Those who do not follow Christ cannot keep God's Commandments because they do not have the Spirit of God.
Linda Lee
not follow Christ cannot keep God's Commandments because they do not
have the Spirit of God.
In Mark 1:8 John the Baptist says of the Messiah, “I indeed have
baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy
Ghost” [Holy Spirit].
Yahashua` the Messiah taught that to obtain eternal life we must
FOLLOW HIM, do good works for the “poor” (meaning those who are
“distressed”), and obey the Ten Commandments (“keep the Commandments”
- Matt. 19:17 & 21).
We know that the Messiah meant THE Ten Commandments when he said to
“keep the Commandments” in Matt. 19:17, not only because he there
listed those of the Ten Commandments contained in Ex. 20:3-17 (see at
bottom) that have to do with how we treat our fellow man (the rest of
the Ten Commandments, including the Great Commandment having to do
with worshipping only God, were covered under his unction to “follow
me” - Matt. 19:21), but also because the Messiah told the Jews that
other different commandments/statutes/statements written in the Torah
(the Hebrew Scriptures, also called the Law of Moses because the word
Torah means “law”) were “YOUR LAW”, the Jews' law, not God's law (John
8:17, John 10:34):
John 8:17, “It is also written in YOUR LAW [Torah, the 'law of
Moses'], that the testimony of two men is true”.
Here the Messiah cites a verse from the Psalms, calling it “your law”,
the Jews' law, also:
John 10:34, “Jesus answered them, Is it not written in YOUR LAW
[Torah, the law of Moses], I said, Ye are gods?”
This is a reference to Ps. 82:6, wherein God told the Israelites they
were “children of the most High”/God and were “gods”. (This was
translated in the KJV Bible from the Hebrew word “elohiym”, which when
applied to a plurality, such as the children of Israel, does not mean
God; it means gods, angels, divine ones, rulers, and judges. Here, its
meaning can only be angels, because there are no other real gods
besides God, and all of the Israelites were not rulers or judges.
'John Gill's Exposition of the Entire Bible' explains: “Many of the
Jewish writers, by "gods", understand "the angels". The Targum [an
Aramaic translation of the Hebrew Scriptures] paraphrases the words
thus: “I said ye are accounted as angels, as the angels on high, all
of you”.)
Mat 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what
good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is
none good but one, that is, God: but IF THOU WILT ENTER INTO LIFE,
KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS.
Mat 19:18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no
murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou
shalt not bear false witness,
Mat 19:19 Honor thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy
neighbor as thyself.
Mat 19:20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept
from my youth up: what lack I yet?
Mat 19:21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect [COMPLETE], go
and sell that thou hast, and GIVE TO THE POOR, and thou shalt have
treasure in heaven: and come and FOLLOW ME.
Mat 19:22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away
sorrowful: for he had great possessions.
We all have sinned or will sin sometime in our lives, and without
Christ giving us the Spirit we are simply unable to refrain from sin.
Christ could heal and forgive sins, but when he did heal them and told
them their sins were forgiven, he told them to go and sin no more:
John 5:14, concerning a man the Messiah had just healed, “Afterward
Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art
made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.”
Joh 8:3 And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken
in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst,
Joh 8:4 They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery,
in the very act.
Joh 8:5 Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be
stoned: but what sayest thou?
Joh 8:6 This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse
him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground,
as though he heard them not.
Joh 8:7 So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and
said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a
stone at her.
Joh 8:8 And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.
Joh 8:9 And they which heard it, being convicted by their own
conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto
the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the
midst.
Joh 8:10 When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the
woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath
no man condemned thee?
Joh 8:11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, NEITHER DO
I CONDEMN THEE: GO, AND SIN NO MORE.
The apostle John taught:
1Jn 3:1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us,
that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth
us not, because it knew him not.
1Jn 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet
appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we
shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
1Jn 3:3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself,
even as he is pure.
1Jn 3:4 WHOSOEVER COMMITTETH SIN TRANSGRESSETH ALSO THE LAW: FOR SIN
IS THE TRANSGRESSION OF THE LAW [The Ten Commandments].
1Jn 3:5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and
in him is no sin.
1Jn 3:6 WHOSOEVER ABIDETH IN HIM SINNETH NOT: WHOSOEVER SINNETH HATH
NOT SEEN HIM, NEITHER KNOWN HIM.
1Jn 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth
righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
1Jn 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth
from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested,
that he might destroy the works of the devil.
1Jn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed
remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
1Jn 3:10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children
of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither
he that loveth not his brother.
1 Pet. 4:1 “Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the
flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath
suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin”.
Many people cite Paul when they make the false claim that Christians
do not have to obey the Commandments, but that is not even what Paul
taught.
For those who see Paul as their teacher and guide, even Paul taught
that we should obey the Commandments, but that without Christ, it was
impossible; even though one might agree in their mind that the
Commandments were good, the Commandments could not be obeyed perfectly
throughout one's life without the Spirit of God we obtained through
belief in Christ. Without Christ, one COULD NOT ALWAYS do the good
that they knew they should do and could not refrain from doing the
evil they knew they should not do.
Here Paul describes his condition when he tried to obey the
Commandments of his own accord without the Spirit enabling him:
Rom 7:5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which
were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto
death.
Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid.
Rom 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and
just, and good.
Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am [WAS]
carnal, sold under sin.
Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no
good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that
which is good I find not.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I
would not, that I do.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law
of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is
in my members.
Paul asks how we can escape this condition of being unable to obey the
Commandments even though we know that they are good, and his answer is
through Christ we are delivered from this dilemma:
Rom 7:24 O WRETCHED MAN THAT I AM! WHO SHALL DELIVER ME FROM THE BODY
OF THIS DEATH?
Rom 7:25 I THANK GOD THROUGH JESUS CHRIST OUR LORD.
Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in
Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made
me free from the law of sin and death.
Rom 8:3 FOR WHAT THE LAW COULD NOT DO, IN THAT IT WAS WEAK THROUGH
THE FLESH, GOD SENDING HIS OWN SON IN THE LIKENESS OF SINFUL FLESH,
AND FOR SIN, CONDEMNED SIN IN THE FLESH:
Rom 8:4 THAT THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF THE LAW MIGHT BE FULFILLED IN US,
WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE FLESH, BUT AFTER THE SPIRIT.
Rom 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the
flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
Rom 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually
minded is life and peace.
Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not
subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Rom 8:9 BUT YE ARE NOT IN THE FLESH, BUT IN THE SPIRIT, IF SO BE THAT
THE SPIRIT OF GOD DWELL IN YOU. NOW IF ANY MAN HAVE NOT THE SPIRIT OF
CHRIST, HE IS NONE OF HIS.
Rom 8:10 AND IF CHRIST BE IN YOU, THE BODY IS DEAD BECAUSE OF SIN;
BUT THE SPIRIT IS LIFE BECAUSE OF RIGHTEOUSNESS.
Rom 2:12 For as many as have sinned without law [the GENTILES] shall
also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law [the
JEWS] shall be judged by the law;
Rom 2:13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but THE
DOERS OF THE LAW SHALL BE JUSTIFIED.
No, I still do not believe the false apostle Paul was a valid apostle,
his methods were not the methods of the apostles, he threatened those
who did not accept him as an apostle, his teachings were not able to
be clearly understood, he argued with the real apostles about many
things and considered himself their equal when he could not be as they
were taught by the Messiah and Paul was not. But for those who do
believe Paul was an apostle, it is shown here that Paul did NOT preach
that Christians did not have to obey the Ten Commandments nor that
they did not have to do good works. People only think he did because
“all his [Paul's] epistles” are “hard to be understood”, so that
confusion leads many of the “unlearned” to “their own
destruction” (eternal damnation) through lawlessness, i.e. failure to
obey the law of God, the Ten Commandments, whereas the teachings of
the Messiah through his real apostles led many of the “unlearned” to
obey the Commandments, to do good works, and to follow Christ in order
to obtain salvation and eternal life.
2Pe 3:16 As also in ALL his [PAUL'S] EPISTLES, speaking in them of
these things; in which are some things HARD TO BE UNDERSTOOD, which
they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other
scriptures, unto THEIR OWN DESTRUCTION.
2Pe 3:17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before,
beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked
[“lawless”], fall from your own stedfastness.
The Ten Commandments:
Exo 20:1 And God spake all these words, saying,
Exo 20:2 I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the
land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
Exo 20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
Exo 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any
likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth
beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:
Exo 20:5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for
I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the
fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them
that hate me;
Exo 20:6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and
keep my commandments.
Exo 20:7 Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain;
for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in
vain.
Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
Exo 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in
it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter,
thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger
that is within thy gates:
Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea,
and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the
LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
Exo 20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long
upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee.
Exo 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.
Exo 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.
Exo 20:15 Thou shalt not steal.
Exo 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.
Exo 20:17 Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not
covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant,
nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's.
Zadok
"Linda Lee" <lindag...@juno.com> wrote in message ...
>Without Christ, mankind CANNOT obey the Ten Commandments. Those who do
>not follow Christ cannot keep God's Commandments because they do not
>have the Spirit of God.
But, your bible contradicts you.
In Jeremiah we are told what the new covenant is.
Jeremiah 31: 33 - "This is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel
after that time," declares the LORD.
"I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
That simply tells us, that God will put his LAW in our minds and our hearts.
One does not need a Saviour for that.
You also need a lesson on what constituted the LAW!!
It is not your simplistic GENTILE view.
And Jesus told you more that keeping the commandments.
Jesus tells you in Matthew 5: 18 -
18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest
letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the
Law until everything is accomplished.
Got that??
Until Heaven and Earth pass away, nothing will change in the LAW!!
No go and ask a JEW, what constitutes the LAW!!
Smile.
Linda Lee
> "Linda Lee" <lindagirl...@juno.com> wrote in message ...
> >Without Christ, mankind CANNOT obey the Ten Commandments. Those who do
> >not follow Christ cannot keep God's Commandments because they do not
> >have the Spirit of God.
>
> But, your bible contradicts you.
>
> In Jeremiah we are told what the new covenant is.
>
> Jeremiah 31: 33 - "This is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel
> after that time," declares the LORD.
> "I will put my law in their minds
> and write it on their hearts.
> I will be their God,
> and they will be my people.
>
> That simply tells us, that God will put his LAW in our minds and our hearts.
No, it says he will put his law in the hearts and minds of the house
of Israel.
>
> One does not need a Saviour for that.
>
> You also need a lesson on what constituted the LAW!!
>
> It is not your simplistic GENTILE view.
>
> And Jesus told you more that keeping the commandments.
>
> Jesus tells you in Matthew 5: 18 -
>
> 18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest
> letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the
> Law until everything is accomplished.
>
> Got that??
The word the Messiah used in Matt. 5:18 was 'nomos'; the same word he
used when he spoke of a verse from the Psalms and the Jews' law of
requiring two witnesses as "your law" (John 8:17 & John 10:34); he
used the word entolē when he spoke of the Ten Commandments in Matt.
19:17. Torah (the Hebrew Scriptures of the Pentateuch) means 'law', he
was speaking of the entire Torah when he said law/nomos, the entire
five books of Moses, and apparently at least the Psalms also,
prophecies and all.
>
> Until Heaven and Earth pass away, nothing will change in the LAW!!
>
> No go and ask a JEW, what constitutes the LAW!!
The precepts in the 'law of Moses' applied only to the Jews. It
doesn't matter what the Jews consider the law to be, the Messiah
called Moses' statutes "your law", the Jews' law, and differentiated
between it and his admonition anyone wanting eternal life should
follow the Ten Commandments.
>
> Smile.
Zadok
"Linda Lee" <lyndal...@juno.com> wrote in message ...
>The precepts in the 'law of Moses' applied only to the Jews. It
>doesn't matter what the Jews consider the law to be, the Messiah
>called Moses' statutes "your law", the Jews' law, and differentiated
>between it and his admonition anyone wanting eternal life should
>follow the Ten Commandments.
Why do you take the lessons of the Gospels, and twist it to match Saulus the
apostate??
It makes one think you don't have a clue!!
Smile.
Linda Lee
> "Linda Lee" <lyndalee8...@juno.com> wrote in message ...
> >The precepts in the 'law of Moses' applied only to the Jews. It
> >doesn't matter what the Jews consider the law to be, the Messiah
> >called Moses' statutes "your law", the Jews' law, and differentiated
> >between it and his admonition anyone wanting eternal life should
> >follow the Ten Commandments.
>
> Why do you take the lessons of the Gospels, and twist it to match Saulus the
> apostate??
>
How so? You're being very vague. Even Paul taught that everyone had to
obey the Ten Commandments.
Are you talking about belief the Messiah was God incarnate or what?
> It makes one think you don't have a clue!!
Be specific what you're talking about when you talk about Saulus'
lessons and what you think the lessons of the Gospels were. I don't
know what beliefs you hold about either of them or from where
specifically you got them.
>
> Smile.
Zadok
> "Linda Lee" <lyndalee8...@juno.com> wrote in message ...
> >The precepts in the 'law of Moses' applied only to the Jews. It
> >doesn't matter what the Jews consider the law to be, the Messiah
> >called Moses' statutes "your law", the Jews' law, and differentiated
> >between it and his admonition anyone wanting eternal life should
> >follow the Ten Commandments.
>
> Why do you take the lessons of the Gospels, and twist it to match Saulus
the
> apostate??
>
>How so? You're being very vague. Even Paul taught that everyone had to
>obey the Ten Commandments.
It's simple. Saulus said you were no longer under the LAW of Moses!!
Jesus never said it!!
And you go off on a tanget saying that Jesus referred to YOUR LAW!!
Why don't you show us where Jesus ever preached to Gentiles??
An a couple of women, who did not need to be circumsized hardly equate to
Gentiles.
