Christians Don't Understand Wicca?
DAVID J STEWART
by David J. Stewart
I have received several e-mails lately from pagans and Wiccans accusing me
of ignorance about Wicca. They tell me to go to websites such as
www.witchvox.com to educate myself. Well, I have been to witchvox and I
have studies their beliefs. One of the biggest criticisms I receive from
the Wicca witches is that they don't believe in Satan and that I'm totally
out of the ballpark to even associate them with Satan. The pagan witches
teach that Christians created the devil, and even the term "pagan." Wiccans
blame Christians for creating all the distortions about what Wicca is really
all about. For a Biblical overview of what Wicca is truly about, please
read Wicca (neo-paganism). According to Wiccans, the devil is only a
boogeyman created by Christians to scare the world. Wicca teaches that
Lucifer is the true god, the god of light and goodness.
May I say, Wicca is of the devil. Wicca witchcraft is Satanic to the
core, straight out of the pits of hell. Just because Wicca witches want to
discredit the Bible and eliminate the clear teachings of Scripture doesn't
mean that it is so. Listen to what the Bible teaches...
"For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus
Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist." -2nd
John 1:7
Wiccans are deceivers and antichrists! Wicca witches teach that there are
many hundreds of deities that we can worship, but Jesus Christ is NOT one of
them. The Bible teaches that there is ONLY ONE GOD (Deuteronomy 6:4; Isaiah
43:10,11). Wiccans are idolaters. Wicca has no place for the Lord Jesus
Christ or the Word of God. Wiccans try to deceive the masses by propagating
that they don't believe in Satan, so how can they be Satanic? This logic
only applies within the Wicca cult itself, not in reality. The entire
premise of Wicca's white witchcraft is that the Bible is NOT true. The
King James Bible is the preserved, infallible, inerrant, inspired Word of
God. The Bible teaches that believers were first called "Christians" at
Antioch by the heathen (Acts 11:26). Just as Wiccans claim that Christians
were the first to call them "pagans," so also it was the pagans who first
called born again believers "Christians." I am a born again believer and I
believe that the King James Bible is God's Word. Jesus is the Saviour and I
have trusted Him to forgive my sins and take me to heaven.
"Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is
antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son." -1st John 2:22
Everything about Wicca witchcraft goes contrary to the Bible. There is no
way to deal with your sins in Wicca. Where does Wicca address the fact that
we are sinners in need of forgiveness? Nowhere! Wicca is a false religion,
damning the souls of it's adherents to hell. Wiccans can accuse Christians
of being ignorant concerning their beliefs, but it is simply not true. I
realize that Wiccans don't believe in Satan, but Christians certainly DO
because the Bible says there is a devil. It is NOT about Christians being
the enemies of Wicca, it is about the Bible, the Word of God, being the
enemy of Wicca. Wiccans like to target Christians with their propaganda,
while avoiding challenging the irrefutable Word of God. Not one spade-full
of archeologists dirt has ever disproved the Bible. Science has not
disproved the Bible. History has not disproved the Bible. Wicca has no
solid rock upon which there house is built, but is rather built upon
uncertain sand. The Christian's faith is built upon the rock solid Word of
God, the Lord Jesus Christ (Revelation 19:13).
It is not my ignorance of Wicca that causes me to say that "Wicca is
Satanic," it is my knowledge of the Word of God. Wiccans tell on themselves
when they declare that Lucifer is the god of light...
"And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of
light." -2nd Corinthians 11:14
I plead with you in Jesus' name to depart from Wicca's works of darkness.
Wicca is a certain path to eternal destruction in the lake of fire
(Revelation 20:15). Wicca is Satanic! Wiccans can deny this allegation all
they want to, but they are certainly of the devil, their master. Satan is a
great deceiver...
"And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil,
and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth,
and his angels were cast out with him." -Revelation 12:9
Satan has deceived the WHOLE WORLD (1st John 5:19). 98% of the world's
masses are bound for hell without Jesus Christ. Catholicism is a lie of the
devil. Islam is a lie of the devil. Buddhism is a lie of the devil.
Mormonism is a lie of the devil. Religious diversity is a lie of the devil.
Wicca is a lie of the devil. Freemasonry is a lie of the devil. Atheism is
a lie of the devil. New Age is a lie of the devil. ONLY through Jesus
Christ can anyone obtain the forgiveness of sins and go to heaven. This is
not just what Christians teach, it is what the Bible teaches. Either you
believe the Bible or you don't. Have you also been deceived?
Wicca is all about Satanism. Although Wicca does not practice the type of
Satanism associated with such groups as the Church of Satan (who openly
declare Satan's existence), Wicca does practice it's own version of Satanism
(which sees Lucifer as good, undeserving of the title "Satan"). Either way,
Wiccans and Satanists worship the same false god. Lucifer is a two-time
loser, cast out of heaven and soon to be cast into hell. Lucifer is the
devil, Satan, the beast. Would it satisfy the godless Witches if I said
that Wicca is all about Luciferianism? Whether the Wiccan Lucifer or the
Christian Satan, it is the SAME evil being...old smut face himself. This is
my response to the foolish accusations from Wiccans that Christians are
ignorant of what Wicca believes. Christians are NOT ignorant of Wicca
witchcraft, we're just not going to recognize your lies and distortions of
the Word of God. Satan is a DECEIVER! Deceitfulness is the hallmark of
Lucifer, Satan.
