------------
Cottontail OS Development Library
http://www.0xfi.com/oslib/
---------------------------------
Nick
|| HI guys
||
|| Some questions for everyone in the alt.os.development group
||
|| 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
|| Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
|| own Operating System.
Writing my own
||
|| 2.If you are developing your own OS
|| a.What is the name of your OS?
Called namoss for an obscure reason at the moment (too long to explain).
|| b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the
|| booting stage.
Got a kernel, got it running, but at the moment I'm changing it to a series
of modules which are loaded by the bootloader.
|| c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence
|| will the OS follow.
Umm probably BSD licence.
|| d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
No URL at the moment.
||
|| 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable
|| and what other things do you like to implement in the future.
Stable:
First stage bootloader (read an arbitrary number of sectors from disk)
Second stage bootloader (switch to pmode, program PICs, etc.)
Kernel:
Paging manager (allocate and deallocate pages, map to physical memory,
lock)
Selector manager (allocate and deallocate selectors in any provided
table, marshal and unmarshal
descriptor records for easy access), and similarly think GDT manager and
IDT manager layers on top of
the selector manager
In development:
Module loader/unloader, including implementation in the second stage
bootloader
Device driver interface including driver/bus hierarchy
Class interface with runtime optimisation (runtime code modification
based on hints in the object format) which I have got working under DOS,
but is not yet integrated into the OS...
Kernel thread manager, which will allow drivers to run under ring 0
without bugs necessarily breaking the
system, by allowing any kernel thread to allocate physical memory but by
default not having it allocated,
so that memory regions need to be mapped before use.
||
|| 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
||
Bootloader 1 in NASM, kernel in Object Pascal :D (using FreePascal) and the
second stage bootloader in NASM but with a statically linked Object Pascal
unit for loading modules.
|| 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
||
I'm Nick, 16 in a couple of months time, student.
|| 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
||
Part time.
|| 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
|| Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did
|| you like them and what are your comments on the books
||
Yep, quite good, but I have seen better OS theory books around, and AFAICR
the book didn't deal much with methods of buffering.
|| 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
|| a.Related to OS Development.
www.nondot.org/sabre/os
www.execpc.com/~geezer/os
http://developer.intel.com/design/litcentr/index.htm
|| b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
||
|| 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
|| it in the future.
At the moment it runs on IA32, I am thinking of porting it to 680x0, PPC and
IA64.
||
|| 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
|| OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
|| novice.
Mainly for me at the moment, though I have a nice language I want to put
around it so it will become based on a class-based orthogonal persistent
object store :P
||
|| 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
|| want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
|| the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
||
Just doing it myself mainly, I am doing an optimising compiler back end so I
am not finishing my compiler until I have done that
|| 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
|| OS
|| a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
|| b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
|| c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
||
On this machine I'm using XP with VMware, but my main development machine is
a 486DX4 running DOS and with no emulator, just running on the bare
hardware, no bootloaders on either.
|| 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
|| a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
|| after you get into more serious work.
A hobby project, but I'll carry on with it.
|| b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
|| about it.
I'm going to be developing it until it's stable and can run plenty of
things, maybe I will provide a POSIX interface so I can compile and run GNU
software...
|| c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
|| form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
|| work on it for more than 2 years or so.
||
Maybe.
|| All the above questions are asked because if we get to know each
|| other more than we can help each other more.
||
|| Though there are so many questions.Please be more descriptive so that
|| everyone can know about you and your OS more.
||
||
|| Thank you for your patience for reading from the top till here
||
|| prizark
Nick
Nick
That it to say, namoss is using my own bootloader.
DarkTama
>
> Some questions for everyone in the alt.os.development group
>
> 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
>
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
DarkOS
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
Well, I released "something" which was really dumb, had basic DarkFS
(no longer exists) and basic pmode etc. etc. nothing special.
basically a neutered dos in protected mode
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
Probably GPL
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
>
Arrrr. can't quite remember.. I havent updated for about a year and a
half.. Do a search and you might come up with something.
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
>
I dunno if any of it is stable, some parts have their "quirks" But
here's what I've implemented so far
-Basic SMP support (no default configurations yet, just config. table
support)
-Bootloader reads /boot/init16.o and /boot/kernel.o off an ext2fs
floppy
-Kernel heap allocation
-Stack-based physical page allocator
there is more but I had 2 and a half hours sleep so I can't think
straight.
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
>
English... haha.. sorry. x86 Assembly language (NASM), I love it..
Down'n'dirty with the hardware!
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
>
I'm Ben Skeggs, 16 and I'm a full-time student and work part time at
KFC!!
