Animal cruelty in films
RPalmer151
most heinous scene in one of the films where a horse and carriage were driven
into an apparently real frozen lake and in which the horse appeared to be
struggling for it's life. Of course cinema is all about illusion, but knowing
what few restrictions early film had regarding the welfare of animals (or
people for that matter) it was a most upsetting scene. It's very hard for me to
enjoy a film which contains scenes of this nature. I continue to ruminate about
the fate of the animal long after that particular scene is over. Another moment
which disturbs me is the scene in GREED in which the mule is apparently
actually shot and killed right on film. Who says there is no such thing as a
snuff film? I'm not a PETA advocate personally, but simply....
-Roger Pee.
Glamour Studios
of years gone by where trip-wires were used to get horses to fall "on cue". You
might also be upset by the chariot race scene in Ben-Hur where one stuntman was
trampled to death, or for that matter the sea battle in the silent Ben-Hur, where
over twenty extras were missing at the end of a day of ship-sinking.
Archie Waugh
norm...@pacbell.net
callousness in exposing, with equal abandon, stars and extras to violent
inundation in "Noah's Ark?"
Norm Lehfeldt
Glamour Studios <glam...@gte.net> wrotf:
James Russell
wrote:
>If you are that sensitive, then I suggest you avoid the hundreds of Hollywood films
>of years gone by where trip-wires were used to get horses to fall "on cue". You
>might also be upset by the chariot race scene in Ben-Hur where one stuntman was
>trampled to death, or for that matter the sea battle in the silent Ben-Hur, where
>over twenty extras were missing at the end of a day of ship-sinking.
On this note, I might add that some scenes in Tony Richardson's
"Charge of the Light Brigade" were cut from UK video release, on the
grounds that the scenes featured horses being felled by tripwires
which is now illegal. As for the stuntman deaths in both versions of
"Ben-Hur", I've long been under the impressions that those stories
were myths, though some horses apparently were killed. A couple of
silents which did result in human deaths were "Trail of 98" and
"Noah's Ark"…
--
James
(Celluloid Dreams 2SER 107.3FM http://www.2ser.com
Monday nights 7-7.30pm AEST)
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Mabuse13
>callousness in exposing, with equal abandon, stars and extras to violent
>inundation in "Noah's Ark?"
>
>Norm Lehfeldt
>
I believe it was Dolores Costello.
Arlene K. Witt
writings are, there are some things (like the trip wires) that I'd
prefer not to know. About all that can be said about films before
there was some protection for animals (and actors) is that - as with
some of the portrayals of blacks and other minorities - there are a
few areas where things have improved.
>Was it Leatrice Joy who remarked in "Hollywood The Pioneers" about Curtiz'
>callousness in exposing, with equal abandon, stars and extras to violent
>inundation in "Noah's Ark?"
>Norm Lehfeldt
Actually it was Dolores Costello. Also, "Hazards of the Game" had a
few horror stories to tell too.
Arlene
George
> On this note, I might add that some scenes in Tony Richardson's
> "Charge of the Light Brigade" were cut from UK video release, on the
> grounds that the scenes featured horses being felled by tripwires
> which is now illegal. As for the stuntman deaths in both versions of
> "Ben-Hur", I've long been under the impressions that those stories
> were myths, though some horses apparently were killed. A couple of
> silents which did result in human deaths were "Trail of 98" and
> "Noah's Ark"…
>
> --
> James
Kevin Brownlow mentioned the stories of animal cruelty and the missing
extras during the filming of Ben-Hur in his book "The Parade's Gone
By". At least some horses do appear to have been killed during some
scenes, but there appears to be disagreement about whether or not any
people really drowned during the naval battles.
--
Mary Miles Minter had been working hard. She probably works harder than
any young girl of her age in the world. She is, perhaps, one of the
most envied children in this or any other country. And she is the
loneliest.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Constance B. Kuriyama
RPalmer151 wrote:
I winced at the scene in _Covered Wagon_ where a horse
is pushed over a cliff. I sincerely hope the horse was dead
before it was pushed. There's something obscene about
sacrificing an innocent animal so that audiences can get
a momentary thrill.
I also wince at the shots of twitching, dying rabbits
in _Rules of the Game_, though I'll admit that it
makes a worthwhile point, and that the rabbits
were probably being shot anyhow. Renoir
didn't cause their deaths just to make his point.
And then, too, there are all those dead rabbits in
still life painting. And Audubon's dead models. :-)
I feel a little less intensely about exposing people to risk,
since they can comprehend the danger and make a
choice. Stunt people risk life and limb regularly, and I don't
feel indignant about it, though there's a point beyond which
the risk becomes unacceptable and the person directing the
scene irresponsible.
Connie K.
CHan534270
time ago by people who thought differently than we do today. It seems unfair to
judge past people with modern day values.
Craig Handley
William Hooper
>> which disturbs me is the scene in GREED in which the mule is apparently
>> actually shot and killed right on film. Who says there is no such thing as
a
>> snuff film?
Beyond animals, even.
Remember the TV shows of the 1970s when it seemed that once a week someone
pushed a Jaguar E-Type over a cliff? Impossible to keep watching after
something like that.
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Bruce Jensen
I agree with both this and the previous post. Values do evolve and so
do their representations on film. I absolutely abhor the maltreatment
of animals in general, and for entertainment in particular; however,
when it comes to the productions of those dead and gone, it is in our
own best interests to say a little prayer for the abused, let bygones
be bygones, and forge ahead to try and produce entertainment that
upholds modern values of compassion and decency. Just as I would not
support the censorship of old films for images of racism, sexism or
other biases, I also would not support censorship of films showing
graphic abuses of either humans or nonhumans. I would, however, do my
best to learn from them, and if possible to teach others what is
ethically right and what is not.
