Walter Bowart Interview (Operation Mind Control)
rpautrey2
http://forteanswest.com/wordpress-mu/washingtonlowfi/2009/03/23/55/
The following interview took place in 2005 between Len Osanic of Black
Op Radio and the late Walter Bowart, author of the groundbreaking 1978
book Operation Mind Control. It has been edited down for placement
here on the blog. The full interview was transcribed for inclusion in
The Mothman’s Photographer III: Meetings With Remarkable West Coast
Witnesses Touched by Anomalous Activities of Interdimensional
Entities, Archetypal Avatars, and the Eerie Yet Enlightening
Phenomenon Known Infamously as “Mothman.” In this interview – one of
Bowart’s last – Bowart alludes to the UFO phenomenon as being part of
government mind control (i.e., MJ-12 as a precursor to MK-Ultra).
Len Osanic of Black Op Radio (LO): We are very pleased to have with us
Mr. Walter Bowart, who is the author of a very historic book,
Operation Mind Control. Tell us about Operation Mind Control.
Walter Bowart (WB): I started digging around. The German Gehlen
organization became part of the CIA. I interviewed a lot of people
from behind the Iron Curtain – a different breed of people. Fletcher
Prouty became a friend of mine. Fletcher was one of those Yale boys.
He flew Presidents Truman and Roosevelt around. After the war, the CIA
was formed with new secrecy agreements asking generals and high-
ranking military officers to sign this weird oath [sending them] to
prison if they talked about any of these secrets. Prouty and his
commanding officers said in no uncertain terms, “Get these Yalies,
these little college boys out of here. We fought a war and won. We
swore to uphold the Constitution and our oath is good. We don’t need a
contract to sign.” Of course the contract was founded upon the
National Security Act, which we’re still operating under. We have
martial law in this country, and we have had it since WW II. It’s
never been revoked.
LO: Colonel Prouty was one of the few people who wasn’t silenced by an
oath. That’s an interesting point.
WB: He was an amazing man. He had a great heart, a great soul, and was
an honest, forthright man. I dedicated Operation Mind Control to him
and others like him [who] tell the truth. There’s not enough of that
[nowadays]. Now we’re in worse shape, with Homeland Security and this
[War on] “Terror.” It was hard enough to find the “communists” under
the bed. How are we going to find the “terrorists” under the bed?
LO: [Especially] when it circles back to who’s financing them…
WB: Yes, the whole banking thing… Of course [the key to the program
itself stays] on the run. As Canadian Marshall McLuhan [said] “When
information travels at the speed of light, there can be no secrecy, no
propriety – everything becomes transparent.” And that’s what is
happening. That’s why we’re so aware of the cryptocracy. When the
World Trade Center was bombed [and] hit by the airplanes on 9/11, I
called my son who was in a very expensive private school. I asked,
“What are you doing?” and he said, “Well, we have Study Hall, so we
can watch the [attack] on television.” I asked, “Well, what’s the
consensus opinion of the kids there in the Study Hall.” He says,
“Almost every one of them believes that elements of the United States
blew up their own building to whip the gullible public into believing
we were under attack.” That was a first impression. So there’s very
little credibility in our government anymore. You can track that from
the assassination of Kennedy. [That] is when it all turned. I remember
the day I heard about the assassination of Kennedy, on my way to work
in New York City. I was a bartender in my 20s, and I saw all of these
Ukrainian and Polish people with their bright babushkas and fedoras.
They were all clustered around a flagpole that was at half-mast. I
walked up to them and asked, “What’s going on?” They said, “The
president was shot. This is a coup d’etat.” They’d seen that happen in
Europe in various ways. But it never occurred to the gullible American
people that it would be so easy to have a coup d’etat. Ever since
then, things have not gone right. We’ve lost our civil rights. This is
a tyranny, a coup d’etat – a serious situation.
LO: Now there are [new] laws enacted to clamp down on whistleblowers.
