Climate change kills marine life
simple_...@yahoo.com
February 18, 2007
Unprecedented changes to ocean currents are having a devastating
effect on finely balanced marine ecosystems, scientists meeting in the
US have warned.
Off the west coast of the United States, the disruption has led to the
death of huge numbers of sea animals including crabs, salmon and tens
of thousands of birds.
Similar ecosystem upheaval has been recorded in other parts of the
world, particularly South America and Africa.
Early evidence suggests that global warming is driving the changes by
throwing previously predictable seasonal winds out of kilter.
The effects appear to be consistent with what has been predicted by
climate change models, say scientists.
Experts at the annual meeting of the American Association for the
Advancement of Science in San Francisco described two extraordinary
linked events in 2005 and 2006.
The first occurred when a nutrient-rich ocean current that normally
appears off northern California and Oregon in spring was delayed by a
month.
This led to a loss of phytoplankton, the microscopic plant organisms
that form the vital base of the ocean ecosystem and upon which larger
animals depend for food.
Salmon, which normally take to the sea at this time, starved. The
effects rippled up through the food web as predators, including many
sea birds, went hungry and died.
The following year the west coast current came back with a vengeance,
producing an upwelling of nutrient-rich water twice as strong as the
average recorded for several previous years.
Phytoplankton bloomed to levels not seen before, turning the sea to
green-brown soup. They then died and sank, causing oxygen levels in
the water to plummet virtually to zero.
The result was a "dead zone" in which nothing could survive.
Scientists conducting a submarine survey found dead crabs and marine
worms scattered across the ocean floor, and no sign of any fish.
The knock-on effects were once again disastrous for sea birds which
relied on the sea creatures for food. Huge numbers of dead birds were
washed up on the shores.
The 2006 dead zone, which remained for nearly 17 weeks, was three
times bigger than any seen in the region before, said Dr Francis Chan,
from Oregon State University in Corvallis.
He said: "It grew to an area the size of the state of Ohio and lasted
much longer than we thought would be possible, from something that we
tracked day to day to months on end.
"It went from a low oxygen system to a no oxygen system. This had a
dramatic effect on marine life."
Dr Julia Parrish, from the University of Washington in Seattle, said
there were "many spikes" in sea bird mortality during 2005 and 2006.
"Beaches were literally littered with the bodies of dead sea birds,"
she told the meeting. "Tens of thousands of additional birds were
washing up on the shore."
Many of the starving birds had also been unable to breed, she said.
Seasonal winds blowing across the sea affect ocean currents by pushing
away surface water, which is then replaced by colder water from below.
Warmer land temperatures resulted in higher pressures and stronger
winds, which in turn had an impact on currents, said the scientists.
Normally these effects were predictable, but recently the system had
become unstable and volatile - a pattern that mirrored climate change
models.
Professor Jane Lubchenco, from Oregon State University, said: "Wild
fluctuations in the intensity of ocean upwellings are wreaking havoc
with the ecosystems of the west coast.
"We're seeing extreme distortions on both sides of the norm. This is a
system that is out of kilter. It's fluctuating rapidly."
Up to five decades of data had shown that the events were
"unprecedented in this ecosystem", she said.
She pointed out that similar ocean current disruption had been seen in
other regions of the world, particularly Peru, Chile and parts of
Africa.
"The ultimate causes of the changes are unknown," Professor Lubchenco
added. "We finger the winds as the important culprit, but we do not
know definitively why these winds are changing. We do know that the
changes are what would be expected under climate change scenarios, and
climate change is a viable hypothesis... We should expect more
surprises."
Findings related to the 2005 event were reported in the online version
of the journal Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences.
Anthony Matonak
> source: http://tinyurl.com/2wnjtv
...
> Up to five decades of data had shown that the events were
> "unprecedented in this ecosystem", she said.
> "The ultimate causes of the changes are unknown," Professor Lubchenco
> added.
Hmm, 50 years of data out of the billions of years the plant has
been around. It doesn't sound like a long enough period to be able
to make reliable predictions. Then again, they flatly admit they
don't know what is the cause.
Anthony
Ejo
<anthony...@nothing.like.socal.rr.com> wrote:
The provided link is not providing a reference to scientific
literature, instead we are dealing with the interpretation of one or
more journalists. This discussion and its conclusions are therefore
difficult to understand.
Ejo
lkgeo1
Red Tide reported at reefs
dilemma
BY TIMOTHY O'HARA
Citizen Staff
Mote Marine Laboratory and Florida Keys National Marine Sanctuary
scientists have confirmed reports of red tide reaching Western Sambos
and Eastern Dry Rocks reefs this week.
They have not been able to pinpoint the source of the red tide, a
harmful and potentially toxic algal bloom that can kill fish and
irritate eyes and respiratory systems in humans. Red tides are more
common in Florida Bay and the backcountry side of the Keys, but these
reefs are located in the Atlantic Ocean. Biologists are unsure
whether
the red tide occurrence is part of a large, toxic algal bloom that
lingered off Sarasota and Fort Myers last summer and fall.
Mote staff marine biologist Cory Walter said the red tide
concentrations are "low," and people could still dive and fish in the
areas around Western Sambos, about a mile and a half south of Boca
Chica, and Eastern Dry Rocks, about five miles southwest of Key West.
People with respiratory problems may want to avoid those areas for
now,
sanctuary spokeswoman Cheva Heck said.
Commercial spear fisherman Lee Starling saw several dead fish at the
bottom and discolored water off Western Dry Rocks this week, he said
Friday. Several fishermen have reported seeing discolored water in
and
near the Tortugas National Park, 70 miles west of Key West, and in
the
Content Keys, about 23 miles northeast of Key West, during
Thanksgiving
week.
Walter and fellow Mote biologist Erich Bartels collected water
samples
from Western Sambos and Eastern Dry Rocks on Friday, and their
samples
confirmed the red tide reports. They noticed greenish, discolored
water, but not reddish brown water, more common with red tide, they
said. They saw two floating dead fish and some fish in the area that
looked "stressed," Bartels said.
The National Marine Sanctuary and Mote Marine Laboratory have been
working together on a program that monitors red tides. The agencies
are
encouraging divers and fishermen to report red tides and take water
samples. People can obtain water sample kits or report red tides by
calling Walter at (305) 745-2729, ext. 301.
toh...@keysnews.com http://keysnews.com/284848901361090.bsp.htm
Joe Fischer
<antho...@nothing.like.socal.rr.com> wrote:
>simple_...@yahoo.com wrote:
>> source: http://tinyurl.com/2wnjtv
>> Up to five decades of data had shown that the events were
>> "unprecedented in this ecosystem", she said.
>...
>> "The ultimate causes of the changes are unknown," Professor Lubchenco
>> added.
>
>Hmm, 50 years of data out of the billions of years the plant has
>been around. It doesn't sound like a long enough period to be able
>to make reliable predictions. Then again, they flatly admit they
>don't know what is the cause.
