Gig Kits: What's In Yours?
Jim Carr
different stuff I have on me at gigs and rehearsals. Maybe I'm just the
exception, but I like to be prepared.
I have a briefcase I keep in my car at all times. I gig or rehearse at least
once a week, but it's not like I'm a pro or anything. However, it's not a
burden to keep this stuff in my car just in case. Here's what's in mine.
What do other people carry? Or do you carry anything like this at all?
* Cords of varying lengths. Each cord has a label on it with its length (I
used white medical tape and a Sharpie), which makes it easy to find what you
want when you're in a hurry or have to send someone else looking for it.
* Balanced cables for running direct.
* Adapter for balanced to 1/4" TRS.
* Mono and stereo patch cables.
* RCA cables.
* Various adapters other adapters.
* Spare 9V, AA, and AAA batteries.
* Phillips and slotted screwdrivers including really small versions.
* Wire cutters and pliers.
* Pack of Allen wrenches
* Small flashlight.
* Soldering iron and solder.
* Foam ball for a mic.
* Mic adapter with clip.
* Six foot extension cord with multiple sockets on the end.
* Spare power cord for an amp.
* Excedrin. Not only does it have two types of painkillers, but it also
contains caffeine for those late night drives home.
* Allergy meds. Even if you don't have allergies, somebody else will.
Besides, they help with bee stings and the like.
* Imonium AD (anti-diarrheal). This was a *real* lifesaver once.
* Rolaids.
* Breath mints.
* Band-aids and first aid spray.
I would say that at one time or another I've used or loaned almost every one
of these items except the soldering iron. In my younger days I used to go
camping a lot, so I kept a similar kit in my trunk. It really doesn't take
up that much space, but it can be a real life saver. If nothing else it's
great leaving for a gig knowing that as long as I have a bass, amp, and
cabinet, I don't have to worry if I forgot something I might need. It's also
great knowing that if somebody else forgot something or has a dead battery,
I have them covered.
Mike Rieves
"Jim Carr" <newsg...@azwebpages.com> wrote in message
news:iF%gi.1995$%K1....@newsfe21.lga...
thing I would add is a small volt/ohm meter. That's close to what I carried
back when I was running sound for bands, and about the same kit I kept at
the club for emergencies. Of all the musicians I know, I only know a couple
who carry a kit like that, some of the guitar and bass players I know don't
even carry extra strings!
Jim Carr
news:i20hi.3064$K9....@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
> That sounds like what every musician should carry, but few do. The only
> thing I would add is a small volt/ohm meter. That's close to what I
> carried back when I was running sound for bands, and about the same kit I
> kept at the club for emergencies. Of all the musicians I know, I only know
> a couple who carry a kit like that, some of the guitar and bass players I
> know don't even carry extra strings!
Good point. I forgot to mention that I carry spare strings. I used to carry
a multimeter, but now it's in the house because I was using it for
something. You just reminded me to put it back. If I needed one in the house
on a regular basis, I'd buy a second one. I know some folks can't afford all
this stuff - that's just life. So next time you change your strings, put the
old ones back in the packaging and put it in your case. I should also note
that I have *never* broken a bass string while playing (knock on wood), but
I've broken guitar strings far too often to remember.
Maybe I am just different. When I was in Swampcooler we fired the sound guy,
and I started handling it. I took the mixer and rack home with me one
weekend. I straightened out the cabling, then labeled all of the cables on
both ends. For example, one pair of cables was labeled "Mixer ST Out L" and
"Mixer ST Out R" and the other end "Power Amp L" and "Power Amp R". This way
if I needed somebody to help me, I could just hand them a cable and point
them in the general direction. If a cable accidentally fell out, I could
look at the label and know where it went rather than have to trace it back
to the source. Setup went a LOT faster that way. It only took me an hour one
evening.
Jim Carr
> Setup went a LOT faster that way. It only took me an hour one evening.
What I mean is that it only took an hour to label all the cords. Setting up
for a gig took only a few minutes.
murk
> What do other people carry? Or do you carry anything like this at all?
Yes:
* Cords of varying lengths.
* Various adapters other adapters.
* Spare 9V, AA, and AAA batteries.
* Phillips and slotted screwdrivers including really small versions.
* Wire cutters and pliers.
* Small flashlight.
* Soldering iron and solder.
* Extension cord with multiple sockets on the end.
* Spare power cord for an amp.
Plus:
* strings
* multi meter
* tape!
* spare pair of pants
Every band needs a member that's anal about carying stuff that *might* come
in handy. There must be a psychologic reason why that usually is the bass
player :)
Mark
Jim Carr
news:5ejl9oF...@mid.individual.net...
> Every band needs a member that's anal about carying stuff that *might*
> come in handy. There must be a psychologic reason why that usually is the
> bass player :)
LOL! I usually carry a spare shirt to a gig, but not pants. I should
probably add it.
Mike Rieves
> "Mike Rieves" <mr...@hotspam.com> wrote in message
> news:i20hi.3064$K9....@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
>
>> That sounds like what every musician should carry, but few do. The only
>> thing I would add is a small volt/ohm meter. That's close to what I
>> carried back when I was running sound for bands, and about the same kit I
>> kept at the club for emergencies. Of all the musicians I know, I only
>> know a couple who carry a kit like that, some of the guitar and bass
>> players I know don't even carry extra strings!
>
> Good point. I forgot to mention that I carry spare strings. I used to
> carry a multimeter, but now it's in the house because I was using it for
> something. You just reminded me to put it back. If I needed one in the
> house on a regular basis, I'd buy a second one. I know some folks can't
> afford all this stuff - that's just life. So next time you change your
> strings, put the old ones back in the packaging and put it in your case. I
> should also note that I have *never* broken a bass string while playing
> (knock on wood), but I've broken guitar strings far too often to remember.
I picked up a second cheap digital volt/ohm meter on sale at Sears for
fifteen bucks, it's small and works fine for carrying in a gig bag.
> Maybe I am just different. When I was in Swampcooler we fired the sound
> guy, and I started handling it. I took the mixer and rack home with me one
> weekend. I straightened out the cabling, then labeled all of the cables on
> both ends. For example, one pair of cables was labeled "Mixer ST Out L"
> and "Mixer ST Out R" and the other end "Power Amp L" and "Power Amp R".
> This way if I needed somebody to help me, I could just hand them a cable
> and point them in the general direction. If a cable accidentally fell out,
> I could look at the label and know where it went rather than have to trace
> it back to the source. Setup went a LOT faster that way. It only took me
> an hour one evening.
That's the only way to go. I always did that when I was running sound, and
I did the house PAs at the clubs the same way, it made it much easier when
changing the setup for different bands. I highly recommend that all bands do
that.
Mike Rieves
Speaking of pants, one of my singer buddies was in the restroom at a club
one night, when the guy next to him pissing, turned around and said, "Hey,
you sing in the band, don't you?", while he was still pissing, all over my
buddy's pants. Fortuately, it was a local gig and he called his wife and got
here to run a pair of pants out to the club. To this day, he still carries a
change of clothes with him to every gig. :-)
js
power strip
spare cord - maybe
Leatherman - maybe
Extra D and G strings if it's an outdoor gig in the summer and I'm thumpin.
AAA card
--
Check out my band, West Eats Meat http://www.myspace.com/westeatsmeat
My Homepage, Back By Popular Demand: http://www.jmsjazz.com
"I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it
comes out."
- Bill Hicks
"Jim Carr" <newsg...@azwebpages.com> wrote in message
news:iF%gi.1995$%K1....@newsfe21.lga...
Frederic Gelinas
> Every band needs a member that's anal about carying stuff that might
> come in handy. There must be a psychologic reason why that usually is
> the bass player :)
In my main band, it's the drummer who's like that. He also owns the
PA. His 10 feet trailer is just full of stuff.