Satan works his lying wonders and fools the masses, but we are NOT
fooled...
"Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and
signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in
them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they
might be saved."-2nd Thessalonians 2:9,10
I am sickened as I watch FOX Lies (news) on the TV. The masses have been
lied to about everything from 911 to Roman Catholicism, from the Oklahoma
City Bombing to Iraq. George W. Bush is a man of lying wonders, as is Bill
Clinton and others. Wicca is also a LIE of the devil. Satan is a master
counterfeiter, a wolf in sheep's clothing. Please don't be deceived my
friend, the Word of God vehemently condemn witchcraft and idolatry. There
is NO good in serving the devil through Wicca, only a road to destruction
paved with neon lights and good intentions....
"There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the
ways of death." -Proverb 16:25
How to go to Heaven
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wicca's Untrue History
"... the sin of witchcraft..." -1st Samuel 15:23
adrenochrome
> Christians Don't Understand Wicca?
>
> http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Religions/Wicca%20&%20Witchcraft/christians_don't_understand_wicca.htm
>
> by David J. Stewart
>
>
>
>
> I have received several e-mails lately from pagans and Wiccans accusing me
> of ignorance about Wicca. They tell me to go to websites such as
> www.witchvox.com to educate myself. Well, I have been to witchvox and I
> have studies their beliefs. One of the biggest criticisms I receive from
> the Wicca witches is that they don't believe in Satan and that I'm totally
> out of the ballpark to even associate them with Satan. The pagan witches
> teach that Christians created the devil, and even the term "pagan." Wiccans
> blame Christians for creating all the distortions about what Wicca is really
> all about. For a Biblical overview of what Wicca is truly about, please
> read Wicca (neo-paganism). According to Wiccans, the devil is only a
> boogeyman created by Christians to scare the world. Wicca teaches that
> Lucifer is the true god, the god of light and goodness.
>
> May I say, Wicca is of the devil. Wicca witchcraft is Satanic to the
> core, straight out of the pits of hell. Just because Wicca witches want to
> discredit the Bible and eliminate the clear teachings of Scripture doesn't
> mean that it is so. Listen to what the Bible teaches...
Who cares what the stoopid bible sez? Anyway, wiccans are fools, if
anything they've adopted xian values such as dividing the universe
into "good" and "evil" and naturally portraying themselves as good and
having absolutely nothing to do with that xian devil they claim to
believe doesn't exist. Wiccans are as stupid as xians in that they
believe they can curry the favor of the gods with the right rituals.
Prancing naked around fairy rings in the woods might be a bit more
fun than singing a joyless hymn in church, but it has the same exact
effect on the real world - none at all.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"White witchcraft groups say that if you curse a person, it will return
to you three-fold, come home to roost, or in some way boomerang back to
the sender. This is yet another indication of the guilt-ridden
philosophy which is held by these neo-Pagan, pseudo-Christian groups.
White witches want to delve into witchcraft, but cannot divorce
themselves from the stigma attached to it. Therefore, they call
themselves white magicians, and base seventy-five per cent of their
philosophy on the trite and hackneyed tenets of Christianity. Anyone
who pretends to be interested in magic or the occult for reasons other
than gaining personal power is the worst kind of hypocrite. The
Satanist respects Christianity for, at least, being consistent in its
guilt-ridden philosophy, but can only feel contempt for people who
attempt to appear emancipated from guilt by joining a witchcraft group,
and then practice the same basic philosophy as Christianity."
-- Anton LaVey; "The Satanic Bible"
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Rev.Rev.
news:FV3jg.11951$921....@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> Christians Don't Understand Wicca?
>
> http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Religions/Wicca%20&%20Witchcraft/christians_don't_understand_wicca.htm
>
> by David J. Stewart
>
>
>
>
> I have received several e-mails lately from pagans and Wiccans accusing
> me of ignorance about Wicca. They tell me to go to websites such as
> www.witchvox.com to educate myself. Well, I have been to witchvox and I
> have studies their beliefs. One of the biggest criticisms I receive from
> the Wicca witches is that they don't believe in Satan and that I'm totally
> out of the ballpark to even associate them with Satan. The pagan witches
> teach that Christians created the devil, and even the term "pagan."
> Wiccans blame Christians for creating all the distortions about what Wicca
> is really all about. For a Biblical overview of what Wicca is truly
> about, please read Wicca (neo-paganism). According to Wiccans, the devil
> is only a boogeyman created by Christians to scare the world. Wicca
> teaches that Lucifer is the true god, the god of light and goodness.
>
I wasn't aware that Pagans or Wiccans worshipped any "Lucifer".......
> May I say, Wicca is of the devil. Wicca witchcraft is Satanic to the
> core, straight out of the pits of hell. Just because Wicca witches want
> to discredit the Bible and eliminate the clear teachings of Scripture
> doesn't mean that it is so. Listen to what the Bible teaches...
>
> "For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that
> Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an
> antichrist." -2nd John 1:7
>
Hang on, you're using a book that contradicts its-self and actually preaches
DEATH and KILLING and HATE to argue that Wicca is bad???
