FA: Prince SOTT 12" UNRELEASED MIXES Testpress Promo!
KenHold
promo 12" with 2 different unreleased mixes of the song!! Fantastic item!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=1080&item=929029626
Other rare Prince items for auction:
http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewSellersOtherItems&userid=symbold
ork&include=0&since=-1&sort=3&rows=25
Jolene Davies
genuine are what?
"KenHold" <ken...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20021209134544...@mb-ca.aol.com...
SaTim
We had one of these back in the day and the mixes were just DMC styled
mixes with some claps and stuff. :(
Sorry man........
BUT, if this is something different than let me know. There was
another SOTT 12" that is out there that has that wierd Horn mix, I've
always wanted to get a hold of that, real or not (It's not BTW).
T
KenHold
mixes with "some claps and stuff". There is a drum part similar to the SOTT
movie (live) version, re-editing and remixing, etc. If it were just a DMC
remix it wouldn't have a "PRO" Warner Brothers catalogue number.
I've only seen 3 of these ever offered in 10 plus years of collecting.
The first one was offered for sale by a major collector and snapped up
immediately for $400.
-Ken
KenHold
>genuine are what?
Yes, these are the Bailey and King/Lewin mixes.. I assume... as they are the
same length as the ones referenced here:
http://sleevographia2.free.fr/Disques/09b20US11.htm
-Ken
Neversin
news:6kp9vuclng9416hrq...@4ax.com...
> As much as I'd love this to be real man, it ain't.
For real??
I paid $300 for that shit...
Neversin.
--
O(+>NIN<+)O
Neversin's ICQ#: 49439148
"A man's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy,
education, and social ties and needs; no religious basis is necessary. Man
would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of
punishment and hope of reward after death."
- Albert Einstein
SaTim
We had one and when I dropped the needle it was embarrasingly fake.
That other one though, THAT is a good one. The one with the horns and
the reverse sounds going on, THAT is the one I want.
Richard Dower
> Unfortunately it isn't. :(
>
> We had one and when I dropped the needle it was embarrasingly fake.
>
> That other one though, THAT is a good one. The one with the horns and
> the reverse sounds going on, THAT is the one I want.
I know the mix you are talking about, it is an excellent mix, "Dive With
Dolphins" mix...long been on 12" vynal and CD.
I have copies of it somewhere...but it's not a legit remix.
Neversin
> Unfortunately it isn't. :(
>
> We had one and when I dropped the needle it was embarrasingly fake.
>
> That other one though, THAT is a good one. The one with the horns and
> the reverse sounds going on, THAT is the one I want.
How about that "Housequake" testpressing with that Razormade mix on it, is
that a fake too?
Richard Dower
"Neversin" <Nevers...@hotSPAMmail.com> wrote in message
news:Ir4K9.18331$lI4.5...@castor.casema.net...
> How about that "Housequake" testpressing with that Razormade mix on it, is
> that a fake too?
Legit...a CD copy can be found on T.'s "1987" 1CDR.
SaTim
<Nevers...@hotSPAMmail.com> wrote:
>"SaTim" <Sa...@power-post.org> wrote in message
>news:dtfhvu8pue8sqg444...@4ax.com...
>
>> Unfortunately it isn't. :(
>>
>> We had one and when I dropped the needle it was embarrasingly fake.
>>
>> That other one though, THAT is a good one. The one with the horns and
>> the reverse sounds going on, THAT is the one I want.
>
>
>How about that "Housequake" testpressing with that Razormade mix on it, is
>that a fake too?
While it's a fake, it IS in fact an "official" remix..
Prince contacted the guy at Razormaid after hearing a New Order remix
he had done (Unoficial Razormaid Mix) and contracted him to do a
"Video Mix" of Housequake... The guy said NO but Prince ave him
$15,000 and dropped the multi off so the guy kinda HAD to do it
(although he wanted NOTHING to do with Prince in any way).
He sent word that it was done and never heard from Prince again.
In Razormaids clause it states something like "If the tapes aren't
piocked up afgter 30 days Razormaid owns them and can do what they
want with it." Hence the Compilation discs with Housequake on them.
There's the tale....... So sayeth the T :)
>
>Neversin.
Neversin
> While it's a fake, it IS in fact an "official" remix..
> Prince contacted the guy at Razormaid after hearing a New Order remix
> he had done (Unoficial Razormaid Mix) and contracted him to do a
> "Video Mix" of Housequake... The guy said NO but Prince ave him
> $15,000 and dropped the multi off so the guy kinda HAD to do it
> (although he wanted NOTHING to do with Prince in any way).
>
> He sent word that it was done and never heard from Prince again.
>
> In Razormaids clause it states something like "If the tapes aren't
> piocked up afgter 30 days Razormaid owns them and can do what they
> want with it." Hence the Compilation discs with Housequake on them.
>
> There's the tale....... So sayeth the T :)
Cool, thanx!
