Autobaun(sp?)
JamiJo
It's short but sweet -
"There are less car related deaths on the Autobaun then any road with a speed
limit."
All my friends quote that like it's a fact - their excuse for speeding on
regular freeways. Me, I say the slower the better. (That's why I think all
non-emergancy veicals should be equiped with a device to keep them from going
over 50 MPH. Cop cars, fire engines, etc, can go as fast as they please.)
~Jami JoAnne Russell~
http://users.50megs.com/gambitsgal/intro.html
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Portal/2450/jami1.html
http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=gambitsjami
David Nebenzahl
> Here's one I keep hearing that to me SCREAMS urban myth. But I could be wrong.
> It's short but sweet -
>
> "There are less car related deaths on the Autobaun then any road with a speed
> limit."
JamiJo, JamiJo: didn't you say you were a writer, some umpty-ump posts
back there?
They you ought to know that it's /fewer/ car-related deaths, not "less
... deaths".
D "Give me fewer butter on my toast" N
--
Life isn't fair, and that to bad, but people like you who whinn about
being percuted all the time actually make it worse for themselfs.
- RicSilver getting tongue-tied on ba.transportation
JamiJo
>back there?
>
>They you ought to know that it's /fewer/ car-related deaths, not "less
>... deaths".
Well, 1: I have never called myself a writer. My *friends* call me that. If you
look at my website it says "Jami's (Bad) Writing!" in the title and how I don't
believe I can write at all but my friends think I can. 2: I'm doing a direct
quote of my friends. They always say "There is less..." blah blah blah -
And before you say anything - they still think that the words a lot and a
little are suppose to be alot and alittle - and one spells believe and either
B-E-L-A-E-V-E and E-A-T-H-E-R. So they're not exactly english majors.
David Nebenzahl
> >JamiJo, JamiJo: didn't you say you were a writer, some umpty-ump posts
> >back there?
> >
> >They you ought to know that it's /fewer/ car-related deaths, not "less
> >... deaths".
>
> Well, 1: I have never called myself a writer. My *friends* call me that. If you
> look at my website it says "Jami's (Bad) Writing!" in the title and how I don't
> believe I can write at all but my friends think I can. 2: I'm doing a direct
> quote of my friends. They always say "There is less..." blah blah blah -
>
> And before you say anything - they still think that the words a lot and a
> little are suppose to be alot and alittle - and one spells believe and either
> B-E-L-A-E-V-E and E-A-T-H-E-R. So they're not exactly english majors.
Well, you might be surprised to hear that the friends one keeps actually
says a lot about a person.
D "As opposed too hear (a.f.u.) where misspellings are on porpoise" N
Andrew Reid
<20001121161310...@ng-fy1.aol.com>:
>Here's one I keep hearing that to me SCREAMS urban myth. But I could be
>wrong. It's short but sweet -
>
>"There are less car related deaths on the Autobaun then any road with a
>speed limit."
>
The folkloric version I have heard is that there are many
fewer *accidents* on the Autobahn, but almost every accident
is invariably fatal to all concerned. This is supposed to
support the notion that mixed-speed traffic leads to
accidents, but it's the speed, not the accidents, that
kill people.
Or something -- I'm having some trouble expressing it
clearly because I don't personally believe it, the starting
point of my doubts being that I don't think Autobahn traffic
is *uniformly* fast. I did look into this at one point,
and debunked "my" version to my own satisfaction, but
unfortunately didn't keep my notes.
Andrew "Zoom! *crunch*" Reid
David Nebenzahl
[stuff about Autobahn accidents]
> Andrew "Zoom! *crunch*" Reid
You left out the canonical sound of tires squealing:
"Zoom! Rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr! *crunch*"
D "Foley" N
Jack Ak
really gay themselves and won't admit it"; it's entirely plausible.
How about this? "We all know Al Gore got more votes in Florida
than his opponent and enough votes for him will be found in the
hand recounts to defeat the other guy, let's go ahead and select
the Gore Florida delegation to the Electoral College and stop
the hand recounts now."
jack "I read it in alt.folklore.urban, so it must be folklore" ak
"JamiJo" <gambit...@aol.comNOWAY> wrote in message news:20001121161310...@ng-fy1.aol.com...
> Here's one I keep hearing that to me SCREAMS urban myth. But I could be wrong.
> It's short but sweet -
>
> "There are less car related deaths on the Autobaun then any road with a speed
> limit."
>
> All my friends quote that like it's a fact - their excuse for speeding on
> regular freeways. Me, I say the slower the better. (That's why I think all
> non-emergancy veicals should be equiped with a device to keep them from going
> over 50 MPH. Cop cars, fire engines, etc, can go as fast as they please.)
>
Bruce Tindall
that would churn out, on demand, a children's book that was an allegory
to any given contemporary topical political situation.
B "We're off to see the wizard, the wonderful Wizard of Fla!" T
--
Today is the first day of the rest of the twentieth century.
Bruce Tindall :: tin...@panix.com
Mitcho
> The folkloric version I have heard is that there are many
> fewer *accidents* on the Autobahn, but almost every accident
> is invariably fatal to all concerned. This is supposed to
> support the notion that mixed-speed traffic leads to
> accidents, but it's the speed, not the accidents, that
> kill people.
Which is why the Autobahns are such an outrageous example. Most of
them are two lanes in either direction between cities: a high-speed
passing lane on the left, and a slow lane filled with trucks on the
right. They have always struck me as extraordinarily dangerous, with
lorries and Trabants (I'm dating myself here, but never mind - insert
the Fiat POS of your choice) putting along on the right at 90kph,
while maniacs in huge Mercedes sedans zoom by on the left at 200kph.
The danger is compounded when the ordinary motorist swishing along at
110kph has to change into the left lane to pass the slower traffic,
and a big Merc sedan instantly appears on his ass, flashing his
headlamps like a madman. Bloody intimidating.
No cite, but a few years ago I read a statistic that suggested Britain
has the best traffic safety record in Europe (if not the world), Italy
(or Greece?) the worst, with Germany somewhere in between. Personal
motoring experience in these countries confirms, for me, these
statistics. If Germany's safety record is better than France's, I
would have to put that down to Germany's more draconian drunk driving
laws (alliterative they are, too).
Mitcho
--
The Urban Redneck : red...@employees.org : Goat Hill, California
http://www.employees.org/~redneck
David Nebenzahl
[...]
> ... If Germany's safety record is better than France's, I
> would have to put that down to Germany's more draconian drunk driving
> laws (alliterative they are, too).
I know both Hungary and Bulgaria have zero-blood-alcohol tolerances, so
I wonder how widespread this is in Eastern Europe and in Europe in
general.
David Nebenzahl
>
> >Well, you might be surprised to hear that the friends one keeps actually
> >says a lot about a person.
>
> say.
You mean "per se" per haps?
That reminds me of the ditty:
'Twas the pig fair last September, the day I well remember,
I was walking up and down in drunken pride.
When my knees began to flutter, and I fell down in the gutter,
And a pig came up and laid down by my side.
As I lay there in the gutter, thinking thoughts I could not utter,
I thought I heard a passing lady say,
"You can tell the man who boozes by the company he chooses.",
And with that the pig got up and walked away.
> After all, I hang around you guys.
>
> Now what do you suppose *that* says?
Um, you're not supposed to bring that up.
KD
"JamiJo" <gambit...@aol.comNOWAY> wrote in message
There was recently an article in Car and Driver (going on memory here, I
don't have a copy of the mag -- read elsewhere) that pointed out that the
accident rate on the Autobahn (sp?) is lower than on US highways.
Significantly. Even though the speeds traveled there are higher.
The article made the point that one of the main differences is that on the
Autobahn, the "stay to the right except when passing" rule is strictly
adhered to. Well, plus a higher percentage of German-made cars, I would
assume.
Regarding a marginal increase in death rates at higher speeds -- think about
it. You're going 75 or 90 and you crash -- I think you die either way. The
vast majority of the time.
I think most auto deaths (based on driver miles) occur at lower speeds and
not on Interstate highways. I have no cite for that -- just a dusty old
memory floating around in my brain.
-KD
Mitcho
> > ... If Germany's safety record is better than France's, I
> > would have to put that down to Germany's more draconian drunk driving
> > laws (alliterative they are, too).
>
> I know both Hungary and Bulgaria have zero-blood-alcohol tolerances, so
> I wonder how widespread this is in Eastern Europe and in Europe in
> general.
I have some great apocryphal stories from the early nineties. Whereas
in Germany the cops (those cuties in the green leathers) drag the
drunk driver over to a ditch and kick him to death, a Belgian friend
of mine swears on his mother's honor (for whatever that is worth with
a Belgian) that he was riding with a friend who was so polluted he
fell out of the car when the Rijkswacht (Gendarmerie) pulled him over.
They allegedly told him he was too drunk to be out driving, whereupon
they bundled him back into his car and sent him driving home. Then
there is the common sight of ratfaced Rijkswacht staggering out of a
pub in the middle of the day to climb into their patrol car to answer
an emergency call. Similar stories abound in France, though I
understand the authorities are getting a lot more serious about drunk
driving these days (take that however you will).
JamiJo
>says a lot about a person.
I thought the saying was "the company one keeps" - not nessasarily friends per
say.
After all, I hang around you guys.
Now what do you suppose *that* says?
And obviously I'm not the best speller, but I do remember little things like a
lot and a little are not all one word. (But despite the constant misspellings
and improper english the people I hang with are, all in all, a good group - if
a little perverted. I use to be sweet and innocent before I met them.
Honestly.)
Ragnar
> Here's one I keep hearing that to me SCREAMS urban myth. But I could be
wrong.
> It's short but sweet -
>
> "There are less car related deaths on the Autobaun then any road with a
speed
> limit."
