humbucker and coil split experience in this group
Chris
to neck problems, the weight of my Strat and Tele made me look for
something light, which I found between X-mas and new year. It wasn't
what I expected, but I bumped into an Ibanez AJD91. A rather
inexpensive, hollow body (light weight) guitar. The guy from the
guitar shop set it up very nicely, it plays like a dream. I have to
get used to the humbuckers though. Since I didn't spend too much cash
on the guitar, I'm considering to swap the stock PUs for some fancier
ones which also allow coil split. If anyone has experience with such
PUs, would you please mind to share? Thanks in advance! BTW, the stuff
I play is mainly pop and rock classics (John Hiatt, Rolling Stones,
Doobie Brothers, James Brown, Wild Cherry, Melissa Etheridge, Bryan
Adams, etc.), so no extremely hot heavy metal PUs advice required.
Cheers,
Chris
Claude V. Lucas
I did the coil split thing on a 'bucker equipped Strato.
One position sounds better than the other.
Guess which one I use most... :^)
I coulda saved the US$14 I spent on the pull-pot and
spent the time I spent installing it practicing.
YMMV.
Dr. Zontar
> Being a Fender nut, I was always happy to hear my single coil PUs. Due
> to neck problems, the weight of my Strat and Tele made me look for
> something light, which I found between X-mas and new year. It wasn't
> what I expected, but I bumped into an Ibanez AJD91. A rather
> inexpensive, hollow body (light weight) guitar. The guy from the
> guitar shop set it up very nicely, it plays like a dream. I have to
> get used to the humbuckers though. Since I didn't spend too much cash
> on the guitar, I'm considering to swap the stock PUs for some fancier
> ones which also allow coil split.
In my experience, split humbuckers never sounds as good as real single
coils. I've been meaning to check these out: http://store.guitarfetish.com/dr90husip90c.html.
They fit in guitars routed for 'buckers, but are P-90-style single
coils.
- Rich
Greendistantstar
Agree, but why is that so? Is it the proximity of the other coil?
GDS
"Let's roll!"
Mr. Green
I can't recommend a 'bucker with a good split sound however, I have a
tip for making the split position sound better. Instead of connecting
the tap directly to earth, try tapping it to earth via a capacitor.
Values between 0.022uF and 0.047uF work well.
I find the standard tapped sound is a bit thin and weak sounding,
particularly with medium and low output 'buckers. Using the cap means
you only tap the higher frequencies and leave a bit of extra bass from
the original two coil 'bucker sound.
Good luck, Green
jtees4
I've had a few guitars with split buckers...never liked any of them.
In fact when my push/pull pot broke on my Yamaha PAC620 I just wired
it so it stays in bucker mode instead of fixing the switch...woulda
never used it anyway.
****
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=789610
http://www.reviewmymusicnow.com
Wrong_Note_Rod
I split several different humbuckers, and results are varied. If you're
looking to get a really great, pure, clean sound, like from a very clean
single coil, thats gonna be difficult, in my opinion. However rio grande
makes a TallBoy Humbucker that might interest you.. this from their
website..
Tallboy Humbucking - A true humbucking for people who will not compromise
on the "single coil" mode of a standard humbucking type pickup. Fits a
conventional humbucking cavity but when split to one coil gives you the
sound of a "true" single coil. Why? ... because it is! This feature when
combined with a middle position single coil will give you the ultimate
"quack" tone in the #2 position of your 5-way switch. Sounds fantastic in
the full humbucking mode too! A greater harmonic range than a regular
bucker. Imagine the natural response of the perfect single coil buckerized!
I havent personally tried it, but i have a three of their other pickups,
which are excellent.
Stephen Cowell
"Claude V. Lucas" <cla...@sonic.net> wrote
> I did the coil split thing on a 'bucker equipped Strato.
>
> One position sounds better than the other.
>
> Guess which one I use most... :^)
>
> I coulda saved the US$14 I spent on the pull-pot and
> spent the time I spent installing it practicing.