Ratso
> In Razormaids clause it states something like "If the tapes aren't
> piocked up afgter 30 days Razormaid owns them and can do what they
> want with it." Hence the Compilation discs with Housequake on them.
Ha ha. Check this out, taken from Razormaid's Compliance Statement:
"One of the problems that we have been having lately is 50 year old
artists (I won't mention names) who's careers are over, flat broke and
lot's of time on their hands, seeing our web site. Desperately seeking
a "loop hole" in our contract, they go out and hire a lawyer in an
effort to get additional royalties for something we had permission on
12 years ago. I don't want to elaborate to much, but let me suffice to
say that I do not enjoy looking up contracts from 12 years ago, (where
it states they have waived all future royalty payments in exchange of
me receiving full payment for my services), just to prove our
innocence!"
SaTim
And WHO doubted my word in here in the past?
Uh Huh
KenHold
"handclap" one you had T... and not the reverse horn one either.
Check out this link for some brief clips from the 12" and some .jpg's of
both the white label testpress 12" I'm auctioning and the Artisan Records
testpressing where I assume the recording was mastered.
http://members.aol.com/kenhold/prince/sottremix.swf
-Ken
P.S. The Artisan Records label .jpg's are from the wonderful Prince vinyl
collector site:
http://sleevographia2.free.fr/0Chercher.htm
KenHold
see my .swf file link for snippets and .jpg's.
-Ken
http://members.aol.com/kenhold/prince/sottremix.swf
SOTT unreleased remixes promo testpress 12" for auction:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=1080&item=929029626&rd=1
Richard Dower
> This SOTT testpress 12" is for real, and different from the DMC style
> "handclap" one you had T... and not the reverse horn one either.
> Check out this link for some brief clips from the 12" and some .jpg's
of
> both the white label testpress 12" I'm auctioning and the Artisan Records
> testpressing where I assume the recording was mastered.
Those mixes can be found on "The illusion Continues" 1CD by Thunderball, and
T. is right...they are not legit mixes...not sanctioned or commisioned by
Prince.
Richard Dower
> "handclap" one you had T... and not the reverse horn one either.
> Check out this link for some brief clips from the 12" and some .jpg's
of
> both the white label testpress 12" I'm auctioning and the Artisan Records
> testpressing where I assume the recording was mastered.
Aristan Recorders is the place where the 12" acetate were made, these have
been floating about for years and years.
Neversin
news:20021212220759...@mb-cf.aol.com...
> This SOTT testpress 12" is for real, and different from the DMC style
> "handclap" one you had T... and not the reverse horn one either.
> Check out this link for some brief clips from the 12" and some .jpg's
of
> both the white label testpress 12" I'm auctioning and the Artisan Records
> testpressing where I assume the recording was mastered.
>
> http://members.aol.com/kenhold/prince/sottremix.swf
OK... Now I'm confused...
I have this 12"... But T said it wasn't legit...
And what is that "Horn Mix" version?
Neversin.
--
O(+>NIN<+)O
Neversin's ICQ#: 49439148
SaTim
>I believe T is confusing these testpress mixes with some DMC style remixes...
>see my .swf file link for snippets and .jpg's.
This is the EXACT 12" we had. It's just an edit.
A REAL remix would at LEAST be a different version of the song and not
just a re-edit.
Richard Dower
"Neversin" <Nevers...@hotSPAMmail.com> wrote in message
> OK... Now I'm confused...
> I have this 12"... But T said it wasn't legit...
These are edits created by someone, but Prince never asked nor sanctioned
said edits, the pressing is legit...but they are "fakes" in the sense that
they were not officially authorised.
> And what is that "Horn Mix" version?
That is some DMC remix, very well done...i have it on tape and CDR
somewhere, it's been out years...some cool horns and bassline added, and
yes...they do some reverse stuff at the start and end of the song, the
Bailey edit and King/Lewin re-edit are different tracks.
Neversin
news:atd8cj$m0p$1...@dorito.esatclear.ie...
Ok, thanx...
$300 not well spent I guess... Ah well, can't have it all, right?
KenHold
>This is the EXACT 12" we had. It's just an edit.
>
>A REAL remix would at LEAST be a different version of the song and not
>just a re-edit.
Before you said that the one you were referring to had "some handclaps and
stuff" and was a DMC style mix... which is not the case. Now you're down to
"it's not a REAL remix, it's just an edit (or re-edit). I won't get into
semantics about the differences between a "remix" or "re-edit", but these 2
tracks are both longer than the LP version and have obvious differences. These
are certainly significant in comparison to any of the 7" edits or the Just as
Long as We're Together/Soft and Wet promo "disco mixes".
So I ask you, so I can make sure where you stand now... in your opinion,
are these "legit re-edits" or not?
-Ken
KenHold
>Those mixes can be found on "The illusion Continues" 1CD by Thunderball, and
>T. is right...they are not legit mixes...not sanctioned or commisioned by
>Prince.
