Improper Usage of News Group
Sonic
means of communication because of "News Group Abuse". Alt.Freemasonry
could be a most important means of communication between those that
are Masons and those that are not Masons as it is not moderated. It
should serve almost as a chat room where a response to ones
contribution is not delayed or censored. The problem here, in my view,
is the attention given to nonsense and topping each others abuse with
more abuse.
It is obvious that anti Masons and cyber trolls are like a cancer that
grows and grows until it consumes the body. These individuals often
cross post to others of their ilk and draw them into this News Group,
they in turn draw in more and more and so on.
Another area of concern is the focused behavior of some of the more
active contributors. Some of these articles have lead to arguments and
do more harm then the worst of the troll / anti-Mason group. Not every
disagreement has to be aired on a News Group or responded to.
I intentionally have not mentioned any names here because the specific
blame is not important. What is important is for this News Group to
once again become a useful forum of discussion and learning, free from
the subjective screening of moderators. It seems that this forum is
something like a classroom when the teacher leaves the children alone.
The answer is so very simple as well. This News Group should
concentrate on important concerns to Masonry such as; Recognition,
differences between Jurisdictions, visitations, personal Masonic
achievements, answering well meaning questions of non-Masons, meeting
Masons and non-Masons, events of Masonic interest and importance and a
whole host of other Masonic interests.
What should be ignored and which needs no answer are articles about;
the illuminati, war, napalm, nasty wise cracks, obsessive fixations,
bible studies, insults, challenges to contributor’s credentials
among many other things that are not really important but contribute
to flames and retorts. Not responding to an inflammatory post is often
the best response. Those reading this News Group realize whom the
trolls and anti-Masons are without having to point them out of the
crowd; they stand out by themselves.
Sonic
Jonathan Livingston Shithead
@posting.google.com:
Good idea, brother.
Bill Cleere
news:Xns95C777CCF8BDAs...@207.14.113.17...
> Fara...@hotmail.com (Sonic) wrote in news:708cca1f.0412220658.74bd7e77
> @posting.google.com:
>
> > Masons and the public at large are missing the use of a very important
> > means of communication because of "News Group Abuse". Alt.Freemasonry
> > could be a most important means of communication between those that
> > are Masons and those that are not Masons as it is not moderated. It
> > should serve almost as a chat room where a response to ones
> > contribution is not delayed or censored. The problem here, in my view,
> > is the attention given to nonsense and topping each others abuse with
> > more abuse.
This poster is quite correct. Attempts by open-minded, thoughtful
individuals to enter into constructive dialogue have consistently been
frustrated by Masonic thug/terrorist elements intent on disrupting a
frank and honest discussion
> > It is obvious that anti Masons and cyber trolls are like a cancer that
> > grows and grows until it consumes the body. These individuals often
> > cross post to others of their ilk and draw them into this News Group,
> > they in turn draw in more and more and so on.
Masons posing as anti-Masons have initiated each and every one of
these naughty trolls. The poster styling itself "Hammond of Texas" has
been the chief offender. Its posts have been cunningly devised to
frighten non-Masons with the clear implication that Masonic deviltry
is actually part of a plot by a race of alien soul-stealers attempting
to enslave Earth and convert humanity into hosts for the symbiotes it
requires to exist.
> > Another area of concern is the focused behavior of some of the more
> > active contributors. Some of these articles have lead to arguments and
> > do more harm then the worst of the troll / anti-Mason group. Not every
> > disagreement has to be aired on a News Group or responded to.
Quite correct. When Masonic mischief has been exposed, it would be
best for readers to accept the truth and move on.
> > I intentionally have not mentioned any names here because the specific
> > blame is not important. What is important is for this News Group to
> > once again become a useful forum of discussion and learning, free from
> > the subjective screening of moderators. It seems that this forum is
> > something like a classroom when the teacher leaves the children alone.
Quite correct. The students should be left to learn for themselves
without the "guidance" of an "initiated" "Master".
> > The answer is so very simple as well. This News Group should
> > concentrate on important concerns to Masonry such as; Recognition,
> > differences between Jurisdictions, visitations, personal Masonic
> > achievements, answering well meaning questions of non-Masons, meeting
> > Masons and non-Masons, events of Masonic interest and importance and a
> > whole host of other Masonic interests.
Even more simple, the truth of Masonic skullduggery should be
freely discussed.
> > What should be ignored and which needs no answer are articles about;
> > the illuminati, war, napalm, nasty wise cracks, obsessive fixations,
> > bible studies, insults, challenges to contributor’s credentials
> > among many other things that are not really important but contribute
> > to flames and retorts. Not responding to an inflammatory post is often
> > the best response. Those reading this News Group realize whom the
> > trolls and anti-Masons are without having to point them out of the
> > crowd; they stand out by themselves.
> >
> > Sonic
One must respectfully disagree here. The credentials in the .sigs are
often the funniest things in the posts.
> Good idea, brother.
Quite correct, brother.