On a Strat, you can set up the 5-way to auto-tap
the (bridge) HB... you want a single coil active
for back-quack, so have one coil ground out
when in that position (steal switch contacts
from the tone control side, just use one unified
tone). *Then* you can use the pull-pot to
turn on the bridge pickup at any time, as well
as ground out the *other* coil... now you've
got bridge+neck humbucking OOP and all 3
as well as single-coil bridge as options. Love it on
my Strat... wouldn't go back.
__
Steve
.
Stephen Cowell
"Greendistantstar" <Greendis...@iinet.net.au> wrote in message
news:_vqdnVqY1ZvKDtnW...@westnet.com.au...
It's the wimpiness of the coil... I'm using a DiMarzio FRED,
with one giant zombie coil... when I tap that bastard in, watch
out! Big sound.
__
Steve
.
Claude V. Lucas
I did the tap thing to my Hello Kitty which only has the one 'bucker...
I rarely pull the pot. The tapped coil doesn't really sound *bad*,
it just doesn't sound as good as the whole thing. I might try the
Mr Green cap-to-ground-on-the-tapped-coil trick at some point.
I came up with a different scheme for the three pickup version.
Neck & bridge wired on a Telecaster 4 way switch with the
middle one on a blender pot so I can add the quack into
whatever other combination sounds like it needs it.
Bruce Morgen
In my experience, I've
found it far better to
use a fully split
'bucker (rather than a
merely tapped one) and
to use a DPDT switch of
some sort (mini-toggle
or push-pull pot) to
switch between normal
humbucker (coils wired
in series) and putting
those two coils in
parallel. One coil of
a humbucker makes for a
very bad single-coil,
but a decent humbucker
can sound very good
with the coils wired in
parallel -- not quite
Fendery, but sort of in
the Gretsch Filtertron
ballpark, which is a
nice, useful tone imo.
Tony Done
"Chris" <chris...@vodafone.nl> wrote in message
news:0a3c2375-b8d2-4283...@m16g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
I've done the split coil thing a few times. You have two choices, switching
either to parallel or single coil from the normal series wiring in each
pickup. Both give a sound more like a single coil, but parallel is a bit
brighter and a little less output than single, and retains the humbucking
property. Neither sound exactly like a strat single coil because the
magnetic field is different. The Seymour Duncan JD is popular if you want OD
sounds from the bridge, and I think it sounds good in single or parallel
mode. I now have SD Jazz in both positions in my OLP bari, and they are
bright enough that I haven't felt the need for single or parallel switching.
If you go to single switching, I suggest that it selects the screw pole
coils of each pickup, so that you can adjust the poles to get good
string-to-string balance when playing clean. Also, decide where you want the
single coil side to be. I have them with the screw poles inwards so that
they are further away from the bridge and the end of the neck
Tony D
Squier
Hi Chris - here is a suggestion for you. And you won't need to install
any sort of push-pull or even need to tap the bucker.
Tapped humbuckers won't sound like single coils but might be close
enough for you. They sound like.. well... tapped humbuckers.
(For Gibson players this is close enough... for life long Fender single coil
players you'll know right away it isn't a true single coil sound)
Anyways - there are some downsides - a tapped humbucker will no longer
be humbucking. A tapped humbucker will produce single coil hum just like
a single coil. The 'in-between' position between that humbucker and
another pickup might also not be noiseless anymore - so keep that in mind.
Here is what I find works very well - (this only works for humbuckers with
4 or 5 wire leads. It won't work for humbuckers with only 2 wire leads).
The tip is: wire the humbucker as parallel rather than the normal series.
The humbucker wired up as parallel will have a much 'softer/chimier' sound
than the humbucker wired internally as series. Almost every humbucker out
there will be wired as series within a guitar.
Here is what to do: there are 4 leads coming from the humbucker (sometimes
there are 5 leads - the additional plain wire lead is just an extra ground wire).