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
>
Hobby
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
>
I own 'Modern Operating Systems' by Andy.. Pretty good book.
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
www.atomicmpc.com.au ... need I say more.
www.shrineofinsanity.com
> a.Related to OS Development.
groups.google.com
Lots of others...
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
>
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
>
None as yet, possible AA-64, I don't like intel's 64-bit
architechture... yuck
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
>
For me. myself. and Irene.
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
>
I'd rather do it all alone by myself, I love the challenge. And the
thrill.
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
Linux
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
Bochs
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
My own.
>
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
forever
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
Nah, forever
> b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
> about it.
lol! hopefully not.. but knowing my memory
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
>
Nope.
> All the above questions are asked because if we get to know each other
> more than we can help each other more.
>
> Though there are so many questions.Please be more descriptive so that
> everyone can know about you and your OS more.
>
>
> Thank you for your patience for reading from the top till here
>
> prizark
No probs.. too tired... stuck at school in english... not doing
work... as usual!
David A. Caabeiro
> || machine is a 486DX4 running DOS and with no emulator, just running
> || on the bare hardware, no bootloaders on either.
> ||
>
> That it to say, namoss is using my own bootloader.
Nick, would you mind quoting just the necessary? (like this)
Thanks in advance,
David.
David A. Caabeiro
> without bugs necessarily breaking the
> system
?? How is that?
David.
Nick
Sorry, I'll remember to do that, it's just that on some of the other
newsgroups on which I post the convention is to include everything when
quoting.
Nick
It's just a thing so that drivers have to reserve areas of memory before
they can arbitrarily write to them, and other drivers can asked to be
notified when a driver reserves areas of memory, and can return a value to
stop the memory from being allocated. Some buggy drivers could then be
caught if they were to write to and read from memory which was not theirs,
without requesting a lock on it first, or if it was already locked by some
other device. It needs threading support, as the PDBR needs to be reloaded
when a device is changed, or pages need to be invalidated in the TLB. I may
well also use an I/O permissions map whereby I/O ports need to be requested
as well.
David A. Caabeiro
> newsgroups on which I post the convention is to include everything when
> quoting.
Weird convention, as doing so is considered a contravention to netiquette...
Anyway, thanks for your commitment.
Regards,
David.
David A. Caabeiro
> when a device is changed, or pages need to be invalidated in the TLB. I
may
> well also use an I/O permissions map whereby I/O ports need to be
requested
> as well.
But using PDBR makes your drivers tasks (ie. processes), not threads... (if
I
understood correctly your idea)
Regards,
David.
Nick
|| threads... (if I
|| understood correctly your idea)
Not exactly, as the same address space is used for each thread, only with
some pages marked as not-present depending on what the thread has allocated.
If every driver thread were to expose the whole of the address space, they
would all use exactly the same address space. So to call a function in a
different driver, some page entries are reloaded and invalidated, instead of
a full task switch.
Craig E. Shea
> HI guys
>
> Some questions for everyone in the alt.os.development group
>
> 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
Both.
>
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
NexOS (Pron. Nex - us)
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
Still in the booting stage.
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
Thinking about GPL or BSD but not really sure yet.
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
None available yet.
>
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
The bootloader! !;^D
>
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
Primarily C, and asembler (x86 to start). Would like to look into
OO design approaches, though everything I've read seems to indicate a)
it can't be done, or b) it would involve enormous overhead/complexity.
>
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
>
Craig E. Shea, 25, student soon to be VB .NET programmer (no flame-mail
please!! !:^D ). Not a die-hard MS fan nor a die-hard Linux fan. Both
have strengths and weaknesses!
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
>
Definitely part-time.
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
>
Reading "Modern Operating Systems, 2nd Ed." By Andrew S. Tanenbaum now.
Plan to read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation, 2nd Ed."
immediately afterwards.
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
I don't know the web addresses, but they can easily be searched for
on Google.com: GazOS website, MINIX website, Linux.org, GNU.org,
OSDev(.org?), etc.
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
MSN.com, google.com, space.com, discovery.com, amazon.com
>
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
Initially and primarily Intel. Later, may be ported to any platform
I wish or others are willing to port to.
>
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
I want it to be used by everyone who wants an alternative to Windows/Linux
>
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
Not to sound selfish or anything, but I'd rather design it myself to
start, i.e. get a lot of the work done myself on all major subsystems.
This "project" is an educational (and hopefully will be useful)
exploration of how the computer's hardware interacts with software (i.e.
the OS) and then the user software with the OS.
Perhaps later, after a lot of it has been written (with a lof of help
from this and other communities) I will open up development to interested
parties.
