bathroom fixture light bulb - vasoline?
Liz Runkle
We've had more than one bulb (40W globe) break as we try to
replace it. Well, I ruined the socket and my husband will have to replace
that - one of those 5 globe bulb vanity fixtures.
He & my brother were talking and mentioned putting vasoline on the
bulb.
I need things spelled out. This would just be around the metal screw
section - and not on the ?contact point? base. I know they didn't mean
on the glass!
Does vasoline act like grease on car battery cables? Keep moisture out
and make them non-rustable - which is why I'm guessing the bulbs stick
in the sockets - especially in a bathroom?
Hubby would explain, but I feel really stupid not know this one! Wasn't
in archives, wasn't on Learn2.com and I checked my home Heloise books!
TIA, liz
Greenlight
screw them in, in order to help ease them out afterwards. There is an
anti-oxidative paste that electricians use variously called by different
brand names (such as noalox, penetrox, etc.) for similar "things". If a bulb
base broke off in the socket, it often can be removed with a long nose
pliers once one is absolutely certain that the power has been turned off at
the socket.
Don Klipstein
: Yeah, some people put vasoline on the screw threads of the bulb when they
: screw them in, in order to help ease them out afterwards. There is an
: anti-oxidative paste that electricians use variously called by different
: brand names (such as noalox, penetrox, etc.) for similar "things".
There are various products like this and some of them are a bit
corrosive. I would use a mild application of vasoline or absolutely
nothing.
Also - screw the bulb only somewhat past the point of things beginning
to get tight. Going as tight as possible short of breakage can fatigue
socket parts or bend socket contacts out of shape.
: If a bulb
: base broke off in the socket, it often can be removed with a long nose
: pliers once one is absolutely certain that the power has been turned off at
: the socket.
Yes, as in absolutely certain, as in switch is in the hot side if it is
off! (Switch in neutral side can turn the bulb off and leave socket
contact points LIVE! and I have seen this!) I would verify lack of
voltage from tip contact and shell of empty sockets of same fixture with
respect to a cold water pipe and work meter probes through any corrosion
or oxides before betting my life that the fixture won't kill me before
grabbing metal parts of a stuck lightbulb with pliers!
- Don Klipstein (d...@misty.com)
Greenlight
> corrosive. I would use a mild application of vasoline or absolutely
> nothing.
These products are variously classified as conductive grease and are
actually required in certian terminations that may tend to corrode via
oxididation and/or electrolysis such as in situations where dis-similar
metals are in direct contact such as steel, aluminum, copper, brass, etc.
Vasoline like other petroleum products on the other hand is an insulator and
is not recommended to help make electrical contacts.
> Yes, as in absolutely certain, as in switch is in the hot side if it is
> off! (Switch in neutral side can turn the bulb off and leave socket
> contact points LIVE! and I have seen this!) I would verify lack of
> voltage from tip contact and shell of empty sockets of same fixture with
> respect to a cold water pipe and work meter probes through any corrosion
> or oxides before betting my life that the fixture won't kill me before
> grabbing metal parts of a stuck lightbulb with pliers!
>
> - Don Klipstein (d...@misty.com)
Absolutely -- that's another good reason to leave certain tasks to well
trained electricians unless one makes the effort to "know" what they are
doing. This simple task can be easily done by anyone who is aware of all the
possibilities and takes all the precautions, of which Don is correct to
mention that turning off the light switch is not always sufficient, but
rather one has to be accurate in knowing how to check for the presence of
power at the light which can be present in some situations even when the
switch is off. However on the other hand, it doesn't take a genius to turn
off the main breaker of the house and to double check for the presence of
power with an ordinary $10 proximity (induction) tester. In other words
there exist safe practices and materials that one can follow and use to do
their own electrical work and there are also unsafe methods and materials as
well.
Joseph Meehan
Either use a proper material designed for electronic use, or get both
good fixture sockets and good light bulbs. They are using some cheap socket
materials these days, they should be outlawed.