Here's what The Bible teaches (from NIV)
Deuteronomy 21:18-21
"If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who does not obey his father and
mother and will not listen to them when they discipline him, his father and
mother shall take hold of him and bring him to the elders at the gate of his
town. They shall say to the elders, "This son of ours is stubborn and
rebellious. He will not obey us. He is a profligate and a drunkard." Then
all the men of his town shall stone him to death. You must purge the evil
from among you. All Israel will hear of it and be afraid."
Luke 14:26
"If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother, his wife and
children, his brothers and sisters-yes, even his own life-he cannot be my
disciple."
Exodus 21:17
"Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death."
ON THE OTHER HAND, the Wiccan Rede clearly says:
"An ye harm none, do what ye will" <- Notice the "HARM NONE", as opposed to
STONE THEM TO DEATH.
> Wiccans are deceivers and antichrists! Wicca witches teach that there
> are many hundreds of deities that we can worship, but Jesus Christ is NOT
> one of them. The Bible teaches that there is ONLY ONE GOD (Deuteronomy
> 6:4; Isaiah 43:10,11). Wiccans are idolaters. Wicca has no place for the
> Lord Jesus Christ or the Word of God. Wiccans try to deceive the masses
> by propagating that they don't believe in Satan, so how can they be
> Satanic? This logic only applies within the Wicca cult itself, not in
> reality. The entire premise of Wicca's white witchcraft is that the Bible
> is NOT true. The King James Bible is the preserved, infallible,
> inerrant, inspired Word of God.
So, you explain the CONTRADICTIONS in the KJV and all other versions, how???
If it is the "preserved, infallible, inerrant, inspired Word of God" then
HOW can there be ANY contradictions within its pages???
Good to all or just a few?
PSA 145:9 The LORD is good to all: and his tender mercies are over all his
works.
JER 13:14 And I will dash them one against another, even the fathers and the
sons together, saith the LORD: I will not pity, nor spare, nor have mercy,
but destroy them.
Who is the father of Joseph?
MAT 1:16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus,
who is called Christ.
LUK 3:23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as
was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli.
Who was at the Empty Tomb? Is it:
MAT 28:1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day
of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.
MAR 16:1 And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother
of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and
anoint him.
JOH 20:1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was
yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the
sepulchre.
Which first--beasts or man?
GEN 1:25 And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle
after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his
kind: and God saw that it was good.
GEN 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and
let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the
air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping
thing that creepeth upon the earth.
GEN 2:18 And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone;
I will make him an help meet for him.
GEN 2:19 And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field,
and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would
call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the
name thereof.
The number of beasts in the ark
GEN 7:2 Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and
his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his
female.
GEN 7:8 Of clean beasts, and of beasts that are not clean, and of fowls, and
of every thing that creepeth upon the earth, GEN 7:9 There went in two and
two unto Noah into the ark, the male and the female, as God had commanded
Noah.
Fowl from waters or ground?
GEN 1:20 And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving
creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open
firmament of heaven.
GEN 1:21 And God created great whales, and every living creature that
moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and
every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
GEN 2:19 And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field,
and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would
call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the
name thereof.
There are far too many more to put here, but I invite you to look for them,
they are there - indeed I have seen them!
Let us face the truth shall we? The truth, the REAL truth, is:
Wicca, and other Pagan beliefs, are based on beliefs that pre-date
Christianity by many, many, many years... Can you point to any Christianity
that pre-dates ancient 'pagan' beliefs (not the Old Testament because a) it
doesn't pre-date Paganism, and b) it belongs to the Jewish and borrowed by
the Christians anyway)??
Many Christian celebrations were originally 'Pagan' in origin, adapted by
the early Christians who were, after all, forming a NEW religion within a
Pagan Roman Empire. Can you explain why Christmas is held at the same time
as the Pagan Winter Solstice and nowhere near when Jesus was actually born?
To ensure that only the Christian word was spread, those following Pagan
beliefs (i.e. "witches") were BURNED AT THE STAKE, or otherwise hunted an
killed. Can you point me to any recorded history of witches or Pagans
killing Christians in a similar way?
Christianity is no more, and no less, valid than ANY OTHER RELIGION. There
are numerous religious beliefs that pre-date Christianity and continue to
this very day, yet you seem to find it necessary to pick on the Pagan
beliefs - why is that? Why not pick on Hindu or Buddhist or even Jew, they
don't accept Jesus as the Messiah so why aren't you in here calling the
Jewish antichrist and all that?
Oh, and BTW - I'm NOT Wiccan, just don't believe in bashing other beliefs
simply because you have been brainwashed into accepting the writings of man
as the word of some god...
[rest of Christian ramblings snipped]
Tigrah
"Rev.Rev." <R...@NoGod.No> wrote in message
news:448df...@news.iprimus.com.au...
> Let us face the truth shall we? The truth, the REAL truth, is:
>
> Wicca, and other Pagan beliefs, are based on beliefs that pre-date
> Christianity by many, many, many years... Can you point to any
> Christianity that pre-dates ancient 'pagan' beliefs (not the Old Testament
> because a) it doesn't pre-date Paganism, and b) it belongs to the Jewish
> and borrowed by the Christians anyway)??
I agree on this point.
>
> Many Christian celebrations were originally 'Pagan' in origin, adapted by
> the early Christians who were, after all, forming a NEW religion within a
> Pagan Roman Empire. Can you explain why Christmas is held at the same
> time as the Pagan Winter Solstice and nowhere near when Jesus was actually
> born?