>
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
I have Win9x/NT/2000 and RedHat/Slackware Linux systems at my
disposal.
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
If any are to be used, it would be Cygwin
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
Lilo (for Linux), Boot.ini for Win9x/NT/2000
>
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
It's a hobby, but nonetheless serious. I hope to branch into
systems design career-wise in the future.
> b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
> about it.
No, will not forget about it.
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
Yes, most likely.
>
> All the above questions are asked because if we get to know each other
> more than we can help each other more.
>
> Though there are so many questions.Please be more descriptive so that
> everyone can know about you and your OS more.
>
>
> Thank you for your patience for reading from the top till here
>
> prizark
I think this list of questions was great. Thanks for compiling and posting.
-- Craig
res19j1c
>
> If any are to be used, it would be Cygwin
Can Cygwin boot your kernel?
KVP
> HI guys
> Some questions for everyone in the alt.os.development group
> 1.Are you visiting alt.os.development just to know more about
> Operating Systems and their internals or do you want to develop your
> own Operating System.
Both.
> 2.If you are developing your own OS
> a.What is the name of your OS?
Currently there isn't a name, but I use the id 'os4'.
(because this is my 4th kernel spec.)
> b.Did you release the first version of your OS or still in the booting
> stage.
It is up and running, but currently not an open project.
(there are almost no drivers and apps.)
> c.If you released your OS or planning to release one what lisence will
> the OS follow.
Currently it is closed, but it could have a public licence in the future.
(if noone buys it... :-) )
> d.And what is the URL for downloading your OS and trying it.
>
> 3.What are the features you implemented in your OS that are stable and
> what other things do you like to implement in the future.
-kernel:
-address space management (3 methods)
-task management (5 methods)
-ipc management (2 methods)
-kernel memory manager (4 methods)
-drivers:
-keyboard & video (simple ascii terminals)
-serial & paralell ports (for debug)
-the others are bios based fallbacks only
-user space:
-syscall support
-own helper library (portable)
-user libs (ex.: 5 user mode memory managers)
The kernel could be configured to run various algorithms, only the interface
is constant. (the whole system is written for scientific purposes in the
first place)
> 4.In what language or you designing your OS.
C and platform specific asm (inline x86 and M68k assembly for example)
> 5.Who are you and how old are you and what do you do for a living.
I'm an engineer, and just starting a new university + phd in the future.
(working as a freelance programmer)
> 6.Is your OS project part time or full time.
Just a tiny part of my part time. (if I happen to have too much time)
> 7.Did you read "Operating Systems, Design and Implementation by
> Andrew.s.Tanenbaum" and other literatures of Anrew.S.Tanenbaum.Did you
> like them and what are your comments on the books
Yes. I like them.
> 8.What are your most frequently visited site on the Internet.
> a.Related to OS Development.
alt.os.development
> b.Other than those that are related to OS development.
>
> 9.On what other architectures does your OS run or you intend to port
> it in the future.
currently: ia32 (x86), M68k (amiga&others), a few microcontrollers
future: sparc, etc.
> 10.Are you developing your OS mainly for you and intrested people in
> OS development to use or do you want your OS to be used even by any
> novice.
Mainly for general purpose, currently for fully automated systems.
> 11.Do you want to desing and develop you OS all by yourself or do you
> want to make a team and you design the kernel and let the team design
> the other OS stuff(compilers,shells,editors etc).
Kernel: by myself
Other stuff: anyone interested?
> 12.What is the environment you use for designing and developing your
> OS
> a.Operating System.(FreeBSD,Windows 95/98/NT/2000/XP,Linux or others)
dos & winnt4
> b.Any use of Emulators(VmWare,Bochs or any other if there is one)
Bochs and UAE.
> c.Boot loader program(GRUB,LILO,Xosl or others.
I use my own.
> 13.How long do you wish to develop your OS.
> a.Is it a hobby project working on it for time being and leave it
> after you get into more serious work.
No, I can even sell parts of it. (as part of my real work)
> b.Do you plan to develop and release under some lisence and forget
> about it.
No.
> c.Or do you wish to take it more seriously,release your first version
> form a team and continue working until it get's better and better and
> work on it for more than 2 years or so.
It's already older than that. (counting from spec. 1 of course)
Some parts of the kernel now run in real life systems...
> All the above questions are asked because if we get to know each other
> more than we can help each other more.
> Though there are so many questions.Please be more descriptive so that
> everyone can know about you and your OS more.
> Thank you for your patience for reading from the top till here
Best wishes: Viktor
ps:
Imho, the best way to make my kernel specification open is to write a
book about it, or at least a few good articles.