Artist demands Diana picture back from Cardiff

[Lux]

An artist has asked for his Princess Diana portrait back because
another picture of her was moved when Prince Charles visited Cardiff
City Hall. Terry O'Callaghan believes the council removed the John
Merton portrait to avoid embarrassing Charles and his new wife, the
Duchess of Cornwall. He wants the return of his own painting which he
gave to the council in 1995.

Mr O'Callaghan was angered that the Merton painting showing Diana in
triplicate was removed from its prominent position at the top of a
staircase when Charles and Camilla finished their three-day tour at
City Hall last week.

He was so upset that he has written to the Lord Mayor of Cardiff Freda
Salway demanding the return of his own painting, which he presented to
the council two years before Diana's death.

John Merton's Diana portrait was moved in Cardiff City Hall
The Cardiff-based artist said he had given his painting to the council
so that city residents and visitors to Wales could see it and he was
"appalled" by the removal of the Merton portrait.

Part of history

He said: "I'm sure the reason they moved it is that Charles and Camilla
visited Cardiff that day and they felt it might slightly embarrass
them.

"Surely they (the royal couple) are big enough to live with that?

"Her name must come up many many times in conversation, so why should
the council hide a portrait away behind closed doors?"

Mr O'Callaghan said: "The lady is dead and she's part of history and it
should have been left like that."

Speaking before it received his letter, the council said it was unaware
of Mr O'Callaghan's concern. The council said: "However, we would like
to reiterate that we do change around pictures and portraits in the
Marble Hall.

"Moving the portrait of Princess Diana allowed us to display the royal
charters concerning the declarations of Cardiff as a city and the
capital of Wales which related directly to the celebratory event on
Thursday (14 July).

"A bust of the Princess of Wales remained in situ at St David's Hall
throughout the royal visit there on Thursday evening."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/wales/south_east/4693205.stm

It IS heartening that there are a few people of principle left.

[Brian Pears]

Lux <luxpe...@aol.com> wrote:
>It IS heartening that there are a few people of principle left.

You mean like the artist who gives a painting to the council
and thinks this gives him the right to decide how the
council should display another artists work. The people of
Cardiff elected their councillors to make civic decisions not
the bloody painter.

--
Brian Pears
Gateshead, UK

[Lux]

Yes, I mean him. Obviously the councillors are unworthy guardians of
such gifts.

[Brian Pears]

So you believe that making a gift bestows rights on the giver
and obligations on the recipient? A very strange philosophy!

[Pnky & Perky sing Live8]

"Lux" <luxpe...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1121746356.6...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...

> Yes, I mean him. Obviously the councillors are unworthy guardians of
> such gifts.

Oh, how right you are, how utterly foolish to give them a painting of
Diana - a work depicting such grace and beauty is as incomprehensible to a
Welshman as an indoor lavatory!

Far better that the painting be rescued from these savages - our English
Rose was never meant to bloom amongst Daffodils and Leeks.

[Lux]

Far better that the painting be rescued from these savages - our
English
Rose was never meant to bloom amongst Daffodils and Leeks.

Whereas a cow would complete a pretty picture.

[Lux]

So you believe that making a gift bestows rights on the giver
and obligations on the recipient? A very strange philosophy!

Of course. If I gave you a work of art and found later that you kept
it in a closet, it would only be right to ask for it back. Likewise,
if you maltreated other works I would like to retrieve any of mine from
you.

[Q]

"Brian Pears" <bpe...@freenet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:WVKspPBh...@tardis.main...

Sometimes it does. When people give art to museums and universities, there
are often complicated stipulations about when and how it may be shown, and
also whether it can be sold or traded for something the institution would
prefer to have. But these things are usually spelled out at the point that
the gift is made, and not a bunch of rules made after the fact.