>Anthony
Yes, those pesky winds, you just can't depend on them
blowing the same direction on every day of the year, and
what else could possible spell doom besides global warming.
Joe Fischer
Eeyore
kT wrote:
> Joe Fischer wrote:
> >
> > Yes, those pesky winds, you just can't depend on them
> > blowing the same direction on every day of the year, and
> > what else could possible spell doom besides global warming.
>
> Yes, energy has nothing to do with winds.
>
> Prevailing winds are a myth, a mass hallucination.
Just how big an idiot are you ?
Graham
Roger Dewhurst
"Anthony Matonak" <antho...@nothing.like.socal.rr.com> wrote in message
news:45d73785$0$28155$4c36...@roadrunner.com...
They cannot even predict an El Nino Southern Oscillation!
R
lkgeo1
wrote:
>
> Just how big an idiot are you ?
>
> Graham
ALMOST AS BIG AS YOU. HOWEVER, THERE WILL "NEVER" BE ONE AS BIG AS
YOU . NEVER !
Clifford
<simple_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1171727453....@s48g2000cws.googlegroups.com...
> source: http://tinyurl.com/2wnjtv
> February 18, 2007
>
> Unprecedented changes to ocean currents are having a devastating
> effect on finely balanced marine ecosystems, scientists meeting in the
> US have warned.
>
"devastating"
"finely balanced"
All those in the first sentance! KOOK alert!!!
Clifford
<rest of tripe snipped>
Joe Fischer
>Yes, energy has nothing to do with winds.
The article wasn't about energy, it was about
changing winds that didn't change at the right time.
>Prevailing winds are a myth,
It wasn't about prevailing winds, it was about
seasonal winds.
>a mass hallucination.
Not a "mass" hallucination, apparently just
your's, confusing prevailing winds with seasonal
changes in winds.
The most characteristic thing about weather
is that it changes, it isn't dependable at all, winds
circulate one way around lows, and the other
way around highs, sometimes at high speed,
at other times hardly noticeable.
And a first time for everything is not
unexpected in nature, two headed snakes
are very common.
Joe Fischer
Joe Fischer
>Joe Fischer wrote:
>> The most characteristic thing about weather
>> is that it changes, it isn't dependable at all, winds
>> circulate one way around lows, and the other
>> way around highs,
>
>That sounds pretty dependable to me.
It is more than "pretty dependable",
it is a certainty, the direction only depending
on which hemisphere.
But the highs and lows are not very
dependable at all.
Joe Fischer
Eeyore
lkgeo1 wrote:
Awww. Poor baby.
I suppose you just can't bear to think there won't ever be a hydrogen economy.
Graham
davee
Joe Fischer
>Sure they are. Where there is high pressure, there is sure to be low
>pressure somewhere else.
You obviously are NOT a meteorologist.
>On top of all that there is an average
>pressure.
If you know the definition of "average", yes.
Is there some reason the fanatical sector of
climatologists are not saying more about the tons
of CO2 causing higher barometric pressure?
>It's the same with temperature, they're called scalar fields.
By the nutty mathematicians maybe, there has
been as much as 40 degrees difference in temperature
between where I live and a city 50 miles away for a week,
and I am glad I am on the warm side.
>Now the wind is a vector field. We have hamiltonians to describe them.
You have nothing useful in either weather predicting
or climate change.
>Now what exactly is it you are trying to say with your goo goo ga ga?
Now you are using the right language, you
are as gullible as a child, but with an ego of an elephant.
Joe Fischer
Joe Fischer
>Joe Fischer wrote:
>> You obviously are NOT a meteorologist.
>>
>>> On top of all that there is an average
>>> pressure.
>>
>> If you know the definition of "average", yes.
>
>So you don't know how average is defined
>
>What is your definition?
Use any definition you like, it is meaningless,
it is just a number, the average.
>> Is there some reason the fanatical sector of
>> climatologists are not saying more about the tons
>> of CO2 causing higher barometric pressure?
>>
>>> It's the same with temperature, they're called scalar fields.
>>
>> By the nutty mathematicians maybe, there has
>> been as much as 40 degrees difference in temperature
>> between where I live and a city 50 miles away for a week,
>> and I am glad I am on the warm side.
>
>So, temperature is not a scalar either.
Temperature in one place is not dependent on
temperature in other places at any instant in time.
Air can be warmed by the sun, and warm air
moves around the globe, and it is only important to
the local area. Numerous weather models are
used, and they often have different results, and
sometimes all are wrong.
>>> Now the wind is a vector field. We have hamiltonians to describe them.
>>
>> You have nothing useful in either weather predicting
>> or climate change.
>
>Sure I do, I have lines in phase space. It's fairly easy to see when the
>weather isn't going to bork out on me in the immediate future.
For a day or so, usually, but the temperature
can change 30 degrees in ten hours or less, so what
time do you take the number to use in the data set?
>It's also
>pretty easy to see those cusps, caustics and catastrophes approaching.
Sometimes quite a few days in advance, but
it is not totally dependable. It is a lot better than it
was the first time I saw an Army Air Force weather
map in 1946.
>For guidance only, errors may be large.
Yes, :-), but it is great that things have improved.
Still, there are lots of variables;
http://weather.unisys.com/model/details.html
so yes, errors may be large.
Some of the data is very meaningful, but
frankly, the idea that a global average temperature
should be a constant within one degree is laughable.
>No, I have science and mathematics. You have nothing.
A lot of people have science and mathematics,
and a lot of them don't but they think they do.
If red tides have appeared off Florida a number of
times, is it really all that unexpected to see it in other
places? The big tsunami was apparently caused by
a underwater escarpment 75 feet high and a thousand
miles long forming, things like that can cause more
change than weather.
Marine life is spectacular, and it is easy to get
too personally involved in the study, and this can cause
people to attach great importance to events.
I wish it were possible to anticipate those conditions
ahead of time and that there was something that could be
done to prevent them.
I was close to the early effort to keep octopi in captivity
near the great lakes, and it seemed impossible for a long
time, but the more nature is studied, the more things that
can be improved, but probably not everything, and not
all the time.
Something happened, but it is wrong to write
headlines blaming climate change for everything.
Or rather to suggest that man is doing something
that causes greater climate change than occurs
naturally is likely exaggerated too often.
Joe Fischer
Peter B. P.
He is a certified lunatic with web access.
--
regards , Peter B. P. - http://titancity.com/blog , http://macplanet.dk
If guns kill, do pencils cause spelling errors?
Peter B. P.
Not true, there will be, at least when we stary mining the gas gigants.
Or more likely, that will be a He3 economy.
Peter B. P.
> Sure they are. Where there is high pressure, there is sure to be low
> pressure somewhere else. On top of all that there is an average
> pressure. It's the same with temperature, they're called scalar fields.
>
> Now the wind is a vector field. We have hamiltonians to describe them.
Wow, the lunatic can name mathematical concepts! Impressive!
But do you know what they actually *are*, lunatic?
Peter B. P.
Maybe we should make a Global Waming Alarmist Bingo? A GWAB?
