Gas Water Heater

[Pointer]

Getting quotes for a gas water heater tank in FL and asking if there are
any preferred makers/models? Anyone have first hand experience??

Thanks in advance.

[Doug]

On Tue, 21 Feb 2012 20:36:33 -0500, Pointer <dryea...@verizon.net>
wrote:

>Getting quotes for a gas water heater tank in FL and asking if there are
>any preferred makers/models? Anyone have first hand experience??
>
>Thanks in advance.

I can't remember the other brand recommended around where I live in
Houston but the other brand recommended around here was "State" and
that's what I got about one year ago. I'm happy with my twin 40 gal
gas water heaters. Somewhere I read that different parts of the
country have different recommendations so what might be good around me
may not be what's recommended around where you are????

[Stormin Mormon]

Ah, you know. The usual advice. Ask your friends and neighbors, visit the
hardware stores, and ask if they install. Read Consumer Reports, and ask
your relatives. And then get the one with the biggest tits ^h^h^h^h
warranty.

My boss used to install A.O. Smith, and I think the one I've got installed
is GE. I'm in NY, so what works here might not work in Florida.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Pointer" <dryea...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:ji1gqu$4s5$1...@dont-email.me...

[DanG]

Might be a good time to consider tankless. Our head plumber is adamant
about Noritz - non proprietary PVC venting. Our vendor here says he's
not ever sold any replacement parts for one.

--


___________________________________

Keep the whole world singing . . .
Dan G
remove the seven

[Tony Hwang]

DanG wrote:
> On 2/21/2012 7:36 PM, Pointer wrote:
>> Getting quotes for a gas water heater tank in FL and asking if there are
>> any preferred makers/models? Anyone have first hand experience??
>>
>> Thanks in advance.
>
>
> Might be a good time to consider tankless. Our head plumber is adamant
> about Noritz - non proprietary PVC venting. Our vendor here says he's
> not ever sold any replacement parts for one.
>

Hi,
I always wondered tankless could fill a Jacuzzi tub?

[tra...@optonline.net]

On Feb 21, 9:29 pm, "Stormin Mormon"

<cayoung61***spambl...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Ah, you know. The usual advice. Ask your friends and neighbors, visit the
> hardware stores, and ask if they install. Read Consumer Reports, and  ask
> your relatives. And then get the one with the biggest tits ^h^h^h^h
> warranty.
>
> My boss used to install A.O. Smith, and I think the one I've got installed
> is GE. I'm in NY, so what works here might not work in Florida.
>
> Christopher A. Young
> Learn more about Jesus
>  www.lds.org
> .
>

> "Pointer" <dryearw...@verizon.net> wrote in message

>
> news:ji1gqu$4s5$1...@dont-email.me...
> Getting quotes for a gas water heater tank in FL and asking if there are
> any preferred makers/models?  Anyone have first hand experience??
>
> Thanks in advance.

I have a State that I bought about 12 years ago at HD.
Just a typical conventional one that had a 10 year
warrantly. About 5 years ago the thermocouple went
on it. I called up State, it was under warranty, and 2 days
later I had a new thermocouple on my doorstep. Didn't
have to send the old one back, no shipping charges.
Very satisfied here.

[George]

On 2/21/2012 9:44 PM, DanG wrote:
> On 2/21/2012 7:36 PM, Pointer wrote:
>> Getting quotes for a gas water heater tank in FL and asking if there are
>> any preferred makers/models? Anyone have first hand experience??
>>
>> Thanks in advance.
>
>
> Might be a good time to consider tankless. Our head plumber is adamant
> about Noritz - non proprietary PVC venting. Our vendor here says he's
> not ever sold any replacement parts for one.
>

The breeching can be really spendy so that is a big point. I looked at
tankless and the proprietary breeching I would need was double the cost
of the heater.

[Steve Barker]

in about a week. if you like lukewarm.

--
Steve Barker
remove the "not" from my address to email

[gregz]

A tank might not fill a jacuzzi, no problem for tankless.