Ah, it seems Jesus only preached to JEWS!! So why wouldn't her refer to it
as YOUR LAW!!
Don't forget now, that Jesus was a Jew.
You need some evidence that he kept the Jewish LAW!!
Try Matthew 26: 18 - He replied, "Go into the city to a certain man and tell
him, 'The Teacher says: My appointed time is near. I am going to celebrate
the Passover with my disciples at your house.' "
Now read Leviticus - 23 -
4 " 'These are the LORD's appointed feasts, the sacred assemblies you are to
proclaim at their appointed times: 5 The LORD's Passover begins at twilight
on the fourteenth day of the first month. 6 On the fifteenth day of that
month the LORD's Feast of Unleavened Bread begins; for seven days you must
eat bread made without yeast. 7 On the first day hold a sacred assembly and
do no regular work. 8 For seven days present an offering made to the LORD by
fire. And on the seventh day hold a sacred assembly and do no regular work.'
"
What?? Jesus was obeying the Leviticus laws on Sacred days??
Why don't you tell us that the Passover is somehow in the 10 Commandments!!
What was it Saulus said??
Colossians 2: 16 - Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or
drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a
Sabbath day.
But what it that the bible says??
2 Chronicles 31: 3 - The king contributed from his own possessions for the
morning and evening burnt offerings and for the burnt offerings on the
Sabbaths, New Moons and appointed feasts as written in the Law of the LORD.
What?? Jesus kept the appointed feasts, WRITTEN IN THE LAW OF THE LORD!!
Note that LAW of the Lord!!
Smile.
Sam Taylor
<lyndal...@juno.com> wrote:
>On Oct 22, 5:28 pm, "Zadok" <nob...@accesswave.ca> wrote:
>> "Linda Lee" <lindagirl...@juno.com> wrote in message ...
>> >Without Christ, mankind CANNOT obey the Ten Commandments. Those who do
>> >not follow Christ cannot keep God's Commandments because they do not
>> >have the Spirit of God.
>>
>> But, your bible contradicts you.
>>
>> In Jeremiah we are told what the new covenant is.
>>
>> Jeremiah 31: 33 - "This is the covenant I will make with the house of Isr=
>ael
>> after that time," declares the LORD.
>> "I will put my law in their minds
>> and write it on their hearts.
>> I will be their God,
>> and they will be my people.
>>
>> That simply tells us, that God will put his LAW in our minds and our hear=
>ts.
>
>No, it says he will put his law in the hearts and minds of the house
>of Israel.
>
Shhhh! this is a secret.......DON"T TELL ANYONE.....
IT"S THE SAME LAW!
BUT
Let;s keep that to ourselves......
>>
>> One does not need a Saviour for that.
>>
>> You also need a lesson on what constituted the LAW!!
>>
>> It is not your simplistic GENTILE view.
>>
>> And Jesus told you more that keeping the commandments.
>>
>> Jesus tells you in Matthew 5: 18 -
>>
>> 18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smalles=
>t
>> letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from t=
>he
>> Law until everything is accomplished.
>>
>> Got that??
>
>
>The word the Messiah used in Matt. 5:18 was 'nomos'; the same word he
>used when he spoke of a verse from the Psalms and the Jews' law of
>requiring two witnesses as "your law" (John 8:17 & John 10:34); he
>used the word entole=CC=84 when he spoke of the Ten Commandments in Matt.
Sam Taylor
wrote:
The Testamony of Jesus is to KEEP the commandments
which Commandments , you ask?
The ones given through Moses.
and the 2 jesus gave.
Most Xtians don't read carefully enough
for Jesus said He gave 2 more, not instead.
>
Linda Lee
> "Linda Lee" <lyndalee8...@juno.com> wrote in message ...
>
> On Oct 22, 6:01 pm, "Zadok" <nob...@accesswave.ca> wrote:
>
> > "Linda Lee" <lyndalee8...@juno.com> wrote in message ...
> > >The precepts in the 'law of Moses' applied only to the Jews. It
> > >doesn't matter what the Jews consider the law to be, the Messiah
> > >called Moses' statutes "your law", the Jews' law, and differentiated
> > >between it and his admonition anyone wanting eternal life should
> > >follow the Ten Commandments.
>
> > Why do you take the lessons of the Gospels, and twist it to match Saulus
> the
> > apostate??
>
> >How so? You're being very vague. Even Paul taught that everyone had to
> >obey the Ten Commandments.
>
> It's simple. Saulus said you were no longer under the LAW of Moses!!
> Jesus never said it!!
He never said Gentiles were either. And James is said to have said
Gentiles only had to observe certain things.
Act 15:18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the
world.
Act 15:19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which
from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from
pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled,
and from blood.
Act 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach
him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.
>
> And you go off on a tanget saying that Jesus referred to YOUR LAW!!
>
Tangent. There was no tangent. I was pointing out it was the law of
Moses, the 613 statutes, versus the Ten Commandments.
> Why don't you show us where Jesus ever preached to Gentiles??
> An a couple of women, who did not need to be circumsized hardly equate to
> Gentiles.
>
> Ah, it seems Jesus only preached to JEWS!! So why wouldn't her refer to it
> as YOUR LAW!!
> Don't forget now, that Jesus was a Jew.
Yes, so he should have said "our law", shouldn't he when he as a Jew
was speaking to Jews?
>
> You need some evidence that he kept the Jewish LAW!!
>
> Try Matthew 26: 18 - He replied, "Go into the city to a certain man and tell
> him, 'The Teacher says: My appointed time is near. I am going to celebrate
> the Passover with my disciples at your house.' "
>
> Now read Leviticus - 23 -
>
> 4 " 'These are the LORD's appointed feasts, the sacred assemblies you are to
> proclaim at their appointed times: 5 The LORD's Passover begins at twilight
> on the fourteenth day of the first month. 6 On the fifteenth day of that
> month the LORD's Feast of Unleavened Bread begins; for seven days you must
> eat bread made without yeast. 7 On the first day hold a sacred assembly and
> do no regular work. 8 For seven days present an offering made to the LORD by
> fire. And on the seventh day hold a sacred assembly and do no regular work.'
> "
>
> What?? Jesus was obeying the Leviticus laws on Sacred days??
>
> Why don't you tell us that the Passover is somehow in the 10 Commandments!!
Okay. Yes, observance of the Passover and other high holy days are in
the Ten Commandments because the holy days were/are called sabbaths as
well. I recall that it may have been the Jewish poster Zev that told
me that.
The high holy days of the days of awe are called Shabbat Shabbaton,
the “Sabbath of Sabbaths”.
It doesn't matter anyway, because as you've pointed out, "Jesus" was a
Jew and would normally observe Jewish traditions. But how is that
related to him being saviour or the world?
Hos. 2:23 "And I will sow her [Jezreel i.e. sown of God -Israel] unto
me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained
mercy; and I will say to them which were not my people, Thou art my
people; and they shall say, Thou art my God."
Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the
house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law
in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their
God, and they shall be my people.
Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and
every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know
me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD:
for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no
more.
You were right that Jeremiah 31:33 applies to all of us as the next
verse reveals even Israel's neighbors will know God's laws, but it
doesn't mean that we don't need a Saviour for that, the Saviour could
be the method by which all men know God.
>
> What was it Saulus said??
>
> Colossians 2: 16 - Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or
> drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a
> Sabbath day.
>
> But what it that the bible says??
>
> 2 Chronicles 31: 3 - The king contributed from his own possessions for the
> morning and evening burnt offerings and for the burnt offerings on the
> Sabbaths, New Moons and appointed feasts as written in the Law of the LORD.
>
> What?? Jesus kept the appointed feasts, WRITTEN IN THE LAW OF THE LORD!!
>
> Note that LAW of the Lord!!
That is translated from torah, and the Torah is also the Pentateuch.
>
> Smile.
Linda Lee
True, we shall all one day know God:
Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the
house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law
in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their
God, and they shall be my people.
Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and
every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know
me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD:
for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no
more.
>
>
>
Linda Lee
> On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 22:01:38 GMT, "Zadok" <nob...@accesswave.ca>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >>The precepts in the 'law of Moses' applied only to the Jews. It
> >>doesn't matter what the Jews consider the law to be, the Messiah
> >>called Moses' statutes "your law", the Jews' law, and differentiated
> >>between it and his admonition anyone wanting eternal life should
> >>follow the Ten Commandments.
>
> >Why do you take the lessons of the Gospels, and twist it to match Saulus the
> >apostate??
>
> >It makes one think you don't have a clue!!
>
> >Smile.
>
> The Testamony of Jesus is to KEEP the commandments
> which Commandments , you ask?
> The ones given through Moses.
> and the 2 jesus gave.
> Most Xtians don't read carefully enough
> for Jesus said He gave 2 more, not instead.
>
>
It was not "instead" of, but how is it two more? To love God and one's
neighbor is simply a paraphrase of the Ten Commandments.
Zadok
> Jesus never said it!!
>He never said Gentiles were either. And James is said to have said
>Gentiles only had to observe certain things.
>Act 15:18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the
>world.
>Act 15:19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which
>from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
>Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from
>pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled,
>and from blood.
>Act 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach
>him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.
Acts?? Another Gentile??
Here do some reading. Luke was nothing but a mouth piece for Saulus.
Irenaeus (180 A.D) tells us: �Luke, Paul�s companion, put down in his book
the Gospel which Paul preached.�
Tertullian speaks of - and Luke�s digest is often ascribed to Paul. And
indeed it is easy to take that for the Master�s which the disciples
published.� Again, �Moreover, Luke was not an apostle, but an apostolic man;
not a master but a disciple: certainly less than his master; certainly so
much later, as he is a follower of Paul, the last of the apostles.�
Origen mentions the gospels in the order commonly received��The third,� says
he, �is that according to Luke, the gospel commended by Paul, published for
the sake of the Gentile converts.�
In the Synopsis ascribed to Athanasius, it is said, �That the gospel of Luke
was dictated by the apostle Paul, and written and published by the blessed
apostle and physician Luke.�
I find it amazing that you reject Saulus, but then turn around and accept
everything his minion Luke says!!
> And you go off on a tanget saying that Jesus referred to YOUR LAW!!
>
>Tangent. There was no tangent. I was pointing out it was the law of
>Moses, the 613 statutes, versus the Ten Commandments.
It is a tangent. Because like all Gentiles, you do not want to obey the
Jewish Law.
But you want the Jewish God.
What you fail to comprehend, is that just like in the OT, in the NT a
Gentile could be
saved, but it entailed him becoming a Jew. That never changed, no matter how
many
times you quote Luke, the minion of Saulus.
Acts is the most insidious book in the bible, as Luke tries to reconcile
Saulus
with the religion that the disciples were preaching.
But even he slips at times.
Acts 21: 20 tells us that the followers of James (the first Bishop of the
Jerusalem Church)
were believers and Zealous of the LAW!!
A little later, in verse 28, Saulus is run out of Judea for teaching against
the Law.
And what was one of the things he did, He took Greeks into the Temple.
And that was against the LAW!!
> Why don't you show us where Jesus ever preached to Gentiles??
> An a couple of women, who did not need to be circumsized hardly equate to
> Gentiles.
>
> Ah, it seems Jesus only preached to JEWS!! So why wouldn't her refer to it
> as YOUR LAW!!
> Don't forget now, that Jesus was a Jew.
>Yes, so he should have said "our law", shouldn't he when he as a Jew
>was speaking to Jews?
To your Gentile mind!! But your's is not a Jewish mind!!
If it was Sabbaths, the commandment woulkd read, Remember the SABBATHS!!
It reads REMEMBER THE SABBATH!!
>Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the
>house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law
>in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their
>God, and they shall be my people.
>Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and
>every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know
>me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD:
>for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no
>more.
>You were right that Jeremiah 31:33 applies to all of us as the next
>verse reveals even Israel's neighbors will know God's laws, but it
>doesn't mean that we don't need a Saviour for that, the Saviour could
>be the method by which all men know God.
You read into the verses something that is not there. You make neighbour
suddenly mean neighbouring nations, and that is not what it says. But
once again, you expand it to mean Gentiles.
> What was it Saulus said??
>
> Colossians 2: 16 - Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat
or
> drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a
> Sabbath day.
>
> But what it that the bible says??
>
> 2 Chronicles 31: 3 - The king contributed from his own possessions for the
> morning and evening burnt offerings and for the burnt offerings on the
> Sabbaths, New Moons and appointed feasts as written in the Law of the
LORD.
>
> What?? Jesus kept the appointed feasts, WRITTEN IN THE LAW OF THE LORD!!
>
> Note that LAW of the Lord!!
>That is translated from torah, and the Torah is also the Pentateuch.
So what?? Jesus was a TORAH OBSERVANT JEW!!
And it was a JEWISH God, until Saulus came along and stole the Jewish God.
And suddenly Gentiles knew more about the scriptures than 2,000 years of
Jewish study
did!!
Now, explain to me, why we need a Saviour!!
What did Jesus do, that God could not do??
Or are you one of these people that think all the Jews who died before Jesus
came,
could not be saved??
Keep in mind that sacrificing a son or a daughter to a God, was/is an
abomination
unto God. You might check Deuteronomy 12: 31 for that.
Smile.
Thurisaz, warrior of Thor
> Without Christ, mankind CANNOT obey the Ten Commandments. Those who do
> not follow Christ cannot keep God's Commandments because they do not
> have the Spirit of God.
1. funny how the most rabidly jebus cultist societies are inevitably the
LEAST moral ones. The very claim itself is already remarkably arrogant.
Herrenmenschen anyone?
2. specify what set of commandments you mean - the alpha or final version?
--
Thurisaz, warrior of Thor, natural enemy of morontheism
The judgment of morontheism: http://www.carcosa.de/nojebus
Ike E 2009
> Without Christ, mankind CANNOT obey the Ten Commandments.