First one to get a full row of buzzwords wins as Honda Insight. :)
Peter B. P.
Agreed. I have little faith in journalists and their supposed ability to
judge scientific facts iwhtout spinning and blowing things out of
proportion.
Eeyore
"Peter B. P." wrote:
> Eeyore <rabbitsfriend...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > lkgeo1 wrote:
> >
> > > Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelati...@hotmail.com> wrote: > > Just how big
> > > an idiot are you ? > > Graham
> > >
> > > ALMOST AS BIG AS YOU. HOWEVER, THERE WILL "NEVER" BE ONE AS > > BIG AS YOU
> . NEVER !
> >
> > Awww. Poor baby.
> >
> > I suppose you just can't bear to think there won't ever be a hydrogen
> > economy.
> >
> > Graham
>
> Not true, there will be, at least when we stary mining the gas gigants.
> Or more likely, that will be a He3 economy.
Sorry to disappoint you but there's not going to be any interstellar mining.
Graham
Eeyore
kT wrote:
> Eeyore wrote:
>
> >>> I suppose you just can't bear to think there won't ever be a hydrogen
> >>> economy.
>
> We've already got one. It's a star called the sun.
>
> >> Not true, there will be, at least when we stary mining the gas gigants.
>
> Totally crackpot.
That wasn't me.
> >> Or more likely, that will be a He3 economy.
>
> Mildly cranky.
Can you learnt to trim headers properly please so thjat they correctly attribute
who said what ?
> > Sorry to disappoint you but there's not going to be any interstellar mining.
>
> No, but interplanetary mining is inevitable
It's never going to happen. Anyone with the tiniest grasp of science and how to
apply it can see that.
Graham
Ray Lopez Kiddie-Porn@NAMBLA.org
old satanic heresy that Rockefeller's dad was a sociopath that brought
home his mistress to live under the family roof or peddled fake cancer
cures or a bigamist who actually went and married another woman under
a faked name.
http://www.nytimes.com/books/first/c/chernow-titan.html
"Before long, Big Bill roughly disabused Eliza of any high-flown
romantic notions she might have had about matrimony. Far from
renouncing his girlfriend, Nancy Brown, he brought her into the
cramped house as a "housekeeper" and began having children,
alternately, by wife and mistress. In 1838, Eliza gave birth to their
first child, Lucy, followed a few months later by Nancy's first
illegitimate daughter, Clorinda. On the night of July 8, 1839, Bill
and Eliza again summoned the midwife, this time to deliver a boy, who
came into the world in a bare front bedroom measuring eight by ten
feet. This child, born during Martin Van Buren's presidency and
destined to become the country's foremost capitalist, would survive
into the second term of Franklin D. Roosevelt's New Deal. Like many
other future magnates--Andrew Carnegie (born in 1835), Jay Gould
(1836), and J. Pierpont Morgan (1837)--he was born in the late 1830s
and would therefore come to maturity on the eve of the post-Civil War
industrial boom. Several months after John's birth, Nancy Brown gave
birth to a second daughter, Cornelia, which meant that Bill, lord of
his own harem, managed to sire four children under one roof in just
two years. Thus, the fiercely moralistic John Davison Rockefeller
(appropriately named after Eliza's sober father) was sandwiched
tightly between two illegitimate sisters, born into a situation
steeped in sin."
http://www.answers.com/topic/john-d-rockefeller
Rockefeller ... His father was a traveling salesman of dubious
products, such as "cancer cures." He was also a philanderer and a
bigamist.
----------------
The EXXON religion is the purity of the nobel corporation who only
toils to delive beneficial products, not the satanic heresy of the
polluting corporation that made kerosine before cars were invented so
it had to dump the poisonous gasoline unwanted byproduct in streams
and rivers.
----------------
The EXXON religion is the good citizen corporation, not the satanic
heresy about Rockefeller going to war with Tom Scott of Penn RR that
led to 2,000 people killed in uprisings that burned 2,000 railcars and
engines and many rail stations. The Exxon religion is the good
corporation, not that satanic heresy of the illegal trust that took a
president Roosevelt and a supreme court 11 years to "break up".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Railroad_Strike
"Pittsburgh, PA became the site of the worst violence. Thomas
Alexander Scott of the Pennsylvania Railroad, often considered one of
the first robber barons, suggested that the strikers should be given
"a rifle diet for a few days and see how they like that kind of
bread."[3]
http://www.cr.nps.gov/nhl/designations/samples/wv/roundhouse.pdf
One railroad, the Pennsylvania, suffered the greatest losses of all
the railroads, with its heaviest losses at Pittsburgh. Fortunately for
the company, the Pennsylvania State Supreme Court held the company not
liable for freight stolen or destroyed at Pittsburgh. What had
happened to the Pennsylvania Railroad caused its president, Tom Scott,
to sell his empire to John D. Rockefeller in October 1877.
----------------
http://mit.edu/thistle/www/v13/3/oil.html
A People's History of the United States
... The Standard Oil Trust was dissolved under court order in 1911
creating many smaller regional companies, including Standard Oil of
New Jersey (Exxon), Standard Oil of New York (Mobil), Standard Oil of
California (Chevron), Standard Oil of Ohio (Sohio), Standard Oil of
Indiana (Amoco), Continental Oil (Conoco), and Atlantic Oil (ARCO). By
1941 Standard Oil of New Jersey was the largest oil company in the
world, controlling 84 percent of the U.S. petroleum market. Its bank
was Chase and its owners were the Rockefellers. ...
... After the Rockefellers, the next largest stockholder in Standard
Oil was I.G. Farben, the giant German chemical company. This
investment was part of a pattern of reciprocal investments between the
U.S. and Germany during the Nazi years. During the Great Depression,
Germany was viewed as a hot area in which to invest.
A brief aside is required here to explain what type of company I.G.
Farben actually was. At the time, it was the world's largest chemical
company and through the talents of its scientists and engineers, it
secured the vital self-sufficiency that was to enable Germany to
maneuver in the world of power politics. From its laboratories and
factories flowed the strategic raw materials that Germany's own
territory could not supply, the synthetics of oil, gasoline, rubber,
nitrates, and fibers. In addition, I.G. produced vaccines and drugs
such as Salvarsan, aspirin, Atabrine, and Novocain, along with sulfa
drugs, as well as poison gases and rocket fuels. The depth of I.G.
Farben's connection to Nazi policy was finally realized at Auschwitz,
the extermination center where four million people were destroyed in
accordance with Hitler's "Final Solution of the Jewish Question".
Drawn by the seemingly limitless supply of death camp labor, Farben
built I.G. Auschwitz, a huge industrial complex designed to produce
synthetic rubber and oil. This installation used as much electricity
as the entire city of Berlin, and more than 25,000 camp inmates died
during its construction. I.G. Farben eventually built its own
concentration camp, known as Monowitz, which was closer to the site of
the complex than Auschwitz was, in order to eliminate the need to
march prisoners several miles to and from the plant every day.