--
Frederic Gelinas
Frederic Gelinas
stuff. The chick singer has all of this in her purse anyway.
The only real thing I am missing, is a spare bass.
At the last gig I did, my strap broke. I was proud to say to others
that I had found a place where the straps were dams cheap: well I
finally paid for it when the bass fell on the floor. No damage to the
bass, but I had to finish the first set sitting. I didn't have a spare
strap! Just forgot to bring it. During the break, I managed to tie it
in some way to finish the gig.
I heard it before in agb: if anything is crucial for the gig, bring two!
--
Frederic Gelinas
BW
wrote:
The only things I DON"T bring, and probably should for some gigs, is a
spare bass and head. Come to think of it, also don't bring a soldering
iron, but spares of everything else. Once had to splice on a new 9V
connector cable for an active bass. Had spares. Certainly wires,
batteries, tools, strings, clip-on light, etc. At one time I carried a
spare mic - twenty years old, beat up, crappy to begin with, and used
it mostly for when the stupid bandleader would say over the PA, "And
now (that drunk at the bar) is gonna come up and sing a song" then,
off-mic to me, "Barry, can he use your mic?" Yeah, the piece of shit
one that never ever touches my lips. I was the fastest mic-switcher
you ever saw. For some reason, I'm not often in that situation
anymore. Thankfully.
ptooner
> different stuff I have on me at gigs and rehearsals. Maybe I'm just the
> exception, but I like to be prepared.
>
> I have a briefcase I keep in my car at all times. I gig or rehearse at
> least once a week, but it's not like I'm a pro or anything. However, it's
> not a burden to keep this stuff in my car just in case. Here's what's in
> mine. What do other people carry? Or do you carry anything like this at
> all?
Amazingly enough, my truck was broken into yesterday and my backpack which
serves the purpose was stolen. So, I've been trying to list what was in it.
Some of my spares (like strings) go in my bass case so I'm not identical but
here's what's different:
>
> * Cords of varying lengths. Each cord has a label on it with its length (I
> used white medical tape and a Sharpie), which makes it easy to find what
> you want when you're in a hurry or have to send someone else looking for
> it.
I don't have the lengths on the cords.
> * Balanced cables for running direct.
> * Adapter for balanced to 1/4" TRS.
> * Mono and stereo patch cables.
> * RCA cables.
> * Various adapters other adapters.
> * Spare 9V, AA, and AAA batteries.
> * Phillips and slotted screwdrivers including really small versions.
I have a Leatherman type multitool instead.
> * Wire cutters and pliers.
leatherman
> * Pack of Allen wrenches
no
> * Small flashlight.
no
> * Soldering iron and solder.
> * Foam ball for a mic.
> * Mic adapter with clip.
> * Six foot extension cord with multiple sockets on the end.
that one stays in the truck
> * Spare power cord for an amp.
> * Excedrin. Not only does it have two types of painkillers, but it also
> contains caffeine for those late night drives home.
I keep Advil
> * Allergy meds. Even if you don't have allergies, somebody else will.
> Besides, they help with bee stings and the like.
> * Imonium AD (anti-diarrheal). This was a *real* lifesaver once.
I think I'll add this one.
> * Rolaids.
> * Breath mints.
> * Band-aids and first aid spray
I keep finger tip bandaids, no spray..
>
Other stuff includes:
* Behringer comp pedal
* two di adapters (xlr to 1/4)
*Mike cable
*two expensive pens and a small notebook
*Mp3 player/recorder
*Band music book,
*Spectacles
I keep all the above in an innocuous looking backpack which I hope looks
worthless. (apparently not) The most valuable thing I lost was the damned
glasses. New, and around $500. They also got the XM radio out of the
truck, but I had a spare. They left the rubber gloves they used to avoid
fingerprints at the scene, so the cop says there is a good chance they'll
get prints from them. The real pisser is the cop told me I could have shot
them if I'd caught them. It seems that they were definitely armed because
they had gotten a gun from the car they hit just before mine. Damn!!
Gerry
ptooner
"Frederic Gelinas" <frederic...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ii7hi.112417$Y_.5...@read1.cgocable.net...
>I bring almost all of that you listed. Except maybe of the pharmacy
> stuff. The chick singer has all of this in her purse anyway.
>
> The only real thing I am missing, is a spare bass.
I do carry one. ;-) I also carry a spare strap. I don't THINK I'm anal??
Gerry
ptooner
"BW" <barryb...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1183123757....@k29g2000hsd.googlegroups.com...
Damn I'm glad you mentioned that!! I had two spare mikes in that bag that
was stolen yesterday and I didn't list them in the police report.
Gerry
>
Stronger Than Dirt (John)
- Extra cables
- Strings
- Multi-tip screwdriver
- Precission screwdriver
- Wire cutters
- Adjustable wrench
- Earplugs
- Straps
- Batteries: AA & 9 volt
- Fan
- Superglue: for finger cuts
Adapters, meters, extra cables and additional tools are in the band's
"magic bag" carried by our guitarist.
I've grown too lazy to carry a second bass (or a hard case for that
matter).
suds mcduff
> The guys in my new band have teased me a few times about all of the
> different stuff I have on me at gigs and rehearsals. Maybe I'm just the
> exception, but I like to be prepared.
>
> I have a briefcase I keep in my car at all times. I gig or rehearse at least
> once a week, but it's not like I'm a pro or anything. However, it's not a
> burden to keep this stuff in my car just in case. Here's what's in mine.
> What do other people carry? Or do you carry anything like this at all?
>
> * Cords of varying lengths. Each cord has a label on it with its length (I
> used white medical tape and a Sharpie), which makes it easy to find what you
> want when you're in a hurry or have to send someone else looking for it.
> * Balanced cables for running direct.
----Haven't had to run direct yet, but I still carry my DI box.
> * Adapter for balanced to 1/4" TRS.
> * Mono and stereo patch cables.
> * RCA cables.
> * Various adapters other adapters.
> * Spare 9V, AA, and AAA batteries.
> * Phillips and slotted screwdrivers including really small versions.
> * Wire cutters and pliers.
> * Pack of Allen wrenches
> * Small flashlight.
-----Without doubt the handiest item, besides duct tape. I carry a
maglight on a sheath on my belt, usually it's covered by my shirt.
I've bailed the drummer out several times when fastners came off his
kit mid-set., last gig he punctured the kick head, and taped it mid
set.
> * Soldering iron and solder.
> * Foam ball for a mic.
> * Mic adapter with clip.
> * Six foot extension cord with multiple sockets on the end.
------I carry a 100' ext cord on a reel, and multiple taps.
> * Spare power cord for an amp.
> * Excedrin. Not only does it have two types of painkillers, but it also
> contains caffeine for those late night drives home.
-----No doze in mine.....
> * Allergy meds. Even if you don't have allergies, somebody else will.
> Besides, they help with bee stings and the like.
> * Imonium AD (anti-diarrheal). This was a *real* lifesaver once.
----Yup, same here
> * Rolaids.
> * Breath mints.
-----Altoids
> * Band-aids and first aid spray.
----I keep a first aid kit in the truck.
Guitarmakermark
Jim,
Hear-Hear on the Immodium.....it is indeed a lifesaver when you need
it!!!
The only thing that seems to be missing from your kit is the
condoms.........
lol
Mark
Frederic Gelinas
> The only thing that seems to be missing from your kit is the
> condoms.........
Can be lifesaving. I personnaly take a picture of my wife. That's
enough to make me speed-packing my rig and getting home to wake her up.
--
Frederic Gelinas
Jay S
KRAZY GLUE!!!
I've fixed fingers and nuts with it before shows.
(My fingers, my bass nut)
Jay S
Jim Carr
news:ci8hi.9410$Qz4....@bignews2.bellsouth.net...
>> * Imonium AD (anti-diarrheal). This was a *real* lifesaver once.
>
> I think I'll add this one.