--
Joe M
26 + 6 = 1 It's Irish math
Daniel Hicks
>
> Okay, for some reason our vanity bulbs above the sink are "touchy."
>
> We've had more than one bulb (40W globe) break as we try to
> replace it. Well, I ruined the socket and my husband will have to replace
> that - one of those 5 globe bulb vanity fixtures.
If the base of the bulb is just broken off inside the fixture, the
sure-fire way to get it out is to (1 and most important) disconnect the
power, preferably at the circuit breaker, (2) poke an ice pick in
between the metal of the socket and the metal of the broken-off bulb,
working the pick back and forth until the bulb base is bent inward maybe
1/4" at the point where the pick was inserted, and (3) grasp the bent-in
portion of the base with the tips of needle-nosed pliers and twist out
the base.
This approach has never failed me. The potato approach rarely works.
> He & my brother were talking and mentioned putting vasoline on the
> bulb.
They are wise beyond their years.
> I need things spelled out. This would just be around the metal screw
> section - and not on the ?contact point? base. I know they didn't mean
> on the glass!
You put a little dab (about match-head size) on the tip and another
little dab (small pea size) on the threaded part. It spreads itself
around as you screw in the bulb.
> Does vasoline act like grease on car battery cables? Keep moisture out
> and make them non-rustable - which is why I'm guessing the bulbs stick
> in the sockets - especially in a bathroom?
It does two things: First it keeps out air, which will cause corrosion
and result in a poor connection. Second, it lubricates the threads and
keeps them from seizing.
Daniel Hicks
>
> > There are various products like this and some of them are a bit
> > corrosive. I would use a mild application of vasoline or absolutely
> > nothing.
>
> These products are variously classified as conductive grease and are
> actually required in certian terminations that may tend to corrode via
> oxididation and/or electrolysis such as in situations where dis-similar
> metals are in direct contact such as steel, aluminum, copper, brass, etc.
> Vasoline like other petroleum products on the other hand is an insulator and
> is not recommended to help make electrical contacts.
The conductive grease products (such as NoAlOx) SHOULD NOT be used.
They could cause a short in the socket. An insulating grease like
vasoline is perfectly fine for electrical contacts (and is in fact used
all the time in industry). A better product is automotive silicone
high-voltage grease, but vasoline will do fine.
Dan Hicks
Master of Engineering in Electrical Engineering
Daniel Hicks
>
> As noted, don't use the Vaseline.
>
> Either use a proper material designed for electronic use, or get both
> good fixture sockets and good light bulbs. They are using some cheap socket
> materials these days, they should be outlawed.
There is nothing wrong with Vasoline. If you go to an electronics store
and get a tube of contact grease it will say "Ingredients: petrolatum"
on the label.
Dimitri
Greenlight
as your tools) and apply them. We are talking about putting the conductive
grease on the screw part, not the tip. I have been using "conductive" grease
for 42 years and never had a short nor have I heard of any "actual" case.
Have you ever put an ohm-meter in any jar? If you had, you would see that
"conductive" grease is actually not all that conductive. Although some
theoretician has created the "rumor" of it being a potential problem, no one
has ever experienced a short this way, rather it is simply some one's
theory. In the old days when I was working in communications I would be sent
samples from Dow and other chemical houses of very expensive super
conductive grease, none of them were capable of creating a short. If you
don't believe me take out an ohm-meter and see what you can conjure up. If
you have a megger check it out and see how far electricity will travel in
that stuff even under voltages far above 120 volts.
Most conductive greases have finely powdered zinc or other metals such as
silver or copper specially emulsified with (yes) often a petroleum base or
molybdenum carrier. It is this powder which makes the difference between
Vaseline as a complete insulator and an electrically conductive and
protective grease. In practical instances such as in communications arrays
subject to everyday outdoor weather corrosion situations it is standard
practice to use conductive grease. No radio engineer would ever spec
Vaseline for an electrical connection. Likewise most of the biggest and best
electrical companies sell UL listed conductive greases in order to
facilitate electrical connections under severe corrosive conditions.