This was the company enthusiastically embraced by Standard Oil as well
as other major American corporations like Du Pont and General Motors.
I do not, however, state that Standard Oil collaborated with the Nazis
simply because I.G. Farben was its second largest shareholder. In
fact, without the explicit help of Standard Oil, the Nazi air force
would never have gotten off the ground in the first place. The planes
that made up the Luftwaffe needed tetraethyl lead gasoline in order to
fly. At the time, only Standard Oil, Du Pont, and General Motors had
the ability to produce this vital substance. In 1938, Walter C.
Teagle, then president of Standard Oil, helped Hermann Schmitz of I.G.
Farben to acquire 500 tons of tetraethyl lead from Ethyl, a British
Standard subsidiary. A year later, Schmitz returned to London and
obtained an additional 15 million dollars worth of tetraethyl lead
which was to be turned into aviation gasoline back in Germany.
After the war began in Europe, the English became angry about U.S.
shipments of strategic materials to Nazi Germany. Standard Oil
immediately changed the registration of their entire fleet to
Panamanian to avoid British search or seizure. These ships continued
to carry oil to Tenerife in the Canary Islands, where they refueled
and siphoned oil to German tankers for shipment to Hamburg.
This deception was exposed on March 31, 1941 when the U.S. State
Department issued a detailed report on refueling stations in Mexico
and Central and South America that were suspected of furnishing oil to
Italian and German merchant vessels. The report listed Standard Oil of
New Jersey and Standard Oil of California among those fueling enemy
ships, but there is no record of any action being taken as a result of
this discovery. Similar deals between Standard Oil and the Japanese
government for the purchase of tetraethyl lead have also been
uncovered, but no direct action was ever taken against Standard Oil
for its dealings with America's enemies. A brief side note, however,
is that on April 17, l945 the Chase National Bank was placed on trial
in federal court on charges of having violated the Trading With the
Enemy Act by converting German marks into U.S. dollars. Because many
countries refused to accept German currency during the war, the Nazis
used foreign banks like Chase National to change the currency into
money that would be accepted, and thus allowed them to purchase much
need materials to prolong the war. The closer one looks, the more ties
one finds between American business and Nazi Germany, many of which
remained strong well into and beyond the war. ...
http://www.us-highways.com/sohist.htm
Peter B. P.
> kT wrote:
>
> > Eeyore wrote:
> >
> > >>> I suppose you just can't bear to think there won't ever be a
> > >>> hydrogen economy.
> >
> > We've already got one. It's a star called the sun.
> >
> > >> Not true, there will be, at least when we stary mining the gas
> >gigants.
> >
> > Totally crackpot.
>
> That wasn't me.
Don't mind Elifirtz, he's just the local equivalent of the village
idiot.
>
>
> > >> Or more likely, that will be a He3 economy.
> >
> > Mildly cranky.
>
> Can you learnt to trim headers properly please so thjat they correctly
> attribute who said what ?
>
>
> > > Sorry to disappoint you but there's not going to be any interstellar
> >mining.
> >
> > No, but interplanetary mining is inevitable
>
> It's never going to happen. Anyone with the tiniest grasp of science and
> how to apply it can see that.
>
> Graham
The only thing that can stop humanity spreading across space is a
supernova or a gamma flash in close proximity to us.
Peter B. P.
> Eeyore wrote:
>
> >>> I suppose you just can't bear to think there won't ever be a hydrogen
> >>> economy.
>
> We've already got one. It's a star called the sun.
>
> >> Not true, there will be, at least when we stary mining the gas gigants.
>
> Totally crackpot.
>
Nope, but that you don't understand the idea behind this comes as no
surprise at all.
> >> Or more likely, that will be a He3 economy.
>
> Mildly cranky.
>
Nope, moron, it's only 20 years away - the chinese already have plans
underway to mine He3 from the Lunar poles.
Peter B. P.
> Peter B. P. wrote:
> > kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
> >
> >> Sure they are. Where there is high pressure, there is sure to be low
> >> pressure somewhere else. On top of all that there is an average
> >> pressure. It's the same with temperature, they're called scalar fields.
> >>
> >> Now the wind is a vector field. We have hamiltonians to describe them.
> >
> > Wow, the lunatic can name mathematical concepts! Impressive!
> >
> > But do you know what they actually *are*, lunatic?
>
> Sure, numbers and stuff. It's not what they are, it's how they operate.
>
> Abstractions are like that.
What would you know about that? You brain is way too fucked up to
function properly in any constructive manner that goes beyone mumbling
pathetic insults and making the occasional blog post (featuring more
pathetic insults).
Peter B. P.
Eeyore
"Peter B. P." wrote:
> Eeyore <rabbitsfriend...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > kT wrote:
> > > Eeyore wrote:
> > >
> > > >>> I suppose you just can't bear to think there won't ever be a
> > > >>> hydrogen economy.
> > >
> > > We've already got one. It's a star called the sun.
> > >
> > > >> Not true, there will be, at least when we stary mining the gas gigants.
>
> > >
> > > Totally crackpot.
> >
> > That wasn't me.
>
> Don't mind Elifirtz, he's just the local equivalent of the village
> idiot.
>
>
> > > >> Or more likely, that will be a He3 economy.
> > >
> > > Mildly cranky.
> >
> > Can you learnt to trim headers properly please so thjat they correctly
> > attribute who said what ?
> >
> >
> > > > Sorry to disappoint you but there's not going to be any interstellar
> mining.
> > >
> > > No, but interplanetary mining is inevitable
> >
> > It's never going to happen. Anyone with the tiniest grasp of science and
> > how to apply it can see that.
> >
> > Graham
>
> The only thing that can stop humanity spreading across space is a
> supernova or a gamma flash in close proximity to us.
Or the energy and materials needed ! It makes dealing with global warming look
like a walk in the park.
Those who talk of factories on the moon make me laugh. I doubt they know very
much about factories on Earth to be honest.
Graham
Eeyore
"Peter B. P." wrote:
> Eeyore <rabbitsfriend...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > "Peter B. P." wrote:
> > > Eeyore <rabbitsfriend...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> > > Awww.
> > > Poor baby. I suppose you just can't bear to think there won't ever
> > > be a hydrogen economy. > > Graham
> > >
> > > Not true, there will be, at least when we stary mining the gas gigants.
> > > Or more likely, that will be a He3 economy.
> >
> > Sorry to disappoint you but there's not going to be any interstellar
> > mining.
> >
> > Graham
>
> Sure abuot that?
100%.
Graham
Eeyore
"Peter B. P." wrote:
> kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
> > > "Peter B. P." wrote:
> > >
> > > > Or more likely, that will be a He3 economy.
> >
> > Mildly cranky.
>
>
> Nope, moron, it's only 20 years away - the chinese already have plans
> underway to mine He3 from the Lunar poles.
Good Lord.
Another moron. It must be moron season ! Is it ok to shoot them ?
Graham
davee
anyway back to hydrogen two parts , one part oxygen.