Just had Rheem installed by plumber recommendation, tank type.

Greg

[DD_BobK]

On Feb 21, 6:49 pm, Tony Hwang <drago...@shaw.ca> wrote:

>
> Hi,
> I always wondered tankless could fill a Jacuzzi tub?

Yes but how satisfactorily would be a function of cold water temp,
water heater output and tub size.

If your tub takes 50 gallons & the heater can produce 4 gpm of
adequately hot water, you'll be good to go in ~12 minutes.
Iower capacity, 3 gpm.... 16 minutes
higher capacity, 9 gpm 6 minutes

here's a pretty decent, unbiased website about tankless

http://www.tanklesswaterheaterguide.com/

here's another one about specfic heaters & use cases
http://www.houseneeds.com/shop/heatingproducts/waterheating/tanklesswaterheatersize.asp

I thought about a tankless but the numbers didn't make sense for my
application......
$1200 for the unit
cold water at 45F
derating for elevation
bigger propane line
questions about longevity
DIY installation costs vs contractor installation
increased hot water usage

cheers
Bob

[DanG]

You have a much better chance with a good tankless. Some of the early
electric attempts at tankless were really sad junk. Perhaps you should
research Noritz.

[Pointer]

Nothing in consumers.

[bob haller]

On Feb 22, 7:10 am, DanG <dgrif...@cox.net> wrote:
> On 2/21/2012 9:52 PM, Steve Barker wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 2/21/2012 8:49 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:
>
> >> DanG wrote:
> >>> On 2/21/2012 7:36 PM, Pointer wrote:
> >>>> Getting quotes for a gas water heater tank in FL and asking if there
> >>>> are
> >>>> any preferred makers/models? Anyone have first hand experience??
>
> >>>> Thanks in advance.
>
> >>> Might be a good time to consider tankless. Our head plumber is adamant
> >>> about Noritz - non proprietary PVC venting. Our vendor here says he's
> >>> not ever sold any replacement parts for one.
>
> >> Hi,
> >> I always wondered tankless could fill a Jacuzzi tub?
>
> > in about a week. if you like lukewarm.
>
> You have a much better chance with a good tankless.  Some of the early
> electric attempts at tankless were really sad junk.  Perhaps you should
> research Noritz.

electric tankless are a loser, requiring 200 amp service just for
heating water.plus 200 amps or whatever to run your home

I have a 75 gallon 75,000 BTU GE gas model that provides endless hot
water.

it includes a brass drain valve, the plastic ones are junk

[George]

Maybe someone forgot to turn it on? A gas tankless is more than up to
the task of filling a jacuzzi.

[bob haller]

> the task of filling a jacuzzi.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

depends on lots of issues........

whats the incoming water temperature? with incoming water at 40
degrees the rise amount must be high enough to get the water to a
comfy temerature.

few tankless can have enough BTU to raise incoming from 40 degrees to
say 120 or so

ANY OTHER water being drawn ? you can overwhem a tankless by drawing
too much hot water at the same time.

think filling a tub while someone is showering:( Burr cold hot water.

may be zero hot water in low flow applications like shaving, the
heater may not trip on

Besides all that theres the high cost of install, big gas lines. May
be issues with exhaust, chimney, may depend on power line to operate
no electric no hot shower, tankless are complex and may need heat
exchanger cleaning espically in hard water areas. so add cost for
trained pro service.

standard tanks are cheap, tend to work well dependably till they
leak.. and typically cost less than a decent candy bar a week when you
divide purchase price by life expectancy

[JIMMIE]

My State is 20 years old. The only problem was the plastic drain
started leaking, easy fix. That was 10 years ago. If I had to replace
it today I would get another but replace the drain valve with a metal
one during installation.

Jimmie

[Pointer]

On 2/21/2012 9:29 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Nothing in consumers.

