What would you do? (MC mentd religion and death of a child)
Cyndie
Please do not read further if you are having a bad day.
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Today started out as an ordinary day. Got out of work and drove to pick up my
daughter from school. When I got there I was greeted by the principal and she
pulled me aside. I was thinking "oh no what did my daughter do". I have only
been pulled aside by the principal once!
This principal knows my IF battle and that I am having a miscarriage (long
story explained at the bottom). She said to me "I dont know how to tell you
this because of what you are going through but 2 of your daughters classmates
(they are brother and sister) weren't in school today. Their mother called me
this morning to tell me that their 3 month old baby brother died in his
sleep......." My heart dropped and tears filled my eyes. The principal was
pulling each parent aside to tell them the news (very small school). She wanted
us to discuss the issue with our children since it would most likely come up at
some point by the siblings that attend the school. Also my daughters class has
played with the newborn when the mother would go in for a visit. Anyway...the
principal knew that when the children came back to school the other students
would be asking them where they were and the principal wanted us to prepare our
children in case the sibling discussed the death...
Ok...so what am I getting at??
Well I see this woman every morning. I visually followed her through her
pregnancy and remember when she "appeared" one morning with the newborn. We
have never spoken...just exchanged smiles. We only see each other in passing
during the morning drop off. My heart aches for this woman. I cried for her
tonight when I was alone. I could feel her pain through my own losses.
I know as time passes I will start seeing her in the morning dropping her
children off again. Do I say something to her?? Do I share my losses with her
so she knows I can truly understand the core of her pain? Do I give her a
card?I feel this strange need to reach out to her and give her a little
support. This has been nagging me all night. I am going to feel so strange
seeing her every morning and staying silent. I am afraid to say something
because I dont want to stir up anymore pain for her.
What would you do??
Ok...now onto the story about how the principal knows about my miscarriage.I
was mortified when this happened but I laugh now when re-telling the story
Welllllll back in November when I did my second IVF. My mother was watching my
daughter. My daughter overheard my Mother all excited telling my father that I
had gotten 11 eggs at my retrival. She yelled to my father in a silly way
"Cyndie has 11 babies!!".
Well the next day my daughter was in religion class. Her entire school is
taught by NUNS!! They were discussing Jesus's birth and my daughter proceeded
to scream out "My mom had 11 babies pulled out of her stomach". Welllllll that
afternoon when I went to pick my daughter this 70 year old Nun in full
habit....rosary beads and all pulled me aside and said "You daughter informed
the school that you had 11 babies taken out of your stomach". OMG!! I was
sooooooooo embarassed!!!!!! I was even more impressed with how much knowledge
she had about IVF!!! Who'd have thought! Well...she continued to silently
follow my IVF progress and thats how she knew about the miscarriage. I will
never forget that day....Ooooohhhh my.
Ok....enough babbling. I posted this because I wanted some mixed input. I
really want to do the right thing. My heart is breaking for this poor family.
Thanks in advance.
*~`~ Cyndie ~`~*
Our lives are not measured by the number of breaths we take,
but by the number of moments that take our breath away.
Starbug
poor woman is going through.
My only advice is to not ignore it. Giving her a card will not stir up
thoughts of her baby. She's already thinking of him. And by not mentioning
the tragedy to her, she may feel as if people think he never existed.
That's the advice I've read elsewhere, about how to approach grieving moms.
Meanwhile, here's a hug for you ..... ((((((((((Cyndie)))))))))))
And how nice that your parents are so enthusiastic and supportive, in your
efforts to defeat IF. You are lucky, in that respect. I'm sorry about your
mc.
Warm hugs,
Starbug and her Zoo
Cyndie wrote in message <20040123223741...@mb-m17.aol.com>...
Peggy Sue
" Cyndie" <cyndire...@aol.comEATSPAM> wrote in message
news:20040123223741...@mb-m17.aol.com...
> This post is may be sensitive to some. It talks about the death of a
child.
