Coolant leaks in EF Falcon
Jason
I'm having a lot of trouble making my EF stop leaking coolant from every
available orifice imaginable! Just when I think that I've stopped the
leaks, it starts again. The leaks were coming from hoses that were well
clamped. Then, when the clamps were further tightened, the leaks appeared
elsewhere. Now, I have changed all the hoses, clamps, replaced the spring
clamps with proper hose clamps, all whilst holding my mouth just right, and
now it is leaking from around the thermostat housing - and I can't tighten
it any further. I can't win!
The system has been flushed, new coolant (original stuff) added and
pressure tested under static conditions with no loss of pressure detectable
after 10 minutes of the pressure tester being pressurised. I haven't done
the test with the car running, however (this may be my next test if
possible). I'm very concerned that there is a head gasket problem, though
I'm being told by a reputable mechanic that it is unlikely that it would
cause these symptoms.
So, my question is: why is my cooling system plumbing unable to handle
the normal pressures that every other EF can handle? The temperatures are
fine - rarely goes over or under the 'M' on 'NORMAL', which I'd consider
normal?
Any ideas? BTW, the car is only 85,000km old, and serviced according to
schedule.
Jase.
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Oracle ®
have to live with, as for the thermostat housing, it seems very common, I
changed my thermostat and gasket, and even put a gasket between the 2 half's
of the thermostat housing, and it still leaked, next thing I would of done
would of been to buy a whole new thermostat housing, it was obviously
warped.
--
Regards
--------------------------------------
"Jason" <j_r...@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:3c0a10fa$0$27197$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
Michael Pretlove
> pressure tested under static conditions with no loss of pressure
detectable
> after 10 minutes of the pressure tester being pressurised. I haven't done
> the test with the car running, however (this may be my next test if
> possible). I'm very concerned that there is a head gasket problem, though
> I'm being told by a reputable mechanic that it is unlikely that it would
> cause these symptoms.
If you are loosing coolant, but its not dropping under your car then your
mechanic is probably correct.
Couple of simple tests. Take out your spark plugs and check for green
coolant on them... or leave them out and turn the engine over... if coolant
comes out the spark plug sockets... its a problem with the head...
NOTE: do not stand next to your engine when you turn it over without
sparkies in it. (regular readers will remember my adventures)
Mike
--
"Ever listen to K-Billy's Super Sounds Of the Seventies?"
- Mr Blonde (Michael Madsen)
Marty Hogan
Jason <j_r...@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:3c0a10fa$0$27197$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
Okies, well, that temp seems WAY too hot to me ... I dunno about anyone
elses experiences with falcons here, but they tend to sit on the very low
end of the temperature guage, just approaching the bottom of the normal
area, so that seems a bit hot, might want to look at getting your radiator
flushed...
Secondly, are you sure your radiator cap is working ? It might be holding a
shitload more pressure then its meant to, causing a few leaks, failing that,
I know Mr Murphy has some experience with thermostat housings which im sure
he will share, ( I think the answer was to replace it with a non OEM ford
part )
Check that its the right spec cap too, it does seem to be holding a shitload
more pressure then it should be.
Good luck !
Kieron Murphy
wrote:
> Any ideas? BTW, the car is only 85,000km old, and serviced according to
>schedule.
Just a thought, have you replaced the thermostat, could be something
weird like that?
Where exactly is it leaking from now? in particular is it from the
heater hose area?
I think the problem is in the warm up phase, as this is when the
system is under most pressure with the thermo closed. A metal pipe out
the back of the water pump is used to bypass the engine block via the
heater hoses which eventually feed the bottom of the thermo housing, a
dual acting thermostat is used to control the water, so check all the
hoses in this area for proper routing, if memory serves and important
part is a metal Y pipe, have a look at a workshop manual cooling
system diagram.
Upper and lower thermostat housings can be suspect, there was also a
faulty batch of aftermarket upper thermo housing's going around about
a year ago - the castings were faulty, the housing in question has a
brass screw in bleeder pipe rather than a cast breather pipe outlet.
Kieron
G & LE Hudson
In November 2000 I blew the top hose on my EF while towing a caravan. the
car didn't get hot or boil the hose just exploded. I replaced all major
hoses then in November of this year again while towing up hill the cooolant
feed hose to the LPG converter exploded and this hose was less than 18
months old and stamped 60psi.all fittings on the pressure side of the Rad
showed weeping signs
after lots of thought I bit the bullet and bought an heavy duty radiator.
during the change over I noticed the bleed hose from the top of the thermo
housing was swollen for the first 25mm
anyway after change over I pulled the bottom tank off the old rad and stuck
a garden hose up the top tank
at least 50% of the tubes had no flow and half of the remainder showed
restricted flow.
I did notice that with the old radiator and the car nice and warm (after a
good run) the segment of the overflow tank that the bleed pipe returns to
was completely full now you can just see a small flow of coolant
check out falcon cooling problems at
http://communities.ninemsn.com.au/Caravanersforum/general.msnw
look forward to what you find
Jason <jr_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3c0b1...@news.iprimus.com.au...
>
> Thanks Keiron. Yes - I have replaced the thermostat, but not the radiator
> cap as yet. I will do that and see what happens.
>
> To answer your question, the leaks seem to come from whatever the weakest
> link is! But, it is now mostly around the thermostat housing, with a
small
> amount leaking on the return line back to the coolant reservoir (on the
> reservoir side of the hose). However, it started around both sides of the
> top radiator hose.
>
> I will check all the hoses you mentioned. Also, the thermostat housing is
> original, and worked for the first part of the car's life. Unless it has
> warped or something? Maybe the new thermostat I put in recently had the
> wrong sized seal around it?
>
> I've got a few things to check now (but I'm hoping its just a radiator cap
> :-) )
>
> Thanks again,
>
> Jase.
>
> "Kieron Murphy" <kie...@reiwa.com.au> wrote in message
> news:3c0afad0...@wa.news.telstra.net...
Oracle ®
cylinders, which would make it a bit safer
--
Regards
--------------------------------------
"Michael Pretlove" <Martain...@wanker.com> wrote in message
news:oryO7.40115$li3.4...@ozemail.com.au...
Oracle ®
I should of mentioned, that I didn't have any such problems till 160,000k's
except when the thermostat housing gasket blew, the one between the
thermostat housing and the head. this was at 125,000k's
--
Regards
--------------------------------------
"Jason" <j_r...@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:3c0a10fa$0$27197$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
Aussiblue
or a single acting one?
"Oracle ®" <thisin...@no.its.not> wrote in message
news:ijIO7.407008$bY5.1...@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
Michael Pretlove
> you when cranking your engine without plugs - is it worth repeating? (I
need
> a laugh :-) )
well due to my number two cylinder being full of coolant, didnt wanna turn
the engine over (had to drive it to my mechanics to get a new head cause the
current one was still under warranty) cause it would bend rods and just
generally not be good while it was full of coolant. I wanted to squirt it
out, then put the sparkies back in and limp it to the shop.
story is, a guy is standing adjancent to my inline 6, i turn it over. His
mouth was slightly open.
in a split second 800cc of coolant hit him square in the face.
he said it tasted sweet.
Thats my tale!
Hope you got a kick out of it.
Oracle ®
bought what ever they gave me when I asked for it :)
--
Regards
--------------------------------------
"Aussiblue" <auss...@dingoblue.net.au> wrote in message
news:3c0b6688$0$21615$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
Kieron Murphy
>Yeah - me too! How can you tell the difference between a dual acting and a
>single acting thermostat visually? I know the thermostat that was in the
>car was Ford original and the new one was a generic one, that looks and acts
>exactly the same? The only difference I could see visually was that, in the
>Ford original one, there was a little float-looking thing in a hole on the
>rim of the thermostat (about the size of a tic-tac with a barb on the end to
>stop it slipping through it's (approx.)4mm hole. The generic one didn't
>have this. There is just a hole there - no float.
Check the pics on this page Jason -
http://www.vtr.org/maintain/stag-cooling.html
the 2 thermos on the left are dual acting. What basically happens is
during warm up, water is bleed off the back of the water pump, when
the thermo opens, that extra disk stops the bleeding, allowing all the
pumped water to ciruclate thru the engine.
I'd imagine if you didn't have a dual acting thermo, some cooled water
will bypass the engine and in high temp situations could cause
overheating, thinking of how the whole system is setup, the heater
would also receive cooler water too, so high engine temps and luke
warm heater could be a tell tail, AussieBlue knows a little on this
too
The hole is used to assist in bleeding the cooling system and to
reduce pressure when the thermo is closed, the 'tic tac' is a simple
one way valve, probably nothing major, main thing is you have the
hole.
Kieron
Michael Pretlove
>
> Jase.
nah, ice cold... been sitting in the cylinder overnight.
Mike
--
Goad
litres everytime I would refill it. Got it looked at and in the end it was
the passengerside tank of the radiator that was apparantly 'bowing' out away
from the cores and leaking water. The thermostat was also on the way out.
I had to get the water pump replaced 8 months earlier also (the day after I
friggn bought it)
Trav
Jason <j_r...@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:3c0a10fa$0$27197$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
Jim
no leaks at all. It has had the water pump replaced after the system was
flushed. Seems to always go after a system flush. I can only assume that a
lot of debris is released and this must destroy the seals on the water pump.
I was riding in a taxi the other day and the driver mentioned that there are
two thermostats available for the EF. One is colder rated than the other. I
take it mine has the hotter thermostat which is better for town driving. The
needle sits about 1/3 the way up. The taxis going all day have the colder
one, I am told, and the needle never leaves the bottom mark.
"Jason" <j_r...@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:3c0a10fa$0$27197$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
Oracle ®
had it out on some pretty hot days.
--
Regards
--------------------------------------
"Jason" <jr_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3c0d5...@news.iprimus.com.au...
> The temp needle on mine sits around he middle (the 'M' on NORMAL) - but
> barely moves from that position, so I'd imagine that it is under control.
> Is that too hot?
>
> Jase.
>
> "Jim" <jae...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:gN4P7.140373$e5.5...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
Jim
But ....
This morning I drove to Mount Isa, a distance of 120km, the needle sat
around the 'M'. Coming back at lunch time the ambient temperature was
getting to 43 degrees C. In this case the needle sat on the bottom mark just
below the 'L' all the way. Strange that it runs the motor cooler when the
temperature of the day gets hotter.
I am not sure why my falcon does this. I am wondering if there is some
control over the cooling by the computer, sensing a higher air intake
temperature and compensating by cooling the motor more.
"Jason" <jr_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3c0d5...@news.iprimus.com.au...
> The temp needle on mine sits around he middle (the 'M' on NORMAL) - but
> barely moves from that position, so I'd imagine that it is under control.
> Is that too hot?
>
> Jase.
>
> "Jim" <jae...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:gN4P7.140373$e5.5...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
Jim
When my hoses where installed the mechanics apply some sort of sealant (red
looking stuff" to the join first so that it is not totally reliant on the
clamp for sealing. Does yours have this?
"Jason" <jr_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3c0eb...@news.iprimus.com.au...
>
> Good - I was beginning to worry! On the fwy it sits on the lower side of
> the 'M'. Around town - regardless of the outside temp - it goes to the
> middle of the 'M'. If I've just come off the fwy and have to do stop
start
> driving, it creeps up to the high side of the 'M'. I rarely see it go to
> the 'R'. Actually, I saw it once when I was going up Mt Tambourine fairly
> quickly, then half way up got caught behind a bus doing 20km/h the rest of
> the way.
>
> The only time it goes *really* high seems to be caused by after boil, or
> when you've had the car turned off for a few minutes then fire it back up
> again. The temp gauge shoots to the 'O' and very quickly (15-30 seconds
or
> so) comes down to the 'M' again, where it stays for the duration of the
> trip.
>
> This seems to be when the engine does most of it's leaking that I can see.
> I can clean off the coolant marks before a drive, then go for a drive, get
> back and have a look and it has hardly leaked (maybe a spot or two still,
> but nothing major). Then, after a few minutes, you can see the hoses
start
> to seep from around the clamps. The temp gauge throughout this is well
into
> the 'O'! Maybe there is a problem here somewhere ???
>
> Jase.
>
> "Oracle ®" <thisin...@no.its.not> wrote in message
> news:DOlP7.416361$bY5.1...@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
Oracle ®
temperature gauge, it was a 43 degree day and I had the a/c on. I had to
drive with the a/c off and the heater on full blast just to bring the
temperature down to an acceptable level. the day after that the heater hose
blew, something fishy was going on, but i fixed it and it didn't happen
again in the week more that I kept it before trading it in.
--
Regards
--------------------------------------
"Jason" <jr_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
Michael Pretlove
> constant, from my experience so far.
could be working backwards... i mean, i drove a ZD fairlane the other day
that said empty on the fuel guage when it was full... and full when it was
empty.
Mike
Jim
1.5 years now and temperature guage indicates some funny things.
Today it decided to run with the needle just below the L all the time
excepting a few times when ot decided to run in its "normal" position of
just below the M.
I gave up a long time ago though worring about it as I haven't had any
problems with the cooling system apart from replacing the water pump.
I guess it is just one of those things that adds character to a car!
Besides, if I solve this mystery, I will only start analysing the tacho or
some other guage. : )
"Jason" <jr_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3c0ff...@news.iprimus.com.au...
> Oh, good! That means mine isn't the only posessed cooling system!
>
> But, it sounds like your thermo got jammed open? It should be pretty
> constant, from my experience so far.
>
> Jase.
>
> "Jim" <jae...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:TyEP7.164282$e5.8...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
Jason
would be something else. Just damned lucky I didn't buy a Commodore - I'd
be posting this from a padded cell by now!!!
Jase.
"Jim" <jae...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:fYjQ7.196132$e5.9...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...