WB: Yes, but of course people will continue… Any totalitarian society
collapses, and ours is destined to collapse. We just cannot become a
snitch culture. The American Dream was not founded on those
principles, and it won’t succeed when we take away freedom. The
greatest thing about America was its freedom, where a person had a
right to freedom of thought. [Freedom of thought] wasn’t mentioned in
the Constitution (freedom of speech was), but freedom of thought
presupposes freedom of speech. Now they have a way of intruding on
your very thought process: [the] mental health system. Ewen Cameron
worked for the CIA. He was the president of the American Psychiatric
Association, the Canadian Psychiatric Association, the head
psychiatrist for the Nuremberg Trials [and] one of the biggest tyrants
[ever. The] CIA paid $750,000 to each of the families of survivors [of
Cameron’s heinous experiments].
LO: Yes… Horrendous stuff, a whole new level of depravity… What we’re
talking about is people who have gone into hospitals with maybe a
nervous twitch in their leg, a muscle spasm or something
psychosomatic. [The doctors said] “We can’t find any physical problems
so it must be something in your head.” Then [the victims were] drugged
and put into psychic driving where they were unconscious for 30 days
in a row [under] brainwashing techniques. This was MK-ULTRA,
ARTICHOKE, and BLUEBIRD.
WB: And MK-DELTA… It goes on and on. Most researchers end up calling
it “MK-ULTRA.” It was ultra-secret. It’s real interesting. Cognitive
dissonance sets in when we go here among the 16,000 files that we got
from the CIA back in the ’70s. There were two [files] on UFOs. When
you read some of the documents that have been released since then, and
put the whole thing together [you see a linked progression]. I
discussed this with Prouty, who was hired as an expert witness to look
at the original [MJ-12] documents. He said he didn’t see one that was
a forgery. So you’ve got MJ-12 [then] MK ULTRA. Is that numbering
process a coincidence? We have to get to the bottom of that secrecy
[and] let it all come out. It will all eventually come out but it’s
going to take a lot of citizens, devoting a lot of time badgering
everybody, to get it out.
LO: [It is crucial] to make people aware of it. People are aware of
Madison Avenue and advertising campaigns to shape opinion, but I think
they’re really underestimating the strides that had been made not
[just] to change your opinion but [to create assassins]. They’re
making a new Manchurian Candidate film. It’s just staggering to think
[about all] that was going on. Like you said, it was one of the best-
kept secrets.
WB: Yes, it was amazing how well-kept it was, but about the UFO thing…
I’ve been doing mind control [research] for 25 years. When I
encountered these two files about the UFO phenomenon in the CIA mind
control files, I just said, “Oh boy, I’m not going to go here because
it’s hard enough [for people] to believe the mind control thing
without bringing UFOs into it.” So I just ignored it. But now I’m
beginning to [wonder]. Prouty had seen a lot of these things. He was
very interested in UFOs. He said he had to debrief a lot of pilots who
had seen UFOs over the years. I have an 8-hour unpublished videotape
of his where he describes all of the UFO connections to intelligence…
I’m getting rather bored with doing run-of-the-mill mind control
[research] because it’s just repeating what I’ve known over and over
again. The new stuff that I’m excited about [is] the UFO [stuff].
People actually start fistfights [over this] because the UFO community
doesn’t want to hear about the mind control thing, and the mind
control aficionados don’t want to hear about the UFO thing. These are
[supposedly] mutually exclusive things. We’ve heard thousands of
individuals telling stories about being abducted and not remembering
it, using hypnosis to recover their memories later. [The high numbers
of] people recovering from ritual abuse by many of these same MK-ULTRA
doctors [created the need for] the False Memory Syndrome Foundation.
[They have] put a lid on the whole thing and caused lawsuits. In
California now, if you’ve ever been hypnotized, you cannot testify in
a trial. You’re disqualified… The MK-ULTRA people knew that memories
could be manipulated; amnesia is easy to induce. Martin T. Orne did a
lot of research on amnesia. He recently passed away. Jolly West was in
there. He recently passed away, too. That whole generation of
villainous “mental health” [professionals is dying off].
