Re: Terry Clements Or Red Shea?
Richard Harison
quarter tones--something not heard too often in western music
--
All the Best
Richard Harison
"Jesse- Joe" <lightf...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1154563392.9...@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>
> posted June 25, 2006 08:37 AM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> The Red years were 2 guitars and a bass. The Terry years have included
> a larger band, with drums, keyboards, pedal steel, etc.
>
> Yeah, I love Red's work on the early recordings, but I can't imagine
> Sundown, for instance, w/o Terry's electic lead.
~~snip
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Richard Harison
used thumb & index. Red & I used thumb, index & middle, although we both bailed
out using the ring finger when absolutely necessary to hit a melody note without
breaking the pattern. Additionally, Red also uses a style called in Nashville
"chicken pickin'" i.e. -- gripping a flat pick and using middle & ring for the
Travis effect. Most famous advocates of that style are Glen Campbell and Roger
McGuinn.
The theory is that cross picking with a flat gives you more speed--notes/second.
Probably true-- but listen to Red's playing on CRT (original UA) after the line
"all the battles have been won." Red is using only his thumb and index to get
that! He taught me how to do it, but best day in my life, I could barely keep
up with him.
But the determining factor is Red's ability to meld his left hand with his
right. I was looking at a video of "Mountains and Maryann" recently and noticed
something I knew so very well. Red played a lot of parallel thirds, sliding
between them. The mindblower is that he made it look effortless--never even
looking at his fingerboard--just smiling.
--
All the Best
Richard Harison
"Jesse- Joe" <lightf...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1154563392.9...@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>
> posted June 25, 2006 08:37 AM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>
> Red Shea or Terry Clements?
>
> Who do you prefer as Gord's lead guitarist. For me in the late 60's in,
> 'The New Penelope,' Coffee House in Montreal, Quebec. Gordon doing "Did
> She Mention MY Name," Gord {12 string,} Red Shea {6 string,} and Rick
> Haynes {Bass}.
>
>
> That to me, was the best of Lightfoot. Classic Canadian Icon, Legend,
> Poet, Genius, Master, Gordon Lightfoot.
>
> Red Shea was really making those strings, Dangled and Jangled of that
> ol' guitarin...JJ.
>
> [ June 25, 2006, 10:05: Message edited by: Jesse -Joe ]
>
> --------------------
> Jessi-Jo says you had better stay home...
> from the ice cap far away.
> "Flyin Blind"
> {gl} ~ 2004 ~
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> IP: Logged |
>
> halocat
> Member
> Member # 75
>
> posted June 25, 2006 10:49 AM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> I posted the same comments a couple of years ago, much to the chagrin
> of some on the board. I like Terry, have met him, and he is a great
> guy, but Red Shea, in my humble opinion, is the best - just listen to
> IYCRMM, Miguel, Minstrel of the Dawn, and then compare to Terry's
> single note, repeating the melody leads - no comparison IMHO.
> Sorry Terry!
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> IP: Logged |
>
> New 12 String Mike
> Member
> Member # 1201
>
> posted June 25, 2006 12:39 PM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Is there really a comparison?
>
> Gord's music changed from the Red years, to the Terry years.
>
> The Red years were 2 guitars and a bass. The Terry years have included
> a larger band, with drums, keyboards, pedal steel, etc.
>
> Yeah, I love Red's work on the early recordings, but I can't imagine
> Sundown, for instance, w/o Terry's electic lead.
>
> Things change.
>
> --------------------
> In my fashion, I have been a father...
>
> Here in my off again, on again smile.
>
> Mike
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> IP: Logged |
>
> Jesse -Joe
> Member
> Member # 1348
>
> posted June 25, 2006 12:57 PM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> You know you are both correct. But if you have to choose between the
> music of yesteryears and todays. I much prefer yesteryears. The music
> was simpler. I guess that's the real question. Early Lightfoot or
> todays Lightfoot? Red Shea was most enjoyable, with the more hits.
> Listen to the beginning of the songs 'halocat', mentioned plus songs
> like, 'Magnificent Outpouring', Rosana, Im Not Sayin. The latter 2 I
> both learned how to play the opening riffs, from Gordon Lightfoot
> Anthology Vol {1}, created by Red Shea.
>
> [ June 25, 2006, 13:32: Message edited by: Jesse -Joe ]
>
> --------------------
> Jessi-Jo says you had better stay home...
> from the ice cap far away.
> "Flyin Blind"
> {gl} ~ 2004 ~
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> IP: Logged |
>
> closetcanadian
> Member
> Member # 556
>
> posted June 25, 2006 01:23 PM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Terry Clements is a very fine musician and a fine flat pick guitarist.
> But I bet even Terry himself would admit he is nowhere near the
> guitarist Red Shea is. I agree completely with halocat's comments,
> there really is no comparison between the two.
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> IP: Logged |
>
> Jesse -Joe
> Member
> Member # 1348
>
> posted July 23, 2006 10:58 AM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Any Newbies want to give there opinions here?
>
> --------------------
> Jessi-Jo says you had better stay home...
> from the ice cap far away.
> "Flyin Blind"
> {gl} ~ 2004 ~
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> IP: Logged |
>
> Daylight Matty
> Member
> Member # 1407
>
> posted July 24, 2006 10:44 AM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> In my opinion, they are of equals. My favorite Gord albums have Red and
> Terry like Sundown, Don Quixote, and Cold On The Shoulder. I couldn't
> imagine what those albums would be like without one or the other.
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> IP: Logged |
>
> Cathy
> Member
> Member # 346
>
> posted July 24, 2006 11:17 AM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> quote:
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Originally posted by halocat:
> I posted the same comments a couple of years ago, much to the chagrin
> of some on the board. I like Terry, have met him, and he is a great
> guy, but Red Shea, in my humble opinion, is the best - just listen to
> IYCRMM, Miguel, Minstrel of the Dawn, and then compare to Terry's
> single note, repeating the melody leads - no comparison IMHO.
> Sorry Terry!
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I agree 100%. Terry and Red have different style, and both are great
> guitar players. But I like Red's fingerpicking. I think Terry may be
> better on the rockier songs, where he can turn on some distortion and
> really do some ad libbing... like Baby Step Back and Sundown. I'm just
> no good at playing that style, and a little better at playing Red's
> style. Sometimes I think he must have a couple extra fingers on each
> hand, though.
>
> --------------------
> Cathy
> http://www.cathycowette.com
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> IP: Logged |
>
> Kenyon
> Member
> Member # 603
>
> posted July 24, 2006 02:25 PM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> I think both Red and Terry are incredible guitarists each with their
> own unique style.
>
> Red Shea is definitely one of the great guitarists of modern music,
> there is no question. His fingerpicking techniques and innovative
> phrasings helped define the early "Lightfoot Sound". I know many people
> equate Gordon Lightfoot with the original trio of Lightfoot, Shea, and
> John Stockfish.