Or two parts oxygen to one part carbon.
Similtaneous equation time!
this is gonna be fun!
to be continued. . . . .
Ray Lopez Kiddie-Porn@NAMBLA.org
wrote:
> It's never going to happen. Anyone with the tiniest grasp of science and how to
> apply it can see that.
>
> Graham
EEYORE the Oozing Syphilis Sore
Peter B. P.
> "Peter B. P." wrote:
>
> > kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
> > > > "Peter B. P." wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Or more likely, that will be a He3 economy.
> > >
> > > Mildly cranky.
> >
> >
> > Nope, moron, it's only 20 years away - the chinese already have plans
> > underway to mine He3 from the Lunar poles.
>
> Good Lord.
>
> Another moron. It must be moron season ! Is it ok to shoot them ?
>
> Graham
It takes one to know one... does that mean it's ok to shoot you?
Peter B. P.
> Did I mention I'm a jazz musician and a somewhat passable free diver?
Great, good for you, stick to that so you don't end up killing people
with bad engineering work.
Peter B. P.
> "Peter B. P." wrote:
>
>
> Or the energy and materials needed ! It makes dealing with global warming look
> like a walk in the park.
>
> Those who talk of factories on the moon make me laugh. I doubt they know very
> much about factories on Earth to be honest.
In 1901, one of the Wrigt brothers said the following:
"Not in a thousand years will man every fly!".
He was wrong.
So will you be. Barring cosmic mishaps, humanity WILL conquer the solar
system, and then the stars int time.
Peter B. P.
Eeyore
"Peter B. P." wrote:
> Eeyore <rabbitsfriend...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > "Peter B. P." wrote:
> > > kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
> > > > > "Peter B. P." wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Or more likely, that will be a He3 economy.
> > > >
> > > > Mildly cranky.
> > >
> > >
> > > Nope, moron, it's only 20 years away - the chinese already have plans
> > > underway to mine He3 from the Lunar poles.
> >
> > Good Lord.
> >
> > Another moron. It must be moron season ! Is it ok to shoot them ?
> >
> > Graham
>
> It takes one to know one... does that mean it's ok to shoot you?
According to habshi the Indians plan to put a man on the mooin too !
Graham
Eeyore
"Peter B. P." wrote:
> Eeyore <rabbitsfriend...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > "Peter B. P." wrote:
> > > kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
> > > > > "Peter B. P." wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Or more likely, that will be a He3 economy.
> > > >
> > > > Mildly cranky.
> > >
> > >
> > > Nope, moron, it's only 20 years away - the chinese already have plans
> > > underway to mine He3 from the Lunar poles.
> >
> > Good Lord.
> >
> > Another moron. It must be moron season ! Is it ok to shoot them ?
> >
> > Graham
>
> It takes one to know one... does that mean it's ok to shoot you?
According to habshi the Indians plan to put a man on the moon too !
Graham
Eeyore
"Peter B. P." wrote:
> Eeyore <rabbitsfriend...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > "Peter B. P." wrote:
> >
> > Or the energy and materials needed ! It makes dealing with global warming look
> > like a walk in the park.
> >
> > Those who talk of factories on the moon make me laugh. I doubt they know very
> > much about factories on Earth to be honest.
>
> In 1901, one of the Wrigt brothers said the following:
>
> "Not in a thousand years will man every fly!".
>
> He was wrong.
>
> So will you be. Barring cosmic mishaps, humanity WILL conquer the solar
> system, and then the stars int time.
There is not remotely any comparison betwen your A and B.
Graham
Eeyore
kT wrote:
> Peter B. P. wrote:
> > Eeyore <rabbitsfriend...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> "Peter B. P." wrote:
> >>
> >> Or the energy and materials needed ! It makes dealing with global warming look
> >> like a walk in the park.
> >>
> >> Those who talk of factories on the moon make me laugh. I doubt they know very
> >> much about factories on Earth to be honest.
> >
> > In 1901, one of the Wrigt brothers said the following:
> >
> > "Not in a thousand years will man every fly!".
> >
> >
> > He was wrong.
> >
> > So will you be. Barring cosmic mishaps, humanity WILL conquer the solar
> > system, and then the stars int time.
>
> It's all about conquest, isn't it.
It's the American way.
Graham
adm
"kT" <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote in message
news:vr_Bh.29$IM...@newsfe05.lga...
> Peter B. P. wrote:
>> Eeyore <rabbitsfriend...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> "Peter B. P." wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Or the energy and materials needed ! It makes dealing with global
>>> warming look
>>> like a walk in the park.
>>>
>>> Those who talk of factories on the moon make me laugh. I doubt they know
>>> very
>>> much about factories on Earth to be honest.
>>
>> In 1901, one of the Wrigt brothers said the following:
>>
>> "Not in a thousand years will man every fly!".
>>
>>
>> He was wrong.
>>
>> So will you be. Barring cosmic mishaps, humanity WILL conquer the solar
>> system, and then the stars int time.
>
What's wrong with tourism or just living there in harmony - why does anyone
need to "conquer" anything else?
What's more, hard vacuum is a very difficult thing to "conquer". It's more a
harsh mistress that one might learn to live with. "Conquering" it is a
fool's errand.
Eeyore
kT wrote:
> And that's why the world hates you.
I'm not American.
> You pass off fascism as libertarianism. What a crock of shit.
Haven't you ever heard of sarcasm ?
Graham
Peter B. P.
> Eeyore wrote: > > kT wrote: > >> Peter B. P. wrote: >>> Eeyore
> And that's why the world hates you.
>
> You pass off fascism as libertarianism. What a crock of shit.
Well, yes you are, since you cann't understand the difference. Another
proof that your brain is on the fritz, 'Fritz.
Peter B. P.
Peter B. P.
> Peter B. P. wrote:
>
> > kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
> >
> >> Did I mention I'm a jazz musician and a somewhat passable free diver?
> >
> > Great, good for you, stick to that so you don't end up killing people
> > with bad engineering work.
>
> If you are worried about my engineering, don't come into my home.
I have wrecking crews for that.
kwag...@hotmail.com
> Peter B. P. wrote:
> > kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
>
> >> Eeyore wrote: > > kT wrote: > >> Peter B. P. wrote: >>> Eeyore
> >>>>>>>>>> Or the energy and materials needed ! It makes dealing with
> >> global warming look >>>> like a walk in the park. >>>> >>>> Those who talk
> >> of factories on the moon make me laugh. I doubt they know very >>>> much
> >> about factories on Earth to be honest. >>> In 1901, one of the Wrigt
> >> brothers said the following: >>> >>> "Not in a thousand years will man
> >> every fly!". >>> >>> >>> He was wrong. >>> >>> So will you be. Barring
> >> cosmic mishaps, humanity WILL conquer the solar >>> system, and then the
> >> stars int time. >> It's all about conquest, isn't it. > > It's the
> >> American way.
>
> >> And that's why the world hates you.
>
> >> You pass off fascism as libertarianism. What a crock of shit.