WITH Christ man cannot obey the Ten Commandments (which, by the way, you're
still breaking by speaking).
1Jo 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth
in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
The believers don't sin, NOT because they keep the law, but because THEY
HAVE THE SEED WITHIN THEM (which won't "sprout" until the resurrection).
And Jesus and Paul SAID THE SAME THING.
> Those who do
> not follow Christ cannot keep God's Commandments because they do not
> have the Spirit of God.
Those who DO follow Christ can't God's Commandments BECAUSE THEY'RE STILL
"FLESH."
1Jn 2:1-2
My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And
if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the
righteous: And HE is the PROPITIATION for our sins: and not for ours only,
but also for the sins of the whole world.
> In Mark 1:8 John the Baptist says of the Messiah, �I indeed have
> baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy
> Ghost� [Holy Spirit].
Which has nothing to do with "law keeping."
> Yahashua` the Messiah taught that to obtain eternal life we must
> FOLLOW HIM,
YES, IN HIS MISSION OF MERCY, NOT "LAW KEEPING."
> do good works for the �poor� (meaning those who are
> �distressed�),
WHICH WOULD BE EVIDENCE OF "MERCY."
> and obey the Ten Commandments (�keep the Commandments�
> - Matt. 19:17 & 21).
JESUS SAID NO SUCH THING, oh, ignorant one: YOU KEEP CUTTING OFF THE STORY
BEFORE IT'S FINISHED, just like you massacre every other scripture on the
subject.
> We know that the Messiah meant THE Ten Commandments when he said to
> �keep the Commandments� in Matt. 19:17...
You moron. Jesus told the man that to DEMONSTRATE how the man WASN'T keeping
the Commandments. And then Jesus went on to prophesy of the GOSPEL OF GRACE.
You're SUCH a Pharisaical demon...
[snip]
Ike
Ike E 2009
"Zadok" <nob...@accesswave.ca> wrote in message
news:384Em.49885$PH1.25759@edtnps82...
>
> "Linda Lee" <lindag...@juno.com> wrote in message ...
>>Without Christ, mankind CANNOT obey the Ten Commandments. Those who do
>>not follow Christ cannot keep God's Commandments because they do not
>>have the Spirit of God.
>
> But, your bible contradicts you.
>
> In Jeremiah we are told what the new covenant is.
>
> Jeremiah 31: 33 - "This is the covenant I will make with the house of
> Israel
> after that time," declares the LORD.
> "I will put my law in their minds
> and write it on their hearts.
> I will be their God,
> and they will be my people.
>
> That simply tells us, that God will put his LAW in our minds and our
> hearts.
Problem is this won't be fulfilled in "Israel" until the THIRD Israel.
> One does not need a Saviour for that.
The Savior will be the ONE DOING IT, oh, clueless one.
And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an
hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father�s name written in their
foreheads.
And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the
voice of a great thunder.
And I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps, and they sung
as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the
elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four
thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.
These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins.
These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were
redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb; and
in their mouth was found no guile, for they are without fault before the
throne of God.
And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the
everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every
nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, saying with a loud voice, Fear
God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and
worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of
waters.
And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen,
that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath
of her fornication.
And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man
worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in
his hand, the same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is
poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be
tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in
the presence of the Lamb: And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for
ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast
and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the
commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
That last part identifies the players here, and it will be the THIRD Israel.
[snip]
Ike
Michael Christ
"Ike E 2009" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:hbrcuc$o15$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>
> "Linda Lee" <lindag...@juno.com> wrote in message
> news:d5b1975d-dc15-4580...@p23g2000vbl.googlegroups.com...
>> Without Christ, mankind CANNOT obey the Ten Commandments.
>
> WITH Christ man cannot obey the Ten Commandments (which, by the way,
> you're still breaking by speaking).
>
Ike wrote:
> 1Jo 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed
> remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
> The believers don't sin, NOT because they keep the law, but because THEY
> HAVE THE SEED WITHIN THEM
That is right
His seed within them.
Ike wrote:
(which won't "sprout" until the resurrection).
Bull.
The only reason you say that is because you are not born of God.
Michael Christ
Zadok
"Ike E 2009" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message ...
> > Jeremiah 31: 33 - "This is the covenant I will make with the house of
> > Israel
> > after that time," declares the LORD.
> > "I will put my law in their minds
> > and write it on their hearts.
> > I will be their God,
> > and they will be my people.
> >
> > That simply tells us, that God will put his LAW in our minds and our
> > hearts.
>
> Problem is this won't be fulfilled in "Israel" until the THIRD Israel.
Some think it is a ball game, with three or nine innings, whatever their
mistaken
beliefs allow!!
> > One does not need a Saviour for that.
>
> The Savior will be the ONE DOING IT, oh, clueless one.
>
> And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an
> hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their
> foreheads.
Your problem is that you quote Revelation, which all happened in 70AD.
Thus it is useless other than a short history course of what happened then.
But on the other hand, you have idiots like yourself, Waiting! Waiting!
Waiting!
Jesus told you his kingdom was not of this world, yet you Wait, and Wait,
and Wait.
Its been nearly 2,000 years, and what another 10,000 need to pass, before
the sky pixie comes??
Smile.
Ike E 2009
>
> "Ike E 2009" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message ...
>> > Jeremiah 31: 33 - "This is the covenant I will make with the house of
>> > Israel
>> > after that time," declares the LORD.
>> > "I will put my law in their minds
>> > and write it on their hearts.
>> > I will be their God,
>> > and they will be my people.
>> >
>> > That simply tells us, that God will put his LAW in our minds and our
>> > hearts.
>>
>> Problem is this won't be fulfilled in "Israel" until the THIRD Israel.
>
> Some think it is a ball game, with three or nine innings, whatever their
> mistaken
> beliefs allow!!
The "mistaken beliefs" are all yours.
And it IS a "ballgame" with "innings"--seven of them. The sixth is drawing
to a close, and the seventh will start in due course of time.
>> > One does not need a Saviour for that.
>>
>> The Savior will be the ONE DOING IT, oh, clueless one.
>>
>> And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him
>> an
>> hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in
>> their
>> foreheads.
>
> Your problem is that you quote Revelation, which all happened in 70AD.
Nope. What is past is prologue.
> Thus it is useless other than a short history course of what happened
> then.
Nope. "That which has been is now, and that which is to be has already
become, and God requires that which is past."
> But on the other hand, you have idiots like yourself, Waiting! Waiting!
> Waiting!
Yup. Just like Abraham.
> Jesus told you his kingdom was not of this world, yet you Wait, and Wait,
> and Wait.
Jesus told the SANHEDRIN that His Kingdom is not of this world...for the
time being.
> Its been nearly 2,000 years, and what another 10,000 need to pass, before
> the sky pixie comes??
1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction
cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not
escape.
[Note whom Paul was quoting: Jeremiah...]
<chuckle>
Ike
Zadok
> > Waiting!
>
> Yup. Just like Abraham.
>
> > Jesus told you his kingdom was not of this world, yet you Wait, and
Wait,
> > and Wait.
>
> Jesus told the SANHEDRIN that His Kingdom is not of this world...for the
> time being.
>
> > Its been nearly 2,000 years, and what another 10,000 need to pass,
before
> > the sky pixie comes??
>
> 1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction
> cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not
> escape.
>
> [Note whom Paul was quoting: Jeremiah...]
Saulus was good at quoting the OT.
The fun thing is all the idiots waiting, and waiting and waiting.
Oh, that includes you, Ike the idiot!!
But don't worry, just Wait, and Wait, and Wait.
But you'll never see it.
Remember Jesus said until Heaven and earth Pass away.
And the SUN of God is eternal. And earth will not pass away,
as long as the SUN of God, watches over us.
Smile.
Linda Lee
wrote:
>
> WITH Christ man cannot obey the Ten Commandments
That a lie.
<snip Idiot Ike's lies>
Linda Lee
> "Linda Lee" <lyndalee8...@juno.com> wrote in message ...
I take Luke with a grain of salt; I don't accept everything that Luke
says because some things, including his account of Paul's Damascus
road experience, and his claim Christ told the apostles to go buy
swords, he either had to learn from Paul or they go against everything
else Christ is reported to have said. But Luke reported things that
were critical of Paul as well and so he seems to attempt to be an
honest reporter.
>
> > And you go off on a tanget saying that Jesus referred to YOUR LAW!!
>
> >Tangent. There was no tangent. I was pointing out it was the law of
> >Moses, the 613 statutes, versus the Ten Commandments.
>
> It is a tangent. Because like all Gentiles, you do not want to obey the
> Jewish Law.
> But you want the Jewish God.
>
> What you fail to comprehend, is that just like in the OT, in the NT a
> Gentile could be
> saved, but it entailed him becoming a Jew. That never changed, no matter how
> many
> times you quote Luke, the minion of Saulus.
>
> Acts is the most insidious book in the bible, as Luke tries to reconcile
> Saulus
> with the religion that the disciples were preaching.
>
> But even he slips at times.
>
> Acts 21: 20 tells us that the followers of James (the first Bishop of the
> Jerusalem Church)
> were believers and Zealous of the LAW!!
What makes you think he slips and isn't just reporting what he heard?
Even Paul taught believers were able to obey the law in Romans Chapter
Eight, the Spirit enabling them.
>
> A little later, in verse 28, Saulus is run out of Judea for teaching against
> the Law.
> And what was one of the things he did, He took Greeks into the Temple.
>
> And that was against the LAW!!
So you're saying:
1. Christ only came to the Jews and rejected the Gentiles
2. Saulus/Paul was an apostate Jew who is the only one who ever wanted
to save the Gentiles.
3. Gentiles had to become Jews to be saved.
4. The Gentiles weren't allowed to convert and weren't allowed in the
Jewish temple because it was against the law.
You do Saulus a huge favor making him the Gentile Saviour.
>
> > Why don't you show us where Jesus ever preached to Gentiles??
> > An a couple of women, who did not need to be circumsized hardly equate to
> > Gentiles.
>
> > Ah, it seems Jesus only preached to JEWS!! So why wouldn't her refer to it
> > as YOUR LAW!!
> > Don't forget now, that Jesus was a Jew.
> >Yes, so he should have said "our law", shouldn't he when he as a Jew
> >was speaking to Jews?
>
> To your Gentile mind!! But your's is not a Jewish mind!!
Well Christ's was a Jewish mind, and if he weren't differentiating
between Moses' law of 613 statutes and God's law of Ten Commandments,
he would have said "our law" instead of "your law".
Each sabbath.
>
> >Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the
> >house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law
> >in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their
> >God, and they shall be my people.
> >Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and
> >every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know
> >me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD:
> >for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no
> >more.
> >You were right that Jeremiah 31:33 applies to all of us as the next
> >verse reveals even Israel's neighbors will know God's laws, but it
> >doesn't mean that we don't need a Saviour for that, the Saviour could
> >be the method by which all men know God.
>
> You read into the verses something that is not there. You make neighbour
> suddenly mean neighbouring nations, and that is not what it says. But
> once again, you expand it to mean Gentiles.
What? You did the same, so why are you changing your position now?
You replied to my initial post by saying the following:
<quote>
"In Jeremiah we are told what the new covenant is.
Jeremiah 31: 33 - "This is the covenant I will make with the house of
Israel
after that time," declares the LORD.
"I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
That simply tells us, that God will put his LAW in our minds and our
hearts." <end quote>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > What was it Saulus said??
>
> > Colossians 2: 16 - Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat
> or
> > drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a
> > Sabbath day.
>
> > But what it that the bible says??
>
> > 2 Chronicles 31: 3 - The king contributed from his own possessions for the
> > morning and evening burnt offerings and for the burnt offerings on the
> > Sabbaths, New Moons and appointed feasts as written in the Law of the
> LORD.
>
> > What?? Jesus kept the appointed feasts, WRITTEN IN THE LAW OF THE LORD!!
>
> > Note that LAW of the Lord!!
> > > That is translated from torah, and the Torah is also the Pentateuch.
>
> So what?? Jesus was a TORAH OBSERVANT JEW!!
>
> And it was a JEWISH God, until Saulus came along and stole the Jewish God.
>
> And suddenly Gentiles knew more about the scriptures than 2,000 years of
> Jewish study
> did!!
>
> Now, explain to me, why we need a Saviour!!
That question doesn't make sense since you claim Christ didn't come to
the Gentiles and that God is a Jewish God therefore only Jews are
saved. So why wouldn't we need a saviour according to your beliefs?
>
> What did Jesus do, that God could not do??
>
> Or are you one of these people that think all the Jews who died before Jesus
> came,
> could not be saved??
No, I think they were in peace in the afterlife awaiting entry into
Heaven.
>
> Keep in mind that sacrificing a son or a daughter to a God, was/is an
> abomination
> unto God. You might check Deuteronomy 12: 31 for that.
Sacrificing yourself is not an abomination. Throughout the Hebrew
Scriptures God prophesied that he would come himself to act as our
only Saviour.
Psa 2:11 Serve the LORD with fear, and rejoice with trembling.
Psa 2:12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way,
when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put
their trust in him.
Psa 23:1 <A Psalm of David.> The LORD is my shepherd; I shall not
want.
Christ said,
Joh 10:14 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of
mine.
Joh 10:15 As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I
lay down my life for the sheep.
Joh 10:16 And other sheep [Gentiles] I have, which are not of this
fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there
shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
Joh 10:17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my
life, that I might take it again.
Notice he does not say God raised him from the dead here as it is
phrased elsewhere, he says "I lay down my life, that I might take it
again".
Zadok
"Linda Lee" <lyndal...@juno.com> wrote in message ...
>I take Luke with a grain of salt; I don't accept everything that Luke
>says because some things, including his account of Paul's Damascus
>road experience, and his claim Christ told the apostles to go buy
>swords, he either had to learn from Paul or they go against everything
>else Christ is reported to have said. But Luke reported things that
>were critical of Paul as well and so he seems to attempt to be an
>honest reporter.