>
> Terry Clements is also very creative in his phrasing and has created
> many famous Lightfoot licks like the opening of the Edmund Fitzgerald,
> Race Among the Ruins, Cold on the Shoulder, and Endless Wire. If you
> ever watch him in concert, he is incredibly subtle and knows just when
> to come in and when to let Lightfoot take the spotlight. He is also
> incredibly precise. If anyone has a copy of the 1973 Soundstage
> appearance, his guitar playing is nothing short of perfect.
>
> Lightfoot has long been known to choose exceptional musicians and these
> two guitarists are a prime example of the calibre of music Lightfoot is
> known to produce. Much of his success belongs to his incredibly tight
> road-hardened band. Rarely do they miss a beat.
>
> Kenyon
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> IP: Logged |
>
> brink-
> Member
> Member # 366
>
> posted July 24, 2006 02:45 PM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Kenyon - I think we should put a bug in Bernie's ear......they need to
> hire you as their promoter! Nice post! Well thought out and concise.
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> IP: Logged |
>
> lighthead2toe
> Member
> Member # 1057
>
> posted July 26, 2006 03:36 PM
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> I've always been troubled by this topic and I guess it's because of the
> sensitivity of it's nature. Having lived in Toronto though and grown
> with the evolution of the Lightfoot sound, and watching Red Shea and
> John Stockfish coming into the band, I once remember saying: "how can
> you top that?" I agree fully with what Kenyon wrote and could not have
> said it better. Also, knowing Kenyon, and having jammed with him his
> words are coming from a Lightfoot listener with a keen ear and a guy
> who can play and sing the songs with the best of them. I always learn
> from these kind of folks. RJ.
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cathy Cowette
two fingers. I almost always use my thumb and three fingers. Hey, they grew
there, so I'm going to use them!
I'm always in a state of amazement when watching old videos. Red made it all
look so easy. He has the best of both worlds. He knows how to fingerpick AND
play solos on an electric guitar, using a pick. And he definitely knows
chord variations up and down the neck, something I didn't take the time to
learn. Maybe I should dig the guitar out and experiment a little. Or maybe
I'm just happy with the sliver of guitar knowledge I already possess. :)
Cathy
http://www/cathycowette.com
"Richard Harison" <no...@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:11548184...@donna.bmts.com...
ran...@telus.net
the stuff you post is totally out of my scope but I love reading it
and although I don"t always understand it up front, when I listen to
the tunes you are talking about, it all seems to come together in a
slow and methodical way. It's great that you come here and share with
us. I could live and die listening to the guitar work that Red Shea
does in that United Artists recording of The Canadian Railroad Trilogy.
I remember in the movie "Amadeus" when that silly emperor made the
reference "there are too many notes" in Mozart's music. Well, when I
listen to what Red does on the guitar there in that part of "all the
battles have been won," I lean back and say: Gee, I wish Gord had put
in a few extra lyrics to accommodate that guitar work. It seems like
Red was on a light ray of creativity when that version was recorded. I
would love to have been there behind the glass in the studio to see it
for real. No question he did have those extra fingers and he sure know
Richard Harison
--
All the Best
Richard Harison
news:1155610158.7...@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> Just discovered this post Richard and I have to confess that most of
> the stuff you post is totally out of my scope but I love reading it
> and although I don"t always understand it up front, when I listen to
> the tunes you are talking about, it all seems to come together in a
> slow and methodical way. It's great that you come here and share with
> us. I could live and die listening to the guitar work that Red Shea
> does in that United Artists recording of The Canadian Railroad Trilogy.
> I remember in the movie "Amadeus" when that silly emperor made the
> reference "there are too many notes" in Mozart's music. Well, when I
> listen to what Red does on the guitar there in that part of "all the
> battles have been won," I lean back and say: Gee, I wish Gord had put
> in a few extra lyrics to accommodate that guitar work. It seems like
> Red was on a light ray of creativity when that version was recorded. I
> would love to have been there behind the glass in the studio to see it
> for real. No question he did have those extra fingers and he sure know
> how to put them to work. Many thanks, Ron Jones.
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nor...@hotmail.com
ago sums up this subject pretty well me thinks ~
"Nobody IMHO could ever say that Terry could come even close to Red's
performance in the "Canadian Railroad Trilogy." On the other
hand...could Red have come up with a motif as memorable as Terry's in
the "Wreck." Chew on that one for a while..."
Never forgot that one.
Onto a little trivia. I'm trying to figure out why some sources state
that Terry was with the GL Band as early as 1970. How can that be true?
He doesn't show up on the SDYS album of 1970, or the SSOL album
recorded in Nashville in 1970-71. He does appear finally on the DQ
release of 1972 (recorded in December of 1971, and finished early in
'72), but how is it he is mentioned as a member as early as 1970 on
places like WF's website, and even on the liner notes to Gord's Gold?
FYI I have read that Terry and Red shared picking assignments for
roughly a year until Red quit as a touring member (in the spring of
1972), but going all the way back to a 1970 dateline?
Trivia - and only trivial - but if it is true, what does a guy as
talented as Terry Clements do "officially employed" in the band but
hanging around in the wings for a year? Moreover, he's not even
included in the Nashville SSOL recording sessions. It just doesn't seem
to add up.
If anyone knows more, or can point to some definitive moment in 1970
that shows TC was indeed onboard, kindly provide it. As I see it, TC
has to be from the "GL class of '71", and not earlier (1969 or 1970) as
is often cited.
Jb
Richard Harison
the DQ sessions (which Red played on as well) Gord knew Red's intentions,
though, and was "on the hunt" before that time. (I was grateful to be
considered a candidate.) Maybe that's what Wayne meant. He was not, as you
state on SSOL. (1970-early 71). I can't explain the Gord's Gold liner notes, as
Gord keeps pretty close tabs on things, I assume it means Terry had been
"selected" some months before he actually took over (which would have given him
time to practice). I remember his tryout at the Blythwood road house, but I
thought that was winter of '71 (say January) Could be wrong--have been before!
--
All the Best
Richard Harison
<nor...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
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johnfowles
I remember his tryout at the Blythwood road house, but I
> thought that was winter of '71 (say January) Could be wrong--have been before!
from the archived page on Terry by Matthew Fifer at:-
http://web.archive.org/web/20011224101412/www.mmlc.nwu.edu/~mfifer/lightfoot/band/terry.html
TERRY CLEMENTS
Born in Detroit,raised in LA, now lives in the Toronto area.
Musical Background:
Musical director for Johnie Tillison. House writer with Buck Owens.
Movie scores. Worked with producer Lou Adler during the Mamas And The
Papas era.
How recruited for Gord:
Terry and Gord met while working on Burt Reynolds first flick. Gord
asked him to join the band. He and Red Shea then shared the picking for
a year until Red quit. First album was Don Quixote.
Gear:
Martin D 18 and Gretch Country Gentleman.
Outside Projects:
Working on a posthumous album.
But the reference to Mr Reynolds is suspect because ,as I read on
Burt's official web site
""In my first nude scene with Angie Dickinson (Sam Whiskey 1969), she
said, 'The best way not to have everyone stare at you was just to take
it all off and walk around the crew nude all day and after awhile they
get tired and bored and don't look at you anymore' (sure!). Well, I got
under the covers first, undressed and threw my clothes on the floor!