>
> > Well, yes you are, since you cann't understand the difference. Another
> > proof that your brain is on the fritz, 'Fritz.
>
> commit violence with almost every post. That's fascism in my book.
Then your book is full of wrong, idiosyncratic definitions.
Peter B. P.
> Peter B. P. wrote:
> > kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
> >
> >> Eeyore wrote: > > kT wrote: > >> Peter B. P. wrote: >>> Eeyore
> >> <rabbitsfriend...@hotmail.com> wrote: >>>> "Peter B. P." wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>> Or the energy and materials needed ! It makes dealing with
> >> global warming look >>>> like a walk in the park. >>>> >>>> Those who talk
> >> of factories on the moon make me laugh. I doubt they know very >>>> much
> >> about factories on Earth to be honest. >>> In 1901, one of the Wrigt
> >> brothers said the following: >>> >>> "Not in a thousand years will man
> >> every fly!". >>> >>> >>> He was wrong. >>> >>> So will you be. Barring
> >> cosmic mishaps, humanity WILL conquer the solar >>> system, and then the
> >> stars int time. >> It's all about conquest, isn't it. > > It's the
> >> American way.
> >>
> >> And that's why the world hates you.
> >>
> >> You pass off fascism as libertarianism. What a crock of shit.
> >
> > Well, yes you are, since you cann't understand the difference. Another
> > proof that your brain is on the fritz, 'Fritz.
>
> I'm just going by your words. You've expressed your desire to hate and
> commit violence with almost every post. That's fascism in my book.
Have I, now? Nope, sorry, you've got the wrong guy. You may want to talk
to your bong buddy, the nymshifter of many names.
Besides, fascism is more than wanton violence. Fascism is the use of
violence as a MEANS TO ACHIEVE POLITICAL CHANGE.
Get your definitions straight.
Peter B. P.
> kwag...@hotmail.com wrote: > On Feb 18, 6:34 pm, kT <cos...@lifeform.org>
> Yes, all definitions are static. Language never evolves.
Your silly redefinitions of select words to suit your own agenda does
not constitute linguistic evolution.
However, it shows your simpleminded arrogance plainly for all to see.
Peter B. P.
> Peter B. P. wrote:
>
> >>> Great, good for you, stick to that so you don't end up killing people
> >>> with bad engineering work.
>
> >> If you are worried about my engineering, don't come into my home.
>
> > I have wrecking crews for that.
>
> Of course you do, you're a fascist.
Nope, sorry. Stop smoking that bong of yours, its killing even more of
your brain cells than your regular alzheimers condition is.
kwag...@hotmail.com
>
Laughable. It's called standard English, and without it you would be
even less coherent in transmitting your already incoherent thoughts.
Your inability to define 'fascism' properly is not a sign that anyone
is a fascist. That you think so is simply more proof of your wrong
and idiosyncratic understanding of the term.
Peter B. P.
> And your posts are archived too. I could dig some up, but it would be a
> waste of time, and only confirm the obvious, that you are a closed
> fascist masquerading as a libertarian in Denmark.
Please dig them up, and let us see if you are lying or not. But I know
you are lying. It is your very nature.
And I'm still not a fascist, but a dumbfuck shithead like you wouldn't
possibly know the difference between fascmism and libertarianism.
Peter B. P.
> Peter B. P. wrote:
> > kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
> >
> >> Peter B. P. wrote:
> >>
> >>>>> Great, good for you, stick to that so you don't end up killing people
> >>>>> with bad engineering work.
>
> >>>> If you are worried about my engineering, don't come into my home.
> >>> I have wrecking crews for that.
>
> >> Of course you do, you're a fascist.
> >
> > Nope, sorry. Stop smoking that bong of yours, its killing even more of
> > your brain cells than your regular alzheimers condition is.
>
> That's what fascists do, when all else fails, smear.
BWAHAHAHAAHAHAH!!!!!!!
Pot - kettle - black!
groups.google.com is chock full of your demented smearing, denigrating,
abusive hatespeech your have vomited up over the years. Are you really
so fucking dementd you think anybody doesn't see your blatant hypocrisy?
You're tragically funny, Elifritz. Really. If IQ tests measured social
aptitude, your score woruld asymptotically approach a fat zero. You have
the social skills of a mouldy banana.
Well, actually, that's an insult to mouldy bananas everywhere.
Peter B. P.
> kwag...@hotmail.com wrote: > On Feb 18, 6:45 pm, kT <cos...@lifeform.org>
> And in french, it's spelled and pronounced completely different.
But we're not writing in french, are we, dumbfuck?
>
> > Your inability to define 'fascism' properly is not a sign that anyone is
> > a fascist. That you think so is simply more proof of your wrong and
> > idiosyncratic understanding of the term.
>
> I understand the intent. The intent is intimidation and smearing,
Which you are a veteran of.
> references to violence,
After listening to your criminally insane verbal abuse for months on
end, nobody would hold it against anyone if they wanted to smash your
skull in with a baseball bat.
Oh... oops. I guess that makes me "fascist". Oh well.
> the use of lies and propaganda,
Youre a master of that, too.
> the promotion of corporatism and authoritarianism, etc, to promote some
> agenda that has no basis in science. Your intent is clear.
And what is your agenda? Perpetuation of your mental illness for all to
see?
Get help man, and get some strong meds. You really do need them.
Peter B. P.
> Peter B. P. wrote: > kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote: > >> Peter B. P.
> wrote: >>> kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote: >>> >>>> Eeyore wrote: > > kT
> wrote: > >> Peter B. P. wrote: >>> Eeyore >>>>
> <rabbitsfriend...@hotmail.com> wrote: >>>> "Peter B. P." wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Or the energy and materials needed ! It makes dealing with
> >>>> global warming look >>>> like a walk in the park. >>>> >>>> Those who
> talk >>>> of factories on the moon make me laugh. I doubt they know very
> >>>> much >>>> about factories on Earth to be honest. >>> In 1901, one of
> the Wrigt >>>> brothers said the following: >>> >>> "Not in a thousand
> years will man >>>> every fly!". >>> >>> >>> He was wrong. >>> >>> So will
> you be. Barring >>>> cosmic mishaps, humanity WILL conquer the solar >>>
> system, and then the >>>> stars int time. >> It's all about conquest,
> isn't it. > > It's the >>>> American way. >>>> >>>> And that's why the
> world hates you. >>>> >>>> You pass off fascism as libertarianism. What a
> crock of shit. >>> Well, yes you are, since you cann't understand the
> difference. Another >>> proof that your brain is on the fritz, 'Fritz. >>
> I'm just going by your words. You've expressed your desire to hate and >>
> commit violence with almost every post. That's fascism in my book. > >
> Have I, now? Nope, sorry, you've got the wrong guy. You may want to talk >
> to your bong buddy, the nymshifter of many names. > > Besides, fascism is
> more than wanton violence. Fascism is the use of > violence as a MEANS TO
> ACHIEVE POLITICAL CHANGE.