> Please do not read further if you are having a bad day.
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Firstly I am so sorry about your M/C
*hugs*
I would give her a card, maybe post it even, just saying that you're sorry
and you're there if she ever wants to talk with you, that you understand
loss (something along those lines)
What an awful situation.
Mrs Duck
Definitely send a card to the mother. If you want to e-mail me privately,
I will be happy to share the things that were done for me when I lost Jeron.
I was thinking about you tonight as I drove home from WMT and was going to
e-mail to see how you are doing, how the methergine worked.
Hugs,
Tracy
Tina Smith
situation on either end, but I would think that a simple card telling her
that you are thinking about her and the family would be plenty. I
definately would not ignore it since she probably knows that the principal
told everyone and if you gave her a card, she could open it in private
where she could "break down" if she needed to or at least open it when
she's in a "better" place. As for what to say to her, I would think it's
up to you as to how much detail you include, but it may seem odd that you
would poor out a detailed story to someone that you have barely spoken to.
Maybe you could just say something like, "I am sorry for the loss of your
baby and you and your family are in our prayers. I have experienced
similar losses and am here for you if you need anything." This way, she
has enough information that if she does need to talk to someone, she could
feel comfortable seeking you out since she knows that you've shared some of
these feelings, but not so much information that seems like you've opened
your soul to a stranger. Perhaps this will open the door to a new
friendship. Sometimes the best things in life are born of tragedy.
Tina
Mom to Ally 12/9/02
cyndire...@aol.comEATSPAM ( Cyndie) wrote in
news:20040123223741...@mb-m17.aol.com:
Jamie Clark
Hugs my friend. Expressing sincere condolences will not stir anything up
for her -- it's all up, all the time right now. As other's have said, she
may think that people have forgotten her child, and a kind word from you, in
person or in a card, would be wonderful. A simple "I'm so sorry." Or even
a "I don't even know what to say, except that I'm so sorry about your son."
Whether you get into your losses or not isn't really important -- by your
compassion and empathy, she'll know that you have experienced a loss too. I
think it's wonderful that you want to reach out to her, and I encourage you
to do so.
--
Jamie & Taylor
Earth Angel, 1/3/03
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Pip
be just lovely. I think it would please her very much that you have taken
the time and energy to be there for her if she needs you.
Good luck
Pip
Leann and Donald
would not necessarily tell her of your own losses. She may feel as though
you are minimizing her loss with your sharing of your m/c. Please
understand that I am not saying that m/c is not as painful as losing an
older baby, but to the other woman it may feel that you are minizing her
loss.
How terrible. My heart goes out to her.
Leann
"Starbug" <lee...@home.com> wrote in message
news:_4mQb.242441$JQ1.100520@pd7tw1no...
Beth
" Cyndie" <cyndire...@aol.comEATSPAM> wrote in message
news:20040123223741...@mb-m17.aol.com...
> so she knows I can truly understand the core of her pain? Do I give her a
> card?
[. . .]
> What would you do??
First of all, I'm sorry that you've had another m/c and that it is ongoing.
:-( By all means reach out to that woman and tell her how sorry you are. I
would probably just give a card, in my case, and talk if she approached me.
I am not sure that I would tell her about my losses, late or early, by way
of condolence, because I'm not sure that she would relate, after losing a
baby who was born and lived in the outer world for 3 months. I can't begin
to understand what that would be like for her. However, I'm betting that
she would welcome an invitation to talk about her little angel, and would
appreciate people who remember things about her little boy and aren't afraid
to mention them. Good luck in whatever you decide.
--
Beth
John & Theodor's mother
b.&d. 12/25/99 & b. 12/3/02
Cyndie
It didnt work....sigh. Looks like I will be having a D&C :(
Cyndie
>baby and you and your family are in our prayers. I have experienced
>similar losses and am here for you if you need anything."
Wow...that is perfect! Great advice everyone. I am going to get her a card and
just simply write something like the above.