He seems?? The fact is that he omits very important facts.
1) The election of James the Righteous as head of the Jerusalem Church.
2) He invents a council where Peter says that by his mouth the Gentiles
would hear the gospel.
Yet Saulus has already told us that Peter was the apostle to the
circumsized!!
And what does Peter say. He was sent to the STRANGERS SCATTERED, Jews!!
Just as James tells us, To the twelve tribes scattered abroad.
And just like Jesus told us, I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of the house
of Israel.
So if you want to be of that house, then you become a Jew, get circumcized
and follow the LAW!!
> But even he slips at times.
>
> Acts 21: 20 tells us that the followers of James (the first Bishop of the
> Jerusalem Church)
> were believers and Zealous of the LAW!!
>What makes you think he slips and isn't just reporting what he heard?
>Even Paul taught believers were able to obey the law in Romans Chapter
>Eight, the Spirit enabling them.
Simply because of all the things he leaves out!!
Luke's account is fiction, designed for Gentiles.
>So you're saying:
>1. Christ only came to the Jews and rejected the Gentiles
That's what Jesus Christ said - It's not me -
Matthew 10: 5 - These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions:
"Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans.
Matthew 15: 24 - He answered, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel."
>2. Saulus/Paul was an apostate Jew who is the only one who ever wanted
>to save the Gentiles.
Saulus was not even a Jew. He was an Udumaean, who claimed to be a Jew.
>3. Gentiles had to become Jews to be saved.
That's right!! And the only thing you can find in the bible that says
otherwise
is written by Gentiles, be it Saulus or Luke.
>4. The Gentiles weren't allowed to convert and weren't allowed in the
Jewish temple because it was against the law.
I never said that!! Any gentile could convert, They could in the OT and they
can today.
They just get circumsized and follow the LAW!!
And that is exactly what Jesus did. He got circumsized and he followed the
LAW!!
And you cannot find anyone who says different, except for ther Gentile
writers,
Saulus and Luke.
>No, I think they were in peace in the afterlife awaiting entry into
>Heaven.
You think?? So what, you are buying into a Purgatory, waiting for some kind
of final deliverance??
> Keep in mind that sacrificing a son or a daughter to a God, was/is an
> abomination
> unto God. You might check Deuteronomy 12: 31 for that.
>Sacrificing yourself is not an abomination. Throughout the Hebrew
>Scriptures God prophesied that he would come himself to act as our
>only Saviour.
That's bull and you should know better. A messiah was promised, who would
free
The Jews from their oppressors and set up the Kingdom of God on Earth!!
And none of that ever happened!!
Not then, and not now, and not in the future.
What I am telling you is very simple.
Jesus could do nothing on his own, only with the power God gave him.
Thus if Jesus can save you, God can save you also.
And if God can save you, there is no need for a Saviour!!
It's a job assigned to pagan Godman like Attis and Mithras, and also
assigned by Gentiles to their idea
of what their Godman Jesus should be.
Smile.
Ike E 2009
>> WITH Christ man cannot obey the Ten Commandments
> That a lie.
Prove it from scripture, without you ignoring contexts or cutting stories
off before the punchline.
Ike
P.S. Still waiting for you to show us where Paul taught a different Gospel
than Jesus.
P.S.S. You're still breaking the law by speaking of the law, Jezie.
Ike E 2009
[snip]
> So if you want to be of that house, then you become a Jew, get circumcized
> and follow the LAW!!
And you'll die condemned by the law, just like Jesus AND PAUL said...
Lk 18:9-14
And [Jesus] spake this parable unto certain WHICH TRUSTED IN THEMSELVES
THAT THEY WERE RIGHTEOUS, AND DESPISED OTHERS:
Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the
other a publican.
The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that
I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this
publican: I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his
eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a
sinner.
I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the
other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that
humbleth himself shall be exalted.
Hmmm. Jesus said the "law-keeper" was NOT justified, and the confessor WAS.
Ga 3:10-13
For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it
is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are
written in the book of the law to do them.
But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is
evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in
them.
Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse
for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
Hmmmm.
Once again, Jesus and Paul taught THE SAME THING.
Ike
Ike E 2009
[snip]
> I take Luke with a grain of salt; I don't accept everything that Luke
> says because some things, including his account of Paul's Damascus
> road experience, and his claim Christ told the apostles to go buy
> swords, he either had to learn from Paul or they go against everything
> else Christ is reported to have said. But Luke reported things that
> were critical of Paul as well and so he seems to attempt to be an
> honest reporter.
Well, then, you don't have much of a Bible left since the synoptic Gospels
were born when Mark and Paul got together, each having one-half of the
story, and Mark's Gospel was incorporated into Luke's Gospel, and the latter
corpus of Matthew.
Hmmm.
No Paul = no Mark, no Luke, no Matthew, no John (as John was thoroughly
familiar with Matthew's Gospel). And there are three books that definitely
don't belong there.
[snip]
Ike
P.S. Still waiting for you to show me where Paul taught a different Gospel
Ike E 2009
[snip]
> The fun thing is all the idiots waiting, and waiting and waiting.
Let them wait like Abraham waited in the desert, and Israel waited in Egypt,
and those who anticipated the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ waited for His
first appearance and presentation.
Those who wait have all the time in the world.
You don't.
[snip]
Ike
Qadosh Stephanos
<Jesus...@Father.com> wrote:
>
>"Ike E 2009" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:hbrcuc$o15$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>
>> "Linda Lee" <lindag...@juno.com> wrote in message
>> news:d5b1975d-dc15-4580...@p23g2000vbl.googlegroups.com...
>>> Without Christ, mankind CANNOT obey the Ten Commandments.
>>
>> WITH Christ man cannot obey the Ten Commandments (which, by the way,
>> you're still breaking by speaking).
>>
>
>Ike wrote:
>> 1Jo 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed
>> remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
>
>> The believers don't sin, NOT because they keep the law, but because THEY
>> HAVE THE SEED WITHIN THEM
>
>That is right
>
>His seed within them.
Wherein arrogant Michael Savour thinks he has a licence to freely sin.
>Ike wrote:
>(which won't "sprout" until the resurrection).
>
>Bull.
>
>The only reason you say that is because you are not born of God.
In other words, I don't love you because you are a child of Satan. ;-)
>Michael Christ
History Lesson 101:
Posted: Aug 14 2000 in "alt.religion.christianity" by Michael Christ:
My name is Michael McLean.
However, I was born Stephen Nash. In 1991, I renounced and abandoned
by law that name and gained the surname McLean because my wife's
surname was McLean. It is a long story but I adopted the name McLean
for her sake and for the sake of her daughter from a previous
marriage. My wife passed away with cancer in 1995 and with that I
also lost my 8 year old daughter to her natural father.
I changed my christian name Stephen to Michael at the same time as the
surname because I never really liked Stephen anyway. So the law that
says you must stop at red traffic lights and pay your taxes states
that if you call me any other name than Michael McLean it is an
offence. Because it has been 'renounced and abandoned' under that
same law.
---
Posted: Mar 12 1999 in "alt.religion.christianity" by DW Suiter:
First of all I wasn`t going to get involved and expose Michael Christ
as the fraud he is.(He even threatened me not to get in his way)!
But when sincere people (Able and others) start to look to him for
guidance then it`s time to set the record straight.
Back in Dec.98, Michael Christ alias Michael Mclean alias Stephen
Nash,got a hold of me because of some visions I had. He wanted to see
me in person and also to visit Amedee in Paris.So i opened my
house to Him and he showed up. He did not come inquiring about my
visions. That was a pretense.
He began by telling me that God had him get involved in a homosexual
relationship with a younger man called Moses. By submitting to sex
with this person he was laying down his life and giving God "his all".
That`s a quote from him. After a couple of years ..they broke up.And
he has been out of any fellowship since. He has no group or followers.
After the third day of listening to him, God spoke to my heart and I
finally challenged his (MC) assertions. He blew up into a near rage.
Told me I knew nothing of God and had to do what he said.I told him he
had been seduced by demons and needed deliverance. I also mentioned I
could pray for him. He was to sleep on it. That next morning I asked
him, "Michael are you still perfect and make no mistakes?" and he said
yes. So I made arrangements to take him to the airport.And away he
went. Insisting all the while he wasn`t done with me yet. That is the
whole story from my end. My wife is also a witness and my business
partner is also. I will give my phone number out to any who email me.
For further discussion if that will help. I am a father of 5
children...9 grandchildren am 48 years old and have been following
Jesus for 30 years.
Sorry Michael,but you deserve to be exposed as all the deeds of
darkness will be....
Mike Shepard
Oregon,USA
Qadosh Stephanos
<xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>"Linda Lee" <lyndal...@juno.com> wrote in message
>news:5f3963c1-3ec8-4001...@g1g2000vbr.googlegroups.com...
>> On Oct 23, 12:54 am, "Ike E 2009" <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>
>>> WITH Christ man cannot obey the Ten Commandments
>
>> That a lie.
In the computation analogies, it is refereed to as circular reference.
>Prove it from scripture, without you ignoring contexts or cutting stories
>off before the punchline.
Conundrum, on one hand hand you say scripture is in error, then one
the hand you want people to provide those perfect Bible scriptures.
>Ike
>
>P.S. Still waiting for you to show us where Paul taught a different Gospel
>than Jesus.
Paul didn't teach a different Gospel. He taught a Christian religion.
>P.S.S. You're still breaking the law by speaking of the law, Jezie.
The Messiah spoke about the law.
Qadosh Stephanos
<lyndal...@juno.com> wrote:
>> WITH Christ man cannot obey the Ten Commandments
It is easier to pretend the 10 commandments are of the law.
Linda Lee
wrote:
> On Fri, 23 Oct 2009 08:37:52 -0700 (PDT), Linda Lee
>
Hi Qadosh. :-) How have you been doing?
It's amazing how some people who claim to be Christians have such an
abhorrence for commandments that tell us not to lust after and steal
what others have, including their very lives.
Zadok
"Ike E 2009" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message > "Zadok"
Your problem idiot boy, is exactly what church fathers rold us.
Irenaeus (180 A.D) tells us: "Luke, Paul's companion, put down in his book
the Gospel which Paul preached."
Tertullian speaks of - and Luke's digest is often ascribed to Paul. And
indeed it is easy to take that for the Master's which the disciples
published." Again, "Moreover, Luke was not an apostle, but an apostolic man;
not a master but a disciple: certainly less than his master; certainly so
much later, as he is a follower of Paul, the last of the apostles."
Origen mentions the gospels in the order commonly received-"The third," says
he, "is that according to Luke, the gospel commended by Paul, published for
the sake of the Gentile converts."
In the Synopsis ascribed to Athanasius, it is said, "That the gospel of Luke
was dictated by the apostle Paul, and written and published by the blessed
apostle and physician Luke."
And you quote Luke, who wrote the Gospel of Saulus, and then quote Saulus
and tell us they agree.
The fact is Luke never knew Jesus, never met Jesus and never studied with
Jesus.
So you can quote his made up stories all you want to justify Saulus, and
to an idiot like you it works.
Smile.
Zadok
I don't need all the time in the world. Simply because I am not waiting.
My God is waiting for me, and when I die he will make sure I enjoy the
mysteries of death,
as I have enjoyed the mysteries of life..
And nothing you religionists say can change that.
The fact remains that Israel was never in Egypt, as any examination of
Egyptian records will show you.
Thus your whole premise is based on MYTH!!
And your Abraham is a figment of a Macabbee priest's imagination!!
Smile.
Qadosh Stephanos
The perfect Bible of 1611AD under a king.
King David didn't cut dicks (1st Samuel).
Bible prostitutes,worse than pornography.
Ike E 2009
[snip]
> Irenaeus (180 A.D) tells us: "Luke, Paul's companion, put down in his book
> the Gospel which Paul preached."
Not exactly: It started back in Mark, when Mark had the teachings of Peter,
and Paul had the information from the OTHER end of the field.
[snip]
> And you quote Luke, who wrote the Gospel of Saulus, and then quote Saulus
> and tell us they agree.
Now demonstrate where Paul preached a different Gospel than Jesus,
ESPECIALLY when the PROPHETS prophesied of THE GOSPEL...
Eze 33:13 When I shall say to the righteous, that he shall surely live; if
he trust to HIS OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS, and commit iniquity, all his
righteousness shall not be remembered; but for his iniquity that he hath
committed, HE SHALL DIE FOR IT.
Now the same thing from Paul...
Ro 10:3 For they being ignorant of God�s righteousness, and going about to
establish THEIR OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS, have not submitted themselves unto the
righteousness of God.
Php 3:9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of
the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness
which is of God by faith.
Bottom line: Anyone who fails to put on the righteousness of Christ via the
Gospel, and relies on their OWN righteousness according to "law keeping" IS
CONDEMNED, just like Jesus taught...
Lk 18:9-14
And [Jesus] spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves
that they were righteous, and despised others:
Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the
other a publican.
The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that
I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this
publican. I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his
eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a
sinner.
I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the
other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that
humbleth himself shall be exalted.
YOU are the "Pharisee;" the believers are the "Publicans."
And both the Old and New Testaments condemn your war against Jesus and His
Gospel (which Paul also taught), "Ebionite."
Ike
Ike E 2009
>
> "Ike E 2009" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message ...
>>
>> "Zadok" <nob...@accesswave.ca> wrote in message
>> news:mtjEm.49931$PH1.30740@edtnps82...
>>
>> [snip]
>>
>> > The fun thing is all the idiots waiting, and waiting and waiting.
>>
>> Let them wait like Abraham waited in the desert, and Israel waited in
> Egypt,
>> and those who anticipated the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ waited for
> His
>> first appearance and presentation.
>>
>> Those who wait have all the time in the world.
