I'm really pissed about this guy.. argh... I need to vent :) Here's the story...
Guy buys an widget from me at the end of July ($120 sale, vintage electronic item, about 20 years old). The auction listed the item as being in functional condition , because.... it worked. I tested it myself, and also had a minor repair professionally done prior to sale, and it was given a good chek-over when it was getting repaired. The repair shop even commented on the excellent condition of it... The item was also sold as-is however, because it is 20 years old, and it was clearly marked as an "as-is" sale, in a normal font, no trickery with tiny fonts or legal-ese, or anything like that.
He paid for the item on Aug 9th, (money order), I shipped it out to him the same day, it got to his place on the 12th according to the tracking info. On the 20th, he gives me a positive feedback, saying he's more then happy with the item (this was 8 days after it arrived), I respond with a positive feedback, saying he made prompt payment, good communication, etc...
On the 27th (15 days after he received the item), he emails me and tells me the widget isn't working properly, and he's taken it in to a repair shop. They've told him it needs $160 worth of repairs for a worn component. (a beta vcr "head")
I emailed him back, and explained that I was perplexed that this problem has arised, as I'd tested the item myself, and found it to be working fine, and also had it professionally serviced prior to sale, and I couldn't understand how the head could have suddenly become worn in the span of less then a month. (He tells me that it's impossible to see anything on the screen, but there was no issue when it was here...) I explained the item was sold as-is, however if he sends me a copy of the invoice, I'd take it to the shop where I had the widget refurbished, and ask them for any suggestions, and try to come to an amicable agreement.
He emailed me again, saying that I had a "legal responsibility", and was "legally liable" to either fix his widget or refund all of his money (including shipping), or he'd go to eBay or Squaretrade. I'm still trying to be helpfull at this point, but this email really rubbed me the wrong way. I explained clearly that the widget was sold as-is, and was functioning when sold, and must have been functioning for at least some period of time after he got it, because he left positive feedback explaining how happy he was with it 8 days after receiving the item. I again offered to show the invoice to the shop where I had the item refurbished for suggestions. I also explained that I'd be more then happy to allow squaretrade to mediate the issue.
He emailed me back with this "No further communication is necessary as it is a waste of my time and yours. I will file complaints with both Ebay and Square Trade. In my view your actions are fraudulent and I will proceed accordingly."
I don't care about him complaining to eBay or squaretrade, I don't feel I've done anything wrong, and I've tried to be helpfull with this guy; in fact if he'd had a different attitude, I'd have offered a discount of some sort at the very least, or send him a replacement part if I could source one at a reasonable price, regardless of the fact the auction was as-is, and it's been in his house for half a month. I don't want anyone to get burned on a buy, but I also don't know what this guy has done to the widget in the half month he's had it. What *really* pisses me off is this guy saying my actions are fraudulent.
Sounds like it broke down AFTER he said he was happy with it and AFTER he left you PFB. Hardly your problem, especially on a 20 year old piece of electronics. Let him report it to anyone he wants to.
> Guy buys an widget from me at the end of July ($120 sale, vintage electronic > item, about 20 years old). The auction listed the item as being in > functional condition , because.... it worked. I tested it myself, and also > had a minor repair professionally done prior to sale, and it was given a > good chek-over when it was getting repaired. The repair shop even commented > on the excellent condition of it... The item was also sold as-is however, > because it is 20 years old, and it was clearly marked as an "as-is" sale, in > a normal font, no trickery with tiny fonts or legal-ese, or anything like > that.
> He paid for the item on Aug 9th, (money order), I shipped it out to him the > same day, it got to his place on the 12th according to the tracking info. On > the 20th, he gives me a positive feedback, saying he's more then happy with > the item (this was 8 days after it arrived), I respond with a positive > feedback, saying he made prompt payment, good communication, etc...
> On the 27th (15 days after he received the item), he emails me and tells me > the widget isn't working properly, and he's taken it in to a repair shop. > They've told him it needs $160 worth of repairs for a worn component. (a > beta vcr "head")
> I emailed him back, and explained that I was perplexed that this problem has > arised, as I'd tested the item myself, and found it to be working fine, and > also had it professionally serviced prior to sale, and I couldn't understand > how the head could have suddenly become worn in the span of less then a > month. (He tells me that it's impossible to see anything on the screen, but > there was no issue when it was here...) I explained the item was sold as-is, > however if he sends me a copy of the invoice, I'd take it to the shop where > I had the widget refurbished, and ask them for any suggestions, and try to > come to an amicable agreement.