Cyndie
>you are minimizing her loss with your sharing of your m/c.
Exactly...thats what I thought last night. In the card I am not even going to
mention anything. I am going to keep it very simple.
-L.
<snip>
>Do I say something to her?? Do I share my losses with her
> so she knows I can truly understand the core of her pain? Do I give her a
> card?I feel this strange need to reach out to her and give her a little
> support. This has been nagging me all night. I am going to feel so strange
> seeing her every morning and staying silent. I am afraid to say something
> because I dont want to stir up anymore pain for her.
> What would you do??
I have a friend who lost a baby at birth and another at a month old.
Based on my experiences, I would say something and give her a card to
open later, signed by you and your daughter. I wouldn't necessarily
bring up your losses unless it came out naturally in conversation.
Loss of a three-month-old is different than m/c, just as all types of
loss are different from each other - not "better or worse", just
different - and when you are in the middle of your own grief, you
cannot always see the connection between two situations.
When my Mom passed, so many people came up to us - people we didn't
know, but who only knew my Mom in passing. It was wonderful to know
so many people cared. One thing that still sticks in my mind was that
my sister told the mail lady that my Mom had died, and the mail lady
cried. That someone so uninvolved in our lives would care enough
about my Mom really touched my heart.
So, yes, say something. It will give her comfort that you care, and
be sure to let her know you and your daughter care about her
children's sense of loss, too.
Take care, Cyndie. You have a big heart, and it shows.
Hugs,
-L.
Megan
weeks, I was sent Sympathy cards! It was HORRIBLE!!! DO NOT send
sympathy, IMO. I think that perhaps a Thinking of You or a Your in my
thoughts and prayers is much nicer.
~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002
Megan
th family. Even though you don't personally know her, you mentioned that
your children are in a small school together, religious at that, so
sending over dinner or a breakfast basket would be a very nice jester.
Or how about a prayer card in the babies name? (you mentioned nuns, I'm
assuming Catholic??)
Megan
clowns!'. Yikes!
Jamie Clark
I hope you don't take offense at this, but I'm really curious. Why were
sympathy cards horrible? Saying "I'm so sorry for your loss" is expressing
sympathy. Why was that bad to hear, for you?
I lost my son at 24 weeks gestation, and was very touched by the outpouring
of sympathy, in all forms, except of course the old *favorite* "At least you
can have another," or "It was God's will." Doi. Those did not help.
--
Jamie & Taylor
Earth Angel, 1/3/03
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"Megan" <megnma...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:2643-401...@storefull-3337.bay.webtv.net...
Diana64
I am so sorry to hear of this family's loss. I think there is probably no
greater pain than that of losing a child.
You could always send this woman a crad and let her know that if she needs
anything, even help with her kids, you could be there for her. Also, one of
the nicest ways to show you care is bring dinners over to the family. Even
organize a "food chain" where each mother in the class brings over a meal each
day for a few weeks. This is a common thing done in Ryan's school. And it is
tremendously appreciated, whether the recipient knows the "cooks" or not.
Something so easy as making a dinner for someone makes an impact.
I hope this helps. Please let us know how the family is doing.
Diana
Ryan 10-6-99
Cara 11-15-01
whodunit
First, I'm sorry to see that you are still undergoing the m/c. :*(
Prayers for a safe D&C and a very quick recovery.
As far as this woman goes, I think the suggestion to send a card and
maybe dinner or a small bouquet or plant would be very thoughtful.
When I m/c'd the people at school acted as though nothing had happened,
and that was almost more painful than the m/c itself! :*( I learned
lated that they were worried about upsetting me (which they did anyway)
so they didn't want to bring "it" up. To me, they were discounting the
fact that my baby had died...when I told them that, they got me a card
and a small plant that I cherished. :*)
It is so kind of you to think of her pain when you are going through so
much yourself. :*) Big hugs to you, no matter what you do!