It's my opinion, based on the .jpg's of the Artisan Records labels, and
the PRO cat# on the testpress itself that they are legit (sanctioned by Prince
and/or Warner Brothers).
What evidence or information do you have that makes you think otherwise?
-Ken
Richard Dower
> Before you said that the one you were referring to had "some
handclaps and
> stuff" and was a DMC style mix... which is not the case.
I think T. was talking about that DMC remix of When Doves Cry...that has
handclaps, horns and added bassline and stuff.
It's extremely well done and professional, but...a fake remix none the less.
Now you're down to
> "it's not a REAL remix, it's just an edit (or re-edit). I won't get into
> semantics about the differences between a "remix" or "re-edit", but these
2
> tracks are both longer than the LP version and have obvious differences.
These
> are certainly significant in comparison to any of the 7" edits or the Just
as
> Long as We're Together/Soft and Wet promo "disco mixes".
> So I ask you, so I can make sure where you stand now... in your
opinion,
> are these "legit re-edits" or not?
These were edits, correct...but the edits were not authorised or sanctioned
by Prince, they were something done by the folks at Aristan
recorders....they were making test 12" and pressing stuff for him back then,
some guys might have just done some edits on their lunch hour or something.
But the Razormaid remix of Housequake is legit, IMO...why?...Prince paid the
guy to do it, sent him the multitrack and asked him to do it.
So when T. said that remix was a fake yesterday he was wrong, it was
authorised and commisioned.
When Prince heard it he didn't like it and lost interest, which is why
Razormaid can still use the song and release it to this day, they now own
the rights...it's in the CONtract.
Richard Dower
"Neversin" <Nevers...@hotSPAMmail.com> wrote in message
> Ok, thanx...
> $300 not well spent I guess... Ah well, can't have it all, right?
Their is more Aristan stuff floating about, i remember some multi vynal 12"
set being sold (different item), and also those SOTT edits..i have also seen
an actual metal 12" acetate, not the plastic vynal....the 12" acetate they
make the vynal from....if i'm technically correct.
KenHold
>Aristan Recorders is the place where the 12" acetate were made, these have
>been floating about for years and years.
So there's no misunderstanding, by "unreleased", I mean that the tracks
were not officially released. I was not inferring that they had never made it
to bootleg or copies weren't circulating among fans.
I realize that to a bootlegger or bootleg/outtake aficionado this is of
little interest, but to a Prince record/collectables collector it probably is.
-Ken
Richard Dower
> It's my opinion, based on the .jpg's of the Artisan Records labels,
and
> the PRO cat# on the testpress itself that they are legit (sanctioned by
Prince
> and/or Warner Brothers).
Aristan recorders have nothing to do with WB, it's a private company in
Burbank, they make test pressings, metal acetates etc.
You are correct, the *actual* item you have is legit, it's a legit item that
came out of Aristan recorders, but what is not legit is the fact that these
two edits were created by someone, and not something Prince himself asked
for or authorised.
I can't comment on what WB may have asked for...we simply don't know.
> What evidence or information do you have that makes you think
otherwise?
These items i have seen for sale since 1995, i heard the mixes back then and
saw the pictures of them, later i had the stuff i my hands.
Richard Dower
>
> So there's no misunderstanding, by "unreleased", I mean that the
tracks
> were not officially released.
The edits were not officially released...correct, but that is not to say
they are edits that were made specifically on request of Prince.
I was not inferring that they had never made it
> to bootleg or copies weren't circulating among fans.
> I realize that to a bootlegger or bootleg/outtake aficionado this is
of
> little interest, but to a Prince record/collectables collector it probably
is.
I agree it's an interesting item, but one must question if from a collectors
standpoint the price tag is worth the ownership, i remember guys paying
$1,000 for these babies a few years back.
A certain collector got hold of it, and Thunderball snagged the edits for
the boot.
SaTim
Dude, I'd LOVE these to be real, because then we'd have another great
piece in our collections. BUT, it just isn't real. Don't you think
that they would have done a TRUE REMIX rather than just edit
extensions onto the song?
Also,
The date, TWO YEARS after the song was actually released, WHY?
Artisan Records, Mastering of Prince stuff on Warners had been done at
Grundman.
By DMC Mix I was reffering to the way they do these "Extended Remixes"
(ie. New Position). Which are EXACTLY what these are.
Handclaps, I seem to remember strange handclaps throughout... I could
be wrong as I listened to the record ONCE, determined it was fake, and
passed it along.
I SERIOUSLY ain't trying to dog ya man, I'm just adding my two cents.
I have been collecting a LONG time and have basically everything out
there that falls into the category this record is being put into and
this one just isn't real. If someone from Warners comes in and gives
me proof that for some reason they were gonna re-release the single
in 1989 as a wierd "extended edit" than I will believe and track this
down again. Until then it's PAINFULLY obvious that this is an
unofficial DJ record.