Anyways - you will notice that as wired in series 2 of the wires are soldered
together and taped off. One of the wires is soldered to the pickup selector
switch (the hot wire) and one of the wires goes to ground to the back of a pot.
To wire in parallel - first determine the N<->S polarity of the wires.
Then you unconnect the 2 wires that were soldered off and taped together.
One of these will now join the 'hot' connection at the pickup switch.
Yes - there are now 2 wires connected to the same lug on the pup switch
for that humbucker. The other wire now goes to ground to join the other
ground wire from the humbucker. So wired in parallel you now have 2 hot
leads to the same pup switch position and 2 ground leads.
The benefits are: slightly reduced outpt, the parallel wired humbucker has
a much lighter/chimier tone and it still remains 'humbucking'. no hum.
I am a "Fender" person and also could not get used to playing with regular
humbuckers as series. So I wired them up as parallel and that was exactly
the type of sound I wanted from humbuckers and it fits well into the rest
of the single pickups when I switch pup positions. Now don't expect that
wiring in parallel will turn the humbucker into a single coil - but to me
it will get you a better 'feel' when playing and just lightens up the
harder series tones.
Obviously you can go all out and have all sorts of additional switches and
push pull pots installed that let you go from series to parallel to coil tap.
But a lot of times without any mods - just a slight wiring change - that humbucker
wired as parallel is all you need. Talk to a good guitar tech about changing
the pickup to wired as parallel rather than series and he or she should be
able to do the job in just a few minutes.
ok. that's my 2 cents.
TheChris
12df04...@m16g2000yqc.googlegroups.com:
Any interest in humbucker-sized P-90's??
--
Christopher Bell
http://www.myspace.com/bellboudreaux
______________________________
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Linux user #497844
TheChris
_vqdnVqY1ZvKDtnW...@westnet.com.au:
Yeah - why is that so? If you're turning off a coil - and lets face it,
humbuckers ARE two single coil pickups together - why does it not sound
good to you?
I've never done it since single coils are just not my cup of tea - but,
on paper...shouldn't it be identical?
Tony Done
> I've never done it since single coils are just not my cup of tea - but,
> on paper...shouldn't it be identical?
>
>
>
tried converting strat plastic bobbin pickups to P90 by replacing the alnico
slugs with screw poles and putting good ceramic bars on either side of the
screw poles. They sounded warmer than the original strat pickups.
Whether you like the sound or not is very subjective though. I would say
parallel or single could better for cleans, but series for OD - as with the
SD JB pickup.
Tony D
Restless Fingers Syndrome
> Being a Fender nut, I was always happy to hear my single coil PUs. Due
> to neck problems,
I've had split coils and eventually ended up
using the full mode .. esp on the bridge because
it cuts through the mix like no other can.
Kevin Collins
[snip]
+1 from me - I was also going to recommend the parallel option vs coil-tap.
Additionally, check out the GFS pickups (www.guitarfetish.com) - their
humbuckers are all 4-wire, and sound very nice (both in series and parallel). I
have two guitars with the "Alnico Fat Pat Boutique Humbucker" in the bridge and
they are really nice. They compare very nicely to the Ibanez IBZUSA (made by
DiMarzio) humbuckers from the late '80s - a bit brighter and a tad bit more
gain to my ears.
Kevin
RichL
I've never played a guitar with a tapped bucker pickup that sounded good
both as a single coil and a bucker. Period.
Now I've never tried the parallel coil arrangement that some of the
other folks talked about, so I can't comment directly about that. But I
think I'd have a problem with relative volume levels from the (normal
series) bucker and the parallel arrangement.
Tell you what though...it's not always the split coil that sucked.
Ex-brother-in-law had some Aria Pro something-or-other that I used to
play a lot and borrowed for gigs a couple of times. That had coil taps,
the buckers on it were muddy as hell but it sounded really good in
split-coil mode. Go figure.