Love,
Carolyne in TX
Beth
> weeks, I was sent Sympathy cards! It was HORRIBLE!!! DO NOT send
> sympathy, IMO. I think that perhaps a Thinking of You or a Your in my
> thoughts and prayers is much nicer.
Here's another perspective. When I lost my son at 19 weeks' gestation, I
appreciated the sympathy cards, trees and plants. I felt as if something
unthinkable had happened to my child, rather than to myself, and these
acknowledgements of his loss meant a lot.
This woman has lost a little guy who had his own personality and living
presence in the entire family's life. If anything deserves a sympathy card,
it's the death of a tiny baby.
Beth
Beth
"Jamie Clark" <jami...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:jRyQb.26036$zj7....@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> I lost my son at 24 weeks gestation, and was very touched by the
outpouring
> of sympathy, in all forms, except of course the old *favorite* "At least
you
> can have another," or "It was God's will." Doi. Those did not help.
My least favorite expression of caring came from the mother of five who said
that something was probably not normal with the baby and that's why I lost
it. I just smiled and explained that "my son was perfect."
Beth
Megan
flowers, etc., but I don't know why, I just hated those sympathy cards.
Maybe because when you are getting sympathy, someone has died and I
didn't really want to admit that my babies had died. I just like the
Tinking of You cards better.
Lily
I am so sorry about that family's loss. It is heartbreaking.
I understand it is very hard for you as well and wish you strength.
You got some excellent advice so I just wanted to add that a very good
friend of mine recently had a stillborn and felt so relieved that I
did ask questions (even lots of details) , she wanted to talk about it
all the time and I understood because that's how I felt when I
experienced loss.
She complained that most people acknowledged it right after it happend
and never again mentioned it......she said all she wanted to hear was
"how are you"...and most people didn't even do that....
Hope this helps a bit..
hugs,
lily
Cyndie
>bring up your losses unless it came out naturally in conversation.
>Loss of a three-month-old is different than m/c, just as all types of
>loss are different from each other - not "better or worse"
I absolutely agree. I feel the loss of a 3 month old can even compare in many
ways.
Cyndie
>and never again mentioned it......she said all she wanted to hear was
>"how are you"...and most people didn't even do that....
I dont understand that. I just went through a situation not the same but...
My mother had lung cancer and a large portion of her friends stopped visiting
or calling. It was quite strange. I am wondering if not knowing what to do or
say causes people to sort of hybernate from the situation. Its quite
possible...but then in the end it makes the person feel alone.
Mrs Duck
Tracy
Mrs Duck
was the fact that my friends and people around me cared enough to send a
card.
Tracy
Mrs Duck
said
> that something was probably not normal with the baby and that's why I lost
> it. I just smiled and explained that "my son was perfect."
>
> Beth
Gosh Beth, I really hated that as well. My son was perfect too, just born
way to early.
Tracy
Mrs Duck
> organize a "food chain" where each mother in the class brings over a meal
each
> day for a few weeks. This is a common thing done in Ryan's school. And
it is
> tremendously appreciated, whether the recipient knows the "cooks" or not.
> Something so easy as making a dinner for someone makes an impact.
> I hope this helps. Please let us know how the family is doing.
>
ITA with this. I didn't have to cook for nearly a month after I lost my
son. Man I couldn't muster the energy to get out of bed some mornings, let
alone care what I made for dinner. WMT gave Chris 3 weeks off all paid and
without him, I would have fallen apart. Chris' co-workers had me/us make a
grocery list, they took up a collection and did my grocery shopping.
Between Chris' co-workers and our Sunday school class we had meals every
other day for a month (most of the meals were big enough to have leftovers).
Friends took Simon to preschool for me and brought him home for the first
couple of weeks. It was alot of the little things that really helped me
cope and get through that tough time.
Tracy
berlioz3
> really want to do the right thing. My heart is breaking for this poor
family.
Cyndie, first off all, I'm just so sorry for your loss. Hugs!