She walked in without a stitch on! I looked up in the rafters where
usually there are one or two guys and there were 150 people up there!
People from Wagon Train came to visit the set, and nobody got tired or
bored!"
Although I saw Gord in London at the Royal Albert Hall in June 1972
(sitting in one of the first 6 rows) I really cannot remember if it was
Red or Terry , almost certainly Red because I was familiar with him
from Montreal concerts in 1968/69 so would most likely have noticed a
different figure on stage.
Richard Harison
as 1971 (I could check my passport--as I got it specifically renewed for that
show only a month before)
In any case, it was definitely Red! I remember because Gord & I flew over the
pond together, Red & Rick following us a day later. There was a debacle in
hotel reservations. Gord ended up at the Hilton and I at the Inn on the Park.
Red & Rick stayed at the same hotel where Gord wrote a lot of "Back Here on
Earth". We ended up at the Westbury. That afternoon Red said we should order
up some morels. Loved them so much we ended up ordering more 2 or 3 times.
--
All the Best
Richard Harison
"johnfowles" <fowle...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1156963063.3...@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>
~~~snip
> Although I saw Gord in London at the Royal Albert Hall in June 1972
> (sitting in one of the first 6 rows) I really cannot remember if it was
> Red or Terry , almost certainly Red because I was familiar with him
> from Montreal concerts in 1968/69 so would most likely have noticed a
> different figure on stage.
>
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nor...@hotmail.com
can't see how TC was actively involved or "officially" aboard prior to
1971. As John noted per the reference to Burt Reynolds "first flick",
if it was 1969 Burt filmed that movie, that seems way too early and is
suspect as such. Too bad Fifer didn't state the name of the movie, as
opposed to calling it Burt's "first flick."
Wayne shows something similar at his webbie:
Terry Clements - How Recruited: Terry and Gord met while Terry was
working on Burt Reynolds' first flick. Gord asked him to join the band.
He and Red Shea then shared the picking for a year until Red quit.
First album was Don Quixote.
One may be borrowing from the other on this though; it'd never stand up
in court being so nebulous. :)
WF has a couple of other interesting references re timelines:
GORDON LIGHTFOOT IN CONCERT - BBC - 1972
This program titled "Gordon Lightfoot In Concert" aired on January 22,
1972 at 11 PM. Accompanied by Red Shea and Rick Haynes, Lightfoot
performs .. [set list]
GORDON LIGHTFOOT - Royal Albert Hall - June 10, 1972
In June, Lightfoot tours the UK, including a stop at the Royal Albert
Hall in London. [set list]
*1972*
- In February, [Lightfoot] plays to two sold out concerts at New York's
Philharmonic Hall.
- Terry Clements replaces Red Shea on lead guitar.
- On stage at Massey Hall in March, Lightfoot feels a numbness on one
side of his face. It is diagnosed backstage as Bell's Palsy.
So then, how are these references also placed in his timelines [!]:
*1970*
Red Shea - Lead Guitar
Terry Clements - Lead Guitar
*1971-75*
Terry Clements - Lead Guitar
Rick Haynes - Bass
All I can say is Wayne is good (real good truth be known), but clearly
not foolproof.
Dang John, too bad you didn't retain a keepsake that indicated the band
personnel from that R.A.H. concert (June '72). Seems like Red may have
hung it up by that point (in the spring of 1972 [perhaps March?]) if
Wayne's 1972 timeline is an accurate gauge. But then again ...
Richard wrote in a post UPDATE:
>In any case, it was definitely Red! I remember because Gord & I flew
>over the pond together, Red & Rick following us a day later. There was
>a debacle in hotel reservations.
Then Red was still the primary guitarist as late as June of '72? Wow.
So if that is indeed the case, I see little or no way Terry could have
been onboard <and hanging in the shadows> dating clear back to 1970,
even if it were as late as December of '70.
As Sgt. Schultz used to say: "Interesting... verrrry interesting!"
[head scratching continues] Jb
johnfowles
Richard Harison wrote:
> John...correct me if I am wrong, but I seem to recall that Royal Albert concert
> as 1971 (I could check my passport--as I got it specifically renewed for that
> show only a month before)
OK Richard.Many thanks for your interesting anecdote but I am afraid
you are most certainly wrong.!it just so happens that my first wife
with whom I had seen Gord four times in Montreal
in 1968/69 decided tothat the grass was greener elsewhere and walked
out in March 1972.
At the time I was keeping a check on the Daily Telegraph every
Saturday, hoping to catch an advertisement for a Lightfoot concert
somewhere in the UK . Sure enough, sometime soon after my dearly
departed wife skidaddled, I spotted a Royal Albert Hall concert advert
and got three good seats in abuut row 6 dead center.I took my sister
and her university friend Claire Beeching, whose father as recorded
on:-
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/history/beeching_biography.shtmla
Had an unenviable task:-
"To this day, there are intelligent people who regard Lord Beeching as
the man who destroyed the railway system, rather than its saviour."
Just before that concert I was talking to my then wife on the phone
(she had run off with a disk jockey in Kent and told her that I would
be in London on her birthday,June 10th to see Gord,The damn woman had
the nerve to askd if shevcould come too and I remember sourly replying
to the effect that I did not want anything to spoil the pleasure of
another Lightfoot concert.
So you have to believe me Richard that year of infamy for me was 1972
not 1971. Go and find your passport do!!
nor...@hotmail.com
> Sure enough, sometime soon after my dearly departed wife skidaddled,
> I spotted a Royal Albert Hall concert advert and got three good seats
> in abuut row 6 dead center.
Sorry about your "year of infamy" John, but it has proved instrumental,
at least in this regard. ;)
If we take your confirmed date of June 1972 (matched by the WF
reference), and Richard's recall that Red was definitely Gord's guitar
accompaniment (and Richard was as front-and-center as you could get
back then), plus your own memory of no new axeman appearing on the
stage, it looks pretty good that Red had not yet "retired" from the
road by the summer of '72. It may be that Terry took over Red's spot as
the official guitarist of the GL touring band just after this UK trip,
while having joined the prior year for the Quixote sessions (Dec '71 -
Jan '72). Note too the January 22, 1972 BBC Concert reference that
Wayne shows (above), again sans Clements.
Richard Harison wrote:
> I remember his tryout at the Blythwood road house, but I thought
> that was winter of '71 (say January)
Could it have been the winter of '71 as you remember, but perhaps on
the other side of it (say November or December '71), and just prior to
the DQ recording sessions? Would tie in nicely if so. But if that is
the case, you can pretty much throw out Terry Clements + 1969 + 1970
for good.
I'm still intrigued by Wayne's reference that "He [TC] and Red Shea
then shared the picking for a year until Red quit." This must be
referring to the DQ (71-72) period, but it makes you wonder if all
three - GL, TC and RS - were performing any live concerts together
during that time as a trio of guitars [?], along with Rick on bass. Any
possibility of this Richard?
