Computer recs?
GC
Hello everyone,
I'm eagerly awaiting the arrival of Oblivion, and thinking about my new
computer. I already need it to play some of my newer games like RC
Tycoon 3 (it will run, but is slow even with reduced settings). I plan
to get a new computer very soon, with the latest and greatest.
Any suggestions where to go to get the best deal? My husband likes
Dell, but I really don't. That's what I have now, and while it is ok
(runs Morrowind nicely), it's, well...a Dell.
I know there are companies where you can put together your system a la
carte--any recommendations? We don't want to build our own system
(although I suppose we could if the savings warranted it).
Any advice is greatly appreciated, or if there is another newsgroup more
appropriate to post to, let me know.
Thanks,
Dawn
Zanziba
for money.
Can you get one and then drop in an expensive graphics card?
--
Zan
"GC" <im_out_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:Vp4lf.64517$qw.63922@fed1read07...
Lex
> The IT network manager i work with seems to think dell are exceptional
value
> for money.
>
> Can you get one and then drop in an expensive graphics card?
>
Yes, although some Dell's use integrated graphics and it needs to be turned
off... somehow. We did exactly that with my sister's computer, and we never
had any problems with it. Apart from breaching the warranty to put the
graphics card in, we have seen nothing but bonuses from this, and it was
cheap and almost guaranteed to work 'from the box'.
It's perfect for someone not wanting to spend a great deal and who isn't
experienced in building their own pc's - apart from sticking the graphics
card in. (However you can get models with *better* graphics, at a cost)
Stratotanker
I would recommd you go to www.newegg.com or even www.outpost.com they
do have pre-built and bare bones systems... but I find the REAL value
on NewEggs individual parts. I too will be building a new system so I
can jam the graphics to MAX as soon as I get Oblivion in my hands!!
At the moment I'm looking at an AMD X2 with dual PCI Express 16 bit
video cards and a 10,000 RPM SATA Western Digital Raptor for the OS
and misc system files to reside... the secondary drive will probably
be either a WD SATA 250 GB or 400 GB drive... have not decided yet.
Either way... look at NewEgg first!
Cheers,
-Stratotanker
On Mon, 05 Dec 2005 16:54:14 -0700, GC <im_out_...@yahoo.com>
wrote:
Michael Hughes
> ...Any recommendations [on a new computer]? We don't want to build our
> own system (although I suppose we could if the savings warranted it).
The money saved definitely warrants it, and actually building the machine
isn't nearly as complicated as the process of choosing components would have
you believe.
Try asking around in comp.hardware and alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt for
advice concerning what components you should choose. You'll generally be
looking for a mainboard with PCI Express that handles 64-bit processors made
by AMD. At the moment, this limits you to two socket choices: socket 754,
which is obsolete, but probably just fine for your purposes, or socket 939,
which will accommodate some more exotic processor options and has a delayed,
but nontheless inevitable death.
The rest of your purchases should fall in line with your mainboard choice.
Decisions of smaller consequence shouldn't haunt you too much -- remember,
prebuilt manufacturers probably pay just the same, if not less attention to
such things (some would say it's intentional, even, all in the name of
keeping users in an upgrade cycle -- but, on the other hand, "never attrib-
ute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity" comes to mind
upon thinking this).
--
Passion is inversely proportional to the amount of real information available.
- Benford's Law of Controversy
GC
Thanks for the advice. My husband is going to price out the components,
but he seems to think the sites where you can pick out your components
(like IBUYPOWER and Cyberpower) have some edge on getting the parts
cheaper because they buy in bulk. Methinks he just doesn't want to
build it :-).
I love that saying--it will come in handy when my in-laws accomplish
their next (and inevitable) act of unbelievable insensitivity.
Dawn
GC
> Dawn,
> I would recommd you go to www.newegg.com or even www.outpost.com they
> do have pre-built and bare bones systems... but I find the REAL value
> on NewEggs individual parts. I too will be building a new system so I
> can jam the graphics to MAX as soon as I get Oblivion in my hands!!
>
> At the moment I'm looking at an AMD X2 with dual PCI Express 16 bit
> video cards and a 10,000 RPM SATA Western Digital Raptor for the OS
> and misc system files to reside... the secondary drive will probably
> be either a WD SATA 250 GB or 400 GB drive... have not decided yet.