>>
>> You don't.
>
> I don't need all the time in the world. Simply because I am not waiting.
Yes, I know: You're digging your way into hell with a backhoe.
> My God is waiting for me, and when I die he will make sure I enjoy the
> mysteries of death,
> as I have enjoyed the mysteries of life..
>
> And nothing you religionists say can change that.
>
> The fact remains that Israel was never in Egypt, as any examination of
> Egyptian records will show you.
> Thus your whole premise is based on MYTH!!
>
> And your Abraham is a figment of a Macabbee priest's imagination!!
...says the heretic.
Ike
Zadok
"Ike E 2009" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message ...
>
> "Zadok" <nob...@accesswave.ca> wrote in message
> news:YwtEm.49131$Db2.20582@edtnps83...
> >
> > "Ike E 2009" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message ...
> >>
> >> "Zadok" <nob...@accesswave.ca> wrote in message
> >> news:mtjEm.49931$PH1.30740@edtnps82...
> >>
> >> [snip]
> >>
> >> > The fun thing is all the idiots waiting, and waiting and waiting.
> >>
> >> Let them wait like Abraham waited in the desert, and Israel waited in
> > Egypt,
> >> and those who anticipated the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ waited
for
> > His
> >> first appearance and presentation.
> >>
> >> Those who wait have all the time in the world.
> >>
> >> You don't.
> >
> > I don't need all the time in the world. Simply because I am not waiting.
>
> Yes, I know: You're digging your way into hell with a backhoe.
And if you wait a week, it'll be halloween, and then maybe when you say BOO,
you will actually scare someone.
Take you choice idiot.
A loving God, or Hell.
The two are not compatible.
Smile.
Ike E 2009
[snip]
> Take you choice idiot.
>
> A loving God, or Hell.
>
> The two are not compatible.
...said the heretic, Marcion.
Meanwhile, "The Lord is a Man of War" and "God is love" are BOTH true
statements.
We've seen Him come in one aspect. We'll see Him come in the other. THEN the
Messianic prophecies will be completed...in ONE Man, Jesus Christ.
Ike
Roger Pearse
> "Linda Lee" <lyndalee8...@juno.com> wrote in message ...
> >I take Luke with a grain of salt; I don't accept everything that Luke
> >says because some things, including his account of Paul's Damascus
> >road experience, and his claim Christ told the apostles to go buy
> >swords, he either had to learn from Paul or they go against everything
> >else Christ is reported to have said. But Luke reported things that
> >were critical of Paul as well and so he seems to attempt to be an
> >honest reporter.
Indeed so.
> <lies of various sorts>
> And if God can save you, there is no need for a Saviour!!
> It's a job assigned to pagan Godman like Attis andMithras, and also
> assigned by Gentiles to their idea of what their Godman Jesus should be.
Attis can save you? Well, castrate yourself first, as he did, and see
how you get on!
Smile.
guardian Snow
What would you know JEZEBEL STALKER.. We can play this retarded
spamming game until you deity comes and destroys one of us or you can
stay on your end of things and I'll make my post you sick witch...
Your going to burn in hell with all your demon friends::
Psa 58:4 Their poison is like the poison of a snake; Like a deaf cobra
that stops its ear,
Psa 58:5 So as not to hear the voice of whisperers, Or a skilled
caster of spells.
Psa 58:6 O Elohim, break their teeth in their mouth! Break out the
fangs of the young lions, O יהוה!
Psa 58:7 Let them melt, let them vanish as water; Let Him aim His
arrows that they be cut down;
Psa 58:8 Like a snail which melts away as it moves, Like a woman’s
stillbirth, Let them not see the sun!
Psa 58:9 Before your pots feel the thorns, Whether green or ablaze, He
sweeps them away.
Psa 58:10 The righteous rejoices when he has seen the vengeance, He
washes his feet in the blood of the wrong,
Linda Lee
GOD SAID He does NOT give his GLORY to another. More proof the Messiah
was God incarnate since he has the glory of the Father.
Of Yahashua` the Messiah Isa. 42:6-8 says,
Isa 42:6 I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold
thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the
people, for a light of the Gentiles;
Isa 42:7 To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the
prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.
Isa 42:8 I am the LORD: that is my name: and MY GLORY WILL I NOT
GIVE
TO ANOTHER, neither my praise to graven images.
Although God says in Isa. 42:8, "my glory will I not give to
another",
Christ (having been God incarnate as the Saviour) has God's glory and
upon his return comes in the glory of God:
Christ said in Matt. 16:27 "For the Son of man shall come in the
GLORY
of his FATHER with his angels; and then he shall reward every man
according to his works".
Antichrist hypocrite Snowjob,
Neither you nor your male chauvinist buddy Ike really care about or
believe what you preach.
Ike lies about what I believe (falsely claiming that I deny the deity
of the Messiah and that I claim we are able to obey the Ten
Commandments without the help of Christ's righteousness), but
hypocritically exempts you Snowjob whom he knows DOES deny the deity
of the Messiah and falsely claims we should be able to and must obey
the Ten Commandments of our own will.
You, like the hypocritical little satan that you are, accuse
Christians daily, calling them names and judging them that they are
judgmental of others, yet you exempt your buddy, the self-professed
Christian Ike, who is as judgmental as they come and adds to that
fault by repeatedly and deliberately giving false witness about
others, lying about what others believe and attacking them on a daily
basis, calling everyone filthy names.
You aren't even sincere about what you claim to hate, let alone what
you claim to believe. The only things you two have in common is that
you are both children of the Devil, control-freak male chauvinists,
liars, and hypocrites who don't really give a damn about the
Scriptures you claim to preach.
guardian Snow
You can read this the first time or the hundredth time this gets
spammed back at you Linda but this is it.. I’m done with you.
Rev 22:11 “He who does wrong, let him do more wrong; he who is filthy,
let him be more filthy; he who is righteous, let him be more
righteous; he who is set-apart, let him be more set-apart.
Dear very SICK, DEMENTED STALKER JEZEBEL. Please feel free to end
this boring spam war at any time and agree to actually follow the
teachings of the Messiah...
What this means is that you go your way in peace and make your post..
I go my way and make my post and we have no need to ever speak to each
other ever again...
You see, I am not the one that is in love with you.. you are the one
that is in love with me and this is why you can't let go of posting to
me , YOU ARE OBSESSED WITH GETTING A SNOWJOB that you aren't getting.
I really do not think it is too much to ask that you keep your posting
to other people and not speak of me on a daily bases in your anal
retentive, boring accusations.
This is not my first spam war as you well KNOW. I’ve been in these on
your side trying to help fend of people just a psychotic as you like
CARL. I’ve patiently asked you many times to stop your attacks on me
and even when you’re not talking to me, you’re talking about me. You
are obsessed with ME, not your deity, not obeying any so called
proclaimed “spirit” that you clearly do not possess unless your
claiming a demon.
If you need a confession, this is it: I do not like you. I have no
desire to share your dogma, speak to you or even know anything of you.
Look, I get it that your this needy person who thinks that if you call
people Chauvinist, that people might think this has anything with you
being a female but you know it doesn’t.. It’s about you showing a tiny
bit of restraint and not attacking me on a daily bases as you have
every time you post for the past YEAR.
It probably is hard for you to understand given that maybe you thought
I was a friend of yours while you went around behaving like the witch
that you are… the reality is that people have a right to post without
being attacked and that is why I sided with you when Carl spam
attacked you.
I can agree to not post in threads you start and I can agree to NEVER
mention you again and honestly if I never heard from you again, that
would greatly please me but I respect that you have the right to post,
unlike you. I respect that you have a freedom of speech, JUST LIKE I
DO.
You do not have to agree with me but I do ask that you let me be.
I realize that this is probably your idea of a cry for help.. I
cannot give it to you.. seek professional help or get somebody else
that is willing to speak with you to help you so badly need.
I realize that you are jealous of the fact that nobody listens to you
are cares about you… that Ike tells you what a witch you are… What
makes you think I disagree or agree with him? Why are you trying to
associate us? Because you are jealous which really is a sad site
because…
We don’t agree on dogma, we can’t communicate like civil people, why
not just do one simple thing and end this stupid harassment NOW
instead of ten years from now or whenever enough people complain?
Is it that hard for you to just leave me alone? Are you so possessed
by evil spirits that you can’t simply follow those teachings you swear
you follow instead of just falsely accusing every person you talk to
on a daily bases?
Linda Lee
wrote:
> You can read this the first time or the hundredth time this gets
> spammed back at you Linda but this is it.. I’m done with you.
>
> Rev 22:11 “He who does wrong, let him do more wrong; he who is filthy,
> let him be more filthy; he who is righteous, let him be more
> righteous; he who is set-apart, let him be more set-apart.
>
> Dear very SICK, DEMENTED STALKER JEZEBEL.
You're slipping, antichrist Snowjob. "JEZEBEL" (and "JEZEBEL WITCH" as
you've posted elsewhere) is so much nicer than your usual "WHORE" and
"MURDERER", the usual names you call me.
How demented are you Snowjob? There was not one post to you from me in
this thread until I replied to your post from
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.messianic/msg/cbba17c340edf5b1
which said,
"What would you know JEZEBEL STALKER.. We can play this retarded
spamming game until you deity comes and destroys one of us or you can
stay on your end of things and I'll make my post you sick witch...
Your going to burn in hell with all your demon friends::
Psa 58:4 Their poison is like the poison of a snake; Like a deaf cobra
that stops its ear,
Psa 58:5 So as not to hear the voice of whisperers, Or a skilled
caster of spells.
Psa 58:6 O Elohim, break their teeth in their mouth! Break out the
fangs of the young lions, O יהוה!
Psa 58:7 Let them melt, let them vanish as water; Let Him aim His
arrows that they be cut down;
Psa 58:8 Like a snail which melts away as it moves, Like a woman’s
stillbirth, Let them not see the sun!
Psa 58:9 Before your pots feel the thorns, Whether green or ablaze, He
sweeps them away.
Psa 58:10 The righteous rejoices when he has seen the vengeance, He
washes his feet in the blood of the wrong,"
Perhaps it is you who is possessed of evil spirits as you speculate I
am in the following. YOU posted to me first in this thread. Do you get
that? Do you think people can't look back in this short thread to see
if what you say is true. You post as you please and then try to stop
others from replying. You've done this since you began posting here.
Obviously, you're just plain crazy.
> Are you so possessed
> by evil spirits that you can’t simply follow those teachings you swear
> you follow instead of just falsely accusing every person you talk to
> on a daily bases?
It's BASIS, NOT "bases", MORON.
Linda Lee
not follow Christ cannot keep God's Commandments because they do not
have the Spirit of God.
In Mark 1:8 John the Baptist says of the Messiah, “I indeed have
baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy
Ghost” [Holy Spirit].
Yahashua` the Messiah taught that to obtain eternal life we must
FOLLOW HIM, do good works for the “poor” (meaning those who are
“distressed”), and obey the Ten Commandments (“keep the Commandments”
- Matt. 19:17 & 21).
We know that the Messiah meant THE Ten Commandments when he said to
“keep the Commandments” in Matt. 19:17, not only because he there
listed those of the Ten Commandments contained in Ex. 20:3-17 (see at
bottom) that have to do with how we treat our fellow man (the rest of
the Ten Commandments, including the Great Commandment having to do
with worshipping only God, were covered under his unction to “follow
me” - Matt. 19:21), but also because the Messiah told the Jews that
other different commandments/statutes/statements written in the Torah
(the Hebrew Scriptures, also called the Law of Moses because the word
Torah means “law”) were “YOUR LAW”, the Jews' law, not God's law (John
8:17, John 10:34):
John 8:17, “It is also written in YOUR LAW [Torah, the 'law of
Moses'], that the testimony of two men is true”.
Here the Messiah cites a verse from the Psalms, calling it “your law”,
the Jews' law, also:
John 10:34, “Jesus answered them, Is it not written in YOUR LAW
[Torah, the law of Moses], I said, Ye are gods?”
This is a reference to Ps. 82:6, wherein God told the Israelites they
were “children of the most High”/God and were “gods”. (This was
translated in the KJV Bible from the Hebrew word “elohiym”, which when
applied to a plurality, such as the children of Israel, does not mean
God; it means gods, angels, divine ones, rulers, and judges. Here, its
meaning can only be angels, because there are no other real gods
besides God, and all of the Israelites were not rulers or judges.
'John Gill's Exposition of the Entire Bible' explains: “Many of the
Jewish writers, by "gods", understand "the angels". The Targum [an
Aramaic translation of the Hebrew Scriptures] paraphrases the words
thus: “I said ye are accounted as angels, as the angels on high, all
of you”.)
Mat 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what
good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is
none good but one, that is, God: but IF THOU WILT ENTER INTO LIFE,
KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS.
Mat 19:18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no
murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou
shalt not bear false witness,
Mat 19:19 Honor thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy
neighbor as thyself.
Mat 19:20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept
from my youth up: what lack I yet?
Mat 19:21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect [COMPLETE], go
and sell that thou hast, and GIVE TO THE POOR, and thou shalt have
treasure in heaven: and come and FOLLOW ME.
Mat 19:22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away
sorrowful: for he had great possessions.
We all have sinned or will sin sometime in our lives, and without
Christ giving us the Spirit we are simply unable to refrain from sin.
Christ could heal and forgive sins, but when he did heal them and told
them their sins were forgiven, he told them to go and sin no more:
John 5:14, concerning a man the Messiah had just healed, “Afterward
Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art
made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.”
Joh 8:3 And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken
in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst,
Joh 8:4 They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery,
in the very act.
Joh 8:5 Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be
stoned: but what sayest thou?
Joh 8:6 This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse
him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground,
as though he heard them not.
Joh 8:7 So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and
said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a
stone at her.
Joh 8:8 And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.
Joh 8:9 And they which heard it, being convicted by their own
conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto
the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the
midst.
Joh 8:10 When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the
woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath
no man condemned thee?
Joh 8:11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, NEITHER DO
I CONDEMN THEE: GO, AND SIN NO MORE.
The apostle John taught:
1Jn 3:1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us,
that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth
us not, because it knew him not.
1Jn 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet
appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we
shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
1Jn 3:3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself,
even as he is pure.
1Jn 3:4 WHOSOEVER COMMITTETH SIN TRANSGRESSETH ALSO THE LAW: FOR SIN
IS THE TRANSGRESSION OF THE LAW [The Ten Commandments].
1Jn 3:5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and
in him is no sin.
1Jn 3:6 WHOSOEVER ABIDETH IN HIM SINNETH NOT: WHOSOEVER SINNETH HATH
NOT SEEN HIM, NEITHER KNOWN HIM.
1Jn 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth
righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
1Jn 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth
from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested,
that he might destroy the works of the devil.
1Jn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed
remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
1Jn 3:10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children
of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither
he that loveth not his brother.
1 Pet. 4:1 “Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the
flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath
suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin”.
Ike E 2009
> Without Christ, mankind CANNOT obey the Ten Commandments.
WITH Christ mankind CAN'T OBEY THE TEN COMMANDMENTS.
Isa 53:4-12 [ed]
Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did
esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. But he was wounded for
our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of
our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.
ALL we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own
way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
...
Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when
thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he
shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his
hand. He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by
his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; FOR HE SHALL BEAR
THEIR INIQUITIES.
Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall
divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto
death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of
many, and made intercession for the transgressors.
Now TAKE OFF, you SATANIC FALSE TEACHER!
[snip]
Ike
Linda Lee
>
> Lying Idiot Ike
Neither you nor your male chauvinist buddy Snowjob really care about
or believe what you preach.
You Ike lie about what I believe (falsely claiming that I deny the
deity of the Messiah and that I claim we are able to obey the Ten
Commandments without the help of Christ's righteousness), but
hypocritically exempts your buddy Snowjob whom you know DOES deny the
deity of the Messiah and falsely claims we should be able to and must
obey the Ten Commandments of our own will.
You, like the hypocritical little satan that you are, repeatedly and
deliberately give false witness about others, lying about what others
believe and attacking them on a daily basis, calling everyone filthy
names. The only one you seem to exempt from your daily attacks is your
male chauvinist buddy Snowjob who joins you in accusing Christians
daily, calling them names and hypocritically judging them that they
are judgmental of others.
Ike E 2009
"Linda Lee" <lindag...@juno.com> wrote...
...nothing that a person with a lick of sense would listen to.
[snip]
Ike
Linda Lee
> "Linda Lee" <lindagirl...@juno.com> wrote...
Qadosh Stephanos
<xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>WITH Christ mankind CAN'T OBEY THE TEN COMMANDMENTS.
Probably a slip of the tongue. heh.
Ike E 2009
"Linda Lee" <lindag...@juno.com> wrote...
...a repetitive strain that belies the fact that she is having a nervous
breakdown because she can't sustain her lies anymore in light of the Word of
Truth.
[snip]
Ike
Qadosh Stephanos
<xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Repetitive strain
Actually the repetitive strain injury is a physical disorder.
CTD is caused by weird people typing trash into the keyboard.
There is no known cure for CTD other than removing keyboards.
Symptoms of CTD are caused by persons inability to keyboards.
Keyboarders are known to trash their keyboards while driving.
Other symptoms of keyboarding are excess religious doctrines.
Probably due to repetitive strain.
Linda Lee
> "LindaLee" <lindagirl...@juno.com> wrote...
Neither you nor your male chauvinist buddy Snowjob really care about
or believe what you preach.
You Ike lie about what I believe (falsely claiming that I deny the
deity of the Messiah and that I claim we are able to obey the Ten
Commandments without the help of Christ's righteousness), but
hypocritically exempts your buddy Snowjob whom you know DOES deny the
deity of the Messiah and falsely claims we should be able to and must
obey the Ten Commandments of our own will.
You, like the hypocritical little satan that you are, repeatedly and
deliberately give false witness about others, lying about what others
believe and attacking them on a daily basis, calling everyone filthy
names. The only one you seem to exempt from your daily attacks is your
male chauvinist buddy Snowjob who joins you in accusing Christians
daily, calling them names and hypocritically judging them that they
are judgmental of others.
You aren't even sincere about what you claim to hate, let alone what
you claim to believe. The only things you two have in common is that
you are both children of the Devil, control-freak male chauvinists,
liars, and hypocrites who don't really give a damn about the
Scriptures you claim to preach.
>
> Lying Idiot Ike
dolf
Saturnalia became one of the most popular Roman festivals. It was marked
by tomfoolery and reversal of social roles, in which slaves and masters
ostensibly switched places--"I thank God that I baptized none of you,
but Crispus and Gaius." [1 Corinthians 1:10-31 (KJV)] In February/March
41 CE, Gaius Sallustius Passienus Crispus was asked by the Emperor
Claudius (41-54 CE) to divorce his cousin, Roman Emperor Augustus�
(30-14 CE) great niece Domitia in 33 and marry his niece Agrippina the
Younger. He was an intelligent, humble and witty person, famous for his
epigram that there had never been a better slave or a worse master,
referring to the Emperor Tiberius (14-37 CE) and his heir, Caligula
(37-41 CE).
Did the Apostle Paul earlier baptize the Roman Caesar Caligula and the
reputable Passienus Crispus (d. 47 CE) as step-father to Nero? Therefore
given this ancestral spiritual prerogative, had no problem in later
making an appeal to Caesar Nero's jurisprudence and whom he met as a
21yo in 58 CE as the fourth year of his rule. Whereas Rome's earlier
emperors (as technically Rome's first citizens) rose to power on the
backs of great deeds to which the inclusion of July and August within
the calendar attests. Nero, like Caligula, obtained power by the
privilege of his birth and by the bestowal of Julio-Claudian dynastic
favour from his grand-uncle Emperor Claudius. Born on 15 December 37 CE
into great wealth and luxury with little training in administration,
Nero was an indolent victim of his own elite status, who after the fire
of July 64 CE, began the persecution of Christians. Which continued
until the legalizing of Christianity by Constantine the Great in 313 CE.
Super: #379 / #67 - Three Treasures; I-Ching: H10 - Tread Carefully;
Tetra: #48 - Ritual; Ego: #286 / #73 - Employing Deeming/ Daring to Act;
I-Ching: H46 - Moving Upward; Tetra: #7 - Ascent
Latin: Gloria {God who comforts the oppressed} Alt: Menkel {Cease Strife
Before God] {
1. HELPS HEAL THE ILLS OF THE SPIRIT, RELEASES FROM PERSECUTORS
2. MEN OF VIRTUE
3. FAITHFULNESS, INDUCES OBEDIENCE IN SUBORDINATES
4. Homoth
} Jesus {He is saved/A savior; a deliverer] of Nazareth {Sovereign; one
chosen or set apart; separated; crowned; sanctified}; #15 CE
[#3 - Prescriptions for Politics/ Keeping the People Quiet, #20 - Left
without Language/ Different From the Vulgar, #52 - So What?/ Returning
to the Origin, #73 - Employing Deeming/ Daring to Act, #79 - Recognizing
Agreements/ Keep Your Obligations, #1 - To Guide with Names/ Reason's
Realisation, #16 - Being a Guide/ Returning to the Root, #35 - Great
Guiding Signs?/ Virtue of Benevolence, #7 - Intentional Reversal/
Dimming Radiance]
The daemon shown below for 17 December relates to Nous Category of
Understanding @ #72 - "Self-Love, Holding Oneself Dear; Tetra: #79 -
Difficulties; I-Ching: H39 - Obstacles" which has a further #330 - ANGEL
MITZRAEL @ #73 - "Employing Deeming, Daring to Act; Tetra: #7 - Ascent;
I-Ching: H46 - Moving Upward" correspondence as autonomic homoiotic
sapiental kabbalistic paradigm, to the Christian Passion as Soul of the
Messiah in the 7th strata: "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is
neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all
one in Christ Jesus. And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed,
and heirs according to the promise. Now I say, that the heir, as long as
he is a child, differeth nothing from a servant, though he be lord of
all; But is under tutors and governors until the time appointed of the
father.
Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage-DOULOO under-HUPO the
elements-STOICHEION of the world-KOSMOS: But when the fullness of the
time was come {ie. "Seventy weeks (as 490 years x 364 days) are
determined for your people and for your Holy City, to finish the
transgression, to make an end of sins, to make reconciliation for
iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and
prophecy, and to anoint the Most Holy." [Daniel 9:24-27]}, God sent
forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, To redeem them that
were under the law {ie. Our Lord Jesus Christ who gave himself for our
sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil age, according to
the will of our God and Father, to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen
[Galatians 1:3-5]}, that we might receive the adoption of sons. And
because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your
hearts, crying, Abba, Father. Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but
a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ. Howbeit then,
when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.
But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how
turn ye again to the weak-ASTHENES and beggarly-PTOCHOS
elements-STOICHEION, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage? Ye
observe days, and months, and times, and years. {Sun and Moon of the 6D
cycle of 2 x 1092 days as 3 x 364 days solar or 3 x 354 + 30 days lunar
cycle: Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to divide the
day from the night; and let them be for signs and seasons, and for days
and years" [Genesis 1:14]} I am afraid for you, lest I have bestowed
upon you labour in vain." [Galatians 3:28-4:11]
Super: #267 / #12 - Numbing Effect of the Conventional/ Abstaining from
Desire; I-Ching: H6 - Conflict; Tetra: #25 - Contention; Ego: #247 / #3
- Prescriptions for Politics/ Keeping the People Quiet; I-Ching: H46 -
Moving Upward; Tetra: #8 - Opposition
Latin: Facies {God above all things} Alt: Anael {Ship of God} {
1. SERVES TO OBTAIN THE FRIENDSHIP OF A PERSON
2. ASTRONOMY & PHYSICS
3. THE SENSITIVITY OF THE HEART
4. Ptiau
} #34 CE
[#70 - Difficulty in Knowing How/ Difficult to Understand, #17 -
Politics, #3 - Prescriptions for Politics/ Keeping the People Quiet, #3
- Prescriptions for Politics/ Keeping the People Quiet, #21 - Guiding
and the Physical/ Emptying the Heart, #63 - Origins in Reversal/
Consider Beginnings, #26 - Ambiguous Reversals/ Virtue of Gravity, #36 -
Natural Reversals/ 'Secret' Explanation, #8 - Worth of Water/ Easy By
Nature]
This cypher-chronos connection to the sum #330 as the HRUMACHIS 'oth 6D
= 6 * 364 as 2184 day cycle to the solar/lunar calendar as evident by
the Spirit moving across the waters in the Genesis narrative, also has a
computed inclusion of the 12th as vCyan on Vernal Equinox of 20 March
1996 + (5*364) + 182 = 12 September 2001 as the 1st day of 7th solar
month and the 17th as vCoral on the #369th day as New Moon of 17
September 2001 / 18 September = 1 Tishri 5762: "And after {#54, #345,
#346} three {#411} months {#299} we departed {G321} in a ship {#191,
#310} of Alexandria {G221}, which had wintered {G3914} in the isle
{#378}, whose sign {G3902} was Castor {G1359} and Pollux {G1359}. And
landing {#347, #394, #456, #547} at {G1519} Syracuse {G4946}, we tarried
{#196, #255, #291, #305, #418} there three {#411} days {#204, #354, #364}.
And from thence {G3606} we fetched a compass {#362}, and came {G2658} to
Rhegium {#241}: and after {#54, #345, #346} one {G3391} day {#204, #354,
#364} the south {#540} wind blew {G1920}, and we came {#49, #62, #212,
#252, #262, #357, #465, #474, #497} the next {G1206} day to Puteoli
{G4223}: Where {G3757} we found {#534, #570} brethren {G80}, and were
desired {#252, #261, #298, #318, #320, #356, #443, #449, #456, #462,
#493, #497, #512} to tarry {#196, #255, #291, #305, #418} with them
seven {#386} days {#204, #354, #364}: and so {G3779} we went {#49, #62,
#212, #252, #262, #357, #465, #474, #497} toward {G1519} Rome {G4516}.
Nous: #72
Time: 17:40 hrs
Date: 2009.12.17
Torah: #70 #40 #40 %81 = #69
Dao: Self-Love, Holding Oneself Dear
Tetra: #79 - Difficulties
I-Ching: H39 - Obstacles
Latin: Festinus {God raised above all things} Alt: Shaahyah {Contemplate
God} {
1. HELPS DESTROY ENEMIES PROTECTS PRISONERS
2. VIGOUR, VOYAGES
3. RESEARCH
4. Sagen
}
Azor {A helper; a court}
And from thence {G1564}, when the brethren {G80} heard {G191} of us,
they came {#174, #232, #277, #317, #327, #419, #422, #530, #548} to meet
{G529} us as far {G891} as Appii {G675} forum {G5410}, and The three
{#411} taverns {G4999}: whom {#1, #270, #470} when Paul {#516} saw {#37,
#237, #285, #288, #332, #342, #345, #390, #399, #430, #515}, he thanked
{G2168} God {#19, #284, #294, #484}, and took {#38, #51, #142, #243,
#249, #289, #339, #343, #346, #348, #409, #434, #454} courage {G2294}.
"The Sages said: '[For] three sins a person is punished (lit., 'it is
collected from a person') in this world, and he has no share in the
World to Come: idolatry, incest / adultery, and murder. And the
spreading of evil gossip (lashon hara) is equivalent to all three.' The
Sages said further: 'Anyone who speaks lashon hara, it is as if he has
denied G-d, as it is stated, '[...those] who said, 'Because of our
tongues we will overpower, our lips are with us, who is master over
us?'' [Psalms 12:5]. And the Sages said further, 'Three does lashon hara
kill: the one who says it, the one who accepts it, and the one who is
spoken about. And the accepter more so than the speaker."