I agree to this point as well.
>
> To ensure that only the Christian word was spread, those following Pagan
> beliefs (i.e. "witches") were BURNED AT THE STAKE, or otherwise hunted an
> killed. Can you point me to any recorded history of witches or Pagans
> killing Christians in a similar way?
>
Romans actually did kill Christians in the colleseums, either by Gladiators
or by wild beasts (usually lions).
> Christianity is no more, and no less, valid than ANY OTHER RELIGION. There
> are numerous religious beliefs that pre-date Christianity and continue to
> this very day, yet you seem to find it necessary to pick on the Pagan
> beliefs - why is that? Why not pick on Hindu or Buddhist or even Jew,
> they don't accept Jesus as the Messiah so why aren't you in here calling
> the Jewish antichrist and all that?
I agree on this point.. there's no point in dogging any one religion over
any other as they're all valid in one way or other. If we were all meant to
believe the same way, we wouldn't have that lovely thing called Free Will,
or Freedom of Choice.
--
Tigrah
=^.^=
http://felinefanatica.comicgenesis.com/
Republican
<fre...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Christians Don't Understand Wicca?
Wiccans don't understand Wicca.
If they did they wouldn't be Wiccans.
Nik
Republican
wrote:
>DAVID J STEWART wrote..., On 06/11/2006 19:01:
>> Christians Don't Understand Wicca?
>>
>> http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Religions/Wicca%20&%20Witchcraft/christians_don't_understand_wicca.htm
>>
>> by David J. Stewart
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>"White witchcraft groups say that if you curse a person, it will return
>to you three-fold, come home to roost, or in some way boomerang back to
>the sender. This is yet another indication of the guilt-ridden
>philosophy which is held by these neo-Pagan, pseudo-Christian groups.
>White witches want to delve into witchcraft, but cannot divorce
>themselves from the stigma attached to it. Therefore, they call
>themselves white magicians, and base seventy-five per cent of their
>philosophy on the trite and hackneyed tenets of Christianity. Anyone
>who pretends to be interested in magic or the occult for reasons other
>than gaining personal power is the worst kind of hypocrite. The
>Satanist respects Christianity for, at least, being consistent in its
>guilt-ridden philosophy, but can only feel contempt for people who
>attempt to appear emancipated from guilt by joining a witchcraft group,
>and then practice the same basic philosophy as Christianity."
>-- Anton LaVey; "The Satanic Bible"
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Satanism" is nothing more than Christianity with an upside down
cross.
Nik
Republican
Admittedly some of the beliefs that make up Wicca do have ancient
origins BUT, and its a big BUT, the multi-cultural origins of these
ancients beliefs did NOT exist in the combination that Wicca is.
Wicca was founded in 1951.
>Can you point to any Christianity
>that pre-dates ancient 'pagan' beliefs (not the Old Testament because a) it
>doesn't pre-date Paganism, and b) it belongs to the Jewish and borrowed by
>the Christians anyway)??
There's lots actually...not that I'm wishing to defend
Christianity...but your point is completely irrelevant.
>Many Christian celebrations were originally 'Pagan' in origin, adapted by
>the early Christians who were, after all, forming a NEW religion within a
>Pagan Roman Empire. Can you explain why Christmas is held at the same time
>as the Pagan Winter Solstice and nowhere near when Jesus was actually born?
You have a point there.
>To ensure that only the Christian word was spread, those following Pagan
>beliefs (i.e. "witches") were BURNED AT THE STAKE, or otherwise hunted an
>killed.
All of them? How do you know?
> Can you point me to any recorded history of witches or Pagans
>killing Christians in a similar way?
The Battle of Siklestad. The Heathen resistance to Charlemagne...the
numerous Viking raids on Monasteries...
Be careful of accusing others of ignorance when you yourself have some
learning to do.
Nik
Republican
wrote:
>
>
>"Rev.Rev." <R...@NoGod.No> wrote in message
>news:448df...@news.iprimus.com.au...
>> Let us face the truth shall we? The truth, the REAL truth, is:
>>
>> Wicca, and other Pagan beliefs, are based on beliefs that pre-date
>> Christianity by many, many, many years... Can you point to any
>> Christianity that pre-dates ancient 'pagan' beliefs (not the Old Testament
>> because a) it doesn't pre-date Paganism, and b) it belongs to the Jewish
>> and borrowed by the Christians anyway)??
>
>I agree on this point.
You oughtn't. The Jewish religion was born out of Moses fleeing Egypt.
It is worth noting that the Pharoah of the time had instituted
Monotheism <cough>.
Dualistic accounts of Good and Evil also predate Judaism...
>> Many Christian celebrations were originally 'Pagan' in origin, adapted by
>> the early Christians who were, after all, forming a NEW religion within a
>> Pagan Roman Empire. Can you explain why Christmas is held at the same
>> time as the Pagan Winter Solstice and nowhere near when Jesus was actually
>> born?
>
>I agree to this point as well.
Of course. Jesus wasn't born in late December...think carefully about
what Mary and Joseph were doing when they went to Bethlehem. What time
of the year would have been the time for census taking?