Of course, you have already recieved wonderful advice about this poor
family. I think a card and meal are a lovely idea. I have no doubt whatever
you decide will be the right thing.
Beth
Nicholas 12/95
Samantha & Alexandra 7/97
Zachary & Gabriel 5/01
berlioz3
"Megan" <megnma...@webtv.net>
> I just like the Tinking of You cards better.
Surely one of those times when not everyone "feels" exactly the same things.
It doesn't make the feelings right or wrong, they just "are". We feel what
we feel, and do the best we can do.
Hugs!
Karen and Joe
So sorry for your mc and of course the tragic news about the baby's death.
So very sad.
I personally don't know what I would do as everybody is different; I guess I
would send a card but I wouldn't say that I understand on it. Good luck
K
" Cyndie" <cyndire...@aol.comEATSPAM> wrote in message
news:20040123223741...@mb-m17.aol.com...
> Ok....enough babbling. I posted this because I wanted some mixed input. I
> really want to do the right thing. My heart is breaking for this poor
family.
>
> Thanks in advance.
> *~`~ Cyndie ~`~*
Susan
It's so sad! I would write her a very nice note telling her how sorry
you are but I'm not sure I would bring up my own losses if I were you.
You could also approach her and tell her how sorry you are also. I have
the same feeling about it as Leann--she may feel like your are mimizing
her loss or something. She's grief stricken. I can understand the
inclination to tell her about your losses. It's a bonding thing and you
want to let her know she's not alone.
My hearts just breaks for her.
Susan
Susan
Susan
Cyndie
>sympathy, IMO.
I wasnt going to. I just think it is too morbid for this scenario. I am not
doing a mass card either because even thought its a catholic montessori school
I cant assume she is catholic. All religions attend the school due to it being
one of the only ones around.
Cyndie
too!!
Cyndie
He sure was!
Cyndie
sympathy card. I know my local card store must have one geared towards a child.
Beth
> Maybe because when you are getting sympathy, someone has died and I
> didn't really want to admit that my babies had died.
How sad, Megan. And you had a double tragedy.
I went straight back to work after Jack died and buried myself in projects,
but got pretty depressed as the months wore on. I don't think I was in
denial, but I spent half my time trying to obliterate the memory by working,
and the other half charting cycles and obsessing during 2ww.
--
Beth
John & Theodor's mother
b.&d. 12/25/99 & b. 12/3/02
MCranEY05
how sad. I think a card telling her that you are sorry for her loss, would be
very nice.
I can't imagine what that mother is going thru. My sister lost her son when he
was 7 weeks old. I was there in the room when he died. It is awful..
HUGS.. you are a wonderful person.
Susan
chocked her.
susan
Sarah Estell
think you should ignore it. Telling her of your losses in an empathetic way
may give her some support - and the fact that you don't know her well might
actually help. Sometimes it is easier to talk to someone who you aren't so
close to.
Sarah
Jamie Clark
I just picked up a sympathy card for a friend whose mother died, and I
thought it was really wonderful. My friend has also lost a child, and I
thought that this card worked really well for someone who has experienced
any other types of losses. The one I got is made by Hallmark, their Fresh
Ink division.
There is a very blue water-color style painting of stars on the front with
the words: "Perhaps they are not the stars, but rather openings in Heaven
where the love of our lost ones shines down to let us know they are with
us." Inside, it simply says, "With Sympathy".
I guess it all depends on the style or type, both of the person and the
card. I think it's good for my friend, because we refer to our lost babies
as angels, and we imagine them playing together, etc. I'm not overly
religious, and not a church going person, but it makes me feel good to think
that my son Nathan is healthy and whole and happy somewhere above. I see
the stars at night and I know he's around me.
Anyway, I'm sure if you browse long enough, you'll find the perfect card for
this woman -- whether it's a sympathy card, a thinking of you card, or even
a blank card with something lovely that you write.
--
Jamie & Taylor
Earth Angel, 1/3/03
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