As for the Just As Long As We're Together 12". THOSE mixes are
COMPLETELY different than the LP versions. What do you mean by what
you are saying? That the SOTT "EDITS" are more different than their
original LP version than the JALAWT / S&W 12" is????? That's SO not
the case, The JALAWT mix is DRASTICALLY different as far down as
MISSING INSTRUMENTS and a different mixdown in general, whereas the
SOTT is just the LP version extended by looping regions of the song
and not adding or deleting ANY of the tracks evident in the LP mix.
Had there been an extra lyric or something I could make justice of the
SOTT mixes, but instead they are just re-edits of the LP version that
anyone could have done.
Sorry dude, fake fake fake.
T
>
>-Ken
SaTim
ken man, I can press a record and scratch any number I want in the
dang thing.
Artisan Reciords never did anything for Prince with Warners.
>
>-Ken
SaTim
>Richard Dower wrote:
>
>>Aristan Recorders is the place where the 12" acetate were made, these have
>>been floating about for years and years.
>
> So there's no misunderstanding, by "unreleased", I mean that the tracks
>were not officially released. I was not inferring that they had never made it
>to bootleg or copies weren't circulating among fans.
There IS a misunderstanding, if it's not REAL it makes no difference
weather it's "released" or "unreleased". Like I said, if it had maybe
as little as an added "uh" in it or an extra guitar part that was
edited of the LP version than MAYBE I would say OK... But there's
NOTHING like that here.
Ken man, go get a Mica Paris 12" or something..... But this one ain't
gonna get ya no where. :)
> I realize that to a bootlegger or bootleg/outtake aficionado this is of
>little interest, but to a Prince record/collectables collector it probably is.
If it were real.............
>
>-Ken
KenHold
>These were edits, correct...but the edits were not authorised or sanctioned
>by Prince, they were something done by the folks at Aristan
>recorders....they were making test 12" and pressing stuff for him back then,
>some guys might have just done some edits on their lunch hour or something.
>
You say that Artisan was making test 12" and pressings for Prince back
then. What proof then can you offer that they were not authorized or
sanctioned? You suppose and hypothesize that some guys might have done some
edits on their lunch hour "or something". Unless you have some concrete
evidence or specific information, it's just as likely (or more likely) they
were sanctioned by Prince or Warner Brothers.. isn't it?
-Ken
Richard Dower
> Dude, I'd LOVE these to be real, because then we'd have another great
> piece in our collections. BUT, it just isn't real. Don't you think
> that they would have done a TRUE REMIX rather than just edit
> extensions onto the song?
> Also,
> The date, TWO YEARS after the song was actually released, WHY?
The date on the acetate is March 1987..23rd if memory serves, Prince was in
Minneapolis at the time.
KenHold
>they were something done by the folks at Aristan
>>recorders....they were making test 12" and pressing >stuff for him back then,
Then Richard Dower wrote:
>Artisan Reciords never did anything for Prince with >Warners.
Ummmm.... I don't think I need to know anything more... thanks.
-Ken
Richard Dower
> Richard Dower wrote:
>
> >they were something done by the folks at Aristan
> >>recorders....they were making test 12" and pressing >stuff for him back
then,
They could mean WB.....they might have asked for some edits to be done, no
one really knows...but Prince never did.
>
> Then Richard Dower wrote:
>
> >Artisan Reciords never did anything for Prince with >Warners.
>
> Ummmm.... I don't think I need to know anything more... thanks.
Bernie Grundman mastering is located in Burbank, Prince has always used him,
i was going by what you said about WB being possibly involved, unless they
had Aristan do something independent.
KenHold
crossed in the European style.
Happy Tracking!
-Ken
P.S. How do you manage to listen to a record once, dis-remember that it had
handclaps and yet remember how all of the other instrumentation was mixed? The
mix on these sounds different to me with instruments (or perhaps parts dropped
out), but I'll be the first to admit I really don't know anything about how
these mixes were done.
I know you're not trying to dog me, and I don't mind the discussion. I
just know getting you to admit you could have been mistaken is gonna be a tall
order ;).
T D'Aquino
Ken is obsessed with his 12" being official :)
What's your address man, I'll send ya a 51 Hrs 12" for you to put your
energy into instead of this one :)
>
>-Ken
>
T D'Aquino
yeah but Ken, come on man, look at who you are talking to :)
I have the SOTT Test Pressing, the LP Test Pressing that is... It's
not Artisan.
>
>-Ken
T D'Aquino
>T... look at BOTH .jpg's again closely, the date is '87 not '89. The 7's are
>crossed in the European style.
>
>Happy Tracking!
HA! Happy Tracking :)
>-Ken
>
>P.S. How do you manage to listen to a record once, dis-remember that it had
>handclaps and yet remember how all of the other instrumentation was mixed? The
>mix on these sounds different to me with instruments (or perhaps parts dropped
>out), but I'll be the first to admit I really don't know anything about how
>these mixes were done.