>
> Either way... look at NewEgg first!
>
> Cheers,
> -Stratotanker
>
but my husband seems to think I can get by with one video card for now.
He's all about saving money, unless it comes to his media center PC
(ahem). I think our main focus will be expandability so that I can
upgrade and perhaps my computer won't be entirely obsolete next year.
Dawn
Michael Hughes
> Michael Hughes wrote:
>
>> GC wrote:
>>
>>> ...Any recommendations [on a new computer]? We don't want to build our
>>> own system (although I suppose we could if the savings warranted it).
>>
>> The money saved definitely warrants it...
>
> ...The sites where you can pick out your components (like IBUYPOWER and
> Cyberpower) have some edge on getting the parts cheaper because they buy
> in bulk.
You speak as if this supposed power translates into any gain on your end.
IBUYPOWER's $US794 special can be cut down to $US410 if you eliminate super-
flouous novelties like neon lights and a transparent case featuring a paint-
ing of a dragon -- and this is on the low-end, where the price difference is
supposed to be negligible, or even in _favor_ of prebuilts. Anything more
than the cursory examination of alternatives that I've provided should yield
results even more favorable to system building, as should research into any-
thing more specific to your needs, which surpass the $US794 special.
Zanziba
"Lex" <Lexam...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4394e9db$0$32250$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
I've been looking at upgrading my old system and it appears cheaper than
trying a build from scratch.
--
Zan
Michael Hughes
>>> ...Dell are exceptional value for money.
>
> [A prebuilt] appears cheaper than trying a build from scratch.
That's only assuming that you meet the following requirements:
* You get the rebate cards filed in triplicate and notarized, three years
after purchase, but not any later than three years and thirty-six hours
after purchase.
Prebuilt manufacturers, and Dell especially, lie about their prices. The
most despicable method of doing this, by far, has historically been the
rebate scam. Rebate work at Dell is subcontracted equally to three part-
ies -- Gator, 180Solutions, and the Russian mafia.
* You won't actually use the computer -- just look at it.
Warranties offered through prebuilt dealerships are by far more flimsy
and have a reduced lifetime compared to warranties offered through the
manufacturer, or even parts retailer, and, by definition, are broken for
the entire machine due to tampering with a single component. I may need
to contact my lawyer on this, too, but it looks like one of Dell's warra-
nties is actually a contract legally indemnifying them from damages, sho-
uld the package contain a mailbomb instead of a computer (I guess Syria
got subcontracted for that one).
* You really, _desperately_ need to match hardware.
Often times, an analog in performance to the prebuilt of choice can be
produced using radically different -- and much cheaper -- hardware, espe-
cially when non-retail component sources come into play (not necessarily
eBay and your neighbor Ted; components from a previous computer work mir-
acles.
* You really, _desperately_ need to get the bundled software.
Most of these "studies" include the cost of software. If you already
have a Windows license, then the person writing the study is in real tro-
uble should the gap between a prebuilt and self-assembled computer run
any less than $US400. Besides that, a license to use intellectual prope-
rty is of a completely arbitrary value that's made up on the spot. If
Dell wanted to gouge their prices just a little bit more, they could bun-
dle software that they made themselves with the computer, charge $US15000
for it at retail, and claim the difference as all advantage.
* You heart vendor lock-in.
Most of the major pre-built manufacturers (and, once again, Dell in part-
icular) *insist* on using deeply proprietary interfaces between core sys-
tem components, locking you into using the Pentium, an inferior and over-
priced product made by a group of convicted monopolists. Often times,
virtually all of the bundled software *must* be installed from the same
boot disk that is used to wipe the disk clean and install Windows, which
happens to be another inferior and overpriced product made by a group of
convicted monopolists.
* You won't upgrade it. Ever.
It is very well-known that many prebuilt manufacturers take painstaking
measures to solder critical system components onto the mainboard and make
space for them by ripping out the slots necessary to use expansion cards.
Try as hard as I might, though, I can't find any sinister reason that
would compel them to do this, so I'll just move on...
Michael Hughes
> I was also looking at the AMD X2, but my husband seems to think I can get
> by with one video card for now.