--
Best regards,
Bruce Jensen
John...@mindspring.com
<roto...@MailAndNews.com> wrote:
>Beyond animals, even.
>Remember the TV shows of the 1970s when it seemed that once a week someone
>pushed a Jaguar E-Type over a cliff? Impossible to keep watching after
>something like that.
>
That is justifiable.
Brent Walker
arl...@inx.net (Arlene K. Witt) wrote:
> I'm with you, Roger. As illuminating as a lot of Diana Sierra Cary's
> writings are, there are some things (like the trip wires) that I'd
> prefer not to know. About all that can be said about films before
> there was some protection for animals (and actors) is that - as with
> some of the portrayals of blacks and other minorities - there are a
> few areas where things have improved.
>
Speaking of Baby Peggy/Diana Cary, Sam Gill mentioned something after
watching that Photoplay footage at Cinecon featuring Charlie the
elephant and his trainer Curly (with ape comic Joe Martin on the
telephone pole).
Sam said that Baby Peggy recalled being present when Charlie
accidentally fatally injured Curly by stepping on him, and that among
Curly's last dying words were "don't kill my elephant for this," though
the elephant was put to death anyway.
--
Brent Walker
bcw...@earthlink.net
Constance Kuriyama
> Just as I would not
> support the censorship of old films for images of racism, sexism or
> other biases, I also would not support censorship of films showing
> graphic abuses of either humans or nonhumans. I would, however, do my
> best to learn from them, and if possible to teach others what is
> ethically right and what is not.
Well put. I'll defend to the death my right to wince, and to learn from
others' callousness and mistakes.
In this connection I'm still marveling at how Ridley Scott handled
Russel Crowe's turn with one of the tigers in _Gladiator_, and his
generally adept use of visual ellipsis. Rarely have I seen more things
in a film that I didn't see at all. ;-)
Connie K.
Bruce Calvert
film called ELECTROCUTING AN ELEPHANT (1903). The description:
"The film begins on what appears to be the yard of an engineering
plant. Approaching the camera are two men leading a large elephant in
a specially built harness to a special steel plate. Smoke arises from
between the plate and the elephant's feet just before it falls over on
its side, apparently dead"
--
Bruce Calvert
Visit the Internet Silent Film Still Archive
http://www.crosswinds.net/dallas/~bcalvert/home.htm
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norm...@pacbell.net
inherently more dangerous than the DC he was peddling.
Norm Lehfeldt
Bruce Calvert <baca...@my-deja.com> wrotf:
Glamour Studios
download at the LOC website.
Archie Waugh
RFCSAC627N
Including Oliver Reed, who died during production but still managed to
complete his scenes.
Richard Carnahan
Constance B. Kuriyama
RFCSAC627N wrote:
I was glad they were able to salvage Reed's last performance.
And while we're on that subject, _Gladiator_seems to have been made
very much as some early films were made. The only usable part of the
script was the story (more or less). The rest of the film was made up
by the director and actors as they went along, including the story they
finally decided on, and I must say I thought the results were amazingly
good. More entertaining than profound, but quite entertaining.
Connie K.
pre...@my-deja.com
Well, sort of. A double was used for his remaining scenes, and then
Reed's face was digitally inserted over his. And while we're on the
subject: Connie, you ARE aware that those tigers were all CGI...?
Mike S.
"Tommy, you like gladiator movies?"--Peter Graves in AIRPLANE!
HasNoName
Glamour Studios <glam...@gte.net> said unto the bozos and zips:
[snipped material below regarding Edison's ELECTROCUTING AN ELEPHANT (1903)]
>For the morbidly inclined, I believe this Edison clip is available for
>download at the LOC website.
And it's also featured in Errol Morris's "Mr. Death: The Rise and Fall of
Fred A. Leuchter, Jr."
---[------------ Floating on the lake of work, it's HasNoName ------------]---
"But it's really GREAT shit, Mrs. Presky!" -- Firesign Theatre
-http://aegis.mcs.kent.edu/~cstone/ - Firesign, film, music,& much, much less-
MacraTerr
>
>In the book of Punter, ch. <39BDA833...@gte.net>,
> Glamour Studios <glam...@gte.net> said unto the bozos and zips:
>[snipped material below regarding Edison's ELECTROCUTING AN ELEPHANT (1903)]
>>For the morbidly inclined, I believe this Edison clip is available for
>>download at the LOC website.
>
>And it's also featured in Errol Morris's "Mr. Death: The Rise and Fall of
>Fred A. Leuchter, Jr."
Bless you. I was driving myself crazy, trying to
remember where I'd seen it.
CHan534270
documentary on Coney Island on PBS. It seems the elephant was part of one of
the amusement parks and went on a rampage. They were going to destroy it by
hanging it as an attraction for the amusement of patrons!!! The anticruelty
society intervened and they had the idea od electrocuting it, which for some
incredible reason was OK with the anticruelty society!
Craig Handley
Constance Kuriyama
Not according to Russell Crowe--who ought to know. He tells a tale of
having problems with some of those scenes because he was wandering off
his marks to avoid getting too close to one of the tigers. Quite a bit
of trickery was used, though, and I haven't had a chance to see it under
circumstances where I can (partly) figure it out. Definitely some use of
telephoto effect.
He also got a cut on the bridge of his nose during the battle scene
which is clearly visible in the film. I don't think that was CGI. ;-)
Connie K.
Brent McKee
this summer on PBS as a part of a documentary on Coney Island, which
focused mainly on the period before the fire that destroyed Dreamland. It
was, perhaps, the most sickening thing I've seen in a long time.
--
Brent McKee
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"If we cease to judge this world, we may find ourselves, very quickly, in
one which is infinitely worse."
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