Jb
Richard Harison
--
All the Best
Richard Harison
"johnfowles" <fowle...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1156992416.5...@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
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Richard Harison
for a guest song at some point. (long time ago). I vividly recall Red coming
back for a few months in 1975, culminating at Royal Albert. (He used my D-18)
--
All the Best
Richard Harison
<nor...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1156998948.5...@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
> If we take your confirmed date of June 1972 (matched by the WF
> reference), and Richard's recall that Red was definitely Gord's guitar
> accompaniment (and Richard was as front-and-center as you could get
> back then), plus your own memory of no new axeman appearing on the
> stage, it looks pretty good that Red had not yet "retired" from the
> road by the summer of '72. It may be that Terry took over Red's spot as
> the official guitarist of the GL touring band just after this UK trip,
> while having joined the prior year for the Quixote sessions (Dec '71 -
> Jan '72). Note too the January 22, 1972 BBC Concert reference that
> Wayne shows (above), again sans Clements.
~~~snip
> I'm still intrigued by Wayne's reference that "He [TC] and Red Shea
> then shared the picking for a year until Red quit." This must be
> referring to the DQ (71-72) period, but it makes you wonder if all
> three - GL, TC and RS - were performing any live concerts together
> during that time as a trio of guitars [?], along with Rick on bass. Any
> possibility of this Richard?
>
> Jb
>
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Richard Harison
My passport was issued in March 1971.
It shows arrival at Heathrow on May 27, 1971
and exit on June 5, 1971.
BUT
It also shows I was at Heathrow on June 7, 1972. What I must have done is
mentally combine the 2 trips into one.
The hotel debacle from 1971 and the Royal Albert from 1972. I remember a TV
taping, because Gord asked me to play "phone book" on Me & Bobby McGee.
Of course I could get off my butt and call Red &/or Terry to get their input, or
would that spoil the fun?
--
All the Best
Richard Harison
"johnfowles" <fowle...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1156992416.5...@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
>
> Richard Harison wrote:
>> John...correct me if I am wrong, but I seem to recall that Royal Albert
>> concert
>> as 1971 (I could check my passport--as I got it specifically renewed for that
>> show only a month before)
>
> OK Richard.Many thanks for your interesting anecdote but I am afraid
> you are most certainly wrong.!
~~~snip
> So you have to believe me Richard that year of infamy for me was 1972
> not 1971. Go and find your passport do!!
>
nor...@hotmail.com
> can't recall both Terry & Red playing live together. Red MIGHT have
> popped up for a guest song at some point. (long time ago).
That's what I pretty much figured. What a dreamscape of sound it would
have been though :: Red and Terry laying down a whirlwind of notes like
swaths of musical graffiti :: call it a ticker tape parade for the
ears! :) To borrow from Derek, woohoo!
> The plot thickens!
> My passport was issued in March 1971.
> It shows arrival at Heathrow on May 27, 1971
> and exit on June 5, 1971.
> BUT
> It also shows I was at Heathrow on June 7, 1972. What I must have
> done is mentally combine the 2 trips into one.
Ouch! Right when it looked like it was coming together rather nicely,
A DOUBLE TRIP [PUN OBVIOUS] HAS TO ARISE! Why oh why RH? :(
The more telling question now becomes: who made up your company on that
SECOND sojourn?
OR >> how can that Blythwood tryout date be accurately pinpointed?
Diane writes:
>From the horse's mouth, so to speak...
> In a conversation with Terry in Concord NH in early August of this year
> he said that he had been with Gord for 34 years. Don't know if this
> helps or confuses the issue...I kinda lost my way with all these dates
> that have been mentioned, but there it is. :o>
Ah, we're back in the saddle again (lost as hell but galloping madly
forward). Let's see if I still know how to do a little basic arithmetic
(fires up calculator without as much as a blink):
2006
- 34
-------
1971-72 (given the '-1' fudge factor that's required with date-backs ::
just ask any family historian)
And this is straight from Terry's <the horse's> mouth! Great addition
Diane.
Richard writes:
> Of course I could get off my butt and call Red &/or Terry to get their
> input, or would that spoil the fun?
No, no, no ... Terry and Red may be following along, quietly rooting us
on to figure out this maddening rubik's cube of GL trivia. [*^*]. All
right, scratch that last thought, but this still resembles a Regis
challenge if I ever saw one. And let's be real - why should their
opinion count more than ours?? [rim shot heard, as the gallery faints]
Gord whispers to Richard: "... And if I don't stop this trembling hand
from reaching for the phone, I'll be reachin' for the bottle, Lord,
before this day is done." <g>
Brain teasers .. oh the humanity!
Memories cemented in infamy, now clearly delirious. Telekidd, er, Jb
Sheryl
nor...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> No, no, no ... Terry and Red may be following along, quietly rooting us
> on to figure out this maddening rubik's cube of GL trivia. [*^*]. All
> right, scratch that last thought, but this still resembles a Regis
> challenge if I ever saw one. And let's be real - why should their
> opinion count more than ours?? [rim shot heard, as the gallery faints]
>
> Gord whispers to Richard: "... And if I don't stop this trembling hand
> from reaching for the phone, I'll be reachin' for the bottle, Lord,
> before this day is done." <g>
>
> Brain teasers .. oh the humanity!
>
> Memories cemented in infamy, now clearly delirious. Telekidd, er, Jb
This is just too funny!
Sheryl
nor...@hotmail.com
> This is just too funny!
But Sheryl, your laughter hardly hides the obvious ~ my most egregious
faux paus to date! EVERYONE who is ANYONE (sic) knows it was Arte
Johnson who played that helmeted, cigarette toting German soldier in
the old Laugh-In series, the one whose signature rejoinder was
"Verrrrry interesting..." Sergeant Schultz was the big affable Bavarian
in the Hogan Heroes cast of characters, known more along the lines of
"I see nothingk .. I know nothingk!!"
Once again, cemented in infamy. :( Who once said the mind is a terrible
thing to waste? Yeah I know, I should have listened to Nancy Reagan all
those years ago when she implored us to "Just say NO!" [the gallery
wakes up, only to faint again]
Go ahead and laugh. I need a hug. Jb
Sheryl
nor...@hotmail.com wrote:
> <snip>
> Go ahead and laugh. I need a hug. Jb
{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{HUG}}}}}}}}}}}}}
Sheryl
Richard Harison
It reminds me of a remark Roger McGuinn made not so very long ago whilst
reminiscing about the Byrds years.
"It was all a blur, wasn't it, Richard?"
I see his point and 34 years represents a fair amount of time passed.
I had a glass of wine with Terry today and broached the subject. His thoughts:
1) The Blythwood tryout was in Jan or Feb 1971
2) He got his landed immigrant papers in the fall of that year (saw them)
But he is not sure exactly when he "took over" from Red. It's too bad Wayne
Francis' tour dates don't go back further, because it was very shortly after
Terry took over that, at the Berkeley Community Theatre, Gord asked me to teach
him Red's licks for Pussywillows/Cattails.
He is also unsure whether he was at Royal Albert in 1972 or not until 1975. His
travel documents/permits, which he produced showed the earliest date as 1975.
(not a smoking gun to be sure)
I am beginning to think he might have been at Albert with Red as early as 1972.