>
Once again, someone must step in and do basic research for JamiJo.
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/gm.html
http://www.statistik-bund.de/presse/englisch/pm/p0063191.htm
Where I find that Germany has approx 82 million people using approx 650,000
km of roads in a country of approx 357,000 sq km where they managed to kill
7,749 people in 1999.
Looking up US stuff, I went to:
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/index.html
http://www.abcnews.go.com/sections/us/dailynews/highway000403.html
Where I found that a country of approx 275 million people using approx
6,350,000 km of roads in a country of approx 9,600,000 sq km managed to kill
41,375 people.
I don't feel like doing actual statistical analysis, but:
The USA is approx 30 times bigger than Germany and has approx 10 times the
amount of roads yet only has 6 times as many highway deaths.
Looks like Germany is a veritable death trap compared to the US.
Consider yet another JamiJo fevered hallucination laid to rest.
Ragnar
Maggie Newman
>Frankly, I thought the AutoBaun was an early-20th-century machine
>that would churn out, on demand, a children's book that was an allegory
>to any given contemporary topical political situation.
>
No, sweetie, you've mipsleed "AutoBaum."
Maggie "hope this hleps" Newman
Bill Heyman
>
> rei...@bellatlantic.net (Andrew Reid) wrote:
> > The folkloric version I have heard is that there are many
> > fewer *accidents* on the Autobahn, but almost every accident
> > is invariably fatal to all concerned.
>
> Which is why the Autobahns are such an outrageous example.
http://www.ibiblio.org/rdu/nhtsalie.html
NHTSA Admits Faulty Statistics for Autobahn
News From the Michigan Chapter of the National Motorists Association
For Immediate Release -- June 5, 1996
In an effort to stop state lawmakers from raising speed limits after the
repeal of the federal speed limit law, the National Highway
Traffic Safety Administration issued a document claiming that the
Autobahn fatality rate is six times higher than that of U.S. Interstate
highways. After months of pressure and inquiries by the National
Motorists Association, NHTSA head Ricardo Martinez has admitted
that the autobahn statistic published in NHTSA's State Legislative Fact
Sheet - Speed came largely from highways in the former East
Germany rather than just the western autobahns most people associate
with high-speed travel.
A report by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety shows the
fatality rate on the western autobahn has been virtually identical to
the death rates on U.S. Interstates for over ten years.
Tony Sweeney
> gambit...@aol.comNOWAY (JamiJo) wrote in
> <20001121161310...@ng-fy1.aol.com>:
>
> >Here's one I keep hearing that to me SCREAMS urban myth. But I could be
> >wrong. It's short but sweet -
> >
> >"There are less car related deaths on the Autobaun then any road with a
> >speed limit."
> >
> The folkloric version I have heard is that there are many
> fewer *accidents* on the Autobahn, but almost every accident
> is invariably fatal to all concerned. This is supposed to
> support the notion that mixed-speed traffic leads to
> accidents, but it's the speed, not the accidents, that
> kill people.
>
> Or something -- I'm having some trouble expressing it
> clearly because I don't personally believe it, the starting
> point of my doubts being that I don't think Autobahn traffic
> is *uniformly* fast. I did look into this at one point,
> and debunked "my" version to my own satisfaction, but
> unfortunately didn't keep my notes.
>
> Andrew "Zoom! *crunch*" Reid
The way I heard it (tm) is that Autobahn collisions tend to involve many
more vehicles in occasional massive multiple-vehicle clusterfucks compared
with the US freeway system. Certainly, the traffic reports I hear here in
the bay area indicate many more commute collisions than I used to have to
count on in London (UK) regional traffic, but usually involving only small
numbers of vehicles. I went to school with someone that was a passenger in
a car that got caught in a 138 vehicle pileup on the Autobahn. This drifts
German collision stats up there with the 'Merkins.
Tony.
Sebastian Weimer
> The USA is approx 30 times bigger than Germany and has approx 10 times the
> amount of roads yet only has 6 times as many highway deaths.
>
> Looks like Germany is a veritable death trap compared to the US.
>
> Consider yet another JamiJo fevered hallucination laid to rest.
>
> Ragnar
..or read it different
only 3.5 times as many people in the us and 10 times the amount of road
(less potential accidents) but 6 times as many as many deadly accidents
The USA must be a death trap ;)
cnr Sebastian
Viv
:"JamiJo" <gambit...@aol.comNOWAY> wrote in message
:news:20001121161310...@ng-fy1.aol.com...
:> Here's one I keep hearing that to me SCREAMS urban myth. But I could be
:wrong.
:> It's short but sweet -
:>
:> "There are less car related deaths on the Autobaun then any road with a
:> speed limit."
:>
:
:Once again, someone must step in and do basic research for JamiJo.
:
:http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/gm.html
:http://www.statistik-bund.de/presse/englisch/pm/p0063191.htm
:
:Where I find that Germany has approx 82 million people using approx 650,000
:km of roads in a country of approx 357,000 sq km where they managed to kill
:7,749 people in 1999.
ie highways death rate of 0.0000945 per capita or approx 1 in 10,000
:Looking up US stuff, I went to:
:
:http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/index.html
:http://www.abcnews.go.com/sections/us/dailynews/highway000403.html
:
:Where I found that a country of approx 275 million people using approx
:6,350,000 km of roads in a country of approx 9,600,000 sq km managed to kill
:41,375 people.
ie highways death rate of 0.001504545 per capita or approx 3 in 2,000
:I don't feel like doing actual statistical analysis,
Maybe it would have been a good idea?
:but:
The difference in motor vehicle death rate per capita is an order of
magnitude. It's a BIG difference.
:The USA is approx 30 times bigger than Germany and has approx 10 times the
:amount of roads yet only has 6 times as many highway deaths.
And yet the figures show me that a town of 10,000 people in Germany
will likely average only one funeral per year for a highway death,
whereas a town of 10,000 in the USA will likely average 15 funerals a
year for highway deaths.
:Looks like Germany is a veritable death trap compared to the US.
As usual, it depends on how you look at the statistics.
:Consider yet another JamiJo fevered hallucination laid to rest.
Or not.
Of course, one ought to look closely at possible confounding variables
before concluding that any difference is due merely to speed limit
laws.
Vivienne "booze, journey patterns, alien abductions" Smythe
--
An eye for an eye finishes up with more severed eyeballs
than anyone's really got a legitimate use for.
(Phil Edwards expresses his lack of appetite for
neverending rebuttals)
Cindy Kandolf
| Here's one I keep hearing that to me SCREAMS urban myth. But I could be wrong.
| It's short but sweet -
|
| "There are less car related deaths on the Autobaun then any road with a speed
| limit."
Perhaps if you spelled it correctly you'd have an easier time finding
information. It's Autobahn.
I thought that the canonical version of this factoid was that there
were fewer accidents, but when they occured they were more likely to
be multi-car pile-ups. I have no idea if that's true either.
However, if this is really so important to you, i would suggest you
ask your friends to back up their claims. You really want to see
figures on accidents per miles driven, though accidents per capita
might be close enough for your purposes... and bear in mind that
figures for Germany in general will include all driving, most of which
will not be done on Autobahn-quality roads.
| All my friends quote that like it's a fact - their excuse for speeding on
| regular freeways. Me, I say the slower the better. (That's why I think all
| non-emergancy veicals should be equiped with a device to keep them from going
| over 50 MPH. Cop cars, fire engines, etc, can go as fast as they please.)
*sigh* Wouldn't it be great if the real world were even half this simple?
- Cindy Kandolf, certified language mechanic, mamma flodnak
flodmail: thefl...@ivillage.com flodhome: Bærum, Norway
flodweb: http://www.flodnak.com/
John Schmitt
gambit...@aol.comNOWAY (JamiJo) writes:
>"There are less car related deaths on the Autobaun then any road with a speed
>limit."
The mathematics behind this are simple. The accident statistics are expressed
in deaths per kilometer or a multiple thereof. At 60 kph, a car is on that
kilometer for an entire *minute*. At 120 kph, the car is on that kilometer for
a mere thirty seconds. If you can drive at 240 kph, you reduce your residency
in that kilometer to 15 seconds. As it takes a finite time to be involved in a
fatal crash, the less time you spend in that kilometer of road, the safer you
are. In London the traffic speeds are very low, and it can sometimes take ten
minutes or more to pass along that kilometer of road, raising the risks
enourmously. This is why it is almost unheard of to see London drivers smiling.
John "keywords" Schmitt
--
It's half and half. Sometimes they're lying, sometimes they don't know what's
happening. - Vladimir Urban on the Russian submarine 'Kursk' crisis.
I've got a disclaimer, and I ain't afraid to use it.
Thomas Prufer
wrote:
>The mathematics behind this are simple. The accident statistics are expressed
>in deaths per kilometer or a multiple thereof. At 60 kph, a car is on that
>kilometer for an entire *minute*. At 120 kph, the car is on that kilometer for
>a mere thirty seconds. If you can drive at 240 kph, you reduce your residency
>in that kilometer to 15 seconds. As it takes a finite time to be involved in a
>fatal crash, the less time you spend in that kilometer of road, the safer you
>are. In London the traffic speeds are very low, and it can sometimes take ten
>minutes or more to pass along that kilometer of road, raising the risks
>enourmously. This is why it is almost unheard of to see London drivers smiling.
A man named Bernoulli formulated a law which clearly states this: if,
for example, two lanes of traffic merge into one, the automobiles
should travel twice as fast. Since the speed limits punish anyone
adhering to this law (and it is a natural law, a law of physics, and
hence beyond and above any legislature), I don't think we need to look
any further as to why accidents happen and London drivers don't smile.
