Oblivion hands-on previews
Air Raid
http://www.oxm.co.uk/articles/previews/role_playing_games/elder_scrolls_iv_oblivion
http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/691/691449p1.html
http://xbox360.1up.com/do/previewPage?cId=3148324&did=13
http://www.gamespot.com/pc/rpg/theelderscrollsivoblivion/news.html?sid=6144923
http://xbox.gamespy.com/xbox-360/the-elder-scrolls-iv-oblivion/691990p1.html
AirRa...@gmail.com
360 vs PC
Blowhole911
controls were for Morrowind and Arx Fatalis on the Xbox. I don't feel
like shelling out $20 more than the PC version for the same controls.
lister...@hotmail.com
360 version.
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Andrew
<lister...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>Most previews have said that they actually prefer the controls on the
>360 version.
Maybe by console game reviewers, there is no way a PC gamer would say
that.
--
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Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
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Lorfarius
"Andrew" <spamtrap@localhost.> wrote in message
news:8cvj02hra3lj7tleg...@4ax.com...
> On 4 Mar 2006 12:45:46 -0800, "lister...@hotmail.com"
> <lister...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Most previews have said that they actually prefer the controls on the
>>360 version.
>
> Maybe by console game reviewers, there is no way a PC gamer would say
> that.
Or it could just be that none of the PC reviewers were allowed to change the
controls for the short playtime they had.
homie
that this?!?!?!
Kendrick Kerwin Chua
Lorfarius <asdkeit...@PLEASEhotmail.com> wrote:
>"Andrew" <spamtrap@localhost.> wrote in message
>news:8cvj02hra3lj7tleg...@4ax.com...
>> On 4 Mar 2006 12:45:46 -0800, "lister...@hotmail.com"
>> <lister...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Most previews have said that they actually prefer the controls on the
>>>360 version.
>>
>> Maybe by console game reviewers, there is no way a PC gamer would say
>> that.
Can we allow for the possibility that PC gamers and console gamers overlap
enough that there aren't really two groups? It's not as if there's some
kind of prize or membership bonus for declaring a preference one way or
another... Don't forget that Morrowind is a big reason why there's so much
crossover since people bought one version based on their positive
experience with the other.
>Or it could just be that none of the PC reviewers were allowed to change the
>controls for the short playtime they had.
It's worth mentioning that Oblivion was optimized for the Xbox 360
intentionally, as Bethesda has said in a ton of interviews and press
releases. But given that the 360 also supports keyboard and mouse input
via the USB ports, I don't see why that option wouldn't also be available
if you really want it.
-KKC, who thinks there are enough things separating people without having
to invent reasons to differentiate...
--
-- "I bought a house, it's a two bedroom house. But - kendrick
I think it's up to me how many bedrooms there are, - @io.com
dont you? F*** you, real estate lady, this bedroom -
has an oven in it!" - Mitch Hedberg, 1968-2005 -
The Merry Piper
Kerwin Chua) wrote:
>releases. But given that the 360 also supports keyboard and mouse input
>via the USB ports, I don't see why that option wouldn't also be available
>if you really want it.
Say what? The 360 allows one to use a mouse? Would that be a garden
variety USB mouse? I've been toying with the idea of purchasing a 360
and am curious about that.
--
The Merry Piper
[http://tmpiper.livejournal.com]
If you want to dance, you'll have to pay ... me!
John Lewis
>Aww... C'mon... Aren't there any more groups you guys can crosspost to
>that this?!?!?!
We would if we could :-) :-)
John Lewis
John Lewis
wrote:
>Sorry, but I'll be getting this one on PC. I remember how ass the
>controls were for Morrowind and Arx Fatalis on the Xbox. I don't feel
>like shelling out $20 more than the PC version for the same controls.
>
Actually $10.
Plus, afaik, the Construction Set ships with the PC version. Pity that
the Xflop360 owners won't be able to access any of the great 3rd-party
mods.... PC Oblivion looks as if it will be a modder's delight, far
more so than Morrowind.
John Lewis
John Salerno
> Plus, afaik, the Construction Set ships with the PC version.
According to the Bethsoft website, the CS will be downloadable for the
PC. Not sure why it isn't included, but it's still free.
Not available for the 360, of course.
Hank the Rapper
> Pity that the Xflop360 owners won't be able to access
> any of the great 3rd-party mods....
Your anti-Bligmerk rants from the last few days are meaningless when you use
the same third-grade names for the Xbox as he.
Kendrick Kerwin Chua
The Merry Piper <merry_pi...@COATyahoo.com> wrote:
>On Sat, 04 Mar 2006 17:56:23 -0600, kend...@fnord.io.com (Kendrick
>Kerwin Chua) wrote:
>
>>releases. But given that the 360 also supports keyboard and mouse input
>>via the USB ports, I don't see why that option wouldn't also be available
>>if you really want it.
>
>Say what? The 360 allows one to use a mouse? Would that be a garden
>variety USB mouse? I've been toying with the idea of purchasing a 360
>and am curious about that.
The 360 has three USB 2.0 ports natively. Two up front for controllers,
one in back for the wireless network adapter (although truthfully, they
all run off of the same hub and you can plug anything in anywhere you
want.) Out of the box, keyboards and storage devices are supported
natively. Mouse support is up to the individual game developers, but the
hardware is certainly capable of garden-variety USB mice. It looks like
Microsoft went out of their way to make the 360 friendly for MMORPG
titles, FPS games and anything else that would benefit from keyboard
input.
-KKC, doing dumb things with RGB encoders...
Andrew
Kerwin Chua) wrote:
>Can we allow for the possibility that PC gamers and console gamers overlap
>enough that there aren't really two groups? It's not as if there's some
>kind of prize or membership bonus for declaring a preference one way or
>another... Don't forget that Morrowind is a big reason why there's so much
>crossover since people bought one version based on their positive
>experience with the other.
I am primarily a PC gamer, and have owned several consoles, I am not
anti-console, but I am not going to play a first person game with a
gamepad, and I am pretty sure I am not alone on that.
>It's worth mentioning that Oblivion was optimized for the Xbox 360
>intentionally, as Bethesda has said in a ton of interviews and press
>releases. But given that the 360 also supports keyboard and mouse input
>via the USB ports, I don't see why that option wouldn't also be available
>if you really want it.
If 360 games supported keyboard/mouse controls, I would buy a 360
today, but AFAIK, none of them do despite there being no technical
reason not to. As it is I am waiting for the likes of Lik Sang to come
up with a kb/mouse>pad converter and if it works I will buy it.
Angof
That's the rub. There is no way I would have played an unmodded Morrowind
and I suspect Oblivion will be the same.
ScoopeX
xbox 360 owners wont care for 3rd party mods as you put it, its all
about the game Obliviob being on the xbox 360 console.
:)
--
XBL Gamertag: ScoopeX
www.360monster.com
Xbox.com - Founding member. :)
My cd of the week - Corrine Baily Rae
The Merry Piper
need for Mail)> wrote:
>That's the rub. There is no way I would have played an unmodded Morrowind
>and I suspect Oblivion will be the same.
I played Morrowind the first time without reading the manual or adding
any mods except Bethesda's. I wanted to simulate the experience of
being tossed up on an unknown shore with no clue about what was going
on.
I had a blast.
As I've played and replayed the game with both expansion packs I've
tried numerous variations but nothing has quite captured the visceral
thrill of that first time.
Angof
> On Sun, 5 Mar 2006 08:53:03 -0000, "Angof" <Mailf...@yahoo.co.uk(no
> need for Mail)> wrote:
>
>> That's the rub. There is no way I would have played an unmodded
>> Morrowind and I suspect Oblivion will be the same.
>
> I played Morrowind the first time without reading the manual or adding
> any mods except Bethesda's. I wanted to simulate the experience of
> being tossed up on an unknown shore with no clue about what was going
> on.
>
> I had a blast.
>
> As I've played and replayed the game with both expansion packs I've
> tried numerous variations but nothing has quite captured the visceral
> thrill of that first time.
I hated the economic system and the balance. Wtf were they thinking with
that pathetic mudcrab and creeper nonsense? I installed the Adventurers mod
and some weapon balance mods (as well as a shed load of others) to change
the game to suit my tastes.
Oh..another thing that really wound me up was the suicidal attacks from the
wildlife...changed that so only diseased animals were stupidly aggresive.
The Merry Piper
I agree. The second play-through had a few mods and the first two
were "A Better Ra'Virr" which made that Balmora kitty-cat tops on my
lists of favored merchants, and, the wildlife mod that makes them
(usually) only attack if attacked first.
Another early mod I enjoyed was an everlasting torch. Very handy.
lister...@hotmail.com
that. "
And yet, they did.
PC.IGN.com: "Another issue for me between the versions is the control.
I think the Xbox 360 controller may actually prove better and more
intuitive."
GamingNexus.com: "After playing both versions I really have to say that
I still preferred the Xbox 360 controls over the PC setup for ease of
use."
I didn't see any previews that compared the controls on both versions
and didn't say the 360 controller wasn't at least as good if not
better.
Angof
> On Sun, 5 Mar 2006 13:13:07 -0000, "Angof" <Mailf...@yahoo.co.uk(no
> need for Mail)> wrote:
>
>> Oh..another thing that really wound me up was the suicidal attacks
>> from the wildlife...changed that so only diseased animals were
>> stupidly aggresive.
>
> I agree. The second play-through had a few mods and the first two
> were "A Better Ra'Virr" which made that Balmora kitty-cat tops on my
> lists of favored merchants, and, the wildlife mod that makes them
> (usually) only attack if attacked first.
>
> Another early mod I enjoyed was an everlasting torch. Very handy.
That reminds me of another of my favourites. Lights_300_V4. Reworks all
lights in the game to be more, colourful, dynamic and realistic. Red
candlesticks have red flames radiate red light, green have green flames and
light...and so on.
Interiors are slightly darkened to make source lights more dominant over the
ambient light. Dungeons are now mostly pitch black with the exception of the
source lights.
Torches have longer expiration times and bigger and brighter radius so that
they are actually useful. I always made sure I was carrying torches with
this mod installed. I personally wouldn't use the everlasting torch mod but
that's a matter of taste. Also a lot more light sources, candles, lanterns
etc. are usable. The mod includes Light based Sneaking and True Light and
Darkness which I also like.
John Lewis
wrote:
>John Lewis wrote:
>> On 3 Mar 2006 22:53:28 -0800, "Blowhole911" <blowh...@walla.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Sorry, but I'll be getting this one on PC. I remember how ass the
>>> controls were for Morrowind and Arx Fatalis on the Xbox. I don't feel
>>> like shelling out $20 more than the PC version for the same controls.
>>>
>>
>> Actually $10.
>>
>> Plus, afaik, the Construction Set ships with the PC version. Pity that
>> the Xflop360 owners won't be able to access any of the great 3rd-party
>> mods.... PC Oblivion looks as if it will be a modder's delight, far
>> more so than Morrowind.
>>
>> John Lewis
>
>xbox 360 owners wont care for 3rd party mods as you put it, its all
>about the game Obliviob being on the xbox 360 console.
>
True, with the attention-span of most of the console-kiddies, brought
up in an environment of TV punctuated every 5 minutes by ads.
Copies of Oblivion Xbox360 will be sold because it is kewl to have
the latest Xbox360 game. Then thrown aside when the next kewl
brain-dead FPS comes out.
John Lewis
Highlandish
<jgpl02tjoej26hk0j...@4ax.com>
> On Sun, 5 Mar 2006 13:13:07 -0000, "Angof" <Mailf...@yahoo.co.uk(no
> need for Mail)> wrote:
>
>>Oh..another thing that really wound me up was the suicidal attacks
>>from the wildlife...changed that so only diseased animals were
>>stupidly aggresive.
>
> I agree. The second play-through had a few mods and the first two
> were "A Better Ra'Virr" which made that Balmora kitty-cat tops on my
> lists of favored merchants, and, the wildlife mod that makes them
> (usually) only attack if attacked first.
>
> Another early mod I enjoyed was an everlasting torch. Very handy.
the one mod I enjoyed the most was the ring of recall with 10 storage slots.
it wasn't a cheat as you had to visit the place first and store it before
you would ever recall back to it.
still... I had ten fingers, why cant I have ten rings?
--
Remove the _CURSEING to reply to me
A pessimist is a man who, given the choice of two evils, chooses both.
Angof
> Quoth The Raven; The Merry Piper <merry_pi...@COATyahoo.com> in
> <jgpl02tjoej26hk0j...@4ax.com>
>> On Sun, 5 Mar 2006 13:13:07 -0000, "Angof"
>> <Mailf...@yahoo.co.uk(no need for Mail)> wrote:
>>
>>> Oh..another thing that really wound me up was the suicidal attacks
>>> from the wildlife...changed that so only diseased animals were
>>> stupidly aggresive.
>>
>> I agree. The second play-through had a few mods and the first two
>> were "A Better Ra'Virr" which made that Balmora kitty-cat tops on my
>> lists of favored merchants, and, the wildlife mod that makes them
>> (usually) only attack if attacked first.
>>
>> Another early mod I enjoyed was an everlasting torch. Very handy.
>
> the one mod I enjoyed the most was the ring of recall with 10 storage
> slots. it wasn't a cheat as you had to visit the place first and
> store it before you would ever recall back to it.
>
I used that too...come on...it is a cheat ;-)
Highlandish
<440c0b79$0$3592$ed2e...@ptn-nntp-reader04.plus.net>
other games had this built in i hear, so it isnt a cheat. extremely handy,
so good it could be thought of as a cheat.....
--
Remove the _CURSEING to reply to me
A narrow mind has a broad tongue.
Angof
> Quoth The Raven; Angof <Mailf...@yahoo.co.uk(no need for Mail)> in
> <440c0b79$0$3592$ed2e...@ptn-nntp-reader04.plus.net>
>> Highlandish wrote:
>>> Quoth The Raven; The Merry Piper <merry_pi...@COATyahoo.com> in
>>> <jgpl02tjoej26hk0j...@4ax.com>
>>>> On Sun, 5 Mar 2006 13:13:07 -0000, "Angof"
>>>> <Mailf...@yahoo.co.uk(no need for Mail)> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Oh..another thing that really wound me up was the suicidal attacks
>>>>> from the wildlife...changed that so only diseased animals were
>>>>> stupidly aggresive.
>>>>
>>>> I agree. The second play-through had a few mods and the first two
>>>> were "A Better Ra'Virr" which made that Balmora kitty-cat tops on
>>>> my lists of favored merchants, and, the wildlife mod that makes
>>>> them (usually) only attack if attacked first.
>>>>
>>>> Another early mod I enjoyed was an everlasting torch. Very handy.
>>>
>>> the one mod I enjoyed the most was the ring of recall with 10
>>> storage slots. it wasn't a cheat as you had to visit the place
>>> first and store it before you would ever recall back to it.
>>>
>>
>> I used that too...come on...it is a cheat ;-)
>
> other games had this built in i hear, so it isnt a cheat. extremely
> handy, so good it could be thought of as a cheat.....
I wouldn't be without it.
Kavvy
John Lewis wrote:
>
> True, with the attention-span of most of the console-kiddies, brought
> up in an environment of TV punctuated every 5 minutes by ads.
>
> Copies of Oblivion Xbox360 will be sold because it is kewl to have
> the latest Xbox360 game. Then thrown aside when the next kewl
> brain-dead FPS comes out.
>
> John Lewis
Considering that most of the people I have met online with the 360 have
been over the age of 25 and also play games with a PC. I'll offer the
suggestion that your comment is based upon pure childishness yourself.
Do you believe that anyone under the age of 18 isn't allowed to own a
PC or something?
Rich
news:440b60f4...@news.verizon.net...
> True, with the attention-span of most of the console-kiddies, brought
> up in an environment of TV punctuated every 5 minutes by ads.
>
> Copies of Oblivion Xbox360 will be sold because it is kewl to have
> the latest Xbox360 game. Then thrown aside when the next kewl
> brain-dead FPS comes out.
I play games on both my PC and 360, but will be paying the extra $10 for the
360 version.
My thought process was pretty easy. I can either play this awesome-looking
game on a Mitsubishi 720p projector blown up on a 106" screen with a nice
5.1 system, or play it on my PC with a 19" Samsung CRT with 5.1 "PC"
speakers.
I suspect many people in a similar situation such as myself (i.e. playing
their 360s on something larger than a PC monitor) will do the same.
I'm a lifelong PC gamer; I remember buying games such as Zork II and King's
Quest new in the box. I've bought hundreds, of not over a thousand new PC
games. However, even I have to admit that PC gaming is dying. I'm not
talking about playing games on PCs; I'm talking about the whole paradigm of
sitting in an office chair, back hunched, with your face a foot and a half
from a monitor. The hardware is really meaningless, IMO. The differences
between the game playing capabilities of a console and a PC are academic at
this point.
Andrew
>My thought process was pretty easy. I can either play this awesome-looking
>game on a Mitsubishi 720p projector blown up on a 106" screen with a nice
>5.1 system, or play it on my PC with a 19" Samsung CRT with 5.1 "PC"
>speakers.
>
>I suspect many people in a similar situation such as myself (i.e. playing
>their 360s on something larger than a PC monitor) will do the same.
Why not run your PC through the projector?
Angof
> The differences between the game playing
> capabilities of a console and a PC are academic at this point.
Not so. When Oblivion is released the Xbox version will not ship with the
construction set...that IMO is a huge difference between the two platforms.
The PC version of Morrowind was immeasurably better due to the modding
community and I expect Oblivion to be the same.
Chris F
usenet surely disproves that. especially alt.* game groups.
--
gamertag: Chrisflynnuk
http://live.xbox.com/member/Chrisflynnuk
Chris F
but is it so hard to believe that people actually want to play a game
as it was intended, rather than fuck about with it endlessly?
Briton
I'm sure some do but is it also hard to believe that you can adapt the game
to suit your tastes without fucking about with it endlessly? :-) I haven't
added a mod for yonks.
Sean Black
<ch...@asifimtellingyoulot.com> writes
I'd definitely fall in to that category. I play PC games and Xbox games,
I'll be getting Oblivion for the 360, I'd rather play it on my
big-screen TV with full surround system relaxing on the couch.
I've played hundreds of PC games over the years and I could count on the
fingers of one hand the amount of times I've actually used any of the
many, many mods for said games. When I do actually manage to finish a
game, PC or Xbox, which is not nearly as often as I should, I very
rarely feel the need to revisit any of them, modded or not.
--
Sean Black
Michael W. Ryder
The only advantage for the PC version for me was the ability to
"correct" some of the the bugs in the game using the console. An option
that was never added to the XBox version. I don't know if Oblivion will
add this support, but I am sure that if they don't there will be a lot
of complaining. Plus I don't know if the XBox version will be
upgradeable as Bethesda puts out the inevitable slew of patches to fix
things that weren't in their rush to get the game out the doors.
Yes, I added some mods to the game, but only after finishing the main
quest the first time. I bought the game when it was first released and
it was months before any real mods started showing up. For the most
part I didn't find any mods that added to the game experience, and of
course there were none that fixed the main problems I had with the game.
John Lewis
I look forward to total-conversion mods using the Oblivion engine.
For an example, how about a variant of Far Cry ? ( This may not be
the best example, since Crytek will probably be shipping their editor
with Crysis )
John Lewis.
Highlandish
<s0jo02tv9dh4udqfs...@4ax.com>
i spent more time playing with the game, than playing the game its self.
--
Remove the _CURSEING to reply to me
If you are good, you will be assigned all the work. If you are really
good, you will get out of it.
chainbreaker
>> but is it so hard to believe that people actually want to play a game
>> as it was intended, rather than fuck about with it endlessly?
>
> i spent more time playing with the game, than playing the game its
> self.
Heh, that sounds like me with CoH's character creation editor. I'd actually
buy a standalone version of it.
--
chainbreaker
jwb
news:cd0Pf.20227$J02....@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> Yes, I added some mods to the game, but only after finishing the main
> quest the first time. I bought the game when it was first released and it
> was months before any real mods started showing up. For the most part I
> didn't find any mods that added to the game experience, and of course
> there were none that fixed the main problems I had with the game.
I found useful mods almost right away. Particularly housing mods. Yes, they
got better over time, but even in the beginning, they were useful, and made
for a better experience.
Also, in my first game, I used the construction set to fashion myself a
sword that a favorite DnD character had years ago. Overpowered yes, but
hell, it's my game :)
Michael W. Ryder
> "Michael W. Ryder" <_mwr...@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
> news:cd0Pf.20227$J02....@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>
>> Yes, I added some mods to the game, but only after finishing the main
>> quest the first time. I bought the game when it was first released and it
>> was months before any real mods started showing up. For the most part I
>> didn't find any mods that added to the game experience, and of course
>> there were none that fixed the main problems I had with the game.
>
> I found useful mods almost right away. Particularly housing mods. Yes, they
> got better over time, but even in the beginning, they were useful, and made
> for a better experience.
>
I didn't find any mods that I liked at all until Suran Underworld. I
loaded the official Bethesda modules but they were more gimmicks than
something that added to the game. I tried Havish but gave up on some of
the quests when they would not work for me. But there were almost no
mods for several months after Morrowind was first released and by then I
had completed the main quest and all the side quests I found interesting.
> Also, in my first game, I used the construction set to fashion myself a
> sword that a favorite DnD character had years ago. Overpowered yes, but
> hell, it's my game :)
>
>
I created a set of glass boots of blinding speed only because the
original ones just did not go with the rest of the glass armor.
BombayMix
>"correct" some of the the bugs in the game using the console. An option
>that was never added to the XBox version. I don't know if Oblivion will
>add this support, but I am sure that if they don't there will be a lot
>of complaining. Plus I don't know if the XBox version will be
>upgradeable as Bethesda puts out the inevitable slew of patches to fix
>things that weren't in their rush to get the game out the doors.
They've already said they will be patches an official mods for the 360.
The first official mod meant to add more options to the horses.
Kendrick Kerwin Chua
BombayMix <bomb...@altavista.co.uk> wrote:
>>The only advantage for the PC version for me was the ability to
>>"correct" some of the the bugs in the game using the console. An option
>>that was never added to the XBox version. I don't know if Oblivion will
>>add this support, but I am sure that if they don't there will be a lot
>They've already said they will be patches an official mods for the 360.
>The first official mod meant to add more options to the horses.
This would be, what? Ground effects, neon lighting, upgraded sound system,
that sort of thing? :)
Seriously, Morrowind hit the original Xbox about three or four months
before Microsoft's online gaming strategy had solidified. If Morrowind had
been ported with Xbox live connectivity in mind, mods and patches might
have been implemented as easily as they were for the PC. Basic Xbox Live
connectivity is free for all 360 owners (at least, enough of a taste to
make people seriously considering shelling out for the Gold service) so
there's arguably potential for mods and patches to be available for
Oblivion. That's just speculation, but the capability is certainly
present.
-KKC, who proposes the thought exercise of creating the medieval version
of 'Pimp My Ride.'
--
-- "I bought a house, it's a two bedroom house. But - kendrick
I think it's up to me how many bedrooms there are, - @io.com
dont you? F*** you, real estate lady, this bedroom -
has an oven in it!" - Mitch Hedberg, 1968-2005 -
Briton
It's a matter of taste I suppose. I found the 'vanilla' version of the game
unplayable for the the economics system alone. I mean...wtf was going
through their minds wirth that pathetic mudcrab and creeper business?
Rich
news:6bgo02hv06t5063vv...@4ax.com...
> Why not run your PC through the projector?
Mostly because my PC sounds like a 747. I'm also not really set up to use a
keyboard/mouse, video card is questionable, etc..
Someday, the console and PC will merge into one device, but we're not quite
there yet. I came to the conclusion awhile back that it made no sense to
continue to upgrade my PC just for games, when the overall gaming experience
over a console was superior for most types of games anyway. And, it's a
HELL of a lot cheaper, plus there are more high quality games to choose
from.
The only remaining type of game that I continue to play using my PC are RTS
games. I'm not sure you can ever really do those on a console - although, I
did say that about FPS games at one point as well and changed my mind!
Angof
> "Andrew" <spamtrap@localhost.> wrote in message
> news:6bgo02hv06t5063vv...@4ax.com...
> Someday, the console and PC will merge into one device, but we're not
> quite there yet.
So we are forever being told. Personally I think it's pants.
Rich
news:440c4925$0$6980$ed26...@ptn-nntp-reader02.plus.net...
> Not so. When Oblivion is released the Xbox version will not ship with the
> construction set...that IMO is a huge difference between the two
> platforms.
> The PC version of Morrowind was immeasurably better due to the modding
> community and I expect Oblivion to be the same.
The construction set is very cool, don't get me wrong. If my PC is up to
snuff, I'll buy Oblivion for the PC in a couple years when it's $10 and
check out the mods people have done, kind of like I did for Neverwinter
Nights. Unfortunately, my days of endless time to fiddle with stuff like
this are over.
BombayMix
>>>"correct" some of the the bugs in the game using the console. An option
>>>that was never added to the XBox version. I don't know if Oblivion will
>>>add this support, but I am sure that if they don't there will be a lot
>>They've already said they will be patches an official mods for the 360.
>>The first official mod meant to add more options to the horses.
>This would be, what? Ground effects, neon lighting, upgraded sound system,
>that sort of thing? :)
More pretty colours basically. Didn't sound anything too exciting and
I've no idea why it not being shipped with it. The guy conducting the
interview didn't ask that question. ^_^
If you want to hear for yourself, it was in an interview here,
http://www.gamingsteve.com, with one of the producers.
Xocyll
reading the entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good,
the signs say:
Eh, the console and PC will merge into your pants?
Xocyll
--
I don't particularly want you to FOAD, myself. You'll be more of
a cautionary example if you'll FO And Get Chronically, Incurably,
Painfully, Progressively, Expensively, Debilitatingly Ill. So
FOAGCIPPEDI. -- Mike Andrews responding to an idiot in asr
Lucian Wischik
>Why not run your PC through the projector?
I do that, sitting on the couch, laptop hooked up to projector and
expensive stereo system, and I use a wireless keyboard+touchpad to
play. It's very good!
--
Lucian
Briton
> "Angof" <Mailf...@yahoo.co.uk(no need for Mail)> looked up from
> reading the entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is
> good, the signs say:
>
>> Rich wrote:
>>> "Andrew" <spamtrap@localhost.> wrote in message
>>> news:6bgo02hv06t5063vv...@4ax.com...
>>
>>
>>> Someday, the console and PC will merge into one device, but we're
>>> not quite there yet.
>>
>> So we are forever being told. Personally I think it's pants.
>
> Eh, the console and PC will merge into your pants?
>
> Xocyll
Nope...I believe things will continue much as they are now.
Michael W. Ryder
Daggerfall where gold had weight and you could buy letters of credit,
houses, etc. I never figured out why they broke everything that worked
in Arena and Daggerfall and I could see no way that a mod could fix
these problems.
Gerry Quinn
Mailf...@yahoo.co.uk says...
> It's a matter of taste I suppose. I found the 'vanilla' version of the game
> unplayable for the the economics system alone. I mean...wtf was going
> through their minds wirth that pathetic mudcrab and creeper business?
Those were essentially cheat options, IMO.
- Gerry Quinn
Briton
I use the Adventurers mod which makes expensive items harder to come by but
also easier to sell when you do (as well as many other tweeks). I also use
several Taddues balance mods which change the stats to make
damage/weights/value of objects, weapons, armours etc. more 'realistic'.
I also use the a Bank mod that adds a banking system where you can
deposit/loan money and buy property. Of course there are many mods that give
the ability to buy your own houses.
Michael W. Ryder
million gold pieces as easily as carrying one. Try that in real life
some time:) The store economics was also absurd. No businessman is
going to buy 100 swords and let them sit on the shelf. If he already
has a couple sitting on the shelf he would offer less for a new one, if
he would buy it at all.
Another thing I liked about Daggerfall is that merchants had a
constantly changing inventory, with better items becoming available as
your character improved. I liked having to constantly check out
merchants looking for that special piece of armor or weapon instead of
knowing that merchant A always had that item in stock regardless of how
many I had purchased in the past.
Mr. Limpet
news:440dbc7e$0$3596$ed2e...@ptn-nntp-reader04.plus.net...
So did the world's buggy whip manufacturers.
Of course, they were right up until the moment they weren't.
Briton
Agree. There is such a thing as roleplaying though. I use the Bank mod and
deposit any spare cash.
>The store economics was also absurd. No businessman is
> going to buy 100 swords and let them sit on the shelf. If he already
> has a couple sitting on the shelf he would offer less for a new one,
> if he would buy it at all.
> Another thing I liked about Daggerfall is that merchants had a
> constantly changing inventory, with better items becoming available as
> your character improved. I liked having to constantly check out
> merchants looking for that special piece of armor or weapon instead of
> knowing that merchant A always had that item in stock regardless of
> how many I had purchased in the past.
Again I agree. Not enough emphasis was placed on the economics of the game
IMO.
CJM
"Highlandish" <ckreskay...@dodo.com.au> wrote in message
news:440bd0c9$0$59081$c30e...@ken-reader.news.telstra.net...
>
> the one mod I enjoyed the most was the ring of recall with 10 storage
> slots. it wasn't a cheat as you had to visit the place first and store it
> before you would ever recall back to it.
>
> still... I had ten fingers, why cant I have ten rings?
>
>
I had a similar mod that allowed 12 slots (no ring needed).
Rather than being a cheat, it was essential. I would have simple got bored
of the game if I had to spend so much time travelling backwards &
forwards....
By the sound of it they have improved this aspect natively in Oblivion
CJM
CJM
"Rich" <ri...@nospam.com> wrote in message news:PTfPf.110$jz2...@fe02.lga...
>
> Someday, the console and PC will merge into one device, but we're not
> quite there yet.
We are. It's called a gaming PC. It does everything a console does but
better, and everything a PC does.
> I came to the conclusion awhile back that it made no sense to continue to
> upgrade my PC just for games, when the overall gaming experience over a
> console was superior for most types of games anyway.
Upgrading is a big issue these days, especially since the top-end hardware
*is* quite expensive...
However, I and many others would dispute the fact that the console
experience is better than the PC one....
> And, it's a HELL of a lot cheaper, plus there are more high quality games
> to choose from.
It *is* cheaper, but then again it does less... And games are more
expensive... it soon adds up...
Xocyll
entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
say:
>
>"Highlandish" <ckreskay...@dodo.com.au> wrote in message
>news:440bd0c9$0$59081$c30e...@ken-reader.news.telstra.net...
>>
>> the one mod I enjoyed the most was the ring of recall with 10 storage
>> slots. it wasn't a cheat as you had to visit the place first and store it
>> before you would ever recall back to it.
>>
>> still... I had ten fingers, why cant I have ten rings?
>
>I had a similar mod that allowed 12 slots (no ring needed).
>
>Rather than being a cheat, it was essential. I would have simple got bored
>of the game if I had to spend so much time travelling backwards &
>forwards....
Not really necessary.
Just mark, recall, divine intervention and almsivi intervention is
enough to get you around most places.
Mark your spot, warp to the nearest temple/fort with an intervention
spell (or scroll), do whatever buying an selling you have to do
(including using fast travel to go elsewhere, then recall back to your
start point.)
If you've done the codex thing as well and gotten access to the travel
guild at the mages you can get around most places pretty quickly.
>By the sound of it they have improved this aspect natively in Oblivion
We'll have to see.
Xocyll
the entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the
signs say:
>Briton wrote:
>> Michael W. Ryder wrote:
>>> Briton wrote:
>>>> Michael W. Ryder wrote:
>>>>> Chris F wrote:
>>>> It's a matter of taste I suppose. I found the 'vanilla' version of
>>>> the game unplayable for the the economics system alone. I mean...wtf
>>>> was going through their minds wirth that pathetic mudcrab and
>>>> creeper business?
>>>>
>>>>
>>> I never liked the "new" economic system. I much preferred the one in
>>> Daggerfall where gold had weight and you could buy letters of credit,
>>> houses, etc. I never figured out why they broke everything that
>>> worked in Arena and Daggerfall and I could see no way that a mod
>>> could fix these problems.
>>
>> I use the Adventurers mod which makes expensive items harder to come by but
>> also easier to sell when you do (as well as many other tweeks). I also use
>> several Taddues balance mods which change the stats to make
>> damage/weights/value of objects, weapons, armours etc. more 'realistic'.
>> I also use the a Bank mod that adds a banking system where you can
>> deposit/loan money and buy property. Of course there are many mods that give
>> the ability to buy your own houses.
>>
>>
>>
>My complaints were that gold weighed nothing, meaning I could carry a
>million gold pieces as easily as carrying one. Try that in real life
>some time:)
Ahh, but unlike Daggerfall you weren't very likely to get a million gold
pieces unless you modified the game since merchants had quite limited
amounts of gold to spend.
> The store economics was also absurd. No businessman is
>going to buy 100 swords and let them sit on the shelf. If he already
>has a couple sitting on the shelf he would offer less for a new one, if
>he would buy it at all.
That's making the assumption that he only sells locally.
>Another thing I liked about Daggerfall is that merchants had a
>constantly changing inventory, with better items becoming available as
>your character improved. I liked having to constantly check out
>merchants looking for that special piece of armor or weapon instead of
>knowing that merchant A always had that item in stock regardless of how
>many I had purchased in the past.
To be fair though, Daggerfall was a couple hundred cities in multiple
provinces and a randomized inventory is _much_ easier than trying to
save the state of all those stores on a 486 with 8 meg ram.
Morrowind on the other hand had very few stores, and came at a time when
computer speed and storage was more than equal to the task of keeping
track of those inventories.
Having all those stores in Daggerfall also meant you could sell anything
you got, so buyable houses, boats and bank drafts made sense in a way
that they didn't in Morrowind.
MJB
"CJM" <cjmn...@REMOVEMEyahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:4782bnF...@individual.net...
>
> "Rich" <ri...@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:PTfPf.110$jz2...@fe02.lga...
>>
>> Someday, the console and PC will merge into one device, but we're not
>> quite there yet.
>
> We are. It's called a gaming PC. It does everything a console does but
> better, and everything a PC does.
Agreed, When the day comes I can surf the web, process my invoices,
communicate with my clients, load and manipulate digital photos, upload the
photos to my website, write text documents, burn DVDs and CDs AND play
games like Morrowind using a keyboard / mouse combo instead of a gamepad on
a Xbox or Playstation console, I'll agree the time of integration 'might'
have arrived. Until then I'll take a multi-function PC with a traditional
keyboard over a single-use game console with it's thumb-wrecking gamepad
anytime.
>
>> I came to the conclusion awhile back that it made no sense to continue to
>> upgrade my PC just for games, when the overall gaming experience over a
>> console was superior for most types of games anyway.
>
> Upgrading is a big issue these days, especially since the top-end hardware
> *is* quite expensive...
True - but if you wait six months the price will go down. PC games are
generally cheaper than their console cousins - sometimes by as much as
twenty or thirty dollars after some 'little' time has passed since the
release date. And while upgrading hardware can be a technical nightmare to
some people, I've actually enjoyed learning about what is inside my PC and
making my own decisions about how I want it to run.
<shrug>
Horses for courses. If all you're going to do is play games on your TV, a
console is a good investment. But IMO you're older and have never owned a
console system, a PC-based game is much more attractive.
>
> However, I and many others would dispute the fact that the console
> experience is better than the PC one....
>
>> And, it's a HELL of a lot cheaper, plus there are more high quality games
>> to choose from.
>
> It *is* cheaper, but then again it does less... And games are more
> expensive... it soon adds up...
>
Agreed. Although the only two console games I ever wished were ported to
the PC were the 'fight night' and Grand Turismo series. I watched my
friends play those and felt envious - until I tried the gamepad and after
just a few minutes my thumbs went numb. So much for that...
--
MJB
Mr. Tin's Miniature Painting Workshop:
http://web.newsguy.com/Mrtinsworkshop/
Highlandish
<iflt02p6gt85udsrb...@4ax.com>
> "CJM" <cjmn...@REMOVEMEyahoo.co.uk> looked up from reading the
> entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
> say:
>
>>
>>"Highlandish" <ckreskay...@dodo.com.au> wrote in message
>>news:440bd0c9$0$59081$c30e...@ken-reader.news.telstra.net...
>>>
>>> the one mod I enjoyed the most was the ring of recall with 10
>>> storage slots. it wasn't a cheat as you had to visit the place
>>> first and store it before you would ever recall back to it.
>>>
>>> still... I had ten fingers, why cant I have ten rings?
>>
>>I had a similar mod that allowed 12 slots (no ring needed).
>>
>>Rather than being a cheat, it was essential. I would have simple got
>>bored of the game if I had to spend so much time travelling backwards
>>& forwards....
>
> Not really necessary.
> Just mark, recall, divine intervention and almsivi intervention is
> enough to get you around most places.
> Mark your spot, warp to the nearest temple/fort with an intervention
> spell (or scroll), do whatever buying an selling you have to do
> (including using fast travel to go elsewhere, then recall back to your
> start point.)
> If you've done the codex thing as well and gotten access to the travel
> guild at the mages you can get around most places pretty quickly.
>
I couldn't be bothered with all that, one cheat I did use was make my
athletics 999 in god mode, and jump where ever I had to go, like superman
would. I'd hit the clouds and direct my lateral motion with the cursors, and
on the minimap I'd watch till I hit where I want to and stall until I fall
down from the clouds. you get from one end of the world to the other in 30
seconds. :)
--
Remove the _CURSEING to reply to me
Without geometry, life is pointless.
Xocyll
Like the scrolls you get from the body just north of the start village.
I never particularly liked jumping that high.
Although, with 100 athletics and something like 336 speed the one
character I had that got vamped covered ground (including long jumps) at
an insane rate.
You really notice the cell loading when you're hitting a cell boundary
every 5 seconds or so.
McGrandpa
"Angof" <Mailf...@yahoo.co.uk(no need for Mail)> wrote in message
news:440d8b28$0$70315$ed26...@ptn-nntp-reader03.plus.net...
I'll keep my PC for games too. You don't do *mods* with the consoles.
That's the best part of the pc games, is the 3rd party mods! Morrowind,
Tombraider, Quakes, DOOMs, UT's, HL's and Far Cry, all have some great user
made levels at the very least. I *like* my PC. I like it for everything
I do. Photography/imaging, games, communicating. But that's ME, and you
and he and she are allowed to like whatever you do :)
McG.
Chris F
i think the question is how long will you be playing PC games for in
the long run?
PC gaming really is dying on its arse. i'm not saying that there
aren't good games being made for PC's, but they just don't sell many.
--
gamertag: Chrisflynnuk
http://live.xbox.com/member/Chrisflynnuk
MJB
"Chris F" <ch...@asifimtellingyoulot.com> wrote in message
news:lnq1121rstsehhg0a...@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 10 Mar 2006 01:48:33 GMT, "McGrandpa"
> <McGran...@NOThotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Angof" <Mailf...@yahoo.co.uk(no need for Mail)> wrote in message
>>news:440d8b28$0$70315$ed26...@ptn-nntp-reader03.plus.net...
>>> Rich wrote:
>>>> "Andrew" <spamtrap@localhost.> wrote in message
>>>> news:6bgo02hv06t5063vv...@4ax.com...
>>>
>>>
>>>> Someday, the console and PC will merge into one device, but we're not
>>>> quite there yet.
>>>
>>> So we are forever being told. Personally I think it's pants.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>I'll keep my PC for games too. You don't do *mods* with the consoles.
>>That's the best part of the pc games, is the 3rd party mods! Morrowind,
>>Tombraider, Quakes, DOOMs, UT's, HL's and Far Cry, all have some great
>>user
>>made levels at the very least. I *like* my PC. I like it for
>>everything
>>I do. Photography/imaging, games, communicating. But that's ME, and you
>>and he and she are allowed to like whatever you do :)
>>McG.
>>
> i think the question is how long will you be playing PC games for in
> the long run?
I'm 47 and have been dealing with computers both professionally and
recreationally since I was 22 or so. The long-run for me is maybe twenty
more years. Beyond that I'm hoping to remain alert enought not to drool
excessively.
>
> PC gaming really is dying on its arse. i'm not saying that there
> aren't good games being made for PC's, but they just don't sell many.
PC gaming is dying, PC gaming is dying, the console is king, oh, woe is me,
woe is me, woe is me....
<shrug>
Well, considering that just three weeks ago I finished the original
half-life for the very first time - played on my new XP computer. And,
short of a catastrophic house fire burning everything-up and my continuing
to complete one PC game every four or five months, I figure I have enough
stuff unplayed and un-installed in boxes to last probably fifteen more
years. And I've still got to buy Oblivion, Call of Ctuhlu, Call of Duty 2
and Medieval total war 2. Hell, in the last three months alone I've
purchased nearly thirty new pc games - buying a new computer will do that.
<shrug>
Provided I can still buy new computers to replace my existing rig, I should
be fine. And if they continue to make product available to a willing
market, I will continue to buy. At least until nurse says 'no' and emptys
my drool bucket.
<grin>
John Lewis
<cjmn...@REMOVEMEyahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>"Rich" <ri...@nospam.com> wrote in message news:PTfPf.110$jz2...@fe02.lga...
>>
>> Someday, the console and PC will merge into one device, but we're not
>> quite there yet.
>
>We are. It's called a gaming PC. It does everything a console does but
>better, and everything a PC does.
>
The Commodore Amiga did that in 1985 thru 1992. True multitasking OS
too. Superior software and hardware engineering than the Mac, Atari ST
and PC at that time. Superior windowed user interface. The world's
first true A/V multimedia computer. Totally open system with extensive
user and developer documentation publicly available -- unlike the Mac.
Sunk by Commodore's marketing and management who went after businerss
computing for which it was a terrible fit. Should have gone after the
then-monochrome Mac. The multitasking OS was perfect for <realtime>
processing of electronic music - multiple simultaneously-active
windows etc. However, greedy looks at the business market side brought
the downfall. Reluctant support of the multimedia developers.
John Lewis
Briton
> On Fri, 10 Mar 2006 01:48:33 GMT, "McGrandpa"
> <McGran...@NOThotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> "Angof" <Mailf...@yahoo.co.uk(no need for Mail)> wrote in message
>> news:440d8b28$0$70315$ed26...@ptn-nntp-reader03.plus.net...
>>> Rich wrote:
>>>> "Andrew" <spamtrap@localhost.> wrote in message
>>
> the long run?
>
Still? Taking it's time shuffling off this mortal coil isn't it? It's been
dying ever since I can remember.
croaker68
M
pc plus Xbox and PSTwo),........100's........
Guess there arent enough hours in the day.........
--
M
------
"War is delightful to those who have had no experience of it."
[Erasmus]
"MJB" <mrt...@OLDSguy.com> wrote in message
news:duqur...@news3.newsguy.com...
Xocyll
reading the entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good,
the signs say:
>Chris F wrote:
Nah, it died years ago but someone reanimated the corpse and now it's
undead.
It's shuffling slowly because it's a zombie.
Rich
> better, and everything a PC does.
The problem with a gaming PC is that it's still a PC, and therefore is not
running standardized hardware. We've come a long way since EMM386 and
Soundblaster issues, but just last summer I was experiencing graphical
problems in World of Warcraft due to having an ATi card. I didn't mind
these issues when I was in high school and had limitless amounts of time to
get things running properly, but after a full day of work I just want to sit
on the couch and play.
> However, I and many others would dispute the fact that the console
> experience is better than the PC one....
It really depends on your setup. For married folks who may have to share a
TV, I don't doubt that they'd prefer PC gaming. But an office chair and PC
monitor can't compete with a HDTV, a simple controller and a La-Z-Boy.
Rich
> Agreed, When the day comes I can surf the web, process my invoices,
> communicate with my clients, load and manipulate digital photos, upload
> the > photos to my website, write text documents, burn DVDs and CDs AND
These are all things a PC does very well. Although, I burn plenty of DVDs
on my Tivo. My point is that we are getting closer to an "all in one" box,
although we're not going to get there anytime in the near future. PCs
aren't "going away", but it's clear from the shrinking number of big-budget
PC titles that its role as a primary entertainment device IS going away.
> keyboard over a single-use game console with it's thumb-wrecking gamepad
> anytime.
I don't understand this comment. Your thumbs are hardier than your wrists,
which take a fair bit of abuse thanks to your mouse and keyboard. I've been
using a PC since I was 13 (will turn 32 in a week) and I'm ok, but after a
long programming session I do have to "shake it out" a bit.
I think part of my prejudice against PCs as gaming devices stems from the
fact I work in IT, and there are really only so many hours I want to sit in
an office chair and stare at a PC monitor in one day.
> release date. And while upgrading hardware can be a technical nightmare
> to some people, I've actually enjoyed learning about what is inside my PC
> and making my own decisions about how I want it to run.
It's not the upgrading process itself that bothers me (it's a whole lot
easier than it once was!), it's the cost of new video cards, and the fact
that many new PC titles simply don't work well with X piece of hardware.
Those god da** copy protection schemes, for example, tend to hate the last
two DVD burners I've owned. I love downloading cracks for PC software I've
purchased. And then there's even the "big" titles, such as WoW and Civ IV,
which both had huge problems with either nVidia or ATi GPUs.
I honestly don't know anyone not in IT who games on a PC, which makes sense.
We're the only people who have the patience and expertise to fix these
nonsense problems.
> the PC were the 'fight night' and Grand Turismo series. I watched my
> friends play those and felt envious - until I tried the gamepad and after
> just a few minutes my thumbs went numb. So much for that...
I've found the PS2 controllers' thumbsticks to be poorly placed. The new
XBox 360 controller is much better in this regard. Although, I did have a
PS2 and put quite a bit of time, without any noticeable thumb strain. I
have a much bigger problem coming home and gaming on my PC after spending an
entire day working on a PC.
MJB
"Rich" <ri...@nospam.com> wrote in message news:FZzRf.10$ls...@fe05.lga...
> "MJB" <mrt...@OLDSguy.com> wrote in message
> news:dumqn...@news3.newsguy.com...
>> Agreed, When the day comes I can surf the web, process my invoices,
>> communicate with my clients, load and manipulate digital photos, upload
>> the > photos to my website, write text documents, burn DVDs and CDs AND
>
> These are all things a PC does very well. Although, I burn plenty of DVDs
> on my Tivo. My point is that we are getting closer to an "all in one"
> box, although we're not going to get there anytime in the near future.
> PCs aren't "going away", but it's clear from the shrinking number of
> big-budget PC titles that its role as a primary entertainment device IS
> going away.
Ummm... apples and oranges. The console was designed solely as an
entertainment device. The PC was always a multi-use device with gaming a
popular sidelight. And when you do get your 'all in one' box it will have a
keyboard and a mouse and a gamepad - and it will be a personal computer for
all effects and purposes. A castrated PC that displays on the TV perhaps,
but a PC none-the-less.
>> keyboard over a single-use game console with it's thumb-wrecking gamepad
>> anytime.
>
> I don't understand this comment. Your thumbs are hardier than your
> wrists, which take a fair bit of abuse thanks to your mouse and keyboard.
> I've been using a PC since I was 13 (will turn 32 in a week) and I'm ok,
> but after a long programming session I do have to "shake it out" a bit.
You probably don't understand the comment because your fifteen years younger
than me and most probably have been using a gamepad for what? 25 years?
Me, I've NEVER owned a console system in my entire life so the gamepad
strains my thumbs in directions it was never meant to go. Perhaps after
years of use, a gamepad is like the keyboard is to me - I've been using one
since I learned to touch-type in 1974 at my mother's insistance. Best piece
of advice my Mom ever gave me...
>
> I think part of my prejudice against PCs as gaming devices stems from the
> fact I work in IT, and there are really only so many hours I want to sit
> in an office chair and stare at a PC monitor in one day.
And when I was in IT I did not even own a PC. I has all the computer stuff
I needed at work - having one at home was a waste of time. Besides, I was a
work 60 or 70 hours a week anyway...
>
> It's not the upgrading process itself that bothers me (it's a whole lot
> easier than it once was!), it's the cost of new video cards, and the fact
> that many new PC titles simply don't work well with X piece of hardware.
> Those god da** copy protection schemes, for example, tend to hate the last
> two DVD burners I've owned. I love downloading cracks for PC software
> I've purchased. And then there's even the "big" titles, such as WoW and
> Civ IV, which both had huge problems with either nVidia or ATi GPUs.
I agree that can be an issue - but it's better now than before. At least
you're not having to figure out how to get high memory to work in DOS! And
the cost of upgrading is merely the expected price, so far as I'm concerned.
>
> I honestly don't know anyone not in IT who games on a PC, which makes
> sense. We're the only people who have the patience and expertise to fix
> these nonsense problems.
That's utter BS. Or you don't know many people over thirty who are
'gamers'. I make my living in the miniature wargaming end of the gaming
biz - and I deal with all sorts of people who share my passion for toy
soldiers. And to a man - ranging in age from twenties to mid-sixties, they
all own computers and they all play computer games. The civ series, the
total war series, flight sims of all sorts - gamers have a keen interest in
computer games that fill their desire for strategy and simulation. Maybe
these sorts of gamers aren't interested in shooters like doom and quake so
are off your radar. But show them Rome:Total War or the 'full canvas
jacket' patch for Red Baron 3D and their eyes light-up and their jaws drop
and they go 'cool....' just like a twelve-year old.
> I've found the PS2 controllers' thumbsticks to be poorly placed. The new
> XBox 360 controller is much better in this regard. Although, I did have a
> PS2 and put quite a bit of time, without any noticeable thumb strain. I
> have a much bigger problem coming home and gaming on my PC after spending
> an entire day working on a PC.
So you're generalizing your situation in IT with everyone else who isn't in
IT? I wonder if a baker or a bricklayer feels the same way as you? Don't
assume that everyone uses the device the same way you do - my 73 year old
father has a good PC and he plays gambling games and golf simulations. Is
his experience any less valid than yours?
chainbreaker
> These are all things a PC does very well. Although, I burn plenty of
> DVDs on my Tivo. My point is that we are getting closer to an "all
> in one" box, although we're not going to get there anytime in the
> near future. PCs aren't "going away", but it's clear from the
> shrinking number of big-budget PC titles that its role as a primary
> entertainment device IS going away.
Nah. The sheer numbers of PCs in the world make the potential PC gaming
market way too big to be ignored. Somebody's gonna be priming the pump for
a long time to come.
--
chainbreaker
Chris F
wrote:
but with dwindling sales, why would they?
if there's no money to be made, there'll be none spent.
chainbreaker
Just the hope of it, considering the numbers of PCs out there, will be
enough to lure plenty.
--
chainbreaker
Chris F
wrote:
yeah thats right. companies will invest thousands in hope.
if the market can't sustain healthy sales, which it doesnt look like
it can considering how fast PC games drop in price, then fewer
publishers will invest their money in it as they will get less and
less out of it.
jwb
news:qYCdnZXBaLP...@comcast.com...
> Just the hope of it, considering the numbers of PCs out there, will be
> enough to lure plenty.
The numbers of PC's "out there" and the number of PC's that are owned by
gamers are a completely different thing.
also
The numbers of PC's out there, and the number of them capable of running a
modern game, are also a completely different thing.
Chris F
wrote:
then dilute that by the percentage of gamers, with a gaming PC who
would buy games for it and i think you'll find that percentage shrinks
even further still.
Michael W. Ryder
capable of playing modern titles? There has always been the problem in
that the computers or consoles weren't powerful enough to handle the
game designer's dreams. The PC does have the advantage that you can
upgrade them to a point. Plus there is the fact that you don't have to
support multiple platforms or hope you choose the right platform for
your next great thing.
When I started playing Morrowind I noticed problems with the graphics
and upgraded the video card to eliminate them. Later I upgraded the CPU
and RAM. Something you can not do with an XBox to make it an XBox360.
Chris F
no, but then a console will last you on average, 5 years or so, and
games out towards the end of that life cycle will look far better than
those released at the machines launch.
how much would you have to spend on PC upgrades to stay up to date
over the course of 5 years?
upgradability is a good thing, but it isnt a benefit over console
gaming unless you have more money than sense.
Michael W. Ryder
But you can not try a console game on a different platform to see if you
are interested in the game. I was able to play Morrowind on a computer
that was not powerful enough for all of the features and then upgrade as
I saw fit. I did not have to first buy a new console and the game and
find out I didn't like either. Most new games being released for the
console market only work on the latest and greatest. On a PC the game
can be tried first before deciding if there is any need to upgrade.
Chris F
i'm sorry, but that is probably the weakest argument i have ever read
in this whole debate. how can you say the best console games will only
run on the latest and greatest hardware only? surely thats a criticism
more aptly aimed at the PC gaming market?
you think its an advantage to be able to buy a game, spend ages
installing it, then to find you need to spend £100+ on an upgrade to
get it working at a playable level, rather than buy a game and know it
will work on your hardware, that you dont have to piss about changing
settings or adding new bits to the machine?
the point is that the "latest and greatest" in the console sense, have
a shelf life of 4, 5, even 6 years. they may not be cutting edge
technology by the end of that time, but you can be guaranteed that a
game you buy in year 6 will work just as well as a game you bought on
launch day.
the amount of money you would have to spend in that same timespan to
keep a PC current, or up to a good standard level of technology to run
the latest games would far outstrip the price of a games console.
McGrandpa
"MJB" <mrt...@OLDSguy.com> wrote in message
I took the typing class in high school. In 71. I've never owned a gaming
console either. But it'd take me a while to count up all the computers,
even old 8 bitters, that i've owned/built.
Nobody has to justify what they buy or just like even. I'm thrilled that,
quite simply, we have the choices! I have a bit of trouble understanding
why folks are argueing over console vs pc. Makes no sense to me at all.
McG.
McGrandpa
Because that money has not gone away and doesn't look like it's going to.
There are now several niches filled with titles. Niches that didn't exist
at all ten years ago. About ten years ago, we saw a boom in sheer numbers
of PC titles, and I'd expect there will be dips, even large ones. new game
releases are nowhere near as low as they were in 1990, nor even in 1996.
it's ok, you all go on and say whatever you want. I'll just go on and buy
the games.
McG.
McGrandpa
young. There are a bunch of us oldsters that've been gaming since the
early 80's with computers. perhaps I simply have the perspective of time
to look at that you may not.
There are more games due out this year alone that I'm looking at buying than
in the whole last five years. And if I have a game, I bought it. Or
someone bought it for my bday or Christmas for me. Five years. I'm looking
at buying NINE games this year. I'm picky as hell. That's a lot of games
for this ol man. Go on, read your magazines, the death dealing online mag
articles and listen to the futz in the forums. My years tell me that we
are in a gaming BOOM... it may be declining some now, but it's still in boom
category. Humanity, and all we do...has ups and downs, an ebb and flow,
just like the tides. Where there is a market, there *will* be sales. No
functioning market is a vacuum, ever. PC games *could* slow to a slight
trickle, but they won't. We might see years where we get nothing but loads
of crappy games, but the pc's ARE there, and that's the market. There Will
Be Games. It's only human :)
McG.
McGrandpa
"Chris F"
snip
> unless you have more money than sense.
> --
>
> gamertag: Chrisflynnuk
> http://live.xbox.com/member/Chrisflynnuk
you stated an opinion there. My own opinion about that is you're outside
the realm of reality.
You live in a smaller world than I do.
McG.
Chris F
im not saying PC gaming will ever die completely, i doubt that very
much. i just think there will be a massive reduction in the amount of
choice available and that, like you say, niche areas will become the
pc gaming mainstay.
the problem with that is that niche areas are exactly that, niche.
they don't appeal to everyone and while they may sustain a small
market, its not going to be one which can sustain a wide and varied
market. the knock on effects of this could be interesting.
i mean, if PC games become less varied, and certain genres become
prevalent, mainly mmorpg's which is pretty much the fastest growing
area of the market, will graphics cards manufacturers such as nvidia
and ati continue to produce so much hardware? if the programmers move
away from the PC for graphics intensive games, where will that leave
them?
choykw
"Chris F" <ch...@asifimtellingyoulot.com>
???????:1v4f12hbihb2bo2vl...@4ax.com...
Monopoly, the boardgame.
Xocyll
entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
say:
>
Damn that sounds familiar, only my typing class was in '79.
Never did learn to touch type, which I found was lucky when it came to
programming.
Getting it right was far more important than entering it quickly, even
for programs in basic on a TRS80 model 1.
On the other hand I do hunt an poke at 50-60 wpm, and since I tend to
look at keys and screen a lot I don't get many typos.
>Nobody has to justify what they buy or just like even. I'm thrilled that,
>quite simply, we have the choices! I have a bit of trouble understanding
>why folks are argueing over console vs pc. Makes no sense to me at all.
Zealotry.
Just like the religious brands it transcends rational thought.
Console vs PC, MAC vs PC, console vs other console, OS vs OS, LCD vs
CRT, brand X vs brand Y (for thousands of different X and Y values) -
people have a natural instinct to herd together and fight the other
herds.
I've never had much of that kind of instinct so I don't end up in those
silly spats (I may argue something's technical merits, but it's not
anything like a religious belief) - and advertising doesn't seem to work
on me either; I buy what I want/need, not the last thing I saw
advertised.
I'm a marketeer's nightmare; the customer they can't sell to based on
anything but the item serving my purpose.
Ricochet
shit:
>Damn that sounds familiar, only my typing class was in '79.
Okay you took a typing class.
>Never did learn to touch type, which I found was lucky when it came to
>programming.
Were you sitting in the back of the class smoking dope? Are you "special"? How
hard is it to fail a high school typing class. I thought the part where you
tell yourself it is a good thing that you are a failure was a nice touch.
>Getting it right was far more important than entering it quickly, even
>for programs in basic on a TRS80 model 1.
Right. We all know how inaccurate touch typing is. When you want something
entered accurately you always use someone certified only to use 2 fingers.
>On the other hand I do hunt an poke at 50-60 wpm, and since I tend to
>look at keys and screen a lot I don't get many typos.
That's not even possible, dumbass.
>Zealotry.
>Just like the religious brands it transcends rational thought.
Did you just say, "Zealotry transcends rational thought" ???
>Console vs PC, MAC vs PC, console vs other console, OS vs OS, LCD vs
>CRT, brand X vs brand Y (for thousands of different X and Y values) -
>people have a natural instinct to herd together and fight the other
>herds.
Are you basing this sociological opinion on your years of failing classes?
Please keep your Grade 8 education to yourself.
>I've never had much of that kind of instinct so I don't end up in those
>silly spats (I may argue something's technical merits, but it's not
>anything like a religious belief) - and advertising doesn't seem to work
>on me either; I buy what I want/need, not the last thing I saw
>advertised.
No, you will just try to convince everyone that the reason you don't know how to
type is because it makes you cooler.
>I'm a marketeer's nightmare; the customer they can't sell to based on
>anything but the item serving my purpose.
No, you are insignificant. A "marketeer" (whatever the fuck that is) could care
less if you stopped breathing right this minute.
On a side note. Allow me to thank you for this entertainment. This will be
posted on my refrigerator and laughed at for weeks to come.
Ricochet
Ricochet
shit:
>Damn that sounds familiar, only my typing class was in '79.
Okay you took a typing class.
>Never did learn to touch type, which I found was lucky when it came to
>programming.
Were you sitting in the back of the class smoking dope? Are you "special"? How
hard is it to fail a high school typing class. I thought the part where you
tell yourself it is a good thing that you are a failure was a nice touch.
>Getting it right was far more important than entering it quickly, even
>for programs in basic on a TRS80 model 1.
Right. We all know how inaccurate touch typing is. When you want something
entered accurately you always use someone certified only to use 2 fingers.
>On the other hand I do hunt an poke at 50-60 wpm, and since I tend to
>look at keys and screen a lot I don't get many typos.
That's not even possible, dumbass.
>Zealotry.
>Just like the religious brands it transcends rational thought.
Did you just say, "Zealotry transcends rational thought" ???
>Console vs PC, MAC vs PC, console vs other console, OS vs OS, LCD vs
>CRT, brand X vs brand Y (for thousands of different X and Y values) -
>people have a natural instinct to herd together and fight the other
>herds.
Are you basing this sociological opinion on your years of failing classes?
Please keep your Grade 8 education to yourself.
>I've never had much of that kind of instinct so I don't end up in those
>silly spats (I may argue something's technical merits, but it's not
>anything like a religious belief) - and advertising doesn't seem to work
>on me either; I buy what I want/need, not the last thing I saw
>advertised.
No, you will just try to convince everyone that the reason you don't know how to
type is because it makes you cooler.
>I'm a marketeer's nightmare; the customer they can't sell to based on
>anything but the item serving my purpose.
No, you are insignificant. A "marketeer" (whatever the fuck that is) could care
drybones
"McGrandpa" <McGran...@NOThotmail.com> wrote in message
news:i_LRf.19706$733....@tornado.texas.rr.com...
Major <snip>
> I took the typing class in high school. In 71. I've never owned a
> gaming console either. But it'd take me a while to count up all the
> computers, even old 8 bitters, that i've owned/built.
> Nobody has to justify what they buy or just like even. I'm thrilled
> that, quite simply, we have the choices! I have a bit of trouble
> understanding why folks are argueing over console vs pc. Makes no sense
> to me at all.
> McG.
McGrandpa,
I retired from 21 years (U.S. Navy in 67) and the US Govt in 83.
That makes me your Grandpa.
Hee hee
drybones
CJM
Flames from the guy who posted the same message twice.
I think I'll post this on my refridgerator door...
Xocyll
entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
say:
>In article <7drf121i4lg394dk9...@4ax.com>, Xocyll typed this inane
>shit:
>
>>Damn that sounds familiar, only my typing class was in '79.
>
>Okay you took a typing class.
>
>>Never did learn to touch type, which I found was lucky when it came to
>>programming.
>
>Were you sitting in the back of the class smoking dope? Are you "special"? How
>hard is it to fail a high school typing class.
No the hard part was that they had 30 machines but had over 50 students
crammed in the class.
>I thought the part where you
>tell yourself it is a good thing that you are a failure was a nice touch.
>>Getting it right was far more important than entering it quickly, even
>>for programs in basic on a TRS80 model 1.
>
>Right. We all know how inaccurate touch typing is. When you want something
>entered accurately you always use someone certified only to use 2 fingers.
WPM scores include an allowable amount of errors, at least that's how it
was taught back then.
Programming doesn't - if it's not input right it doesn't work.
>>On the other hand I do hunt an poke at 50-60 wpm, and since I tend to
>>look at keys and screen a lot I don't get many typos.
>
>That's not even possible, dumbass.
It's very possible. No one ever said hunt and poke had to involve only
two fingers.
>>Zealotry.
>>Just like the religious brands it transcends rational thought.
>
>Did you just say, "Zealotry transcends rational thought" ???
>
>>Console vs PC, MAC vs PC, console vs other console, OS vs OS, LCD vs
>>CRT, brand X vs brand Y (for thousands of different X and Y values) -
>>people have a natural instinct to herd together and fight the other
>>herds.
>
>Are you basing this sociological opinion on your years of failing classes?
>Please keep your Grade 8 education to yourself.
Let me guess, you must be a denizen of one of the console groups this
got crossposted to.
>>I've never had much of that kind of instinct so I don't end up in those
>>silly spats (I may argue something's technical merits, but it's not
>>anything like a religious belief) - and advertising doesn't seem to work
>>on me either; I buy what I want/need, not the last thing I saw
>>advertised.
>
>No, you will just try to convince everyone that the reason you don't know how to
>type is because it makes you cooler.
No that's the kind of infantile "logic" that seems to be your specialty.
>>I'm a marketeer's nightmare; the customer they can't sell to based on
>>anything but the item serving my purpose.
>
>No, you are insignificant. A "marketeer" (whatever the fuck that is) could care
>less if you stopped breathing right this minute.
People like me are what marketeers hate, because there's nothing they
can do to sell to us.
People like you on the other hand probably buy nothing but what you see
advertised.
>On a side note. Allow me to thank you for this entertainment. This will be
>posted on my refrigerator and laughed at for weeks to come.
Knock yourself out, it's not like I care about your opinion, you're a
non entity to me.
Nice double post by the way, you must be a real genius to have failed
sending a post properly.
McGrandpa
*SIMS*. The most prevalent game out for the PC. Sims. Yech! Next to
that, strats. More yech.
McG.
McGrandpa
"Xocyll" <Xoc...@kingston.net> wrote in message
news:7drf121i4lg394dk9...@4ax.com...
Welcome to the club! the Two Marketeers! ;) *TELE*marketers don't repeat
dialing this number either! :o)) They're just target practice for me ;)
Yeah. Something like the rams skirting the herd... pickin out which sheep
to hump next ;) LOL!
I might be an old man... but I'm a *dirty* old man ;)
McG.