LO: Today, the Internet gets a bad rap. [But] we are the Internet – a
true form of democracy… We often don’t like everything we see there,
but that is “the people” speaking.
WB: That’s right, and basically, it’s the last chance we’ve got. That
may be why we’re seeing this reaction [from the cryptocracy] – trying
to shut it down. We’ve got Homeland Security and all of these new
Draconian laws. The Constitution is in shambles. The Bush
administration is a tyranny. It’s more than mind control… The American
public are [generally] “sheeple.” But it only takes 5% of the
population to change [things].
LO: Well, I was a bit encouraged by what you mentioned about the
number of people who reacted with suspicion after 9/11. In Canada, we
usually get the impression that in certain educational environments
Americans tend to be more aware, but the large cross-section of the
U.S. is, I’m sorry to say, grossly ignorant. I don’t mean that
insultingly, I just mean [that they are] seriously uneducated.
WB: I couldn’t believe [this when it happened, but] I bought a
hamburger in Tucson, AZ and the lady didn’t know how to add! She
couldn’t figure out what the change was, because I ordered something
that wasn’t on her buttons that she had. I didn’t really fully
understand what was going on. I told her how much change it was, and
she trusted me and gave me the right amount of change. I looked back
at the cash register and it didn’t have regular keys. It had large
buttons with pictures of the [items] like you might see a 3 or 4 year
old child working with. It would add up the amount and tell her – it
[actually] spoke – how much [the total was]. So they are hiring people
who are totally illiterate and, of course, designing a system that
will function with these people. Marshall McLuhan talked about post-
literacy… McLuhan got most of his ideas, apparently, from James
Joyce’s magnificent Finnegan’s Wake. It’s the ultimate in books…
Recently, I’ve been working on a project to try to describe to people
what the subconscious is and how it works with [waking] consciousness.
It’s part of hypnotherapy, and it goes back to the Kahunas and the
Berbers. It describes the technology for healing without touch.
Maxwell Freedom Long wrote about it. It’s very important stuff [that]
fits in with the information age… As we become more transparent, less
like machines, we become more spiritual. We have our god-given gifts –
what people call ESP. When we all become telepathic, it will be
pointless to have a National Security Act or a Homeland Security Act.
LO: The [elites] are probably going to fight to keep that from
happening.
WB: It’s almost like they’re trying to take us back to the 19th
century. We’re trying to go back to the Fall [of Man. However] the
technology’s already been invented; you can’t take it back. The cat’s
out of the bag. Get on with the information age… The information
economy is infinite, and money is obsolete. We’re into a whole new
paradigm; quantum physics proves it. Go to IBM.com and look up their
teleportation experiments. Look up their time travel [experiments].
They’ve proven it with photons. From a photon [you go] to an atom, to
a molecule, and then, pretty soon, the whole family can go to another
dimension on a Sunday afternoon.
LO: That would be a truly open environment. I can hardly wait.
WB: Well, that’s what I’m looking forward to, and that’s why I feel
confident and optimistic. We’re seeing here the tyranny of the Bush
administration and that whole gang of oil company executives and
corrupt bankers, using the sweat equity of a nation – money that’s not
backed by anything but the promissory note of the worker. The
insurance society has got to go. It’s just Las Vegas gambling with a
built-in 25% profit. But today you can’t run a business without
insurance. You can’t get a loan without insurance. Instead of building
a safety net of some kind for the elderly and indigent and sick and
homeless, we’ve just tried to tell them insurance. It doesn’t work;
it’s going to collapse – the collapse of the New Roman Empire. The
Roman Empire was based upon roads [and water management.
Unfortunately] we still are working with the road metaphor, the
plumbing diagram, when in fact the laser ought to be our metaphor.
LO: Is there anything else that you wanted to bring up about your
book?