Dude, I know what I'm doing.. I KNOW how the LP version sounds, and I
have been re-editing stuff for YEARS. Since I was a little boy, I
KNOW What's uup with the process and what it sounds like when it is
done. TRUST ME! :)
> I know you're not trying to dog me, and I don't mind the discussion. I
>just know getting you to admit you could have been mistaken is gonna be a tall
>order ;).
Hee HAAAAAA!!!!!!! :) Got Dan Right! :)
Listen man, I can admit I'm wrong, WHEN I am wrong! :)
if it were real I would own it, I DO NOT and never cared to after
hearing it and KNOWING it was just done by someone and not something
"real".
For crying out loud man, I own TWO DIFFERENT pressings of the TRAITOR
12"... THAT has NOTHING to do with Prince yet I have it. I got them
all JUST to prove they were fakes... Should I buy this 12" from you
just to toss into my "This is bullshnig" pile alongside the Mona Lisa
"Qualified Kiss" 12" that People use to SWEAR (as you are here) was
Prince? :)
Now, if ya wanna talk REAL... Let's talk about the valve stem caps
that Lib stole off of Prince's BMW last Celebration. Now THAT is
REAL! ;)
leeharrisonline.com
>just know getting you to admit you could have been mistaken is gonna be a
>tall
>order ;).
>
T's not wrong.
The sample I heard was the exact same album version with those annoying 1980's
edit "sampler" tricks ala Duran Duran's Re Flex Flex Flex Flex Flex
It's just someone splicing a tape a whole bunch or messing with an early
sampler.
Lee
http://www.leeharrisonline.com
Pimple in Dutch is pukkel.
Billy
actually like it.
--
~~Billy~~
ICQ#: 40523352
Purple Funk
"T D'Aquino" <DAQUIN...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ugkkvu8s7b6125c9f...@4ax.com...
: >
:
:
KenHold
>
>What's your address man, I'll send ya a 51 Hrs 12" for you to put your
>energy into instead of this one :)
>
51 Hours? No, I don't think that's something WB's authorized, so it's not
real ;). Seriously though T, how many of those things do you have tucked away?
I'm of the opinion that the SOTT 12" is "real", although I'm not sure any
consensus has been reached as to what "real" or "legit" means. Is it "real"
only if Prince mixed it himself? Is it "real" only if Prince himself
authorized it? Is it "real" only if Prince and/or Warner Brothers authorized
it (most would agree on this one). Is it "real" only if it's a "remix" instead
of just a "re-edit"? I don't know that there is going to be a consensus on all
of these things.
Things we do know... Artisan Records mastered these recordings and made a
pressing with Artisan labels, dates, and info. There is also a white label
testpressing with a "PRO"-type cat# commonly used by WB's.
Everything else has been opinion, speculation or completely baseless
statements.
Here's my opinion based on what we do know... it doesn't seem unreasonable
to believe that WB's and/or Prince commisioned some re-edits for a possible
second promo 12" for SOTT, made up some testpressings after the recordings had
been mastered at Artisan, then scrapped the idea.
On the cover of the 12" there's a handwritten sticker which says "Sign O'
The Times, unreleased version, withdrawn testpressing." While it's true any
previous owner could have written that and put it on, it does agree with me ;).
I know there was a serious collector from here in California who sold one
of these back in the early-mid 90's for $400. Maybe someone still has some
contact with him. He had some interesting stuff and obviously some connections
at WB's.. he was selling the unreleased J-cards and O-cards for Carmen Electra
and Ingrid and Mavis and such... e-mail was started with THX I believe.
-Ken
Billy
yeah he's cool guy, that's who I picked my Vanity 6 CD up from a couple
years ago. I think he pretty much cleared his collection out.
--
~~Billy~~
ICQ#: 40523352
Purple Funk
"KenHold" <ken...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20021213211752...@mb-cf.aol.com...
: >Ken is obsessed with his 12" being official :)
:
KenHold
>just to toss into my "This is bullshnig" pile alongside the Mona Lisa
>"Qualified Kiss" 12" that People use to SWEAR (as you are here) was
>Prince? :)
I'm not "swearing" anything, it's just my opinion based on the available
evidence at my disposal. I've heard a lot of jumping up and down saying "it's
fake" but now it's slid a bit more to "it's not interesting to me". You're
certainly entitled to your opinion, but I need some facts if you're going to
sway mine.
It doesn't help that Richard is proclaiming what Prince did or didn't
authorize, giving meaningless info like "Prince was in MPLS at the time". On
the other hand, he did mention that people have paid $1000 for the SOTT 12" and
that Thunderball got ahold of them from a collector.
>
>Now, if ya wanna talk REAL... Let's talk about the valve stem caps
>that Lib stole off of Prince's BMW last Celebration. Now THAT is
>REAL! ;)
>
I had jury duty on a case where they claimed that the valve stems were
left off a Ford Explorer at the factory and that could have been to blame for a
crash that ended in 2 people losing there lives. Of course it was bullshit, it
was driver error, but the guy got off anyway from manslaughter charges.