[tra...@optonline.net]

If he considers tankless it would be good if he
could report back what he finds and what he
decides. I can see why a plumber would like
tankless, since the install labor as well as the
product cost is going to be a lot more than
the install for just replacing a conventional.

They can be great for certain applications.
IMO, the cost effectiveness just isn't there
for the typical residential replacement of a
storage type unit.

[Stormin Mormon]

I replaced my WH, a couple years ago. I think that a full flow brass ball
valve drain would have been excellent idea. I did not, and will likely
regret my neglect.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"JIMMIE" <JIMMIE...@YAHOO.COM> wrote in message
news:9ecce8c0-5ff4-424c...@r1g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...

[JIMMIE]

On Feb 22, 9:10 am, "trad...@optonline.net" <trad...@optonline.net>
wrote:

I was thinking about getting a a tankless for my house in Fl. Too
expensive, they may be more efficient but the upfront cost are just
ridiculous. Total cost was around $3K I dont think you would ever
recover your investment.

Jimmie

[bob haller]

>
> I was thinking about getting a a tankless for my house in Fl. Too
> expensive, they may be more efficient but the upfront cost are just
> ridiculous. Total cost was around $3K I dont think you would ever
> recover your investment.
>

> Jimmie-

Thats the problem the numbers just arent there.

the payback time will exceed the life of the unit:(

[Peter]

My 23 year old CraftMaster 80 gallon natural gas hot water heater
finally bit the dust last month and I needed to replace it. Couldn't
find a local dealer in my area, so that wasn't a choice for me. I don't
know if they are as well made today as then, but I never any repairs
required for it.

Since I would not be doing it myself, I looked at the total package cost
- the heater, installation, and removal of the old unit. My local
plumber uses only Bradford White. On the web, I learned that those are
sold only to the trade, not to private consumers. However, they seem to
have excellent reviews. The plumber's charge was only about $75 more
than what it would have cost me to have an equivalent item installed by
one of the major big box chains, so I went with my local plumber. Too
soon to know if I made a mistake or not. So far, so good.

[Pointer]

Tankless is out of the question for this application.

The two recommendations I see are State and Bradford White. Hope they
are good in FL.

Appreciate the recommendation regarding a brass drain valve which
appears important.

Thanks

[bob haller]

> > soon to know if I made a mistake or not. So far, so good.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

actually your better off at install replacing whatever valve there is
with a ball type, for best draining

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

On Tue, 21 Feb 2012 19:49:55 -0700, Tony Hwang <drag...@shaw.ca>
wrote:

I doubt it - and my advice to anyone considering a tankless is "DO
YOUR HOMEWORK" and don't believe all the hype.

If your water is REAL SOFT, i.e virtually no TDS it might make sense.
Depending on your usage.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

On Wed, 22 Feb 2012 04:03:20 +0000 (UTC), gregz <ze...@comcast.net>
wrote:

My current unit is a conventional Mexican built GE labelled unit
from Home Despot. My last one (installed about 18 years earlier) was a
GSW made in Fergus Ontario. If this one lasts as long as the last one
I won't likely be here to see it changed.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

On Wed, 22 Feb 2012 05:55:04 -0800 (PST), bob haller <hal...@aol.com>
wrote:

Let's see, 18 years is 936 weeks -spread the $600 cost over 936 weeks
and it;s considerably less than a crappy candy bar per week.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

On Wed, 22 Feb 2012 13:45:46 -0800 (PST), bob haller <hal...@aol.com>
wrote:

And the drain valve is not nearly as important on a gas unit as on an
electric

[DD_BobK]

On Feb 22, 10:33 am, Pointer <dryearw...@verizon.net> wrote:
> Tankless is out of the question for this application.
>
> The two recommendations I see are State and Bradford White.  Hope they
> are good in FL.
>
> Appreciate the recommendation regarding a brass drain valve which
> appears important.
>
> Thanks
>

MAJOR SNIP

why is blanket statement?

"Tankless is out of the question for this application."

Technical or financial issues?