Thomas "Royal Coachman and all that" Prufer
Taran
gambit...@aol.comNOWAY (JamiJo) wrote:
> >Well, you might be surprised to hear that the friends one keeps
actually
> >says a lot about a person.
>
> I thought the saying was "the company one keeps" - not nessasarily
friends per
> say.
>
> After all, I hang around you guys.
>
> Now what do you suppose *that* says?
It says you're a tireless little pest who keeps following us around
even after we've told you a zillion times to go away.
Please go away. Or at least shut up.
Taran
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
JTM
"Mitcho" <red...@employees.org> wrote in message
news:022m1tgp2ddu2u2k6...@4ax.com...
> rei...@bellatlantic.net (Andrew Reid) wrote:
<snip>
> No cite, but a few years ago I read a statistic that suggested Britain
> has the best traffic safety record in Europe (if not the world), Italy
> (or Greece?) the worst, with Germany somewhere in between. Personal
> motoring experience in these countries confirms, for me, these
> would have to put that down to Germany's more draconian drunk driving
> laws (alliterative they are, too).
A 1995 FWHA study on speed management indicates that the German accident
rate per vehicle-km was slightly higher than the US rate. The Autobahn does
have a slightly lower fatality rate compared to the Interstate, which may be
attributable to the restrictions on weekend commercial traffic on the
Autobahn. When a truck and car collide the chances of fatalities are
increased several times over collisions between similar weighted vehicles.
The Netherlands have the lowest rate in Europe which they achieve by
deliberately obstructing traffic with artificial lane narrowing, round
abouts, rumble strips and so on. In a small compact country having to
travel slower is much less of an inconvenience than in the US.
Dave Wilton
>The difference in motor vehicle death rate per capita is an order of
>magnitude. It's a BIG difference.
>
>:The USA is approx 30 times bigger than Germany and has approx 10 times the
>:amount of roads yet only has 6 times as many highway deaths.
>
>And yet the figures show me that a town of 10,000 people in Germany
>will likely average only one funeral per year for a highway death,
>whereas a town of 10,000 in the USA will likely average 15 funerals a
>year for highway deaths.
>
>:Looks like Germany is a veritable death trap compared to the US.
>
>As usual, it depends on how you look at the statistics.
Absolutely, and no one has posted the data necessary to evaluate the
question properly. What is needed is the accident rate per
passenger-mile and the fatalities per passenger-mile in both
countries. It would also help to separate out accidents on the
autobahn/interstate from other accidents.
Simply counting fatalities won't do. Germany has fewer per capita
highway deaths, but is this because the highways are safer or because
they drive fewer miles?
--Dave Wilton
da...@wilton.net
http://www.wilton.net
David Nebenzahl
Hmm. Maybe a better comparison would be between Der Autobahn and 1-5 in
the Central Valley[1].
During heavy tule-fog weather.
[1] The "Fruit basket of America": California's agricultural heartland
'twixt coast and Sierra Nevada. Also home to more rednecks than you can
shake a stick at. (Lotsa Armenians, too.)
Karen J. Cravens
<3a1cff8c....@news.dnai.com>:
>Absolutely, and no one has posted the data necessary to evaluate the
>question properly. What is needed is the accident rate per
>passenger-mile and the fatalities per passenger-mile in both
>countries. It would also help to separate out accidents on the
>autobahn/interstate from other accidents.
>
>Simply counting fatalities won't do. Germany has fewer per capita
>highway deaths, but is this because the highways are safer or because
>they drive fewer miles?
And don't forget, a higher fatality rate means a lower repeat-offender
rate...
--
Karen "than a higher offender bender rate, I suppose" Cravens
Jack Ak
in the middle of intersections. These landscaped circles were
probably the same as the "round abouts".
A winter time afternoon activity was watching cars slide and bounce
off the adjacent curbs. Sometimes the tires came off the rim and
we offered our assistance to help mount the spare. Personal
service tips were sometimes offered. . o )
jack
"JTM" <c...@j.com> wrote in message news:WQSS5.4065$2s1.3...@bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
<...>
> The Netherlands have the lowest rate in Europe which they achieve by
> deliberately obstructing traffic with artificial lane narrowing, round
> abouts, rumble strips and so on. In a small compact country having to
> travel slower is much less of an inconvenience than in the US.
<...>
Joseph M. Shair
gambit...@aol.comNOWAY says...
~Here's one I keep hearing that to me SCREAMS urban myth. But I could be wrong.
~It's short but sweet -
~
~"There are less car related deaths on the Autobaun then any road with a speed
~limit."
~
~All my friends quote that like it's a fact - their excuse for speeding on
~regular freeways. Me, I say the slower the better. (That's why I think all
~non-emergancy veicals should be equiped with a device to keep them from going
~over 50 MPH. Cop cars, fire engines, etc, can go as fast as they please.)
But at 50 MPH, accidents are still frequently fatal.
Imagine the savings in life if the limit were 20 MPH
instead. Even then, though, a few accidents would
have fatal consequences, so a 5 MPH limit would be
more suitable. Unfortunately, a heavy automobile
hitting a pedestrian even at 5 MPH can have
disastrous consequences, so the obvious solution is
to limit the mass of vehicles (excluding the ones
you mentioned above) to 100 lbs. or so.
Or possibly one could set up regulations that require
a person to know how to drive before getting a license.
Joe "Hot button -- Me?" Shair
--
Identifying successful bait for future trolls...
Bob Beck
[snippage]
: The Netherlands have the lowest rate in Europe which they achieve by
: deliberately obstructing traffic with artificial lane narrowing, round
: abouts, rumble strips and so on. In a small compact country having to
: travel slower is much less of an inconvenience than in the US.
I was amused to learn, (mumble) years ago, that Golden Earring of "Radar
Love" fame ("I've been driving all night, my hands are wet on the
wheel") was a Dutch band. Not that I've driven in Europe, but I figured if
you drove all night in the Netherlands you'd end up in Marseilles or
someplace.
Bob "if this is Tuesday..." Beck
Hairy One Kenobi
news:3a1cff8c....@news.dnai.com...
> Simply counting fatalities won't do. Germany has fewer per capita
> highway deaths, but is this because the highways are safer or because
> they drive fewer miles?
Dang. And I was about to suggest that the Moon was the safest place to
drive.. a handful of drivers, only there for three days at a time, and no
fender-benders. Can't work out the stats, as I'm not sure what zero divided
by [insert number of choice] would work out to statistically...
--
Hairy One Kenobi
Disclaimer: the opinions expressed in this opinion do not necessarily
reflect the opinions of the highly-opinionated person expressing the opinion
in the first place. So there!
Hairy One Kenobi
"Thomas Prufer" <pru...@i-dial.de> wrote in message
news:90mn1tki5onf8010l...@4ax.com...
> A man named Bernoulli formulated a law which clearly states this: if,
> for example, two lanes of traffic merge into one, the automobiles
> should travel twice as fast. Since the speed limits punish anyone
> adhering to this law (and it is a natural law, a law of physics, and
> hence beyond and above any legislature), I don't think we need to look
> any further as to why accidents happen and London drivers don't smile.
Nah. It's not the speed, it's the increased pressure..
Thomas Prufer
>
>The Netherlands have the lowest rate in Europe which they achieve by
>deliberately obstructing traffic with artificial lane narrowing, round
>abouts, rumble strips and so on. In a small compact country having to
>travel slower is much less of an inconvenience than in the US.
Is the speed limit in the Netherlands really lower than in the US? I
really doubt it...
55 mph is 88 kilometers per hour; even trucks are allowed to go 62 mph
(100 km/h) on the Autobahn in Germany. And I'm pretty sure in the
Netherlands, the speed limit for passenger cars is higher than
100km/h.
Thomas Prufer
Karen J. Cravens
<enip1tol7hpc011hh...@4ax.com>:
>Is the speed limit in the Netherlands really lower than in the US? I
>really doubt it...
>
>55 mph is 88 kilometers per hour; even trucks are allowed to go 62 mph
>(100 km/h) on the Autobahn in Germany. And I'm pretty sure in the
>Netherlands, the speed limit for passenger cars is higher than
>100km/h.
Good grief. I am shocked, simply shocked, that you furriners don't keep up
with current events here in the US. 55mph speed limit got repealed awhile
back. It's back to a state-by-state thing (I assume); you can do 75 in
Oklahoma, and 70 in Kansas. Used to be there was no daytime limit on
certain roads in Montana, but I think they got tired of idjits with
testosterone-mobiles coming up to try them out, and getting themselves
killed in the process. (One should not jump from 75 mph to 150 without
practicing.)
--
Karen "'70 in Kansas' is *not* an interstate hwy # reference" Cravens
Bill Kinkaid
wrote:
>
>A man named Bernoulli formulated a law which clearly states this: if,
>for example, two lanes of traffic merge into one, the automobiles
>should travel twice as fast. Since the speed limits punish anyone
>adhering to this law (and it is a natural law, a law of physics, and
>hence beyond and above any legislature), I don't think we need to look
>any further as to why accidents happen and London drivers don't smile.
>
Bernoulli's Law governs fluids, doesn't it? Traffic, being made up of
large bits of metal, glass and assorted other stuff, is not a fluid.
Bill in Vancouver
Seeg file? We don't need no steenking seeg file!
Yehuda Naveh
Actually, the distinction is even finer: Bernoulli's law governs
*incompressible* fluids. Traffic, to a very good approximation, is a
*highly compressible* fluid.
Yehuda
Cap'n Twill
Not even I-70?
Of course, that's probably your point, so I'll just stand over there now.
Thomas Prufer
Though that's unfair, Mr Schmitt's been chumming upstream.