>> To ensure that only the Christian word was spread, those following Pagan
>> beliefs (i.e. "witches") were BURNED AT THE STAKE, or otherwise hunted an
>> killed. Can you point me to any recorded history of witches or Pagans
>> killing Christians in a similar way?
>
>Romans actually did kill Christians in the colleseums, either by Gladiators
>or by wild beasts (usually lions).
He also neglects the raids by Vikings (and others) on European
Monasteries...
>> Christianity is no more, and no less, valid than ANY OTHER RELIGION. There
>> are numerous religious beliefs that pre-date Christianity and continue to
>> this very day, yet you seem to find it necessary to pick on the Pagan
>> beliefs - why is that? Why not pick on Hindu or Buddhist or even Jew,
>> they don't accept Jesus as the Messiah so why aren't you in here calling
>> the Jewish antichrist and all that?
>
>I agree on this point.. there's no point in dogging any one religion over
>any other as they're all valid in one way or other. If we were all meant to
>believe the same way, we wouldn't have that lovely thing called Free Will,
>or Freedom of Choice.
People frequently misunderstand the meaning of the word 'valid'. if a
religion is as full of contradictions as the Bible is then it is
logically 'invalid'.
Nik
Attuarii
> On Mon, 12 Jun 2006 18:36:22 -0600, "Tigrah" <feli...@pmt.org>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>"Rev.Rev." <R...@NoGod.No> wrote in message
>>news:448df...@news.iprimus.com.au...
>>> Let us face the truth shall we? The truth, the REAL truth, is:
>>>
>>> Wicca, and other Pagan beliefs, are based on beliefs that pre-date
>>> Christianity by many, many, many years... Can you point to any
>>> Christianity that pre-dates ancient 'pagan' beliefs (not the Old
>>> Testament because a) it doesn't pre-date Paganism, and b) it belongs to
>>> the Jewish and borrowed by the Christians anyway)??
>>
>>I agree on this point.
>
> You oughtn't. The Jewish religion was born out of Moses fleeing Egypt.
> It is worth noting that the Pharoah of the time had instituted
> Monotheism <cough>.
According to the fairy tale that is the "Old Testament".
>
> Of course. Jesus wasn't born in late December...think carefully about
> what Mary and Joseph were doing when they went to Bethlehem. What time
> of the year would have been the time for census taking?
Of course. Jesus wasn't born.
>>> To ensure that only the Christian word was spread, those following Pagan
>>> beliefs (i.e. "witches") were BURNED AT THE STAKE, or otherwise hunted
>>> an
>>> killed. Can you point me to any recorded history of witches or Pagans
>>> killing Christians in a similar way?
>>
>>Romans actually did kill Christians in the colleseums, either by
>>Gladiators or by wild beasts (usually lions).
>
> He also neglects the raids by Vikings (and others) on European
> Monasteries...
>
>>> Christianity is no more, and no less, valid than ANY OTHER RELIGION.
>>> There are numerous religious beliefs that pre-date Christianity and
>>> continue to this very day, yet you seem to find it necessary to pick on
>>> the Pagan
>>> beliefs - why is that? Why not pick on Hindu or Buddhist or even Jew,
>>> they don't accept Jesus as the Messiah so why aren't you in here calling
>>> the Jewish antichrist and all that?
>>
>>I agree on this point.. there's no point in dogging any one religion over
>>any other as they're all valid in one way or other. If we were all meant
>>to believe the same way, we wouldn't have that lovely thing called Free
>>Will, or Freedom of Choice.
>
> People frequently misunderstand the meaning of the word 'valid'. if a
> religion is as full of contradictions as the Bible is then it is
> logically 'invalid'.
>
> Nik
--
"It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses
or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not
change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people."
Giordano Bruno
Seon Ferguson
Seamus
> More lies spread by a Christain kook why am i not suprised?
This is a bit cryptic. Which statements are you protesting? Wicca is a
pretty recent phenomenon.
the_virt...@yahoo.com
> On Mon, 12 Jun 2006 18:57:02 GMT, adrenochrome <pituit...@iguana.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> >DAVID J STEWART wrote..., On 06/11/2006 19:01:
> >> Christians Don't Understand Wicca?
>
>
> >> by David J. Stewart
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >"White witchcraft groups say that if you curse a person, it will return
> >to you three-fold, come home to roost, or in some way boomerang back to
> >the sender. This is yet another indication of the guilt-ridden
> >philosophy which is held by these neo-Pagan, pseudo-Christian groups.
> >White witches want to delve into witchcraft, but cannot divorce
> >themselves from the stigma attached to it. Therefore, they call
> >themselves white magicians, and base seventy-five per cent of their
> >philosophy on the trite and hackneyed tenets of Christianity. Anyone
> >who pretends to be interested in magic or the occult for reasons other
> >than gaining personal power is the worst kind of hypocrite. The
> >Satanist respects Christianity for, at least, being consistent in its
> >guilt-ridden philosophy, but can only feel contempt for people who
> >attempt to appear emancipated from guilt by joining a witchcraft group,
> >and then practice the same basic philosophy as Christianity."
> >-- Anton LaVey; "The Satanic Bible"
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Satanism" is nothing more than Christianity with an upside down
> cross.
>
>
> - Show quoted text -
Actually, the upside down cross is the cross of st Peter.
He didn't feel worthy to be crucified in the same way Jesus was, and
requested it upside down.