[Doug]

On Wed, 22 Feb 2012 13:33:53 -0500, Pointer <dryea...@verizon.net>
wrote:

>Tankless is out of the question for this application.
>
>The two recommendations I see are State and Bradford White. Hope they
>are good in FL.
>
>Appreciate the recommendation regarding a brass drain valve which
>appears important.
>
>Thanks
>

Yes, that's the recommendation I couldn't remember around where I
live... Bradford White. As I said I went with "State" but I can't
compare to Bradford White since I never had one. The State model I
have has brass drain valves. The prior water heaters I had (brand??)
did not and after like 10 years, one cracked and spewed mist
everywhere. It wasn't pretty. I think I had a State in another
house long time ago and that was fine as far as I remember.

Whatever you order, just make sure parts are easy to come by as you
might need service some day and getting the parts quickly will make
life a lot easier for you.

[Pointer]

Thanks. Rather shocked at a quote yesterday of over $1400 for providing
and installing a 40 gel gas unit on a simple swap out. Trying others.

[Pointer]

It simply does not pay and then there is the issue of the vent size.

[bob haller]

On Feb 23, 9:22 am, Pointer <dryearw...@verizon.net> wrote:
> On 2/23/2012 12:28 AM, Doug wrote:
>
>
>
>
>

> > On Wed, 22 Feb 2012 13:33:53 -0500, Pointer<dryearw...@verizon.net>

> and installing a 40 gel gas unit on a simple swap out.  Trying others.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

try some big box stores with install, 1400 bucks is way too expensive

[George]

What issue of vent size? As someone pointed out there are newer designs
that use standard schedule 40 PVC for exhaust.

[Stormin Mormon]

I wonder which unit?
http://www.nextag.com/40-gallon-gas-water-heater/stores-html
And how much of that $1400 was markup and labor?

You might be paying more for a 40 gel unit. Most heaters only do water.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Pointer" <dryea...@verizon.net> wrote in message

news:ji5i55$ipp$1...@dont-email.me...

[Stormin Mormon]

Vent-agra. When size matters.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Pointer" <dryea...@verizon.net> wrote in message

news:ji5il0$ljf$1...@dont-email.me...

[DD_BobK]

Cool.... makes sense. I investigated as well but bigger propane
line, unit cost & others were a killer.
Plus I figured some people would take "Hollywood" showers and my
propane bill would sky rocket.

Decreasing water temp is Mother Nature telling you......... "shower's
over".

But to answer you original question Bradford White..... I got 17
years out of the first one and just replaced it.

I was jammed for time, couldn't procure the specialized unit or do the
install myself ..... so I jobbed it out.

75 gallon propane, high elevation unit $1200 incuding tax
installation (threaded ball valves on hot & cold lines) $500 :(
~$100 per year .....


Oh well not cheap but by the time I drove & did it myself it would
have taken me three days and $100 in gas.


cheers
Bob

[gregz]

I like my little hardware store. Great prices, and usually cheaper on
select products, they have third party installers. I bought my rheem tank
for less than $400 . A plumber will double price of unit.

Greg

[Doug]

On Thu, 23 Feb 2012 09:22:03 -0500, Pointer <dryea...@verizon.net>
wrote:

I'm thinking $800 to $1100 and if really just a swap out on a first
floor... probably closer to the $800-$900 range. Let's face it the
plumbers want to eat too <grin>.

[Pointer]

I need an installer in FL. 10 years ago I would have done it myself as
I have done an A/C system and two water heaters.

[Pointer]

In a futile effort to justify his price he stated that he wanted to
retire some day.

[ng_reader]

As mentioned AO Smith makes the Vertex which all things being equal I
would have installed. The list price is close to 2k but it's a much
better design.

If you like to sweat plumbing then it is an easy DIY project. If you
have to pay someone, it will cost around $400 to $700. You might be able
to "bargain" by telling the repair man that you will have the tank
drained before they get there.

Best.

[HeyBub]

Pointer wrote:
> I need an installer in FL. 10 years ago I would have done it myself
> as I have done an A/C system and two water heaters.