Thomas Prufer
Thomas Prufer
Cravens) wrote:
>Good grief. I am shocked, simply shocked, that you furriners don't keep up
>with current events here in the US. 55mph speed limit got repealed awhile
>back. It's back to a state-by-state thing (I assume); you can do 75 in
>Oklahoma, and 70 in Kansas. Used to be there was no daytime limit on
>certain roads in Montana, but I think they got tired of idjits with
>testosterone-mobiles coming up to try them out, and getting themselves
>killed in the process.
Yup, Virginia's got a 65 mph limit on the interstate. So the folks all
drive at 75-80 mph. But then my father-in-law's here in Germany got an
old Jetta diesel with near 300,000 kilometers on it, and he can't
drive it faster than 100 mph because the M+S (mud & snow?) tires are
only rated to that. And a friend of mine, again in Germany, had a
fully street-legal motorcycle[1] that was clocked at 157 mph, and was
nippy getting up there. Otherwise, he was quite rational, though "the
muscles of his arms were strong as iron bands".
> (One should not jump from 75 mph to 150 without practicing.)
I'd be scared of jumping even a moderate 55 mph.
Thomas Prufer
[1] and the inspections in Germany are *really* tough
Cindy Kandolf
| I know both Hungary and Bulgaria have zero-blood-alcohol tolerances, so
| I wonder how widespread this is in Eastern Europe and in Europe in
| general.
Hmm. Scandinavian drunk driving laws are supposed to be particularly
strict, but i think that's as much because of the punishments as
because of the blood-alcohol limits. Norwegian law has recently been
changed, so 2 parts per thousand is now the legal limit. Before that
it was 5 parts per thousand. The old rule wasn't particularly strict
by European standards. But if you get caught, the punishment for the
first offense is usually three weeks imprisonment.
Alastair Rae
<n...@microtech.com> wrote:
>[...]
>I know both Hungary and Bulgaria have zero-blood-alcohol tolerances, so
>I wonder how widespread this is in Eastern Europe and in Europe in
>general.
I believe zero blood alcohol is impossible. Something to do with
fermentation in the stomach. A figure of "equivalent to half a pint of
beer" emerges from the fuzzy morass that is my memory.
--
Alastair Rae, London, Europe.
Remove NOSPAM from my email address to reply.
My opinions are not necessarily those of my employers.
Lara Hopkins
> I believe zero blood alcohol is impossible. Something to do with
> fermentation in the stomach. A figure of "equivalent to half a pint of
> beer" emerges from the fuzzy morass that is my memory.
Does this count as a wild sighting?
Driving under the Influence of Pasta
Impossible.
"Innocent" man is repeatedly arrested for drunkenness, but claims not to
drink; turns out he has a "mutant yeast" in his stomach which ferments
ingested carbohydrates into alcohol.
Another "grain of truth" UL. Yeasts do ferment carbohydrates into
ethanol; that's how beer and wine are made. Traces of ethanol have been
detected people's stomachs, and levels are higher in those on
acid-supressing medication, presumably because acid suppresses yeast
growth (Bode, Rust and Bode, 1984[1]). However, the levels of ethanol
measured would equate to around one percent of one standard drin -
nowhere near enough to put someone over the limit, or even make them
tipsy.
Lara
[1]Scand J Gastroenterol 1984 Sep;19(6):853-6 Related Articles, Books
"The effect of cimetidine treatment on ethanol formation in the human
stomach."
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov:80/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&
list_uids=6515321&dopt=Abstract
John Schmitt
Thomas Prufer <pru...@i-dial.de> writes:
>Caught me two.
>Though that's unfair, Mr Schmitt's been chumming upstream.
Sorry about that. I thought that my followup to our resident airhead was
sufficiently egregious to only mesmerise the truly gullible. This was
compounded by the fact that while I specifically instructed newsrdr "rep/keyw =
troll" it did not in fact, put the keyword in the header. Bummer. Hence the
internym not providing a clue.
John "2-4-6-8 Motorway" Schmitt
Karen J. Cravens
>> Karen "'70 in Kansas' is *not* an interstate hwy # reference" Cravens
>
>Not even I-70?
>
>Of course, that's probably your point, so I'll just stand over there now.
It was, and we are *not* going to go there.
--
Karen "especially this weekend, it's too crowded" Cravens
David Lesher
>"JamiJo" <gambit...@aol.comNOWAY> wrote in message
>Regarding a marginal increase in death rates at higher speeds -- think about
>it. You're going 75 or 90 and you crash -- I think you die either way. The
>vast majority of the time.
NOVA recently had highly impressive meterage from an Autobaun camera.
A large Benz convertible going approx 200KPH lost control, bounced
off a guardrail or two, flipped over, slid a LONG way upside down,
hit the berm/ditch, flipped back to right side up and stopped.
The impressive part? The door then opened and the driver walked up
the berm to sit down.
--
A host is a host from coast to coast.................wb8foz@nrk.com
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433
David Lesher
>Regarding a marginal increase in death rates at higher speeds -- think about
>it. You're going 75 or 90 and you crash -- I think you die either way. The
>vast majority of the time.
NOVA recently had highly impressive meterage from an Autobahn camera.
Casady
wrote:
>Perhaps you will be surprised to learn that carburetors can't
>and don't compress liquids.
Sure they do. They have to obey the laws of physics. Hint: what
is the speed of sound in gasoline? And don't claim it can't make
a difference in real life. It can.
>j. ak
A top poster. Obviously clue challenged. One clue: you put your
comments at the bottom of a newsgroup post so that the entire
world can have a chance to review that bitty part of 300 odd posts
per day, AFU only,[ the Navy is just as busy, i.e. SNM]. Email on
the other hand, should usually have the reply on top, on the
assumption that the reader knows who you are and what you are
addressing. So you _can_ leave all kinds of stuff dangling from the
bottom of your email, for reference, your own, or theirs. So we have
a newbie. Or some kind of chump. This is AFU, where top posting is
regarded as a sign of stupidity.
"David Hatunen" <hat...@bolt.sonic.net> wrote in message
news:JXxT5.789$Y3.3...@typhoon.sonic.net...
>> In article <Pine.GSO.4.21.00112...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu>,
>> Yehuda Naveh <yen...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu> wrote:
>> >On Fri, 24 Nov 2000, Bill Kinkaid wrote:
>> >
>> >> Bernoulli's Law governs fluids, doesn't it? Traffic, being made
>> >> up of large bits of metal, glass and assorted other stuff, is
>> >> not a fluid.
That doesn't follow, actually. Ever hear the phrase ' flow of
traffic' ? It actually has meaning in real life.
>> >Actually, the distinction is even finer: Bernoulli's law governs
>> >*incompressible* fluids.
Well actually:
Non ausus suissem serenissimo nomini tuohydrodtnamicam hane
inscribere, nisi illa Academiae Scientiarum.....
[snip a shitload, pages of it, chapters...]
and then there is there is chapter ten, titled [in translation]:
Concerning Properties and Motions of Elastic Fluids, but especially
of Air.
[Snip]
Are there any jive chumps out there that haven't heard the phrase:
'Read the Fucking Book' ? I thought so.
Daniel Bernoulli
>> Oh, dear. The carburetor in my car will be terribly disappointed to
>> find out that it can't do what it is doing.
You poor bastard. I didn't know that carbs that ran windows existed.
That shit is always disappointed, and disappointing. Yes Dave, I
know, you happen to be geek enough to use something else. More
power to you. Fuckin neurotic software that obeys the laws of
physics but has to have 'feelings', consisting mostly, I am sure, of
' I am madly in love with Murphy, who deserves to rule absolutely'.
All kidding aside, I been hearing all my life that carbs run by the
gospel according to Bernoulli, [there were two, Johann was the
father], and I'd tend to take a successful physics teacher's word
on
it, had I not already been hearing it for about forty years. All the
refs agree, if you read them all; picking out bits to misread is
easier, faster at any rate. It takes decades to spend decades
reading refs, but I digress.
My copy of bernoulli, combined edition, Johann, Hydraulics, and
Daniel, Hydrodynamics only cost me two bucks used. 1968 Dover
Press, Translated Thomas Carmody, and Helmut Kobus.
Casady
Casady
Hatunen) wrote:
>In article <6oET5.13611$6W1.7...@news.flash.net>,
>Jack Ak <akj...@excite.com> wrote:
>
>>"David Hatunen" <hat...@bolt.sonic.net> wrote in message
>>news:JXxT5.789$Y3.3...@typhoon.sonic.net...
>>> In article <Pine.GSO.4.21.00112...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu>,
>>> Yehuda Naveh <yen...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu> wrote:
>>> Oh, dear. The carburetor in my car will be terribly disappointed to
>>> find out that it can't do what it is doing.
>
>>Perhaps you will be surprised to learn that carburetors can't
>>and don't compress liquids.
>
>No perhaps about it, though, that you're going to be surprised
>that you haven't the foggiest as to the difference between a fluid
>and a liguid.
Now zee liguid. I varned you that vee haf vays. Orderly, prepare
zee liguid, and vee vill...{snipped, ask Alston for ideas...]
Casady
Lee Ayrton
On Fri, 24 Nov 2000, Yehuda Naveh wrote:
> > Bernoulli's Law governs fluids, doesn't it? Traffic, being made up of
> > large bits of metal, glass and assorted other stuff, is not a fluid.
>
> Actually, the distinction is even finer: Bernoulli's law governs
> *incompressible* fluids. Traffic, to a very good approximation, is a
> *highly compressible* fluid.
Syncronicity in action: There's an article in the December 2000 issue of
ATLANTIC MONTHLY entitled "The Physics of Gridlock." It discusses the
application of certain models of gas flow to traffic studies, as
performed by "several German theoretical physicists."
The article doesn't mention if they travel the Autobahn on the way to the
lab.
David Hatunen
Oh, dear. The carburetor in my car will be terribly disappointed to
find out that it can't do what it is doing.