-Ken
KenHold
>
>yeah he's cool guy, that's who I picked my Vanity 6 CD up from a couple
>years ago. I think he pretty much cleared his collection out.
>
I believe it ended with aol.com. Very nice guy. I bought one item from
him long ago. Just wondered if anyone had contact with him.. if he had any
info.
-Ken
Billy
e=UTF-8&scoring=r&selm=20001116162626.08866.00000103%40ng-fz1.aol.com&rnum=5
this was the thread on AMP back in 2000, it's him.
--
~~Billy~~
ICQ#: 40523352
Purple Funk
"KenHold" <ken...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20021213214317...@mb-cf.aol.com...
: >THX????@aol.com
:
:
T
>"SaTim" <Sa...@power-post.org> wrote in message
>news:5ttjvukafabhq8kgf...@4ax.com...
>> On 13 Dec 2002 03:15:29 GMT, ken...@aol.com (KenHold) wrote:
>>
>> >I believe T is confusing these testpress mixes with some DMC style
>remixes...
>> >see my .swf file link for snippets and .jpg's.
>>
>> This is the EXACT 12" we had. It's just an edit.
>>
>> A REAL remix would at LEAST be a different version of the song and not
>> just a re-edit.
>
>So is the U Got the Look "EP" bogus too? I seem to remember it being hawked
>by the same people who were talking about the SOTT "remixes"...?
Put it this way, if the UGTL "acetate" or whatever it was was
legit.... Wouldn't we have the mixes?
Case closed.
>
>
>
T
>>Ken is obsessed with his 12" being official :)
>>
>>What's your address man, I'll send ya a 51 Hrs 12" for you to put your
>>energy into instead of this one :)
>>
>
> 51 Hours? No, I don't think that's something WB's authorized, so it's not
>real ;). Seriously though T, how many of those things do you have tucked away?
I think I have 3 left out of about 10 or 15.... I didn't count them,
I tossed 30 out into the wind to make folks feel there were alot of
trhem for some reason, as if 30 is "alot" :)
> I'm of the opinion that the SOTT 12" is "real", although I'm not sure any
>consensus has been reached as to what "real" or "legit" means. Is it "real"
>only if Prince mixed it himself?
That would be real (which THIS is not under these circumstances))
> Is it "real" only if Prince himself
>authorized it?
Prince "Authorized the Razormaid Housequake mix but I can't say that
the initial Razormaid release is "real" ....... The MIX is though.
Your SOTT 12" is NOT under these circumstances either. ;)
> Is it "real" only if Prince and/or Warner Brothers authorized
>it (most would agree on this one).
Of course...... But your 12" is not. ;)
>Is it "real" only if it's a "remix" instead
>of just a "re-edit"? >
Absolutely not. I can re-edit something, it wouldn't be "real" though
>I don't know that there is going to be a consensus on all
>of these things.
> Things we do know... Artisan Records mastered these recordings and made a
>pressing with Artisan labels, dates, and info. There is also a white label
>testpressing with a "PRO"-type cat# commonly used by WB's.
> Everything else has been opinion, speculation or completely baseless
>statements.
Um, proof.....
MY test pressing of the SOTT LP is done by Bernie Grundman
studios......
My SOTT retail release, 12", 12" promo were all done by BGM. Guess
what, PROOF!
> Here's my opinion based on what we do know... it doesn't seem unreasonable
>to believe that WB's and/or Prince commisioned some re-edits for a possible
>second promo 12" for SOTT, made up some testpressings after the recordings had
>been mastered at Artisan, then scrapped the idea.
Here's my opinion based on what we do know. there was only ONE song
actually CHANGED and included on a 12" release..... HOT THI(NG. The
REST of the SOTT singles were all released as LP versions on their
respective 12"s... WHY ON EARTH would he release a crappy edit of the
first single as a 12"? Why wouldn't he Remix the song the same way he
ALWAYS did or release an EXTENDED VERSION (which does NOT mean
EXTENDED EDIT BTW)?
> On the cover of the 12" there's a handwritten sticker which says "Sign O'
>The Times, unreleased version, withdrawn testpressing." While it's true any
>previous owner could have written that and put it on, it does agree with me ;).
So does some dude who paid alot more than it's worth ;)
> I know there was a serious collector from here in California who sold one
>of these back in the early-mid 90's for $400. Maybe someone still has some
>contact with him. He had some interesting stuff and obviously some connections
>at WB's.. he was selling the unreleased J-cards and O-cards for Carmen Electra
>and Ingrid and Mavis and such... e-mail was started with THX I believe.
Yup........ I can tell you the whole story behind this too....