I highly recommend it. The time I needed it the stuff locked up my sphincter
tighter than it would be my first night in prison.
Jim Carr
news:6xbhi.25$Io4.6@edtnps89...
> KRAZY GLUE!!!
> I've fixed fingers and nuts with it before shows.
> (My fingers, my bass nut)
That's a good suggestion. It takes up almost no room. Believe it or not,
I've never had a cut on my finger like that before. I've been blessed/cursed
with soft, supple skin. Sort of like my wife's supple pouting breasts that
sit up and beg for attention. :-) Seriously, though, I get calluses, but
they remain soft. I've noticed on other people they are dry and sometimes
get sliced. I've never lost a callus. Even my feet are soft. My wife says I
have sissy feet.
The downside to this kind of skin is that if my fingers get really dry, I
find it more difficult to play. Lane recommends washing your hands with warm
water and soap before a gig. If I did that all of the oils would come off,
and my fingers would feel all wrong on the strings. The other downside is
that my strings get full of dirt and grime more quickly.
I know...more information than you wanted to hear.
Jim Carr
news:1183135242.4...@d30g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>> * Imonium AD (anti-diarrheal). This was a *real* lifesaver once.
> Hear-Hear on the Immodium.....it is indeed a lifesaver when you need
> it!!!
You know, it sounds like a stupid thing to carry with you, but in all
seriousness, if you need it, you REALLY need it.
> The only thing that seems to be missing from your kit is the
> condoms.........
You obviously haven't seen a picture of me. I consider my looks the best
form of birth control I could ever have!
Brian Running
> form of birth control I could ever have!
Yet another thing we have in common! This is getting spooky.
Misifus
I keep most of that stuff either in my gig bag or in my car. I have one
other item I value, one of those little plug in testers to check for
proper power and grounds on unfamiliar stages. I've seen some amps
fried due to wiring problems. Heck, even a missing ground can add a lot
of noise if nothing else.
Other than that, it's a good list; better than good, it's great.
-Ra
--
Misifus-
Rafael Seibert
mailto:rafse...@suddenlink.net
blog: http://rafsrincon.blogspot.com/
Photos: http://www.flickr.com/photos/rafiii
home: http://www.rafandsioux.com
col.st...@gmail.com
I don't carry *all* of that (simply because I hadn't thought of them),
although an extra mic cable I happened to have with me got another
band out of trouble. Never throught of the OTC drugs, either. I do,
however, now carry a small tool kit. That's even helped me out of the
office.
Good work. Thanks; I very much appreciate it.
Starbuck
Larry Shaw
spare lead for my own mike.
spare guitar lead (cord).
bottle/can opener
tuner.
spare power lead for amp'(s)
"Jim Carr" <newsg...@azwebpages.com> wrote in message
news:iF%gi.1995$%K1....@newsfe21.lga...
Susan
> The guys in my new band have teased me a few times about all of the
> different stuff I have on me at gigs and rehearsals. Maybe I'm just the
> exception, but I like to be prepared.
>
> I have a briefcase I keep in my car at all times. I gig or rehearse at least
> once a week, but it's not like I'm a pro or anything. However, it's not a
> burden to keep this stuff in my car just in case. Here's what's in mine.
> What do other people carry? Or do you carry anything like this at all?
The only thing I haven't seen on the list that was recommeneded to me is
toothpicks. In case your strap pins or something come loose, or if
you're eating spinach dip:-)
I've carried a little flashlight in my purse forever. It's come in handy
on many occasions. (For those of you who wonder what women cart around
with them all day long.)
-Susan
Neil N
> The guys in my new band have teased me a few times about all of the
> different stuff I have on me at gigs and rehearsals. Maybe I'm just the
> exception, but I like to be prepared.
>
> I have a briefcase I keep in my car at all times. I gig or rehearse at least
> once a week, but it's not like I'm a pro or anything. However, it's not a
> burden to keep this stuff in my car just in case. Here's what's in mine.
> What do other people carry? Or do you carry anything like this at all?
>
"Justin Case" on bass gigs.
Rather minimal.
Extra cable or two,
Spare strings (but I've only needed a spare once in 20 years)
25' 14 guage ac extension, ends in a quad box.
Mag light
AC tester.
There's usually a spare mic and a few cables hanging around in my
vehicle.
I can't recall having come across any critical situations where the
above didn't suffice, or I couldn't improvise.
Now, for sound work I've built a rolling 5 drawer tool box out of an
old power rack. Very handy, rolls into the truck with the sound
system. I equip it with everything imaginable, I use it both on
location, or here in my shop. It really has simplified life. Dozen
different types of tape, including painter's masking tape, which is
perfect for labelling on the short term and blocking the stage, true
gaff tape and muliple coloured electrical tape. Sharpies. Complete set
of hand tools, mainly pliers and screwdrivers of every size and
configuration.Cordless drill with spare battery and charger, mutiple
bits. Soldering iron, heatshrink, lighter. Half dozen of each and
every connector in my rig, full battery complement, cable ties,
maglight and snakelight, and of course multimeter. Every "Gozinta"
connector, and turnaround possible.
Almost forgot, bug repellent. Very important. As already mentioned;
also Pepto Bismal. Greatly appreciated when you do need it and you're
on a 16 hour gig.
I always skip the chicken wings with that in mind...
ptooner
"Susan" <s...@freeshell.org> wrote in message
news:qMzhi.27572$tL1....@newsfe22.lga...
I've often wondered how a woman can get such an incredible amount of stuff
in their purses. Especially since the same woman couldn't pack a suitcase
if her life depended on it. Truly amazing. My wife's cell phone rang in
her purse the other day when she was in the shower. There is no way I could
find it in time to avoid it going to voice mail.
Gerry
Mike Rieves
I'd add safety pins too, you never know when someone is going to have a
wardrobe malfunction and a safety pin or two can keep things together until
other arrangements can be made. We kept several behind the bar for that
purpose.
Susan
> I've often wondered how a woman can get such an incredible amount of stuff
> in their purses. Especially since the same woman couldn't pack a suitcase
> if her life depended on it. Truly amazing. My wife's cell phone rang in
> her purse the other day when she was in the shower. There is no way I could
> find it in time to avoid it going to voice mail.
>
> Gerry
It's all part of the plan to confuse you men....
Or us women. Seriously, no matter what size the purse, it fills up. So I
have a little bitty one, less strain on the shoulders*. I'll have to ask
the security guard at work what's in it when he x-rays it on Monday. All
I know is that I have a small flashlight, which really is useful. And
quarters, which are also really useful. And this lamp. And this paddle
ball game. And this ash tray. That's all I need...
-Susan
*Now you know why women bassists don't complain about heavy basses.
Years of training from an early age.
RichL
I get a kick out of my daughter, who's now living with me after a few years
on her own. Her purse will be sitting on a nearby table, her cell phone
will start ringing, she'll rush over to it, and it will still go to voice
mail before she can dig through all the crap and get to it.
OTOH my stuff is just strewn everywhere. At least hers is confined to a
specific area!
Mogens V.
> I'd add safety pins too, you never know when someone is going to have a
> wardrobe malfunction and a safety pin or two can keep things together until
> other arrangements can be made. We kept several behind the bar for that
> purpose.
So true. I was a freelance photographer way back, and always kept sewing
needles and sorts in the camera bag, and what happened? The bride had
her expensive white dress torn. Bet they were happy I had it.
Ha! Really opened the eyes on a few chicks. A dude with sewing stuff! He
must be the sensitive type. Nearly got myself a bride wannabe :-D
--
Kind regards,
Mogens V.
Tim Holding
out with set up and tear down sits in my car 24/7. As some have said,
some of this stuff comes in very useful even outside of gigs:
-Small sewing kit (3 needles, various color thread, small buttons and
safety pins)
-Ear Plugs
-Duct Tape (black, silver and clear)
-Batteries of all descriptions.
-Nail clippers (includes small scissors and a knife)
-Flick-knife (the legal kind)
-Full screw driver kits, both full sizes and jeweler sized
-10mm and an adjustable spanner (10mm is there from my rowing days and
i can never bring myself to part with it)
-Ropes
-Various OTC medications
-First Aid kit
ptooner
"RichL" <rple...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4umdnQBL3v6QpBrb...@comcast.com...
Know what you mean. I lived in europe for a few years where men carry
purses and I can tell you it's a wonderful thing. Here our pockets are
always jammed and bulging and we still don't have what we need. Due to back
problems, I was advised some years ago to never put my wallet in a hip
pocket where I had carried it for years. Now I have my wallet (too big no
matter how many times you trim it down) in one front pocket and my cell
phone in the other. Then where do I put my keys?? Or my Pen?? or my
penknife? Speaking of keys, nearly everybody has two cars and at least cars
and most of them have an electronic fob as well as one or more keys. Then
you have at least one house key. It helps a little that the new cars are
going over to combination key and fob like MB has had for years. Anyway,
what do you do with all that crap? Here in Florida we usually don't have
shirt pockets or even jackets so it really does become a problem. Now you
know why I'm always losing my glasses. I don't have any place to put them.
Gerry
>
>
ptooner
"Mike Rieves" <mr...@hotspam.com> wrote in message
news:dcFhi.15760$p7....@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
Aw, you know you can fix anything with gaffer tape. I could tell some tales
about that, but I'll pass at the moment. Suffice it to say that I was in
broadcast tv in the live days. ;-)
Gerry
>
RichL
Well, in my case the problem is partially solved because I don't tend to
carry a lot with me when I go out. I don't have a cell phone to begin with,
keys and wallet contents trimmed to bare minimum, etc.
Now the glasses are a different story. Until the past couple of years I've
never needed them for general use, just for reading. So it's been
interesting adapting, and yeah, I can never find them. I wound up bringing
an extra pair to the office just in case I've forgotten my regular pairs
when I leave home. But that's more a symptom of "old-timer's disease" than
anything else.
Misifus
This is why they make little holsters for cell phones that fasten around
the purse strap. Prima facie case that women can't find their cell
phones at all.
-Raf (my wife could hide a baby elephant in some of her purses)
Mike Rieves
in Nashville when it first opened and I know exactly what you mean.
Kloka-mo'
--
-rob Bartlett, TN
O>
/(\)
^^
Lane Baldwin
The original article is here:
http://www.basssessions.com/dec03/gigbag.html
The second article is here (scroll down to Creating the Ultimate Gig Bag):
http://www.eden-electronics.com/info/articles/index.asp
Keep Thumpin', Lane...
Ask not what bass can do for you...Ask what YOU can do for bass.
www.laneonbass.com | www.myspace.com/lanebaldwin
www.deeperblues.com | www.myspace.com/deeperblues
www.basstalkradio.com | www.myspace.com/basstalkradio
www.eden-electronics.com | www.myspace.com/edenelectronics
"Jim Carr" <newsg...@azwebpages.com> wrote in message
news:iF%gi.1995$%K1....@newsfe21.lga...
> The guys in my new band have teased me a few times about all of the
> different stuff I have on me at gigs and rehearsals. Maybe I'm just the
> exception, but I like to be prepared.
>
> I have a briefcase I keep in my car at all times. I gig or rehearse at
> least once a week, but it's not like I'm a pro or anything. However, it's
> not a burden to keep this stuff in my car just in case. Here's what's in
> mine. What do other people carry? Or do you carry anything like this at
> all?
>
Jim Carr
news:28Qii.18136$2v1....@newssvr14.news.prodigy.net...
> I've written about this twice:
>
> The original article is here:
> http://www.basssessions.com/dec03/gigbag.html
I read your article. You said diaphragm, screws and nuts. Heh heh.
Mogens V.
Nothing worse than how Lexicon named preset in older models:
The LXP-5 has "Ho Drum", "Ganged Echo" and "Body Snatchers" presets.
Now, if that ain't porn, I dunno what is!
Lane Baldwin
Well, ... uhm... last time I ... uh... screwed a lady with a diaphragm...
uh... nah.... ain't workin'.
Never mind.
I got nothin'...
Benj
Susan wrote:
> I've carried a little flashlight in my purse forever. It's come in handy
> on many occasions. (For those of you who wonder what women cart around
> with them all day long.)
Yes, a nearby woman with one of those large purses would mean you need
NO gig kit at all. Need a 7/16 socket wrench? No problem, just dig
into the old purse! :-) I've got a little tiny LED flashlight on my
keychain at all times. TOTAL lifesaver on MANY occasions.
For bass I take a slightly different approach (the exception being
large gigs) I try to make EACH bass case self-contained. Therefore I
gather together ALL the tools (allen wrenches, screw drivers,
whatever) needed to adjust THAT particular bass. Thus whatever the
problem the tools are there to fix it. And I also include whatever
else the bass might need, including an extra set of strings of the
kind I use on THAT bass, and batteries for THAT bass and a cheap tuner
and also a bass stand. For my main axes I've modified the cases to
take one of those fold-up "Ultimate" stands. Nice. For lesser basses I
just throw one of those cheapie floor-level stands in there so that
even if you forget a stand you still don't have to lean the bass in a
corner or against the wall. Each case has it's own bass strap that
goes with THAT bass. I use strap locks so toothpicks are not required.
Each case usually has TWO guitar cords "just in case". The main idea
is I can grab a given bass, drive to the gig and NOT go, "Oh crap I
don't have a cord, or a stand, or a strap, or can't install a new
battery", or anything else. My main axes even have a little DI in
there too. Mostly I use those cheapo "guitar research" rectangular
hard cases and there is plenty of room in there for all this stuff. On
a DI gig I just grab the case and go. Makes me feel like a horn
player!
Of course for the "big gig" I have a tool box with all the usual stuff
in it. One interesting thing I've got is this plastic partitioned box
that is filled with cable adapters, rack screws, cable ties and other
stuff. It's a commercial thing called a "Gig Box" and I have NO idea
where I bought it. I even amplified the contents a bit with even MORE
adapters and useful cable and rack stuff. Can be a total lifesaver
when dealing with sound systems. If you see one around somewhere I
highly recommend getting it.
Benj
Lane Baldwin
"Benj" <bja...@iwaynet.net> wrote in message
news:1183700515....@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
This is very similar to how I do it now, as well. I've been collecting those
zipper pouches to put all the tools, strings and batteries in, and that goes
into the front pocket of the gig bag. I also have a small single shoulder
backpack for cords, though, and carry this to all gigs.
But, yeah, for gigs out of town, the whole big box comes along.
-
Neil N
> "Lane Baldwin" <l...@laneonbass.comSPAM.com> wrote in message
How did I miss that one ... Do you like your buns toasted?
Jim Carr
news:1183700515....@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
> Benj
You know I feel *really* cheated when I read some long post by you but don't
get the "Benj (Who <insert cleverness here)" signature signature.
col.st...@gmail.com
> in their purses. Especially since the same woman couldn't pack a suitcase
> if her life depended on it. Truly amazing. My wife's cell phone rang in
> her purse the other day when she was in the shower. There is no way I could
> find it in time to avoid it going to voice mail.
I will be on my death bed and never be able to answer that question.
But stuff like cell phones should be in easily accessible outside
pockets. Other important items like car keys, house keys and hand-held
videogame systems should be in those easily accessible outside pockets
as well :-)
Then again, we women should learn not to stuff too much stuff in said
easily accessible outside pockets. I actually have one where I don't -
one pocket for Nintendo DS, one for keys/cell phone, one for
prescription drugs, inside pocket for credit cards, etc, another nice
little pocket for picks and effect plugs. God only knows, though, why
I'm carrying a Korg 4-track recorder and a pair of headphones. I'd
been meaning to use em for something and I forgot now. Oh well.
Starbuck
Lane Baldwin
"Neil N" <dalto...@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:1183737082.8...@r34g2000hsd.googlegroups.com...
Heh heh... you said buns....
Susan
> Susan wrote:
>
>> I've carried a little flashlight in my purse forever. It's come in handy
>> on many occasions. (For those of you who wonder what women cart around
>> with them all day long.)
>
> Yes, a nearby woman with one of those large purses would mean you need
> NO gig kit at all. Need a 7/16 socket wrench? No problem, just dig
> into the old purse! :-) I've got a little tiny LED flashlight on my
> keychain at all times. TOTAL lifesaver on MANY occasions.
>
> For bass I take a slightly different approach (the exception being
> large gigs) I try to make EACH bass case self-contained.
So, you're saying that I need a different bass for each of my purses?
Mind you, that can get expensive, purses can be pricey, if I
accidentally get the wrong bass...
Okay, my main purse is a little black leather thing with a small
shoulder strap and a zipper, no outside pockets. For summer, I have a
little woven thing in taupe with a snap, very tiny. And I have a larger
black leather bag with an outside pocket for those times when I need more...
I also have a leather patchquilt style fringe bag in various shades of
brown that I've used in my halloween flower child costume. (Make Love
Not War!!!!) I have a few more, but they are a bit fruffy and not taken
out much, a black and gold clutch or a couple of things with beads or
pearls. I'm not sure what else and I don't know where they came from.
Anyway, which basses should I buy for them?
Right now, my MTD and my SX have been sharing my everyday purse, but
maybe that's wrong too???
-Susan
Misifus
I've thought my wife could hide a baby elephant in her purse, but if
you're getting two basses in yours, you've got her beat!
-Raf
Jim Carr
news:5fd6o4F...@mid.individual.net...
> I've thought my wife could hide a baby elephant in her purse, but if
> you're getting two basses in yours, you've got her beat!
Q: Why do elephants wear shoes with yellow soles?
A: So you don't see them when they float upside down in a bowl of custard.
Q: Have you ever seen an elephant floating upside down in a bowl of custard?
A: No, of course not.
Kloka-mo'
Thanks Jim!
ROFL!!!
Jim Carr
news:Dr-dnVhijJfsMgzb...@comcast.com...
>> http://homepage.tinet.ie/~cronews/elep/elep.html
>>
>>
>>
>
> Thanks Jim!
> ROFL!!!
I don't remember how I stumbled across that page, but it's been in my
favorites for a few years now. It's just the juvenile kind of humor I enjoy.
I realized the other day that I remember the first joke I ever made up all
by myself. I was in first grade, and we had just taken a field trip to pick
pumpkins for Halloween. I said to the teacher, "Do you know why so many
pumpkins in the pumpkin patch were broken? Because people kept telling funny
jokes and they all cracked up."
Not bad for six years old. Unfortunately, 35 years later I haven't
progressed much.
Benj
> So, you're saying that I need a different bass for each of my purses?
>
> Mind you, that can get expensive, purses can be pricey, if I
> accidentally get the wrong bass...
I don't know how much of a "real" woman you are, but the women I know
literally have HUNDREDS of purses (I'm NOT kidding here!) AND get
this, those purses all match HUNDREDS of pairs of shoes! How much of
a stretch could it be to match purses, shoes and basses?
> Okay, my main purse is a little black leather thing with a small
> shoulder strap and a zipper, no outside pockets. For summer, I have a
> little woven thing in taupe with a snap, very tiny. And I have a larger
> black leather bag with an outside pocket for those times when I need more...
ONLY a "main" purse and a backup purse? How deficient! The last taupe
purse I bought was for a women I knew who needed something a "little
extra". So I bought here this nice "end of the world" purse in taupe
leather. You know, the kind with the .38 holster built into it. Made
by a company called: "Feminine Protection"! (I'm NOT kidding!) [All
real women can out shoot me with a .38, but so far haven't met one who
plays bass better than I do]
> I also have a leather patchquilt style fringe bag in various shades of
> brown that I've used in my halloween flower child costume. (Make Love
> Not War!!!!) I have a few more, but they are a bit fruffy and not taken
> out much, a black and gold clutch or a couple of things with beads or
> pearls. I'm not sure what else and I don't know where they came from.
OK,. clearly you are slightly advanced beyond the simple main and
backup purses, but sad to say you very much need to concentrate on
more "fun shopping"! Are you sure you aren't a man?
> Anyway, which basses should I buy for them?
>
> Right now, my MTD and my SX have been sharing my everyday purse, but
> maybe that's wrong too???
Only TWO basses and sharing a purse? How Gauche! Take my experienced
word for it, you've got to have at least TWO purses matching the
colors of the finish on EACH bass and of course, the matching SHOES to
go with each bass and purse. Do I have to send the fashion police
around to your place?
Rule: you can NEVER own too many basses, purses, shoes, ....
Benj
Susan
> Susan wrote:
> OK,. clearly you are slightly advanced beyond the simple main and
> backup purses, but sad to say you very much need to concentrate on
> more "fun shopping"! Are you sure you aren't a man?
Hmmm, nobody has *ever* questioned me on that account before. I'll just
say that I have a tambourine...
> Only TWO basses and sharing a purse? How Gauche! Take my experienced
> word for it, you've got to have at least TWO purses matching the
> colors of the finish on EACH bass and of course, the matching SHOES to
> go with each bass and purse. Do I have to send the fashion police
> around to your place?
It's quite possible, but give me a break, I'm still a beginner:) When I
learn more about tone woods and spalted vs. quilted tops, I'm sure that
I'll be better prepared to accessorise.
> Rule: you can NEVER own too many basses, purses, shoes, ....
Shoes and basses I'll grant you. Only the die-hard cosmo-girl is that
concerned about purses!
> Benj
-Susan
Card carrying woman:-)
Lane Baldwin
"An elephant is a mouse with an operating system"
Oh, yeah....
Jim Carr
news:rl96939fkl1sa19m3...@4ax.com...
> Here's all you need to know about so-called "tone woods"...it's all a
> scam run by luthiers with supplies of wood that wasn't moving, so they
> invented the term "tone woods" to sell it to rubes who hear
> differences in the acoustic sound of solidbody basses and believe that
> it transfers to the electric sound. And it doesn't.
Uh oh! Here comes the great tonewood debate! I happen to be on your side.
Obviously, the best way to test the theory is to make identical basses from
different woods, which is nearly impossible. Another way might be to record
the bass before an after cutting off nearly all of the body. I ain't gonna
do it.
One test I have done is to listen to my bass while the body is sitting flat
on a carpeted floord with my knees on either side of the body. Surely if
tonewoods make a noticeable difference, then extending the body like that
should also affect the tone. To my ear it doesn't. By contrast on an
acoustic instrument simply placing your palm on the back of the body
dramatically changes the tone.
Susan
> On Mon, 09 Jul 2007 23:03:45 -0400, Susan <s...@freeshell.org> wrote:
>
>> Benj wrote:
>>> Susan wrote:
>>> OK,. clearly you are slightly advanced beyond the simple main and
>>> backup purses, but sad to say you very much need to concentrate on
>>> more "fun shopping"! Are you sure you aren't a man?
>> Hmmm, nobody has *ever* questioned me on that account before. I'll just
>> say that I have a tambourine...
>>
>>> Only TWO basses and sharing a purse? How Gauche! Take my experienced
>>> word for it, you've got to have at least TWO purses matching the
>>> colors of the finish on EACH bass and of course, the matching SHOES to
>>> go with each bass and purse. Do I have to send the fashion police
>>> around to your place?
>> It's quite possible, but give me a break, I'm still a beginner:) When I
>> learn more about tone woods and spalted vs. quilted tops, I'm sure that
>> I'll be better prepared to accessorise.