--
********** DAVE HATUNEN (hat...@sonic.net) ***********
* Daly City California *
******* My typos are intentional copyright traps ******
Charles A Lieberman
Andrew Reid
>>"There are less car related deaths on the Autobaun then any road with a
>>
> The folkloric version I have heard is that there are many
>fewer *accidents* on the Autobahn, but almost every accident
>is invariably fatal to all concerned.
You don't understand. The factoid is that the *number* of accidents is
proportional, they just aren't as important.
Charles "Less calories" Lieberman
--
Charles A. Lieberman | "You can't just, on a whim, pull out more
Brooklyn, New York, USA | siblings." --Meredith Robbins
http://calieber.tripod.com/home.html
No relation.
Jack Ak
and don't compress liquids.
j. ak
"David Hatunen" <hat...@bolt.sonic.net> wrote in message news:JXxT5.789$Y3.3...@typhoon.sonic.net...
David Hatunen
>"David Hatunen" <hat...@bolt.sonic.net> wrote in message
>news:JXxT5.789$Y3.3...@typhoon.sonic.net...
>> In article <Pine.GSO.4.21.00112...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu>,
>> Yehuda Naveh <yen...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu> wrote:
>> >On Fri, 24 Nov 2000, Bill Kinkaid wrote:
>> >
>> >> Bernoulli's Law governs fluids, doesn't it? Traffic, being made
>> >> up of large bits of metal, glass and assorted other stuff, is
>> >> not a fluid.
>> >
>> >Actually, the distinction is even finer: Bernoulli's law governs
>> >*incompressible* fluids.
>>
>> Oh, dear. The carburetor in my car will be terribly disappointed to
>> find out that it can't do what it is doing.
>Perhaps you will be surprised to learn that carburetors can't
>and don't compress liquids.
No perhaps about it, though, that you're going to be surprised
that you haven't the foggiest as to the difference between a fluid
and a liguid.
--
Robert Alston
"Casady" <rca...@uswest.net> wrote in message
news:2mhu1to1vcpdbolai...@4ax.com...
> zee liguid, and vee vill...{snipped, ask Alston for ideas...]
Here I was minding my own business (and you have no need to know that
business) when up pops my name. You have no idea how much this
disturbed me. Of course it disturbed my current, uh, client, yeah that
is the word, client, more than it disturbed me.
For information on how to use the liquid remit two-fifty (plus lots of
cash for helicopter fuel) and the standard release of liability to :
Janitorial Services
1 AFU Plaza
NY, NY 10001
Once you have done that and I have received same then you can be
instructed in the use of zee liquid. How much good that info will do
you I have no idea.
Robert "You can't miss me, I'll be the guy in the black helicopter"
Alston
Cap'n Twill
> >
> >
> >Of course, that's probably your point, so I'll just stand over there now.
>
> It was, and we are *not* going to go there.
>
> --
> Karen "especially this weekend, it's too crowded" Cravens
I take it you aren't a fan of toll roads.
Thomas Prufer
>NOVA recently had highly impressive meterage from an Autobahn camera.
>A large Benz convertible going approx 200KPH lost control, bounced
>off a guardrail or two, flipped over, slid a LONG way upside down,
>hit the berm/ditch, flipped back to right side up and stopped.
Seen that happen with my own eyes on the Autobahn. Car going 170-180
km/h, snow tires not rated for it, rear tire disintegrates, tears off
bumper, bumper swings around under car, loss of control, skid, flip,
slam over the ditch: Three passengers survived this with minor cuts
and scratches, and not in a Mercedes either. One a kid, and the kid
not wearing a seat belt. Not much traffic, or someone would have
plowed into him as he skidded across three lanes... Biggest danger was
the driver wandering around in shock later -- he could have easily
stepped into traffic. We tried to keep him sitting down, but couldn't,
until a doctor came around and did this authority-exuding thing that
worked. We'd assumed he was rational, which he wasn't under the
circumstances.
Going from memory, most big fatal accidents on the Autobahn are
pileups where cars hit the end of a standing column in a fog, or truck
drivers falling asleep causing mayhem. Mechanical logs showing speed
over time are mandatory in trucks, and they are checked to see that
rest periods and maximum driving times are complied with. They quite
frequently are not.
Thomas Prufer
Yehuda Naveh
> In article <Pine.GSO.4.21.00112...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu>,
> Yehuda Naveh <yen...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu> wrote:
> >On Fri, 24 Nov 2000, Bill Kinkaid wrote:
> >
> >> Bernoulli's Law governs fluids, doesn't it? Traffic, being made
> >> up of large bits of metal, glass and assorted other stuff, is
> >> not a fluid.
> >
> >Actually, the distinction is even finer: Bernoulli's law governs
> >*incompressible* fluids.
>
> Oh, dear. The carburetor in my car will be terribly disappointed to
> find out that it can't do what it is doing.
It gets weirder and weirder. We're speaking Daniel, not Jacques, right?
Why not send britannica.com and the physics dictionary of about.com your
carburetor, you may get some stock options in return.
Yehuda, It's in the dictionary AND in Britannica, so it MUST be wrong.
[1]
http://www.britannica.com/bcom/eb/article/9/0,5716,119069+14+110311,00.html
[2]
http://physics.about.com/science/physics/library/dict/blbernoullislaw.htm
Yehuda Naveh
On Fri, 24 Nov 2000, Lee Ayrton wrote:
> On Fri, 24 Nov 2000, Yehuda Naveh wrote:
>
> > > Bernoulli's Law governs fluids, doesn't it? Traffic, being made up of
> > > large bits of metal, glass and assorted other stuff, is not a fluid.
> >
> > Actually, the distinction is even finer: Bernoulli's law governs
> > *incompressible* fluids. Traffic, to a very good approximation, is a
> > *highly compressible* fluid.
>
> Syncronicity in action: There's an article in the December 2000 issue of
> ATLANTIC MONTHLY entitled "The Physics of Gridlock." It discusses the
> application of certain models of gas flow to traffic studies, as
> performed by "several German theoretical physicists."
There are plenty of smart people around the world applying hydrodynamic
models to traffic flows. The original poster actually used only the
continuity equation, of which only rather trivial conclusions can be
drawn. I don't know if Bernoulli's, or a generalization of which, has ever
been applied (I don't see much sense in transverse pressure when it comes
to traffic), but viscosity models certainly have.
It changes the way you view the rush-hour after reading one of them
papers.
Yehuda, Is it already December in Australia?
obUL: F 'Pressure' as in 'blood pressure' has something to do with
'pressure' as used in hydrodynamics, eg Bernoulli.
Alex Shaw
>"KD" <kaye...@hotmail.com> writes:
>
>
>>Regarding a marginal increase in death rates at higher speeds -- think about
>>it. You're going 75 or 90 and you crash -- I think you die either way. The
>>vast majority of the time.
>
>NOVA recently had highly impressive meterage from an Autobahn camera.
>A large Benz convertible going approx 200KPH lost control, bounced
>off a guardrail or two, flipped over, slid a LONG way upside down,
>hit the berm/ditch, flipped back to right side up and stopped.
>
>The impressive part? The door then opened and the driver walked up
>the berm to sit down.
Not unusual - it is the deceleration that kills. If a car rolls
skids etc. it is slowing down slowly and providing they do not fall
out the occupants are not usually seriously injured. Its just a very
destructive way of braking.
I have dealt with many accidents and it is the vehicles with the
single dent in the front, where it has hit a tree and stopped dead,
that contain the most seriously injured occupants.
Alex Shaw Alex...@freeuk.com
David Hatunen
Yehuda Naveh <yen...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu> wrote:
>On Fri, 24 Nov 2000, David Hatunen wrote:
>
>> In article <Pine.GSO.4.21.00112...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu>,
>> Yehuda Naveh <yen...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu> wrote:
>> >On Fri, 24 Nov 2000, Bill Kinkaid wrote:
>> >
>> >> Bernoulli's Law governs fluids, doesn't it? Traffic, being made
>> >> up of large bits of metal, glass and assorted other stuff, is
>> >> not a fluid.
>> >
>> >Actually, the distinction is even finer: Bernoulli's law governs
>> >*incompressible* fluids.
>>
>> Oh, dear. The carburetor in my car will be terribly disappointed to
>> find out that it can't do what it is doing.
>
>Why not send britannica.com and the physics dictionary of about.com your
>carburetor, you may get some stock options in return.
>
>Yehuda, It's in the dictionary AND in Britannica, so it MUST be wrong.
>
>[1]
>http://www.britannica.com/bcom/eb/article/9/0,5716,119069+14+110311,00.html
>
>[2]
>http://physics.about.com/science/physics/library/dict/blbernoullislaw.htm
Oh. Wait a minute. I see the problem: confusion between Bernoulli's
Law and Bernoulli's Principle. The latter is applicable to
carburetors and, I would suppose, traffic flow. My boo-boo; someone
said "Law" and I followed the lead blindly.
David Lesher
>>A large Benz convertible going approx 200KPH lost control, bounced
...............^^^^^^^^^^
>>off a guardrail or two, flipped over, slid a LONG way upside down,
........................................................^^^^^^^^^^^
>>hit the berm/ditch, flipped back to right side up and stopped.
>Not unusual - it is the deceleration that kills. If a car rolls
>skids etc. it is slowing down slowly and providing they do not fall
>out the occupants are not usually seriously injured. Its just a very
>destructive way of braking.
Give the facts above, I found it very impressive.
YMMV.
David Scheidt
: Alex Shaw <alex...@freeuk.com> writes:
:>>David Lesher <wb8...@panix.com> wrote:
:>>A large Benz convertible going approx 200KPH lost control, bounced
: ...............^^^^^^^^^^
:>>off a guardrail or two, flipped over, slid a LONG way upside down,
: ........................................................^^^^^^^^^^^
:>>hit the berm/ditch, flipped back to right side up and stopped.