In the case of donated art, the donor often gets a substantial tax
deduction -- he needs the assistance of the donee in order to be able to do
that. If he has taken a large deduction, he can't very well as for his
gift to be returned. -- Q

[Lux]

And no doubt the mere thought of the current title holder has
contributed to renewed interest in the last Welsh Princess of Wales,
also badly treated by the English royals:

"Harpist stirred by story of Welsh princess Jul 18 2005

The moving story of Gwenllian, Wales's last princess, has inspired a
new album by harpist Llio Rhydderch.

Llio, like Gwenllian, was brought up on the shores of the Menai Strait,
and one of the tracks on the new CD reflects Gwenllian's first innocent
months in the area in 1282.

Gwenllian's father, Llywelyn ap Gruffudd, was killed soon after her
birth and the baby was moved by the English to Lincolnshire.

To ensure she did not produce children, she was confined to a priory at
Sempringham, Lincs, until she died in June 1337.

Llio, who continues the centuries-old Welsh tradition of improvising on
the triple harp, visited Sempringham while preparing the new album's
music. Old Lincolnshire airs, including Brigg Fair, are woven into some
tracks on the CD, titled Gwenllian.

Llio said she was spurred on to create the album by the success of the
Princess Gwenllian Society, formed in the 1990s to keep the princess's
memory alive and to maintain the Gwenllian memorial at Sempringham.

'Gwenllian has been a footnote for generations,' said Llio, who lives
on Ynys M™n. 'Now she's coming back to the nation's memory. There's a
lot of emotion in the music (on the new CD). There are some happy
pieces too, especially where Gwenllian's innocence is portrayed.'"

http://icwales.icnetwork.co.uk/0900entertainment/0050artsnews/tm_objectid=15749609&method=full&siteid=50082&headline=harpist-stirred-by-story-of-welsh-princess--name_page.html

[Brian Pears]

Lux <luxpe...@aol.com> wrote:
>Of course. If I gave you a work of art and found later that you kept
>it in a closet, it would only be right to ask for it back. Likewise,
>if you maltreated other works I would like to retrieve any of mine from
>you.

If you gave me anything then it would become my property. You could
ask for it back, but whether you would get it back or nor would be at
my discretion.

[Lux]

Well, you are have no understanding of art, obviously, nor of how to
properly treat a gift.

[Brian Pears]

Lux <luxpe...@aol.com> wrote:
>Well, you are have no understanding of art, obviously, nor of how to
>properly treat a gift.

No dear, you have no understanding of the definition of "gift".
The object which forms the gift is immaterial. According to the
OED a gift is something given willingly and without charge.
Something given becomes the property of the recipient and its
disposition is at the discretion of the recipient.

[Lux]

Yes, Rover, we know how a boor like yourself would rely on
technicalities and legalisms where a gift is concerned.

[Brian Pears]

Lux <luxpe...@aol.com> wrote:
>Yes, Rover, we know how a boor like yourself would rely on
>technicalities and legalisms where a gift is concerned.

You really are a prat. Ownership of a gift is not a technicality
or a legalism, it is basic and very simple fact.

[FJae]

What was that Sacha about ME throwing around insults. You may want to
get on Brian for this too.

[Lux]

I know we can rest assured that no one will be gifting you with a van
Gogh or any other work of value, so you will not have an opportunity to
put your philistinism into practice.

[Jean Sue Libkind]

Brian Pears wrote:
> Lux <luxpe...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>> Yes, Rover, we know how a boor like yourself would rely on
>> technicalities and legalisms where a gift is concerned.
>
>
> You really are a prat. Ownership of a gift is not a technicality
> or a legalism, it is basic and very simple fact.
>

Well, we know not to accept anything from Fanny/Danny/Pudding-and-Lies
because they'll just take it back anytime they want to.

Apparently "giving" isn't their thing; "taking" must be.

js

Crossposting deleted as it is a waste of time

[Lux]

Don't you ever stop your brownnosing, Lapdog?

[Danny]

On 19 Jul 2005 11:58:57 -0700, "Lux" <luxpe...@aol.com> wrote:

>Yes, Rover, we know how a boor like yourself would rely on
>technicalities and legalisms where a gift is concerned.

