The origins of Texas style chili
Wayne Lundberg
may have anecdotal references to the origins of one of the greatest delights
in the culinary arts ever created by mankind. The hot, bubbling,
scent-tear-jerking, taste-enriched, chili beans or plain old chili.
My anthropological studies hint at the origins of this great dish as cowboys
herding longhorns north to Dodge City and carrying only the bare necessities
of jerky and beans, a tasteless mouthful if you ever had one! But a Mexican
cowboy riding along offered his few, precious chilies to the pot and
suddenly beans, jerky and chile made it to the hungry bellies satisfying not
only the hunger, but the taste buds.
Anybody care to share their thoughts on Texas Chili?
I made some last night and my family is still running around rubbing their
belly in gusto and good cheer claiming their tummy really likes the
combination of beans, beef and chile.
Wayne, in Chula Juana
Douglas S. Ladden
<Wayn...@example.invalid> shared its ideas in
alt.food.mexican-cooking on Sat, 27 Sep 2003 21:17:09 GMT:
> I'm crossposting this one because I'd like to hear from the
> old-timers who may have anecdotal references to the origins of one of
> the greatest delights in the culinary arts ever created by mankind.
> The hot, bubbling, scent-tear-jerking, taste-enriched, chili beans or
> plain old chili.
>
> My anthropological studies hint at the origins of this great dish as
> cowboys herding longhorns north to Dodge City and carrying only the
> bare necessities of jerky and beans, a tasteless mouthful if you ever
> had one! But a Mexican cowboy riding along offered his few, precious
> chilies to the pot and suddenly beans, jerky and chile made it to the
> hungry bellies satisfying not only the hunger, but the taste buds.
>
> Anybody care to share their thoughts on Texas Chili?
>
One of the better sites I've found regarding the history and legends
of chili can be found here:
http://www.geocities.com/NapaValley/4079/History/Chili/ChiliHistory.htm
I hope you enjoy it. It is actually pretty interesting.
--Douglas
Troy.
Wet you whistle with these:
http://www.mayouspice.com/texchilihist.html
http://www.fiery-foods.com/dave/chiliconcarne1.asp
Wayne Lundberg
time.
Wayne
"Douglas S. Ladden" <nospa...@nowayjose.org> wrote in message
news:Xns94039C3DBF32Ed...@204.127.204.17...
Wayne Lundberg
listed, I read a lot of similarities in the history and legends behind this
wonderful dish.
Only two comments which may or may not be original. Most Mexican food is
cooked without hot chiles and the picante is added by the eater from salsas
on the table or counter. Mole may be the exception but again, great care is
taken to select the less picante chiles that go into it unless the regional
taste demands really hot stuff as some villages in Veracruz.
The other comment is that, as far as I know, chili contains beef and
although deer and antelope were here long before the conquest, these meats
were cooked in mole or adobado or the like, or were cooked on open flame
such as you see kid goat in Monterrey. Beef came with the Spanish, so it
makes sense that vaqueros and cowboys along the trail would use that brick
chili, add water and make the famous Texas chili.
Wonderful lore! And my mouth would be watering except that my wife and I
just finished off two bowls of my slightly modified chili, (the addition of
two chile anchos and a tad more garlic than usual).
Cheers!
Wayne
"Troy." <bul...@iinescasca.net> wrote in message
news:3F76187D...@iinescasca.net...
Jay P Francis
chili, in Northern Mexico.
I'm too lazy to type out the recipes but they are both available in the Mexico
The Beautiful cookbook.
Sinaloa- Chilorio is a chile seasoned pork dish including ancho chiles and
cumin.
Sonora- Carne Con Chile is a chile seasoned pork dish with ancho chiles and
cumin.
Cuchulain Libby
"Jay P Francis" <jaypf...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20030928004755...@mb-m19.aol.com...
> Let's not forget that two chili like dished exist and may have pre-dated
Texas
> chili, in Northern Mexico.
Don't forget Hungarian goulash. Very similar to chili in it's preperation.
-Hound
GEEZER
beans in it, you put them on the side=====GEEZER
"Cuchulain Libby" <cli...@satx.XX.com> wrote in message
news:_lDdb.170866$834....@twister.austin.rr.com...
Nixon, D
I thought so....... I ate enough of it when I was a kid.