AMD X2 is the name of AMD's dual-core technology -- it allows two distinct
processors to share the same socket, producing a performance boost for appl-
ications compiled with optimizations for multiple processors (Oblivion will
be counted among these). However, each processor operates at a lower clock
speed than its single-cored equivalent, meaning that performance suffers
with single-threaded applications.
You're mistaking this with the technologies that allow one to have two video
cards serve a single display space -- ATi's Crossfire, nVidia's SLi, and
Dell's VaporWare. Optimizations for this happen at the system level, and
it's primarily an option for upgrading, the rationale behind it being that
if each generation of graphics card doubles the speed and reduces the price
of older components, it would be somewhat cheaper to just pop in a second
graphics card of the previous generation. However, reality diverges from
that slightly in that speed with two graphics cards doesn't double, precise-
ly.
Stratotanker
Hold your husbands feet to the FIRE!!
Don't let him short change you... if he has his toys you can have
yours!!!
Cheers,
-Stratotanker
GC
> My man Michael speaks the truth...
> Hold your husbands feet to the FIRE!!
> Don't let him short change you... if he has his toys you can have
> yours!!!
> Cheers,
> -Stratotanker
>
Well, he checked and lo and behold, discovered that you CAN build one
cheaper yourself :-). I guess there was a time that was true, and then
it wasn't true, and he just assumed that it still wasn't true (if indeed
it ever was NOT true--this is getting confusing...).
His feet are out of danger for now. Besides, I'm the one who plays the
most computer games and video games in this house, so I need the best
computer possible, right?
Dawn
GC
> GC wrote:
>
>
>>Michael Hughes wrote:
>>
>>
>>>GC wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>...Any recommendations [on a new computer]? We don't want to build our
>>>>own system (although I suppose we could if the savings warranted it).
>>>
>>>The money saved definitely warrants it...
>>
>>...The sites where you can pick out your components (like IBUYPOWER and
>>Cyberpower) have some edge on getting the parts cheaper because they buy
>>in bulk.
>
>
> You speak as if this supposed power translates into any gain on your end.
> IBUYPOWER's $US794 special can be cut down to $US410 if you eliminate super-
> flouous novelties like neon lights and a transparent case featuring a paint-
> ing of a dragon -- and this is on the low-end, where the price difference is
> supposed to be negligible, or even in _favor_ of prebuilts. Anything more
> than the cursory examination of alternatives that I've provided should yield
> results even more favorable to system building, as should research into any-
> thing more specific to your needs, which surpass the $US794 special.
Actually, it wasn't ME speaking, it was my husband, through me, but
symantics, schemantics....
He has since discovered that he can build one cheaper than buy one, just
as you said. However, I kind of like the neon lights and transparent
cases with dragons ;-). But you can do that yourself, too, as a friend
of ours has proved.
Dawn
GC
LMAO!!! Great stuff, and chock full of useful information too. You
should have your own blog. I like your style.
Dawn
GC
I was just responding to his post bit by bit, not equating the AMD X2
with the two video card capability. Although admittedly I don't have a
clue about either (other than that AMD is reputed to be much better than
Pentium). I am more computer savvy than your average bear, but not
anywhere near your level of knowledge.
So is it worth it to have two graphics cards, in your opinion?
Dawn
markB
>
> I was just responding to his post bit by bit, not equating the AMD X2
> with the two video card capability. Although admittedly I don't have a
> clue about either (other than that AMD is reputed to be much better than
> Pentium). I am more computer savvy than your average bear, but not
> anywhere near your level of knowledge.
>
> So is it worth it to have two graphics cards, in your opinion?
>
Coming in a bit late :) But I use Dell exclusively. I buy them for the
nonprofit I work for and at home. Most recent deal: Dim9150, 3 Ghz P3
Dual Core, 2 Gigs RAM, 160 meg HD, Radeon X600 256 Hypermemory, 24"
widescreen flat panel, DVD burner, for $1434. I've only had good
support, though rarely needed. The Radeon was just a slot-filler,
waiting for Oblivion to come out, but Morrowind runs flawlessly on this
box. Their prices change quickly on the web, so you have to keep checking.
-mb
GC
My husband was considering Dell, which is what I have now, but after we
thought about it we decided to build our own so that we can upgrade it
later and perhaps not have to buy everything new again in a year :-).
It should be interesting...LOL.
Dawn