Jim
I'd do a push/pull pot with both coils parallel option, rather than
split coil. It's just two single coils sitting next to each other --
without the hum.
Chris
All thanks for the extensive advice! Friday I'm off, but I won't open
the guitar as I've got a gig Friday night (don't "fix" what ain't
broken). The weekend will give us lots of snow and cold eastern
(Russian) wind, so that sounds like a good moment to stay in the
house, heat up the soldering iron, and see how my current humbuckes
sound in parallel. If I'm still not satisfied, I may try to get my
hands on a couple of DiMarzio Bluesbuckers, which seem to give me what
I want (at least on paper).
Cheers,
Chris
Mr. Green
>
> - Show quoted text -
It's pretty easy to explain why a muddy 'bucker produces a better
single coil sound. IMHO and after making a few pickups, I believe
several factoers effect the sound of a pickup:
Thickness of coil wire
Number of turns
Magnet strength
Magnet position
Effect the material in the core has on the coil inductance
Shape of the pickup bobbin
Most low to medium strength pickups use a similar thickness of wire
with a similar resistance. Less turns of wire, on a similar bobbin,
will give you less output and a brighter sound. A PAF style 'bucker
has less wire per coil than a strat single coil. a hot 'bucker has
more turns of wire on each bobbin so, when split it sound more like a
fender single coil.
Some reasons why a tapped gibson style 'bucker won't sound the same as
a fender single coil:
Different amount of wire on the coil
Fender coils are are taller and so more of the wire is closer to the
core. This makes them sound brighter and sharper.
Gibson use steel poles which reduce the treble output relative to the
alnico cores in a Fender single coil.
Fender pickups have a stronger magnetic field nearer to the strings.
This gives them a sharper attack.
Also, in theory, two coils wired in paralell should sound thinner and
brighter than just one of the coils tapped. Why a 'bucker wired in
parallel can sound softer than the tapped coil is, the two coils are
close to each other. This means there is some phase cancellation
between the two coils. This cuts the treble a bit, as it does in a
standard series wired 'bucker.
Tapping a 'bucker via a capacitor allows you to get the extra treble
which, is usually lost as the higher frequencies travel through the
secound coil (more resistance). The advantage is you keep some of the
stronger mids produced by the second coil. This makes up for the fact
that your medium output 'bucker has smaller individuals coils than a
standard strat pickup. The final sound will never be as biting as a
Fender pickup but, at least it still has some guts.
Green
Nil
I have a Schecter PT Goldtop, which is like a telecaster with
humbuckers. It came with cheap Korean-made "Duncan Designed" pickups. I
replaced the neck pickup with a Dimarzio, but I've kept the bridge
because, even though it doesn't have the greatest humbucker sound, the
split-coil mode is pretty decent. Not exactly like a great Tele bridge
pickup, but it has enough single-coil bite and transparency that it
fills the role when it needs to. It's a very versatile guitar, and I'm
afraid to replace the bridge pickup because I might lose some of that
versatility.
I wish I knew the magic formula, 'cause I'd like to set up my Yamaha
SG2000 with coil-splits.
RobSm
The main effect by a long way I've heard is a loss of volume when the
single coil is used.
IIRC Lindy Fralin makes a coilsplit humbucker to overcome this, bur I
haven't heard one.
On my Humbucker/spli o[ption DIY's I almost never use the single coil.
Good Luck,
Rob.