>
> scam run by luthiers with supplies of wood that wasn't moving, so they
> invented the term "tone woods" to sell it to rubes who hear
> differences in the acoustic sound of solidbody basses and believe that
> it transfers to the electric sound. And it doesn't.
Hey Boomer, thanks. I was just kidding about the tone woods, etc.
>>> Rule: you can NEVER own too many basses, purses, shoes, ....
>> Shoes and basses I'll grant you. Only the die-hard cosmo-girl is that
>> concerned about purses!
>
> How does Bongo know so much about purses and shoes?
I imagine that he has a lot of women in his life and he notices things
and is man enough not to worry about it. Or he's just being nice enough
to rescue me out of a stupid post:)
-Susan
Neil N
>
> Here's all you need to know about so-called "tone woods"...it's all a
> scam run by luthiers with supplies of wood that wasn't moving, so they
> invented the term "tone woods" to sell it to rubes who hear
> differences in the acoustic sound of solidbody basses and believe that
> it transfers to the electric sound. And it doesn't.
>
Thought experiment:
All other things being equal, imagine a bass with a balsa wood body
and then an ebony bodied one. Do they sound identical in your mind ?
Mike Rieves
They don't, but it's mostly because the balsa wood body would have a lot
less sustain, due to it's lack of density. The type of wood in the body will
affect the sustain characteristics, but not a whole lot else, since the
pickups are not picking up actual sound, they're sensing the string
vibrating in the pickup's magnetic field.
RichL
OK, here's a monkey wrench to throw into the works. I'll agree the wood
(within reasonable limits) doesn't affect the sound of a solid-body electric
bass very much, but how about a hollow-body bass? I played a Gibson hollow
body (it may have been an EB2; it wasn't mine) way back when. I'd think for
a hollow body the type of wood, quality, etc. would have more of an effect
than for a solid-body. Any thoughts?
Jim Carr
news:ZrKdnQpaUuWq_wnb...@comcast.com...
> OK, here's a monkey wrench to throw into the works. I'll agree the wood
> (within reasonable limits) doesn't affect the sound of a solid-body
> electric
> bass very much, but how about a hollow-body bass? I played a Gibson
> hollow
> body (it may have been an EB2; it wasn't mine) way back when. I'd think
> for
> a hollow body the type of wood, quality, etc. would have more of an effect
> than for a solid-body. Any thoughts?
Here's my perspective. Like Mike said, the pickups are sensing only the
vibrations of the strings (assuming the pickups haven't gone microphonic).
So, the first question in my mind is how does the wood (solid body or
otherwise) affect the vibration of the string? What's the mechanical
process?
How does your body fit into the picture? After all, usually part of your arm
is touching the instrument while the back of the body is pressing against
your torso, both of which you would think would also be getting hit with
energy from the vibrations. Your feet are on the floor, so the energy goes
there as well. If the wood is having an effect, then I would think your body
would as well.
To what degree is the effect?
Audiophools deceive themselves quite a bit. I know there were times when I
was *positive* I heard something only to find out doing blind ABX tests that
it was all in my head. To me this makes the "I can hear it" argument pretty
unreliable.
Alembic is diplomatic about it. They say on their neck-through instruments
that it doesn't matter what wood you choose, you won't really notice a
difference, though some folks with great ears just might (cough). If I cut
off the body parts on my neck-through Spector and glued balsa wood in its
place, I would expect absolutely no difference. On a set neck I could see
the joint itself being a factor, but I'm still not convinced bolting the
same neck to pine and maple bodies would result in any noticeable
difference.
Mike Rieves
will cause the strings to be excited and vibrate harder around the resonant
frequencies, which will be picked up by the pickups and this will affect the
sound of the bass. Solid body basses are an entirely different matter. Since
there are no real peaky resonances to solid bodies, the sound is not
affected, except for how the wood damps sustain.
Several years ago, a friend of mine took a piece of 3/8" x 2" steel plate
and cut a groove for it down the center of the back of his old electric
guitar, it ran the length of the body, and the neck and brdge were bolted to
it through the body. The result was that it had tremendous sustain, but it
was so heavy that it made a Les Paul seem like a lightweight, and it didn't
really sound any different, except for the sustain.
Les Cargill
> "Neil N" <dalto...@rogers.com> wrote in message
> news:1184083489.0...@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
>
>>On Jul 10, 2:29 am, JMiller <i...@bigassbroadcast.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Here's all you need to know about so-called "tone woods"...it's all a
>>>scam run by luthiers with supplies of wood that wasn't moving, so they
>>>invented the term "tone woods" to sell it to rubes who hear
>>>differences in the acoustic sound of solidbody basses and believe that
>>>it transfers to the electric sound. And it doesn't.
>>>
>>
>>Thought experiment:
>>
>>All other things being equal, imagine a bass with a balsa wood body
>>and then an ebony bodied one. Do they sound identical in your mind ?
>>
>
>
> They don't, but it's mostly because the balsa wood body would have a lot
> less sustain, due to it's lack of density.
Density prolly don't *hurt*, but it does
not determine sustain. A busted baseball
bat has the same density as it did
before it was broken, but it ain't gonna
ring after it's busted.
People used to sell brass bridge saddles
because of "density". Wrong!
> The type of wood in the body will
> affect the sustain characteristics,
It will. Density is just one property, and probably not all that
important.
> but not a whole lot else, since the
> pickups are not picking up actual sound, they're sensing the string
> vibrating in the pickup's magnetic field.
>
>
Unless you're recording absolutely direct into the console,
there's always a bit of feedback with electric
instruments. So pickups matter.
--
Les Cargill
RichL
A couple of potential complications:
First, yeah, it's what the pickups are sensing that's important. However,
keep in mind that if the body is vibrating, the pickups are vibrating with
it, and so even if the strings weren't vibrating at all, the distance
between the pickups and strings would be changing periodically in time.
Now, is this pickup vibration in phase or out of phase with the string
vibration? Is this frequency-dependent? Since the body is vibrating more
strongly (in a relative sense) for hollow bodies than for solid bodies, it
can be argued that from this perspective it can effect tone more, especially
if it's in phase at some frequencies and out of phase at others. Does the
type and quality of wood affect this? Don't really know, I suspect it has
some effect.
Second, ideally the string is suspended by either nut or fret at one end and
the bridge at the other. If the acoustic impedance the string sees at
either end is effectively infinite, and there are no other damping
mechanisms, the string will vibrate forever. The note dampens out because
of acoustic coupling to the neck or the body at one end of the string or the
other (and also because the air itself provides some resistance to
vibration, but that's usually minor). It also radiates sound waves outward
through the strings and loses energy that way, some of which gets coupled
into the body, more so for a hollow body, and even more so if it has
f-holes. The question then becomes, does the type and quality of wood
matter, and if so, how, and how much?
For the coupling through the neck, acoustic energy is being lost by the
strings through the frets and nut, and depending on the type of fretboard or
neck wood, the nature of the energy loss can be frequency-dependent. Maple
fretboards, it is claimed by some, produce a brighter sound than rosewood.
I don't have much direct experience with this, as all the fretboards on my
guitars and basses are rosewood. But whatever's going on at the neck is
basically the same in solid and hollow bodies anyway.
When we get to the bridge, things get interesting. Some leakage of acoustic
energy can occur through the bridge into the tailpiece, and certainly in
hollow body guitars, there seems to be a difference in the sustain for, say,
stop-bar tailpieces compared to trapeze types. I have guitars with both,
and see the difference. However the wood in the underlying body doesn't
seem to affect this. However, vibrations going through the bridge into the
body, I would guess, are the most important consideration, because not only
would the coupling between the bridge and the body (and especially its
frequency dependence) depend on the type and quality of the wood, but also
the efficiency with which it then couples into the acoustic modes of the
chamber itself. And the "Q" of these modes also depends on these factors.