> He emailed me again, saying that I had a "legal responsibility", and was > "legally liable" to either fix his widget or refund all of his money > (including shipping), or he'd go to eBay or Squaretrade. I'm still trying > to be helpfull at this point, but this email really rubbed me the wrong way. > I explained clearly that the widget was sold as-is, and was functioning when > sold, and must have been functioning for at least some period of time after > he got it, because he left positive feedback explaining how happy he was > with it 8 days after receiving the item. I again offered to show the invoice > to the shop where I had the item refurbished for suggestions. I also > explained that I'd be more then happy to allow squaretrade to mediate the > issue.
> He emailed me back with this "No further communication is necessary as it is > a waste of my time and yours. I will file complaints with both Ebay and > Square Trade. In my view your actions are fraudulent and I will proceed > accordingly."
> I don't care about him complaining to eBay or squaretrade, I don't feel I've > done anything wrong, and I've tried to be helpfull with this guy; in fact if > he'd had a different attitude, I'd have offered a discount of some sort at > the very least, or send him a replacement part if I could source one at a > reasonable price, regardless of the fact the auction was as-is, and it's > been in his house for half a month. I don't want anyone to get burned on a > buy, but I also don't know what this guy has done to the widget in the half > month he's had it. What *really* pisses me off is this guy saying my > actions are fraudulent.
The only thing to do is reply to the SquareTrade complaint at least 1 time so that they don;t win by default. Even if they DO win, SquareTrade is not binding, but state the facts one time in your initial response like you did here "As-is item both refurbished and tested before shipment and buyer left positive feedback 8 days after tracking shows delivery stating that they were happy with item. It's not my fault that they broke it after that."
Then, after entering that info, check the box on the SquareTrade complaint page stating that the matter is closed and you no longer want to deal through SquareTrade, which will immediately close the complaint.
> Sounds like it broke down AFTER he said he was happy with it and AFTER he > left you PFB. Hardly your problem, especially on a 20 year old piece of > electronics. Let him report it to anyone he wants to.
Yep. And he paid by money order, so you don't have to worry about a chargeback.
He can complain all he wants to eBay, but if you save his emails, and document the dates he received the item and left feedback, it will be pretty obvious to anyone that he cries to that you are not at fault.
But on the other hand, he may indeed be having real troubles with the VCR.
In reality, he may have had it work fine for a few days, and then appear to go bad. For example, if he put in a tape, and recorded a program, it may indeed have played back fine. Rental movies may play fine. But if he takes a tape he previously recorded on his old VCR, it may not track properly through the new machine. If he then takes it into a shop for an estimate, and the alignment of the VCR is fine, the next thing they often do is examine the heads for wear. If the heads are worn, and likely they are, a technician will want to replace them. Head wear is a very common cause for VCRs not playing a "good" picture. The problem just may be that his old VCR was so far out of alignment that the tapes he previously recorded will track outside of the path the new machine is capable of handling.
This is a common problem a lot of people have when buying a new VCR. Often they find their old tapes just will not track properly in the new VCR, and they blame the new unit, or decide that their old tapes are just too old. Even if the picture plays fine, often the soundtrack may be distorted, garbled, or the stereo signal missing. This may be his problem, and he may be a victim of his own ignorance in regard to that situation.
So the buyer may not have done anything to damage the VCR, and it may indeed be experiencing problems. But that still does not mean it's the seller's responsibility. It just means that you often will have to give the buyer the benefit of doubt in such a situation. He may indeed feel victimized.
Or he may have wrecked it somehow, and be making up the story of the estimates if he can't provide proof. But we really don't know that yet.
> I'm really pissed about this guy.. argh... I need to vent :) Here's the > story...
> Guy buys an widget from me at the end of July ($120 sale, vintage electronic > item, about 20 years old). The auction listed the item as being in > functional condition , because.... it worked. I tested it myself, and also > had a minor repair professionally done prior to sale, and it was given a > good chek-over when it was getting repaired. The repair shop even commented > on the excellent condition of it... The item was also sold as-is however, > because it is 20 years old, and it was clearly marked as an "as-is" sale, in > a normal font, no trickery with tiny fonts or legal-ese, or anything like > that.
> He paid for the item on Aug 9th, (money order), I shipped it out to him the > same day, it got to his place on the 12th according to the tracking info. On > the 20th, he gives me a positive feedback, saying he's more then happy with > the item (this was 8 days after it arrived), I respond with a positive > feedback, saying he made prompt payment, good communication, etc...