But there was usually a lot more fat/grease than what
he describes here. And, of course about 40 crackers
"Saltines" were an essential.
Note the comment on the end re. beans and/or tomatoes . . . .
Below is the reference.
This guy knows "Texas Chile" in its original state !!
McDave in McMaryland
========================================================
http://www.recipesource.com/soups/chili/03/rec0314.html
* Exported from MasterCook *
Billy Bob Barnett's Texas Style Chili
Recipe By : khea...@utmmg.med.uth.tmc.edu
Serving Size : 1 Preparation Time :0:00
Categories : Posted
Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method
-------- ------------ --------------------------------
10 pounds ground chuck
1 cup hot chili powder
1 cup chili powder -- (mild)
3/4 cup paprika
1/2 cup cumin
1/4 cup garlic powder
1/4 cup salt
1/8 cup crushed red pepper
1 pound suet
3 quarts water
1/4 cup sugar -- add 20min before
-- end
Add fat first, then meat and seasonings to fat. Add water after it cooks 2
hrs.
Cook 3 hrs total. Stir occasionally. Now that's Texas Chili! (Although I
usua
lly throw in Shiner Bock Beer for part of that water.) This is real good
with
raw chopped onion on top (plus the ubiquitous saltines).
Busted by Christopher E. Eaves <cea...@airmail.net>
NOTES : TRUE TEXAS CHILI HAS NO BEANS AND NO TOMATO. NONE.
=====================================================================
McDave
--
/s/ David E. Nixon in Maryland "A Faire Lande of Pleasant Living"
"Wayne Lundberg" <Wayn...@example.invalid> wrote in message
news:O0tdb.155842$0v4.11...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Nixon, D
Wayne;
You've received some wonderful tips and some interesting sites
in response to your post.
But, since your original subject is "origins of Texas style chili", there's
quite a few points you need to keep in mind along with my other two
responses to your post.
In that neck of the woods when people speak of "chili" they don't
really mean the chili plant , they mean chunked up beef and fat with a lot
of chili
powder cooked with it. Until I started to school I thought the word
chili was a synonym for MEAT.
People there (oldtimers) NEVER speak of "Chili Con Carne". To use
Spanish/Mex words was about the most low-brow thing that a person
could do. Until recently, of course.
In the "Last Days of the Old Wild West", NO ONE would think of putting
beans or tomatoes into a mess of chili. It just was NOT done.
People used onions once in a while in chili, but garlic, and cumin,
was definitely not used.
Nowadays, many (myself included) do love beans of various variety
and diced tomatoes and all manner of good spices in my "chili".
But, your subject was about "origins". All of which reminds
me; we've got a real good 4 lb. package of beef
in the freezer and I'll thaw it and put a gallon of chili on to cook
before I have to go to the Sen.Cntr.. I don't have an official name
for mine so everyone just calls it "Daddy Dave's Chili".
Oh, and I should mention----- the original beverage that went with
Original Texas Chili was (for those that weren't guests at Huntsville) was
"Miller's Highlife the Champage of Bottled Beers". Heh, heh, heh . . . .
McDave OKIE at Large, now at large in McMaryland
=====================================================================
"Wayne Lundberg" <Wayn...@example.invalid> wrote in message
news:O0tdb.155842$0v4.11...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Wayne Lundberg
"Nixon, D" <n...@att.net> wrote in message
news:RKUdb.163057$3o3.11...@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>
> Wayne;
>
> You've received some wonderful tips and some interesting sites
> in response to your post
This has been a delightful string with so many great responses and site
suggestions that I really feel enriched and more than satisfied with the
results so far.
I don't think I would like the real Texas chili; my taste buds simply don't
respond to fat and excessive chile picante. But I'm thinking that the
origins of this recipe must go back to the pioneers and mountain men
trekking across this great land. They carried most of their food with them
and hunted for the rest. The food they carried had to last a long time; as
did food on long sea voyages. Pemmican comes to mind, as mentioned in one of
the sites listed before. Pemmican and dried beef jerky must have been among
the most prevalent. Then somebody discovered the chiles from Mexico that
could grow so easily in the south and with that added heat to hide the
rotting smell and taste of old pemmican and jerky, was born true Texas
Chili. Which makes perfect sense in that beans were mostly from Mexico, as
were tomatoes and little onions. Cumin came from the Europeans and was
eventually grown in the Americas. Beef was unknown in Mexico prior to the
conquest. So Texas Chili surely has it's true origins in Texas as cowboys
and vaqueros proliferated. I love the story of the San Antonio Chile Ladies
selling their food by the bowlful next to the comal. In Mexico this is a
common sight, only the chili is tacos, menudo, pozole, quesadillas and the
like. We still eat standing up, leaning forward so the salsa will drip onto
the ground and not our shirts as we munch on a corn tortilla taco filled
with whatever concoction is at hand.
Cheers!
Wayne
Nixon, D
chile; no beans, no tomatoes. Or (if you do sneak some in there)
don't tell anybody about it. I won't). <chuckle>
McDave
"Wayne Lundberg" <Wayn...@example.invalid> wrote in message
news:zXYdb.157599$0v4.11...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
David Wright
wrote:
Thanks for those names, Jay. I had thought for a long time that a
simple carne guisada could easily have evolved into Texas chili, but
these two are even closer.
David
Cuchulain Libby
GEEZER wrote:
> Hay HOUND aint no way Goulash and chili are the same, and you don't
> put beans in it, you put them on the side=====GEEZER
Didn't say they were. Said they were similar enough. Like every civilization
has a flat bread. And what the hell do beans have to do with goulash or
Texas Chili?
Do you even know what goulash is? Them cowboys or their folks came from
somewhere...
-Hound
Jack Schidt®
It's got browned meat and paprika is a chile. Why not?
Jack
Misschef
it many times), but NOT similar in any other way....taste, ingredients (cept
the pork, if you use it in chili)..........saurkraut?? potatoes?? Uh, chili
doesn't come to mind here.
"Cuchulain Libby" <cli...@satx.XX.com> wrote in message
news:_lDdb.170866$834....@twister.austin.rr.com...
Cuchulain Libby
"Misschef" <miss...@earthlink.net> wrote
... saurkraut?? potatoes?? Uh, chili
> doesn't come to mind here.
See I didn't think goulash had those things. But then I don't think chili
has beans. Sounds like you just made my case, thanks.
-Hound
The Ranger
> ... saurkraut?? potatoes?? Uh, chili doesn't come to mind here.
> >
> See I didn't think goulash had those things. But then I don't
> think chili has beans. Sounds like you just made my case, thanks.
That's certainly a head-in-the-sand close to proving a point... Next thing
you'll be expecting us to believe is it's okay to add cocoa to chili...
The Ranger
Wayne Lundberg
"The Ranger" <cuhula...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:blc73f$algul$1...@ID-61173.news.uni-berlin.de...
The Ranger
A quick Google shows different.
The Ranger
Wayne Lundberg
regarding the origins of chili as we know it today.
Mole goes back to pre-Columbian Mexican cooking as evidenced in many of the
the monk's writings shortly after the conquest. Primary ingredients were
turkey, a dozen varieties of dried chiles, peanuts and chocolate. Today we
add tomatoes and little green onions which were native prior to the
'discovery' of America.
Mole is also used as the basic sauce for deer, armadillo, rabbit and piglet.
So the only difference between a good Mexican mole and Texas Chili is beef.
The friars reporting on the Aztec custom of cutting the heart from the
captured warriors or selected victims, told of parts of the body being cut
from the cadaver and tossed to the multitudes bellow; who would then take
the chunks of tough warrior muscle and simmer in mole sauce for a couple of
days before scooping up the special meal with quartered corn tortillas as
spoons.
I know from personal experience the tenderizing qualities of a good mole. We
would sacrifice the oldest turkey in the flock for the upcoming feast. It
would take three days to prepare the mole sauce using the old turkey's stock
as the base liquid. It would take three days to tenderize these old birds!
So it makes sense that chili is nothing more than tough old beef left over
from the tables of the wealthy and given only to prisoners, cowboys and
vaqueros who would then use the ancient Amerindian combination of chiles to
tenderize the mix and make it palletable. Thus creating one of the greatest
dishes on the planet.
Wayne in Chula Vista
My credientials: http://www.calmexnet.org/partners/wayne.htm
Linda
"Misschef" <miss...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:Te7eb.37273$pP6....@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> Maybe Hungarian Goulash is similar in preparation (I'll give ya
that....made
> it many times), but NOT similar in any other way....taste, ingredients
(cept
> the pork, if you use it in chili)..........saurkraut?? potatoes?? Uh,
chili
> doesn't come to mind here.
Sauerkraut goes great with pork. :)
Linda
[---]
Misschef
sauerkraut is one of my favorite dishes. It was being compared to chili,
though and I couldn't see the relationship. :o) Misschef
"Linda" <pure...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:0Poeb.44292$vj2.10359@fed1read06...
Jack Schidt®
> Yes, Linda. I agree wholeheartedly. Hungarian Goulash with pork and
> sauerkraut is one of my favorite dishes. It was being compared to chili,
> though and I couldn't see the relationship. :o) Misschef
>
>
Goulash is a descendent of Gulyasleves, a Hungarian beef soup.
Ingredients
6 small dried red chiles such as Cayenne or Piquin
5 Tablespoons hot Hungarian paprika
1 cup flour
1 pound cubed, boneless beef chuck
2 Tablespoons bacon fat or oil
1 medium onion, cut in thin slices
1 large carrot, peeled and diced
4 cups beef broth
1 tablespoon fresh black pepper, coarsely ground
3/4 teaspoon caraway seeds
<similar to texas beef chile, yes?>
Here's another:
a.. 2 lb. beef chuck
b.. 1 tsp. salt
c.. 2 onions, white or yellow
d.. 2 Tbsp. lard or shortening
e.. 2 Tbsp. imported sweet paprika (most important to use real hungarian
paprika for ultimate flavor)
f.. 2 bay leaves
g.. 1 Qt. water
h.. 4 peeled and diced potatoes
i.. 1/4 tsp. black pepper
Other than Székely gulyás, which is made with pork and sauerkraut, Gulyas is
made with beef or veal.
The word "goulash" comes from a French corruption of the German corruption
of gulyas, which is Gulasch. In Germany gulaschsuppe is a close imitation
of gulyas, but not as good.
Anyway, enough non-germaine food history. In Europe they probably debate
real goulash like we debate real chili (I can hear it now..."Real goulash
DOES NOT include potatoes!)
Jack
Cuchulain Libby
"Jack Schidt®" <jack....@sneto.neto> wrote >
> Anyway, enough non-germaine food history. In Europe they probably debate
> real goulash like we debate real chili (I can hear it now..."Real goulash
> DOES NOT include potatoes!)
My whole theorem was based on a Wolfgang Puck episode wherein he went to
Budapest and visited a goulash house. *In the kitchen* the prep was nearly
identical to chili. Whatever condiments they happen to serve it with are of
no consequence, just that he put up this chef and his preparation as
authentic goulash.
-Hound
Misschef
neighbor of mine. She is in her 60's and has only lived in the US for about
15 years, speaks English with difficulty, and is a marvelous cook. Her
recipe for Goulash includes pork, Szeged paprika, sauerkraut and potatoes.
She calls it Szeged Goulash and swears it is the ONLY Hungarian goulash, but
I suspect the recipes in Hungary are regional, depending on the origin. As
in most countries cuisines, there are probably many, many variations on a
single recipe.
Yes, the recipe you posted is indeed quite similar to Texas Chili!! It
sounds marvelous, I will try it soon.
I humbly retract my previous statements regarding the lack of comparison.
Misschef
"Jack SchidtŽ" <jack....@sneto.neto> wrote in message
news:Ztzeb.7711$zt5....@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com...
Cuchulain Libby
Misschef wrote:
> I humbly retract my previous statements regarding the lack of
> comparison.
>
> Misschef
Apology accepted <g>
It would interesting to investigate the heredity of those early cowboys. The
towns in the Hill Country were settled by Germans, drawn by a land
speculator who had a speculative investment of 300,000 acres of worthless,
Indian-infested land he sold to the homefolk as a Paradise. He bought it
sight unseen. Sort of like Florida swampland only prettier. The cattle
coming up from the Nueces on their way to market ate all the grasses up
there, leaving room for the cedar to take over.
Unless the Chili Queens predate the immigrants.
-Hound
Jack Schidt®
Betcha anyone with a pan and a pot naturally browns meat and adds chiles.
Just a hunch, Hound.
Jack
GEEZER
"Cuchulain Libby" <cli...@satx.XX.com> wrote in message
news:H3Beb.28918$iH6....@twister.austin.rr.com...
GEEZER
Mexican people have Native American Blood in them
"Cuchulain Libby" <cli...@satx.XX.com> wrote in message
news:vOIeb.28999$iH6....@twister.austin.rr.com...
Cuchulain Libby
"GEEZER" <dmi...@texas.net> wrote in message
news:2s2dnZ6CS7t...@texas.net...
> Why don't you enter it into a chili cook off
Because my chili has more chiles than paprika? And comino...
-Hound
Cuchulain Libby
> Damn you mean there were none of us "NATIVE AMERICANS " here most of the
> Mexican people have Native American Blood in them
That's a different take on chili. And one I support. The Aztlans/Aztecs had
a stew...some had cocoa, some didn't.
My homage to this is 'Hogan's Famous'. Includes corn, tomatoes, cocoa
powder, 3 beans etc. just no potatoes. It ain't CASI-approved chili but it's
damn good.
-Hound
Charles Gifford
"Wayne Lundberg" <Wayn...@example.invalid> wrote in message
>
> The other comment is that, as far as I know, chili contains beef and
> although deer and antelope were here long before the conquest,
Just a gentle correction for anyone who cares. There have never been
antelope in the Americas. You are probably refering to the pronghorn -
"Antelocapra americana". It is not related to antelopes nor to any living
animal. As the scientific name suggests, they are sometimes placed in a
group of animals called "goat antelopes" although they are neither. Other
animals in this group: chamois, saiga, takin and muskox. Other than the
muskox and takin none are actually related.
Charlie
Jack Schidt®
"Steve Wertz" <swe...@fastmail.micronesia> wrote in message
news:ueolovgkjsv2f419u...@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 13 Oct 2003 09:57:11 GMT, "Charles Gifford"
> <taxi...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> >"Wayne Lundberg" <Wayn...@example.invalid> wrote in message
> >news:O0tdb.155842$0v4.11...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> >>
> >> The other comment is that, as far as I know, chili contains beef and
> >> although deer and antelope were here long before the conquest,
> >
> >Just a gentle correction for anyone who cares. There have never been
> >antelope in the Americas. You are probably refering to the pronghorn -
> >"Antelocapra americana". It is not related to antelopes nor to any living
>
> Sombody should have pointed this out to Brewster Higley before they
> made "Home on the Range" the State Song of Kansas... ;-)
>
> http://www.50states.com/songs/kansas.htm
>
> Don't get me started on their use of the word "buffalo" either -
> supposedly there are no buffalo in the Americas, either.
>
> -sw
For there not being any, I sure have been 'buffalo'd' more times than I care
to remember!
Jack
A1 WBarfieldsr
news:pNBib.7921$vR7....@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com...
>
> "Steve Wertz" <swe...@fastmail.micronesia> wrote in message
> news:ueolovgkjsv2f419u...@4ax.com...
> > On Mon, 13 Oct 2003 09:57:11 GMT, "Charles Gifford"
> > <taxi...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> >
> > >"Wayne Lundberg" <Wayn...@example.invalid> wrote in message
> > >news:O0tdb.155842$0v4.11...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> > >>
> > >> The other comment is that, as far as I know, chili contains beef and
> > >> although deer and antelope were here long before the conquest,
> > >
> >
> > supposedly there are no buffalo in the Americas, either.
> >
> > -sw
>
> For there not being any, I sure have been 'buffalo'd' more times than I
care
> to remember!
>
> Jack
>
bound bull buffalo, LOL.
Jack Sloan
"Jack Schidt®" <jack-...@snot.net> wrote in message
news:pNBib.7921$vR7....@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com...
>
Jack
Jack Schidt®
"Jack Sloan" <jqs...@hal-pc.org> wrote in message
news:3f8b2912$0$96751$a726...@news.hal-pc.org...
> >
> I'd bet you've been buffalo'd bison of the best buffaloers around.
> Jack
>
>
Perfect!!
Frogleg
<taxi...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>"Wayne Lundberg" <Wayn...@example.invalid> wrote
>>
>> The other comment is that, as far as I know, chili contains beef and
>> although deer and antelope were here long before the conquest,
>
>Just a gentle correction for anyone who cares. There have never been
>antelope in the Americas. You are probably refering to the pronghorn -
>"Antelocapra americana". It is not related to antelopes nor to any living
>animal. As the scientific name suggests, they are sometimes placed in a
>group of animals called "goat antelopes" although they are neither. Other
>animals in this group: chamois, saiga, takin and muskox. Other than the
>muskox and takin none are actually related.
And someone called *me* an obsessive fuss-budget! :-) Given the
number of Antelope counties and towns, and states requiring "antelope"
hunting permits, let's give Wayne a break and acknowledge that while
the "Antelocapra americana" may not be the same critter as an African
antelope, not many Texans are making "pronghorn" stew.
Heaven knows what "Texas style" chile means. As you well know, New
Mexico is the source of all authentic chile/chilli recipes and foods.
With or without antelope. :-)
GEEZER
armadillo, if its meat me cook it!!!
"Frogleg" <fro...@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:4g2oov4ggt29huokg...@4ax.com...
Charles Gifford
> <taxi...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> And someone called *me* an obsessive fuss-budget! :-) Given the
> number of Antelope counties and towns, and states requiring "antelope"
> hunting permits, let's give Wayne a break and acknowledge that while
> the "Antelocapra americana" may not be the same critter as an African
> antelope, not many Texans are making "pronghorn" stew.
My dear Frogleg, I wasn't criticizing Wayne. Mammalian taxonomy is one of
the few things that I know something about. This gave me a chance to
contribute here whilst learning from others. Mr Durrell would certainly
approve! ;-)
Charlie
Frogleg
<taxi...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>"Frogleg" <fro...@nowhere.com> wrote
>> On Mon, 13 Oct 2003 09:57:11 GMT, "Charles Gifford"
>> <taxi...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>>
>> And someone called *me* an obsessive fuss-budget! :-) Given the
>> number of Antelope counties and towns, and states requiring "antelope"
>> hunting permits, let's give Wayne a break and acknowledge that while
>> the "Antelocapra americana" may not be the same critter as an African
>> antelope, not many Texans are making "pronghorn" stew.
>
>My dear Frogleg, I wasn't criticizing Wayne. Mammalian taxonomy is one of
>the few things that I know something about. This gave me a chance to
>contribute here whilst learning from others. Mr Durrell would certainly
>approve! ;-)
Aww, now you've hit one of my soft spots. RIP, Gerry. I *did* notice
that your post was informative, not critical. However, having hunted
(or at least been in the truck) around Magdalena, NM, what my
companions said they were after were "antelope." I do, however,
appreciate your exactitude. :-)
Nixon, D
"Charles Gifford" <taxi...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:XFuib.9187$dn6....@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net...
Oh yeah?? Well if that be true, tell me this-------------------- why would
"where the deer and the ANTELOPE play" be in the words of the
most popular song of the 20th Century !!!! ???? I'm talkin'
Home on the Range !
McDave
>
>
Douglas S. Ladden
Because songwriters (a) are ignorant, (b) take artistic license,
(c) couldn't get "goat antelopes" to fit into the rhythm and meter of
the song, or (d) didn't like the way "muskox" rolled off the tongue.
*grin*
--Douglas
Jack Sloan
"Douglas S. Ladden" <nospa...@nowayjose.org> wrote in message
news:Xns94198E48CE4FDd...@63.240.76.16...
> Nixon, D on 19 Oct 2003 suggested:
>
> >
> > "Charles Gifford" <taxi...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> > news:XFuib.9187$dn6....@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> >>
> >> "Wayne Lundberg" <Wayn...@example.invalid> wrote in message
> >> news:O0tdb.155842$0v4.11...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> >> >
> >> > The other comment is that, as far as I know, chili contains beef
> >> > and although deer and antelope were here long before the conquest,
> >>
> >> Just a gentle correction for anyone who cares. There have never been
> >> antelope in the Americas. You are probably refering to the pronghorn
> >> - "Antelocapra americana". It is not related to antelopes nor to any
> >> living animal. As the scientific name suggests, they are sometimes
> >> placed in a group of animals called "goat antelopes" although they
> >> are neither. Other animals in this group: chamois, saiga, takin and
> >> muskox. Other than the muskox and takin none are actually related.
> >>
> >> Charlie
> >
after shooting it for a wall mount. I also know they really like Oreo
cookies. I stopped somewhere on a fenceline around Post , Texas and fed
Oreos to a herd of these antelopes who stopped to look at me. Really pissed
my 2 little girls off bad...they wanted the cookies for themselves.
Jack
Charles Gifford
"Nixon, D" <n...@att.net> wrote in message
news:GSvkb.184501$0v4.14...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
But, but.....that's the same song that has non-existent buffalo roaming too!
<grin>
Charlie
Nixon, D
If they scarfed up on those Oreos, they were no doubt Melanesian MuskOxes.
Texans don't know any better. Most can't tell an antelope from an
anecdote.
They think MuskOx is a brand of perfume manufactured up in Oklahoma !!
McDave
>
>
Nixon, D
=============================================================
Well, one of those non-existent buffaloes tore the arm off a cousin of
mine when he was on a picnic in the Wichita Mountains of Oklahoma
in 1972. He was a native OKIE, a Warrant Officer in the U.S. Army
Artillery,
and should have know better than to wander among the herd in the
rutting season !! They did let him stay in the Army until his
retirement.
McDave
>
>
Nixon, D
"Douglas S. Ladden" <nospa...@nowayjose.org> wrote in message
news:Xns94198E48CE4FDd...@63.240.76.16...
Willie Nelson wrote the song----------------- Crazy.
Jack Sloan
Kack<G>
Jack Sloan
OK, I guess they couldda been takins 'cause they were sure takin' those
oreos.
Jack
David Wright
>
>"Charles Gifford" <taxi...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:XiMkb.4238$S52...@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>> But, but.....that's the same song that has non-existent buffalo roaming
>too!
>> <grin>
>>
>> Charlie
>
>=============================================================
>
>Well, one of those non-existent buffaloes tore the arm off a cousin of
>mine when he was on a picnic in the Wichita Mountains of Oklahoma
>in 1972. He was a native OKIE, a Warrant Officer in the U.S. Army
>Artillery,
>and should have know better than to wander among the herd in the
>rutting season !! They did let him stay in the Army until his
>retirement.
>
>McDave
I'm sure that what Charlie meant was that what many (most?) people in
the US call "buffalo" are really "bison." Think water buffalo or Cape
buffalo for the real thing. The song writer did get the "deer" part
right, but missed on the antelope (pronghorn) and buffalo (bison.)
David
Nixon, D
You're sure right about that.... particularly one who cain't
tell an Cantaloupe from a Antelope !!
McDave
Jim Lane
Poetic license.
jim
James A. Finley
No one has mentioned the Texas Jackalope.
Jim
Nixon, D
"James A. Finley" <finl...@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:vp8pu1r...@corp.supernews.com...
No, they haven't. But, I had one back in my OKIE days.
Actually, I bred it myself. Turned out to be a cross between a Jackass
and a Jack Rabbit. And, when it died, we used its skeleton for
a Jack-o-lantern.......
Saying of the Day------ "Always carry a small flask of whiskey in
case of snakebite.
Furthermore, always carry a small snake."
I guess I better quit this cross-posting. Many on this newsgroup get
all "quivvered up" when a guy cross posts! It's considered worse than
cross-dressing !
McDave, OKIE At Large
===========================================================
>
>
Frogleg
the late 70s/early 80s. The subject of ingredients, methods, and
authencities of chile/chilli/chilie has consistently been one of the
most prolific generators of discussion since then. There *is* no
original concept. Humans stew whatever's available together -- meat,
veg, grain -- whatever. In his original post, Wayne mentioned seeking
"old timer" recollection. Well, since capsicums of various sorts have
been grown and eaten in the Americas for thousands of years, a *real*
old timer might report "chile -- tasty!" Or rather "green thing tasty;
also good when red -- let's add to bean pot." It's sort of like
asking the "origin" of salting foods, or adding sweeteners.
Chili/chile/chilli isn't an invention. It's an evolution. Peppers must
surely have been one of the most welcome exports from the new world
(like tomatoes and potatoes) considering their rapid inclusion in
world cuisine.