Jack Slutmuffin
> >to you three-fold, come home to roost, or in some way boomerang back to
> >the sender. This is yet another indication of the guilt-ridden
> >philosophy which is held by these neo-Pagan, pseudo-Christian groups.
> >White witches want to delve into witchcraft, but cannot divorce
> >themselves from the stigma attached to it. Therefore, they call
> >themselves white magicians, and base seventy-five per cent of their
> >philosophy on the trite and hackneyed tenets of Christianity. Anyone
> >who pretends to be interested in magic or the occult for reasons other
> >than gaining personal power is the worst kind of hypocrite. The
> >Satanist respects Christianity for, at least, being consistent in its
> >guilt-ridden philosophy, but can only feel contempt for people who
> >attempt to appear emancipated from guilt by joining a witchcraft group,
> >and then practice the same basic philosophy as Christianity."
> >-- Anton LaVey; "The Satanic Bible"
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Satanism" is nothing more than Christianity with an upside down
> cross.
>
"Christianity" is nothing more than Satanism with an upside down cross.
Nevermore
> From: Republican <repub...@email.com>
> Newsgroups: alt.islam.sufism,alt.languages.irish,alt.mexico,alt.movies.
> christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.religion.asatru
> Subject: Re: Christians Don't Understand Wicca? Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2008
> 11:07:39 +1300 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.
> supernews.com
>
> On Mon, 12 Jun 2006 18:36:22 -0600, "Tigrah" <feli...@pmt.org>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>"Rev.Rev." <R...@NoGod.No> wrote in message
>>news:448df...@news.iprimus.com.au...
>>> Let us face the truth shall we? The truth, the REAL truth, is:
>>>
>>> Wicca, and other Pagan beliefs, are based on beliefs that pre-date
>>> Christianity by many, many, many years... Can you point to any
>>> Christianity that pre-dates ancient 'pagan' beliefs (not the Old
>>> Testament because a) it doesn't pre-date Paganism, and b) it
>>> belongs to the Jewish and borrowed by the Christians anyway)??
>>
>>I agree on this point.
>
> You oughtn't. The Jewish religion was born out of Moses fleeing Egypt.
Dating on pottery shards across ancient Isreal indicates the Hebrews
never went anywhere. The Hebrew peoples decended from the hills and
made up their history out of whole cloth. There is no archeological
record validating any such stay in Egypt.
> It is worth noting that the Pharoah of the time had instituted
> Monotheism <cough>.
Hundreds down, one to go...
>
> Dualistic accounts of Good and Evil also predate Judaism...
>
>>> Many Christian celebrations were originally 'Pagan' in origin,
>>> adapted by the early Christians who were, after all, forming a NEW
>>> religion within a Pagan Roman Empire. Can you explain why
>>> Christmas is held at the same time as the Pagan Winter Solstice and
>>> nowhere near when Jesus was actually born?
>>
>>I agree to this point as well.
>
> Of course. Jesus wasn't born in late December...think carefully about
> what Mary and Joseph were doing when they went to Bethlehem. What time
> of the year would have been the time for census taking?
Actually, you've got the question backwards - ask yourself what sort of
idiots the Romans (not known for being idiots) would have had to have
been to institute a census on or about 0 A.D. which required all those
to be counted to travel to the home of their ancestors to be counted?
We couldn't make that happen today, let alone 2,000 years ago, let alone
in Galilee which (unlike Judea) wasn't even a Roman province, let alone
to count people when the only thing that was of interest to Roman
censuses was taxable property (what were they going to do, forward the
statistics to the Department of Children and Families?!?!?!?)...
I think you can see that any notion of a lowly carpenter and his wife
hopping on a donkey and heading off to participate in a Roman civil
government function clear in what was effectively another country in
that day and age is about as fictional as the notion of slaves wandering
around the desert in a big mass for years on end looking for their
homeland.
Nevermore (don't get me started on frankincense)
Attuarii
> In <i1qcp356c2s2f95ta...@4ax.com> Republican wrote:
>> From: Republican <repub...@email.com>
>> Newsgroups: alt.islam.sufism,alt.languages.irish,alt.mexico,alt.movies.
>> christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.religion.asatru
>> Subject: Re: Christians Don't Understand Wicca? Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2008
>> 11:07:39 +1300 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.
>> supernews.com
>>
>> On Mon, 12 Jun 2006 18:36:22 -0600, "Tigrah" <feli...@pmt.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>"Rev.Rev." <R...@NoGod.No> wrote in message
>>>news:448df...@news.iprimus.com.au...
>>>> Let us face the truth shall we? The truth, the REAL truth, is:
>>>>
>>>> Wicca, and other Pagan beliefs, are based on beliefs that pre-date
>>>> Christianity by many, many, many years... Can you point to any
>>>> Christianity that pre-dates ancient 'pagan' beliefs (not the Old
>>>> Testament because a) it doesn't pre-date Paganism, and b) it
>>>> belongs to the Jewish and borrowed by the Christians anyway)??
>>>
>>>I agree on this point.
>>
>> You oughtn't. The Jewish religion was born out of Moses fleeing Egypt.
>
> Dating on pottery shards across ancient Isreal indicates the Hebrews
> never went anywhere. The Hebrew peoples decended from the hills and
> made up their history out of whole cloth. There is no archeological
> record validating any such stay in Egypt.