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "Seems you are claiming that God
is a three-way polygamous, incestrious, gay marriage! Blasphemy!! And by
YOUR own standards!"
Guardian Snow (American Yahwehist) OZ Parasite: "I find that word
"blasphemy" tossed about too often."
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "I agree, but the idiotic moronic
twit Ike repeatedly did so, which is why I turned it back on him, but of
course he is far too thick to understand that."
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "Hmmm. 'the idiotic moronic
twit Ike.'
And yet it's Tim who can't get it through his thick skull that marriage
was established in God's image, and God's image is marriage.
Or should we say that he doesn't want to, lest he find he has embraced
the heresy of "politically corrected christianity?"
Merlin (merli...@gmail.com): "Merlin knows not why so many christians
are afraid to love as Jesus teaches. Merlin has been trying for a while
now to get even one person on christnet to try to love to see what
happens. There seems a fear that love may change many, a fear that when
we love we won't be the same person.
We all give up something to be with god, our own personal sacrifice is
what is important. To give up this world tho not our business in the
world. To give up our hatred and confusion tho not our quest for truth
and grace. We all gotta give of ourselves, and it is easiest in love,
cause that love leads it's own life in us with Jesus showing us the way
to the father mother god.
And when we do give up on this world and begin to love, we find where we
are in the world and the good we may want to promote in this world with
our love. We are not here to fight, we are here to learn to love. That
takes trying to love, correction: that takes loving.
It is amazing what happens, Tim sees it in Tim, others have found this
love also. It is as scary as it may seem to love as Jesus asks us to
love. The benefits out weight the worst that can happen to us. For when
we love we are more open and aware of the world around us. We see the
character and good in everyone, we see everyone we meet potential no
matter where they may be at that moment. Love and the hanger door to the
universe opens for us all."
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "Your blasphemies of THROWING
OUT GOD'S WORD..."
Guardian Snow (American Yahwehist) OZ Parasite: "Personally, I've become
callous to hearing it because I see it next to my name on a daily basis.
Merlin is an interesting case but let's face it, you are casting your
time to the wind by talking to him.. He's not going to change and
suddenly become straight."
Merlin (merli...@gmail.com): "What does this comment have to do with
reality?"
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "Everything. The Word, the
Works, and the Spirit have to agree. When someone says something that
doesn't agree, they're trying to pull a fast one, which is what you've
been doing all along. [snip]"
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "In the beginning was the Word,
and the Word was with God, and the Word was God ... and the Word became
flesh and dwelt among us."
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "Now, what the hell did that
have to do with my statement?
JESUS said there were three things that testified to Him: The Word, the
Works He did, and The Spirit. If something doesn't AGREE with one of
these three things, SOMEBODY is PULLING YOUR LEG. And Merlin
SPECIFICALLY DENIES THE AUTHORITY OF SCRIPTURE.
Of course. He has to. The minute one examines Merlin's lies in light of
what scripture says, it quickly becomes apparent that Merlin is ALWAYS
saying the OPPOSITE of what the Word says.
Then people like you are taken in by his "whorish" lies just because he
couches them in the word "love" as many times as he can, when what he is
talking about is about as far away from "love" as east is from west.
You have to be one really weak and pathetic "Christian" to be taken in
by that kind of B.S."
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "Indeed. In fact, I believe that
is actually impossible for any gay person to do. IMO however, that is
not the point. The point is that Merlin has a far, far better grasp on
the CORE message of the Gospel than Ike has, since the core message is
'Love God, Love thy Neighbour'."
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "Thanks for demonstrating how
much you AREN'T Christian, Tim, and that you reject the basic tenants of
the Gospel, which you do every time you endorse Merlin's "antichristian"
doctrines.
Jesus and the boys said one thing. Merlin says the opposite. Tim agrees
with Merlin. Go figure."
Guardian Snow (American Yahwehist) OZ Parasite: "...and for the most
part, I doubt that any reasonable person would give him a second thought."
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "I don't know him, but I don't
write off *everything* he says just because he is somewhat
unconventional. There remains the fact that he expresses unconditional
love as being the key,"
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "Unconditional love?
God never taught it.
Why would I?
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that
whosoever believeth in him [condition prima facia] should not perish,
but have everlasting life." [John 3:16]"
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "...and on that much I think he is
closer than Idiot Ike to the truth, even if he is still way off. "
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "...said one blasphemer to
the other."
Guardian Snow (American Yahwehist) OZ Parasite: "I would be curious to
learn more about your opinion and other people on the topic directly. I
think it's a disgusting practice but... if you didn't base your
understanding simply on the idea of homosexuality as sin.. why would you
disagree with the practice?"
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "I make a distinction between
sexual *orientation* (that is, whether a person finds people of their
own sex or the opposite one *attractive*, whether or not they act on
that), and sexual *activity*. The reason I make that distinction is that
I believe that whereas sexual activity IS a choice, sexual *orientation*
is not."
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "Neither is heterosexuality,
and pretty much every man is given to the desire for heterosexual
behavior. But this is only evidence of the CORRUPTION OF THE FLESH man
lives in.
This STILL in NO WAY substantiates THE ABOMINATION of same-sex marriage."
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "Thus it is as nonsensical to say
"It is a sin to have a homosexual orientation" as it is to say "It is a
sin to have black skin" or "It is a sin to be left-handed"."
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "Rationalistic nonsense.
God never wrote a prohibition on being black or left-handed.
He DID prohibit SAME SEX, just as He prohibited every OTHER form of
sexual behavior that DIVERTS FROM THE DIVINE IMAGE, i.e. MARRIAGE.
But Tim plays a game of selective perception when it comes to
comparisons, doesn't he?"
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "Thus, to be 'gay' (in the sense
of orientation) of itself just *cannot* be a sin."
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "The hell it can't.
The FLESH is BORN IN SIN, and IS SIN."
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "Moving on to sexual *acts*,
whether someone finds something 'disgusting' or not is not the issue.
There are some people who find the idea of ANY sexual activity
'disgusting'. Some find the notion of oral sex disgusting, others think
it normal. Feelings of disgust are irrelevant."
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "Good thing "feelings" are
irrelevant in the law."
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "From the Christian point of view,
almost anything in the Fallen world is intrinsically sinful. Also it
makes little sense to consider one sin 'worse' than another, since we
consider ANY sin, even the tiniest, little, itsy-bitsy teeny-weeny sin
to be kingdom-excluding and deserving of death, in God's eyes."
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "Says Tim from his
rationalizations...again.
Fact is, the law had different weights and measures for different acts,
and homosexual activity was on THE DEATH LIST. That any violation of the
law breaks the whole law in NO WAY changes the fact that there were
MAJOR and MINOR sins, Tim."
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "Thus IMO it is unfair to pull out
the sins of one particular group and hold up *their* sins as being worse
than our own. IMO that is scape-goating or distraction. We are ALL sinners."
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "Which, again, in no way
mitigates the fact that the law has MAJOR and MINOR sins.
But, of course, Tim doesn't READ the law anymore, does he? Someone lied
and told him it was completely irrelevant, as per the growing
apostasy--I also [snip-yawned] the rest without reading it."
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "Because it was all based on your
misunderstanding of my position, or more likely your deliberate
obtuseness because you have been clearly caught in the act of blatant
prejudice. "
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "The only 'prejudice' I hold
is the one against antibiblical lies, especially the ones trying to
rewrite the story for the sake of political correctness (which will be
the downfall of us all)."
Tim Reason (timr...@hotmail.co.uk): "Well, I ignore political
correctness, because it is rubbish. I will stick with the majority of
Christians, and let you go off on your own way."
Thom Madura (tomm...@optonline.net): "The majority of christians are
catholics and their leader said this "Pope Pius IX in an encyclical in
1854 said this:
"It must, of course, be held as a matter of faith that outside the
apostolic Roman Church no one can be saved, that the Church is the only
ark of salvation, and that whoever does not enter it will perish in the
flood."
So - are you saying you are a catholic - or not if you are not a
catholic - then YOU are not with the majority of christians."
(ru) dolf: "Just make sure this political liberty as religious freedom
of yours concerning Apostolic baptism of opportunistic divorcees and
friends of Caesar, doesn't lead to less-majeste as slander of the
Sovereignty of State."
Randy � [Sody] Barbara (pulpi...@gmail.com): "Dolf. Seriously. Are you
a spam-bot, or are you just totally nuts?"
Jude Smart-Alex-ander (ashm...@bellsouth.net): "He's not nuts even
though, on the surface, he appears to be. :) "
Mark "I" Tindall (me@home389): "Dolf is far more intelligent than Randy
Young."
Jude Smart-Alex-ander (ashm...@bellsouth.net): "True."
Randy � [Sody] Barbara (pulpi...@gmail.com): "Are you experimenting
with artificial intelligence or something?"
(ru) dolf: "I do own a copy of mdbs GURU for Windows/32 and have an
artificial intelligence interest. I have an interest in homoiotic
sapiental kabbalistic reality. Having just seen a news story about a
computer virtual reality {ie. A graphical environment which simulates
the real world as the sensory reality to which a person is intently
focused or interfaced} of Iraq war zones and its psychosomatic use to
deprogram soldiers with post traumatic stress syndrome. My informal
interest is equivalently concerned with the autonomic modelling of human
and terrestial events against my virtual cube for artificial
intelligence purposes and this project has, following the GURU
Artificial Intelligence 4th Generation Language Scripting tool's first
selection for usage by the Victoria Police Force, taken some 24 years of
metaphysical philosophical and theological conceptual thinking.
At the following URL, I am concerned with an event.zen@row:col being a
telos supernal and ego entry event.telos@super:ego in the hierarchy for
that telos entry.
http://www.grapple.id.au/grapple.html (safari only)
What I'm informally looking at is the ability to set a watch
oCUBE.setWatch: function (zen, row, col, telos, sup, ego) on specific
Categories of Understanding for any given event upon a date
year@month:day or time hour@minute:second and observing by the
oCUBE.compareSet: function(setA, setB) where these categories intersect
within other sub-Categories in other areas of the virtual cube.
I wish to see if any appraisals of other phenomenal events such as
speech@date:time can be made at these specific intersection points and
whether they are able to contribute to coherency as any sense of being
relative to time, containment and cohesion as unity of apperception,
determination of verity and hence amenable to rules based statements and
analysis--given that this is a variable array _GIZMO navigated within
the document:
_GIZMO[zen][row][col].watch[telos + '@' + sup + ':' + ego] = {
watch: telos + '@' + sup + ':' + ego,
date: now.getFullYear() + '@' + (now.getMonth()+1) + ':' +
now.getDate(),
time: now.getHours() + '@' + now.getMinutes() + ':' + now.getSeconds()
};"
Eric Fisher (ericf...@webtv.net): "Good grief... looks like it's
still recess at the govt. school... some things never change..."
Diana [Saskia] Lonnie (shech...@reborn.com): "---))) Hi Eric, it is
nice to see your name here again. I hope life is treating you well."
Jude Smart-Alex-ander (ashm...@bellsouth.net): "Talking about change,
how's the "change" going with you, Erica? :) Attracted to this
particular thread ('Beating death of a gay teen' or 'Saying no to rabid
anti-homosexualists') for any personal reasons? :) I was thinking about
you yesterday because I came across your name in my files. :) "
(ru) dolf: "Jude Done That" or "Jude Smart-Alex-ander"?
Jude Smart-Alex-ander (ashm...@bellsouth.net): "I'm sorry but that
makes me want to punch somebody... the ones responsible."
(ru) dolf: "A punch and judy show or a crazy with multiple personality
disorder?"
Nous: #7
Time:
Date:
Torah: #6 #300 #200 %81 = #20
Dao: Intentional Reversal, Dimming Radiance
Tetra: #56 - Closed Mouth
I-Ching: H12 - Stagnation
Latin: Adorandus {Just God} Alt: Kahtiel {Weariness of Signs of God} {
1. AIDS AGAINST FALSE, UNJUST ACCUSATIONS
2. JUSTICE, NOBILIY, MAGISTRATES & LAWYERS
3. THE WORD
4. Thumis
}
Jesse {Gift; oblation; one who is}
Jude Smart-Alex-ander (ashm...@bellsouth.net): "Neither of them are
aware of their own self deception although surely many have tried to get
them to look."
Randy � [Sody] Barbara (pulpi...@gmail.com): "Attack the Bible, defend
homosexuality. You're the one who is deceived."
Jude Done That (ashm...@bellsouth.net): "Blindly follow stone-aged
men's perception of God not to mention their COMPLETE WISDOM (har har
har) regarding what homosexuality was/is. ;) Bye bye now
I attack the LIE of inerrancy. Sorry, you're too FundaMENTAL to know the
difference."
Ike E 2009 (xhermanei...@gmail.com): "There's that blasphemous
underlying assumption again that the law was just a "cultural fluke" of
the time, nevermind that Jesus FULLY UPHELD the law and the prophets,
which means you CAN'T believe in Jesus Christ if you don't BELIEVE IN
THE LAW, otherwise, there isn't anything to have GRACE from. Absolute
idiocy."
Jude Done That (ashm...@bellsouth.net): "Oh, yeah? If "God" instituted
ALL the laws of the OT, why do you full-of-ignorance FundaMENTALists
just choose some of them to follow ESPECIALLY since it is clear that the
11 apostles continue to follow Mosaic law vs. Paul who told the Gentiles
they didn't have to follow the law except for about THREE exceptions. :) "
Nicodemus (Ancient...@Heaven.Net): "Is [it] safe to pray?"
(ru) dolf: "It is, afterall, not so long since Catholics prayed weekly
for 'the conversion of England.'"