The problem there is that I always thought I had only been to England with
Gordon on 3 occasions 1971, 1975, and 1981. My passport says I was also there
in 1972. But it is hard to conceive Gord being over there 2 Junes in a row.
Yet the TV shows...yet my passport visas. Hmmmm.
Tried to call Red tonight as well, but he was not at home.
--
All the Best
Richard Harison
"Richard Harison" <no...@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:11570455...@donna.bmts.com...
Jenney
I remember seeing Terry play at the first GL concert I went to, at the
American Shakespere Theatre in Stamford Connecticut. I remember Terry
distinctly, as the person that brought me told me he was only 19. That
part turned out not to be true, but Terry sure was young!
I always thought that was 1971, but there is a good chance it was
later. I can't imagine it was later than 1972 though. I wish I could
remember the show better, is there the chance that Red was playing too?
I almost seem to remember both of them being there.
Sometimes it all is a big blur.
Jenney
Sheryl
Ahh, the mystery continues!
Sheryl
nor...@hotmail.com
> {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{HUG}}}}}}}}}}}}}
Thanks for that Sherry - you made my day (big hugs are no ka oi as they
say in the 50th state). ;)
Richard wrote:
> "Of all the things I've lost in life, I miss my mind the most" -- Anon.
Says so much in one simple line, doesn't it? Try as we do to resist the
cobwebs and dust, much of it is as inevitable as the aging process
itself. Or was it that way all along, and we were simply too
preoccupied in our leaps and bounds forward to take notice?
> It reminds me of a remark Roger McGuinn made not so very long ago
> whilst reminiscing about the Byrds years.
> "It was all a blur, wasn't it, Richard?"
> I see his point and 34 years represents a fair amount of time passed.
Roger no less .. but how true and how blue. I used to pride myself on
my recall, I truly did. Bit I have long since seen the error of my ways
... :(
> I had a glass of wine with Terry today and broached the subject.
> His thoughts:
> 1) The Blythwood tryout was in Jan or Feb 1971
> 2) He got his landed immigrant papers in the fall of that year (saw them)
> But he is not sure exactly when he "took over" from Red.
Wow Richard, more than we could have asked. Thanks. Seems your initial
recollection of the the Blythwood tryout being in early '71 was dead
on. Not too shabby I might add. But what now seems most amazing - at
least to me - is that TC was aboard that long before the DQ recording
sessions in December of '71. That's a LONG time to be part of a band
but hanging in the shadows. Could Red and Terry have been trading off
performing live during that single year [1971], alternately in some
fashion [?]. As Wayne states in his timeline, "Gord asked [TC] to join
the band. He and Red Shea then shared the picking for a year until Red
quit." Makes you wonder what "shared the picking" exactly entailed.
Unfortunately he also shows Terry aboard as early as 1970. This at a
minimum suggests both WF and the Gord's Gold liner notes are off by a
year ('70 versus '71).
> It's too bad Wayne Francis' tour dates don't go back further, because
> it was very shortly after Terry took over that, at the Berkeley Community
> Theatre, Gord asked me to teach him Red's licks for Pussywillows/Cattails.
How true, but what a classic vignette that Pussywillows story is. You
were right in the middle of it all as the "handover" occurred, in more
ways than one. ;)
> He is also unsure whether he was at Royal Albert in 1972 or not until 1975.
> His travel documents/permits, which he produced showed the earliest date
> as 1975. (not a smoking gun to be sure)
But another hint that Red may have been performing with Gord live still
at this point in time.
> I am beginning to think he might have been at Albert with Red as early
> as 1972. The problem there is that I always thought I had only been to
> England with Gordon on 3 occasions 1971, 1975, and 1981. My
> passport says I was also there in 1972. But it is hard to conceive Gord
> being over there 2 Junes in a row.
> Yet the TV shows...yet my passport visas. Hmmmm.
Well Wayne only makes reference to the Albert concert in '72, he
doesn't even mention a '71 performance! And yet he indicates - albeit
only suggestively in his timelines - Terry replacing Red on lead guitar
BEFORE the UK tour. So the mystery thickens indeed!
> Tried to call Red tonight as well, but he was not at home.
Tell Red we really need help on this one if possible ~ he needs to know
that some of us won't sleep 'till we get to the bottom of this. <lol>
Joking aside, more particulars on that '72 R.A.H. performance would be
an eye opener, especially if RS was still performing live that late (as
it so far appears he might have been). It's like John said earlier in
the discussion: he was front and center at that RAH concert, and would
most likely have noticed if Red had suddenly "morphed" into Terry. Also
Wayne's notes show Red as the appointed second axe for the BBC concert
of January 22, 1972, but unfortunately doesn't indicate who accompanied
GL during the UK tour / RAH performance in June '72. Could this
possibly suggest Terry was onboard for a year to a year and a half
<gasp> without being part of the touring band?? Holy you-know-what
Batman!
Jb
nor...@hotmail.com
More murky math from Jb's calculator (crunch time for TC)
1947 (TC BD)
+19
-----
1966
No cigar Jenny! Another tiny bubble bursts, thanks to Jb's soulless
calculator. :-)
> Sometimes it all is a big blur.
Well join the rest of us in the senile-before-our-time club J. The
blurriness of our precious recollections ... it first hit me maybe 10
years ago when I found myself talking to an old friend back on the
Hawaiian Islands. He and I both attended the last Moody Blues concert
there (although independent of each other) in either 1987 or '88. As we
were recalling that memorable event, it dawned on me how little in the
way of minutiae I could recall of it.
I thoroughly enjoyed the band's performance, I do remember that ::
though it was without their trademark Mellotron wizmeister Mike Pinder,
who added so much to their overall sound during their "farewell" tour
in 1974 that reached the Islands (synthy Patrick Moraz of Yes was his
replacement for the '88 concert). I remember a great Hayward guitar jam
towards the end, and Ray Thomas really belting out the song Veteran
Cosmic Rocker. But when it came to the rest of the songs performed, the
banter that was spoken, the sequence of events as they occurred, etc.
etc, I could recall very little actually. And mind you, I was stone
cold sober at the time (had a beer or two during the entire show with
my girlfriend).
It was then and there, while we were dredging up spirits of that night
long ago, it hit me ~ the mind is far more mercurial than we care to
believe or admit. I am also a believer that reams of memory tangles are
in our noggins alright, it's just that they can't be freely tapped as
we would all wish. And I tell you, "stonings" of the past or not, the
mind CAN play tricks (even wreak havoc) with our recall of "reality" at
times. Too many scenes and mental images get fused together to form
"new realities" that we swear were the way they actually were. In this
regard one ought to pause and reflect a bit before professing their
surefire recollections. The devil is always in the details it seems.
How much further lost would we be without our photographs and
video/sound files!? AND PASSPORTS! lol
Sherry wrote:
> Ahh, the mystery continues!
We'll get to the bottom of it, one way or another, trust me! :-) Having
RH in our corner is a huge bonus - in more ways than one! What a
valuable resource to compliment Wayne's fabulous collection of GL
trivia and timelines, and Matthew and Valerie's background + interview
collections. As for myself, I enjoy brain teasers like this. The
handing over of the live axe - the baton so to speak - from Red to
Terry is definitely one of the key chapters in the Lightfoot story. But
dang if it isn't easy to pinpoint this transition as it actually
happened.