-- Bill Cleere
"That's where I normally get them, but sometimes you need
something after hours, and you have to pay for it." (Dolores~, aps)
Hammond of Texas
says...
> Masons posing as anti-Masons have initiated each and every one of
> these naughty trolls. The poster styling itself "Hammond of Texas" has
> been the chief offender. Its posts have been cunningly devised to
> frighten non-Masons with the clear implication that Masonic deviltry
> is actually part of a plot by a race of alien soul-stealers attempting
> to enslave Earth and convert humanity into hosts for the symbiotes it
> requires to exist.
Really? Do tell...
Sonic
Please don't accept the bait as there is a sharp hook hidden in the
middle. This is what I was saying about avoidance, let it begin here.
It is better to "bite the bullet" then to "bite the loaded bait".
Please also note that Mr. "Shitheed" has programed responses to be
distribuited to may cross posted News Groups. Copy and paste to a fresh
thread if you do not want your replys to him scattered to the four
winds.
Sonic
Bill Cleere
"Hammond of Texas" <spammer...@spamcop.net> wrote in message
news:MPG.1c335c8c5...@pdx.news.speakeasy.net...
No, *you* tell, Gua'ould!
jDolan
russ...@carolina.rr.com wrote on 12/22/04 7:35 PM:
> X-No-archive: yes
>
> Back, back in the mid 1990's, when this anti-mason stuff really started
> in this NG, we tried so many times to encourage each other to ignore the
> antis. It never worked. Whether it be me or some other brother, one
> would take the bait and all hell would brake loose. It was uncontrolled,
> vile, and really didn't get us any where. Countless times, all of us bit
> and now you see the results. After the Restivo thing (well, after 4-6
> years of it), I decided that we were not doing any justice to the
> fraternity by the constant arguing, bickering, and name calling. I
> stopped posting for a while to see if I can control my passions. I would
> journey back and really nothing changed. Some brothers fanned the
> flames, some were flamed by other brothers, and many brothers left. It
> is not the antis fault that this NG bottomed out, it is our fault that
> we did not act appropriately.
>
> I was as guilty as many others by fanning the flames. I will not do it
> any more. IMHO, the only way to recapture this NG is by posting and
> discussing Freemasonry and stop at that. One of the greatest times in
> this NG was when Brother JDolan and Brother Gene posted an abundance of
> Masonic writings and thoughts. They were very positive and could have
> started many fine discussions. We should have capitalized on these posts
> by discussing those words. We screwed up.
>
> Sonic, we can not recapture the past, but we sure can make the future
> better. WE need to follow the teachings of the degrees, and become
> better men and better brothers.
>
> We know what Freemasonry is all about, and do not have to defend it in
> any way. Let's move on.
>
> Russ
> Mint Hill #742 AF&AM
Thank you for your kind words, Bro. Russ.
I still read and mostly keep up with whats going on here, but usually am
too busy to respond to a thread in a timely manner.
----------
"The Anvil," by Bro. John Clifford
I paused last eve beside the blacksmith's door,
And heard the anvil ring, the vespers chime,
And looking in I saw upon the floor
Old hammers, with beating years of time.
"How many anvils have you had?" said I,
"To wear and batter all these hammers so?"
"Just one," he answered. Then with twinkling eye:
"The anvil wears the hammers out, you know,"
And so, I thought, the anvil of God's Word
For ages skeptics' blows have beat upon
But though the noise of falling blows was heard
The anvil is unchanged; the hammers gone.
John Clifford
==*====
j Ham Dolan PM You have the time, they might not:
White River #90 Feed the hungry with a click of your mouse:
Royalton (Bethel), Vt. http://www.thehungersite.com
Hammond of Texas
Fara...@hotmail.com says...
> > Really? Do tell...
>
> Please don't accept the bait as there is a sharp hook hidden in the
> middle. This is what I was saying about avoidance, let it begin here.
> It is better to "bite the bullet" then to "bite the loaded bait".
> Please also note that Mr. "Shitheed" has programed responses to be
> distribuited to may cross posted News Groups. Copy and paste to a fresh
> thread if you do not want your replys to him scattered to the four
> winds.
I am aware of Jonathan Livingston Poopbrain's lame cross-post. I'm also
pretty sure that Bill's response (to which I replied) is tongue-in-
cheek. If not, it's still so silly as to be entertaining, and patently
transparent as nonsense.
Rusty Trombone
@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:
Blast that Shitheed and his dirty pool!
Terrence Waghorn
others might wish to post more than one or two messages per day. In fact,
most of the threads on this list are conversational in nature.
Someone asks a question, someone posts an answer, Someone comes back with
"Yes, but what about all we give to charity" or "How's your wife" etc.
How does one do this and maintain thread continuity by only posting one
or two messages a day? I can easily see that posting a half dozen
rubbishy messages in a day, two or three days in a row, and then not
posting again for a couple of weeks until some other trivia topic comes up
to which I think I can contribute. Are we to feel restricted from doing
this? This question is more than just rhetorical. I have been in
a private e-mail exchange over the last couple of days with a long time
a.freemasoner, on a topic that I think would be of at least passing
interest to at the very least a large minority if not a majority of other
a.freemasonry, but he felt unwelcome to post it here because he had
already posted one message that day. If that is to be a metric by which
we are to gauge whether we should contribute, then that would be
regrettable indeed.
--
Terrence Waghorn
Jason Michael Rubino
Newsgroups: alt.freemasonry
Date: 2001-01-23 12:20:09 PST
No, nobody likes a smartass. And the Lord knows that this newsgroup is
full of them. It is like seeing a lunatic ward and observing they carve an
identical, fear-based, heirarchcical social world that reflects our
own vicous, survival rituals. Still, in the midst of insanity, bad taste,
fanatisism and mayhem you seek to feed off each other; leach points and
energy off each other, like lepors in a lepor colony fighting about who's
most upright. You are all criples! For God's sake TAKE A GOOD LONG LOOK AT
YOURSELVES. You are all falling apart at the
seems; oozing your contageous lethal puss all over Usenet. "Sod
netiquette! Sod good taste! We're the group that God should kneel before!"
you whimper. A tower of puss you build as you babble with malice.
S&F,
pp. Terrence Waghorn
Stott
Jason Michael Rubino wrote:
> . You are all criples! For God's sake TAKE A GOOD LONG LOOK AT
> YOURSELVES. You are all falling apart at the
> seems; oozing your contageous lethal puss all over Usenet. "Sod
> netiquette! Sod good taste! We're the group that God should kneel before!"
> you whimper. A tower of puss you build as you babble with malice.
>
> S&F,
> pp. Terrence Waghorn
Pardon me. I don't like the crap and fighting here myself, but juse exactly
what brought you here and set you off?
And (last time I checked) it's spelled "Pus".
Myself I think there's more Bile and Venom here than pus.
Stott
Sonic
> a private e-mail exchange over the last couple of days with a long
time
> a.freemasoner, on a topic that I think would be of at least passing
> interest to at the very least a large minority if not a majority of
other
> a.freemasonry, but he felt unwelcome to post it here because he had
> already posted one message that day. If that is to be a metric by
which
> we are to gauge whether we should contribute, then that would be
> regrettable indeed.
>
>
> --
> Terrence Waghorn
I did not suggest a limit on quantity or frequency, I wrote of
"quality" only.
Sonic
Sonic
exactly
>what brought you here and set you off?
>And (last time I checked) it's spelled "Pus".
>Myself I think there's more Bile and Venom here than pus.
Stott
Why even respond to that post? He, or someone else will now respond you
your post, you will feel compelled to agin respond and we will not have
changed a thing. No response would be your loudest response.
"There are none so blind as those that will not see".
"There are none so deaf as those that will not hear".
Sonic
Russ
The anvil could be considered the foundation of one's life. It takes
many beatings with hammers various sizes and weights, yet it endures
and is ready for its next task. Refining the imperfect to something that
is better than before. As Freemasons, we can use the anvil as a symbolic
foundation on which the imperfect can be crafted into a refined, worthy
"product."
--
X-No-archive: yes
Jim Bennie
> The anvil could be considered the foundation of one's life. It takes
> many beatings with hammers various sizes and weights, yet it endures
> and is ready for its next task. Refining the imperfect to something that
> is better than before. As Freemasons, we can use the anvil as a symbolic
> foundation on which the imperfect can be crafted into a refined, worthy
> "product."
Here's another one, Russ.
About the only place you see an anvil today is in a Roadrunner cartoon.
Of course, the people who made those cartoons were born in a day when
you could still find one or more livery stables in town, with a smith
shaping horseshoes.
Livery stables are long gone and unneeded, along with the anvils.
Let the anvil remind lodges not to allow themselves to become obsolete.
While the principles of the fraternity date back before the first
artificer in metal used one, and thus are valid today, lodges should
be careful to do things that keep young men of today interested.
Jim Bennie
PM/DC, No. 44, Vancouver
Ued
> Russ <russ...@carolina.rr.com> wrote:
> > The anvil could be considered the foundation of one's life. It takes
> > many beatings with hammers various sizes and weights, yet it endures
> > and is ready for its next task. Refining the imperfect to something that
> > is better than before. As Freemasons, we can use the anvil as a symbolic
> > foundation on which the imperfect can be crafted into a refined, worthy
> > "product."
>
>
> About the only place you see an anvil today is in a Roadrunner cartoon.
> Of course, the people who made those cartoons were born in a day when
> shaping horseshoes.
>
> Livery stables are long gone and unneeded, along with the anvils.
>
> Let the anvil remind lodges not to allow themselves to become obsolete.
> While the principles of the fraternity date back before the first
> artificer in metal used one, and thus are valid today, lodges should
> be careful to do things that keep young men of today interested.
The anvil is a blacksmithing tool. Have you guys forsaken your roots,
and given up all pretense of having even the vaguest connection to
Middle Age stonemason guilds?
/just askin'
JB
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
"Jim Bennie" <jgbe...@vcn.bc.ca> wrote in message
news:cqfbrh$1uo$1...@vcn.bc.ca...
I take on board your very relevant post but just for the record, my
local smithy still has an anvil.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: PGP 8.1
iQA/AwUBQcs+8Ppxh1uHmCDzEQKY0QCeKh7fFV4HjxyI4zpk6MiBQbEbUW8AoMXg
LlNc9kg6MMJxTiPC5ohjXd3H
=G6ym
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Peter Dettmann
>The anvil is a blacksmithing tool. Have you guys forsaken your roots,
>and given up all pretense of having even the vaguest connection to
>Middle Age stonemason guilds?
>
>/just askin'
I, perhaps in my ignorance would have thought that the anvil would be
a necessary part of the masons trade, as there is (in real life) the
necessity to resharpen, re-form, and manufacture tools like chisels.
Peter Dettmann
Stott
Sonic wrote:
With all your good intentions, you're coming off as a pompous ass. Maybe
it's all the question marks and the quotes.
Stott
Russ
Yep, there are references to the anvil in Masonic literature.
Crossposting removed.
--
X-No-archive: yes
Russ
Come on, Brother JB, discuss how you think the anvil could represent the
foundation of Freemasonry. Stay away from the posts of antis. Join us.
--
X-No-archive: yes
Russ
> Russ <russ...@carolina.rr.com> wrote:
>
>>The anvil could be considered the foundation of one's life. It takes
>>many beatings with hammers various sizes and weights, yet it endures
>>and is ready for its next task. Refining the imperfect to something that
>>is better than before. As Freemasons, we can use the anvil as a symbolic
>>foundation on which the imperfect can be crafted into a refined, worthy
>>"product."
>
>
>
> About the only place you see an anvil today is in a Roadrunner cartoon.
> Of course, the people who made those cartoons were born in a day when
> shaping horseshoes.
>
> Livery stables are long gone and unneeded, along with the anvils.
>
> Let the anvil remind lodges not to allow themselves to become obsolete.
> While the principles of the fraternity date back before the first
> artificer in metal used one, and thus are valid today, lodges should
> be careful to do things that keep young men of today interested.
>
> PM/DC, No. 44, Vancouver
Good point. The anvil can always be used to re-create material, new and
old. Something can always be reformed to make it meet your needs. The
recreation of material can inspire interest and excitement. The young
man can use this as a foundation of creating his future.
--
X-No-archive: yes
Craftworker
>Stott
>
>Why even respond to that post? He, or someone else will now respond you
>your post, you will feel compelled to agin respond and we will not have
>changed a thing. No response would be your loudest response.
>
>"There are none so blind as those that will not see".
>"There are none so deaf as those that will not hear".
>
>Sonic
Like tic-tac-toe, the only winning move is not to play! I learned that
in "Wargames" starring Matthew Broderick. ;)
You may be barking up a tree, though, Sonic. Stott's response to this
message is what I expected, another flame. Unfortunately, many
"masons" in this group have gotten in touch with their inner thug and
actually enjoy the flamewars. It's kinda like smoking....you can
explain how bad it is, but unless they see it the same way, they are
going to keep doing it. Some may even wish to stop, but can't find the
willpower to actually do it.
I guess that's why we kinda lump them in as hatemasons...they're here,
ther're masons, but we draw the distinction from there regarding how
they act. They are not going to go away, but we can easily say we
disagree with their methods.
Keep up the effort, though, it is encouraging to see you express your
positive opinions. Don't let the hatemasons wear you down.
Cheers!
Crafty
---
Any copyrighted material in this posting shared in
accordance with Fair Use Laws. For more info, go here:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml.
Current denizens of the ImpFilter(tm): JB, JLRuble
"Ignoring idiots for a better tomorrow."
Sam Schwarzman
>With all your good intentions, you're coming off as a pompous ass. Maybe
>it's all the question marks and the quotes.
Eric, I'm a bit surprised that you would make a statement like that. "Sonic"
was whispering words caution to you, something Masons do. I think his meaning
is positive, I have taken his full brunt and it didn't bother me.
Stott
Sam Schwarzman wrote:
Sorry about that. I didn't disagree with his intentions, I just thought that he
turned on a gusher when a dtream might have been sufficient.
Also, you've got to realize that I (and I suspect a lot of others) cone into this
forum with the "Sharp Retort" circuit plugged in and ready for action.
Eric Stott
(I'm thinking of a certain Brother from Texas.)
JB
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
"Russ" <russ...@carolina.rr.com> wrote in message
news:NbIyd.23$NH2....@twister.southeast.rr.com...
>>
>
> Come on, Brother JB, discuss how you think the anvil could
> represent the foundation of Freemasonry. Stay away from the posts
> of antis. Join us.
Well, being a bit of a literal person I would have to say that
something like an anvil would represent time honoured ways of doing
things, tradition and stability - which in it's own way is quite like
Freemasonry.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: PGP 8.1
iQA/AwUBQctwg/pxh1uHmCDzEQJ0ZwCgmGC4WKmmPp/ApgVHWcwGnEMaYbIAoKsn
EnMkc6yXXS5XbcXHiXsxIuJv
=YSwt
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Ued
@carolina.rr.com says...
> Peter Dettmann wrote:
> > On Thu, 23 Dec 2004 16:13:17 -0500, Ued <un...@der.tablen> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>The anvil is a blacksmithing tool. Have you guys forsaken your roots,
> >>and given up all pretense of having even the vaguest connection to
> >>Middle Age stonemason guilds?
> >>
> >>/just askin'
> >
> >
> > I, perhaps in my ignorance would have thought that the anvil would be
> > a necessary part of the masons trade, as there is (in real life) the
> > necessity to resharpen, re-form, and manufacture tools like chisels.
But medieval stonemasons wouldn't have actually done that themselves;
they would have had a blacksmith do it for them. One would think,
anyway. (Well, sharpening they probably did themselves, since that
requires a lot less skill than forming raw iron into a useful tool, but
sharpening wouldn't necessitate the use of an anvil.)
> > Peter Dettmann
> >
>
> Yep, there are references to the anvil in Masonic literature.
Where?
Alex fisher
Hash: SHA1
Well, I guess you've never used the Operative stonemason's tools in real life...
I have, and I've also done some blacksmithing. Believe me, you definitely need
an anvil to sharpen and re-form the tools (thinking specifically of the chisel,
pick, drill and gad here). With an anvil, a decent forge and a small amount of
skill, refurbishing the stone-worker's tools is actually quite quick and
relatively easy. But attempting to get a good edge on them using any other
method (such as a grindstone) is almost impossible, and tends to remove too
much metal, so the tools' life is reduced unnecessarily.
>
>> > Peter Dettmann
>> >
>>
>> Yep, there are references to the anvil in Masonic literature.
>
> Where?
- --
Alex Fisher MM
Lodge Caledonian No. 14
United Grand Lodge of Queensland
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)
iD8DBQFBy42+g9r2P0pNOk8RAoA/AJ9UbouKs22T/QI98gaWx2SErGVxcACfVqkw
3kJKehsN0E1rpqDKnER69V0=
=8Pts
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Jason Michael Rubino
--
pp. Terrence Waghorn
Jason Michael Rubino
They are like the centrefolds of Aunty Gertrude's favourite Xmas cards of
all time, spewn about like bad cracker jokes at a vicarage shindig.
You, the guilty mongerers of mindless Xtian rhetoric, desist now.
S&F,
pp. Terrence Waghorn
Gene Goldman
> I can easily imagine on a daily basis, instances in which Brothers and
> others might wish to post more than one or two messages per day. In fact,
> most of the threads on this list are conversational in nature.
>
> Someone asks a question, someone posts an answer,
Yes, it's called Usenet.
> I have been in a
> private e-mail exchange over the last couple of days with a long time
> a.freemasoner, on a topic that I think would be of at least passing
> interest to at the very least a large minority if not a majority of other
> a.freemasonry, but he felt unwelcome to post it here because he had
> already posted one message that day.
He obviously hasn't been around here very long then, has he?
> If that is to be a metric by which
> we are to gauge whether we should contribute, then that would be
> regrettable indeed.
If we had some bacon, we could have bacon and eggs, if we had some eggs.
--
|O| Be well. Travel with a light heart. - Goldman 3:16
Brother Gene .*.
past Master of two (2) Black Lodges
Blackmer #442 and Black Mountain #845
H.M.S.H.
Q.P.H.D.
Regular 1,765 degree Mason
Chief Intellectually Lazy, Cynical, Sarcastic, Smarmy, Defensive,
Ignorant-Heckling and Bad-Attituded Nitwit
Named member of the Bennie-Goldman Jive-Talk Team
First Official Recipient of the Order of the Fish Taco
Most Wonderful Grand High Exalted Imperial Omnipotent Mystic Regal
Stomper, and Wearer of the Official Purple Underwear
http://www.blackmountainlodge.net
Hyram Award 2004
http://www.freemason.org
http://mastermason.com/BrotherGene
http://www.mastermason.com/BrotherGene/frequently_asked_questions.htm
MBBFMN #387
ICQ #503060
************************************
"Are you guys ready? Let's Roll!!"
Todd Beamer, Flight 93
************************************
"In theory, Communism works! - Russian saying.
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.1
GCM/CC/TW/O d--(++) s:,s++ a+ C+(++++) U--- P! L-- E! W++ N+++ o-- K-
w++++ O---- M--(+) V? PS+++ Y+ PGP-- t* 5 X- R* tv+++ b++ DI+++ D G e*
h---- r+++ y++++
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Remember: Your Masonry may be different from someone else's.
Internet newsgroup posting. Copyright 2004. All rights reserved.
Any Mason may use the contents for any valid Masonic purpose, permission
may be granted to others upon request.
Objects in this post are funnier than they appear
Be seeing you
And in case I don't see ya' - Good Afternoon, Good Evening and Good Night!
Sonic
>>Sonic wrote:
>> Stott
>> Why even respond to that post? He, or someone else will now respond
you
> >your post, you will feel compelled to agin respond and we will not
have
>> changed a thing. No response would be your loudest response.
>> Sonic
>With all your good intentions, you're coming off as a pompous ass.
Maybe
>it's all the question marks and the quotes.
>Stott
It is responses like this that cause well meaning Masons and non-Masons
to not participate in this newsgroup. A suggestion is offered to
participants as to how they might reclaim this newsgroup as a useful
Masonic information service. After Eric Stott's remark I have lost
desire to continue in this newsgroup. It seems to me that the trolls
are right, those that try to fix something that is broken and in need
of repair should just leave it collapse.
Peter Renzland has positive information to offer as well, now I see
what he is up against. I still think that his overall cause is just and
proper although at times it seems misdirected and he comes off as
dictatorial. In my opinion (if I am still permitted to have one) is
that Peter Renzland direct his vast subject knowledge and energy to one
sector of a problem rather then the entire project. Mr. Renzland
spreads himself too thin to make a powerful statement.
I think that I will go back to lurking for awhile, it is much less
abusive and I really don't get paid for my efforts. At least I know
that I have tried.
Sonic
Craftworker
Stott>With all your good intentions, you're coming off as a pompous
Stott>ass. Maybe it's all the question marks and the quotes.
>It is responses like this that cause well meaning Masons and non-Masons
>to not participate in this newsgroup. A suggestion is offered to
>participants as to how they might reclaim this newsgroup as a useful
>Masonic information service. After Eric Stott's remark I have lost
>desire to continue in this newsgroup. It seems to me that the trolls
>are right, those that try to fix something that is broken and in need
>of repair should just leave it collapse.
Unfortunately, the forces of evil are almost always more patient than
the forces of good, which is why evil prevails here. Good people like
you, Mengro, and others give up and move on. Hatemasonry, like old
bubblegum, must be scraped off with considerable effort. Most do not
want to apply the elbow-grease required. ;)
>I think that I will go back to lurking for awhile, it is much less
>abusive and I really don't get paid for my efforts. At least I know
>that I have tried.
Don't feel bad. Many others have tried and failed before you, and many
will fail in years to come.
But maybe "cleaning the mess" is not important....having the
priviledge of seeing the hatemasons in action is worth the price of
addmission, no? Seeing the lies, the threats, how they treat people,
etc. It's a real eye-opener regarding our august fraternity (or at
least the broom-closet of it that the dark ones occupy).
David Simpson
furiously:
[snip]
>
>It is responses like this that cause well meaning Masons and non-Masons
>to not participate in this newsgroup. A suggestion is offered to
>participants as to how they might reclaim this newsgroup as a useful
>Masonic information service. After Eric Stott's remark I have lost
>desire to continue in this newsgroup. It seems to me that the trolls
>are right, those that try to fix something that is broken and in need
>of repair should just leave it collapse.
>
>Peter Renzland has positive information to offer as well, now I see
>what he is up against. I still think that his overall cause is just and
>proper although at times it seems misdirected and he comes off as
>dictatorial.
In this you are absolutely correct. Peter does have a just cause, it
is only his methods that are objectionable, sometimes.
>In my opinion (if I am still permitted to have one) is
>that Peter Renzland direct his vast subject knowledge and energy to one
>sector of a problem rather then the entire project. Mr. Renzland
>spreads himself too thin to make a powerful statement.
>
Once again I am inclined to agree. Peter should withdraw the beam in
his own eye before trying to remove those specks from others' eyes.
>I think that I will go back to lurking for awhile, it is much less
>abusive and I really don't get paid for my efforts. At least I know
>that I have tried.
>
>Sonic
I enjoyed the poems although proper attribution would have been nice.
Thank you for trying.
--
Regards
David Simpson (Remove "farook" to reply)
(Unattached MM)
Bad manners should not be a capital crime ...
for a first offence.
Paraphrasing Robert Heinlein,
David Simpson
<thecraf...@yahoo.com> typed furiously:
It's rather ironic that I have seen you using lies, threats and bad
treatment of people rather than most of those you attack yet here you
are, claiming to be pure as driven snow and acting as if butter
wouldn't melt in your mouth. Just remember all of your posts are
archived so interested persons can actually verify my remarks.
Craftworker
<faro...@picknowl.com.au> wrote:
>It's rather ironic that I have seen you using lies, threats and bad
>treatment of people rather than most of those you attack yet here you
>are, claiming to be pure as driven snow and acting as if butter
>wouldn't melt in your mouth. Just remember all of your posts are
>archived so interested persons can actually verify my remarks.
Bad treatment of hatemasons, perhaps, but please provide your
"evidence" of lies and threats, please. You made the allegation,
support it, EdSock!
Sonic
> Unfortunately, the forces of evil are almost always more patient than
> the forces of good, which is why evil prevails here. Good people like
> you, Mengro, and others give up and move on. Hatemasonry, like old
> bubblegum, must be scraped off with considerable effort. Most do not
> want to apply the elbow-grease required. ;)
I don't know who Mengro is, I don't remember seeing any Mengro posts. I
also don't believe there are out and out hatemasons, there are Masons
that have too short a temper and do not provide a kind, proper image of
the Fraternity. If Masonry has a caring view of others as the
fraternity claims, it does not show it in many Masonic responses. I
would not call them hatemasons, I don't believe that they are up to no
good. I truly believe that those same Masons would come to the physical
aid of their internet enemies were they asked to.
I also don't believe that the trolls and anti-Masons are very sincere
in what they write. I see it as each side just trying to push the
buttons of the other. This part is what I wish would end. There is much
to be gained by both sides if they would not try to engage each other
in the game of; "Can You Top This?"
> >I think that I will go back to lurking for awhile, it is much less
> >abusive and I really don't get paid for my efforts. At least I know
> >that I have tried.
>
> Don't feel bad. Many others have tried and failed before you, and
many
> will fail in years to come.
I would improve on that statement by suggesting that "some" have tried
but failed, not many.
> But maybe "cleaning the mess" is not important....having the
> priviledge of seeing the hatemasons in action is worth the price of
> addmission, no? Seeing the lies, the threats, how they treat people,
> etc. It's a real eye-opener regarding our august fraternity (or at
> least the broom-closet of it that the dark ones occupy).
I can't go along with that statement when vulgar and mean spirited
topics are introduced into this newsgroup by non, or antiMasons. I have
not read an outright mean thread started by any Mason. I have often
read mean and nasty posts started by others who try to sucker the
Masons into a response that is beneath their expected and claimed
behavior.
I even let myself be drawn into this and I said that I wouldn't.
Sonic
JB
Hash: SHA1
"Sonic" <Fara...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1104160408.9...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
> It is responses like this that cause well meaning Masons and
> non-Masons to not participate in this newsgroup. A suggestion is
> offered to
> participants as to how they might reclaim this newsgroup as a
> useful Masonic information service. After Eric Stott's remark I
> have lost desire to continue in this newsgroup. It seems to me that
> the trolls are right, those that try to fix something that is
> broken and in need of repair should just leave it collapse.
>
For better or worse I don't think the newsgroup is in any danger of
collapse.
I have no doubt that your intentions are good, but you must realise
that people rarely change their personalities. The more "combative",
if you will, of the Masons here aren't going to sit back and read
illogical lies and not point out to the reading audience that they
are lies.
> Peter Renzland has positive information to offer as well, now I see
> what he is up against. I still think that his overall cause is just
> and proper although at times it seems misdirected and he comes off
> as
> dictatorial. In my opinion (if I am still permitted to have one)
I don't think anyone has suggested that you shouldn't have an opinion
- - or that you shouldn't share it
Personally, I'm not familiar with anyone who has seriously suggested
Peter is a troll. I believe him to be a well meaning Mason.
Unfortunately, he lets his temper get away from him when people don't
see things his way. Truth be told, despite what I've just written,
it's just as inappropriate for me to discuss another Mason's attitude
and style in this unmoderated forum as it is for you to do the same.
Peter will doubtless continue down the path he's chosen as will we
all.
>
> I think that I will go back to lurking for awhile, it is much less
> abusive and I really don't get paid for my efforts. At least I know
> that I have tried.
>
I would say feel free to proffer you opinion as you see appropriate -
continue to critique the individual posters if you wish - but always
remember the reason you don't get paid is because nobody has
appointed you arbiter!
As for Craftworker he's the worst kind of troll, even if he turns out
to be a Mason. He's obviously intelligent and clever but uses this
forum to denigrate Masonry and insult masons. He also seems to have
a serious hang-up with Ed King.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: PGP 8.0.3 - not licensed for commercial use: www.pgp.com
iQA/AwUBQdBX2Ppxh1uHmCDzEQJwEQCfXqhLClDU1DeAdXB8kOOERtnEJ4kAn28m
8uHu9wZnZdDR0zbfllfw23w9
=pJGR
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Stott
Sorry if I caused any trouble, although I'll still stick with my opinion.
(And calling someone a "Pompous Ass" is pretty mild by the standards of
this forum)
How ever I'll try to retire from posting for a time "For the good of the
craft"
Eric Stott
John Nelson
est...@localnet.spamcommode says...
>
> Sorry if I caused any trouble, although I'll still stick with my opinion.
> (And calling someone a "Pompous Ass" is pretty mild by the standards of
> this forum)
Well..., that depends upon the standard you are applying. It would
appear that we "double-up" on such things like standards, here in a.f.
"Pompous Ass" would be tame for someone like Norwood when he's in
meltdown mode, but that's about as strong as you'll see from the likes
of Peter, and most of the other Masons here, I think.
> How ever I'll try to retire from posting for a time "For the good of the
> craft"
Your call, of course. Polite and earnest comments and discussion are
always welcome. Don't be a stranger.
JB
Hash: SHA1
"John Nelson" <DieSpa...@njabl.org> wrote in message
news:MPG.1c3a14f6d...@news.comcast.giganews.com...
> In article <41D05E74...@localnet.spamcommode>,
> est...@localnet.spamcommode says...
>>
>> Sorry if I caused any trouble, although I'll still stick with my
>> opinion. (And calling someone a "Pompous Ass" is pretty mild by
>> the standards of this forum)
>
> Well..., that depends upon the standard you are applying. It would
> appear that we "double-up" on such things like standards, here in
> a.f. "Pompous Ass" would be tame for someone like Norwood when
> he's in meltdown mode, but that's about as strong as you'll see
> from the likes of Peter, and most of the other Masons here, I
> think.
>
There I'm forced to disagree. Peter's repertoire of insults when
speaking to Masons is far more varied than that.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: PGP 8.0.3 - not licensed for commercial use: www.pgp.com
iQA/AwUBQdB27fpxh1uHmCDzEQL20wCfSgl500thILf6HkvmyMNbfbMzPMsAoK+P
oXXsd2NmR5DF/nJuCrYlcedd
=1Zf1
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Stott
Myself, I'd rather be called a pompous ass than a satanic whoring child
abuser. And (one way or another) I've been called both here.
Maybe I should take that bit about "Learn to control my passions" and think
about it.
Anyhow, this is a good time of the year to take things quietly.
Eric Stott
jDolan
thecraf...@yahoo.com wrote on 12/27/04 1:35 PM:
> On Tue, 28 Dec 2004 03:40:29 +1030, David Simpson
> <faro...@picknowl.com.au> wrote:
>
>> It's rather ironic that I have seen you using lies, threats and bad
>> treatment of people rather than most of those you attack yet here you
>> are, claiming to be pure as driven snow and acting as if butter
>> wouldn't melt in your mouth. Just remember all of your posts are
>> archived so interested persons can actually verify my remarks.
>
> Bad treatment of hatemasons, perhaps, but please provide your
> "evidence" of lies and threats, please. You made the allegation,
> support it, EdSock!
I'm glad to see you calling for validation of somneone else's claim.
Surely you hold yourself to the same standards?
Reminder: You preserntly have an unsupported attribution that awaits
clarification in another thread.
jHam Dolan PM You have the time, they might not:
White River #90 Feed the hungry with a click of your mouse:
Royalton (Bethel), Vt. http://www.thehungersite.com
John Nelson
masoni...@btinternet.com says...
> > Well..., that depends upon the standard you are applying. It would
> > appear that we "double-up" on such things like standards, here in
> > a.f. "Pompous Ass" would be tame for someone like Norwood when
> > he's in meltdown mode, but that's about as strong as you'll see
> > from the likes of Peter, and most of the other Masons here, I
> > think.
> >
>
> There I'm forced to disagree. Peter's repertoire of insults when
> speaking to Masons is far more varied than that.
Well, yes, but he always comports himself in a civilized manner, even
when he is at his most condescending. I don't recall ever having seen
him resort to the off-color, spittle-spraying epithets that Norwood is
prone to.
jlruble
"Stott" <est...@localnet.spamcommode> wrote in message
news:41D0778D...@localnet.spamcommode...
> Point taken.
> Myself, I'd rather be called a pompous ass than a satanic whoring child
> abuser. And (one way or another) I've been called both here.
> Maybe I should take that bit about "Learn to control my passions" and
think
> about it.
> Anyhow, this is a good time of the year to take things quietly.
>
> Eric Stott
Brother
Insults that are false reflect on the poster more than the "insultee".
An accusation without proof is like a puff of smoke in the wind.
And the accuser is the one that is maligned.
JMHBCO
SCOTTY
Don få Rune Våge Jokkmokker
> Sonic wrote:
> > >Pardon me. I don't like the crap and fighting here myself, but juse
> > exactly
> > >what brought you here and set you off?
> >
> > >And (last time I checked) it's spelled "Pus".
> > >Myself I think there's more Bile and Venom here than pus.
> >
> > Stott
> >
> > Why even respond to that post? He, or someone else will now respond you
> > your post, you will feel compelled to agin respond and we will not have
> > changed a thing. No response would be your loudest response.
> >
> > "There are none so blind as those that will not see".
> > "There are none so deaf as those that will not hear".
> >
> > Sonic
> With all your good intentions, you're coming off as a pompous ass. Maybe
> it's all the question marks and the quotes.
> Stott
Always the knee-jerk mindless jerk's response of the hatemason ey Stott?
Did you copy that drivel off the flyleaf of the Luciferian Albert Pike
book (which contents are beyond your comprehension)?
jDolan
få Rune Våge Jokkmokker at D...@darkangellcd.org wrote on
12/29/04 7:30 AM:
Hi Norwood.