Ordinary Vaseline is not approved by UL for good reason. Things "like"
Vaseline but much better like "permatex" is excellent for automobiles,
boats, and antenna non-conductive nuts and bolts, but are not formulated nor
should they be recommended for electrical connections.
I have no doubt that Vaseline would (like any other grease) help lubricate
the screw shell, prevent corrosion, and aid in its removal -- so too would
wheel bearing grease. Each are formulated for specific uses. On the other
hand I want to let consumers know that there are specially formulated
products for electrical connections that are well proven and generally
considered much better (many of them have gone through the UL listing
process). For example, if one cares to visit the world's oldest radio
organization website, the ARRL, they list over 20 different conductive
greases to use to improve electrical connections and inhibit corrosion in
adverse conditions (of which NOALOX and PENETROX are only two).
Hey if you like Vaseline, great, but put I suggest that you put it where it
will do the most good!
Daniel Hicks <danh...@ieee.org> wrote in message
news:390C1C08...@ieee.org...
Greenlight
petrolatum may be one of the ingredients (the carrier), but not the the
active ingredient.
Daniel Hicks <danh...@ieee.org> wrote in message
news:390C1CA8...@ieee.org...
David Inman
rag and wipe over the screw base and contacts - hardly enough to make
the surface wet - I do not spray WD40 directly onto the light bulb!.
Bulbs seem to screw in more easily, and I haven't had one "stick" in
the socket when removing it at the end of it's life since I started
the WD40 practice about 2 1/2 years ago.
It's worked for me - and is a lot less messy than Vaseline or
dielectric grease.
David Inman
"Dimitri" <dia...@the-spa.com> wrote in message
news:390C2B55...@the-spa.com...
Daniel Hicks
on the front label and "Contents: petrolatum" on the back. Nothing
else. Came from an electronics supply house.
Greenlight
Daniel Hicks <danh...@ieee.org> wrote in message
news:390C7DC4...@ieee.org...
Greenlight
it being conductive or to the contrary?
Greenlight <saha...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:mz%O4.39027$k5.11...@news1.frmt1.sfba.home.com...
Joseph Meehan
does the work (good or bad).
Arthur Shapiro
conduct electricity (I presume!), which is a fairly significant
drawback.
Go to Pep Boys or the equivalent and for a couple bucks pick up a
tiny tube of "Permatex Dialectric Tuneup Grease". It's a gooey
substance intended for high-voltage auto ignition circuit
connections, and it must therefore conduct electricity.
I've had good luck using it on prone-to-stick lightbulbs, such as
in the moist air of a bathroom. As the old commercial says, "a
little dab'll do ya."
I actually bought it because it improves the sound of my
(high-end) audio system when used on electrical connections. Just
one of those bizarre realities that make no sense.
Art
Daniel Hicks
>
> The problem with Vaseline would seem to be that it doesn't
> conduct electricity (I presume!), which is a fairly significant
> drawback.
>
> Go to Pep Boys or the equivalent and for a couple bucks pick up a
> tiny tube of "Permatex Dialectric Tuneup Grease". It's a gooey
> substance intended for high-voltage auto ignition circuit
> connections, and it must therefore conduct electricity.
"Dialectric" means insulalting!! A contact grease need not conduct
electricity, since the conduction is done by metal-to-metal contact.
The purpose of the grease (in addition to facilitating disassembly) is
to exclude air and moisture. It is the air and moisture that causes
connections to corrode.
Daniel Hicks
looks and feels like plain old Vaseline.
Greenlight wrote:
>
> Thanks Dan. What's the manufacturer and brand?
>
Robert Hancock
connection together the metal scrapes through the film and makes the
connection, and the grease seals out any corrosion. Presumably the same sort
of thing will happen with a light bulb.