> On the 27th (15 days after he received the item), he emails me and tells me > the widget isn't working properly, and he's taken it in to a repair shop. > They've told him it needs $160 worth of repairs for a worn component. (a > beta vcr "head")
> I emailed him back, and explained that I was perplexed that this problem has > arised, as I'd tested the item myself, and found it to be working fine, and > also had it professionally serviced prior to sale, and I couldn't understand > how the head could have suddenly become worn in the span of less then a > month. (He tells me that it's impossible to see anything on the screen, but > there was no issue when it was here...) I explained the item was sold as-is, > however if he sends me a copy of the invoice, I'd take it to the shop where > I had the widget refurbished, and ask them for any suggestions, and try to > come to an amicable agreement.
> He emailed me again, saying that I had a "legal responsibility", and was > "legally liable" to either fix his widget or refund all of his money > (including shipping), or he'd go to eBay or Squaretrade. I'm still trying > to be helpfull at this point, but this email really rubbed me the wrong way. > I explained clearly that the widget was sold as-is, and was functioning when > sold, and must have been functioning for at least some period of time after > he got it, because he left positive feedback explaining how happy he was > with it 8 days after receiving the item. I again offered to show the invoice > to the shop where I had the item refurbished for suggestions. I also > explained that I'd be more then happy to allow squaretrade to mediate the > issue.
> He emailed me back with this "No further communication is necessary as it is > a waste of my time and yours. I will file complaints with both Ebay and > Square Trade. In my view your actions are fraudulent and I will proceed > accordingly."
> I don't care about him complaining to eBay or squaretrade, I don't feel I've > done anything wrong, and I've tried to be helpfull with this guy; in fact if > he'd had a different attitude, I'd have offered a discount of some sort at > the very least, or send him a replacement part if I could source one at a > reasonable price, regardless of the fact the auction was as-is, and it's > been in his house for half a month. I don't want anyone to get burned on a > buy, but I also don't know what this guy has done to the widget in the half > month he's had it. What *really* pisses me off is this guy saying my > actions are fraudulent.
> Sigh... What to do, What to do....
Full refund of all costs, of course.
-- Many thanks,
Don Lancaster Synergetics 3860 West First Street Box 809 Thatcher, AZ 85552 voice: (928)428-4073 email: d...@tinaja.com
Why not just pay people for the privilege of bidding on your stuff? It would be far easier and make everyone much happier. Then "buyers" would have a right to be angry about your cancelling their "bid" as it would be costing them money. While you're at it, you can straighten their bananas for them, too.
<tekni...@nospamrogers.com> wrote: >He emailed me back with this "No further communication is necessary as it is >a waste of my time and yours. I will file complaints with both Ebay and >Square Trade. In my view your actions are fraudulent and I will proceed >accordingly."
eBay is a trading service, not a mental healthcare charity. I'm sorry, but you've just met Mr Angry and today the sky-penguins are telling him that _you're_ the incarnation of pure evil.
>tekni...@nospamrogers.com >They've told him it needs $160 worth of repairs for a worn component. (a >beta vcr "head")
I wonder what he's playing in his new VCR. If it's a tape *he made himself* on another VCR, there's always a risk that it won't play. A likelihood, even.
I have tons of tapes I recorded on one of my old VCRs that don't play well on my current unit. I get snow across the bottom, and terrible sound.
It's just the nature of the medium that old tapes may not align perfectly with the head(s) of a new VCR.
"Jim Menning" <jmSePnAnM...@SnPeAwM.rr.com> wrote in message <news:sRTYc.25808$Gk5.9075@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com>... > "EF in FLA" <iloves...@spam-me-some-more.com> wrote in message > news:zKSYc.6118$uN5.4149@tornado.tampabay.rr.com... > > Sounds like it broke down AFTER he said he was happy with it and AFTER he > > left you PFB. Hardly your problem, especially on a 20 year old piece of > > electronics. Let him report it to anyone he wants to.
> Yep. And he paid by money order, so you don't have to worry about a > chargeback.
> He can complain all he wants to eBay, but if you save his emails, and > document the dates he received the item and left feedback, it will be > pretty obvious to anyone that he cries to that you are not at fault.
> But on the other hand, he may indeed be having real troubles with the VCR.
> In reality, he may have had it work fine for a few days, and then appear to > go bad. For example, if he put in a tape, and recorded a program, it may > indeed have played back fine. Rental movies may play fine. But if he > takes a tape he previously recorded on his old VCR, it may not track > properly through the new machine. If he then takes it into a shop for an > estimate, and the alignment of the VCR is fine, the next thing they often > do is examine the heads for wear. If the heads are worn, and likely they > are, a technician will want to replace them. Head wear is a very common > cause for VCRs not playing a "good" picture. The problem just may be that > his old VCR was so far out of alignment that the tapes he previously > recorded will track outside of the path the new machine is capable of > handling.