These types of things affect directly the sound you hear when you play the
instrument unplugged. But of course when you're plugged in it's the string
vibration itself that's being sensed (and, to a much lesser degree, body
vibration). So what's the acoustic sound got to do with anything? Well, I
would say that whatever acoustic energy is transmitted from the strings to
the body robs the string of acoustic energy (basically from energy
conservation), so any frequency dependences in these energy-leaking
mechanisms result in tonal variations. And since the type and quality of
the wood at least some of these mechanisms, one would expect the wood to
have an effect on the plugged-in sound.
Of course the real question is, how much? Very difficult to quantify,
unless you can magically get your hands on two instruments that are
identically constructed except for the wood used. And, does it matter as
much for basses as it does for guitars? Food for thought.
Mike Rieves
"Les Cargill" <lcar...@cfl.rr.com> wrote in message
news:46949352$0$30642$4c36...@roadrunner.com...
> Mike Rieves wrote:
>
>> "Neil N" <dalto...@rogers.com> wrote in message
>> news:1184083489.0...@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>>On Jul 10, 2:29 am, JMiller <i...@bigassbroadcast.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Here's all you need to know about so-called "tone woods"...it's all a
>>>>scam run by luthiers with supplies of wood that wasn't moving, so they
>>>>invented the term "tone woods" to sell it to rubes who hear
>>>>differences in the acoustic sound of solidbody basses and believe that
>>>>it transfers to the electric sound. And it doesn't.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Thought experiment:
>>>
>>>All other things being equal, imagine a bass with a balsa wood body
>>>and then an ebony bodied one. Do they sound identical in your mind ?
>>>
>>
>>
>> They don't, but it's mostly because the balsa wood body would have a lot
>> less sustain, due to it's lack of density.
>
> Density prolly don't *hurt*, but it does
> not determine sustain. A busted baseball
> bat has the same density as it did
> before it was broken, but it ain't gonna
> ring after it's busted.
That is meaningless to this topic, since we're dealing with a body that is
effectively one solid piece of wood. If the body is cracked, you're going to
either replace the body or the whole guitar, just like you would a cracked
baseball bat.
> People used to sell brass bridge saddles
> because of "density". Wrong!
Again, not germane to the issue, with types of wood density has to do with
solidity and closeness of the grain, which will affect sustain. All woods
are made mostly of the same thing, cellulose. With metals, that ain't
necessarily so. For example, lead is very dense, but it dampens sound.
>> The type of wood in the body will affect the sustain characteristics,
>
> It will. Density is just one property, and probably not all that
> important.
Well, I'd guess that density is one reason why Les Pauls have more natural
sustain than Strats...
>> but not a whole lot else, since the pickups are not picking up actual
>> sound, they're sensing the string vibrating in the pickup's magnetic
>> field.
>
> Unless you're recording absolutely direct into the console,
> there's always a bit of feedback with electric
> instruments. So pickups matter.
Sure, the pickups matter, microphonic pickups will allow the body to have
more effect on the sound than will non-microphonic pickups, and If you're
playing through an amp, sympathetic vibrations in the body and the pickups
will have some affect on the sound. that's easy to prove with a hollow body
or semi-hollow, but a lot less noticable with a solid body, indeed, with
non-microphonic pickups the difference probably won't be noticable, unless
the sound is very loud, but even in that case sympathetic vibration of the
strings will swamp any effect the body might have.
> --
> Les Cargill
Brian Running
> will cause the strings to be excited and vibrate harder around the resonant
> frequencies, which will be picked up by the pickups and this will affect the
> sound of the bass.
No, just the opposite. At the guitar's resonant frequencies, the
string's vibration is damped. The body vibrates, and the energy to make
it vibrate comes from the string. Your scenario would involve the
creation of energy from nothing.
> Solid body basses are an entirely different matter. Since
> there are no real peaky resonances to solid bodies, the sound is not
> affected, except for how the wood damps sustain.
Not true. It's the same principle, just a matter of degree, is all.
There are resonances in solid-body basses, but they are not in frequency
ranges that affect the strings much. Solid-body wood choices do affect
sound, but not nearly as much as a number of other factors, such as
strings and pickups.
Mike Rieves
"Brian Running" <brun...@XXameritechXX.net> wrote in message
news:T%dli.5364$rL1...@newssvr19.news.prodigy.net...
>> Semi-hollow body basses do have an added effect, the body cavity
>> resonance will cause the strings to be excited and vibrate harder around
>> the resonant frequencies, which will be picked up by the pickups and this
>> will affect the sound of the bass.
>
> No, just the opposite. At the guitar's resonant frequencies, the string's
> vibration is damped. The body vibrates, and the energy to make it vibrate
> comes from the string. Your scenario would involve the creation of energy
> from nothing.
No, at anything's resonant frequency, vibration energy peaks. The energy for
the resonance comes from the soundwaves coming from the amp, There is no
violation of conservation of energy laws. I see what you're saying, but a
solid body or semi-hollow bass is normally played through an amp. Recording
direct is an exception but the amp, or lack of it has much more to do with
it than the wood the body is made of.
>> Solid body basses are an entirely different matter. Since there are no
>> real peaky resonances to solid bodies, the sound is not affected, except
>> for how the wood damps sustain.
>
> Not true. It's the same principle, just a matter of degree, is all. There
> are resonances in solid-body basses, but they are not in frequency ranges
> that affect the strings much. Solid-body wood choices do affect sound,
> but not nearly as much as a number of other factors, such as strings and
> pickups.
Isn't that basically what I said?
Brian Running
>> vibration is damped. The body vibrates, and the energy to make it vibrate
>> comes from the string. Your scenario would involve the creation of energy
>> from nothing.
>
> No, at anything's resonant frequency, vibration energy peaks. The energy for
> the resonance comes from the soundwaves coming from the amp, There is no
> violation of conservation of energy laws.
Mike, you are truly something else.
Mike Rieves
"Brian Running" <brun...@xxtdsxx.net> wrote in message
news:vTgli.36476$G23....@newsreading01.news.tds.net...
Okay, I goofed, at resonance, vibration amplitude increases. However, in
this case, since the pickup is picking up the strings' vibrations, the
amplitude of the signal from the pickup will also increase. Ever try holding
your bass right in front of the amp with it cranked? If you hit a note close
to a resonance, the note's amplitude will increase, eventually resulting in
feedback. Watch the string when this happens, is it damped? Never mind, the
answer is no, it vibrates like mad.
With a guitar string, or a speaker cone, or pretty much anything else that
has a resonant frequency, the amplitude of the vibration increases as it
gets close to resonance, and peaks at the resonant frequency, for a given
input level. With a speaker, its electrical impedance also increase as it
nears resonance, peaking at resonance. Since an acoustic guitar body is
basically a Helmholtz resonator, the air movement at the sound hole also
peaks at the body's resonant frequency.
As you stated previously, a solid body's resonance points are not at
amplitudes or frequencies that affect the strings very much.
Brian Running
> this case, since the pickup is picking up the strings' vibrations, the
> amplitude of the signal from the pickup will also increase. Ever try holding
> your bass right in front of the amp with it cranked? If you hit a note close
> to a resonance, the note's amplitude will increase, eventually resulting in
> feedback. Watch the string when this happens, is it damped? Never mind, the
> answer is no, it vibrates like mad.
No one was talking about feedback induced by the amplifier. You know
that perfectly well. We are talking about "tone woods," the effect of
wood density on the bass's tone. When the body resonates, it absorbs
energy from the string at that frequency, the opposite of what you said
happens.
Les Cargill
I'm afraid it *is* relevant - the bat isn't broken-broken, just
cracked. The point is to show that the resonances matter,
not the mass/density.
>
>>People used to sell brass bridge saddles
>>because of "density". Wrong!
>
>
> Again, not germane to the issue, with types of wood density has to do with
> solidity and closeness of the grain, which will affect sustain. All woods
> are made mostly of the same thing, cellulose. With metals, that ain't
> necessarily so. For example, lead is very dense, but it dampens sound.
