Compressor Question
Jim
I'm putting together a studio in my house and am using Cubase along
with a Delta 1010 and a mixer. I'd like to purchase a compressor to
record basically drums and would like to know what you guys would
suggest. My friend mentioned DBX but I wouldn't know what model etc
I'd need to record in a digital environment.
Thanks,
J
RichL
Not sure how much you want to spend, but I've got this one and I'm
thoroughly satisfied with it:
http://www.fmraudio.com/RNC1773.HTM
I know personally of pro studios that use them routinely. Considering
the price, you could get several of them and use a separate compression
channel (there are two on each unit) for each of many drum mics for the
price of a single pro-level DBX unit. Depends on what you're shooting
for, of course, but to me a handful of RNCs is a more logical choice for
a home studio.
Laurence Payne
How many microphones would you use on a drum kit? Would they all need
individual compression? Have you a particular reason to compress
externally while tracking rather than in Cubase while
monitoring/mixing?
RichL
The eternal question, right? A matter of personal taste?
Myself, I use external compressors when recording *some* tracks, but not
all. Mainly it's a matter of whether or not some unexpected transient
is going to overload the A/D but that's less of a concern when you've
got 24 bits or higher on the digital tracks since you've got enough
dynamic range to lower the input level before hitting the noise floor.
Maybe it's a matter of old habits dying hard, then ;-)
Jim
Thanks for responding.
1 kick
1 snare
4 toms
1 hi hat
2 overhead
1 possible additional condenser for ambience
I have been getting a pretty good sound without a compressor but have
heard recordings recently that used compression going in and they
sounded massive. I just can't get that attach and presence with my
current setup. You also mentioned compressing in Cubase...how would I
do that?
Thanks again Laurence!!
Laurence Payne
wrote:
>> How many microphones would you use on a drum kit? Would they all need
>> individual compression? Have you a particular reason to compress
>> externally while tracking rather than in Cubase while
>> monitoring/mixing?
>
>The eternal question, right? A matter of personal taste?
>
>Myself, I use external compressors when recording *some* tracks, but not
>all. Mainly it's a matter of whether or not some unexpected transient
>is going to overload the A/D but that's less of a concern when you've
>got 24 bits or higher on the digital tracks since you've got enough
>dynamic range to lower the input level before hitting the noise floor.
>Maybe it's a matter of old habits dying hard, then ;-)
When it's a matter of laying out hard cash for equipment, I think he
needs a better reason than personal whim :-)
Laurence Payne
>1 kick
>1 snare
>4 toms
>1 hi hat
>2 overhead
>1 possible additional condenser for ambience
>
>I have been getting a pretty good sound without a compressor but have
>heard recordings recently that used compression going in and they
>sounded massive. I just can't get that attach and presence with my
>current setup. You also mentioned compressing in Cubase...how would I
>do that?
The same way you'd apply any plugin effect.
I doubt the position of the compressor(s), before or after tracking,
made a lot of difference. What WILL make a difference, in rough order
of importance, are:
The instrument and player.
The room you record in.
Choice of microphone.
Recording technique.
Recording hardware.
RichL
Yeah, true, if that were the only use for the compressor. You can
always use an outboard compressor in post-processing, and if you've got
less-than-stellar digital onboard compressors with your
less-than-stellar digital recording software, something as cheap as the
RNC may still be a big improvement over what you would have available
otherwise. Also, I find the RNC useful as a guitar/bass stomp-box
substitute (more flexible than actual stomp-box pedals which don't
usually allow separate control of gain, threshold, ratio, attack, and
release).
Tony Risotto
> http://www.fmraudio.com/RNC1773.HTM
>
I second that. I've got a pair of these, too. They're good. Not just "good
for the price," either.
T
Jim
Tony - what are the advantages of having two of these, also if I'm
using a PC based recording tool, does it matter if I get an analog or
digital device?
I'm really new to this as you can tell and just wanted to make the
right choice.
Thanks again,
J.
Laurence Payne
>what are the advantages of having two of these, also if I'm
>using a PC based recording tool, does it matter if I get an analog or
>digital device?
>I'm really new to this as you can tell and just wanted to make the
>right choice.
You already own Cubase. It has compression functions built in. What
sort of results have you been getting from using them?
Jim
I'm not sure how to use the Cubase compression but will refer to the
manual. I'm a little confused about differences between built in
(software) compression and an outboard device.
I'll try it out.
Thanks,
J
RichL
> Hi Laurence,
>
> I'm not sure how to use the Cubase compression but will refer to the
> manual. I'm a little confused about differences between built in
> (software) compression and an outboard device.
> I'll try it out.
Even though, in principle, all compressors with separate control over
compression ratio, attack, release, gain, and threshold should behave
similarly, in practice they don't. Most of them "color" the sound in
some respect, which isn't intrinsically either "good" or "bad". It all
depends on personal taste and the specific application.
Most outboard devices work in the analog domain, most onboard devices
work in the digital domain, and again there's nothing inherently
superior for one over the other. I'm not specifically familiar with
Cubase and the onboard compressors that come with them, so I can't make
a judgement specifically about them.
But I'd recommend that if you're just starting out with Cubase, you
become familiar with what's included in the package. You might find an
outboard compressor to be a useful thing to have around, as I do. (I
use Sonar producer for recording, and although it comes with an
assortment of compressors, I find having an external one useful for
reasons I explained in a different post.) Also, before investing in
either an expensive external compressor or expensive third-party
software compressors, you'd be well served by experimenting with what
you have and/or buying a relatively cheap external compressor and
develop a *feel* for differences among them. Only then will you be able
to answer the question for yourself, "what is lacking here and what can
I buy to make up for it".
Laurence Payne
>I'm not sure how to use the Cubase compression but will refer to the
>manual. I'm a little confused about differences between built in
>(software) compression and an outboard device.
Tape systems had a low dynamic range. It was standard practice to
record as hot as possible, so as not to fall into the noise floor.
"Going over" wasn't the disaster it is on a digital system. But you
still wanted to keep in control, so a compressor straight after the
microphone, before hitting tape, was a good idea and frequently done.
You don't have to worry about the noise floor recording into 24-bit
digital (or even into the rather-less-than-24 bits your ADC probably
actually delivers :-). So now we compress because we like the way it
sounds.
The compressors supplied in Cubase are no-frills utilities. But
they'll show you what compression does. It would seem silly not to
explore them thoroughly before buying anything else. And you'd have
to spend a LOT of money to get the flexibility of using plugins. You
can have separate compression on each track, on groups, on the output
bus... That's a lot of boxes if you used outboard units!
Jim Carr
Since nobody else posted it, here's my article on using a compressor:
http://www.azwebpages.com/bass/basscompression.htm
It's slanted towards bass players, but it's still a good article for
anybody interested in compression. I don't recommend compression on the
way in. To me it's one of things you do because through experience you
know exactly what you're doing. Otherwise, just set your recording
levels safely and apply the compression later. If you compress on the
way in, you can't undo it.
Instead, spend a lot of time reading about how to mic drums and even
more time experimenting with mic choice and position.
--
Write a wise saying and your name will live forever.
- Anonymous
Tony Risotto
Jim (original poster):
I agree with the others who suggest you use the software-based compressors.
If you NEED external, hardware compressors, FMR Audio's compressors are
good. But, if you can use the ones that Cubase comes with, use them.
Regards,
T
Jim
try out the Cubase one and decide from there.
J.
On Sun, 13 Dec 2009 12:20:02 -0500, "RichL" <rple...@yahoo.com>
wrote: