VATSIM - error installing FSInn
Gregory
Per a recent email from a Sim-bud, I'm trying to get on VATSIM.
http://forums.vatsim.net/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=20466
There was an error when installing FSCopilot:
http://home.comcast.net/~flightsim/FSFDT_395.png
http://home.comcast.net/~flightsim/FSFDT_396.png
The .dll installed in FS9 ok, but it seems the directory for FSX was
incorrect (see above). It should be.. E:\Flight Simulator X
There was no uninstall capability so I did a System Restore. Is the
software sloppy or did I make a mistake? Please advise.
-G
Grunt
programs to install and you have to do them in the right order. If you
had it installed (or a previous version uninstall it). Also there is
only one version that works with fSX and it's the beta one - there is no
release and hasn't been for 3-4 years.
Frankly, I just use Squawkbox 4. I know FSInn is popular but FSInn was
beta three years ago, still is, and is no longer developed. It has a
lot of fancy features but it's got a lot of issues. Once you install it
you have to run the program from the menu and make sure that some of
it's modules run as administrator. Then you have to disable the media
player (I think that's the module) or you get errors.
Also, when I go to the forums and the English language section is
labeled "The Getto" it says something <G>. I'm not that sensitive about
things like that but it indicates a general attitude.
Danny
un-installed the files. You might have to (must) manually remove ALL
RELATED folders and files from any previous installation before you try to
re-install it.
System restore might have been a bit extreme, me thinks. Before you
re-install, if you choose to re-install, I suggest you check and double
check the installation directory to see if the folders are GONE!
There is a small program you can d/l here:
http://flightsim.apollo3.com/files/fs-files.html called FSXfix.exe. It will
correct a registry entry that might not point to your currently installed
FSX directory. I had to use this initially after I installed FSx on my
laptop.
If you have anything from NORTON antivirus on your computer, likely you will
not get FSInn to work properly even if you can get it installed. As Grunt
stated, it must be in the proper order but normally FSInn will look for
FSCopilot and will stop if FSCopilot is not found.
I have been using FSinn for several years with FS9 with no problems to speak
of. I use a wireless router and have shut down the windows firewall on my
computer and use AVGFree antivirus. FSInn worked great with WinXP on an
earlier computer and was a bit aggravating, initially, with Vista 32, but I
am using Vista 32 for 18 months now. I am currently running FS9 and FS10
and connecting to our club's private server as well as Vatsim's
servers,(when I choose to do so).
RUN THE INSTALLERS AS ADMINISTRATOR, by right clicking the exe files, even
if your user ID has admin rights.
Or, as suggested, try Squawkbox. The last time I used SB was likely 5 or 6
years ago, so I know nutt'in about it, but I'm sure Grunt & the Vatsim Help
Forum can get you connected.
Danny
"Gregory" <flights...@bkwds.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:u4v1e55k2jpdqo0d9...@4ax.com...
Grunt
fine and doesn't have the hassle FSInn does. I never used all the fancy
gizmos in FSInn anyway <G>.
Danny wrote:
> The Control Panel's 'ADD AND REMOVE PROGRAMS" feature should have
> un-installed the files. You might have to (must) manually remove ALL
> RELATED folders and files from any previous installation before you try
> to re-install it.
>
L. D. James
users are very quick to respone to tech support questions for FSInn. The
resolutions usually don't work and the suggestions are always followed up
with telling the users to switch to Squawkbox.
If you look at the support forums you'll see just as many support issues
with Squawkbox as with FSInn. The only difference is that support for
Squawkbox is followed up focus for Squawkbox. I'll try to have your topic
focused on FSInn. If there's a problem, it's always something very minor.
Anyway, The link you posted below should get you up and running with the 4
quick steps. It goes from the inistial download to the first successful
connection. After that you're a single click away after having started
Flight Simulator. I see you were told to make FSInn modules are run as
administrator, but you'll see in the link you posted that only Flight
Simulator should be marked to run in the elevated mode.
Try following the steps in the link. Review the troubleshooting section in
the link and post your results.
By the way, just before clicking on the post option I reviewed your message.
Your problem will be resolved by running the fsxfix.exe program as
suggessted by one of the other uses who posted.
You can find it in the FSInn/VATSIM FAQ linked on the page you posted. It
described the issue and described the resolution which happens to be to grab
fsxfix.exe from the download section of http://flightsim.apollo3.com .
-- L. James
--
L. D. James
lja...@apollo3.com
www.apollo3.com/~ljames
"Gregory" <flights...@bkwds.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:u4v1e55k2jpdqo0d9...@4ax.com...
>
L. D. James
news:hbqv6s$ua9$1...@news.albasani.net...
> Did you install the two in the right order. If I remember there are two
> programs to install and you have to do them in the right order. If you
> had it installed (or a previous version uninstall it).
Hi, Grunt. The order doesn't matter because the install program will only
install based on the required order. With some of the earlier versions it
did matter.
> Also there is only one version that works with fSX and it's the beta
> one - there is no release and hasn't been for 3-4 years.
That's the way it is with VATSIM at this time. The developer of FSInn was
very diligent to give access to the working program while they waited for
the bugs to be removed from the simconnect API of FSX. It was clearly
announced.
>
> Frankly, I just use Squawkbox 4. I know FSInn is popular but FSInn was
> beta three years ago, still is, and is no longer developed.
While the question was about FSInn, this is the same with Squawkbox. It's
very popular. Is in Beta, and is no longer developed.
> It has a lot of fancy features but it's got a lot of issues. Once you
> install it you have to run the program from the menu and make sure that
> some of it's modules run as administrator.
Not true. The installation steps provided states against this. This will
cause the application to fail. That's why it's in the short four step
installation guide which won't fail.
> Then you have to disable the media player (I think that's the module) or
> you get errors.
Totally not relevant in any way.
>
> Also, when I go to the forums and the English language section is labeled
> "The Getto" it says something <G>. I'm not that sensitive about things
> like that but it indicates a general attitude.
I guess I can understand you might not like the application if you don't
like the developers. Anyway, support for FSInn and VATSIM is provided on
VATSIM. You really don't have to have contact with the developers. But of
course, they aren't that bad if you get to know them.
Your effort to help is of course appreciated. I just thought I'd clear up
some of the misconception of FSInn and using it. VATSIM has two excellent
clients. I think it'd be nice to have a user see the merit in the one they
happen to choose. There are rarely issues with FSInn. If there is one, it's
usually something simple like having the application blocked by a third
party firewall/antivirus program. This happens with any application that
using the Internet. Unfortunately when a person asks a simple question
about FSInn a number of people will jump in and suggest dropping the
application.
L. D. James
"Grunt" <grun...@charter.ent> wrote in message
> SB version 4 is for FSX and works well. Not fancy but it works just fine
> and doesn't have the hassle FSInn does. I never used all the fancy gizmos
> in FSInn anyway <G>.
>
I've used both. I don't find a hassle with either. I find it easier to
support FSInn because it's easier to use. There are just as many people
having problems with Squawbox as there are having problems with FSInn.
For some reason many Squakbox users are on a campaign to get the FSInn users
to using Squawkbox. I don't see why it should be so important to try to
force the user to change clients.
There is a very similar recurring problem when as the one this user just has
with FSInn in installing Squawbox. Something happens to the registry every
once and then. When the person posts the question they are not bombarded
suggestions to change clients. They are just told to run a registry repair
tool.
Bill
"L. D. James" <lja...@apollo3.com> wrote in message
news:e--dncxlII0D6XzX...@posted.choiceonecommunications...
>
> "Grunt" <grun...@charter.ent> wrote in message
> news:hbr65l$86t$2...@news.albasani.net...
>> SB version 4 is for FSX and works well. Not fancy but it works just fine
>> and doesn't have the hassle FSInn does. I never used all the fancy
>> gizmos in FSInn anyway <G>.
>>
>
> I've used both. I don't find a hassle with either. I find it easier to
> support FSInn because it's easier to use. There are just as many people
> having problems with Squawbox as there are having problems with FSInn.
>
Larry I have both working on my system with FSX and vista.
I happen to prefer FSInn as it has many more useful workable features,
especially being able to use the weather on VATSIM
I do not campaign for anyone to switch. People can do what they want and
whatever works for them.
I think the support you have provided to VATSIM users is excellent and the
install steps you have posted in the forum works as advertised.
Thanks
Bill
Grunt
L. D. James wrote:
> "Grunt" <grun...@charter.ent> wrote in message
> news:hbqv6s$ua9$1...@news.albasani.net...
>> Did you install the two in the right order. If I remember there are
>> two programs to install and you have to do them in the right order.
>> If you had it installed (or a previous version uninstall it).
>
> Hi, Grunt. The order doesn't matter because the install program will
> only install based on the required order. With some of the earlier
> versions it did matter.
Yes, the order does matter because if you do it wrong even if it tells
you then there is an uninstall. I was trying to save the OP some hassle.
>> Also there is only one version that works with fSX and it's the beta
>> one - there is no release and hasn't been for 3-4 years.
>
> That's the way it is with VATSIM at this time. The developer of FSInn
> was very diligent to give access to the working program while they
> waited for the bugs to be removed from the simconnect API of FSX. It
> was clearly announced.
>
Except that there has been no development or work on FSInn for several
years - at least two years - and from what I've seen they don't plan on
further work. I would think that by now they would have been able to
sort out the issues. If not they never will as Simconnect is not being
developed anymore since Aces was disbanded.
Also, I'm not a "avid SB user". I started with FSInn some time ago and
have used it extensively - meaning I've had to install it several times
and I've used it on VatSim and other MP venues quite a bit.
>>
>> Frankly, I just use Squawkbox 4. I know FSInn is popular but FSInn
>> was beta three years ago, still is, and is no longer developed.
>
> While the question was about FSInn, this is the same with Squawkbox.
> It's very popular. Is in Beta, and is no longer developed.
>
No - I think you'd better check on that. SB4 has been released at
http://www.squawkbox.ca/ and has an active forum. It's a lot newer than
FSInn. On the other hand FSInn is still Beta and has been for at least
a couple of years.
>> It has a lot of fancy features but it's got a lot of issues. Once you
>> install it you have to run the program from the menu and make sure
>> that some of it's modules run as administrator.
>
> Not true. The installation steps provided states against this. This
> will cause the application to fail. That's why it's in the short four
> step installation guide which won't fail.
>
>> Then you have to disable the media player (I think that's the module)
>> or you get errors.
>
> Totally not relevant in any way.
>
Very relevant when you get errors upon exiting FSX - and you do get a
dialog error that you have to close. Checking the forums shows it's a
known issue and you have to disable the media player to fix it.
>>
>> Also, when I go to the forums and the English language section is
>> labeled "The Getto" it says something <G>. I'm not that sensitive
>> about things like that but it indicates a general attitude.
>
> I guess I can understand you might not like the application if you don't
> like the developers. Anyway, support for FSInn and VATSIM is provided
> on VATSIM. You really don't have to have contact with the developers.
> But of course, they aren't that bad if you get to know them.
Well, my dislike of FSInn came from extensive use of it and it was after
that I actually got into the forums and site. Unfortunately you can't
always separate the app from the developers. There are many apps that
are good but the people who support them have such bad attitudes that
the app isn't worth using because of the support response. I have
several apps in this category both in the FS world and in my work.
>
> Your effort to help is of course appreciated. I just thought I'd clear
> up some of the misconception of FSInn and using it. VATSIM has two
> excellent clients. I think it'd be nice to have a user see the merit in
> the one they happen to choose. There are rarely issues with FSInn. If
> there is one, it's usually something simple like having the application
> blocked by a third party firewall/antivirus program. This happens with
> any application that using the Internet. Unfortunately when a person
> asks a simple question about FSInn a number of people will jump in and
> suggest dropping the application.
>
> -- L. James
>
Yes, there are two clients and both are usable. Which one a user
decides on is up to him but he needs information on both. As for rarely
an issue with FSInn I'll argue that point based on my experience and the
extensive searches I had to do to find fixes to things like the exit
dialog error, the fact you need to run the FSInn app from the program
menu first before running it from FSX, and the changes needed under
Vista to set it to run as Admin. Just running FSFix isn't always going
to fix things - I never had to run it. Granted once you go through all
that it runs fine. Since Gregory is having issues with the install my
comments (and others) are entirely appropriate. There are issues during
install and set up that must be addressed to get FSInn to work and
Gregory needs to know them. I found the answeres by spending a lot of
my valuable time digging through various websites so I can't see that
telling someone about the issues and fixes to save him some time is not
appropriate.
Suggesting another client is also a perfectly valid suggestion. I've
been grateful for such suggestions when I've been in this situation. I
may not take the suggestions but at least I have alternatives to check
out and decide. Gregory has had a very interesting time getting things
going for FSX in general and he may want to know about another client.
Ultimately the decision will be his based on what he likes and what he
can get installed. For me the decision was made after using both.
In short the comments I and others have made are not to bash FSInn but
to help Gregory get a working VATSim/MP client no matter which it is.
Are you associated with FSInn in some way or have a vested interest in
it as you seem over sensitive to our comments.
Grunt
easily fixed and then they have the startup issue (have to run from the
menu first), set run as admin under Vista/Win7, the exit dialog issue
(disable a FSInn feature).
I really don't care what people use nor do most of the others here.
We're just trying to help Gregory and others and suggesting another
client is valid. You seem to be extra sensitive about it.
I've run both extensively and the main issue I've had with FSInn are the
setup issues and the fact it's still Beta and has been for at least a
couple of years with no sign of it being picked up again. For me I
didn't want to invest any more time in a application that isn't going to
be developed or supported.
Gregory
the following to our attention:
SB sure does NOT look fancy. It seems like something from the early
Windows NT years. FSInn would appear to be ok.. and I need to get
over the `hump� and into VATSIM. The installation problem was minor.
It probably could have been solved by manually copying the .dll to
the FSX \modules directory. Since the install failed, there was no entry
in the Add & Remove Software section of Control Panel.
To go over the issues briefly.. FSInn has a slight installation
directory issue? and there is a shutdown error when exiting FSX?
I'm always running as an administrator, so what is the install issue
again? When do you run the registry fix? before or after the install?
Can you make a simple bulleted list of one-liners (please.) :))
Assuming all that is ok.. will I need a headset with mic? Also in what
way does the user sync the weather so that both the client and the
controller are under the same Wx (wind) conditions?
I'll be flying GA twin turboprops and single-isle jets/jetliners.
-G
sorry for being a bit dense...
>I really don't care what people use nor do most of the others here.
>We're just trying to help Gregory and others and suggesting another
>client is valid. You seem to be extra sensitive about it.
>
>I've run both extensively and the main issue I've had with FSInn are the
>setup issues and the fact it's still Beta and has been for at least a
>couple of years with no sign of it being picked up again. For me I
>didn't want to invest any more time in a application that isn't going to
>be developed or supported.
>
>L. D. James wrote:
>>
>> "Grunt" <grun...@charter.ent> wrote in message
>>
Gregory
the following to our attention:
>The Control Panel's 'ADD AND REMOVE PROGRAMS" feature should have
>un-installed the files. You might have to (must) manually remove ALL
>RELATED folders and files from any previous installation before you try to
>re-install it.
>
>System restore might have been a bit extreme, me thinks. Before you
>re-install, if you choose to re-install, I suggest you check and double
>check the installation directory to see if the folders are GONE!
>
>There is a small program you can d/l here:
>http://flightsim.apollo3.com/files/fs-files.html called FSXfix.exe. It will
>correct a registry entry that might not point to your currently installed
>FSX directory. I had to use this initially after I installed FSx on my
>laptop.
Ok.. that was easy enough: http://home.comcast.net/~flightsim/FSXFix.png
The end ` \ � makes the difference? Many other FSX add ins do not trip
over the syntax character in the registry.
{ more below }
>If you have anything from NORTON antivirus on your computer, likely you will
>not get FSInn to work properly even if you can get it installed. As Grunt
>stated, it must be in the proper order but normally FSInn will look for
>FSCopilot and will stop if FSCopilot is not found.
>
>FSInn worked great with WinXP on an earlier computer and was a bit aggravating,
>initially, with Vista 32, but I am using Vista 32 for 18 months now. I am currently
>running FS9 and FS10 and connecting to our club's private server as well as
>Vatsim's servers,(when I choose to do so).
>
>RUN THE INSTALLERS AS ADMINISTRATOR, by right clicking the exe files
>even if your user ID has admin rights.
>
>Or, as suggested, try Squawkbox. The last time I used SB was likely 5 or 6
>years ago, so I know nutt'in about it, but I'm sure Grunt & the Vatsim Help
>Forum can get you connected.
>Danny
Squawkbox at first looks plain and simple. FSInn has a bit more style?
and according to the replies, it has more features. Hopefully I can give
it another run with more success.
The main job for today however is making and jarring another batch of
Monte Carlo style pasta sauce!! :))
Did I mention chili? we're due for another crock pot of chili soon!!!
-G
Danny
Add-ons>FSCopilot>Settings.
You can scroll down to find TUNER in that list. By default is shows ENABLED.
Double Click on ENABLE to change it to DISABLED. This is a feature that
allows you to tune 123.4 on your comm radio and listen to Blue Sky Radio.
I, too, had an exit problem and that fully resolved the problem. Also test
the CHAT window on the control panel. If you get an error there, let me
know. there is a very simple fix for that too.
And, while, Larry James doesn't need any defense by me, I consider Larry to
be Mr. Authority when it comes to FSInn. His suggestions and advise, in my
opinion, are to be taken seriously and followed to the letter. He has no
hidden agenda...only to help get FSInn working for all those who are
interested.
Danny
"Gregory" <flights...@bkwds.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:ddp5e5penv0m8f8k8...@4ax.com...
Grunt
at the end of the path but assume it's there so the final paths they
use are bad. It's an oversight in programming and happens.
Gregory wrote:
> On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 22:25:54 -0400, "Danny" <drm...@yahoo.com> brought
> the following to our attention:
>
>> The Control Panel's 'ADD AND REMOVE PROGRAMS" feature should have
Grunt
fine. In the end it's whatever you prefer. I went with FSInn at first
because that's what the guys on my VA used and it had more stuff. I
found out that I didn't use the stuff and all I needed was to connect to
VATSIM of my MP server and run. I didn't use the radar or the other
options. Once it's running FSInn is pretty nice.
Let me try and summarize so you can get FSInn running, Gregory. I'll
include all I know so what you've worked past ignore. These were
documented on the FSInn web site which unfortunately went down some time
ago and is still out of action (all you get is a homepage).
* For FSX you must have the correct versions - they are beta releases
but that's all there is.
* There are two parts and installation must be done in a certain order.
The manual tells you which and the install will not let you proceed if
you do it wrong. If you did then uninstall and wipe out any directories
and files that are left.
* On Vista Some of the modules/exes need to be set up to run as
administrator even if you installed them as an admin. I'll have to see
if I have a list somewhere.
* After install and before running FSInn from FSX you run FSInn from the
programs menu. If you don't you'll get an error the first time you
run FSInn from FSX.
* Once in FSX disable the tuner from the FSInn menu (Danny explains how
in his post). If you don't do that you get an error when you exit FSX.
This one drove me crazy as it doesn't say FSInn is the issue - FSX
just gives an app crash error so I thought it was FSX.
* FSInn breaks every known rule of UI design ao that takes some getting
used to. The close buttons are on the bottom right instead of top right.
That's all I can remember now. I'll see if I can find more information
on the modules. These are all issues that would have been fixed if
development continued but the development stopped after the beta was
released so they won't be fixed.
Weather - I run ASA so I use that to set weather but you can use VATSim
weather, FSX weather (real time or set your own), or there are other
weather server options. However, when flying VATSIM you'll want real
weather that the controller sees so I use ASA weather with VATSIM being
the second choice.
You don't need a headset with a mic - just a mic. You can run with a
stand-alone mic and the speakers but that setup will probably pickup
room noise and ATC may bother whoever else is within earshot. Most
people who do VATSIM and multplayer use a headset/mic setup. I have a
Saitek Pro Flight unit that a friend gave me and it works great. Others
in this group will have other suggestions.
Feel free to ask if you need more information.
L. D. James
>
>
>
>
> L. D. James wrote:
>> "Grunt" <grun...@charter.ent> wrote in message
>> news:hbqv6s$ua9$1...@news.albasani.net...
>>> Did you install the two in the right order. If I remember there are two
>>> programs to install and you have to do them in the right order. If you
>>> had it installed (or a previous version uninstall it).
>>
>> Hi, Grunt. The order doesn't matter because the install program will
>> only install based on the required order. With some of the earlier
>> versions it did matter.
>
> Yes, the order does matter because if you do it wrong even if it tells you
> then there is an uninstall. I was trying to save the OP some hassle.
>
Hi, Grunt. When I say the order doesn't matter, I really meant bombarding
the user by telling him to be sure of the right order isn't an issue.
That's because and attempt to install FSInn before installing the FSCopilot
API will prompt the user to install the FSCopilot API first.
You itemised a lot of details that can make it appear as some huge haphazard
task of thring to get eerything right. It isn't a task. It just as simple
as downloading the items and clicking in stall, which the installations
steps describes.
So telling the user to be sure to install in the right order is moot.
>
>>> Also there is only one version that works with fSX and it's the beta
>>> one - there is no release and hasn't been for 3-4 years.
>>
>> That's the way it is with VATSIM at this time. The developer of FSInn
>> was very diligent to give access to the working program while they waited
>> for the bugs to be removed from the simconnect API of FSX. It was
>> clearly announced.
>>
>
> Except that there has been no development or work on FSInn for several
> years - at least two years - and from what I've seen they don't plan on
> further work. I would think that by now they would have been able to sort
> out the issues. If not they never will as Simconnect is not being
> developed anymore since Aces was disbanded.
>
> Also, I'm not a "avid SB user". I started with FSInn some time ago and
> have used it extensively - meaning I've had to install it several times
> and I've used it on VatSim and other MP venues quite a bit.
>
>>>
>>> Frankly, I just use Squawkbox 4. I know FSInn is popular but FSInn was
>>> beta three years ago, still is, and is no longer developed.
>>
>> While the question was about FSInn, this is the same with Squawkbox.
>> It's very popular. Is in Beta, and is no longer developed.
>>
>
> No - I think you'd better check on that. SB4 has been released at
> http://www.squawkbox.ca/ and has an active forum. It's a lot newer than
> FSInn. On the other hand FSInn is still Beta and has been for at least a
> couple of years.
First I would like to apologize to the Squawkbox users if my messages to you
appear like I have something bad to say about Squawkbox. I don't. I have
nothing but praise for both the VATSIM pilot clients. However, for some
reason you describe issues with FSInn which is common with both clients and
bash FSInn for it and ignore the fact that it's common for both clients.
I don't know why you give a link suggesting that it backs up your
misinformation about Squawkbox not being beta when the link clearly states
that it is. The link also clearly states that development has stopped.
The developers promptly informed the users the delay with completing FSInn
and what was left. It's a package developed for Flight Simulator. The bug
was reported to the developers of Flight Simulator before it was released.
While we agree it's unlikely that Flight Simulator will be fixed, I'll give
you a logical step that you might find hard to conclude, but that component
of FSInn won't be completed either. Yes. the uses were presented with a
workable resolution just before the release of FSX. They were presented
with and update just before SP2 was released. While you might be very sure
that if Microsoft were working secretly to surprise the fans with an FS2010
or FS2012 the FSInn team wouldn't provide a client, I'm not.
But I really don't think the bashing is a way to promote such consideration.
Again, look at the first page (the latest news) that will come up when you
enter the link you posted:
The first paragraph says in the last sentence:
--------------------------
Unless Microsoft resumes development, I very much doubt there will be a
version beyond the recent 4.0 release.
--------------------------
Look also at the second article that says: "Squawkbox 4 released!"
The second sentence of the first paragraph says:
--------------
The public beta of SquawkBox 4 is out and ready for your enjoyment.
--------------
This is the generous courtesy of the Squawbox developers following suit as
with FSInn, providing the users with the Beta of Squawkbox.
The release you describe is the release of the beta project to the
community. This is what the FSInn team did, but we did it earlier to
quickly allow the users to enjoy Flight Simulator X on VATSIM. I believe it's
something you should have something good to say about, not a cause for
bashing the effort.
I think it was/is a very noble thing of the FSInn developers. I think it
was/is a very noble thing of the Squawkbox developers. I can't identify
with how you can see it as good for one by a cause to bash the other.
>
>>> It has a lot of fancy features but it's got a lot of issues. Once you
>>> install it you have to run the program from the menu and make sure that
>>> some of it's modules run as administrator.
>>
>> Not true. The installation steps provided states against this. This
>> will cause the application to fail. That's why it's in the short four
>> step installation guide which won't fail.
>>
>>> Then you have to disable the media player (I think that's the module) or
>>> you get errors.
>>
>> Totally not relevant in any way.
>>
>
> Very relevant when you get errors upon exiting FSX - and you do get a
> dialog error that you have to close. Checking the forums shows it's a
> known issue and you have to disable the media player to fix it.
>
When you speak of media player, you're probably thinking of the Sky Blue
Radio feature which the installation steps describe how to disable to avoid
the exit error.
I don't think you can show me a link with someone having a problem with
FSInn and Media player. I scan the internet often to look at issues that
people might have with it. It's something I haven't seen. If I find
something new, I'll study a resolution and link it to the installation steps
for the convenience of all the FSInn users.
While I agree that would be something noble, your messages on this matter
hardly appear to me as an effort to help the user by giving support. It
appears mare like and issue to discourage the user from giving the pilot
client of his choice a chance.
I really don't think avid Mac users should jump in every time the see a
question from a PC user of how to use his PC by telling him to dump his PC
and buy a Mac. I would find him intentions especially suspect if he
happened to pick components that were common with both a PC and Mac to bash
the PC while praising the Mac.
> As for rarely an issue with FSInn I'll argue that point based on my
> experience and the extensive searches I had to do to find fixes to things
> like the exit dialog error,
The first user immediately gave this user a link that resolves that issue as
well as any other issue someone would have with FSInn. Sorry you missed the
page. But users are strongly encouraged to look at the PRC before flying on
VATSIM. They are not supposed to use a client that isn't provided by
VATSIM. This information that you say you had such a hard time is provided
in the installation steps in the PRC on VATSIM.
> the fact you need to run the FSInn app from the program menu first before
> running it from FSX, and the changes needed under Vista to set it to run
> as Admin.
You're still giving false information about setting up FSInn. That's might
also be a reason that you had a bad experience with it. I'm sorry you did.
But the steps are very simple. While I do everything I can to keep the
quick installation reference sheet extremely short, I did include, "you must
not put a check mark to run any of the FSInn modules as administrator" in
the sheet. You continue to try to force this step, which shouldn't be done
and can cause problems. You also complain about this step that shouldn't be
done, for having to do it.
This, like all the other items you're throwing out has nothing to do with
FSInn and is very misleading.
> Just running FSFix isn't always going to fix things - I never had to run
> it.
Right. It's a very rare occasion. Having a registry issue is rare. Many
people have Flight Simulator running without corrupted registers. However,
for the few that might have a registry issue, like any other problem a
person might have with FSInn, it's provided VIA the very small installation
sticky.
If you take a break from bashing FSInn for requiring an uncorrupted
registry, you might also notice Squawkbox looks for one also. I don't see a
lot of your messages giving support to the Squawkbox users who have the
installation issue. The response to most of those comes from either me or
Norman. Norman usually tells them to download the registry tool from
flight1.com allow Flight Simulator to install. I usually tells people to
download fs9tool.exe from the download section http://flightsim.apollo3.com
. No bashing, no fanfare. Just repair the registry and proceed with the
install. FSInn doesn't come into the picture.
By the way, this is the Squawkbox developers reply to the corrupted registry
issue:
It appears to be described "Installer fails if registry entries not in
place".
The resolution appears to be "wontfix".
http://squawkbox.ca/bugs/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=389
I believe the user's recourse would be to repair their registries or
reinstall Flight Simulator, which would also repair it.
I don't make this reference about Squawkbox or its developers as a bash.
But again, I believe it's very misleading for you to bash the FSInn
developers for doing what might not be as uncommon as you try to suggest
(when it comes to FSInn).
> Granted once you go through all that it runs fine.
I can't identify with the all that. But I guess a person can drive all over
town to go across the street. But it might be more convenient to just walk
across the street.
In other words, just person the steps in the quick reference sheet and as
you mention, it'll work fine. Too bad you missed it. And for some reason,
even as now, it has been suggested to this user with an issue, you're trying
hard to bury it.
> Since Gregory is having issues with the install my comments (and others)
> are entirely appropriate. There are issues during install and set up that
> must be addressed to get FSInn to work and Gregory needs to know them. I
> found the answeres by spending a lot of my valuable time digging through
> various websites so I can't see that telling someone about the issues and
> fixes to save him some time is not appropriate.
He has a question about using FSInn with VATSIM. The first reply gave him a
quick installation reference sheet that won't fail. For some reason, you're
suggestion that there's some type of requirement of spending lots of
valuable time going all over the web. I'm surprised you can't see it as
more direct to use the resolution that is presented right there on VATSIM.
>
> Suggesting another client is also a perfectly valid suggestion. I've been
> grateful for such suggestions when I've been in this situation.
I don't see a problem with suggesting a different client, per se. However
it's one thing to suggest a difference client and something else confuse the
whole issue by posting a lot of false statements about the product in
question; and also make statements that are common with both and suggest
dropping the one for that common component.
I believe it's very much in order for the new user to have this information
also.
> may not take the suggestions but at least I have alternatives to check out
> and decide. Gregory has had a very interesting time getting things going
> for FSX in general and he may want to know about another client.
He had a simple installation glitch. The first reply gave him the
resolution to that, plus the installation steps that will resolve just about
any issue he might have with FSInn. You confuse the issue by giving
suggestions about installation the client that would cause problems.
Idealistically the next person that has a simple issue with FSInn will see
the truth about the ease of operation and will not be confused what you've
placed here (as possibly everywhere you see an FSInn question).
You might not be doing this on purpose. But if you look at the link from
the initial response, you'll see you're giving false installation
suggestions. I'm telling you the suggestion you're giving will surely cause
problems with FSInn and VATSIM.
> Ultimately the decision will be his based on what he likes and what he can
> get installed. For me the decision was made after using both.
>
> In short the comments I and others have made are not to bash FSInn but to
> help Gregory get a working VATSim/MP client no matter which it is. Are you
> associated with FSInn in some way or have a vested interest in it as you
> seem over sensitive to our comments.
>
I don't see others making comments to bash FSInn. Only you. the suggestions
from the others have been very much on the topic of the question, as well as
very helpful.
L. D. James
> On Fri, 23 Oct 2009 15:17:33 -0400, Grunt <grun...@charter.ent> brought
> the following to our attention:
>
> SB sure does NOT look fancy. It seems like something from the early
> Windows NT years. FSInn would appear to be ok.. and I need to get
> over the `hump� and into VATSIM. The installation problem was minor.
> It probably could have been solved by manually copying the .dll to
> the FSX \modules directory. Since the install failed, there was no entry
> in the Add & Remove Software section of Control Panel.
Hi, Gregory. You're right the installation problem was very minor. It's
also very rare that it happens.
Manually copying the .dll's would fail. The installation is very simple.
Just follow the installation steps given by your Sim-bud and you shouldn't
have any problems.
http://forums.vatsim.net/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=20466
Notice there is an FSInn/VATSIM FAQ linked in that message. Review those
questions also. There are just a few, but they are great tips for getting
the best from FSInn and VATSIM.
You won't have any issue that isn't resolved by reviewing those two
messages.
I'll still be glad to help if you do.
By the way, I notice that Grunt is suggesting that you go all over the
internet for fixes. He also gave you a list of steps to do. His list is
bigger than the steps in the link you have above. His steps might cause you
problems and confusion. By his messages, he had problems. I suggest that
you follow the steps provided in the link on VATSIM to save time and
aggravation.
>
> To go over the issues briefly.. FSInn has a slight installation
> directory issue? and there is a shutdown error when exiting FSX?
> I'm always running as an administrator, so what is the install issue
> again? When do you run the registry fix? before or after the install?
>
Normally there isn't any issues... just a matter of following the provides
steps. Of course if you have a registry problem, it doesn't matter when you
run it to fix it.
> Can you make a simple bulleted list of one-liners (please.) :))
Provided in the link above.
>
> Assuming all that is ok.. will I need a headset with mic? Also in what
> way does the user sync the weather so that both the client and the
> controller are under the same Wx (wind) conditions?
>
> I'll be flying GA twin turboprops and single-isle jets/jetliners.
>
> -G
>
> sorry for being a bit dense...
You don't sound dense the least.
Glad to be of asistence.
By the way, Welcome to VATSIM!
Gregory
the following to our attention:
Great list!! You have an outline for a webpage there!!
It was all very clear about 1-hour ago, but I'm having doubts again.
Getting lots of good advise from multiple sources. Some of us can
misinterpret enthusiasm as negative.
Hopefully FSInn will put an entry in Add & Remove Programs this
time in case the install goes afoul. Will also do a system restore point
just in case.
-G
Grunt
happens next by starting FSX. If FSInn is in the add-ons menu and works
you're fine. If not see what the error is and correct it.
One other source would be the VATSim forums. When I went through all
this I found information on the FSInn web site which appears broken now
and the VATsim forums.
L. D. James
"Grunt" <grun...@charter.ent> wrote in message
> Just take it one step at a time. First install it. Then see what happens
> next by starting FSX. If FSInn is in the add-ons menu and works you're
> fine. If not see what the error is and correct it.
>
> One other source would be the VATSim forums. When I went through all this
> I found information on the FSInn web site which appears broken now and the
> VATsim forums.
>
Hi, Grunt. I was reading and replying to the messages as I saw them. This
last message appears to be good advice for the user with FSInn. The tone
and intentions sounds different from the previous messages.
There's a chance that one of the problems you were having was looking for
support on the FSInn web site. It wasn't designed as a support site, it was
designed for being a programmers' site. Lots of people were frustrated
because they logged on to the site and tried to get the developers to fix
their OS and teach them how to use their computers. The management didn't
want that type of flow.
I understand, it was something different than what you expected and was
looking for. But at the same time, they did provide a support
representative to VATSIM. VATSIM has always been very tolerant to teach
people about their OS and just about any issue they could possibly have.
much like the generous helpful attitude of the usenet forum.
Grunt
Yes, it was the blue sky tuner - the FSInn media player that causes exit
errors with FSX. Wrong terminology but the error exists and has a
workaround.
I was going to answer more but with you saying I am making false
statements and giving me credit for statements I did not say I feel
further discussion is fruitless.
The short of it and you can ignore it all you want is that there are
well documented issues with FSInn that many people encoounter during
the install. They have been there since the beta was released and since
it's a beta issues are expected and if development had continued they
would have been addressed. Development ceased so we have to work with
what we have. I gave Gregory a heads up for what he might expect so he
won't get frustrated by fixing a problem and then finding another,
fixing, it and then finding another and so on. I felt that's better than
saying follow this guide and it always works, it's only this issue,
etc. If being honest and telling a user what he can expect ahead of time
is what you consider bashing then so be it. I use and have used both
and will continue to do so and I'll be honest about both also - of
course I haven't seen much discussion on SB here probably because it's
not used as much.
Grunt
being honest with Gregory - there will be install issues. But there are
workarounds. Should I have said nothing and let him hit the next issue
and get frustrated?? I feel it's better to let him know he may hit other
problems but keep going and this is true especially in light of
Gregory's recent hassles with getting FSX running. I think he's had
enough frustration for one week <G>.
The problems I had are not due to the FSInn web support or VATSim. They
are issues with FSInn When I first installed FSInn I found the
answers on both sites. Each covered a different aspect so between them
I got the whole story. The bottom line is that FSInn has install issues
that many have encountered. But that is to be expected - it's beta and
if development had continued the issues would have been fixed.
Development did not continue so we work with what we have - a version of
FSInn that works with FSX and that's a major plus. I never used the FS9
version so have no idea how it worked with FSX if it does at all. The
downside is we have an FSInn that has install issues and most people
will see some of them (I never had an issue with registry corruption or
missing slashes for FSInn although I have for other apps) if not all.
The best thing for all is to let the user know what he might see, that
there are workarounds, and to keep perservering. When it's installed
FSInn runs well and has some neat features that no one else has and
since SB seems to be neglected and there are no others being developed
it's the best choice (you should see what X-Plane has!). If development
had continued I would have bugged the UI though - that close window
button on the bottom right violates all UI interface standards and
practices and is hard to remember <G>!!
L. D. James
>I stand corrected on the SB 4 release. It is beta.
>
> Yes, it was the blue sky tuner - the FSInn media player that causes exit
> errors with FSX. Wrong terminology but the error exists and has a
> workaround.
>
> I was going to answer more but with you saying I am making false
> statements and giving me credit for statements I did not say I feel
> further discussion is fruitless.
You spoke ill of FSInn for having been released as Beta while praising and
linking Squawkbox. I thought that was misleading.
You suggest problems with FSInn as if it should be (I'm trying to find a
different word than bash that means harsh criticism) harshly criticized,
while having problems with computer applications are so common.
If you pick something that I said that you didn't say, I'll either apologize
or point out that you misunderstood something that I had said. I thought
you made a false statement by suggestion that FSInn was inferior to
Squawkbox because it is released as Beta. They are both.
I quoted your statements that I disputed. I didn't just say you made those
statements, I replied to your statements with facts.
Please quote text of one of my messages that indicates a statement that you
didn't say? I would be very glad to retract a mistake that I might have
made, or clarify what I meant with everything I have to say.
You said you have to run the modules as administrator. That is false. The
application is very robust and some of the components will work when done
wrong. But that suggestion is a false statement and would possibly cause
any one trying to use FSInn to have the same problems that probably made you
drop it.
Had you used the support channel that I gave to this user, you probably
wouldn't have such harsh criticism about FSInn.
>
> The short of it and you can ignore it all you want is that there are well
> documented issues with FSInn that many people encoounter during the
> install.
You make a lot of statements that I consider false. I'd be glad to see this
well documentation you speak of. If it was so well documented, I believe
you could link to it rather than just saying it.
I gave you a link with a quick reference sheet that works. The reference
sheet is on VATSIM for VATSIM. It's also linked in the VATSIM PRC for users
who will be using the application. This is a fact. Your references about
your well documents many install failure issues are something I'd be glad to
learn. I wouldn't ignore it. I'd add this documentation to expand my
knowledge and ability to give better support.
> They have been there since the beta was released and since it's a beta
> issues are expected and if development had continued they would have been
> addressed. Development ceased so we have to work with what we have. I
> gave Gregory a heads up for what he might expect so he won't get
> frustrated by fixing a problem and then finding another, fixing, it and
> then finding another and so on. I felt that's better than saying follow
> this guide and it always works, it's only this issue, etc.
I appreciate your reference to all the problems you had. You didn't have to
have the problems had you followed the steps provided by VATSIM that are
provided on VATSIM. You had lots of problems and thought it would be best
to bring the problems to a new user who doesn't have to have them.
I can't see saying the application is beta with lots of issues and problems,
check out Squakbox which I switched to because of the problems. I can't
deal with beta programs that are not being developed. as been better than
giving the quick reference sheet that resolves the issue the user is having
and any other problems.
> If being honest and telling a user what he can expect ahead of time is
> what you consider bashing then so be it. I use and have used both and
> will continue to do so and I'll be honest about both also - of course I
> haven't seen much discussion on SB here probably because it's not used as
> much.
No. Squawkbox is used just as much, and most likely much more on VATSIM
than FSInn. You speak of my ignoring problems. Take a look at the link you
gave me. There is a forum there. There are four issues being discussed
that were posted within the last 24 hours.
It's clear that you're blind to the issues with Squawbox, but you very
animate about bashing FSInn for having issues.
Squawbox is a fine program just like FSInn. I don't know of any programs
that are popular that people don't have issues with. Because all the
resolutions for using FSInn are contained on one installation page and it's
linked FSInn/VATSIM FAQ, I believe it says a lot about the stability of the
application.
I understand that you see it different. But you might consider that what
you're saying is based on people like yourself that are doing haphazard
things with the application rather than showing respect for the installation
steps and usage.
I won't as you say ignore the issues. I'm trying to explore the issues and
address them. You might consider not ignoring the resolutions.
L. D. James
"Grunt" <grun...@charter.ent> wrote in message
> I'm not sure where you get this tone thing. In the first response I'm
> being honest with Gregory - there will be install issues. But there are
> workarounds. Should I have said nothing and let him hit the next issue
> and get frustrated?? I feel it's better to let him know he may hit other
> problems but keep going and this is true especially in light of Gregory's
> recent hassles with getting FSX running. I think he's had enough
> frustration for one week <G>.
I understand that you don't believe it, because you didn't test it for
yourself. But using the installation link will provide a very easy install
and successful experience with FSInn. I see you subsequently retyped most
of the steps in a message to him and he was up and running.
I believe bringing up a whole lot of issues that a user won't have if they
follow the installation steps would be a bigger burden and more frustrations
than it's worth. Had I read your comments with my first question about
FSInn and I didn't know what I know, I probably would have thought I was
speaking with a very experienced export and have been frightened away from
it. I probably would have went to Squawkbox as you suggested, and looking
at the Squakbox support forums, possible had just as many if not more issues
and felt relieved with a whew, what if I had went the hard way.
It's unlikely if you reply to a Squawkbox user's question that he's having
problems installing Squawbox with a big, you're using an unsupported,
discontinued, beta. You're probably just say run the registry repair tool
and the thread would be over. That probably wouldn't frighten the user away
from the application.
I believe to tell the user, as I'm doing, that he won't have any problems as
long as he follow the short quick installation reference card. The four
steps will give him an initial connection. After then he'll be a single
click away after starting Flight Simulator.
If you have a question, just yell.
I'm sorry, but I have to dispel your "facts" about the application being
such a great source of frustration. I don't think it has to be.
-- L. James
--
L. D. James
lja...@apollo3.com
www.apollo3.com/~ljames
>
Gregory
the following to our attention:
>I'm not sure where you get this tone thing. In the first response I'm
>being honest with Gregory - there will be install issues. But there are
>workarounds. Should I have said nothing and let him hit the next issue
>and get frustrated?? I feel it's better to let him know he may hit other
>problems but keep going and this is true especially in light of
>Gregory's recent hassles with getting FSX running. I think he's had
>enough frustration for one week <G>.
Ok you guys.. cease fire now!! FSInn is installed and there's no
apparent problem (other that the firewall messages.) No need to
keep bantering about clients, etc. Thanks for the help!!
Where was the webpage that describes ALL of the FSInn screens
and functions? The google search for keywords in this group doesn't
find Jack anymore.
-G
Grunt
a PDF in the install directories check VATSim and if you can't find it
there let me know as I have a copy.
L. D. James
Hi, Gregory. No fire intended. But with me, where FSInn is concerned,
support and resolutions if there are problems, abounds.
For convenience and consistency I always start out with the installation
sticky. If it's not there I'll added it if it's important for FSInn/VATSIM.
In this case, like all your questions so far, this is provided.
Click on the original link you posted, then click on the provided link to
the FSInn Manual.
By the way, thanks for the compliment on the operations of FSInn. I believe
it's very stable and ahead of its time. I'm certain there'll be an FSInn
(or pilot client by a different name) to appear in time for the next
generation of Flight Simulators that materialize. I can't imagine VATSIM
being left out.
Let me know how you make out with the pictures and features. While I'm not
the author, I praise the developers for the great job of the details, I
proofed the manual with passion before it was released.
Gregory
the following to our attention:
>The shutdown error is a know issue, too. Click the Add-ons>FSCopilot>Settings.
>You can scroll down to find TUNER in that list. By default is shows ENABLED.
>Double Click on ENABLE to change it to DISABLED. This is a feature that
>allows you to tune 123.4 on your comm radio and listen to Blue Sky Radio.
>I, too, had an exit problem and that fully resolved the problem. Also test
>the CHAT window on the control panel. If you get an error there, let me
>know. there is a very simple fix for that too.
I had the Chat window error but could not recall that you posted the
comment above. It was frustrating, as I sat there on the ramp at KBOS,
KATL and KLAX (where ServInfo said there were controllers.) Someone
kept initiating a Chat session but I could not respond. It kept chiming
and chiming. Eventually the controllers left duty at KBOS.. probably
because of the lunkhead newbie. :))
Found the chat window `fix� by reading a setup webpage at Vatsim IIRC.
Had to run FSInn alone from the start menu first.
Actually submitted a flight plan and did a short flight last night.
It even showed up on ServInfo!! { woohoo }
Here are some other questions..
1) Do the Vatsim controllers run the whole show? that is, do you disable
ATC in FSX? or run with both?
2) Why.. when sitting at LAX in a parking spot, does ServInfo report
that I'm at Hawthorne (KHHR)?
3) My aircraft has an invalid ICAO code.. something about ZZZZ?
Next I need to connect a Mic. Would you prefer a clip-on Mic, or one on
a long sloping boom with desktop pedestal?
-G
L. D. James
> On Sat, 24 Oct 2009 10:07:42 -0400, "Danny" <drm...@yahoo.com> brought
> the following to our attention:
>
>>The shutdown error is a know issue, too. Click the
>>Add-ons>FSCopilot>Settings.
>>You can scroll down to find TUNER in that list. By default is shows
>>ENABLED.
>>Double Click on ENABLE to change it to DISABLED. This is a feature that
>>allows you to tune 123.4 on your comm radio and listen to Blue Sky Radio.
>>I, too, had an exit problem and that fully resolved the problem. Also
>>test
>>the CHAT window on the control panel. If you get an error there, let me
>>know. there is a very simple fix for that too.
>
> I had the Chat window error but could not recall that you posted the
> comment above. It was frustrating, as I sat there on the ramp at KBOS,
Hi, Gregory. I'm sure it was frustrating. This is why I strongly encourage
FSInn users to read the original link you posted in its entirety. I have
also kept it short to make it easy for it to be read in its entirety. It
goes from the initial download to the first connection. Then after that it's
a single click to connect to VATSIM after having loaded Flight Simulator.
I know you know now after having suffered frustration. But when you first
got the error if you had glanced at the link you could have just opened
FSInn from the start menu and replied from there or from the other FSInn
panel you had. Some people mention that you have to restart Flight
Simulator. But you don't. Just click on the resolution and you're in
business.
If you haven't read that link, I strongly suggest that you do.
> KATL and KLAX (where ServInfo said there were controllers.) Someone
> kept initiating a Chat session but I could not respond. It kept chiming
> and chiming. Eventually the controllers left duty at KBOS.. probably
> because of the lunkhead newbie. :))
>
> Found the chat window `fix� by reading a setup webpage at Vatsim IIRC.
> Had to run FSInn alone from the start menu first.
>
> Actually submitted a flight plan and did a short flight last night.
> It even showed up on ServInfo!! { woohoo }
>
>
> Here are some other questions..
>
> 1) Do the Vatsim controllers run the whole show? that is, do you disable
> ATC in FSX? or run with both?
Controllers control their space just like in the real world. If you are
located in a vicinity that isn't manned, you're on your own to use Unicom
for separation. So the show they really control is their space. You can
see this in the PRC on VATSIM. Take a look at the required reading section
and the First Flight Lesson.
They don't turn off ATC in flight simulator. In FS9 the built in ATC is
turned off automatically by FS9 when entering multiplayer mode. However,
FSInn doesn't use the multiplayer mode in FSX. You can connect to VATIM in
any of the modes. You have to turn off FSX's ATC manually. This is
mentioned in that quick reference sheet (the link in your original post). I
believe you'd be surprised at how much is covered in just a small amount of
text.
People understandable can get frustrated and a bit overwhelmed when looking
everywhere to get FSInn up and running. This might have something to do
with some of the frustration that Grunt felt which caused him to go to
Squawbox. However, knowing these things ahead of time and getting them
taken care of doing the install can spare the user of frustration. You'll
have a better chance of seeing it as the very consistent and stable
application that it is.
I don't mind answering any of your questions. I'm just giving you a heads
up for some of the issues that might appear as annoyances that you don't
notice, but could be spared from by reading the installations page.
>
> 2) Why.. when sitting at LAX in a parking spot, does ServInfo report
> that I'm at Hawthorne (KHHR)?
Were you even at Hawthorne? You might have to refresh Servinfo by clicking
on the VATSIM Button. You can have it refresh automatically by setting
options in the connections parameters.
>
> 3) My aircraft has an invalid ICAO code.. something about ZZZZ?
>
You have a plane that FSInn doesn't recognize.
Use the "Edit Current Used Plane" option. You can either find the button
on the black window that pops up to tell you FSInn doesn't recognize the
plane and shows you the "ZZZZ", or you can get there by going to the Inn
Control Panel -> Advance -> Pla(ne) -> Config -> Edit Current Used Plane.
Then fill out the known information under the Green User tab.
Danny
And Danny says, 'Amen'.
"L. D. James" <lja...@apollo3.com> wrote in message
news:57mdncn-Bc1I8XrX...@posted.choiceonecommunications...
Gregory
brought the following to our attention:
>"Gregory" <flights...@bkwds.comcast.net> wrote in message
>>
>> I had the Chat window error but could not recall that you posted the
>> comment above. It was frustrating, as I sat there on the ramp at KBOS..
>
>... when you first got the error if you had glanced at the link you could have
>just opened FSInn from the start menu and replied from there or from the
>other FSInn panel you had. Some people mention that you have to restart
>Flight Simulator. But you don't. Just click on the resolution and you're in
>business.
>
>If you haven't read that link, I strongly suggest that you do.
>
>> Here are some other questions..
>>
>> 1) Do the Vatsim controllers run the whole show? that is, do you disable
>> ATC in FSX? or run with both?
>
>Controllers control their space just like in the real world. If you are
>located in a vicinity that isn't manned, you're on your own to use Unicom
>for separation. So the show they really control is their space. You can
>see this in the PRC on VATSIM. Take a look at the required reading
>section and the First Flight Lesson.
>
>They don't turn off ATC in flight simulator. In FS9 the built in ATC is turned
>off automatically by FS9 when entering multiplayer mode. However, FSInn
>doesn't use the multiplayer mode in FSX. You can connect to VATIM in
>any of the modes. You have to turn off FSX's ATC manually. This is
>mentioned in that quick reference sheet (the link in your original post). I
>believe you'd be surprised at how much is covered in just a small amount
>of text.
There was another problem that kept me disconnected for at least two
days, and that was the IP address in the VATSIM pulldown was invalid. It
wasn't until reading through the DOCs that I found a list of Server IPs,
and then copied and pasted the Texas one in there. The pulldown IP list
wasn't populated like in the illustrations, just one that didn't work.
>> 2) Why.. when sitting at LAX in a parking spot, does ServInfo report
>> that I'm at Hawthorne (KHHR)?
>
>Were you even at Hawthorne? You might have to refresh Servinfo by clicking
>on the VATSIM Button. You can have it refresh automatically by setting
>options in the connections parameters.
I was never at Hawthorne, but parked on the south ramp of LAX. It didn't
make any sense. Loaded up back to Boston and the controllers has left.
Also tonight.. ServInfo cannot update itself from the server. It says
the data is 1hr, 37min old (last was 18:31). After setting the Options
to `update every three mins� new data stopped coming in. Plus it
popped-up the `change server?� dialogue box in the background which
ran the CPU and cooling fan revs ups.
Does that happen now and then? or did I break something?
>> 3) My aircraft has an invalid ICAO code.. something about ZZZZ?
>>
>
>You have a plane that FSInn doesn't recognize.
>
>Use the "Edit Current Used Plane" option. You can either find the button
>on the black window that pops up to tell you FSInn doesn't recognize the
>plane and shows you the "ZZZZ", or you can get there by going to the Inn
>Control Panel -> Advance -> Pla(ne) -> Config -> Edit Current Used Plane.
>Then fill out the known information under the Green User tab.
Yeah.. saw that but didn't know exactly what to enter.
-G
>-- L. James
L. D. James
This like just about any FSInn/VATSIM issue would not have been a problem if
you had followed the steps provided in the link you posted in your original
message. The original messages tell exactly what to put in the settings and
were to get working IP numbers.
>
>>> 2) Why.. when sitting at LAX in a parking spot, does ServInfo report
>>> that I'm at Hawthorne (KHHR)?
>>
>>Were you even at Hawthorne? You might have to refresh Servinfo by
>>clicking
>>on the VATSIM Button. You can have it refresh automatically by setting
>>options in the connections parameters.
>
> I was never at Hawthorne, but parked on the south ramp of LAX. It didn't
> make any sense. Loaded up back to Boston and the controllers has left.
>
> Also tonight.. ServInfo cannot update itself from the server. It says
> the data is 1hr, 37min old (last was 18:31). After setting the Options
> to `update every three mins� new data stopped coming in. Plus it
> popped-up the `change server?� dialogue box in the background which
> ran the CPU and cooling fan revs ups.
>
> Does that happen now and then? or did I break something?
>
Yes, this happens every now and then. There currently is a problem with the
data servers. It usually doesn't last long. I'll probably soon place a
link in the FSInn/VATSIM FAQ that will check and allow the users to
immediately know when there is a data server issue. Of course the
description you just gave with Servinfo's behavior is an indication. My
logs indicate it started about 4 hours ago and is still a problem at this
time.
Unfortunately you can't check to see your location status until this data
server issue is resolved.
From: "Danny" Tuesday, October 27, 2009 6:54 PM, wrote:
> LD wrote: If you haven't read that link, I strongly suggest that you do.
>
> And Danny says, 'Amen'.
Thanks Danny!
boB-Copter6
> LD wrote: If you haven't read that link, I strongly suggest that you do.
>
> And Danny says, 'Amen'.
>
>
>
>
What Link??
I guess I have to read the PRC page again. Have you been on VATSIM
recently? I have a couple hours but I always flew around Texas and
there were no controllers. The tower controller in Las Vegas called me
up just to chat. He wasn't busy either.
--
==============
==============
boB-Copter_Six
VATSIM 890442
==============
==============
Gregory
<cop...@xxxyahooxxx.vom> brought the following to our attention:
>Danny wrote:
>> LD wrote: If you haven't read that link, I strongly suggest that you do.
>>
>> And Danny says, 'Amen'.
>
>
>What Link??
>
>I guess I have to read the PRC page again. Have you been on VATSIM
>recently? I have a couple hours but I always flew around Texas and
>there were no controllers. The tower controller in Las Vegas called me
>up just to chat. He wasn't busy either.
boB.. I think he means the link in the OP..
http://forums.vatsim.net/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=20466
Here's another link.. http://faq.apollo3.com/ljames/fsinn/vatsim/faq/
Danny has been advising off main line (that means by email) on VATSIM.
It's a big and daunting step, and for anyone mildly interested in the
Virtual air world, a good place to start is by installing ServInfo.
http://www.avsim.com/hangar/utils/servinfo/home.htm
Somewhere there's a 2007 update for ServInfo. The more users the better!
I know that you know about this stuff (many of you) already.
-G
Gregory
brought the following to our attention:
>
> "Gregory" <flights...@bkwds.comcast.net> wrote in message
>
>> days, and that was the IP address in the VATSIM pulldown was invalid. It
>> wasn't until reading through the DOCs that I found a list of Server IPs,
>> and then copied and pasted the Texas one in there. The pulldown IP list
>> wasn't populated like in the illustrations, just one that didn't work.
>>
>
>This like just about any FSInn/VATSIM issue would not have been a problem if
>you had followed the steps provided in the link you posted in your original
>message. The original messages tell exactly what to put in the settings and
>were to get working IP numbers.
>>
Yes, I did read over all of the instruction from three advisers but when
it came to tackling the whole thing initially (it can be a challenge)
there were details missing. Let me point out one such detail from link
in OP.. "Installing FSInn (updated 15 Sep 2009)."
>3) Started Flight Simlator, clicked on Add-on, Clicked on Inn Control
>Panel -> Set -> General -> Basic (Filled in my Call Sign, First Name,
>Last Name and Homebase Airport. Then Clicked Network -> VATSIM
>(typed in my UserID, Password and a current server from [Vatsim
>Current List of Servers]).
It says.. "type in my UserID, Password and a current server from [List]"
This is a key show-stopper issue, because it doesn't say `Server IP� but
merely `a current server.� Since there's already an IP in the Network ->
VATSIM field, the NEW user would expect it to work without a clear
instruction to:
COPY and PASTE a Server IP from the Current List!!
One of the figures showed a drop-down IP list which wasn't there.
Please don't mistake the tone here as harsh or angry. I'm only
identifying a tripping point for the new user. You may want to edit
or clarify this important step. q:-]
-G
L. D. James
Hi, Gregory. I've been giving this support for nearly 6 years. Most of the
people (I'm not saying you) who have problems, have problems, because they
haven't read looked at or tried the steps. It's an extremely rare occasion
that people who actually follow the steps have problems.
I am extremely meticulous about keeping the quick reference sheet small. On
rare occasions someone will give me a suggestion for something that should
be added. However, on most of those occasions, adding the note would be a
bit redundant and have the effect of making the sheet bigger. On most
occasions the additional information wouldn't be so helpful, because the
ones who actually have problems with it, are the ones who haven't read or
tested the steps anyway. Those people would still miss those added steps if
they were there.
As far as using the word server IP, that's not necessary. You can actually
put the server name there. Most people are familiar with punching in
servers (or IP numbers) because many of them have already experimented with
Flight Simulator's multiplayer features, as well as other multiplayer games.
I don't mean to sound callous and inconsiderate by not updating the link
based on your suggestion. I'm just pointing out some of the considerations
that have gone into play while considering what you feel is missing.
I really would like to reiterate in the sticky that the most common issue is
a connection issue. But you might notice the FSInn/VATSIM FAQ is linked
there and described as compiled from questions in the VATSIM's FSInn help
forum. While the setup step suggests using the IP with the best ping with a
link of the IP's and a button to ping test them, the first suggestion for
having a connection problem reiterates that.
I understand it's different in your case, but I find that biggest show
stopper in my experience is that many people will not test the steps before
expressing frustration about having problems.
I get lots of PM's and Emails from many people who never post a help
message, take the time to tell me how easy the installation and first use
went for them.
Unfortunately the messages we read, in providing support, are messages where
people have problems.
You might be right that important details are missing. But for me, I would
read something into the wording, ". and a current server from [Vatsim
Current List of Servers -
http://faq.apollo3.com/ljames/fsinn/vatsim/data/showservers.pl]. To me it
would appear that using the list would be important. I'd just do it for the
sake of following the steps. I believe you'll be surprised at how many
people the wording facilitates.
I will say that I revisit the sticky regularly to check the wording. I also
refer to the link in just about every support question to ensure something
important and necessary really isn't missing.
boB-Copter6
>>
> Danny has been advising off main line (that means by email) on VATSIM.
> It's a big and daunting step, and for anyone mildly interested in the
> Virtual air world, a good place to start is by installing ServInfo.
>
> http://www.avsim.com/hangar/utils/servinfo/home.htm
>
> Somewhere there's a 2007 update for ServInfo. The more users the better!
>
> I know that you know about this stuff (many of you) already.
>
>
> -G
>
Forget AVSIM. That's another OOOPS file link.
I'm sure I can find it on flightsim.com
--
==============
==============
boB-Copter_Six
==============
==============
Gregory
<cop...@xxxyahooxxx.vom> brought the following to our attention:
>Gregory wrote:
>>>
>> Danny has been advising off main line (that means by email) on VATSIM.
>> It's a big and daunting step, and for anyone mildly interested in the
>> Virtual air world, a good place to start is by installing ServInfo.
>>
>> http://www.avsim.com/hangar/utils/servinfo/home.htm
>>
>> Somewhere there's a 2007 update for ServInfo. The more users the better!
>>
>> I know that you know about this stuff (many of you) already.
>>
>>
>> -G
>
>
>Forget AVSIM. That's another OOOPS file link.
>
>I'm sure I can find it on flightsim.com
Sorry.. you can google v2.02 and find a download link.
Here's the update:
http://dump.trissy.org/vatpac/vatsimofficialservinfo2007update.zip
ANd a view of it running around 6:45 PM
http://home.comcast.net/~flightsim/ServInfo.png
-G
boB-Copter6
>>
>> Forget AVSIM. That's another OOOPS file link.
>>
>> I'm sure I can find it on flightsim.com
>
>
> Sorry.. you can google v2.02 and find a download link.
>
>
> Here's the update:
> http://dump.trissy.org/vatpac/vatsimofficialservinfo2007update.zip
>
>
> ANd a view of it running around 6:45 PM
>
> http://home.comcast.net/~flightsim/ServInfo.png
>
>
> -G
>
>
>
Sorry. I didn't mention I had it buried away on one of my backup drives.
I re-installed it. Vatspy doesn't seem to work under Win7.