With older VCRs - especially obsolete formats like Beta - there is far too much potential for the buyer not being satisfied if you sell as anything better than untested/as-is/spare. It could be that the machine you sell is in perfect condition, but the buyer's previous one wasn't, so they're old tapes "won't play properly," for which they will blame the new VCR. Of course, it is just possible that the heads might be teetering on the edge of their useful life, and the new owner might push them over that edge fairly quickly, whether through careful use or not. In the past, I've seen people selling used Betacam tapes as Betamax blanks, even though the tape formulation is far too abrasive for Betamax machines, and so is a quick route to dead heads. On the other hand, reapir technicians are not unknown for "finding" lots of things that "need" to be fixed (they're a bit like dentists in that respect).
The reality, though, is that pretty much every VCR depreciates to zero value in seven years. After that point, it's worth maybe £10 (US$15-20) for scrap/spares. The only exception would be if you're looking at a machine that was mothballed after <7 years use, but the genral rule of thumb is that something that old will have been used into the ground after that time.
I think your offer to take a form to your local repair shop to get their opinion was very helpful and more than most would do.
The item was sold "as is" and he already left you feedback and paid via money order. This is the best possible situation for a seller to be in when they have done nothing wrong and a buyer starts making demands.
If SquareTrade contacts you, respond that the item was sold "as is" and you tested it before shipping. There is nothing they can do and this is clearly his problem.
Good Luck! I think he may just disappear when he discovers this threats arn't working on you.
> I'm really pissed about this guy.. argh... I need to vent :) Here's the > story...
> Guy buys an widget from me at the end of July ($120 sale, vintage electronic > item, about 20 years old). The auction listed the item as being in > functional condition , because.... it worked. I tested it myself, and also > had a minor repair professionally done prior to sale, and it was given a > good chek-over when it was getting repaired. The repair shop even commented > on the excellent condition of it... The item was also sold as-is however, > because it is 20 years old, and it was clearly marked as an "as-is" sale, in > a normal font, no trickery with tiny fonts or legal-ese, or anything like > that.
> He paid for the item on Aug 9th, (money order), I shipped it out to him the > same day, it got to his place on the 12th according to the tracking info. On > the 20th, he gives me a positive feedback, saying he's more then happy with > the item (this was 8 days after it arrived), I respond with a positive > feedback, saying he made prompt payment, good communication, etc...
> At this point the deal was over. Period. The End.
Thanks for all the advice folks, I appreciate it.. I had intended to not follow up with him any more (other then responding to any squaretrade inquiries), but I really appreciate the support offered here.... and I just needed to vent the problem with this guy...
> > At this point the deal was over. Period. The End.
> Thanks for all the advice folks, I appreciate it.. I had intended to not > follow up with him any more (other then responding to any squaretrade > inquiries), but I really appreciate the support offered here.... and I just > needed to vent the problem with this guy...
> Cheers
Unless you want to waste more time, and go from the level of "ARGH!!!!" all the way up to "AIEEEEE!!!", there's really no need to respond to Squaretrade junkmail.
>> > At this point the deal was over. Period. The End.
>> And thus they should IMMEDIATELY stop selling on eBay. >> Perhaps taking up hang gliding, decoupage, or blacksmithing instead.
> Do we really need a flood of msgs asking whether horseshoes can go Media > Mail?
> Please consider deleting "blackmithing" from your recommendations.
Now Now...A "farrier" does the shoeing thing...;0) I can say from experience there is very little money on eBay for a Blacksmith forging his own stuff, there is too much imported crap.
Also, what's with that site? Did it just start up 10 minutes ago? There's nothing there! Only one member? And even if there were some topics in the empty forum, of what value would it be? Do you think potential bidders will all run off to your site and check it out as if it were the Better Business Bureau?
Looks like a complete waste of time to me. It really serves no function at all other than a private little bitching club. We can discuss all those subjects right here, on this newsgroup. No need to waste our time running over there.
> >> > At this point the deal was over. Period. The End.
> >> And thus they should IMMEDIATELY stop selling on eBay. > >> Perhaps taking up hang gliding, decoupage, or blacksmithing instead.
> > Do we really need a flood of msgs asking whether horseshoes can go Media > > Mail?
> > Please consider deleting "blackmithing" from your recommendations.
> Now Now...A "farrier" does the shoeing thing...;0) > I can say from experience there is very little money on eBay for a > Blacksmith forging his own stuff, there is too much imported crap.
> my 2¢....«º»
Forgeries are quite common. -- Many thanks,
Don Lancaster Synergetics 3860 West First Street Box 809 Thatcher, AZ 85552 voice: (928)428-4073 email: d...@tinaja.com