The THX address belongs to a guy named MB who IS legit. However,
there were THREE guys in that clan, ONE of which made COPIES of "In
House" cassettes and sold them as real, now MB DID NOT as far as I
know, BUT..... There was ALOT of "dd' pieces in this set and this
SOTT 12" was one evidentally.
You can't test me bro, I know ALL ;)
>
>-Ken
>
T
>T wrote:
>
>>just to toss into my "This is bullshnig" pile alongside the Mona Lisa
>>"Qualified Kiss" 12" that People use to SWEAR (as you are here) was
>>Prince? :)
>
> I'm not "swearing" anything, it's just my opinion based on the available
>evidence at my disposal. I've heard a lot of jumping up and down saying "it's
>fake" but now it's slid a bit more to "it's not interesting to me". You're
>certainly entitled to your opinion, but I need some facts if you're going to
>sway mine.
> It doesn't help that Richard is proclaiming what Prince did or didn't
>authorize, giving meaningless info like "Prince was in MPLS at the time". On
>the other hand, he did mention that people have paid $1000 for the SOTT 12" and
>that Thunderball got ahold of them from a collector.
Man, Dick is killfiled here... I have NO idea about anuything your
saying he said here.
Anyway, this whole thing si definately NOT my "opinion" it's absolte
fact, and you can HEAR that by listening to the edits.
>>Now, if ya wanna talk REAL... Let's talk about the valve stem caps
>>that Lib stole off of Prince's BMW last Celebration. Now THAT is
>>REAL! ;)
>>
>
> I had jury duty on a case where they claimed that the valve stems were
>left off a Ford Explorer at the factory and that could have been to blame for a
>crash that ended in 2 people losing there lives. Of course it was bullshit, it
>was driver error, but the guy got off anyway from manslaughter charges.
God dang Dick Dower, he'll stop at NOTHING to get an MP3 of a Prince
song.
NOTHING I say!
>
>-Ken
>
KenHold
>I think I have 3 left out of about 10 or 15.... I didn't count them,
>I tossed 30 out into the wind to make folks feel there were alot of
>trhem for some reason, as if 30 is "alot" :)
You mean you fib to suit your own whims? Shock! :) I've seen a few of
the 51 Hours being auctioned on Ebay by different people over the past few
years, and I rarely look for Prince stuff. I wouldn't be surprised if there
were 30 or more floating around.
>The THX address belongs to a guy named MB who IS legit. However,
>there were THREE guys in that clan, ONE of which made COPIES of "In
>House" cassettes and sold them as real, now MB DID NOT as far as I
>know, BUT..... There was ALOT of "dd' pieces in this set and this
>SOTT 12" was one evidentally.
What is a "dd" piece? The address was THHxxx if you're thinking about
someone else. His name is Todd (thus the "T" in THH). I was able to get in
touch with him and he was nice enough to reply even though he's been out of
Prince collecting for a while. He said that he can't really remember if the
mixes were "fake" or not, but his impression was that they were.
Anyway, I've ended the auction for the 12". I wrote in the description
that it was "an authentic WB's testpressing". Until the origin of the Artisan
pressing and/or the whitelabel pressing can be pinned down, I'm not going to
possibly mislead someone into paying several hundred dollars for something,
giving possibly false information. The burdens of having a conscience :).
(note to Prince: look into it).
-Ken
T
>T wrote:
>
>>I think I have 3 left out of about 10 or 15.... I didn't count them,
>>I tossed 30 out into the wind to make folks feel there were alot of
>>trhem for some reason, as if 30 is "alot" :)
>
> You mean you fib to suit your own whims? Shock! :) I've seen a few of
>the 51 Hours being auctioned on Ebay by different people over the past few
>years, and I rarely look for Prince stuff. I wouldn't be surprised if there
>were 30 or more floating around.
Trust me man, I owned each and every single one made.
>>The THX address belongs to a guy named MB who IS legit. However,
>>there were THREE guys in that clan, ONE of which made COPIES of "In
>>House" cassettes and sold them as real, now MB DID NOT as far as I
>>know, BUT..... There was ALOT of "dd' pieces in this set and this
>>SOTT 12" was one evidentally.
>
> What is a "dd" piece? The address was THHxxx if you're thinking about
>someone else. His name is Todd (thus the "T" in THH). I was able to get in
>touch with him and he was nice enough to reply even though he's been out of
>Prince collecting for a while. He said that he can't really remember if the
>mixes were "fake" or not, but his impression was that they were.
Oops, sorry. You're right. Todd was his name. See, there were three
people in a oup that sold off alot of Warner In House stuff. Todd was
the third guy. The other two were the ones who actually WORKED for WB
and GOT the stuff. Todd evidentally ripped the other guys off and now
they won't associate with him. Todd was always cool when I spoke to
him (which was only a few times) But I am pretty good friends with
the other two guys and they filled me in on everything.