BP is a stupid ranting old idiot, ignore the pervert.

[Danny]

On 19 Jul 2005 12:58:38 -0700, "FJae" <f_jo...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>How DARE you!
>My family was the sole contributor of all funds needed leading to the
>building of a children's wing in a major city centre in Canada.
>Disgusting liar.

careful, they will research this, find out who yuo are, then spend all
their boring days on here trashing the good deeds you family has done
for Canada.

[FJae]

Thanks Danny!
They can search away...

[Brian Pears]

Just returning your abuse - or do you regard calling someone
"Rover" as being a courteous salutation?

I try to treat people as they treat me - so don't expect civility
from me while you dish out your supercilious insults.

[Danny]

On Tue, 19 Jul 2005 21:19:22 GMT, Brian Pears <bpe...@freenet.co.uk>
wrote:

>FJae <f_jo...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>What was that Sacha about ME throwing around insults. You may want to
>>get on Brian for this too.
>>Brian Pears wrote:
>>> Lux <luxpe...@aol.com> wrote:
>>> >Yes, Rover, we know how a boor like yourself would rely on
>>> >technicalities and legalisms where a gift is concerned.
>>>
>>> You really are a prat. Ownership of a gift is not a technicality
>>> or a legalism, it is basic and very simple fact.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Brian Pears
>>> Gateshead, UK
>
>Just returning your abuse - or do you regard calling someone
>"Rover" as being a courteous salutation?

you idiot, calling yuo rover was being polite to say the least.

>
>I try to treat people as they treat me - so don't expect civility
>from me while you dish out your supercilious insults.

i do the same, your a tired old pervwert with nothing better to do
than harass strangers and single young females on AGR.

now rover, go find your mistress, supper time ya know =)

[FJae]

SACHA YOO HOO OVER HERE...someone is breaking your rules...or are those
just rules for certain people?

[Danny]

On 19 Jul 2005 14:46:19 -0700, "FJae" <f_jo...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>SACHA YOO HOO OVER HERE...someone is breaking your rules...or are those
>just rules for certain people?

3 husbands later, Sacha has NO rules, none that matter anyway.

[Sacha]

On 19/7/05 20:58, in article
1121803118.3...@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, "FJae"
<f_jo...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> How DARE you!
> My family was the sole contributor of all funds needed leading to the
> building of a children's wing in a major city centre in Canada.
> Disgusting liar.
>

More information. Thank you.
--

Sacha
(remove the weeds for email)

[Danny]

hmmm... yes, am sure it is in your "file" already.

[Dai Losin]

So who wants a picture of that English slut anyway? Throw it out with the
garbage. Dai Losin

"Pnky & Perky sing Live8" <conc...@ease.com> wrote in message
news:3k46qkF...@individual.net...

[Lux]

Are you Welsh, or some other hostile foreign national?

[Sacha]

On 21/7/05 23:58, in article
1121986717.0...@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com, "Lux"
<luxpe...@aol.com> wrote:

This from a woman who didn't know where Lesotho is.

[Dai Losin]

This is a Welsh site isn't it? What are you doing here? Are you English or
some other kind of foreigner? Cer i uffern ac ymunwch a'r Saeson
eraill. Dai Losin

"Lux" <luxpe...@aol.com> wrote in message

news:1121986717.0...@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

[Lux]

No, this is alt.gossip.royalty. Ignore Sacha, she is from Jersey. I
am another kind of foreigner.

[Pnky & Perky sing Live8]

"Some Taffy Git <cwm...@optonline.net> gibbered in message:
news:MSVDe.3783$Qy1....@fe09.lga...

Cer i uffern ac ymunwch a'r Saeson
> eraill. Dai Losin

Would you kindly refrain from making those strange sibilated noises!? The
ability to make animal-like sounds does *not* constitute a bona-fide
language - and I find it very inconvenient to clean your spittle from my
monitor.

Sheesh! - a Gorsedd of 'Bards' is just a pretentious name for a spitting
competition!..

BWWWAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHAAAAA!!!!!