--
Robert Hancock Saskatoon, SK, Canada
To email, remove "nospam" from hanc...@nospamhome.com
Home Page: http://members.home.net/hancockr
"Arthur Shapiro" <art.s...@unisys.com> wrote in message
news:8ekd7h$aua$1...@si05.rsvl.unisys.com...
> The problem with Vaseline would seem to be that it doesn't
> conduct electricity (I presume!), which is a fairly significant
> drawback.
>
> Go to Pep Boys or the equivalent and for a couple bucks pick up a
> tiny tube of "Permatex Dialectric Tuneup Grease". It's a gooey
> substance intended for high-voltage auto ignition circuit
> connections, and it must therefore conduct electricity.
>
Greenlight
but hope its more than vaseline. The other "conductive pastes" that I have
used were mostly blackish or greenish (mostly I guess from the emulsified
metals).
Regarding tuners, be careful because TV tuners are extremely delicate and
sensitive and also subject to malfunctioning due to "crud". Especially
anything that is left open to the air may attract dust if it is not
specially designed not to.
Greenlight
> electricity, since the conduction is done by metal-to-metal contact.
If it you applied the grease completely around both contact points and it
didn't conduct then how could current flow? That is why there are small
fortunes spent on developing "conductive" grease. Certainly the word,
"insulator", is a relative term each one rated by its dielectric properties,
so there is a diffrenece say between teflon and porcelin on the high side
and low dielectric grease on the other side. In the training of electricians
and technicians they are instructed to go for the lowest dielectric
properties as possible in order to help facillitate conduction. Even an
apprentice is taught this.
> The purpose of the grease (in addition to facilitating disassembly) is
> to exclude air and moisture. It is the air and moisture that causes
> connections to corrode.
That is true, but incomplete. You are only addressing simple oxidation, not
di-electric corrosion of metals due to arcing or disimilar outer shell
electron properties. Even various alloys of steel will have different
di-electric properties and can create corrosion when in contact, but even
more so different metal elements. This is where a well tested and formulated
conductive grease is valuable (not simply as an insulating anti-oxidant
coating).
Although I did not say that the vaseline wouldn't "suffice" in the light
bulb screw shell situation, I'd like to point out that there are products
that can be gotten at any HD or good hardware store that are better
formulated and indeed safer (according to UL and CSA).
Tony Miklos
>
> < A contact grease need not conduct
> > electricity, since the conduction is done by metal-to-metal contact.
>
> If it you applied the grease completely around both contact points and it
> didn't conduct then how could current flow?
I don't know why I'm getting into this but here's my scoop. I have
worked on electro-mechanical equipment for the past 20 years. On
contacts that simply open and close, no, you would never use any oil,
white grease, vaseline, or dielectric grease. Now on contacts that
slide (wiper fingers on a biscuit with brass rivets) different people in
the trade use just about any type of lubricant out there. They all seem
to work just fine and some of this equipment is from the 1930's.
How you apply this to the bulb socket dilemma is up to you, I only
telling you what I know.
--
Tony
Daniel Hicks
GC Electronics makes most of the chemicals sold to the TV and
electronics repair trade. If you buy a can of contact cleaner at Radio
Shack it was probably packaged by GC Electronics.
I'm well aware of the cautions about tuners. I've been working in
electronics since I was 12 years old.
> If it you applied the grease completely around both contact points and it
> didn't conduct then how could current flow? That is why there are small
> fortunes spent on developing "conductive" grease.
Good question. I've never seen conductive grease used in electronic
equipment except in some very special circumstances. (Thermal grease is
of course an entirely different beast.)
> Certainly the word,
> "insulator", is a relative term each one rated by its dielectric properties,
> so there is a diffrenece say between teflon and porcelin on the high side
> and low dielectric grease on the other side. In the training of electricians
> and technicians they are instructed to go for the lowest dielectric
> properties as possible in order to help facillitate conduction. Even an
> apprentice is taught this.
Strange, I never learned that in 5 years in engineering school. The
only place where conductive insulation is used is in very high voltage
applications where a very slight conductance is desireable in order to
bleed of static charge evenly and prevent concentrated voltage stress on
the insulators. But the amount of conductance required there would look
like an insulator at 120V.
> > The purpose of the grease (in addition to facilitating disassembly) is
> > to exclude air and moisture. It is the air and moisture that causes
> > connections to corrode.
>
> That is true, but incomplete. You are only addressing simple oxidation, not
> di-electric corrosion of metals due to arcing or disimilar outer shell
> electron properties. Even various alloys of steel will have different
> di-electric properties and can create corrosion when in contact, but even
> more so different metal elements. This is where a well tested and formulated
> conductive grease is valuable (not simply as an insulating anti-oxidant
> coating).
The whole idea of making a good connection revolves around a good
metal-to-metal connection. Such a connection can be formed with
virtually any combination of metals, and the two metals connected
together will not corrode AT THE CONNECTION. The problem is that they
WILL corrode immediately adjacent to the connection, and most corrosion
or oxidation results in a (more or less) insulating layer. With thermal
cycling, etc, this insulating layer will grow thicker and penetrate
deeper into the area where the metal-to-metal connection is until
eventually there is no metal-to-metal connection. The two tricks, then,
to a good electrical connection are pressure and the exclusion of oxygen
and other oxidizing gasses. The pressure itself helps exclude oxygen,
but a coating of grease improves this exclusion by an order of magnitude
or so.
Aluminum wire in particular generates a very highly insulating oxide
(whereas copper oxides are classified as semi-conductors). This is one
of the main reasons why aluminum wire is such a problem. The
metal-bearing pastes such as NoAlOx function in part by providing a
"sacrifical anode" that prevents the oxidation of the wire. Any
conductive property of the NoAlOx itself is incidental and of no
particular value, since the resistance of the compound would still be
orders of magnitude more than what is needed for a good connection.
> Although I did not say that the vaseline wouldn't "suffice" in the light
> bulb screw shell situation, I'd like to point out that there are products
> that can be gotten at any HD or good hardware store that are better
> formulated and indeed safer (according to UL and CSA).
Nope, those compounds are designed for wiring terminals and splices.
The ones that do any good contain a metal such as zinc to act as a
sacrificial anode. For the light bulb use they are no better or safer
than petrolatum, and they could possibly cause problems.
Daniel Hicks
>
> >
> > < A contact grease need not conduct
> > > electricity, since the conduction is done by metal-to-metal contact.
> >
> > didn't conduct then how could current flow?
>
> worked on electro-mechanical equipment for the past 20 years. On
> contacts that simply open and close, no, you would never use any oil,
> white grease, vaseline, or dielectric grease. Now on contacts that
> slide (wiper fingers on a biscuit with brass rivets) different people in
> the trade use just about any type of lubricant out there. They all seem
> to work just fine and some of this equipment is from the 1930's.
>
> How you apply this to the bulb socket dilemma is up to you, I only
> telling you what I know.
Switch contacts (at least those that operate with any frequency) are a
different beast. Each cycle cleans the contacts, and grease is only
needed as a lubricant for sliding contacts. We're concerned here with
connections that are static -- not made and broken. The problem with
such connections is that, absent any cleaning action, the connecting
surfaces can corrode.
Daniel Hicks
(for contacts, at least). Petrolatum can absorb a very slight amount of
moisture, while silicone dielectric grease won't. Also, where a
connection may be exposed to the weather, the silicone grease will not
wash off as easily. I use the two pretty much interchangeably.
But they are both insulating (ie, dielectric) greases.
Robert Hancock
metal contact. I really doubt a decent connection at all could be made if
the only thing current could go through was the grease, conducting or not.
--
Robert Hancock Saskatoon, SK, Canada
To email, remove "nospam" from hanc...@nospamhome.com
Home Page: http://members.home.net/hancockr
"Greenlight" <saha...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1JsP4.40199$k5.11...@news1.frmt1.sfba.home.com...