WB: Just the cognitive dissonance that’s in our society. Eighty
percent of the people in the U.S. apparently believe in UFOs. Talk
about mind control… The aliens, the little greys (or whoever they are)
described by abductees have the ability to erase your memories and
control your mind. People [try to] say, “You can’t do that to me! I’ve
got willpower. I can’t be made to do something against my will and
without my knowledge. I can’t be hypnotized!” [Unfortunately]
everybody can be hypnotized one way or another.
LO: You’ve [certainly] documented that, from the 1950s on.
WB: Yes, and now I know even more about it. As we become transparent
[in the McLuhan sense] the subconscious becomes the ground upon which
whatever figures are painted. The subconscious has always been way
ahead of us. It’s in our dreams. Those of us who’ve had our dream
state and waking [state both turned] on at the same time can describe
in great detail what that’s like. It’s very disconcerting but it’s
also a wonderful, terrible experience that is going to be our future.
I toured the New Jersey Neuropsychiatric Institute in Princeton in the
1960s, interviewing Canadian Humphrey Osmond, who coined the term
“psychedelic.” [He was a] wonderful, charming, energetic man [who] was
helping schizophrenics using niacinamide and vitamin C. He told me,
“We’re all going to be hearing voices, seeing visions, and
experiencing ultradimensional and intradimensional phenomena, because
schizophrenia is our next evolutionary step.” We’re going to have to
come to terms with having our senses on full-blown, before we can
explain who we are and what God-given rights we have.
LO: Yes, the subconscious is powerful and is being harnessed by [both]
the military [and] private sectors. We’re talking about an evolution
that is more multidimensional. I understand what you’re talking about
myself. I’ve had lots of experiences and dreams along those lines. For
example, I don’t know how many people have had parallel dreams –
multiple experiences at the same time – but it gives a very good idea
of schizophrenia. The mind is not very well understood at this point…
WB: It really is not. Look at the DSM-IV [Psychiatric Diagnostic
Manual. It] is strongly influenced by the insurance companies and
people having no experience in the richness of the human mind and
spirit. That’s one of the things that the MK-Ultra victims taught me.
Over and over I heard the phrase, “They didn’t mess with my mind; they
messed with my soul.” I’ve begun to think in spiritual terms of what
has gone on here. This is a horrible thing. [It is] just like the
Inquisition, but more sophisticated and less visible. There’s no blood
on the streets, but that makes it even more insidious. And of course
the technology is now available to everyone. There’s a guy in New
Mexico who is selling psychotronic weapons. He says, “I can boil my
mother-in-law’s brain from 100 yards with this little handheld device
that I can keep in a brown paper bag. If I just put it on low power,
it scrambles her thoughts and her memory. If I turn it up full blast,
it will [melt] her brain in the brain pan.” So I said, “Look, I’ll get
a [test animal] or something. I want to film it.” He chickened out,
because he thought animal protection would get him. His company is
named Consumertronics. I heard that the governor of New Mexico
personally made it his cause to put this guy out of business, because
he was selling machines that cost $5000, which nobody was sure worked.
But mind control has become a way for people with a variety of mental
disorders or problems to escape responsibility. They [simply] say,
“The voices I hear are from the government – they are doing this to
me.” At a conference of psychiatrists, psychologists, and survivors of
mind control, I learned that the ET phenomenon was very common – and
[yet] suppressed – at the suggestion of the therapists. [Victims come
to understand that the therapist will] never believe you about satanic
ritual abuse if you [also] tell them about this alien stuff. The next
wave of research is going to be looking at both the mind control
effects and the so-called “alien abduction” effects. A friend of mine
has made a chart comparing reports of ritual abuse, alien abduction,
and government mind control. [All] are describing the bright lights,
doctors in white coats, and medical tables. The descriptions are
universal across the board. It [all] sounds like the same phenomenon.
And the differences [too] are worth discussing, not [just] the
similarities. It is the tip of a [mind control] research iceberg.
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