You can usually find a day laborer for $10-12 per hour in the parking lot of
the box store. If his hand fits a wrench, and with your supervision, you
should be out for 20-30 bucks for the install. We're talking two water
connections with flexible hoses, and one gas connection with a similar
flexible hose.

Seriously, the intellect to install a water heater is trivial; the labor to
jack the thing around not so much.

On the other hand, if you live in a jurisdiction that requires permits,
inspections, and a licensed, union plumber, it might be more.

Don't forget the earthquake strap.

[Pointer]

Have done it in the past but in this case it is not worth it due to age,
rebates(need licensed plumber), second floor, etc.

[Ashton Crusher]

On Tue, 21 Feb 2012 20:36:33 -0500, Pointer <dryea...@verizon.net>

wrote:

>Getting quotes for a gas water heater tank in FL and asking if there are
>any preferred makers/models? Anyone have first hand experience??
>
>Thanks in advance.

I might be doing the wrong thing but I buy the cheapest and run it at
as low a water temp as I can get away with. The only thing where high
heat is useful is in automatic dishwasher and I buy those with water
heating capability. I used to run the water heaters at high temps
and it seemed like no matter how much I paid for them it caused them
to rust out far faster. After switching to buy cheap and keep the
heat low they all seem to last fairly long. High heat also seems to
generate huge amounts of mineral deposits in the bottom. Low heat
seems to have solved that problem too.

[Grumpy]

DO NOT BUY SEARS in my area are bunch scumb bags....

"Ashton Crusher" <de...@moore.net> wrote in message news:j3aik79coiohskar4...@4ax.com...

[gregz]

Sometimes I also reduce the flame level.

Greg

[Pointer]

Had a Rheem installed yesterday with a slight leak appearing in the
supply line. Plumber returned at 9am today and replaced the supply line
as promised. $770 (including new brass supply line ball valve to
replace a questionable PVC one) less rebate of $350.

[tra...@optonline.net]

On Feb 25, 5:08 pm, Pointer <dryearw...@verizon.net> wrote:
> On 2/25/2012 3:45 PM, gregz wrote:
>
>
>

> > Ashton Crusher<d...@moore.net>  wrote:
> >> On Tue, 21 Feb 2012 20:36:33 -0500, Pointer<dryearw...@verizon.net>

> >> wrote:
>
> >>> Getting quotes for a gas water heater tank in FL and asking if there are
> >>> any preferred makers/models?  Anyone have first hand experience??
>
> >>> Thanks in advance.
>
> >> I might be doing the wrong thing but I buy the cheapest and run it at
> >> as low a water temp as I can get away with.  The only thing where high
> >> heat is useful is in automatic dishwasher and I buy those with water
> >> heating capability.  I used to run the water heaters  at high temps
> >> and it seemed like no matter how much I paid for them it caused them
> >> to rust out far faster.  After switching to buy cheap and keep the
> >> heat low they all seem to last fairly long.  High heat also seems to
> >> generate huge amounts of mineral deposits in the bottom.  Low heat
> >> seems to have solved that problem too.
>
> > Sometimes I also reduce the flame level.
>
> > Greg
>
> Had a Rheem installed yesterday with a slight leak appearing in the
> supply line.  Plumber returned at 9am today and replaced the supply line
> as promised.  $770 (including new brass supply line ball valve to

> replace a questionable PVC one) less rebate of $350.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

That's a hell of a rebate. From who? Anything special about
the water heater, like high efficiency? Wouldn't think so from
the price.

[Pointer]

The rebate is from the gas company and they confirmed the heater must
only be new. Must be a federal program designed to get votes. Higher
rebates for tankless.

[tra...@optonline.net]

On Feb 26, 9:12 am, Pointer <dryearw...@verizon.net> wrote:

> rebates for tankless.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

And it's just a typical conventional storage water heater right?
Not direct vent or anything special?

[Pointer]

Nothing special.