> Anyway, I've ended the auction for the 12". I wrote in the description
>that it was "an authentic WB's testpressing". Until the origin of the Artisan
>pressing and/or the whitelabel pressing can be pinned down, I'm not going to
>possibly mislead someone into paying several hundred dollars for something,
>giving possibly false information. The burdens of having a conscience :).
>(note to Prince: look into it).
You are a nobleman my friend. So can I offer ya $100 ;)
Just kidding :)
I dohowever want the For You JapCD. Wanna trade?
>
>-Ken
>
The Collector
who are the other 2 in the clan you talked about ? (are they SS and JG ?)
can you say anything about the tapes SS sold ? are those fake ones ?
do you know the story about the remixes of 7 ?
please let us know
TJ
http://users.skynet.be/yormeister
"SaTim" <Sa...@power-post.org> schreef in bericht
news:afckvu0ktp3kama7g...@4ax.com...
KenHold
>You are a nobleman my friend. So can I offer ya $100 ;)
>
>Just kidding :)
>
>I dohowever want the For You JapCD. Wanna trade?
I'm not going to cancel any of the other auctions as I'm trying to raise
some extra Christmas cash. I don't think I've bought or traded for any items
in a few years now.
I may have some other things you might be interested in if you have some
particular things (official/promo) you're interested in trading. Contact via
e-mail.
-Ken
T
<fa30...@skynet.be> wrote:
>T,
>who are the other 2 in the clan you talked about ? (are they SS and JG ?)
>can you say anything about the tapes SS sold ? are those fake ones ?
>do you know the story about the remixes of 7 ?
>please let us know
The tapes SS sold were speculated to be fakes because they were
purchased from Todd. This is one of the reasonsthe other guys
wouldn't be bothered by Todd anymore.
I told SS the story and he wouldn't believe it so........
Not sure who JG is.
The 7 cassette, that one I asked my friend (one of the other two)
about and he said he had no recollection of the tape. Being that
EVERYTHING Todd had gotten was from him that one is a dead end to me.
The mixes are real, but the legitamacy of the tapes a few of you
bought is definately in question since there seems to be several out
there but only one original.
T
Bart Van Hemelen
rumoured that ken...@aol.com (KenHold) spake thus on the subject of
"Re: FA: Prince SOTT 12" UNRELEASED MIXES Testpress Promo!" in
alt.music.prince:
>I believe T is confusing these testpress mixes with some DMC style remixes...
>see my .swf file link for snippets and .jpg's.
>
>http://members.aol.com/kenhold/prince/sottremix.swf
Uhm... How can you even think these are real? They're quite obviously
amateur remixes.
--
Bart Van Hemelen
http://pr1nc3.com/BVH/
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T
<tenthousa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>In the dim and distant past on 13 Dec 2002 03:15:29 GMT, it was
>rumoured that ken...@aol.com (KenHold) spake thus on the subject of
>"Re: FA: Prince SOTT 12" UNRELEASED MIXES Testpress Promo!" in
>alt.music.prince:
>
>>I believe T is confusing these testpress mixes with some DMC style remixes...
>>see my .swf file link for snippets and .jpg's.
>>
>>http://members.aol.com/kenhold/prince/sottremix.swf
>
>Uhm... How can you even think these are real? They're quite obviously
>amateur remixes.
Edits Barto, edits..........
Jolene Davies
"Standing At The Altar", "Neon Telephone", "The Bird", those 2 versions of
"Beautiful" on the UK 12".
But they're still fake ;-)
I've got one of those "51 Hours" 12"s. Are there really only 15 in
existance? I got mine sealed, although I've now opened it. The $200 I paid
seems a little cheap if that's all there is.
"Bart Van Hemelen" <tenthousa...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:rpbqvu0au6aqqb6kp...@4ax.com...
T
<Jolene....@btopenworld.com> wrote:
>They're no worse or more pointless than the official remixes/edits of
>"Standing At The Altar", "Neon Telephone", "The Bird", those 2 versions of
>"Beautiful" on the UK 12".
>But they're still fake ;-)
Standing At The Altar, Neon Telephone, Beautiful all had extra stuff
on them. The Bird was just an edit something like the SOTT posted
here. But The Bird was real :)
>I've got one of those "51 Hours" 12"s. Are there really only 15 in
>existance? I got mine sealed, although I've now opened it. The $200 I paid
>seems a little cheap if that's all there is.
$200 IS cheap because I have never sold one out for under $350.
I wish I could remember how many were in that box exactly, but I'm
estimating them at around 15 now (I originally said 30).
Rogue588
"I've got one of those "51 Hours" 12"s. Are there really only 15 in
seems a little cheap if that's all there is."
To which T replied:
"$200 IS cheap because I have never sold one out for under $350.
I wish I could remember how many were in that box exactly, but I'm
estimating them at around 15 now (I originally said 30)."
Damn. So I guess I STOLE my sealed copy for $50.
--
Rogue588.
"trust...who do ya?"
Mr. Nelson
wrote:
God yes! Where on earth did you find THAT?