>
> And in nearly all of your posts, in your .sig particularly, you make overt
> references to gun violence.
Oh dear. What part of "If guns kill, do pencils cause spelling errors?"
has anything to do with gun violence? Don't you understand what an
"analogy" is? Or is that fascist, as well in your demented world?
What fucking nutcase are you??
> That's the fascist modus operandi.
Your paranoid delusion shows. You need meds, now, kid. Your grip on
reality is very very weak.
>
> Intimidate and smear.
Yes, we all know your MO, kiddo.
>
> > Get your definitions straight.
>
> You mean the mathematical and scientific definitions, of course.
No, I mean verbal definitions, dumbfuck.
kwag...@hotmail.com
> > Laughable. It's called standard English, and without it you would be
> > even less coherent in transmitting your already incoherent thoughts.
>
> And in french, it's spelled and pronounced completely different.
Irrelevant but backpedalling noted.
> > Your inability to define 'fascism' properly is not a sign that anyone
> > is a fascist. That you think so is simply more proof of your wrong
> > and idiosyncratic understanding of the term.
>
> I understand the intent. The intent is intimidation and smearing,
> references to violence, the use of lies and propaganda, the promotion of
> corporatism and authoritarianism, etc, to promote some agenda that has
> no basis in science. Your intent is clear.
Is English your first language? I am guessing not. I don't think you
would be quite this incoherent if it were. If I am simply
underestimating your ability to be incoherent, I apologize.
Carbon Criminal Polluters
and open your mouth?
kwag...@hotmail.com
> Peter B. P. wrote:
> > kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
>
> >> Peter B. P. wrote:
> >>> kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
>
>
> > And I'm still not a fascist, but a dumbfuck shithead like you wouldn't
> > possibly know the difference between fascmism and libertarianism.
>
You are having some real difficulties with political terminology; I'd
suggest an introductory text.
Peter B. P.
> Peter B. P. wrote: > kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote: > >> Peter B. P.
> "If guns kill". It's at the bottom of every post.
*headdesk*
Hypothetical analogies do not constitute the threat of violence, you
fucking, lying, smearing, arrogant, demented, mentally ill dumbfuck king
of all dumbfucks.
>
> > And I'm still not a fascist, but a dumbfuck shithead like you wouldn't
> > possibly know the difference between fascmism and libertarianism.
>
> Libertarians are fascists.
You are a demented dumbfuck if you even believe that for a second. But
we already knew this.
You, sir, are a prime example why it was an grave error to stop forcibly
locking people up in mental institutions some decades back. You belong
there. You are a prime candidate for acute psyshiatric treatment. You
are not sane, and you do not belong in society among sane people.
Peter B. P.
> Peter B. P. wrote:
> > kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
> >
> >> Peter B. P. wrote:
> >>> kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Peter B. P. wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>>>> Great, good for you, stick to that so you don't end up killing people
> >>>>>>> with bad engineering work.
> >>>>>> If you are worried about my engineering, don't come into my home.
> >>>>> I have wrecking crews for that.
> >>>> Of course you do, you're a fascist.
> >>> Nope, sorry. Stop smoking that bong of yours, its killing even more of
> >>> your brain cells than your regular alzheimers condition is.
> >> That's what fascists do, when all else fails, smear.
> >
> > BWAHAHAHAAHAHAH!!!!!!!
> >
> > Pot - kettle - black!
> >
> > groups.google.com is chock full of your demented smearing, denigrating,
> > abusive hatespeech your have vomited up over the years. Are you really
> > so fucking dementd you think anybody doesn't see your blatant hypocrisy?
>
> Science is on my side, not yours.
You wouldnt even know what my side is, you demented moron.
>
> > You're tragically funny, Elifritz. Really. If IQ tests measured social
> > aptitude, your score woruld asymptotically approach a fat zero. You have
> > the social skills of a mouldy banana.
>
> Yet I possess a basic repertoire of scientific methods, which I use.
No, you don't. You use a basic repertoire of abuse and smear against
those who disagree with you. You are a classical schoolyard bully, only
the bully probably has more social skills than you do.
Youre just a little weak moron who hides behind his computer monitor,
venting your verbal abuse and everyone else, because youre too fucking
inept to survive out there in the real world.
And trust me, it shows, kiddo.
>
> When it comes to science, that's far more important than social skills.
You don't get out much, do you?
kwag...@hotmail.com
> I'm only interested in science.
An interest in understanding the terms you use could be helpful too.
Ethics and politics wouldn't hurt either. Art is nice. You shouldn't
restrict yourself like that.
> Since your objections to carbon dioxide induced global warming and
> climate change have no basis in science, then your objections to the
> science of climate change and global warming must be political.
In part they are, in part you haven't proved your case. Put those
together and they make an exceedingly good reason not to take your
conclusions at face value.
kwag...@hotmail.com
> > Your paranoid delusion shows. You need meds, now, kid. Your grip on
> > reality is very very weak.
>
> Politics is not reality.
Can you quantify that? LOL
Peter B. P.
wrote:
> Peter Bjørn Perlsø :: When Exxon Pisses in your face, do you smile
> and open your mouth?
Fucking idiot. I have no sympahies with Exxon or any other Big Corp.
Peter B. P.
Peter B. P.
> Wow, wonderful meltdown Borg. Since your objections to carbon dioxide
> induced global warming and climate change have no basis in science, and
> your website is filled with political demagoguery, then your objections
> to science must be political.
Now listen up, Elifritz, because my patience with your idiocy is wearing
dangerously thin:
I do not object to AGW. I object to shortsighted political action that
will do harm to the global economy while doing little or nothing to stop
global warming, or serve big-government statist political interests,
such as Kyoto is currently doing.
Is that clear? Or do I have to spell it out for you?
Exxon Liars & Thieves
helping OILY INC rule the world, = FASCISM
Here's the crime record of one vice-president candidate of the
"Libertarian Exxon Front Party"
Instead of arguing, the links to the record of his funders is posted:
Koch Industries called Organized Crime on National TV by brother Bill
Koch. These are the people you should know and decide that they are
your preferred choice to bring you information by their hirlings like
"Bawana".
http://snipurl.com/pk51
Google Results for "Charles G. Koch Summer Fellows" CATO Institute.
http://snipurl.com/pk5l
Google Results 1 - 100 of about 535 for Koch Interns Cato Institute,
Heritage, Hudson Institute, Competitive Enterprise Institute.
http://snipurl.com/pk57
Google Results 1 - 100 of about 191 for "Koch Industries" "Organized
Crime".
http://snipurl.com/pk5f
Google Results 1 - 100 of about 679 for Killer Koch Industries,
Smalley.