> < A contact grease need not conduct
> > electricity, since the conduction is done by metal-to-metal contact.
>
> If it you applied the grease completely around both contact points and it
> didn't conduct then how could current flow? That is why there are small
> fortunes spent on developing "conductive" grease. Certainly the word,
> "insulator", is a relative term each one rated by its dielectric
properties,
> so there is a diffrenece say between teflon and porcelin on the high side
> and low dielectric grease on the other side. In the training of
electricians
> and technicians they are instructed to go for the lowest dielectric
> properties as possible in order to help facillitate conduction. Even an
> apprentice is taught this.
>
> > The purpose of the grease (in addition to facilitating disassembly) is
> > to exclude air and moisture. It is the air and moisture that causes
> > connections to corrode.
>
> That is true, but incomplete. You are only addressing simple oxidation,
not
> di-electric corrosion of metals due to arcing or disimilar outer shell
> electron properties. Even various alloys of steel will have different
> di-electric properties and can create corrosion when in contact, but even
> more so different metal elements. This is where a well tested and
formulated
> conductive grease is valuable (not simply as an insulating anti-oxidant
> coating).
>
Greenlight
I understand the sacrificial metal idea (as I work on Marine electrical
systems), but I actually have samples of and still see advertised conductive
greases that chemical firms claim have copper or silver in them in order to
aid conductivity. I agree totally that the vaseline has good lubricating
qualities and it will act to seal out moisture and air (certainly not better
than standard automotive permatex) but significantly, yes.
I was taught that not only did conductive grease do all what was said above
about vaseline, but its advantage was that it didn't create insulation
between the contact points (or at least less). I like the data that you are
sharing, but being trained in science the question naturally arises why
copper and silver (besides zinc) is added to some "conductive greases" by
very well known chemical labs?
Another quandary is if what you bought as contact grease is indeed simply
vaseline and nothing else, why did you buy it?
> > Although I did not say that the vaseline wouldn't "suffice" in the light
> > bulb screw shell situation, I'd like to point out that there are
products
> > that can be gotten at any HD or good hardware store that are better
> > formulated and indeed safer (according to UL and CSA).
>
> Nope, those compounds are designed for wiring terminals and splices.
> The ones that do any good contain a metal such as zinc to act as a
> sacrificial anode. For the light bulb use they are no better or safer
> than petrolatum, and they could possibly cause problems.
A third natural question arises, if conductive greases are formulated
differently from contact grease (which you have) why would conduction
surfaces at splices and terminals need to be treated radically different
from the screw shell contact points? Observing the different kinds of screw
shells lately, some are made of brass, some steel alloys, some copper
alloys, while the screw shell material of bulbs are of a dis-similar metal.
Would not the application of conductive grease help reduce electrolysis in
any such situation and is this not a situation which could have existed in
the screw shell of the bathroom in question? In marine electrical work we
assume that even within an alloy, that electrolysis (self corrosion) can
occur under marine conditions (such as in the case of common red brass. Here
zinc is most often used because of its freerer availability of electrons and
hence in any moist or steamy situation zinc impregnated conductive grease
may be of benefit in order to prevent the negative consequences of galvanic
corrosion.
Lastly, can you point me to any data that indicates that conductive grease
is corrosive or could cause problems and if so what kind of problems? This
would be of benefit to help improve the results of my work. Thanks again for
your well thought out response.
Daniel Hicks
>
> Dan, thanks for the constructive information, and I say that sincerely.
>
> I understand the sacrificial metal idea (as I work on Marine electrical
> systems), but I actually have samples of and still see advertised conductive
> greases that chemical firms claim have copper or silver in them in order to
> aid conductivity. I agree totally that the vaseline has good lubricating
> qualities and it will act to seal out moisture and air (certainly not better
> than standard automotive permatex) but significantly, yes.
>
> I was taught that not only did conductive grease do all what was said above
> about vaseline, but its advantage was that it didn't create insulation
> between the contact points (or at least less). I like the data that you are
> sharing, but being trained in science the question naturally arises why
> copper and silver (besides zinc) is added to some "conductive greases" by
> very well known chemical labs?
The only reason I can think of for adding the other metals (besides
being able to say you did) would be if small particles of the metal
tended to get caught between the two contact surfaces and increase the
localized contact pressure. In theory a bunch of small high-pressure
contacts is better than one large low-pressure contact.
> Another quandary is if what you bought as contact grease is indeed simply
> vaseline and nothing else, why did you buy it?
For use with fine electronics I wanted to be sure the stuff was free of
any additives that might cause a problem. Besides, it's much more
convenient in the small tube and you don't use enough of it that cost is
a factor.
> > > Although I did not say that the vaseline wouldn't "suffice" in the light
> > > bulb screw shell situation, I'd like to point out that there are
> products
> > > that can be gotten at any HD or good hardware store that are better
> > > formulated and indeed safer (according to UL and CSA).
> >
> > Nope, those compounds are designed for wiring terminals and splices.
> > The ones that do any good contain a metal such as zinc to act as a
> > sacrificial anode. For the light bulb use they are no better or safer
> > than petrolatum, and they could possibly cause problems.
>
> A third natural question arises, if conductive greases are formulated
> differently from contact grease (which you have) why would conduction
> surfaces at splices and terminals need to be treated radically different
> from the screw shell contact points? Observing the different kinds of screw
> shells lately, some are made of brass, some steel alloys, some copper
> alloys, while the screw shell material of bulbs are of a dis-similar metal.
> Would not the application of conductive grease help reduce electrolysis in
> any such situation and is this not a situation which could have existed in
> the screw shell of the bathroom in question? In marine electrical work we
> assume that even within an alloy, that electrolysis (self corrosion) can
> occur under marine conditions (such as in the case of common red brass. Here
> zinc is most often used because of its freerer availability of electrons and
> hence in any moist or steamy situation zinc impregnated conductive grease
> may be of benefit in order to prevent the negative consequences of galvanic
> corrosion.
The conductive greases are intended primarily for difficult-to-connect
situations, such as aluminum to copper. Granted, the typical lightbulb
socket may represent an aluminum to brass situation, but the current
density is orders of magnitude less than, say, the service connection in
a 200 amp breaker panel. Also, though I take your word for it that the
"conductive" grease isn't really conductive, I would be leery of a trace
of the stuff across an insulator developing some conduction over time as
the metal dissolves in the grease or electrostatic forces align the
metal particles or whatever. When used for the breaker panel service
connection, eg, the grease is kept in a reasonably well-defined area,
but when smeared on a bulb (and, indirectly, into the socket) things are
less well-controlled.
> Lastly, can you point me to any data that indicates that conductive grease
> is corrosive or could cause problems and if so what kind of problems? This
> would be of benefit to help improve the results of my work. Thanks again for
> your well thought out response.
Don't have any, and wouldn't really think that corrosiveness would be a
problem with the greases. I have read that some of the contact greases
are actually so flammable that they can create a fire hazard, but I
don't know which ones fall into this category.
As I said, I use the pertrolatum (and also silicone "high voltage"
grease) in electronic equipment. One common use is to coat the edge
connectors of memory DIMMs, as bad connections in the memory sockets is
a common source of system failure. Given how close together the
connection lands are on a memory DIMM, any sort of conductive grease
would represent a danger of shorting the connections.
hitman
wrote:
snip
>If it you applied the grease completely around both contact points and it
>didn't conduct then how could current flow?
The film of vasoline does not interupt the contact from touching.
snip
>> The purpose of the grease (in addition to facilitating disassembly) is
>> to exclude air and moisture. It is the air and moisture that causes
>> connections to corrode.
>
>That is true, but incomplete. You are only addressing simple oxidation, not
>di-electric corrosion of metals due to arcing or disimilar outer shell
>electron properties.
We're talking lifght bulbs, not relay contacts.
>Although I did not say that the vaseline wouldn't "suffice" in the light
>bulb screw shell situation, I'd like to point out that there are products
>that can be gotten at any HD or good hardware store that are better
>formulated and indeed safer (according to UL and CSA).
>
>
__________________________________________
The more you own the more you have to fix!
Lin and Ron
Sebastian Fl, formerly NJ
(Maplewood, Neptune, Bricktown[Laurelton], Toms River)
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Greenlight
hitman <rspicerGA...@spacey.net> wrote in message
news:391639e1...@news.spacey.net...
> On Tue, 02 May 2000 04:21:17 GMT, "Greenlight" <saha...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
> snip
> >If it you applied the grease completely around both contact points and it
> >didn't conduct then how could current flow?
> The film of vasoline does not interupt the contact from touching.
> snip
Hmmm, what are you on...no body said that vaseline interupted the flow of
current did they? You missed the point, but with that attitude, I'll not
waste my time.
> We're talking lifght bulbs, not relay contacts.
Yes, son, I am speaking to the light bulb screw shells that got so corroded
that the bulbs got stuck and the glass shaterred. Now I am sharing (not with
you God forbid) there is a safer way out of this that is recognized in the
trade and approved by the NAED (yep you don't know who they are do you?)
But if you wish to beleive that galvanic action is not involved or that
vaseline is the best thing since the atom bomb, who am I (a jackboot
electrician of 30 years) to dare suggest some thing that contradicts your
"reality". I really don't care what you do with vaseline "hitman", but I do
care to put out information that I know is safe and works better. Why it is
that you feel that you have to attack some one who contradicts your belief,
speaks to your own insecurity only. You use the vaseline fine -- that is
your right! I'll continue to use and suggest what I think is better.
Greenlight
the thread did I). Rather it is desirable to keep these contact points
clean. Grease or especailly Vaseline would attract dust and dirt and
increase the arcing. Hermetically sealed relays are thus better. Normally
the best preventative treatment is to file down any pits or uneven spots (if
you have a pitted relay) and remove the source of moisture if present. If
one used any protective coating at all, it should be very light and not
sticky like Vaseline. There are special sprays that are available
commercially formulated for this purpose. Relay contact points are not very
different from the points of older cars. Use light grease or no grease at
all for the rotor/arm, but keep the contact points clean, unpitted, even,
and free of grease.
hitman <rspicerGA...@spacey.net> wrote in message
news:391639e1...@news.spacey.net...
> On Tue, 02 May 2000 04:21:17 GMT, "Greenlight" <saha...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
> snip
> >If it you applied the grease completely around both contact points and it
> >didn't conduct then how could current flow?
> The film of vasoline does not interupt the contact from touching.
> snip
> >> The purpose of the grease (in addition to facilitating disassembly) is
> >> to exclude air and moisture. It is the air and moisture that causes
> >> connections to corrode.
> >
> >That is true, but incomplete. You are only addressing simple oxidation,
not
> >di-electric corrosion of metals due to arcing or disimilar outer shell
> >electron properties.
> We're talking lifght bulbs, not relay contacts.
Hamm4fun
The vaseline works fine for light bulbs. One of the jobs I had in the early 70s
was working at a motel as night clerk, handyman ,maid, you-name-it. The motel
had a sign with a couple of hundred light bulbs and the restraunt across the
street had a matching sign. All the bulbs were exposed to the weather. It was
vaseline that kept the bulbs from corroding and was also the lubricant used on
the switching mechanism. I still use a lubricant on the lamps in my house but
now I use DC3, a silicon dielectric grease. I bought a tube about 10 years ago
and only about half is used now.
Greenlight
Hamm4fun <hamm...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000508221558...@ng-ch1.aol.com...