If Terry was officially onboard in Jan-Feb 1971 as is being recalled,
then he was not involved with the finishing touches of the SSOL
sessions done in Nashville in April of that year (the wrap up
enhancements), but he was there in plenty of time for the Don Quxote
production in December. I'd be curious to learn just when TC -FIRST-
performed LIVE with Gord and the band, and if he and Red ever performed
live together (both during this 71-72 period and in 1975, the year Red
returned to tour with the band briefly once again). It may be as
Richard recalls, only for a song or two now and again - and strictly as
exceptions to the rule. But did TC and RS ever "trade off" being the
second performing guitarist during 1971-72, or was that simply a de
facto concession to Red until he chose to officially pull the plug?
It all seems a bit strange, but that makes it all the more intriguing.
Jb
Richard Harison
Red called me today, and was the first to admit his memory wasn't much better
than mine or Terry's. Here is what our conversation added to the mix:
He feels (as do I and Terry) that Terry took over in concert in the autumn of
1971. This fits a fact: Terry introduced me to a girl in Seattle then (More
infamy)
Red says he was playing for Ian Tyson in autumn 1975, and was not at Royal
Albert that year.. Which only leaves June, 1972. I fondly remember incidents
involving Red that could NOT have happened on the 1971 trip 'cross the pond.
FI: He used my D-18 at Royal Albert strung to play Ode to Big Blue & DQ.
True--he could have had 2 axes on stage, but if, as believed, Terry did take
over in 1971, then it would have made sense for Gord to bring him along to
accent the DQ material.
Red Terry and I all agree that 34 years is a long time ago--and at 70 to 80
concerts a year.....
--
All the Best
Richard Harison
"Richard Harison" <no...@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:11572482...@donna.bmts.com...
Ed Mullen
> More clues...
> Red called me today, and was the first to admit his memory wasn't much better
> than mine or Terry's. Here is what our conversation added to the mix:
> He feels (as do I and Terry) that Terry took over in concert in the autumn of
> 1971. This fits a fact: Terry introduced me to a girl in Seattle then (More
> infamy)
> Red says he was playing for Ian Tyson in autumn 1975, and was not at Royal
> Albert that year.. Which only leaves June, 1972. I fondly remember incidents
> involving Red that could NOT have happened on the 1971 trip 'cross the pond.
> FI: He used my D-18 at Royal Albert strung to play Ode to Big Blue & DQ.
> True--he could have had 2 axes on stage, but if, as believed, Terry did take
> over in 1971, then it would have made sense for Gord to bring him along to
> accent the DQ material.
> Red Terry and I all agree that 34 years is a long time ago--and at 70 to 80
> concerts a year.....
>
Richard, can you still find your car keys?
Seriously, thank you for what you add to mix here. It is precious and
well appreciated. Most of us have collected enough years and baggage
along the way that it is getting a tad difficult to reconstruct exact
details. But, gee, it is fun trying!
I only wish I could remember 1971 in other than rather vague terms ...
well, there was that incident ... oh, no, let's not go there.
--
Ed Mullen
http://edmullen.net
http://mozilla.edmullen.net
http://abington.edmullen.net
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One says to the other: "Does this
taste funny to you?"
Sheryl
Ed Mullen wrote:
><snip>
> I only wish I could remember 1971 in other than rather vague terms ...
Hmmm, 1971... I was in 7th grade... I had a crush on my English
teacher, and my favorite group was The Carpenters.
Reminisences anyone?
Sheryl
Ed Mullen
All I can say to that is: "Smart ass!" :-)
Music, I suppose, will be the thing that sustains me when I'm too old
for sex, and not quite ready to meet God. - Dolly Parton
nor...@hotmail.com
> No cigar Jenny! Another tiny bubble bursts, thanks to Jb's soulless
> calculator. :-)
Wow, in re-reading that, it almost sounds like I'm doubting Jenny's
concert citation there. Not for a second Jenny (!), if it were read
that way. All I meant to say is Terry was definitely not 19 at that
time. Nothing more ('cept damn that calculator!). ;)
Ed Mullen wrote to Richard:
> Seriously, thank you for what you add to mix here. It is precious and
> well appreciated. Most of us have collected enough years and baggage
> along the way that it is getting a tad difficult to reconstruct exact
> details. But, gee, it is fun trying!
It sure is fun trying though, isn't Ed? ;) In a sort of bittersweet and
maddening way. But isn't that true of so much now, as we cast longer
and longer glances over our shoulders recalling those glorious days
gone by? <g>
Sherry wrote:
> Hmmm, 1971... I was in 7th grade... I had a crush on my English
> teacher, and my favorite group was The Carpenters.
> Reminisences anyone?
All I can say is smart asses don't get any lovelier. ;)
Jb
nor...@hotmail.com
thanks to you for your special contributions here.
Richard wrote:
> More clues...
> Red called me today, and was the first to admit his memory wasn't much better
> than mine or Terry's.
Unfortunately we're all in the same boat, one that is often moored in
murky waters. It never helps when that boat is named Homo Sapien! ;)
> Here is what our conversation added to the mix:
> He feels (as do I and Terry) that Terry took over in concert in the autumn of
> 1971. This fits a fact: Terry introduced me to a girl in Seattle then (More
> infamy)
Ha! Those are the very BEST kinds of infamy (you lucky devil). :-)
Just to stoke the coals a bit, I'll lace in a few more odds-n-ends I
uncovered recently:
-------------------------1971
-- Concert review (excerpted) as posted by Wayne Francis on Aug 1, 1998
[alt.music.lightfoot NG]:
This was written by Sharon Cassidy in the Detroit News.
Toronto, Massey Hall 1971
GORDON LIGHTFOOT'S TRIUMPH - Toronto Telegram March, 1971
Gordie appeared alone save for guitarist Red Shea (who got off some
blues licks that were quite incredible) and bass player Rick Haynes.
-- Terry Clements from the Lightfoot Soundstage special [September
1979] - band interviews [Fifer website]:
"I've been playing with Gord now for 8 years. I like him as a musician.
He has really beautiful melodies and then he says something in the
songs too that most people don't. He's a real pro to work for."
1979 - 8 = 1971 FITS!
-------------------------1975
Richard wrote:
> Red says he was playing for Ian Tyson in autumn 1975, and was not at Royal
> Albert that year..
-- Concert review (excerpted) as posted by Wayne Francis on Aug 1, 1998
[alt.music.lightfoot NG]:
Here is another Massey Hall review, this time from 1975 [March].
GORDON LIGHTFOOT SETS TOMORROW'S STANDARDS TODAY
In Toronto, Gordon Lightfoot could do 20 minutes of Gregorian chants
and still get a standing ovation.
Musically Lightfoot appeared well armed. Terry Clements and Red Shea
played lead guitars while Pee Wee Charles added pedal steel and Richard
Haynes filled in the bottom line on bass. They were a tight,
road-hardened crew and the sound they produced was both intricate and
accomplished.