:>Not unusual - it is the deceleration that kills. If a car rolls
: Give the facts above, I found it very impressive.
: YMMV.
The newer Mercedes convertibles, or at least the big expensive one, have a
roll bar that deploys in the event of a rollover. I'm not sure I'd trust
it to save my life, but it's nifty technology.
--
David Scheidt <dsch...@enteract.com>
Stop being Rambo, and start being Ghandi. -- Paul Tomblin
Deborah Stevenson
On 27 Nov 2000, David Scheidt wrote:
> David Lesher <wb8...@panix.com> wrote:
> : Alex Shaw <alex...@freeuk.com> writes:
>
> :>>David Lesher <wb8...@panix.com> wrote:
> :>>A large Benz convertible going approx 200KPH lost control, bounced
> : ...............^^^^^^^^^^
> :>>off a guardrail or two, flipped over, slid a LONG way upside down,
> : ........................................................^^^^^^^^^^^
> :>>hit the berm/ditch, flipped back to right side up and stopped.
>
> :>Not unusual - it is the deceleration that kills. If a car rolls
>
> : Give the facts above, I found it very impressive.
> : YMMV.
>
> The newer Mercedes convertibles, or at least the big expensive one, have a
> roll bar that deploys in the event of a rollover. I'm not sure I'd trust
> it to save my life, but it's nifty technology.
That was, in fact, what the footage was demonstrating--the roll bar popped
up as it should and kept the driver from squishdom.
Deborah Stevenson
(stev...@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu)
David Lesher
And the non-insignificant fact that AFTER that journey, the frame was
un[bent,damaged] enough that the door still functioned correctly.
Mitcho
> That was, in fact, what the footage was demonstrating--the roll bar popped
> up as it should and kept the driver from squishdom.
I believe the correct technical term is "squishage."
Mitcho
--
The Urban Redneck : red...@employees.org : Goat Hill, California
http://www.employees.org/~redneck
Deborah Stevenson
On Mon, 27 Nov 2000, Mitcho wrote:
> Deborah Stevenson <stev...@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu> wrote:
>
> > That was, in fact, what the footage was demonstrating--the roll bar popped
> > up as it should and kept the driver from squishdom.
>
> I believe the correct technical term is "squishage."
Both seem valid here but slightly different--"squishage" is what's getting
scraped up (perhaps even requiring a "becoming" preceding it for use
here), but "squishdom" is the state of being or becoming that stuff.
I guess it depends on whose ox is roadkill.
Deborah Stevenson
(stev...@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu)
Mitcho
> > > That was, in fact, what the footage was demonstrating--the roll bar popped
> > > up as it should and kept the driver from squishdom.
> >
> > I believe the correct technical term is "squishage."
>
> Both seem valid here but slightly different--"squishage" is what's getting
> scraped up (perhaps even requiring a "becoming" preceding it for use
> here), but "squishdom" is the state of being or becoming that stuff.
From http://www.m-w.com:
Main Entry: squish·age
Function: noun
1 a : the action or an instance of squishing
b : a quantity squished (what's getting scraped up)
2 : loss due to squishing
Alastair Rae
wrote:
>Alastair Rae <NOSPA...@tertio.com> wrote:
>> I believe zero blood alcohol is impossible. Something to do with
>> fermentation in the stomach. A figure of "equivalent to half a pint of
>> beer" emerges from the fuzzy morass that is my memory.
>
>[...]. However, the levels of ethanol
>measured would equate to around one percent of one standard drin -
>nowhere near enough to put someone over the limit, or even make them
>tipsy.
Sorry to get all defensive, but I did say zero was impossible, in
response to David Nebenzahl statement that "both Hungary and Bulgaria
have zero-blood-alcohol tolerances"
You need to have something you can measure. Supposing you inhale near
somebody who's been eating sherry trifle. Will you have zero blood
alcohol?
--
Alastair Rae, London, Europe.
Remove NOSPAM from my email address to reply.
My opinions are not necessarily those of my employers.
Lara Hopkins
> Lara Hopkins wrote:
> >Alastair Rae wrote:
> >> I believe zero blood alcohol is impossible. Something to do with
> >> fermentation in the stomach. A figure of "equivalent to half a pint of
> >> beer" emerges from the fuzzy morass that is my memory.
> >
> >[...]. However, the levels of ethanol
> >nowhere near enough to put someone over the limit, or even make them
> >tipsy.
>
> Sorry to get all defensive,
No need; I wasn't attacking. I was rather excited at the sighting.
Amateur folklorists get that way, sometimes.
> but I did say zero was impossible, in
> response to David Nebenzahl statement that "both Hungary and Bulgaria
> have zero-blood-alcohol tolerances".
And I presented evidence that your vaguely-remembered figure of a half a
pint (equating to one standard drink or a BAL[1] of 0.02 in our
language) was at least one hundred times too high. If you have any more
information or kewl nudie tails, I'd love to hear them for the FAQ.
Lara "Are we renaming it FAQ2K+1?" Hopkins
[1] ObBOA: Blood Alcohol Level
Simon Slavin
dsch...@tumbolia.com (David Scheidt) wrote:
> The newer Mercedes convertibles, or at least the big expensive one, have a
> roll bar that deploys in the event of a rollover. I'm not sure I'd trust
> it to save my life, but it's nifty technology.
Actually, you can. The roll-bar provides better safety than the
standard metal roof on the 'average' saloon.
Simon.
--
http://www.hearsay.demon.co.uk | Come to think of it, just what are we going
No junk email please. | to say to an alien race if we make contact?
| "Do you have Napster?"
| "Stop making crop circles!" -- Scott Barber
Lon Stowell
Simon Slavin <sla...@hearsay.demon.co.uk@localhost> wrote:
>In article <8vu5oq$6go$1...@bob.news.rcn.net>,
>dsch...@tumbolia.com (David Scheidt) wrote:
>
>> The newer Mercedes convertibles, or at least the big expensive one, have a
>> roll bar that deploys in the event of a rollover. I'm not sure I'd trust
>> it to save my life, but it's nifty technology.
>
>Actually, you can. The roll-bar provides better safety than the
>standard metal roof on the 'average' saloon.
We've had some serious earthquakes here in California, but
I am pretty sure that none of the earthquake construction
safety laws require roll-bars on drinking establishments.
Bill Heyman
>
> In article <8vu5oq$6go$1...@bob.news.rcn.net>,
> dsch...@tumbolia.com (David Scheidt) wrote:
>
> > The newer Mercedes convertibles, or at least the big expensive one, have a
> > roll bar that deploys in the event of a rollover. I'm not sure I'd trust
> > it to save my life, but it's nifty technology.
>
> Actually, you can. The roll-bar provides better safety than the
> standard metal roof on the 'average' saloon.
>
A bunch of the boys were whooping it up in the Mercedes-Benz saloon;
The kid that handles the music-box was
hitting a jag-time tune;
Back of the bar, in a solo game, sat
Dangerous Simon Slavoon,
And watching his luck was his light-o'-love,
the lady that's known as Lou.
When out of the night, which was fifty below,
and into the din and glare,
There stumbled a miner fresh from the creeks,
dog-dirty, and loaded for bear.
He looked like a man with a foot in the grave
and scarcely the strength of a louse,
Yet he tilted a poke of dust on the bar, and he
called for drinks for the house.
There was none could place the stranger's face,
though we searched ourselves for a clue;
But we drank his health, and the last to
drink was Dangerous Simon Slavoon.
There's men that somehow just grip your eyes,
and hold them hard like a spell;
And such was he, and he looked to me like a
man who had lived in hell;
With a face most hair, and the dreary stare
of a dog whose day is done,
As he watered the green stuff in his glass,
and the drops fell one by one.
Then I got to figgering who he was, and
wondering what he'd do,
And I turned my head--and there watching him
was the lady that's known as Lou.
His eyes went rubbering round the room, and
he seemed in a kind of daze,
Till at last that old piano fell in the
way of his wandering gaze.
The rag-time kid was having a drink; there
was no one else on the stool,
So the stranger stumbles across the room, and
flops down there like a fool.
In a buckskin shirt that was dazed with dirt
he sat, and I saw him sway,
Then he clutched the keys with his talon
hands--my God! but that man could play.
Were you ever out in the Great Alone, when
the moon was awful clear,
And the icy mountains hemmed you in with a
silence you most could hear;
With only the howl of a timber wolf, and you
camped there in the cold,
A helf-dead thing in a stark, dead world,
clean mad for the muck called gold;
While high overhead, green, yellow, and red,
the North Lights swept in bars?--
Then you've a hunch what the music
meant...hunger and might and the stars.
And hunger not of the belly kind, that's
banished with bacon and beans,
But the gnawing hunger of lonely men for a
home and all that it means;
For a fireside far from the cares that are,
four walls and a roof above;
But oh! so cramful of cosy joy, and
crowded with a woman's love--
A woman dearer than all the world, and
true as Heaven is true--
(God! how ghastly she looks through her
rouge,--the lady that's known as Lou.)
Then on a sudden the music changed, so soft
that you scarce could hear;
But you felt that your life had been looted
clean of all that it once held dear;
That someone had stolen the woman you loved;
that her love was a devil's lie;
That your guts were gone, and the best for
you was to crawl away and die.
'Twas the crowning cry of a heart's despair, and
it thrilled you through and through--
"I guess I'll make it a spread misere,"
said Dangerous Simon Slavoon.
The music almost dies away...then it
burst like a pent-up flood;
And it seemed to say, "Repay, repay," and my
eyes were blind with blood.
The thought came back of an ancient wrong,
and it stung like a frozen lash,
And the lust awoke to kill, to kill...then
the music stopped with a crash,
And the stranger turned, and his eyes they
burned in a most peculiar way;
In a buckskin shirt that was glazed with dirt
he sat, and I saw him sway;
Then his lips went in in a kind of grin, and
he spoke, and his voice was calm,
And "Boys," says he, "you don't know me, and
none of you care a damn;
But I want to state, and my words are straight,
and I'll bet my poke they're true,
That one of you is a hound of hell...and
that one is Simon Slavoon."
Then I ducked my head and the lights went out,
and two guns blazed in the dark;
And a woman screamed, and the lights went up,
and two men lay stiff and stark.
Pitched on his head, and pumped full of lead,
was Dangerous Simon Slavoon,
While the man from the creeks lay clutched to the
breast of the lady that's known as Lou.
These are the simple facts of the case, and
I guess I ought to know.
They say that the stranger was crazed with
"hooch," and I'm not denying it's so.
I'm not so wise as the lawyer guys, but
strictly between us two--
The woman that kissed him and--pinched his
poke--was the lady known as Lou.
Casady
wrote:
>Simon Slavin wrote:
>>
>> In article <8vu5oq$6go$1...@bob.news.rcn.net>,
>> dsch...@tumbolia.com (David Scheidt) wrote:
>>
>> > The newer Mercedes convertibles, or at least the big expensive one, have a
>> > roll bar that deploys in the event of a rollover. I'm not sure I'd trust
>> > it to save my life, but it's nifty technology.
>>
>> Actually, you can. The roll-bar provides better safety than the
>> standard metal roof on the 'average' saloon.
Snip a bunch of set in a 'drinking' saloon doggerel, not that bad
either.
Simon was kind enough to warn us that he is British by spelling
'sedan' 'saloon' just as they like to spell truck 'lorry'. Kind of
him. The world is a big place, and it is often useful to have some
idea where the poster is from. I am from Iowa, USA, about 43 N
94 W, rural Des Moines, for what it is worth. If Simon wants to
call the biggest cars, the Cadillacs, the Bentley, the Benz, and
the lesser breeds of similar design and heft saloons just because
they call them that where he lives, I guess I can live with it. Been
reading that spelling for at least forty years. Not lately however.
Makes me feel old.
Casady
Scott Craver
>>Simon Slavin wrote:
>>>
>>> Actually, you can. The roll-bar provides better safety than the
>>> standard metal roof on the 'average' saloon.
>
>'sedan' 'saloon' just as they like to spell truck 'lorry'.
We've got cars big as bars, we've got rivers of gold....
-S
McCaffertA
<rca...@uswest.net> writes:
>Simon was kind enough to warn us that he is British by spelling
>'sedan' 'saloon' just as they like to spell truck 'lorry'.
Actually, they spell "salon" "saloon", you get down to it; the term was a
nautical borrowing, and the useage for barrooms spun off of the shipboard use,
if memory serves.
Interesting how the "-oon" ending gets displaced over time, reverting to
the French original; "salon" has all but obliterated "saloon", and armies now
use "ponton" bridges, not "pontoons". Next thing you know, some buffon will
start calling those air bags "ballons", non?
Anthony "now, Hairball will tell us about his sailor friends..." McCafferty
Brian Cooke
>
> Snip a bunch of set in a 'drinking' saloon doggerel, not that bad
> either.
>
doggerel, would welcome your warm words of approval, were he alive to
read them.
Brian "you'd love 'The cremation of Sam McGee'" Cooke
--
"The perfect thread is the one whose incarnate absence we silently
contemplate." -Ian Munro on the Zen of AFU
Casady
wrote:
>Casady wrote:
>>
>> Snip a bunch of set in a 'drinking' saloon doggerel, not that bad
>> either.
>>
>I'm sure that Robert Service, the author of most of that bit of
>doggerel, would welcome your warm words of approval, were he alive to
>read them.
>
>Brian "you'd love 'The cremation of Sam McGee'" Cooke
Well yes. I couldn't recall Robert Service's name, but it looked
sort of familiar. I have been exposed to 'Sam McGee', decades
ago, possible in about 8th grade, English class. I have all of
Kipling's verse, for example,but none of Service's that I know of,
and I appreciated the info. It wasn't exactly a troll, but I kind of
hoped someone would mention the source.
Casady
Marc M Reeve
>> either.
>>
>doggerel, would welcome your warm words of approval, were he alive to
>read them.
>
>Brian "you'd love 'The cremation of Sam McGee'" Cooke
That being one of two Service poems of which I'm aware, I'll assume that
"Simon Slavoon" was substituting for "Dan McGrew" in the version posted.
Marc "that, and it fits the rhyme scheme better" Reeve
--
Marc Reeve cmr...@SPAM.ucsc.edu
"I recall disliking Washington National in the early/mid '80s because
it was of the "only ticked passengers beyond this point" sort."
-Drew Lawson
Bill Kinkaid
<yen...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu> wrote:
>> Syncronicity in action: There's an article in the December 2000 issue of
>> ATLANTIC MONTHLY entitled "The Physics of Gridlock." It discusses the
>> application of certain models of gas flow to traffic studies, as
>> performed by "several German theoretical physicists."
>
>
>Yehuda, Is it already December in Australia?
>
Which brings up another old Andy Rooney question: how do magazines
decide what month they release a certain month's issue? Why do some
magazines put out their December issue in August?
And subscription renewals. When we get a renewal notice in July (for a
magazine which expires in January) and can't remember if we're late
renewing for this year or they're early in sending us the notice for
next year.
Bill in Vancouver
Seeg file? We don't need no steenking seeg file!
Bill Kinkaid
Hatunen) wrote:
>In article <6oET5.13611$6W1.7...@news.flash.net>,
>Jack Ak <akj...@excite.com> wrote:
>>"David Hatunen" <hat...@bolt.sonic.net> wrote in message
>>news:JXxT5.789$Y3.3...@typhoon.sonic.net...
>>> In article <Pine.GSO.4.21.00112...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu>,
>>> Yehuda Naveh <yen...@ms.cc.sunysb.edu> wrote:
>>> >On Fri, 24 Nov 2000, Bill Kinkaid wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> Bernoulli's Law governs fluids, doesn't it? Traffic, being made
>>> >> up of large bits of metal, glass and assorted other stuff, is
>>> >> not a fluid.
>>> >
>>> >Actually, the distinction is even finer: Bernoulli's law governs
>>> >*incompressible* fluids.
>>>
>>> Oh, dear. The carburetor in my car will be terribly disappointed to
>>> find out that it can't do what it is doing.
>
>>and don't compress liquids.
>
>No perhaps about it, though, that you're going to be surprised
>that you haven't the foggiest as to the difference between a fluid
>and a liguid.
>
The carburetor's job is to take gasoline, a contiguous liquid,
convert it into very small, but still liquid, particles, and have it
sucked into the engine by the action of the pistons. Along with the
gas, the engine also sucks in air (a gas but also a fluid).
David Hatunen
Bill Kinkaid <kin...@look.ca> wrote:
>The carburetor's job is to take gasoline, a contiguous liquid,
>convert it into very small, but still liquid, particles, and have it
>sucked into the engine by the action of the pistons. Along with the
>gas, the engine also sucks in air (a gas but also a fluid).
The gasoline will be a vapor by the time it gets to the cylinder if
the system is properly designed.
Ron Saarna
"Bill Kinkaid" <kin...@look.ca> wrote in message
news:3a267b09....@news-west.look.ca...
> Which brings up another old Andy Rooney question: how do magazines
> decide what month they release a certain month's issue? Why do some
> magazines put out their December issue in August?
Conventional comic-book wisdom has it that it is to trick the newsstands
into keeping it out for sale until the cover-month is over. I suspect it
began with magazines that published on a non-monthly basis, ie; 10 issues a
year, bi-monthly, quarterly, etc... so that after being on the stand for one
month, it didn't just get pulled leaving out the potential of missed-sales
in the gap, unsold issues being returned. When certain magazines went
monthly, it would be confusing to have 2 or 3 December issues, so the
chronological dating continued. Imagine this scenario: You are a quarterly,
and in September you release your December issue. By October your magazine
was a wild hit, and you decide to go bi-monthly next issue. In November you
release your January issue, and it too sells out. In December you roll out
your new monthly and it has a cover date of February. You now have a
magazine that is perpetually 3 months out of time.
> And subscription renewals. When we get a renewal notice in July (for a
> magazine which expires in January) and can't remember if we're late
> renewing for this year or they're early in sending us the notice for
> next year.
Forget that one... why do we have 5 cards tumble into your lap each issue
instead?
David Hatunen
Bill Kinkaid <kin...@look.ca> wrote:
>Which brings up another old Andy Rooney question: how do magazines
>decide what month they release a certain month's issue? Why do some
>magazines put out their December issue in August?
Another poster mentions this, but my understanding is that the
month on the cover is the pull-date; the news stand should keep it
until that month is over. In practice it wiol be pulled when the
next issue arrives.
>And subscription renewals. When we get a renewal notice in July
>(for a magazine which expires in January) and can't remember if
>we're late renewing for this year or they're early in sending us
>the notice for next year.
Drive me nuts, too. Plus the reminders they send you *after* you've
sent in your renewal. I try to always take the longest subscription
term available since this cuts the number of renewal notices and
also locks in a rate.
R H Draney
>
> Conventional comic-book wisdom has it that it is to trick the newsstands
> into keeping it out for sale until the cover-month is over. I suspect it
> began with magazines that published on a non-monthly basis, ie; 10 issues a
> year, bi-monthly, quarterly, etc... so that after being on the stand for one
> month, it didn't just get pulled leaving out the potential of missed-sales
> in the gap, unsold issues being returned. When certain magazines went
> monthly, it would be confusing to have 2 or 3 December issues, so the
> chronological dating continued.
And in the first three months of 1989, DC Comics got tired of people
asking about this and *backed up* the cover dates by three
months...result: if you go by the sequential issue number, the cover
dates go Dec'88, Jan'89, Feb'89, Mar'89, Jan'89, Feb'89, Mar'89,
Apr'89...normalcy is restored beyond this point...but it does mean that
there are "January" issues of every title being published that year that
*follow* "March" issues in the continuity....
Around here this is known as "screwing up the collector's database"....
> > And subscription renewals. When we get a renewal notice in July (for a
> > magazine which expires in January) and can't remember if we're late
> > renewing for this year or they're early in sending us the notice for
> > next year.
I got tired of being called by my subscription "services" and
inadvertently renewing something I still had four years coming on...now
I keep a list of expiration dates in my PDA and the phone calls are
*much* more entertaining on my end....r
--
All this talk about Chad and not one word about Jeremy....
Bill Kinkaid
wrote:
>> decide what month they release a certain month's issue? Why do some
>> magazines put out their December issue in August?
>
>
>instead?
>
Yep, they make it all the way through the distribution and postal or
retail systems, and fall out as soon as you pick them up.
Except TV Guide. The only magazine which is opened and read a few
times regularly every day, and they now stick the damn cards right
into the binding. While it's useful for the Frank Costanzas of the
world to file them on their bookshelves, it's a pain flipping through
and running into stupid cards which you can't take out without ripping
the book apart.
Andy Walton
:Which brings up another old Andy Rooney question: how do magazines
:decide what month they release a certain month's issue? Why do some
:magazines put out their December issue in August?
I see it as yet another form of the "the other guy does it, so I have to"
marketing phenomenon. If you're at a newsstand on November 25, why buy the
outdated Nov. 23 Time when you can get the forward-looking Dec. 1 issue of
Newsweek? Why buy the October Vogue when you can get the December Glamour
at the same time at the same price?
Of course, if you keep old (especially monthly) magazines for reference,
this becomes maddening; if you look up an article in the July 1995 issue
of MacUser, you've got to remind yourself that it actually reflects events
in October 1993 or thereabouts.
A similar example is gasoline (ObTWIAVBP: petrol) pricing -- that weaselly
small-type "9" is there because no one dares be the first to drop it. If
my station's sign advertises $1.350 gas, I'll get my clock cleaned by the
guy at the next corner who's selling the stuff at a bargain $1.349, with
the last digit a quarter the size of the others.
:And subscription renewals. When we get a renewal notice in July (for a
:magazine which expires in January) and can't remember if we're late
:renewing for this year or they're early in sending us the notice for
:next year.
Actuarial science. As long as your subscription obligation is shorter than
your predicted life expectancy, they'll keep asking you to re-up.
--
"My main reason for adopting literature as a profession is that, as the
author is never seen by his clients, he need not dress respectably."
-- George Bernard Shaw
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andy Walton * att...@mindspring.com * http://atticus.home.mindspring.com/
Andy Walton
:On Thu, 30 Nov 2000 17:46:21 GMT, "Ron Saarna" <du...@sympatico.ca>
:wrote:
:>
:>Forget that one... why do we have 5 cards tumble into your lap each issue
:>instead?
:>
:
:Yep, they make it all the way through the distribution and postal or
:retail systems, and fall out as soon as you pick them up.
When I get home with a new magazine, my first act is to hold it over a
trash can, binding up, and shake it vigorously and then riffle the pages.
Then I can read in reasonable peace, except for the glued-into-the-binding
perforated card inserts. I can understand the blitz in newsstand copies,
but why do subscribers get some 1.0x10^5 subscription offers per issue?
danny burstein
> :Which brings up another old Andy Rooney question: how do magazines
> :decide what month they release a certain month's issue? Why do some
> :magazines put out their December issue in August?
>I see it as yet another form of the "the other guy does it, so I have to"
>marketing phenomenon. If you're at a newsstand on November 25, why buy the
>outdated Nov. 23 Time when you can get the forward-looking Dec. 1 issue of
>Newsweek? Why buy the October Vogue when you can get the December Glamour
>at the same time at the same price?
And let's not forget that the automobile manufacturers' model years have
been starting earlier and earlier in the previous calendar year.
--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
dan...@panix.com
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]
Hairy One Kenobi
> The carburetor's job is to take gasoline, a contiguous liquid,
> convert it into very small, but still liquid, particles, and have it
> sucked into the engine by the action of the pistons. Along with the
> gas, the engine also sucks in air (a gas but also a fluid).
.. the result being referred-to as the "air-fuel mixture", a fluid. And,
yes, Bernoulli has a Principle, not a law - Boyle et al provided that bit.
--
Hairy One Kenobi
Disclaimer: the opinions expressed in this opinion do not necessarily
reflect the opinions of the highly-opinionated person expressing the opinion
in the first place. So there!
R H Draney
>
> A similar example is gasoline (ObTWIAVBP: petrol) pricing -- that weaselly
> small-type "9" is there because no one dares be the first to drop it. If
> my station's sign advertises $1.350 gas, I'll get my clock cleaned by the
> guy at the next corner who's selling the stuff at a bargain $1.349, with
> the last digit a quarter the size of the others.
An additional observation I made a couple of weeks ago...you might see
$1.479, you might see $1.539, and all sorts of prices in and around that
range...you will seldom see $1.509 or any price with a zero before that
miniature trailing nine...apparently they're worried about passengers
who call out prices, e.g. "that Mobil station has one-forty-seven-nine"
because "one-fifty, nine" sounds too much like "one-fifty-nine"....
R H "punctuation? is, important!" Draney
Drew Lawson
att...@mindspring.com (Andy Walton) writes:
>In article <3a267b09....@news-west.look.ca>, kin...@look.ca wrote:
> :And subscription renewals. When we get a renewal notice in July (for a
> :magazine which expires in January) and can't remember if we're late
> :renewing for this year or they're early in sending us the notice for
> :next year.
>
>Actuarial science. As long as your subscription obligation is shorter than
>your predicted life expectancy, they'll keep asking you to re-up.
Because of this, and poor observations on my part, I ended up
renewing myself into three years of MacWorld a while back. That's
about to expire in a month or two. And because of their same
tactics, there's no way in hell that I'll renew it.
Drew "burn me once, shame on you . . ." Lawson
--
|Drew Lawson | So many newsgroups |
|dr...@furrfu.com | So little time |
|http://www.furrfu.com/ | |
JoAnne Schmitz
>[snippage]
>
>> :Which brings up another old Andy Rooney question: how do magazines
>> :decide what month they release a certain month's issue? Why do some
>> :magazines put out their December issue in August?
>
>>I see it as yet another form of the "the other guy does it, so I have to"
>>marketing phenomenon. If you're at a newsstand on November 25, why buy the
>>outdated Nov. 23 Time when you can get the forward-looking Dec. 1 issue of
>>Newsweek? Why buy the October Vogue when you can get the December Glamour
>>at the same time at the same price?
>
>And let's not forget that the automobile manufacturers' model years have
>been starting earlier and earlier in the previous calendar year.
But TV fall premieres seem to come later and later.
JoAnne "then they toss in a rerun three weeks into the season just to mess you
up" Schmitz
Casady
Walton) wrote:
>In article <3a2732ce....@news-west.look.ca>, kin...@look.ca wrote:
>
> :On Thu, 30 Nov 2000 17:46:21 GMT, "Ron Saarna" <du...@sympatico.ca>
> :wrote:
> :>
> :>Forget that one... why do we have 5 cards tumble into your lap each issue
> :>instead?
> :>
> :
> :Yep, they make it all the way through the distribution and postal or
> :retail systems, and fall out as soon as you pick them up.
>
>When I get home with a new magazine, my first act is to hold it over a
>trash can, binding up, and shake it vigorously and then riffle the pages.
>Then I can read in reasonable peace, except for the glued-into-the-binding
>perforated card inserts. I can understand the blitz in newsstand copies,
>but why do subscribers get some 1.0x10^5 subscription offers per issue?
They call those thing blow ins, and I have seen presses in
action,using moving air to blow subscription [and other] offers into
the magazines. They stay there because the mags are bound into
bundles. You occasionally find the cards on the shelves and floors
at the book [or grocery] store, where they have in fact, fallen out
during the retail distribution. My latest 'Practical Boat owner' [or
something,] an overpriced British mag, has a neat x cut on the back
cover from the knife of some dimwit that cannot open a bundle
without slashing the goods as well. Didn't notice till I got it
home.
The cards are not bad for cleaning weed, they say, and make decent
fuel, better than the mag itself, as they lack
the clay sizing the makes the artwork clear, and the ash content
high. Spider Robinson, the SF writer and reviewer related how he
heated his Nova Scotia farmhouse with review copies of books,
actually said that they were good fire starter, for building the
fire back up in the morning. As Coed said, 'wood burning stove, no
natural gas, If that ain't country, I'll kiss your ass.' First snow
on the ground, [and the lawn furniture, and BBQ grill], and it is
chilly already. I may burn a few dozen books just to get the chill
out of the living room. Fuck literacy. It never did me a bit of good
in my entire life. Learning to read was a mistake.
Casady
Charles A Lieberman
www.deja.com/msgid.xp?MID=<3a32e1db....@news.newsguy.com>
>>And let's not forget that the automobile manufacturers' model years have
>>been starting earlier and earlier in the previous calendar year.
>
>But TV fall premieres seem to come later and later.
There was a confounding factor this year.
--
Charles A. Lieberman | "Jesus is not a tree."
Brooklyn, New York, USA | -Meredith Robbins
http://calieber.tripod.com/home.html
No relation.