Gregory
>G
>G 1) Do the Vatsim controllers run the whole show? that is, do you disable ATC in FSX? or run with both?
>G
On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 17:56:59 -0400, "L. D. James" <lja...@apollo3.com>
brought the following to our attention:
>Controllers control their space just like in the real world. If you are
>located in a vicinity that isn't manned, you're on your own to use Unicom
>for separation. So the show they really control is their space. You can
>see this in the PRC on VATSIM. Take a look at the required reading section
>and the First Flight Lesson.
>
>They don't turn off ATC in flight simulator. In FS9 the built in ATC is
>turned off automatically by FS9 when entering multiplayer mode. However,
>FSInn doesn't use the multiplayer mode in FSX. You can connect to VATIM in
>any of the modes. You have to turn off FSX's ATC manually. This is mentioned
>in that quick reference sheet (the link in your original post). I believe you'd be
>surprised at how much is covered in just a small amount of text.
L.D.
I'm back to the same `sticking point� here. Was in my twin turbo at
Daytona Beach and made a Flight Plan to Savannah GA since there was
a JAX CTR (Jacksonville) controller on duty. Was going along with FSX
ATC.. from Ground, to Tower, to Departure, to the Center. Then when
approaching 18,000 tried to contact JAX CTR on Vatsim.
First off I don't have a mic yet.. and he told me to switch transponder
to Mode C... and after a min or so I reported `unable.� So I descended
to 17,000 but he told me that if I didn't set the transponder, I should
disconnect until learning the system. I basically got kicked off Vatsim.
If you fly in un-staffed regions, then you can get away with it and
still show up on ServInfo.
So the next step is to read the tutorials. Another thing is.. I though
one communicates in Vatsim via Chat when no Mic is present, but the
controller said "please to not PM me.. tune your radio." Was I
broadcasting? to Unicom? Ok.. RgR the radio.. but in doing all this..
FSX dropped me from IFR.
If that's the case.. then I'll need a MUCH better flight plan with
charts and VOR freqs handy. After leaving JAX CTR.. what then?
Request IFR clearance from FSX ACT? Is he going to vector me to
Savannah tower? or to Savannah approach?
I think Vatsim might need to be better staffed for this to work
smoothly? You see what's happening here? Once it's working.. it will
be `as real as it gets.�
-G
Danny
Else you might see AI traffic and think it is Vatsim Traffic.
"Gregory" <flights...@bkwds.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:susle59lql2h11oeq...@4ax.com...
Gregory
the following to our attention:
>
Ok.. you know I'm cramming a LOT of information to get it working. :))
Here's what I needed..
http://home.comcast.net/~flightsim/Squawk_Mode.png
And this about Chat.. http://home.comcast.net/~flightsim/Inn_Chat.png
-G
>"Gregory" <flights...@bkwds.comcast.net> wrote in message
>>
>>>1) Do the Vatsim controllers run the whole show? that is, do you disable ATC in FSX? or run with both?
>>>
>>
Danny
the radio stack transponder as you would if using the built-in ATC from the
sim, or by typing, in the chat window, .x then the four digit squawk code
given by the controller, ex: .x1200, .x5214.
I did not know you could double click the C button to Ident.
Gregory" <flights...@bkwds.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:s84ne59qt4hnberd5...@4ax.com...
Gregory
the following to our attention:
Woohoo.. first flight on Vatsim!! Orlando to Daytona Beach!!
Yep.. I know exactly how the syntax goes into the chat window.
Good FSInn programming after all. :))) I'd say Inn blows away
Squawk, but haven't tried SB. Need to enable a Mic tomorrow.
Ready to go for the twin Instrument Rtng soon (FS that is.)
-G
boB-Copter6
Do some VFR flying below 1200Ft AGL for a bit slowly working your way
into control zones. Get a mike. they are cheap.
boB-Copter6
You have passed me. I've only flown some small VFR flights. I just fly
like in real life. contact ground, tower, leave then transponder off. :)
Gregory
<cop...@xxxyahooxxx.vom> brought the following to our attention:
>
>> I think Vatsim might need to be better staffed for this to work
>> smoothly. You see what's happening here? Once it's working..
>> it will be `as real as it gets.�
>>
>> -G
>
>
>Do some VFR flying below 1200Ft AGL for a bit slowly working
>your way into control zones. Get a mike. they are cheap.
Thanks boB.. I know your advice is good, but I'm through 1200' in
no-time with some of those radical v2+10 climbouts. :)) Actually
made two mistakes. First.. I planned for 16,000' but CLR-DEL said
either 150 or 170. Didn't matter because the trip was too short for
that altitude. Maybe got to 14,000. Second mistake was, from Rwy 18
heading I turned left for ORL (VOR) and ended up making a tear-drop
turn (>180�) Should have turned right, but it was only a 10-15� mistake.
Here's the traffic in the U.S. last evening...
http://home.comcast.net/~flightsim/ServInfo_1030.png
It's a LOT busier than the other night. The MORE, the BETTER!!
-G
btw.. already have two or three Mics, and have to RTFM again....
Gregory
<cop...@xxxyahooxxx.vom> brought the following to our attention:
>
>>> You are progressing rapidly, Gregory. You can enter squawk code either in
>>> the radio stack transponder as you would if using the built-in ATC from the
>>> sim, or by typing, in the chat window, .x then the four digit squawk code
>>> given by the controller, ex: .x1200, .x5214.
>>>
>>> I did not know you could double click the C button to Ident.
Danny.. FSInn was apparently coded by some real pros. It's very
programmer-ish and looks / feels like something you'd use in the
engineering department. Well done! You know.. my VRinsight
M-Panel is still on backorder. That will be a nice gadget.
http://home.comcast.net/~flightsim/M_Panel_1.jpg
No more Quilling around with that baby!! LoL
>You have passed me. I've only flown some small VFR flights. I just fly
>like in real life. contact ground, tower, leave then transponder off. :)
boB.. As with the other evening, you get up there 16000, 17, 18, with
lots of clouds, and quickly realize how totally unprepared you are to
make such a flight!!
What's a good `quick chart reader� for FSX?
-G
Gregory
the following to our attention:
>Definitely turn OFF FSX atc and Turn off AI if you are in a busy area.
>Else you might see AI traffic and think it is Vatsim Traffic.
Two nights ago I saw this old hulk that looked like an AI jet from
FS4 or FS95 sitting on the taxiway at Daytona Beach. It had no
landing gear, was `belly on the concrete� and apparently made
of just a few dozen polygons.. later realizing it must have been
a Delta jet generated by Vatsim?
-G
Danny
and Mid week. Not a busy time on Vatsim, really. I was flying from
Pensacola to Atlanta in Beech 1900. Contacted Atl Ctr. He acknowledged and
gave me a 3 letter abbreviation with which I was not familiar. I ask for him
to clarify, as any good real life pilot would, I think.
His response to me..."I don't have time for pilot training."
I advised him he had no more than two or three planes in his sector...if, he
was too busy to "play the game" he should not have logged on! It is NOT a
job." Within two minutes he stated "Atlanta Center is closing
immediately".
Not sure what his problem was but he obviously has something going on in
real life. I think most controllers will attempt to be helpful, but not
all. Some take it too seriously and that is why some sim pilots are "put
off" and never attempt to use Vatsim...for fear of being embarrassed or
intimidated.
There was an older (read that mature and patient) controller at Santa Monica
who was excellent when it came to helping. I left Santa Monica for Catalina
Island and he asked if I had ever made the flight or departed Santa Monica?
Then proceeded to give me the proper departure procedure. Not sure if he is
still there or not.
Danny
"Danny" <drm...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:hcfouh$a7n$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
Gregory
the following to our attention:
>I once had a 'bad' experience with an Atlanta Ctr controller. Mid evening
>and Mid week. Not a busy time on Vatsim, really. I was flying from
>Pensacola to Atlanta in Beech 1900. Contacted Atl Ctr. He acknowledged and
>gave me a 3 letter abbreviation with which I was not familiar. I ask for him
>to clarify, as any good real life pilot would, I think.
>
>His response to me..."I don't have time for pilot training."
Yeah.. I ask for `vectors for KDAB approach� and the reply from
JAX CTR was.. "I don't have time for that." But no problem really.
It was chat window ATC anyway. He signed off so I went back to
FSX ATC and started a descent. Soon had the field in sight, and
contacted tower.
-G
boB-Copter6
>
> What's a good `quick chart reader� for FSX?
>
>
> -G
>
I'm still looking. When I do use approach plates I go to airnav.com,
pull up the airport and click the chart I want. Clunky but works.
Danny
www.navmonster.com
"Gregory" <flights...@bkwds.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:qreoe5p0ojsrgvnma...@4ax.com...
Danny
There is a free version and a pay version with added capabilities. I use
free occasionally.
"Gregory" <flights...@bkwds.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:qreoe5p0ojsrgvnma...@4ax.com...