The four of them sat in a semi-circle around Lightfoot, obviously
enjoying the music themselves. Two vases of roses decorated amplifiers
behind Lightfoot and added to the relaxed atmosphere.
-- Wayne Francis on Oct 2, 1996 [alt.music.lightfoot NG]
In 1975, the Lightfoot band consisted of Terry Clements, Red Shea, Rick
Haynes and Pee Wee Charles. That configuration lasted only for that one
year. When the band hit the road again in 1976, Red was gone, but Barry
Keane was added.
-- Jcarp on Mar 6, 2000 [rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic NG]:
Saw Lightfoot perform in Seattle in 1975. He was only accompanied by
Terry Clemens on that tour.
-- closetcanadian on August 09, 2006 [Corfid Forum]
I read somewhere that Red had tired of touring and life on the road. He
wanted to spend more time at home with his family. Back in 1974 or 1975
he did go back on the road for one tour as I saw both Red and Terry
backing Gord at the Hollywood Bowl that summer. That was quite a treat
to see those two guitarists on stage together!
1975 Tour Dates:
- March 17-23 = Massey Hall, Toronto, ON
- June 21 = Opera House, Seattle, WA
- July 11,13, 14 = Hollywood Bowl, Los Angeles, CA
- Fall '75 = Ian Hunter
- October 29 = Royal Albert Hall, London
Based on the above, and the WF website timelines, it would then appear
Red rejoined the GL touring band for roughly 4 months or so in 1975
(perhaps March-July), and not for the entire year as is hinted at at
times.
All the same, that would have been a marvelous time to have caught the
Lightfoot band live, especially on the dates where Red and Terry were
actually playing together (but as is now obvious, at least per Jcarp @
Seattle, the band did not always perform together as a full ensemble on
every appearance during those tours). Verrry interesting, as old Arte
would say...
-------------------------1972
Richard wrote:
> Which only leaves June, 1972. I fondly remember incidents
> involving Red that could NOT have happened on the 1971 trip 'cross the pond.
> FI: He used my D-18 at Royal Albert strung to play Ode to Big Blue & DQ.
> True--he could have had 2 axes on stage, but if, as believed, Terry did take
> over in 1971, then it would have made sense for Gord to bring him along to
> accent the DQ material.
M*o*s*t interesting. One last "trailer" as it were perhaps [?],
possibly even performing as a trio of guitars! Could John Fowles have
actually witnessed such a thing? Or perhaps Terry "gave it to Red" for
this special night, if JF clearly recalls only one guitar accompaniment
on stage. It's worth remembering though, this would have been just one
concert in that June '72 UK tour.
-- Per WF website [TV and Radio]:
A program titled "Gordon Lightfoot In Concert" aired on the BBC on
January 22, 1972 at 11 PM. Accompanied by Red Shea and Rick Haynes,
Lightfoot performs [set list].
This could well have been recorded earlier, perhaps during the prior
year. Nothing in the phraseology says "aired" necessarily means "live."
Also the "latest" [chronologically] of the songs performed in the set
list that night were Summer Side Of Life and Ten Degrees And Getting
Colder from SSOL. And not a thing from DQ! [= FITS ?]
-- Concert review (excerpted) as posted by Wayne Francis on Aug 1, 1998
[per alt.music.lightfoot NG]:
Here is a review of an October, 1972 concert in Detroit.
PURIST LIGHTFOOT PLEASES U OF D FANS
by Bill Gray
Gordon Lightfoot looked out from the stage at the University of Detroit
Memorial Building where he was playing Saturday night.
He came on stage flanked by his two sidemen, bassist Richard Haynes and
lead guitarist Terry Clements.
[= Fits]
-------------------------
Richard wrote:
> Red Terry and I all agree that 34 years is a long time ago--and at 70 to 80
concerts a year.....
Absolutely. Hell, I can't always recall all that many details from
concerts I attended only a number of years back. Unfortunately the
scenes and images from 20 and 30 years ago are only going to be that
much more fuzzy. Saw John Mayall in '70. Blur! Chuck Berry + Bo Diddley
in '71. Blur! The Stones with ZZ Top in '73. Blur! Ten Years After and
the Moody Blues in '74. Blurs! Eric Clapton and Alvin Lee in '75.
Blurs! On and on it goes for Jb. :(
Let us not forget the most obvious given of them all - asking questions
is the easy part; coming up with answers is generally the opposite! All
that much more if they have to be backed by those unpleasant things
called facts! ;)
Great additions RH. Big chops to Terry and Red for the donated mind
bends on this one. If anyone has more tidbits to add, please do so!
Blurry recollections are certainly welcome. They'll be right at home
here!
Jb
Ed Mullen
> Jb wrote (back on Sep 3):
>> No cigar Jenny! Another tiny bubble bursts, thanks to Jb's soulless
>> calculator. :-)
>
> Wow, in re-reading that, it almost sounds like I'm doubting Jenny's
> concert citation there. Not for a second Jenny (!), if it were read
> that way. All I meant to say is Terry was definitely not 19 at that
> time. Nothing more ('cept damn that calculator!). ;)
>
> Ed Mullen wrote to Richard:
>> Seriously, thank you for what you add to mix here. It is precious and
>> well appreciated. Most of us have collected enough years and baggage
>> along the way that it is getting a tad difficult to reconstruct exact
>> details. But, gee, it is fun trying!
>
> It sure is fun trying though, isn't Ed? ;) In a sort of bittersweet and
> maddening way. But isn't that true of so much now, as we cast longer
> and longer glances over our shoulders recalling those glorious days
> gone by? <g>
>
16. And still is. Evoking time ahead, and now, time past. Good feelings.
Assphasia- a condition where your face looks so much like your butt your
bowels don't know which way to move.
Sheryl
> Jb wrote >
> All I can say is smart asses don't get any lovelier. ;)
>
> Jb
Oh, you're confusing me with Jenney, but, thanks!! She's the lovely
one!!
Sheryl
drb...@sbcglobal.net
Carpenters though.)
donnie
in article 0Kadnbe7WcFvuGPZ...@comcast.com, Ed Mullen at
e...@edmullen.net wrote on 9/5/06 8:35 PM:
Ed Mullen
You mean ... you were actually BORN already in 1971?!!! Geez.
Always try to be modest. And be damn proud of it!
drb...@sbcglobal.net
e...@edmullen.net wrote on 9/8/06 6:56 PM:
> drb...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
>> Shall we say I was NOT in 7th grade in 1971. :) (I must admit I did like the
>> Carpenters though.)
>>
>> donnie
>>
>> in article 0Kadnbe7WcFvuGPZ...@comcast.com, Ed Mullen at
>> e...@edmullen.net wrote on 9/5/06 8:35 PM:
>>
>>> Sheryl wrote:
>>>> Ed Mullen wrote:
>>>>> <snip>
>>>>> I only wish I could remember 1971 in other than rather vague terms ...
>>>>> <snip>
>>>> Hmmm, 1971... I was in 7th grade... I had a crush on my English
>>>> teacher, and my favorite group was The Carpenters.
>>>>
>>>> Reminisences anyone?
>>>>
>>>> Sheryl
>>>>
>>> All I can say to that is: "Smart ass!" :-)
>>
>
> You mean ... you were actually BORN already in 1971?!!! Geez.
>
> --
> Ed Mullen
I KNEW I loved this man. :)
donnie
Ed Mullen
Uh ... I was gonna say something about "being easy" but then I decided
that discretion was the better part of valor ... or something! :-D
Disco is to music what Etch-A-Sketch is to art
Janice Ross
4th grade :-)
(but I too liked the Carpenters)
Janice
<drb...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:C12731EC.34F9%drb...@sbcglobal.net...
Derek
No, honest!
;)
Derek
PS On the Soundstage recording from 1979 or whenever it was, I believe
Terry C said he had been "playin' with Gord for eight years." I also
seem to remember him putting an emphasis on the word "eight" as if it
was an eternity! :)
"Your chances of getting hit by lightning go up if you stand under a
tree, shake your fist at the sky and say, "Storms suck!"
--Johnny Carson
Cathy Cowette
> More clues...
> Red called me today, and was the first to admit his memory wasn't much
> better than mine or Terry's. Here is what our conversation added to the
> mix:
> He feels (as do I and Terry) that Terry took over in concert in the autumn
> of 1971. This fits a fact: Terry introduced me to a girl in Seattle then
> (More infamy)
> Red says he was playing for Ian Tyson in autumn 1975, and was not at Royal
> Albert that year.. Which only leaves June, 1972. I fondly remember
> incidents involving Red that could NOT have happened on the 1971 trip
> 'cross the pond. FI: He used my D-18 at Royal Albert strung to play Ode to
> Big Blue & DQ. True--he could have had 2 axes on stage, but if, as
> believed, Terry did take over in 1971, then it would have made sense for
> Gord to bring him along to accent the DQ material.
> Red Terry and I all agree that 34 years is a long time ago--and at 70
> to 80 concerts a year.....
>
> --
> All the Best
> Richard Harison
Richard, what do you mean by "strung to play Ode to Big Blue & DQ"? Did he
use alternate tunings on those songs, or did he just prefer certain strung
gauges?
I play a lead part to DQ, and it sounds similar to Red's, but I do it with a
capo in G progression. Did Red use a capo?
Cathy
http://www.cathycowette.com
Cathy Cowette
"Ed Mullen" <e...@edmullen.net> wrote in message
news:p5GdncoWSYgkgWPZ...@comcast.com...
Sheesh. I wish I could remember what I did yesterday!
Short term memory loss is a pain in the....
brain.
Cathy
http://www.cathycowette.com
Cathy Cowette
"Sheryl" <Sher...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:1157504677....@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
>
> Hmmm, 1971... I was in 7th grade... I had a crush on my English
> teacher, and my favorite group was The Carpenters.
>
> Reminisences anyone?
>
> Sheryl
I was a freshman, and my favorite group was Simon and Garfunkel.
Cathy
http://www.cathycowette.com
Richard Harison
First of all, Red used a high string axe for Big Blue & DQ. Thus my conclusion
that he did play Royal Albert in 1972 because he used my D-18 high string. It
fit the material Gord was using at the time.
Gord plays quite a few of his songs in the key of B. (A shape-capoed 2 frets).
As I recall, during the DQ sessions (1971) Red played DQ in A shape capoed on
the 2nd, high string, whereas Terry plays in G shape using a normally strung
axe.
Does that do it for you?
--
All the Best
Richard Harison
"Cathy Cowette" <ca...@cathycowette.com> wrote in message
news:o6eNg.40673$8j3....@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
> Richard, what do you mean by "strung to play Ode to Big Blue & DQ"? Did he
> use alternate tunings on those songs, or did he just prefer certain strung
> gauges?
> I play a lead part to DQ, and it sounds similar to Red's, but I do it with a
> capo in G progression. Did Red use a capo?
>
> Cathy
> http://www.cathycowette.com
>
----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==----
Cathy Cowette
> Wow...everybody is asking questions about things that happened 34 years
> ago!
> First of all, Red used a high string axe for Big Blue & DQ. Thus my
> conclusion
> that he did play Royal Albert in 1972 because he used my D-18 high string.
> It
> fit the material Gord was using at the time.
> Gord plays quite a few of his songs in the key of B. (A shape-capoed 2
> frets).
>
> As I recall, during the DQ sessions (1971) Red played DQ in A shape capoed
> on
> the 2nd, high string, whereas Terry plays in G shape using a normally
> strung axe.
> Does that do it for you?
>
> --
> All the Best
> Richard Harison
>
Sure does, and it explains how Red gets that distinct sound on DQ. I thought
he must have capoed it up. The fact that he did it on a high string guitar
didn't even cross my mind.
But I'm pretty sure Terry plays the lead in A shape, capoed on 2. If
anything, I'd guess that Red plays it in G shape.
Cathy
http://www.cathycowette.com
johnfowles
from JB posting to Newsgrouo
Tues, Sep 5 2006 11:34 pm
M*o*s*t interesting. One last "trailer" as it were perhaps [?],
possibly even performing as a trio of guitars! Could John Fowles have
actually witnessed such a thing? Or perhaps Terry "gave it to Red" for
this special night, if JF clearly recalls only one guitar accompaniment
on stage. It's worth remembering though, this would have been just one
concert in that June '72 UK tour.
OK OK further to the above. I never actually said as such that "I
clearly recalled one guitar accomplaniment on stage", but I HAVE now
unearthed conclusive evidence that at that June 10 1972 concert both
Red and Terry played (the latter as second lead guitar) but not
necessarily at the same time. In a similar vein it is also a fact as
confirmed by Mike after the concert at New Jersey's Red Bank concert on
April 13 2002 that the May 18, 1981 Royal Albert Hall concert featured
both Mike and Pee Wee
John Fowles (UK resident March 10 1941 -April 4 1964. and November 1969
- June 25 2000)
johnfowles
johnfowles wrote:
>
> OK OK further to the above. I never actually said as such that "I
> clearly recalled one guitar accomplaniment on stage", but I HAVE now
> unearthed conclusive evidence that at that June 10 1972 concert both
> Red and Terry played (the latter as second lead guitar) but not
> necessarily at the same time. In a similar vein it is also a fact as
> confirmed by Mike after the concert at New Jersey's Red Bank concert on
> April 13 2002 that the May 18, 1981 Royal Albert Hall concert featured
> both Mike and Pee Wee
Well All Right
Both Bru/silverheels and I were in the Royal Albert Hall in London on
June 10th 1972 to see a total of four guitarists on stage together. I
am now going to present the unarguable evidence just take a look sat
this:-
http://www.johnfowles.org.uk/lightfoot/June_10_1972_two_guitars_700.jpg
Scan of the souvenir programme/brochure
> John Fowles
A scan of the earlier and similar 1969 programme reveals that at that
toime Red was apparently masquerading as some sort of Irishman see:-
http://www.corfid.com/gl/images/frank/14.jpg