News
Also, The Koch Pipeline Co., LP, another subsidiary of Koch
Industries, had agreed to pay some $35 million in fines and penalties
for violations of the ...
http://waternet.com/news.asp?mode=4&N_ID=14430 - 16k
News
Koch hit with record Clean Water Act fine. HOUSTON - The Koch
Pipeline Co., ... of Koch Industries, Inc. in Wichita, KS, has agreed
to pay some $35 million ...
http://waternet.com/news.asp?mode=4&N_ID=11149 - 16k
Forbes.com: Forbes Faces: The Koch Brothers
In September 1999, Koch Industries paid $8 million in damages after
a ... It was forced to pay a $35 million settlement for 300 separate
oil spills in six ...
http://www.forbes.com/2001/01/04/0104faces.html - 27k
Forbes.com: Forbes World's Richest People 2001
Brothers Charles and David run Koch Industries, the $35 billion
oil ... mishap in its Corpus Christi refinery; the company agreed to
pay a $20 million fine. ...
http://www.forbes.com/finance/lists/10/2001/LIR.jhtml?passListId=10&passYear=2001&passListType=Person&am...
- 70k
StealthPacs.org | Overview of Citizens for a Sound Economy (CSE ...
CSE co-founder David H. Koch is a member of Cato's board of directors.
13 Koch ... of Koch Industries, an oil and gas company that paid a $35
million fine in ...
http://www.stealthpacs.org/profile.cfm?Org_ID=162 - 31k
July/August 2002 - Sierra Magazine - Sierra Club
In January, Koch Industries agreed to pay about $35 million for
violations of the Clean ... but also to pay a $1 million fine for air-
pollution violations. ...
http://www.sierraclub.org/sierra/200207/thinktank.asp - 41k
David H. Koch - SourceWatch
Koch Industries received a $30000000.00 criminal fine in March
2000: ... for more than 300 oil spills in five states, prompting a
penalty of $35 million. ...
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=David_H._Koch - 14k
The Center for Public Integrity
The owners of Koch Industries, the nation's second wealthiest
privately owned business, the brothers were recently given a $35
million federal fine in ...
http://www.publicintegrity.org/report.aspx?aid=508 - 35k
The Center for Public Integrity
The brothers own Koch Industries, the nation's second wealthiest
privately owned business, which was recently given a $35 million
federal fine in connection ...
http://www.publicintegrity.org/report.aspx?aid=537 - 61k
[ More results from www.publicintegrity.org ]
Endgame Directory of Transnational Corporations
A federal judge in Austin, TX, has approved a record $35 million civil
fine against Kansas-based Koch Industries, ending lawsuits involving
about 300 oil ...
http://www.endgame.org/dtc/k.html - 47k
EMS Pipeline Services - Regulatory Compliance
Those who fail to comply face penalties, which are already reaching
record highs, including a $35 million fine for Koch Industries. ...
http://www.emspipeline.net/compliance/index.asp - 19k
The Clear and Present Danger of the Sociopathic Insanity of David ...
The owners of KOCH INDUSTRIES, the nation's second wealthiest
privately owned business, the brothers were recently given a $35
million federal fine in ...
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Killer_David_Koch.html - 71k
Organized Crime Ring - Killer Koch's Citizens for a Sound Economy
Not surprisingly, the industry has lavished more than $440 million
over the past six ... and Koch and Ashcroft settled the lawsuit for a
$20 million fine, ...
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/CSE_Organized_Crime.html - 67k
Environmental Defense - Press Release: Environmental Defense Says ...
Today's proposed fine compares unfavorably to the $35 million fine the
US Environmental Protection Agency levied against Koch Industries,
Inc. in January of ...
http://www.environmentaldefense.org/pressrelease.cfm?ContentID=1230 -
23k
Peter B. P.
> >>> And I'm still not a fascist, but a dumbfuck shithead like you wouldn't
> >>> possibly know the difference between fascmism and libertarianism.
> >> Libertarians are fascists.
> >
> > You are having some real difficulties with political terminology; I'd
> > suggest an introductory text.
>
> I'm only interested in science.
>
> Since your objections to carbon dioxide induced global warming and
> climate change have no basis in science, then your objections to the
> science of climate change and global warming must be political.
You're in broken record mode.
Take your meds.
Peter B. P.
> Politics is not reality.
But your insanity clearly is very very real.
Exxon Liars & Thieves
helping OILY INC rule the world, = FASCISM
Instead of arguing, the links to the record of his funders is posted:
Peter B. P.
> Yes, you might go postal and start invoking violence any second now.
Sorry to disappint you, moron, but I will not. That's only in your sick
mind.
> > I do not object to AGW. I object to shortsighted political action that
> > will do harm to the global economy while doing little or nothing to stop
> > global warming, or serve big-government statist political interests,
> > such as Kyoto is currently doing.
>
> In other words, you object to science for political reasons.
Kyoto is not science, it IS POLITICS, you dumb fucking moron.
> >
> > Is that clear? Or do I have to spell it out for you?
>
> I can spell it out for you. You are a F A S C I S T masquerading as a
> Libertarian.
You are a lying, hateful, smearing, dumbfuck, demented moron
masquerading as a scientist.
> Kyoto has nothing to do with science
AT least you recognize it for what it is.
Now take your meds, you idiot dumbfuck.
Peter B. P.
> Definition of "Libertarianism" = a Corporate Organized Crime Front
> helping OILY INC rule the world, = FASCISM
>
> Here's the crime record of one vice-president candidate of the
> "Libertarian Exxon Front Party"
Here's a wake up call for you. You really need to get your facts
straight:
http://www.lewrockwell.com/long/long15.html
"In short, the 19th-century libertarians observed the rise of the
various tendencies that would come together to make fascism –
militarism, corporatism, regimentation, nationalist chauvinism,
plutocracy in populist guise, the call for "strong leaders" and
"national greatness," the glorification of conflict over commerce and of
brute force over intellect – and they bitterly opposed the whole
package."
http://blog.lewrockwell.com/lewrw/archives/000258.html
"...as I explained our opposition to the military-industrial complex and
our true free market position as against corporatism which raises up
"businessmen" who know how to play politics rather than how to meet the
needs of consumers."
http://blog.mises.org/archives/003537.asp
"Bush and Oil: Partners in Corporatism"
http://www.mises.org/journals/lar/pdfs/3_2/3_2_4.pdf
And lots more on Lew Rockwell, mises.org and so on.
Stop posting your usual bullshit, and actually learn something about
libertarianismbefor eyou talk about it. Libertarians are NOT
CORPORATIST.
Exxon Liars & Thieves
> Exxon Liars & Thieves <Exxon.Liars.and.Thie...@Exxon-Turds.info> wrote:
>
> > Definition of "Libertarianism" = a Corporate Organized Crime Front
> > helping OILY INC rule the world, = FASCISM
>
> > Here's the crime record of one vice-president candidate of the
> > "Libertarian Exxon Front Party"
>
> Here's a wake up call for you. You really need to get your facts
> straight:
>
> Stop posting your usual bullshit, and actually learn something about
> libertarianismbefor eyou talk about it. Libertarians are NOT
> CORPORATIST.
Definition of "Libertarianism" = a Corporate Organized Crime Front
helping OILY INC rule the world, = FASCISM
Instead of arguing, the links to the record of his funders is posted: