boys swimming nude in high school pool
K. D.
class. As for most PE classes, swim was not co-ed. We girls brought our
own towels and other necessities, but were given suits every swim period,
which we turned in at the end of class to be laundered.
The door from the boys' locker room to the pool was locked when the girls
had swim, and vice versa, for obvious reasons. But, especially since it was
common knowledge that the boys wore NOTHING during swim class. Zip. Nada.
In the buff.
A former male classmate of mine came through town a few years ago, and spent
the night at our house. The topic of the boys wearing nothing for swim
class somehow came up, and my husband could NOT believe it. He said that he
wore a suit in his HS swim class, and was convinced that the story of the
boys wearing nothing was a massive joke perpetuated by the boys to tease the
girls. No amount of persuading would convince him.
In my particular graduating class, the knowledge of the boys swimming nude
was especially well-known due to an incident, which was so memorable that it
was specially mentioned by the M-C at our 20-year reunion. One of the male
members of the swim team was planning on doing some extra swimming during a
free period he had one day. Thru an incredible coincidence, he was unaware
that a girls' class was currently in the pool, but more importantly for some
unknown and unlucky reason, the door from the boys' locker room had been
left unlocked. You guessed it -- he walked into the girls' swim class stark
naked!
Even telling my husband of this story would not convince him. Two years
later, we were in Seattle, and visited another former male classmate of
mine, who verified the story of the males swimming nude. My husband remains
convinced (so he says), to this day, that it isn't true.
I can't PROVE they swam nude, but we always accepted it as truth. My
brother-in-law, who went to the HS on the other side of town, reports that
they wore suits in swim.
Are there any males out there who can attest to this practice? More
importantly, WHY was it done?
Bob Graham
Idaho when I was growing up. It was exactly as you described it. That was hmmmm
-- about 60 years ago.
Aloha - bob \ooo_
"K. D." wrote:
--
-------
<http://home.hawaii.rr.com/bgraham/>
Loomis Farkle
flowrchi...@prodigy.net writes:
>My high school had a swimming pool, and part of PE involved weekly swim
>class. As for most PE classes, swim was not co-ed. We girls brought our
>own towels and other necessities, but were given suits every swim period,
>which we turned in at the end of class to be laundered.
>
>The door from the boys' locker room to the pool was locked when the girls
>had swim, and vice versa, for obvious reasons. But, especially since it was
>common knowledge that the boys wore NOTHING during swim class. Zip.
>
>
>Are there any males out there who can attest to this practice? More
>importantly, WHY was it done?
>
the school went coed. The swimming pool was in the basement of the gym
and was very hot (think boiler rooms and such). Until the pool was
opened up to all sexes (this was South Dakota -- don靖 ask), swimming
suits weren靖 allowed because they didn靖 want to clog up the filters and
drains with any stray material that might become detached from said
suits. On a normal suit, this isn靖 going to happen; however, it was
kind of hard to convince some of us farmboys that those cutoff jeans we
had been wearing into the creek for 18 years were not, in fact, official
swimming suits. At least, that零 what Coach Bruce and Coach Lance told
us.
Cyclone Ambiguous
>us.
Did Coach Julian have any say in the matter?
Cyclone Ambiguous
In prophecy of FF9's main character
Slighly repentant Sadist in Chief of the EAC and High Bakesale Coordinator
The Supreme Clone of the Church of Jenova's Witnesses
Wondering why AOL limits me to a 254 character sig in ngs
HWM
> Are there any males out there who can attest to this practice?
On a little side-step the Yrjönkatu Baths reopened in Helsinki after a
massive renovation. Before according to ancient practices no swimming
suits were allowed in the hall. Now the Helsinki board or something or
whatever tried to introduce co-ed suited swimming, and finally the
patrons even got the bureau of Museums and Antiquities to step in and
say that no renovations may be made to acommodate the co-edness. So it
is in the buff. The baths, be seen at a glimpse in a scene from "Gorky
Park".
I dare your husband there when he is in Helsinki... history is made at
night.
--
Cheers, | The conformity of purpose will be achieved |
HWM | through the mutual satisfaction of requirements.|
"Mind the gap"=> hen...@iobox.fi & http://www.kuru.da.ru
Lars Eighner
In our last episode <7v8jfl$3so8$1...@newssvr04-int.news.prodigy.com>,
the lovely and talented "K. D." <flowrchi...@prodigy.net>
broadcast on alt.folklore.urban:
|Are there any males out there who can attest to this practice? More
|importantly, WHY was it done?
It has been mumbltey-mumbltey years since I was in school, but back
in those duck-and-cover days, guys did swim nude in class (in Houston)
public schools. The team, however, had itty-bitty things that
make Speedos seem modest, because -- I guess -- practice was
generally open to parents and such. Besides which, in practicing
for competitive swimming there was the issue -- I suppose --
of ... uh ... streamlining.
In public schools, I guess, the expense was a factor. And I suspect
there was some concern about what a wet bathing suit in a locker
would do over a weekend -- this was Houston before the schools
were air conditioned. Sox, jocks, and shorts could get pretty
ripe, and a wet bathing suit in the mix would be asking for trouble.
Moreover, at that time, just about every dad had been in the
military in the war and the draft was still on so it was expected
that every boy would be in the military so you might as well admit
you were a communist as object to the practice -- in fact I think
I did hear an objection or two on the grounds of modesty, and
the answer always was "Well, what is he going to do when he
is in the Army and has to shower with a hundred guys?"
--
Lars Eighner 700 Hearn #101 Austin TX 78703 eig...@io.com
(512) 474-1920 (FAX answers 6th ring) http://www.io.com/%7Eeighner/
Please visit my web bookstore: http://www.io.com/%7Eeighner/bookstore/
Don't care if it's true - just love it. --Eric Hocking
Intheway1
>|importantly, WHY was it done?
>
The standard explanation given at my college for the "no suit" rule (which was
officially dropped in the early 1960s) was the risk of clogging the pool
filter. Several of the older faculty members (all male) continued to swim nude
after that during times when the pool was not in use by a class or the swim
team.
The school was not co-ed until 1970, when a local variant of the legend
immediately appeared. According to the story, during the first week of school
after co-education was introduced, several professors went for their daily
swim. Included in this group was one who was legally blind. While the others
were still changing into their suits, he stripped down, removed his very thick
eyeglasses and left the locker room.[1] Hearing voices from across the pool,
the professor waved and shouted "Good morning, gentlemen" to a line-up of
Freshman women. He stood there smiling and waving until a second professor
arrived and shoved him into the pool.
Fred "Comparative Anatomy is not on the schedule" Wilhelms
[1] Given the permanent ambience of this locker room, the fear of adding drying
bathing suits to the olfactory mix was probably not a factor in the change of
the "no suit" rule.
K. D.
Lars Eighner wrote in message <9oCG4AwZ...@io.com>...
>In public schools, I guess, the expense was a factor. And I suspect
>there was some concern about what a wet bathing suit in a locker
>would do over a weekend -- this was Houston before the schools
>were air conditioned.
Yes, the concern over expense does make sense. But, the girls in my HS were
given towels and suits each swim period, which were collected and laundered,
so I'm assuming that the boys were given towels, at least.
>Moreover, at that time, just about every dad had been in the
>military in the war and the draft was still on so it was expected
>that every boy would be in the military so you might as well admit
>you were a communist as object to the practice -- in fact I think
>I did hear an objection or two on the grounds of modesty, and
>the answer always was "Well, what is he going to do when he
>is in the Army and has to shower with a hundred guys?"
This is a good insight. (I especially love the remark about being a
communist!) Even if not preparing them for the army, my male friends
surmised that the exercise in nude swimming had something to do with making
them into men.
Ah ha! And now I remember how the conversation started (about boys swimming
nude) with my visiting friend! He was saying that he had overheard some
female students who were horrified at the shower accommodations in the dorm
where they were living. Since the school had originally been male only, the
dorms had all been designed and built with male students in mind. Some of
the bathrooms had not been redesigned since then, and naturally there were
no partitions (much less curtains!) in the communal showers.
Andrea Jones
K. D. wrote in message <7v9j2r$1jas$1...@newssvr03-int.news.prodigy.com>...
>>military in the war and the draft was still on so it was expected
>>that every boy would be in the military so you might as well admit
>>you were a communist as object to the practice -- in fact I think
>>I did hear an objection or two on the grounds of modesty, and
>>the answer always was "Well, what is he going to do when he
>>is in the Army and has to shower with a hundred guys?"
>
>This is a good insight. (I especially love the remark about being a
>communist!) Even if not preparing them for the army, my male friends
>surmised that the exercise in nude swimming had something to do with making
>them into men.
>
>Ah ha! And now I remember how the conversation started (about boys
swimming
>nude) with my visiting friend! He was saying that he had overheard some
>female students who were horrified at the shower accommodations in the dorm
>where they were living. Since the school had originally been male only,
the
>dorms had all been designed and built with male students in mind. Some of
>the bathrooms had not been redesigned since then, and naturally there were
>no partitions (much less curtains!) in the communal showers.
are supposedly ok with the communal shower thing. Especially given that in
my experience, men tend to be more violently worried about homosexuality.
Then again, I spent my first year in the Navy without my own shower, and you
lose a lot of squeamishness when your options are either group showers or no
showers at all.
Andrea "I'm still willing to kill for a bathtub." Jones
Thomas J. Wood
In the past males swam in rivers, lakes and pools nekkid routinely and no one
thought anything of it. Suits were only worn if ladies were present. But
sometimes not even then. I have a book with a ca. 1910 photo taken in a German
army officer's club. The men are all swimming butt nekkid, while women and
children watch.
Today men are much more homophobic than in the past. You can see this fear
growing in the 20th century by looking at group photos of sports teams or
fraternities over the years. In the early part of the century the guys are all
over each other; nowadays you rarely see any physical contact.
--
Tom Wood
Alan W. Holmes
<flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
>
>Are there any males out there who can attest to this practice? More
>importantly, WHY was it done?
>
In my high school (mid-late sixties) we wore swimsuits, which wre
issued for each class and laundered by the school.
In an earlier period (I think around 1960) I took swim classes in the
YMCA in Utica NY, and students swam nude. Classes were, obviously,
male only. I cannot remember for sure if the instructors wore suits,
but I think they did. In this case, I suspect that it was for expense
reasons, but I have no cite to back it up.
Alan Holmes
awho...@erols.com
K. D.
Alan W. Holmes wrote in message <38186b3a...@news.erols.com>
>In my high school (mid-late sixties) we wore swimsuits, which wre
>issued for each class and laundered by the school.
>
>In an earlier period (I think around 1960) I took swim classes in the
>YMCA in Utica NY, and students swam nude. Classes were, obviously,
>male only. I cannot remember for sure if the instructors wore suits,
>but I think they did. In this case, I suspect that it was for expense
>reasons, but I have no cite to back it up.
Part of what interests me over this whole topic is various people's
reactions to it. While, as female students in the same school, we were
somewhat puzzled and horrified at the thought of the boys swimming nude, we
accepted it as "just the way it is."
My bro-in-law, same town, different school district, was surprised and
perplexed to learn of the practice, since the boys at HIS school wore suits.
I think it is no coincidence that he lived on the more affluent side of
town, and we were always aware that we were the "poorer" school.
Other females, and some males (i.e., my husband) are absolutely incredulous
that this practice occurred. Obviously, from the posts here, it was very
common in the post-WWII era, even up through the Viet Nam era.
While we're on the topic, other posters have suggested the ban had something
to do with preventing the filtration system from clogging. This makes some
sense (even if it isn't actually true), because even tho the girls were
provided with suits (which arguably could clog the filtration system as much
as boys' suits), we did have to wear bathing caps. Since they don't usually
keep your hair dry (a possible rationale) the reason was given that our hair
would clog the filtration system. I can't remember about other places I
have gone to swim, but the pool I use regularly now has nothing at all
posted about a requirement to wear a bathing cap. Some women do. I think
some men even do. But the vast majority don't. I guess either the reason
about potential clogging of the filtration system was never valid, or
filtration systems have improved, or both.
K. D.
Thomas J. Wood wrote in message <38186CAC...@uis.edu>...
>
>Today men are much more homophobic than in the past. You can see this fear
>growing in the 20th century by looking at group photos of sports teams or
>fraternities over the years. In the early part of the century the guys are
all
>over each other; nowadays you rarely see any physical contact.
>
do with this entire aspect of male fraternity / sports / bonding. The
homophobia.
During these various discussions of male nudity while swimming and in locker
rooms, etc., the topic did arise (again, no double entendre intended --
yeah, right) about the fact that a male would have been branded for life had
he to show any obvious signs of arousal while in the company of a bunch of
other naked males.
That some young males unarguably were aroused by the nudity of their male
classmates, but were seemingly able to prevent themselves from showing their
admiration somewhat dispels the "myth" that we girls heard during the same
years of "I can't help it -- 'it' is out of my control."
Ralph Jones
> [snip]
> I can't PROVE they swam nude, but we always accepted it as truth. My
> brother-in-law, who went to the HS on the other side of town, reports that
> they wore suits in swim.
>
> Are there any males out there who can attest to this practice? More
> importantly, WHY was it done?
My high school had no pool (it was in Miami and practically everybody could swim
already), but in my freshman year at Georgia Tech (1958/59), PE included one
quarter of swimming and the pool was "suits optional, so you can wear one if
you're really a sissy". We were given the usual line about clogging the filter,
but I think the real motivation was that the hot Georgia weather, plus the
dampness of a locker room, was germ heaven.
We had the same story about the guy walking nekkid into the wrong place, and
people who had been to other nude pool sites told it too.
The school had received its first women students only 6 years before, and this
was the first year they were offered the swim course. At first women-only hours
were set up; later, men's nude use was restricted to shorter hours so they could
have mixed swimming and finally skinnydipping was a thing of the past.
rj
Jim Everman
>
> I honestly fail to see why women should expect private showers, while men
> are supposedly ok with the communal shower thing. Especially given that in
> my experience, men tend to be more violently worried about homosexuality.
> Then again, I spent my first year in the Navy without my own shower, and you
> lose a lot of squeamishness when your options are either group showers or no
> showers at all.
>
> Andrea "I'm still willing to kill for a bathtub." Jones
I took a tour of a nuclear research reactor once - W-P Air Force
Base, Dayton, Ohio. The tour guide pointed out that they had seperate
decontamination showers for males & females, even though the recomended
procedure was to "run to the shower, stripping as you run. Shower
thoroughly, then don the disposable clothing located at the exit of
the shower."
Even though the showers were free standing devices, side by side,
they were still required by law (UL?) to have seperate facilities.
This was circa 1965, and we all took the guide's word for it.
--
Jim Everman mailto:eve...@Anet-STL.com
http://www.Anet-STL.com/~everman/
Never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by
stupidity.
K. D.
Ralph Jones wrote in message <381872A9...@qwestinternet.net>...
>
>My high school had no pool (it was in Miami and practically everybody could
swim
>already), but in my freshman year at Georgia Tech (1958/59), PE included
one
>quarter of swimming and the pool was "suits optional, so you can wear one
if
>you're really a sissy".
Some of those old Ga. Tech. group student pictures crack me up -- the young
men do look like a "serious" lot.
If you're not in or near Atlanta any more, I hope you have had a chance to
return, and check out the new (outdoor, but covered) pool, which was built
for the Olympics. I'm pretty sure, suits are no longer "optional."
>We had the same story about the guy walking nekkid into the wrong place,
and
>people who had been to other nude pool sites told it too.
Regarding the story from my HS about the boy walking in nekkid, I can't
swear that it is true (since I didn't SEE it), but I am unaware of anyone in
my class who does not accept it as true. Since it is possible that he
walked in on a class of girls from another year, no one from my class might
have seen it, either. Although I have lost touch with Steve S., I did know
him well in HS. The summer before we both entered junior high, altho we had
not met one another prior to that (having attended different grammar
schools), we had both been involved in accidents, and were on the same
hospital ward. As it turns out, our fathers had known one another for years
(I'm guessing drinking buddies here). This person DOES (or at least DID)
exist, I can vouch for it.
As mentioned, at the 20th reunion, I heard the former classmate who served
as M-C say that the committee who planned the reunion had wanted to give
Steve a special award for the most memorable story from HS (mentioned most
in the questionnaire sent out, which included "what do you remember most
from HS?"). When Steve's response came back from Florida, where he now
lives, he said that he wouldn't be able to attend. Several classmates
called him back, offering to pay for his plane fare, but he never made it.
(Can you blame him?)
I didn't see it happen, and I haven't seen Steve, since we graduated, to ask
him personally. If we both attend the next reunion, I'll ask him, and get
back with you.
JoAnne Schmitz
wrote:
>I honestly fail to see why women should expect private showers, while men
>are supposedly ok with the communal shower thing. Especially given that in
>my experience, men tend to be more violently worried about homosexuality.
>Then again, I spent my first year in the Navy without my own shower, and you
>lose a lot of squeamishness when your options are either group showers or no
>showers at all.
You started awfully young, didn't you? First year, most kids are just learning
to walk and talk a little.
JoAnne "now we know why you're so tired of guard duty" Schmitz
Olivers
>
> On Wed, 27 Oct 1999 23:24:58 -0500, "K. D."
> <flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
> >
> >importantly, WHY was it done?
> >
>
> issued for each class and laundered by the school.
>
> In an earlier period (I think around 1960) I took swim classes in the
> YMCA in Utica NY, and students swam nude. Classes were, obviously,
> male only. I cannot remember for sure if the instructors wore suits,
> but I think they did. In this case, I suspect that it was for expense
> reasons, but I have no cite to back it up.
>
required at Waco's YMCA, the communicated justification being
cleanliness, not letting dirty boys or suits in the clean pool.
1950 or so - Nude swimming at YMCA camp, North Bosque River near Valley
Mills during week, but suits required on visitors days.
1920s - at least 1957 - Nude swimming permitted at Camp Stewart for Boys
Beginners and Junior "Pools" (actually portions of North Fork of
Guadelupe) near Hunt, Texas on non-visiting days. Suits required at
Senior "Pool" due to visibility.
I suspect that while "Homophobia" may have been no less prevalent, the
customs, traditions and precedents of local culturen outweighed societal
concerns.
--
Olivers/SWRSO
"When you waltz across Texas,
the beer tastes better at closing time."
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Andrea Jones
Jim Everman wrote in message <381875...@anet-stl.com>...
>Andrea Jones wrote:
>>
>> I honestly fail to see why women should expect private showers, while men
>> are supposedly ok with the communal shower thing. Especially given that
in
>> my experience, men tend to be more violently worried about homosexuality.
>> Then again, I spent my first year in the Navy without my own shower, and
you
>> lose a lot of squeamishness when your options are either group showers or
no
>> showers at all.
>>
>
>
> I took a tour of a nuclear research reactor once - W-P Air Force
>Base, Dayton, Ohio. The tour guide pointed out that they had seperate
>decontamination showers for males & females, even though the recomended
>procedure was to "run to the shower, stripping as you run. Shower
>thoroughly, then don the disposable clothing located at the exit of
>the shower."
>
> Even though the showers were free standing devices, side by side,
>they were still required by law (UL?) to have seperate facilities.
>This was circa 1965, and we all took the guide's word for it.
referring to the complaint in the e-mail I had quoted, wherein the female
students complained that they didn't have individual shower stalls, and this
lack was attributed to the fact that the dorm had been a men's dorm
previously, and the showers weren't "converted" for the women.
Andrea "Although co-ed showers would have made boot camp more interesting"
Jones
Constance S Marshall
naked in the pool at their gym for many years. there is also a scene in one
of Edmond Crispin's mysteries (The Moving Toyshop? I can check but I'm too
lazy to get up right now) in which a group of Oxford dons, swimming naked in
Parson's Pool, takes off after a murderer and chases him through the town.
ConnieM
K. D. <flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:7v8jfl$3so8$1...@newssvr04-int.news.prodigy.com...
> My high school had a swimming pool, and part of PE involved weekly swim
> class. As for most PE classes, swim was not co-ed. We girls brought our
> own towels and other necessities, but were given suits every swim period,
> which we turned in at the end of class to be laundered.
>
> The door from the boys' locker room to the pool was locked when the girls
> had swim, and vice versa, for obvious reasons. But, especially since it
was
> common knowledge that the boys wore NOTHING during swim class. Zip.
> brother-in-law, who went to the HS on the other side of town, reports that
> they wore suits in swim.
>
Ralph Jones
I went to Camp Cloudmont, a summer camp near Mentone AL mostly populated by Miami
boys, in the summer of 1952. The lake swimming area there was suits optional.
A cousin in Connecticut who worked as a counselor at similar camps in the Northeast
in the late Fifties described the same thing.
rj
Dr H
On Wed, 27 Oct 1999, K. D. wrote:
}Are there any males out there who can attest to this practice? More
}importantly, WHY was it done?
Yes, we swam nude in junior high swim classes. On the high school
swim team, however, we wore suits.
As to why... nothing but idle speculation to offer.
Dr H
Dr H
On Thu, 28 Oct 1999, K. D. wrote:
}
}You have touched on (no pun intended) a topic I suspected had something to
}do with this entire aspect of male fraternity / sports / bonding. The
}homophobia.
}
}During these various discussions of male nudity while swimming and in locker
}rooms, etc., the topic did arise (again, no double entendre intended --
}yeah, right) about the fact that a male would have been branded for life had
}he to show any obvious signs of arousal while in the company of a bunch of
}other naked males.
}
}That some young males unarguably were aroused by the nudity of their male
}classmates, but were seemingly able to prevent themselves from showing their
}admiration somewhat dispels the "myth" that we girls heard during the same
}years of "I can't help it -- 'it' is out of my control."
I imagine that swimming 20-30 100-yard sprints was something of a factor
in 'dampening' any arousal...
Dr H
Dr H
On Thu, 28 Oct 1999, K. D. wrote:
}
}>there was some concern about what a wet bathing suit in a locker
}>would do over a weekend -- this was Houston before the schools
}>were air conditioned.
}
}Yes, the concern over expense does make sense. But, the girls in my HS were
}given towels and suits each swim period, which were collected and laundered,
}so I'm assuming that the boys were given towels, at least.
Sometimes we were. But real MEN didn't need towels. :-)
And the other comments about 'showering with 100 guys in the Army'
did jog some memory cells -- I recall hearing similar things as a
lad.
Dr H
R H Draney
> While we're on the topic, other posters have suggested the ban had something
> to do with preventing the filtration system from clogging. This makes some
> sense (even if it isn't actually true), because even tho the girls were
> provided with suits (which arguably could clog the filtration system as much
> as boys' suits), we did have to wear bathing caps. Since they don't usually
> keep your hair dry (a possible rationale) the reason was given that our hair
> would clog the filtration system. I can't remember about other places I
> have gone to swim, but the pool I use regularly now has nothing at all
> posted about a requirement to wear a bathing cap. Some women do. I think
> some men even do. But the vast majority don't. I guess either the reason
> about potential clogging of the filtration system was never valid, or
> filtration systems have improved, or both.
And this leads to another silly rule: women were required to wear bathing caps;
men were not...this persisted well into the time when some women were wearing
very short hair and some men went shoulder-length...I believe Dave Berg of Mad
magazine fame illustrated the clash between rule and reality in one of his
"Lighter Side" articles, late 1960s/early 70s....r
--
"I may not know much about art, but I know what they tell me I'm supposed to
like."
K. D.
Dr H wrote in message ...
>
>On Thu, 28 Oct 1999, K. D. wrote:
>}Yes, the concern over expense does make sense. But, the girls in my HS
were
>}given towels and suits each swim period, which were collected and
laundered,
>}so I'm assuming that the boys were given towels, at least.
>
> Sometimes we were. But real MEN didn't need towels. :-)
Without a doubt. And "real" women need two -- one for body, one for hair.
Guys -- I know this might not make sense to any of you, but believe me, it's
a "girl" thing.
K. D.
Dr H wrote in message ...
>
> in 'dampening' any arousal..
Probably a factor, but what about in the shower BEFORE entering the pool?
John Opalko
K. D. <flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
>
>Are there any males out there who can attest to this practice?
We swam nude at my high school (Chicago Public Schools, 1972). My father,
who attended the same school, said they swam nude in his day, too.
>More importantly, WHY was it done?
Who knows? Probably some male bonding thing. Anyway, it beat having to
wear trunks, but, then, I was an inveterate skinny-dipper at the time.
The girls had to wear these *U*G*L*Y* blue, shapeless things when they swam.
Or so I hear... ;-)
John "'gymnasium' comes from the Greek word for 'naked'" Opalko
--
John Opalko Clear Spring Associates, Ltd.
jo...@clearspring.com McMinnville, Oregon, USA
AFol...@webtv.net
"K. D." <flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
<major snip>
> Are there any males out there who can attest to this practice? More
> importantly, WHY was it done?
>
I can attest to the practice from Lake View High School, Chicago, forty years
ago. The legendary part was the story that blocks of ice were left to melt
in the pool overnight, for the entertainment of the 8:00 a.m. class.
--
Alan "retrospective goosebumps" Follett
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Nathan F. Miller
"Thomas J. Wood" <wo...@uis.edu> wrote:
>
> In the past males swam in rivers, lakes and pools nekkid routinely
and no one
> thought anything of it. Suits were only worn if ladies were present.
But
> sometimes not even then.
Indeed, and I would suspect that talk of threads clogging the drain
are just an excuse not to give up the perfectly natural and virtuously
heathenish practice too soon.
Another thought: Didn't the ancient Greek and Roman atheletes swim
in the nude? And isn't the idea of including "physical education" along
with mental education an aspect of how public education in democratic
societies has been largely rhetorically grounded in respect for old
Athenian ideals of the education of male citizens of the _polis_?
Could it have just been simple copying?
>
> Today men are much more homophobic than in the past. You can see this
fear
> growing in the 20th century by looking at group photos of sports
teams or
> fraternities over the years. In the early part of the century the
guys are all
> over each other; nowadays you rarely see any physical contact.
>
My fifty-something uncle from rural North-West Pennsylvania swears
that when he was a youth, there were "always" circle-jerks in the
weight room of the local YMCA; that "everyone" knew about it (I wonder
if "everyone" really means just the menfolk); that nobody thought there
was anything "gay" about it. I have heard similar stories from other
older guys, one of them saying he was peer-pressured to join in on the
grounds that the other guys would say he was "sissy" in he didn't.(!)
Nathan "and anyone who objects is obviously a commiepinkofag" Miller
HWM
> Some of
> the bathrooms had not been redesigned since then, and naturally there were
> no partitions (much less curtains!) in the communal showers.
Uhhh... communal "bathrooms" ? There's this one film atleast 'Full Metal
Jacket' that has a communal "bathroom" in one of the graphic scenes
allright, much resembling what we had when I was in the Finnish army
(barracks designed in 1934) not to mention the washbasins which
resembled a round feeding-through. After getting to barracks where the
toilets had partitions *between* them I really felt 'private'.
" Anything less than 8 blokes in it is considered a 'single room' "
Cheers, | The conformity of purpose will be achieved |
HWM | through the mutual satisfaction of requirements.|
"Mind the gap"=> hen...@iobox.fi & http://www.kuru.da.ru
HWM
> Probably a factor, but what about in the shower BEFORE entering the pool?
Even though they claim that cold makes you stiff, it has quite the
opposite effect on the male member. And I remember the showers never
being *warm*...
--
HWM
> We had the same story about the guy walking nekkid into the wrong place, and
> people who had been to other nude pool sites told it too.
If you get any Rowan Atkinson tv-flicks with him as "Mr Bean" there is
the one scene where he manages to loose his trunks (he's wearing those
golf shorts 'merkins call swimming suits vs. the sausage covers the
yurpeens use, apparently to enhance the humor)
And of course getting up butt naked out of the pool the girl's swimming
team is just getting in. Apparently an old joke.
Well, now remembering this, my dad has a pair of swimming trunks from
the 1950's he adamantly used, which did not fit too well. I have been
witnessing him and a few other elder gentlemen managing to twist their
trunks in the manner that when they sit down they "let it all hang
out".
K. D.
John Opalko wrote in message <7van4n$4cl$1...@jellicle.clearspring.com>
>The girls had to wear these *U*G*L*Y* blue, shapeless things when they
swam.
>Or so I hear... ;-)
Ours were shades of blue and aqua -- color-coded for size. Yes, they were
quite unflattering. Being as self-conscious as the next teen-age girl
during those year, I used to wear two -- one my size, and one the next
bigger size over it. This was not an uncommon practice.
K. D.
Nathan F. Miller wrote in message <7vbbfq$3id$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
> Another thought: Didn't the ancient Greek and Roman atheletes swim
>in the nude?
Uh, I suggest we not go down the road of what the ancient Greeks,
especially, did while nude..........
>And isn't the idea of including "physical education" along
>with mental education an aspect of how public education in democratic
>societies has been largely rhetorically grounded in respect for old
>Athenian ideals of the education of male citizens of the _polis_?
>Could it have just been simple copying?
Good point -- I don't know if this is the case.
> My fifty-something uncle from rural North-West Pennsylvania swears
>that when he was a youth, there were "always" circle-jerks in the
>weight room of the local YMCA; that "everyone" knew about it (I wonder
>if "everyone" really means just the menfolk); that nobody thought there
>was anything "gay" about it. I have heard similar stories from other
>older guys, one of them saying he was peer-pressured to join in on the
>grounds that the other guys would say he was "sissy" in he didn't.(!)
Hmmmm, this is interesting. I wonder if this is actually true, or just
embellishment of the past and/or teasing a gullible younger generation. You
know, a la "I walked to school, five miles, uphill both ways, through three
feet of snow....."
Speaking of walking to school through snow legends, I know a teenager whose
dad is from Quebec Province -- his dad tells the same sort of walking
through snow stories, but with the added touch "pulling my school books
behind me on a little sled." Nice, huh?
jerryG
"Andrea Jones" <aegi...@email.msn.com> wrote:
> Small misunderstanding here. I wasn't referring to co-ed showers, I
> was referring to the complaint in the e-mail I had quoted, wherein
> the female students complained that they didn't have individual shower
> stalls, and this lack was attributed to the fact that the dorm had
> been a men's dorm previously, and the showers weren't "converted" for
> the women.
>
Yeah, the group showers in junior high were lots of fun. It was like
a conveyer belt where you went in on one end and then out the other.
But you always had to watch-out for that wise-guy on the end taking a
pee. Anybody walking into the stream would get laughed at vigorously.
I went to bootcamp in Orlando, and there were rumors about the girls
smuggling bananas out of the galley in their purses. Any voracity
to that, or was that just a rumor started by the guys.
> Andrea "Although co-ed showers would have made boot camp more
> interesting" Jones
jerry "yes, but the co-ed shower scene in 'Starship Troopers' was
surreal" G
--
this little moment, brief as it may be- it need
not be long, for it is a leap. Soren Kierkegaard
Joachim Lous
| In the past males swam in rivers, lakes and pools nekkid routinely and no one
| thought anything of it. Suits were only worn if ladies were present. But
| army officer's club. The men are all swimming butt nekkid, while women and
| children watch.
You don't have to go that far back. You can still find communal showers
adjoining the pool in perfectly respectable german hotels, although suits
are worn in the pool.
I remember being very puzzled at a swimming pool in Texas (mid-80s) where
a sign in the boys' locker room said that trunks must be kept on in the
shower. I was used to the exact opposite in Norway: showering 'properly'
was mandatory before entering the pool. I'm still not quite sure what the
texan rule was supposed to achieve.
--
Joachim Lous joa...@nr.no
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking
his head,"are a sure sign of a diseased mind." - Terry Pratchett
Joachim Lous
| Another thought: Didn't the ancient Greek and Roman atheletes swim
| in the nude?
To the degree they swam as a sport, I would assume so, since they
ran, wrestled, threw etc. in the nude. But then there were only
male spectators.
--
Joachim Lous joa...@nr.no
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Five exclamation marks, the sure sign of an insane mind" - Terry Pratchett
Richard I. Pelletier
<Joachi...@nr.no> wrote:
> I remember being very puzzled at a swimming pool in Texas (mid-80s) where
> a sign in the boys' locker room said that trunks must be kept on in the
> shower. I was used to the exact opposite in Norway: showering 'properly'
> was mandatory before entering the pool. I'm still not quite sure what the
> texan rule was supposed to achieve.
The purpose was to wash the trunks, too, before they entered the pool.
Vale,
Rip
--
Multiplication is not commutative before breakfast.
Richard I. Pelletier
NB eddress: r i p 1 [at] h o m e [dot] c o m
Joachim Lous
| Are there any males out there who can attest to this practice? More
| importantly, WHY was it done?
Or more logically, what would be the POINT of trunks?
We are talking about a group of males only, that presumably would shower
together that same day anyway.
--
Joachim Lous joa...@nr.no
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Deborah Stevenson
On 29 Oct 1999, Joachim Lous wrote:
> You don't have to go that far back. You can still find communal showers
> adjoining the pool in perfectly respectable german hotels, although suits
> are worn in the pool.
>
> I remember being very puzzled at a swimming pool in Texas (mid-80s) where
> a sign in the boys' locker room said that trunks must be kept on in the
> shower. I was used to the exact opposite in Norway: showering 'properly'
> was mandatory before entering the pool. I'm still not quite sure what the
> texan rule was supposed to achieve.
One possibility is you misunderstood the situation. Communal
single-sex showers are common enough that a friend of mine (a babyfaced
Lutheran minister, just to make it more amusing) was buck nekkid and
showering away happily in one after his swim. Unfortunately, he'd been
misled by a vestigial urinal--this was in fact the suit-on coed shower
area, as he discovered when a bevy of young lovelies demurely clad in
Speedos happened upon him.
Other University of Chicago types here may well know which shower area I
speak of--it's the one for the pool at Bartlett. That urinal makes things
mighty confusing.
Deborah Stevenson
(stev...@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu)
HWM
> Other University of Chicago types here may well know which shower area I
> speak of--it's the one for the pool at Bartlett. That urinal makes things
> mighty confusing.
Reminds me of a bar toilet in France, the urinal on the left, the
'cabinet' on the right and a mirror, tap and washbin in the middle.
Well, I say it requires some gall to answer 'ca va' and try to avoid
squirting into your eye when a lady emerged from the cabinet happily
going 'ca va?'.
Andrea Jones
jerryG wrote in message <7vcois$4lt$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
<snip group showers>
>I went to bootcamp in Orlando, and there were rumors about the girls
>smuggling bananas out of the galley in their purses. Any voracity
>to that, or was that just a rumor started by the guys.
>
guys. My experience with the members of my brother division led me to
believe that those young men wanted _so_ badly to believe that the women of
their sister division were horny as hell and just panting after a chance to
get one of them alone, and that in lieu of a few minutes alone with a man,
we were engaged in everything from masturbation with bananas to lesbian sex.
Alas, it was not so. We were all so damn tired we fell into our racks and
slept like the dead from 2200 to 0400. And during the day if we had a spare
moment or two, we would go to almost any lengths to use it to take a nap.
In short, if we smuggled a banana out of the galley, it was because we
wanted to eat it right before PT (which unfortunately occured before
breakfast).
Andrea "I was an accomplished cookie smuggler" Jones
emu...@imap3.asu.edu
>
> Ah ha! And now I remember how the conversation started (about boys swimming
--> nude) with my visiting friend! He was saying that he had overheard some
> female students who were horrified at the shower accommodations in the dorm
> where they were living. Since the school had originally been male only, the
> dorms had all been designed and built with male students in mind. Some of
> the bathrooms had not been redesigned since then, and naturally there were
> no partitions (much less curtains!) in the communal showers.
FWIW, I've been out of high school for a relatively short time (hi. I'm
young. I apologize.) and nobody, male or female, EVER used the showers after
gym class at my high school or middle school, and those my age that I've
talked to have said the same about their HS's. (I wasn't involved in
extra-curricular sports, so I can't vouch for that.) We just doubled up on
the Secret.
I can't venture a guess why this is, that (many of) my generation prefered to
stink rather than be nude in front of others. well, I do have a guess. We
weren't given enough time to shower after class, much less to relacquer
our hair. But modesty could have played a part. We did master putting on one
shirt and removing the other without ever being shirtless, after all.
Thus, my generation is not accustomed to community bathing.
Erin "class of 96, class of 00" m
John Opalko
K. D. <flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
%
%Hmmmm, this is interesting. I wonder if this is actually true, or just
%embellishment of the past and/or teasing a gullible younger generation. You
%know, a la "I walked to school, five miles, uphill both ways, through three
%feet of snow....."
That's "...three feet of snow *in the blazing, hot sun*," if you please.
John "you youngins don't know how easy you've got it, by cracky" Opalko
Doug Weller
constance...@gte.net says...
> Although this is not exactly high school, Congressman and senators swam
> naked in the pool at their gym for many years. t
>
As we did at Yale in 1959!
--
Doug Weller Moderator, sci.archaeology.moderated
Submissions to: sci-archaeol...@medieval.org
Doug's Archaeology Site: http://www.ramtops.demon.co.uk
Co-owner UK-Schools mailing list: email me for details
Nina Neudorfer
Deborah Stevenson said:
> Other University of Chicago types here may well know which shower area I
> speak of--it's the one for the pool at Bartlett. That urinal makes things
> mighty confusing.
When I was at Penn State Univ. in the late 70's, my dorm building was
originally built as temporary housing for WWII vets who were taking
advantage of the GI Bill. There were maybe eight one story buildings, and
they alternated by sex, a man's dorm, then a woman's. All the buildings were
alike, with one big bathroom that had a long trough-like Urinal. We used to
do handwashing of underwear, etc in it. Woe to the guy who wouldn't take his
lazy ass 50 feet to a man's bathroom, and instead pissed in our urinal!
--
Nina " roar Lions roar"
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Ninth Grade Proficeincy Tests 10/22 - 29"
----marquee at South High School, Cleveland, OH
Walter Eric Johnson
: My high school had a swimming pool, and part of PE involved weekly swim
: class. As for most PE classes, swim was not co-ed. We girls brought our
: own towels and other necessities, but were given suits every swim period,
: which we turned in at the end of class to be laundered.
On another note, nearly 40 years ago, some of the girls at
Panhandle State College in Goodwell, Oklahoma were wondering
why their swimsuits were so loose. They very frequently
had to pull their tops back up after diving in. It turned
out that the men's swim team were playing around during some
of their night swims and wearing the swimsuits from the
women's locker room instead of their own.
Eric Johnson
Doug Weller
swimming is the norm, and there used to be more.
Mark D. Lew
<emu...@imap3.asu.edu> wrote:
> [...] Thus, my generation is not accustomed to community bathing.
For those who would try to determine when this change happened, my
experience is as follows:
In junior high (1976-1978) showering in PE class was routine and universal.
In 9th grade I had no PE class. In high school (1979-1982) some people
showered, but about 60% didn't.
mdl
Mark D. Lew
<flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
> Speaking of walking to school through snow legends, I know a teenager whose
> dad is from Quebec Province -- his dad tells the same sort of walking
> through snow stories, but with the added touch "pulling my school books
> behind me on a little sled." Nice, huh?
That's not extraordinary; it's just common sense. I grew up in Alaska. In
elementary school we often brought our plastic sleds to school for use
during recess. Walking to and from school I would frequently plot my
backpack on the sled and drag it along.
Mark D "and during the winter I walked over a small lake" Lew
Mark D. Lew
<flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
> Without a doubt. And "real" women need two -- one for body, one for hair.
> Guys -- I know this might not make sense to any of you, but believe me, it's
> a "girl" thing.
No, it's a length thing. When I had long hair, I needed two towels. Now
that I'm short again I'm fine with just one.
mdl
Dan Evans
>Thus, my generation is not accustomed to community bathing.
There was a recent article in the Philadelphia Inquirer about the
trend away from showering at school, by both males and females. The
article said that many gym showers in schools in the Philadelphia area
were rarely, if ever, used.
The article gave many of the same explanations for the trend, but
noted that wrestlers still tended to shower, probably because they are
less modest about their bodies and more concerned about sweat and
diseases from other wrestlers and the wrestling mats.
**Dan Evans
**I am not your lawyer unless
**you have sent me a check.
K. D.
>John Opalko wrote in message >That's "...three feet of snow *in the
blazing, hot sun*," if you please.
hahahaha -- pretty good, John. I had never heard THAT version.
But, did I tell you about the time (TRUE STORY) that I was walking to school
on snowy winter day....
In typical teen-age girl fashion, I did not want to wear my boots, so was
wearing my shoes, but carrying my boots (just in case). This worked pretty
well, in that the roads, driveways, and sidewalks were well-plowed, creating
those lovely slush-covered banks of snow along the edges.
At one point, I had to cross over one such bank. My foot encountered a soft
spot, and in went my leg, up to the thigh. When I pulled my leg out,
naturally the shoe stayed behind, in the snow.
<whew> Luckily I had those boots. I gave the shoe up for lost, put on my
boots, and went on to school.
The next spring, while walking by the same spot, I saw the shoe, floating in
a puddle produced from the spring thaw!
WHICH answers at least part of the question of where those single shoes one
sees along the road come from. It wasn't exactly on the highway, tho -- it
was in the driveway behind the maintenance building.
K. D.
Walter Eric Johnson wrote in message
.
>On another note, nearly 40 years ago, some of the girls at
>Panhandle State College in Goodwell, Oklahoma were wondering
>why their swimsuits were so loose. They very frequently
>had to pull their tops back up after diving in. It turned
>out that the men's swim team were playing around during some
>of their night swims and wearing the swimsuits from the
>women's locker room instead of their own.
Interesting. And somewhat kinky, perhaps?
retr...@bigpond.com
thing. It was huge, hundreds of people there. There was segregated
male/female areas, but everyone was naked there, all ages. I remember
getting some stares because some of the locals hadn't seen a foreigner
before!
Public bath houses are quite common in Japan. Not swimming, I know, but
still related to your post.
In direct reply to your post, in my experience here in Australia people
are more modest than the characters in your message.
*************
K. D.
Mark D. Lew wrote in message ...
>
>Mark D "and during the winter I walked over a small lake" Lew
Growing up in central NY state was not quite as frigid as Alaska, I am sure.
Yeah, at times, we would walk out on the bay, or shake there. I even used
to see people drive out for ice fishing.
HOWEVER, we were cautioned strenuously about this practice by all adults --
falling thru the ice being a real danger, a la George's brother, Harry, in
It's a Wonderful Life. I have no first-hand knowledge of this happening to
anyone out on the bay, or anyone drowning or freezing from same. I did fall
through the ice of a shallow pool along shore once -- MAN, was that cold!
retr...@bigpond.com
night except for the bathroom/toilets. So the toilet was the only place
to sit, play cards, talk, before sleeping.
***********************
retr...@bigpond.com
"K. D." <flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
>
> >John Opalko wrote in message >That's "...three feet of snow *in the
> blazing, hot sun*," if you please.
>
> hahahaha -- pretty good, John. I had never heard THAT version.
>
> But, did I tell you about the time (TRUE STORY) that I was walking to
school
> on snowy winter day....
>
> In typical teen-age girl fashion, I did not want to wear my boots, so
was
> wearing my shoes, but carrying my boots (just in case). This worked
pretty
> well, in that the roads, driveways, and sidewalks were well-plowed,
creating
> those lovely slush-covered banks of snow along the edges.
>
> At one point, I had to cross over one such bank. My foot encountered
a soft
> spot, and in went my leg, up to the thigh. When I pulled my leg out,
> naturally the shoe stayed behind, in the snow.
Wow! It's just so hard for me to imagine so much ice and stuff! I have
never lived anywhere and seen
retr...@bigpond.com
mark...@earthlink.net (Mark D. Lew) wrote:
> Mark D "and during the winter I walked over a small lake" Lew
____________________
David "and in the summer it was so hot it wasn't even funny" Crittle
(we frequently lose foreign tourists in the deserts)
retr...@bigpond.com
http://www.users.bigpond.com/retrovox
***************************************
K. D.
retr...@bigpond.com wrote in message <7vf2n3$lr8$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>I remember
>getting some stares because some of the locals hadn't seen a foreigner
>before!
Are you sure that's why they were staring? <tempted to use an emoticon
here -- I'm sure someone here would know of one which would be appropriate>
You know, there is that famous myth about certain ethnic / racial groups
being better endowed than others. Assuming you are not Asian and male,
perhaps non-Asian men are better endowed than Asian men. I do not know this
from personal, or even second-hand experience, and no offense at all to
Asian men -- just letting my mind wander.......
Feedback?
Paul Sweeney
Joachim Lous <Joachi...@nr.no> wrote in message
news:7vckpc$kq5$3...@snipp.uninett.no...
> Nathan F. Miller:
> | Another thought: Didn't the ancient Greek and Roman atheletes swim
> | in the nude?
>
> To the degree they swam as a sport, I would assume so, since they
> ran, wrestled, threw etc. in the nude. But then there were only
> male spectators.
Not so in Sparta old chap, the girls got to play as well as watch.
Paul "not that beach volleyball was around at the time" Sweeney
R H Draney
> You know, there is that famous myth about certain ethnic / racial groups
> being better endowed than others. Assuming you are not Asian and male,
> perhaps non-Asian men are better endowed than Asian men. I do not know this
> from personal, or even second-hand experience, and no offense at all to
> Asian men -- just letting my mind wander.......
>
> Feedback?
Sure...the Asian stereotype of a Caucasian is not the converse (tall, pale,
big-eyed?) of the Euro-Northamerican stereotype of an Asian...from what I've
heard (m*tt*?) the image is of someone with a really big NOSE, and covered with
hair from neck to knees....r
--
"God grant me the Serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
the Courage to change the things I can, and the Wisdom to know
the difference...oh, and a pony!"
John Gilmer
K. D. <flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:7v8jfl$3so8$1...@newssvr04-int.news.prodigy.com...
> My high school had a swimming pool, and part of PE involved weekly swim
> class. As for most PE classes, swim was not co-ed. We girls brought our
> own towels and other necessities, but were given suits every swim period,
> which we turned in at the end of class to be laundered.
>
> had swim, and vice versa, for obvious reasons. But, especially since it
was
> common knowledge that the boys wore NOTHING during swim class. Zip.
Nada.
> In the buff.
>
In my Pittsburgh grade school we were given out suits for swimming as were
the girls. One reason was that there was only one set of doors between a
"public" area and the pool.
When I attending an all boys school in Washington, DC they didn't supply
suits and the students were not permitted to bring their own. As indicated
elsewhere, this reduced the burden on the pool cleaning system. We were
expected to shower carefully before and after using the pool.
The instructor did wear a suit.
The time frame was the mid 50's.
JLG
>
Bill Schnakenberg
>
> In article <7vc5mh$t5g$1...@newssvr03-int.news.prodigy.com>,
> K. D. <flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
> %
> %Hmmmm, this is interesting. I wonder if this is actually true, or just
> %embellishment of the past and/or teasing a gullible younger generation. You
> %know, a la "I walked to school, five miles, uphill both ways, through three
> %feet of snow....."
>
>
That's nothing! When I was a kid I had to get up off the couch and walk all
the way across the room to change the TV channel or adjust the sound... in
3 feet of snow... with no shoes... uphill!
> John "you youngins don't know how easy you've got it, by cracky" Opalko
>
> --
> John Opalko Clear Spring Associates, Ltd.
> jo...@clearspring.com McMinnville, Oregon, USA
>
> http://www.clearspring.com/
--
Bill -
PSP Terrorist - D'Lanok de Caresk chapter - Anti-Troll Unit 235
--------------------------------------------------------------
The USS Salem, CA-139. The World's only preserved Heavy Cruiser,
Quincy, MASS. http://www.frontiernet.net/~willshak/salem/salem.html
--------------------------------------------------------------
Remove OutSpammedDot from my e-mail address when replying directly.
Any e-mail sent from @Hotmail.com is deleted without being read.
HWM
> Are you sure that's why they were staring?
"mommy-mommy- look, a bignosed hairy red monkey"
"shhh, don't stare"
ummhh... well, could be just that westerners are not regarded too clean,
you know they have no manners at all, imagine now thy sneeze in a paper
and then put it in their pockets - yecch...
And the writer did forget to mention if he had tattoos...
Chris W.
Okay, my Jr. High (grades 8-10) P.E. class of '82-'85 certainly didn't
shower. We only had five or ten minutes between bells to change. I
didn't take P.E. in H.S., as I was tired of changing in front of one
girl who liked to stare at everybody whilst changing.
Chris Webb
Ron Harless
boys PE. class swam in the pool nude.. He said it had something to
do with keeping the pool clean... Yea Right ? . I thought it was
odd at the time , but he is being truthful.. I told him that the
entire class is subject for a table porn book,,, called " Young
Bods,, in the Buff" ! Just never know who's taking pictures...
K. D.
Ron Harless wrote in message
<1699-381...@storefull-223.iap.bryant.webtv.net>...
What part of western NY, in particular, does your boss hail from? Just
curious.....
TGuelker
> > %embellishment of the past and/or teasing a gullible younger generation.
You
> > %know, a la "I walked to school, five miles, uphill both ways, through
three
> > %feet of snow....."
> >
> > That's "...three feet of snow *in the blazing, hot sun*," if you please.
> >
>
> That's nothing! When I was a kid I had to get up off the couch and walk
all
> the way across the room to change the TV channel or adjust the sound... in
> 3 feet of snow... with no shoes... uphill!
>
K. D.
danny burstein wrote in message <7vggpk$ef$1...@panix2.panix.com>
...
>You had multiple channels?
My earliest recollection is of two channels, both in glorious black and
white.
Phil Edwards
Weller) wrote:
>In article <P15S3.656$hp5....@dfiatx1-snr1.gtei.net>,
>constance...@gte.net says...
>> Although this is not exactly high school, Congressman and senators swam
>> naked in the pool at their gym for many years. t
>>
>As we did at Yale in 1959!
There was a small scandal at my (single-sex, downmarket fee-paying)
school shortly before I went there in 1973. One of the teachers had
started running Saturday morning swimming sessions in the school pool.
Open to all boys, free of charge, only one condition: no trunks. The
governors weren't best pleased when they found out.
Phil "obviously a classicist" Edwards
--
Phil Edwards http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/amroth/
"I'll shave the hamster and get back to you."
- Andrea Jones offers some Real Research
danny burstein
>>
>> That's nothing! When I was a kid I had to get up off the couch and walk
>all
>> the way across the room to change the TV channel or adjust the sound... in
>> 3 feet of snow... with no shoes... uphill!
>>
>both ways!
You had multiple channels?
--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
dan...@panix.com
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]
Robert M. Wilson
writes:
>>>
>>> That's nothing! When I was a kid I had to get up off the couch and walk
>>all
>>> the way across the room to change the TV channel or adjust the sound...
in
>>> 3 feet of snow... with no shoes... uphill!
>>>
>>both ways!
>
>You had multiple channels?
Ours was steam-operated.
We didn't have electricity.
Catherine
Are there any males out there who can attest to this practice? More
importantly, WHY was it done?
My brother attended an all-male catholic high school in the early 70s.
I remember him complaining to me when I was little that they insisted
that everyone swim nude.
David H. Siegel
> <Things about coed/ambiguously coed bathrooms>
>
> Nina " roar Lions roar"
Although I have not lived there, I've had the opportunity to use the
bathrooms in Wien, the only dormitory-style[1] dormitory here with coed
bathrooms. There are no urinals, just stalls, and, in the URH[2]
tradition, the shower stalls are about as private as the main gates.
While this leads to little confusion, it does lead to wonderful stories
from friends who have resided there. Similarly, all the bathrooms in the
suite-style dormitories (EC[2] is one) lack urinals.
Note to Ms. Robbins: Avoid Wien at all costs. I'm not kidding. If you
think JJ8[2,3] is bad, you have NO idea.
--
David "Roar, Lion, Roar/And wake the echoes of the Hudson Valley!"
Siegel
dh...@columbia.edu
<Webpage Coming Soonish>
"All tautologies are true." -David Kagan
[1] One hallway with rooms along the sides. As opposed to
suite/apartment style.
[2] BOA/TWINC Block: University Residence Halls, East Campus, John Jay.
[3] My floor last year.
Bill Schnakenberg
>
> In <s1nemk...@corp.supernews.com> "TGuelker" <fix...@hotmail.com> writes:
> >>
> >> That's nothing! When I was a kid I had to get up off the couch and walk
> >all
> >> the way across the room to change the TV channel or adjust the sound... in
> >> 3 feet of snow... with no shoes... uphill!
> >>
> >both ways!
>
> You had multiple channels?
Yep! Seven of 'em as I can recall.
> --
> _____________________________________________________
> Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
> dan...@panix.com
> [to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]
--
Bill Schnakenberg
> writes:
> >>>
> >>> That's nothing! When I was a kid I had to get up off the couch and walk
> >>all
> >>> the way across the room to change the TV channel or adjust the sound...
> in
> >>> 3 feet of snow... with no shoes... uphill!
> >>>
> >>both ways!
> >
> >You had multiple channels?
>
> We didn't have electricity.
Similar to george Gobel's gas guitar?
Suzanne Marie Saunders (LIS)
>"Mark D. Lew" wrote:
>> <emu...@imap3.asu.edu> wrote:
>> > [...] Thus, my generation is not accustomed to community bathing.
>> For those who would try to determine when this change happened, my
>> experience is as follows:
>> In junior high (1976-1978) showering in PE class was routine and universal.
>> In 9th grade I had no PE class. In high school (1979-1982) some people
>> showered, but about 60% didn't.
>Okay, my Jr. High (grades 8-10) P.E. class of '82-'85 certainly didn't
>shower. We only had five or ten minutes between bells to change. I
>didn't take P.E. in H.S., as I was tired of changing in front of one
>girl who liked to stare at everybody whilst changing.
high school, the year I had to take PE ('87-'88) showering was officially
required (I even wrote a letter to the school board complaining about it
at the beginning of the year, so I assume this was a county-wide policy.
I got a response citing the heat of Florida's climate as the reason.) In
practice, if the female coach was around, girls took off their outer
gym clothes, stayed in bra and panties and wrapped a towel around
themselves on top of that, and pretty much just stuck arms and legs into
the spray. If she wasn't around, the towel might just be used to wipe off
the sweatiest areas before putting regular clothes back on.
Suzanne
--
Suzanne Marie Saunders * "Whoo! Sensory deprivation kicks ass!"
segn...@crosswinds.net * -- Homer Simpson
http://www.crosswinds.net/~segnbora/
David Tarkowski
<emu...@imap3.asu.edu> wrote:
>Thus, my generation is not accustomed to community bathing.
>
In my physical education years ('87 to '94) there were several reasons that we
did not shower. I was in Southern California and there was a pretty good
water shortage going on at the time, the lack of time, the risk of disease,
mold, fungus, and somebody slipping and sueing the school, and the most
important, lack of funds to maintain the showers. Many of us were glad that
we did not have to shower in front of each other, but we were not allowed to
so were never presented with the choice.
-Dave "long, rambling sentences" Tarkowski
--
"Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball" -SNL
Bob Ward
<willshakOu...@frontiernet.net> wrote:
>"Robert M. Wilson" wrote:
>>
>> danny burstein wrote in message <7vggpk$ef$1...@panix2.panix.com>...
>> >In <s1nemk...@corp.supernews.com> "TGuelker" <fix...@hotmail.com>
>> writes:
>> >>>
>> >>> That's nothing! When I was a kid I had to get up off the couch and walk
>> >>all
>> >>> the way across the room to change the TV channel or adjust the sound...
>> in
>> >>> 3 feet of snow... with no shoes... uphill!
>> >>>
>> >>both ways!
>> >
>> >You had multiple channels?
>>
>> Ours was steam-operated.
>> We didn't have electricity.
>
>Similar to george Gobel's gas guitar?
I remember a gas-powered razor in a novelty shop a few years back...
Mark D. Lew
<flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
> Growing up in central NY state was not quite as frigid as Alaska, I am sure.
Don't be so sure. This was in Anchorage, where the temperature rarely goes
below zero (F). In December and January, temperatures are typically lower
in Chicago, Minnesota, etc, than in Anchorage. The main significance of
Alaska winters is not that they're colder, but that they last so much
longer. You could expect snow on the ground from about Halloween through
Easter.
> HOWEVER, we were cautioned strenuously about this practice by all adults --
> falling thru the ice being a real danger, a la George's brother, Harry, in
> It's a Wonderful Life.
On the first few days you'd stay off, of course, but after the temperature
had been below freezing for more than a few days it was never a concern.
The particular lake that we crossed every day was only about the size of a
city block, with little circulation and not very deep, so a week into
winter you could figure the whole thing was solid. When spring came, it
would usually melt from the top down. Sometimes, there would be a few
inches of water on the surface but you could still walk on it because it
was still solid below.
mdl
John Lupton
This is beginning to sound like a Simpsons episode...
"Oh, no, that's an *Albany* expression...not Utica" (Principal Skinner,
discussing "fried hams" with Superintendent Chalmers)
John "I alwayth lithp, exthept when I thay 'Ithaca'" Lupton
**********************************************
John Lupton, Network Services Manager
School of Arts & Sciences Computing
University of Pennsylvania, Philadelphia PA
**********************************************
jlu...@sas.upenn.edu
Jim Everman
The biker chick with a kick starter on her vibrator.
--
Jim Everman mailto:eve...@Anet-STL.com
http://www.Anet-STL.com/~everman/
Never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by
stupidity.
K. D.
Jim Everman wrote in message <381DB7...@anet-stl.com>
> The biker chick with a kick starter on her vibrator.
Is there a web site for this? The ladies of AFU need to know......
Mike Muth
On 30-Oct-1999, mark...@earthlink.net (Mark D. Lew) wrote:
> In article <Pine.GSO.3.96.991029...@email2.asu.edu>,
> <emu...@imap3.asu.edu> wrote:
>
> > [...] Thus, my generation is not accustomed to community bathing.
>
> For those who would try to determine when this change happened, my
> experience is as follows:
>
> In junior high (1976-1978) showering in PE class was routine and
> universal.
> In 9th grade I had no PE class. In high school (1979-1982) some people
> showered, but about 60% didn't.
In my junior and senior high school days ('64-'70), school policy was no
shower -> no pass.
Mike
Charles Wm. Dimmick
> "Andrea Jones" <aegi...@email.msn.com> wrote:
> > Small misunderstanding here. I wasn't referring to co-ed showers, I
> > was referring to the complaint in the e-mail I had quoted, wherein
> > the female students complained that they didn't have individual shower
> > stalls, and this lack was attributed to the fact that the dorm had
> > been a men's dorm previously, and the showers weren't "converted" for
> > the women.
??? Both Junior High School and Senior High School (In Orlando,
Florida, 1950's) had communal showers in both the boys' locker rooms
and the girls' locker rooms. My wife reports the same situation where
she went to school in Gainesville, FL. Years earlier, when I belonged
to the YMCA, we used to swim naked in the pool after gym. Also
same deal at summer camp (Camp Washington, nr Schooley's Mt,
New Jersey), swim naked in the morning, wear suits in the afternoon
(when ladies might be present).
Charles
"And some rin up hill and down dale, knapping
the chucky stanes to pieces wi' hammers, like
sae mony road-makers run daft -- they say it is
to see how the warld was made!"
Chip Taylor
>
>danny burstein wrote in message <7vggpk$ef$1...@panix2.panix.com>...
>>In <s1nemk...@corp.supernews.com> "TGuelker" <fix...@hotmail.com>
>writes:
>>>>
>>>> That's nothing! When I was a kid I had to get up off the couch and walk
>>>all
>>>> the way across the room to change the TV channel or adjust the sound...
>in
>>>> 3 feet of snow... with no shoes... uphill!
>>>>
>>>both ways!
>>
>>You had multiple channels?
>
>
>Ours was steam-operated.
>We didn't have electricity.
>
>
Chip
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
God, grant me the Senility to forget the people I never liked anyway, the
good fortune to run into the ones I do, and the eyesight to tell the
difference.
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
Dan Drake
> FWIW, I've been out of high school for a relatively short time (hi. I'm
> young. I apologize.)
WOW, is this outfit so dominated by old fogies that people have to
apologize for youth?
Seniority -- the fairest form of privilege, because all you have to do
is hang on long enough.
But I digress.
> and nobody, male or female, EVER used the showers after
> gym class at my high school or middle school, and those my age that I've
> talked to have said the same about their HS's...
>
> I can't venture a guess why this is, that (many of) my generation prefered to
> stink rather than be nude in front of others. well, I do have a guess. We
> weren't given enough time to shower after class, much less to relacquer
> our hair.
So, old Brick Johnson was right. I always thought so.
In my HS in the 50s *everybody* damn well took his [sic] shower in the
big communal shower room, and the coach made sure of it. (A laudable
policy, and there's no need to tell the unpleasant tale of one
down-side to it, except to mention that homosexuality was not
involved.) Brick would assure us occasionally that the Girls avoided
taking showers because [delivered in scornful mincing tones] they
didn't want to mess up their hair. He made it clear that Men, or
those aspiring to be, didn't have such concerns.
Those were the days. In the lesser grades, what is now middle school,
there were people who weren't really sure what he meant when, in his
drill-sergeant mode, he referred to the whole class as a bunch of
pansies.
> But modesty could have played a part.
It seems to me that an anti-modesty policy was a very important but
unspoken part of the mandatory showers. That the girls might have
avoided showers for reasons of modesty was not mentioned, if memory
serves, though perhaps mainly because the whole subject would have
been much too interesting to the boys; but it must have played some
part back in the prudish old 50s.
Odd how much modesty remains in real life, in this publicly
fantastically vulgar and salacious society. It's enough to make a
person think. ("You're right! Desperate measures are needed!")
By the way, as to having enough time: You kids think you have it
tough! At my school the boys had to go about 100 yards up a steepish
hill to get to the class buildings, and maybe much farther to get to
class. But it was uphill only one way, and we had no snow.
--
Dan Drake
d...@dandrake.com
http://www.dandrake.com
Meredith Robbins
> FWIW, I've been out of high school for a relatively short time (hi. I'm
> gym class at my high school or middle school, and those my age that I've
> extra-curricular sports, so I can't vouch for that.) We just doubled up on
> the Secret.
>
> I can't venture a guess why this is, that (many of) my generation prefered to
> stink rather than be nude in front of others. well, I do have a guess. We
> weren't given enough time to shower after class, much less to relacquer
> shirt and removing the other without ever being shirtless, after all.
>
> Thus, my generation is not accustomed to community bathing.
I never knew anyone to shower after gym class while I was in high
school, lo these many months ago. I just can't bring myself to
attribute this to modesty: a significant portion of the girls with whom
I went to school had no problem parading half-naked through the
hallways, much less completely naked through the locker room. It would
have been entirely contrary to the attitude of my high school to blanch
at the prospect of communal showering. There just wasn't enough time
alotted after class to shower and still make it to one's next class on
time. Besides which, the shower room was positively vile (which was
probably the result of the fact that no one ever used them -- they were
like ghost showers, with tumbleweeds rolling through and everything).
When I was in junior high school (they called it "middle school," but it
wasn't really), the school did offer towel service, even though no one
showered then, either. By the time I got to high school, they had
stopped offering towel service altogether.
> Erin "class of 96, class of 00" m
Meredith "class of '99, class of '03 -- let's talk about young, shall
we?" Robbins
--
"...[W]hile it might be funny as hell to plant a cockroach in your
buddy's taco, stabbing him to death just isn't."
-Andrea Jones, alt.folklore.urban
http://www.eclectricity.org might be funny as hell
Dr H
On Sat, 30 Oct 1999, Dan Evans wrote:
}On Fri, 29 Oct 1999 23:29:47 -0700, <emu...@imap3.asu.edu> wrote:
}>
}>FWIW, I've been out of high school for a relatively short time (hi. I'm
}>young. I apologize.) and nobody, male or female, EVER used the showers after
}>gym class at my high school or middle school, and those my age that I've
}>talked to have said the same about their HS's. (I wasn't involved in
}>extra-curricular sports, so I can't vouch for that.) We just doubled up on
}>the Secret.
}>
}>I can't venture a guess why this is, that (many of) my generation prefered to
}>stink rather than be nude in front of others. well, I do have a guess. We
}>weren't given enough time to shower after class, much less to relacquer
}>our hair. But modesty could have played a part. We did master putting on one
}>shirt and removing the other without ever being shirtless, after all.
}>
}>Thus, my generation is not accustomed to community bathing.
}
}There was a recent article in the Philadelphia Inquirer about the
}trend away from showering at school, by both males and females. The
}article said that many gym showers in schools in the Philadelphia area
}were rarely, if ever, used.
}
}The article gave many of the same explanations for the trend, but
}noted that wrestlers still tended to shower, probably because they are
}less modest about their bodies and more concerned about sweat and
}diseases from other wrestlers and the wrestling mats.
It wasn't an option for us. We were *required* to shower after
phys-ed, and before & after using the pool. On pain of a few miles
run around the track and several hundren push-ups...
Dr H
Dr H
90 posts in just 4-days: who would have imagined this to be a topic of
such intense interest in afu?
Dr H
K. D.
Dr H wrote in message ...
>
> 90 posts in just 4-days: who would have imagined this to be a topic of
> such intense interest in afu?
(no kidding, especially after you-know-who started the thread....)
Bill Schnakenberg
I bet that blew the stink off you!
>
> Dr H
jerryG
I'm just glad Andrea cleared up that UL concerning banana smuggling
from the galley in bootcamp. The chief-petty officers loved to start
rumors on our ship and I fell for most of them. Like, we're going to
the Netherlands and there's a large group of ladies waiting for us at
the pier. We ended up in Narvik, Norway, where I got my "Bluenose."
Or, we're going to Alexandria, Egypt, but ended up 40 miles off the
coast of Lybia following a Russian task force. Or, the one where we
were supposed to go to Tel Aviv but ended up off the coast of Somolia,
getting overflown by Mig 23's.
jerry "and we lost steering in the Suez Canal" G
--
this little moment, brief as it may be- it need
not be long, for it is a leap. Soren Kierkegaard
N Jill Marsh
<Pine.GSU.4.05.99110...@garcia.efn.org>:
Distribution:
Dr H (hiaw...@efn.org) wrote:
> 90 posts in just 4-days: who would have imagined this to be a topic of
> such intense interest in afu?
Not me, these shower threads don't even get this much traffic in rec.nude,
where they are somewhat more on-topic.
But in that vein...the story of a boy walking into the pool area nude
while the girls are in the pool is a standard one at every pool at which I
have regularly swam or worked, which is more than a couple of dozen
places. At the local highschool, there was even a name attached to the
fella, though this name changed every few years, thus keeping the person
three or four years older than the present class. While I have no doubt
that it may have happened on occaision, I have never met anyone who
experienced the incident directly (either as the victim or the spectator).
I suspect that these stories are just too funny to teenagers to let truth
get too much in the way.
At my highschool, the boys wore suits, though it was rumoured the varsity
teams skinny-dipped post practices after school hours.
njm
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well that old street light was painting mystical circles
on the pavement at the front of the bar;
While inside a band was playing magical music
to the strains of a blue melancholy guitar. (Hafner/Zinn/Hafner)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ilmari Karonen
: But in that vein...the story of a boy walking into the pool area nude
: while the girls are in the pool is a standard one at every pool at which I
: have regularly swam or worked, which is more than a couple of dozen
: places. At the local highschool, there was even a name attached to the
Well, I'm willing to confess that something similar has happened to me
personally, though I was only L8 years old then, which sort of ruins the
original punchline. I'd gone back to the shower after swimming, and was
obediently showering naked as the sign[1] said, when I suddenly remembered
I'd left my swimming goggles at the pool and ran to get them..
At least that's how I think it happened, though my memory isn't very good
on the details. I recall being very embarrassed by it then, though that's
rather hard to imagine as these days my pretty much only concern about
nudity is whether I might offend somebody else[2]. I suppose the remarks
by the classmates who witnessed the event were part of the explanation.
[1] Those signs saying "No sauna or showering while wearing a swimsuit"
seem to be found at every public swimming pool around here. About two
people out of three actually seem to follow the advice.
[2] No, that doesn't mean you can have a JPG.
--
Ilmari Karonen (reply address expires) - http://www.sci.fi/~iltzu/
"I would like to remind you that my statement that 'glass flows' is more
appropriate for this Newsgroup concerning Folklore than your knowledgable
tirade and scientific references." -- Rambler III in afu
Rambler III
[snip]
"....I'd left my swimming goggles at the pool and ran to get them."
In your modesty, did you try to hide what is above or below the waist?
Or did you march out like a soldier with your arms swinging in the
British style?
> Ilmari Karonen (reply address expires) - http://www.sci.fi/~iltzu/
> "I would like to remind you that my statement that 'glass flows' is more
> appropriate for this Newsgroup concerning Folklore than your knowledgable
> tirade and scientific references." -- Rambler III in afu
Surprise! Surprise!
Glass does flow at the end of blowpipe or pantil in the process of
making pane glass.
It's called crown glass or a bullseye.
You do know the names of glassmaking tools and their uses? For example,
what are wood- or steel-jacks or a handle-shear? What other method was
used to make pane glass by blowpipe? How is plate glass made? How is
pane glass made today?
--
RAMBLER III
"You must not spend your whole life looking for other people's
systematic mistakes. You must make some of your own."
Peter Van de Kamp, Astronomer
Andrea Jones
K. D. wrote in message <7vleq7$396k$1...@newssvr04-int.news.prodigy.com>...
>
>Dr H wrote in message ...
>>
>> such intense interest in afu?
>
>
>
really AFU's very own Anti-Christ. In fact, as several other people (who
you've apparently killfiled) have pointed out, when you're not having some
weird spasm of a persecution complex you tend to contribute well to the
group. So why don't you just give up on trying to cram yourself into the
"Poor, poor persecuted me" peg hole? It's getting pretty old.
Andrea "Come to think of it, I wonder if I'm on <ominous music> The List?"
Jones
Becca Ward
> Y'know, K.D., contrary to what you'd apparently like to believe, you aren't
> really AFU's very own Anti-Christ.
She can't be. The position has been filled.
> Andrea "Come to think of it, I wonder if I'm on <ominous music> The List?"
> Jones
Well, of course you are _now._
Becca Ward
--
So I guess I'm stuck with being the rooster in this froup
(when I'm not the antichrist). -- Charles Wm. "Aggie" Dimmick