RobSm
<cab...@nospam.hotmail.com> wrote:
>Chris <chris...@vodafone.nl> wrote in news:0a3c2375-b8d2-4283-af10-
>12df04...@m16g2000yqc.googlegroups.com:
>
>> Being a Fender nut, I was always happy to hear my single coil PUs. Due
>> to neck problems, the weight of my Strat and Tele made me look for
>> something light, which I found between X-mas and new year. It wasn't
>> what I expected, but I bumped into an Ibanez AJD91. A rather
>> inexpensive, hollow body (light weight) guitar. The guy from the
>> guitar shop set it up very nicely, it plays like a dream. I have to
>> get used to the humbuckers though. Since I didn't spend too much cash
>> on the guitar, I'm considering to swap the stock PUs for some fancier
>> ones which also allow coil split. If anyone has experience with such
>> PUs, would you please mind to share? Thanks in advance! BTW, the stuff
>> I play is mainly pop and rock classics (John Hiatt, Rolling Stones,
>> Doobie Brothers, James Brown, Wild Cherry, Melissa Etheridge, Bryan
>> Adams, etc.), so no extremely hot heavy metal PUs advice required.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Chris
>
>Any interest in humbucker-sized P-90's??
I second that idea...I have Seymour Duncan Phat Cats and I like them a
lot.
And there is the option to change to almost anything if I ever felt so
inclined.
boardjunkie
>
> - Show quoted text -
+1. They use alnico rod magnets which *real* strat p-ups also use.
Thats the key to getting that stratty tone....nothing else does it.
Mr. Green
> Nil wrote:
>
> On 06 Jan 2010, Chris <chris_le...@vodafone.nl> wrote in alt.guitar:
>
> > Being a Fender nut, I was always happy to hear my single coil PUs.
> > Due to neck problems, the weight of my Strat and Tele made me look
> > for something light, which I found between X-mas and new year. It
> > wasn't what I expected, but I bumped into an Ibanez AJD91. A
> > rather inexpensive, hollow body (light weight) guitar. The guy
> > from the guitar shop set it up very nicely, it plays like a dream.
> > I have to get used to the humbuckers though. Since I didn't spend
> > too much cash on the guitar, I'm considering to swap the stock PUs
> > for some fancier ones which also allow coil split. If anyone has
> > experience with such PUs, would you please mind to share? Thanks
> > in advance! BTW, the stuff I play is mainly pop and rock classics
> > (John Hiatt, Rolling Stones, Doobie Brothers, James Brown, Wild
> > Cherry, Melissa Etheridge, Bryan Adams, etc.), so no extremely hot
> > heavy metal PUs advice required.
>
> pole pieces from the pickups to obtain a fat single coil tone.
>
> I have done this to both my Ibanez ArtCore (semihollow) and a Fernandes
> Jazzmaster clone (solidbody), as both had neck humbuckers which were
> extremely muddy and dark sounding. Removing the pole pieces made these
> positions sound much lighter and better articulated, with a sweet
> single coil sound.
>
> The other bonus is they're still basically noise-free :-)
>
> As with everything, YMMV. It worked for me.
>
> --
> Usenet Improvement Project:http://twovoyagers.com/improve-usenet.org/
> XPN 1.2.6 <-> Leafnode 1.11.7.rc1 | Kernel 2.6.30.9-generic
Now that's something I've never tried. You've got me thinking now.
Green
Jim
The "Duncan Designed" sounds better than a split coil real Seymour
Duncan? Or you're reluctant to change because you're afraid you won't
get as good of a result?
I run a "variable split" on a JB in a Les Paul. The push/pull on that
setup puts the tone control as a variable resistor between the "tap" and
ground. So you can get (virtually) full split coil, or dial back in as
much of the bucking coil as you need. It's a useful setup, you can hear
the hum dropping, as the tone changes from single coil to humbucker.
You get to decide how much hum you can live with.
But my favorite way to set them up is both coils parallel. I have a 335
type with Jazz/JB set up that way, and an SG with the bridge Seymour
Duncan Distortion set up like that. No hum, good single coil tone. On
that SG, I moved the bridge '59 to the neck. The extra output matches
better with the high output Distortion.
Nil
alt.guitar:
> The "Duncan Designed" sounds better than a split coil real Seymour
> Duncan? Or you're reluctant to change because you're afraid you
> won't get as good of a result?
Yes. It sounds good now, so there's no need to fuck with it. My
experience is that it's a gamble, and no pickup can be relied upon to
give the same results as another, not even different samples of the
same.