>
It may be cellulose, but it's arranged in highly
complex patterns which exhibit different speeds of
propagation, and so different resonances.
>
>>>The type of wood in the body will affect the sustain characteristics,
>>
>>It will. Density is just one property, and probably not all that
>>important.
>
>
> Well, I'd guess that density is one reason why Les Pauls have more natural
> sustain than Strats...
>
Assuming they do ( and some don't ), I'd say you're wrong. Customs
and Standards are way different. The maple cap is why.
>
>>>but not a whole lot else, since the pickups are not picking up actual
>>>sound, they're sensing the string vibrating in the pickup's magnetic
>>>field.
>>
>>Unless you're recording absolutely direct into the console,
>>there's always a bit of feedback with electric
>>instruments. So pickups matter.
>
>
> Sure, the pickups matter, microphonic pickups will allow the body to have
> more effect on the sound than will non-microphonic pickups,
The frequency response matters more. "Good" pickups have a lot of
mid peak-ey stuff happening.
> and If you're
> playing through an amp, sympathetic vibrations in the body and the pickups
> will have some affect on the sound. that's easy to prove with a hollow body
> or semi-hollow, but a lot less noticable with a solid body, indeed, with
> non-microphonic pickups the difference probably won't be noticable, unless
> the sound is very loud, but even in that case sympathetic vibration of the
> strings will swamp any effect the body might have.
>
Sure. But the pickups act as a filter in series with
the feedback leg of an oscillator. Makes a huge
difference.
>
>>--
>>Les Cargill
>
>
>
--
Les Cargill
Mike Rieves
"Brian Running" <brun...@XXameritechXX.net> wrote in message
When you're dealing with solid body basses, in a live situation, you're
ALWAYS going to be playing through some sort of amplification system, either
an amp or the PA. Even when recording direct, you'll be using amplification,
and as you said, and I repeated, there are no resonance points in a solid
body that are at any frequency or amplitude of interest, or that will have
any audible effect on the sound. Therefore, with a solid body bass, there
will be no resonance points to damp the strings, period. It's a moot point,
why belabor it? Assuming the use of woods that are normally used in building
guitar bodies, the type of wood used is going to have a minimal to audibly
nonexistant effect on the tone of the instrument when standard magnetic
pickups are used.
With a hollow body, it's a slightly different story, there will be body
resonant points and, like in bass reflex speakers, system resonance points
as well, the strings will transfer energy to the body at the body resonance
points and the string will lose some vibrational energy as a result, but at
the system resonance, the string vibrational amplitude will increase, not
decrease. I suspect that these body and system resonance nodes are a big
part of what gives any hollow body guitar it's characteristic sound,
probably as much as or more so than the type of wood used in the body.
Mike Rieves
It's only relevant if the body is cracked, The mass/density really only
matters if the material is similar, like all wood is mostly cellulose and
the density is a big part of the differences between types of wood.
>>
>>>People used to sell brass bridge saddles
>>>because of "density". Wrong!
>>
>>
>> Again, not germane to the issue, with types of wood density has to do
>> with solidity and closeness of the grain, which will affect sustain. All
>> woods are made mostly of the same thing, cellulose. With metals, that
>> ain't necessarily so. For example, lead is very dense, but it dampens
>> sound.
>>
>
> It may be cellulose, but it's arranged in highly
> complex patterns which exhibit different speeds of
> propagation, and so different resonances.
Right, those highly complex patterns are mostly differences in the density
within the woods. Different woods have different grain patterns and
therefore different patterns in density vcariation within any piece of wood.
>>
>>>>The type of wood in the body will affect the sustain characteristics,
>>>
>>>It will. Density is just one property, and probably not all that
>>>important.
>>
>>
>> Well, I'd guess that density is one reason why Les Pauls have more
>> natural sustain than Strats...
>>
>
> Assuming they do ( and some don't ), I'd say you're wrong. Customs
> and Standards are way different. The maple cap is why.
There are lots more things that affect sustain in a guitar than just wood,
but all other things being identical, the guitar with the denser wood body
is going to have at least a bit more sustain. If you thought I was trying to
say that the density of the body wood was the primary factor in sustain, I
apologize for misleading you, that isn't what I meant at all. The type of
wood in the body is just one, and not the most important one by a long shot,
of the many things that affect the amount of natural sustain in a guitar.
>>>>but not a whole lot else, since the pickups are not picking up actual
>>>>sound, they're sensing the string vibrating in the pickup's magnetic
>>>>field.
>>>
>>>Unless you're recording absolutely direct into the console,
>>>there's always a bit of feedback with electric
>>>instruments. So pickups matter.
>>
>>
>> Sure, the pickups matter, microphonic pickups will allow the body to have
>> more effect on the sound than will non-microphonic pickups,
>
> The frequency response matters more. "Good" pickups have a lot of
> mid peak-ey stuff happening.
I agree with that too, but the type of wood used in the body has nothing to
do with that in a solid body guitar or bass.
>> and If you're playing through an amp, sympathetic vibrations in the body
>> and the pickups will have some affect on the sound. that's easy to prove
>> with a hollow body or semi-hollow, but a lot less noticable with a solid
>> body, indeed, with non-microphonic pickups the difference probably won't
>> be noticable, unless the sound is very loud, but even in that case
>> sympathetic vibration of the strings will swamp any effect the body might
>> have.
>>
I totally agree with that. With non-microphonic pickups, the only way to
get feedback in a solid body is to get close enough to the amp to make the
strings vibrate sympathetically.
> Sure. But the pickups act as a filter in series with
> the feedback leg of an oscillator. Makes a huge
> difference.
>
It seems like you think I was one of those arguing on the side of the type
of wood affecting the tone of a solid body electric, I wasn't, I was just
saying that a denser wood body will result in a bit more sustain.
Brian Running
> resonant points and, like in bass reflex speakers, system resonance points
> as well, the strings will transfer energy to the body at the body resonance
> points and the string will lose some vibrational energy as a result, but at
> the system resonance, the string vibrational amplitude will increase, not
> decrease.
No, it won't. It can't, unless there's additional energy input into the
system. This is the point I've been making all along, you can try to
bury it under a load of bullshit if you must, but you are wrong. If
what you're saying were true, then you would get runaway feedback from
an acoustic, unamplified guitar.
Believe what you want, I'm all done with this. So long.
Mike Rieves
"Brian Running" <brun...@XXameritechXX.net> wrote in message
Brian, when did you go to school for electronics and/or acoustics? For
anything that resonates, amplitude of vibration is greatest at resonance, it
has nothing to do with additional energy going in, at resonance, there is
least resustance to vibration, therefore vibration is greatest for a given
energy input. The energy input in this case is that provided by picking the
string. Why would you think that you'd get feedback? That makes no sense at
all, the resistance to vibration is at minimum at resonance, but that
doesn't meant that there is no reisistance, it just means that there is less
resistance that at other than resonant frequences.
Les Cargill
> "Les Cargill" <lcar...@cfl.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:4696afdd$0$4732$4c36...@roadrunner.com...
>
<snip>
>>I'm afraid it *is* relevant - the bat isn't broken-broken, just
>>cracked. The point is to show that the resonances matter,
>>not the mass/density.
>
>
> It's only relevant if the body is cracked, The mass/density really only
> matters if the material is similar, like all wood is mostly cellulose and
> the density is a big part of the differences between types of wood.
>
Right - I was simply using that a thought-experiment to
show that density *matters*, but it's not the sole
determinant.
<snip>
>
> It seems like you think I was one of those arguing on the side of the type
> of wood affecting the tone of a solid body electric, I wasn't, I was just
> saying that a denser wood body will result in a bit more sustain.
>
I'm saying "maybe" :) If the body absorbs less vibration, then it will
have better sustain. Density might do that for ya.
>
--
Les Cargill