Most of the OT is some kind of wholesale fabrication. I recall reading an
archaeological report about 1st Century CE Palestine which claimed that the
homes where no writing was found were the homes of Hebrew speakers. Since
all of the texts discovered on the dig were Greek, that was a convenient
fiction.
But it would make for an interesting legend to tell about a leper colony.
DEE
> More lies spread by a Christain kook why am i not suprised?
Defending the *reality* of Wicca are ya kook?
sarchasm
> > More lies spread by a Christain kook why am i not suprised?
>
> Defending the *reality* of Wicca are ya kook?
It's as real as any christian bullshit, so why not?
Nevermore
>>> You oughtn't. The Jewish religion was born out of Moses fleeing
>>> Egypt.
>>
>> Dating on pottery shards across ancient Isreal indicates the Hebrews
>> never went anywhere. The Hebrew peoples decended from the hills and
>> made up their history out of whole cloth. There is no archeological
>> record validating any such stay in Egypt.
>
> Most of the OT is some kind of wholesale fabrication. I recall
> reading an archaeological report about 1st Century CE Palestine which
> claimed that the homes where no writing was found were the homes of
> Hebrew speakers. Since all of the texts discovered on the dig were
> Greek, that was a convenient fiction.
It's kind of like the argument that "record keeping wasn't all that good
back then" or "there were all kinds of `messiahs' running around" to
explain why there is no mention of Jesus outside the bible (a book which,
by the way, claims that "throngs" of people came clear "from foreign
lands" to hear him speak!).
Seon Ferguson
"sarchasm" <sar....@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:fng5u0$6gd$1...@registered.motzarella.org...
(no offense to the Wiccans reading this. I do believe they are one way to
worship the creator though) just like Jesus (the son of God figure
Christains blindly worship) but what I am defeding is the fact that Witches
do not believe in Satan and anyone who believes that is eather a liar (and
knows it) or has been fooled by lies spread by the Church and
jesus-is-saviour is a kook site who thinks the big evil boogie man is out to
get them. "DEE" have you read any other articles from jesus-is-saviour?
dank
A relative of mine went insane and stumbled across some Wicca propaganda
on the Internet and after hearing him babble about it incessantly I
decided it was a stupid little brainwashing cult that should be
destroyed. More like a game of Dungeons & Dragons that's gone way too
far than a standard religious cult, with teenage players getting so caught
up in the game it brainwashes them and they begin believing they really
are mythological characters with magic powers.
My interpretation of Wicca is that it was invented as a similar role-
playing game in the 19th century, taking elements from Celtic mythology
and pretending it had some connection to ancient pagan religions. The
major attraction of the Wicca cult is that it claims to be the religion
practiced by "witches" that xians burned at the stake centuries ago.
Though there is little evidence that any Inquisition victims were
anything other than ordinary heretics, by pretending that they were
real (?) witches gives modern Wicca practitioners a sense of collective
victimization. Though most of us see them as silly and perhaps a bit
mentally unbalanced, Wiccans enjoy imagining that they are persecuted
and it is just a matter of time before another witch genocide.
Nik
wrote:
Don't the Dead Sea Scrolls refer to Jesus?
Nik
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aine
Nevermore
> From: Nik <repub...@email.com>
> Newsgroups: alt.islam.sufism,alt.languages.irish,alt.mexico,alt.movies.
> christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.religion.asatru
> Subject: Re: Christians Don't Understand Wicca? Date: Sun, 03 Feb 2008
> 19:46:37 +1300 Organization: Superfeed.net
>
> On Sat, 26 Jan 2008 14:47:03 -0600, Nevermore <bur...@thestake.net>
> wrote:
>
>>In <sfadnUhOdNKMXQfa...@speakeasy.net> Attuarii wrote:
>>
>>>>> You oughtn't. The Jewish religion was born out of Moses fleeing
>>>>> Egypt.
>>>>
>>>> Dating on pottery shards across ancient Isreal indicates the
>>>> Hebrews never went anywhere. The Hebrew peoples decended from the
>>>> hills and made up their history out of whole cloth. There is no
>>>> archeological record validating any such stay in Egypt.
>>>
>>> Most of the OT is some kind of wholesale fabrication. I recall
>>> reading an archaeological report about 1st Century CE Palestine
>>> which claimed that the homes where no writing was found were the
>>> homes of Hebrew speakers. Since all of the texts discovered on the
>>> dig were Greek, that was a convenient fiction.
>>
>>It's kind of like the argument that "record keeping wasn't all that
>>good back then" or "there were all kinds of `messiahs' running
>>around" to explain why there is no mention of Jesus outside the bible (
>>a book which, by the way, claims that "throngs" of people came clear
>>"from foreign lands" to hear him speak!).
>
> Don't the Dead Sea Scrolls refer to Jesus?
>
> Nik
No. Actually there is no contemporary ancient reference to Jesus
outside of the individual "books" of the pseudo-epigraphic gospels (
Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, etc.) which began appearing in the Second
Century and were selected amongst and cobbled together later (when the
Gnostic gospels - the Gospel of Mary, Gospel of Judas, etc. were tossed
out). You can get an excellent history of how Jesus was essentially
made up by googling the Jewish scholarly article "Refuting Missionaries"
and by checking out jesusneverexisted.com
Nevermore
Attuarii
Nevermore
> From: Attuarii <chatt...@germania.sup>
> Newsgroups: alt.islam.sufism,alt.languages.irish,alt.mexico,alt.movies.
> christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.religion.asatru
> Subject: Re: Christians Don't Understand Wicca? Date: Sun, 03 Feb 2008
>
> Nevermore wrote:
>
>> In <rpoaq3lsh8tstlqv6...@4ax.com> Nik wrote:
>>> From: Nik <repub...@email.com>
>>> Newsgroups: alt.islam.sufism,alt.languages.irish,alt.mexico,alt.
>>> movies. christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.religion.
And - like I said - from that very website:
In his story, Mohammed Ali Samman admitted that some pages had been lost,
burnt or thrown away. Even so, he had laid his hands on a fabulous
treasure with its Coptic translations, dating back to the 2nd century AC,
of religious and philosophical texts that were even older, initially
written in Greek
In other words, there are NO ancient CONTEMPORARY references to Jesus.
The Second Century AD would be like having the first references to
George Washington appear in 1976!
Attuarii
Big Brother is Goldstein.
Joseph Littleshoes
And lets stick this in here befroe some one mentons the "Testimonium
Flavanium"
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/scott_oser/hojfaq.html
--
JL
Nevermore
> From: Attuarii <chatt...@germania.sup>
> Newsgroups: alt.islam.sufism,alt.languages.irish,alt.mexico,alt.movies.
> christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.religion.asatru
> Subject: Re: Christians Don't Understand Wicca? Date: Sun, 03 Feb 2008
> mexico,alt.movies.christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.
> religion.asatru
>
> Nevermore wrote:
>
>> In <iMudnYjqmfNdWjja...@speakeasy.net> Attuarii wrote:
>>> From: Attuarii <chatt...@germania.sup>
>>> movies. christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.religion.
>>> asatru Subject: Re: Christians Don't Understand Wicca? Date: Sun, 03
>>>
>>> Nevermore wrote:
>>>
>>>> In <rpoaq3lsh8tstlqv6...@4ax.com> Nik wrote:
>>>>> From: Nik <repub...@email.com>
>>>>> Newsgroups: alt.islam.sufism,alt.languages.irish,alt.mexico,alt.
>>>>> movies. christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.religion.
>>>>> asatru Subject: Re: Christians Don't Understand Wicca? Date: Sun,
>>>>> 03 Feb 2008 19:46:37 +1300 Organization: Superfeed.net
>>>>>
>>>> was essentially made up by googling the Jewish scholarly article
>>>> "Refuting Missionaries" and by checking out jesusneverexisted.com
>>>> Nevermore
>>>
>>> http://www.nag-hammadi.com/
>>
>> And - like I said - from that very website:
>>
>> In his story, Mohammed Ali Samman admitted that some pages had been
>> lost, burnt or thrown away. Even so, he had laid his hands on a
>> fabulous treasure with its Coptic translations, dating back to the
>> 2nd century AC, of religious and philosophical texts that were even
>> older, initially written in Greek In other words, there are NO
>> ancient CONTEMPORARY references to Jesus. The Second Century AD would
>> be like having the first references to George Washington appear in
>> 1976!
>
> Big Brother is Goldstein.
My accountant?!? I'm not following you, big guy.
Attuarii
The forces which cause one line of verse to follow the previous caused that
post. There is meaning to be found, but I can explain it no better than I
have.
Nevermore
> From: Attuarii <chatt...@germania.sup>
> Newsgroups: alt.islam.sufism,alt.languages.irish,alt.mexico,alt.movies.
> christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.religion.asatru
> Subject: Re: Christians Don't Understand Wicca? Date: Sun, 03 Feb 2008
> mexico,alt.movies.christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.
> religion.asatru
>
> Nevermore wrote:
>
>> In <c9adnXyhReZIQTja...@speakeasy.net> Attuarii wrote:
>>> From: Attuarii <chatt...@germania.sup>
>>> movies. christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.religion.
>>> asatru Subject: Re: Christians Don't Understand Wicca? Date: Sun, 03
>>> irish,alt. mexico,alt.movies.christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.
>>> wicca,alt. religion.asatru
Ah, well. As we say at ARW: We are all Ren.
Ray Elizondo
"aine" <aine_n...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d63b1c9a-9d64-4bd8...@m34g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
Nevermore
wrote:
> From: Joseph Littleshoes <jpst...@isp.com>
> Newsgroups: alt.islam.sufism,alt.languages.irish,alt.mexico,alt.movies.
> christian-bale,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.religion.asatru
> Subject: Re: Christians Don't Understand Wicca? Date: Sun, 03 Feb 2008
> isp.com
Thanks! In the back of my mind I kind of felt the TF would be stirring
from some desperate source...
Attuarii
So "Ren" another word for Ymir?
Seon Ferguson
> news:d63b1c9a-9d64-4bd8...@m34g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
> On Jan 26, 12:41 pm, "sarchasm" <sar.ch...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> "DEE" <adravi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > "Seon Ferguson" <seo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > > More lies spread by a Christain kook why am i not suprised?
>>
>> > Defending the *reality* of Wicca are ya kook?
>>
If you believe the article you are a kook as well.
zsars
--
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