Jude Smart-Alex-ander (ashm...@bellsouth.net): "Look, either start
acting somewhat normal and having somewhat normal conversations or just
don't talk to me, okay? If you don't respect my request, you won't see
me respond to you again. If that's what you want, then just don't
respect my request."
Nicodemus (Ancient...@Heaven.Net): "Where do you want to start?"
An important side point which bears mention regards the Rambam's first
statement -- that violators of cardinal sins receive no share in the
hereafter. The commentators make it clear that this is only without
repentance. Certainly man may repent all his sins -- till his last
moments on earth, and by so doing merit a share in the World to Come.
The Rambam himself, in his Laws of Repentance (3:14), after listing
categories of heretics and the like who receive no share in the
afterlife, states as follows: "When is it the case that each of these
has no share in the World to Come? When he dies without repentance. But
if he repents his wickedness and [then] dies in a state of penitence,
behold he is among those who receive a share in the World to Come. For
there is nothing which stands in the way of repentance. Even if he
denied G-d his entire life and at the last moment returns, he has a
share, as it states, ''Peace! Peace to the far and the close!' says G-d,
'and I will heal him'' [Isaiah 57:19]."
The Rambam there continues that even if such people regretted their
actions in the inner recesses of their hearts and at the last moments of
their lives, their repentance is to some extent efficacious. It really
is a world of love. G-d did not create us just to punish us make our
lives difficult, but so that we'd cleave to Him and merit His closeness.
No one, no matter how sinful he has been and regardless of his age and
track record is "doomed". G-d waits till the very last moment for our
devotion.
'And when {#375} we came {#49, #62, #212, #252, #262, #357, #465, #474,
#497} to Rome {G4516}, the centurion {G1543} delivered {#277, #325,
#327, #331, #334, #440, #480, #490, #498, #511} the prisoners {#339,
#379} to the captain {G4759} of the guard {G4759}: but Paul {#516} was
suffered {G2010} to dwell {#220, #225, #260, #310, #405, #411, #415,
#418, #434, #516} by himself {G1438} with a soldier {G4757} that kept
{G5442} him.
And it came {#183, #197, #227, #236, #246, #277, #280, #281, #282, #283,
#288, #289, #294, #303, #308, #332, #339, #343, #348, #377, #379, #388,
#392, #393, #401, #429, #431, #437, #438, #443, #485, #493, #494, #503,
#508, #511, #542, #551} to pass, that after {#54, #345, #346} three
{#411} days {#204, #354, #364} Paul {#516} called {G4779} the chief
{G4413} of the Jews {G2453} together {G4779}: and when they were come
{G4905} together {G4905}, he said {#43, #53, #56, #204, #253, #261,
#263, #283, #296, #313, #323, #348, #351, #353, #354, #401, #408, #411,
#459, #473, #516, #525} unto them, Men {G435} and brethren {G80}, though
I have committed {#178, #225, #274, #328, #339, #369, #374, #375, #378,
#379, #383, #386, #389, #395, #424, #428, #434, #469, #472, #473, #480,
#485, #486, #488, #569, #574, #583} nothing {#530} against {#417} the
people {#301, #311, #501}, or {G2228} customs {#22, #29, #284} of our
fathers {G3971}, yet was I delivered {#277, #325, #327, #331, #334,
#440, #480, #490, #498, #511} prisoner {#339, #379} from Jerusalem
{G2414} into {G1519} the hands {G5495} of the Romans {G4514}.
Nous: #23
Time: 06:50 hrs
Date: 2009.7.4
Torah: #40 #5 #300 %81 = #21
Dao: Constancy of Guiding Concepts, Emptiness & Non-Existence
Tetra: #26 - Endeavor
I-Ching: H18 - Arresting Decay
Latin: Verus {God saviour} Alt: Nanael {Pray to God} {
1. HELPS TO LIVE IN PEACE WITH ALL
2. OCCULT MAGIC & THEOLOGY
3. LEARNING
4. Teut or Theuth
}
Mahalalel {Praise (fame) of God}
Who {#362}, when they had examined {G350} me, would have let {G630} me
go {G630}, because {#14, #15} there was no {#267, #377} cause {G156} of
death {#366, #481} in me. But when the Jews {G2453} spake {G483} against
{G483} it, I was constrained {G315} to appeal {#375, #377, #381, #389,
#472, #489} unto Caesar {#333, #342}; not that I had {#80, #280, #375}
ought {#570} to accuse {G2723} my nation {#72, #79, #329, #334} of. For
this {G5026} cause {G156} therefore {#520} have I called {#252, #261,
#298, #318, #320, #356, #443, #449, #456, #462, #493, #497, #512} for
you, to see {#37, #237, #285, #288, #332, #342, #345, #390, #399, #430,
#515} you, and to speak {G4354} with you: because {G1063} that for the
hope {#325, #399} of Israel {#349} I am bound {#281, #445} with this
{G5026} chain {G254}.
And they said {G2036} unto him, We neither {G3777} received {#80, #245,
#284, #289, #290, #349, #388, #435, #445} letters {#445, #486} out of
Judaea {#496, #506} concerning {G4012} thee, neither {G3777} any {#570}
of the brethren {G80} that came {#412, #485, #525} showed {G518} or
{G2228} spake {#76, #79, #81, #275, #276, #280, #284, #287, #293, #296,
#325, #329, #370, #381, #415, #434, #470, #479, #501} any {#570} harm
{#309, #313, #319, #388, #428, #509} of thee. But we desire {G515} to
hear {G191} of thee what {#1, #270, #470} thou thinkest {G5426}: for as
concerning {G4012} this {G5026} sect {G139}, we know {G1110} that every
{G3837} where {G3837} it is spoken {G483} against {G483}.
"Rabbi Yochanan the sandal maker said: Every assembly which is for the
sake of Heaven will eventually endure. And one which is not for the sake
of Heaven will not endure."
The theme of this week's mishna is that assemblies or gatherings -- even
(or especially) for worthy causes -- will not meet success if the
participants are not acting with sincerity and for the sake of Heaven.
If parents are active in a school board meeting in order to put the
principal in his place, or if families join to form a synagogue --
basically in order to make a statement to the *other* synagogue they're
breaking away from, the effort will ultimately fail. (And the synagogue
or school does not have to physically collapse for it to be clear that
the undertaking was a shameful failure.) Bad motives and bad agendas
make for bad institutions. We are all human and carry our share of bones
to pick and axes to grind. (I'm sure I could come up with a few more
metaphors.) But if the underlying purpose of our meetings and
undertakings is for anything short of the sake of Heaven, the results
will be as fleeting and temporal as human beings themselves tragically are.
(I was once asked to attend a synagogue meeting (of a synagogue I rarely
attended) specifically to vote against a certain individual for
synagogue president. I did so partly because the requester was not one I
could easily refuse, and partly because the case against that certain
individual was fairly convincing. (Note how I leave out virtually every
detail. ;-) So perhaps it was justified, but still... Religious causes
should not become fronts for airing our personal dislikes and vendettas.)
It's worthwhile to draw an important distinction here. Generally
speaking, the Rabbis view insincere deeds quite favorably. The Talmud
writes often that it is better to learn or perform good deeds
insincerely, for insincere deeds lead to sincere ones (Pesachim 50b).
Better to "do" -- study Torah out of not-fully-committed curiosity, or
perform mitzvos (commandments) for reward or recognition. The doing
itself is valuable, in fact invaluable. Good deeds themselves wield an
influence on a person and touch the soul." [� 2009 by Rabbi Dovid
Rosenfeld and Torah.org, Pirkei Avos: United We Stand, Chapter 4, Mishna 14]
And when they had appointed {#417} him a day {#204, #354, #364}, there
came {#43, #148} many {#235, #245, #246, #446, #450, #455, #515} to him
into {G1519} his lodging {G3578}; to whom {#1, #270, #470} he expounded
{G1620} and testified {G1263} the kingdom {G932} of God {#19, #284,
#294, #484}, persuading {#225, #255, #269, #274, #309, #319, #320, #323,
#329, #350, #351, #431, #435, #455, #484, #496, #522} them concerning
{G4012} Jesus {G2424}, both {#305} out of the law {#280, #430} of Moses
{G3475}, and out of the prophets {G4396}, from morning {G4404} till
{G2193} evening {#391, #441}.
"And some {G3588-G3303} believed {#225, #255, #269, #274, #309, #319,
#320, #323, #329, #350, #351, #431, #435, #455, #484, #496, #522} the
things which were spoken {#43, #53, #56, #204, #253, #261, #263, #283,
#296, #313, #323, #348, #351, #353, #354, #401, #408, #411, #459, #473,
#516, #525}, and some {#70, #80, #318, #358, #370, #420, #501, #508,
#511} believed not." [Acts 28:11-24]
I'd like to now begin by examining the second statement of the Rambam. I
feel it holds the key to understanding the others. The Rambam states
(quoting Talmud Erchin 15b) that speaking lashon hara is akin to denying
G-d. Now this statement seems extreme. We recognize, of course, that
great damage can be done with loose lips, yet how in the world can any
action, no matter how heinous, in any way approximate atheism? We all
sin, sometimes seriously. Yet none of us could imagine in the darkest
recesses of our hearts that G-d does not exist. (The Theory of
Evolution? Don't make me laugh.) If so, how could the Talmud even
venture such a comparison?
A straightforward explanation is actually implied by the Rambam himself
elsewhere (Laws of Tumas Tsara'as 16:10). He explains that people who
speak lashon hara do not content themselves with speaking about the
lowly. Their cynicism then turns to the righteous, then to the prophets,
in whose words they cast aspersions. Ultimately, such people will speak
ill of G-d Himself, denying His goodness or justness. Thus, with such
sins, one thing leads to another until the gossiper in some way denies
G-d. [� 2009 by Rabbi Dovid Rosenfeld and Torah.org, Maimonides on Life
-- Cynicism: The Joy of Inexistence, Part I, Chapter 7, Law 3(a)]
Nous: #9
Time: 16:40 hrs
Date: 2009.12.3
Torah: #1 #30 #4 %81 = #35
Dao: Inconstancy of Achievement, Practicing Placidity
Tetra: #32 - Legion
I-Ching: H7 - Army
Latin: Animus {Propitious God} Alt: Yeielel {Howl to God} {
1. HELPS HIDE THAT WHICH ONE DOES NOT WISH TO REVEAL, SECRETS
2. PLAGUE & RABIES
3. HEALING
4. Viroaso
}
Noah {Rest, Repose; consolation}
In this law the Rambam quotes a short selection of rabbinic statements
regarding the severity of lashon hara as gossiping. We asked how the
Sages could have possibly made so sweeping a statement by equating
lashon hara to denying G-d. True, gossiping is terrible and can destroy
lives, but how could any sin be compared to the denial of G-d Himself?
"And even {G2531} as they did not like {#356, #360, #367, #401, #409,
#446, #462} to retain {#80, #280, #375} God {#19, #284, #294, #484} in
their knowledge {G1922}, God {#19, #284, #294, #484} gave {#277, #325,
#327, #331, #334, #440, #480, #490, #498, #511} them over {#277, #325,
#327, #331, #334, #440, #480, #490, #498, #511} to a reprobate {G96}
mind {#390, #570}, to do {#178, #225, #274, #328, #339, #369, #374,
#375, #378, #379, #383, #386, #389, #395, #424, #428, #434, #469, #472,
#473, #480, #485, #486, #488, #569, #574, #583} those {#70, #80, #318,
#358, #370, #420, #501, #508, #511} things which are not convenient
{#178, #479};
Being filled {#498} with all {#11, #281, #282, #292, #299, #332, #341,
#432, #441, #482, #489, #492} unrighteousness {G93}, fornication {#316,
#326, #366, #516}, wickedness {#329, #369, #519}, covetousness {#311,
#321, #361, #511, #521}, maliciousness {#52, #62, #252}; full {G3324} of
envy {G5355}, murder {G5408}, debate {#315, #324, #389}, deceit {#374,
#574}, malignity {#344}; whisperers {G5588}, backbiters {G2637}, haters
{G2319} of God {G2319}, despiteful {G5197}, proud {G5244}, boasters
{G213}, inventors {G2182} of evil {#42, #52, #311, #511} things,
disobedient {G545} to parents {#338}, without {G801} understanding
{G801}, covenantbreakers {G802}, without {G794} natural affection
{G794}, implacable {G786}, unmerciful {G415}:
Who {#362} knowing {G1921} the judgment {G1345} of God {#19, #284, #294,
#484}, that they which commit {#247, #252, #297, #301, #342, #459, #484,
#551} such {G5108} things are worthy {G514} of death {#366, #481}, not
only {#280} do the same {G846}, but have {#80, #280, #375} pleasure
{G4909} in them that do {#247, #252, #297, #301, #342, #459, #484, #551}
them." [Romans 1:28-32]
The answer provides us a very basic understanding of the workings of the
human mind. Last week Rabbi Dovid Rosenfeld posed further: Why in fact
*do* people speak lashon hara? At times of course it's because *he* hurt
*me* very badly on some past occasion and so I yearn for sweet revenge.
But as we know, some people are just chronic speakers of lashon hara.
They always see bad in others -- in other individuals, in other ethnic
groups, in other types of Jews (especially ones more religious than
they), seemingly for no provocation. Now what kind of pleasure do such
people get in being so cynical? Why assume the worst? Why do some people
have such a drive to see ugliness and failings in others? What do they
gain from it?
As an interesting aside, the Talmud (Ta'anis 8a) states that in the End
of Days, all the animals will approach the snake and ask it why it bites
without eating, seemingly for no personal benefit of its own. [� 2009 by
Rabbi Dovid Rosenfeld and Torah.org, Maimonides on Life -- Cynicism: The
Joy of Inexistence, Part I, Chapter 7, Law 3(b)]