Re: Starving people refuse to eat food aid
Richard Casady
<k...@KeithLynch.net> wrote:
>Was there ever a time when most people had horses and wagons?
>I don't think so.
How soon we forget. It not that long ago when most people were
farmers, and they pretty much all had horses and wagons.
Casady
Strobe
wrote:
Very few farmers ran their farm singlehanded, and I strongly suspect that
more Americans were farm laborers than were farmers.
I doubt that many farm laborers owned horse and wagon, or that they
had much need for such.
Lon
? What particular era and section of america do you base your claim on?
Every area I am familiar with had extended families as labor, and horses
and wagons only until tractors became available.
As for having a need for a horse, you dont need to own it to need it.
It could be argued [based on your claim of laborers] that the owner of
the horse had less need for it than the laborer who used it.
Not that it was all horses and tractors--for plowing the average bull
could outplow most horses, plus offer a tastier end game.
Mac
> Not that it was all horses and tractors--for plowing the average bull
> could outplow most horses, plus offer a tastier end game.
When one of the Maritimes switched the side of the road they drove on,
it was known as "the year of free beef." The oxen knew damned well
what side of the road they were supposed to be walking on, generally,
and mostly refused to go along with the new regulations, with
unpleasant consequences for them.
Anthony "Gives a new twist to "Year of the French," don't it?"
McCafferty
Mac
wrote:
As mentioned elsewhere, the number of vehicles and prime movers to
people used to be quite different, and some of them weren't used much
for carrying humans around. Oxen were the dominant traction animal
once, and they ain't too big on galloping on command.
Anthony "Mules-R-Us" McCafferty
Lon
> On Dec 27, 8:51 am, Lon <lon.stow...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>> Not that it was all horses and tractors--for plowing the average bull
>> could outplow most horses, plus offer a tastier end game.
>
> When one of the Maritimes switched the side of the road they drove on,
> it was known as "the year of free beef." The oxen knew damned well
> what side of the road they were supposed to be walking on, generally,
> and mostly refused to go along with the new regulations, with
> unpleasant consequences for them.
Sounds like an area without Open Range laws...where the world's most
expensive[1] cattle roam pretty much where they darned please.
[1] Hit one, and ask how much its gonna cost you.
Richard Casady
wrote:
Sure. Those laborers walked to town to buy their groceries.
Casady
Mac
They didn't wait for 'em to get hit. Oxen that couldn't cooperate
with the change went to slaughter as quickly as they could be
replaced, apparently. Since this was just post-(First World)War,
i.e., the year of free trucks, and the year of free aircraft engines,
a lot of them were not replaced by fellow oxen. I wonder what effect
this had on veal prices; a larger number of male cows might have been
diverted from that.
Anthony "travelling steer-age" McCafferty
Mac
wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Dec 2009 10:50:29 -0500, Strobe <Str...@nyc.Beep!Beep!.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> >wrote:
>
> >>On Fri, 11 Dec 2009 01:10:17 +0000 (UTC), "Keith F. Lynch"
> >><k...@KeithLynch.net> wrote:
>
> >>>Was there ever a time when most people had horses and wagons?
> >>>I don't think so.
>
> >>How soon we forget. It not that long ago when most people were
> >>farmers, and they pretty much all had horses and wagons.
It was not that long ago that most people were rural rather than
urban. Many of those "rural" folk were in small towns as well as on
farms, and many of them were in non-farming jobs, in fact, some
'citified" professions once required lower density -everyplace needed
lawyers, for instance- and these people were often land-owning and
identified as such -i.e., as a farmer. You also had the spinoff from
Jeffersonian ideas about the inherent moral superiority of the Noble
Man of the Soil; many men who wore many hats, as rural folk often do,
were fondest of identifying themselves as "farmer." For example,
George Washington and Thomas Jefferson both seem to have seen
themselves as "farmers," in one sense of the word, rather than as
surveyors or lawyers or retired soldiers or government officials.
Rural laborers, who might work in manufacturing one week, farming
another three, and transportation the next, were generally loosely
lumped in the "farm laborer" category, unless they had a particular
skilled trade.
> >Very few farmers ran their farm singlehanded, and I strongly suspect that
> >more Americans were farm laborers than were farmers.
> >I doubt that many farm laborers owned horse and wagon, or that they
> >had much need for such.
>
> Sure. Those laborers walked to town to buy their groceries.
The number of little corner stores, especially in some parts of the
South, that were in walking range, was surprising.
Anthony "No cites. Not until the SF flood ebbs" McCafferty
Hatunen
<Str...@nyc.Beep!Beep!.com> wrote:
That kind of depends on how far back you're going. In 18th C
America most farms were small freeholds (in the North, at least)
and were pretty much family-run. That mode persisted into the 19
C but the family farms were stretching out intot he Midwest.
--
************* DAVE HATUNEN (hat...@cox.net) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
Hatunen
<richar...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>On Sun, 27 Dec 2009 10:50:29 -0500, Strobe <Str...@nyc.Beep!Beep!.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 27 Dec 2009 07:25:56 -0600, Richard Casady <richar...@earthlink.net>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>On Fri, 11 Dec 2009 01:10:17 +0000 (UTC), "Keith F. Lynch"
>>><k...@KeithLynch.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Was there ever a time when most people had horses and wagons?
>>>>I don't think so.
>>>
>>>How soon we forget. It not that long ago when most people were
>>>farmers, and they pretty much all had horses and wagons.
>>
>>Very few farmers ran their farm singlehanded, and I strongly suspect that
>>more Americans were farm laborers than were farmers.
>>I doubt that many farm laborers owned horse and wagon, or that they
>>had much need for such.
>
>Sure. Those laborers walked to town to buy their groceries.
Farm laborers of old generally lived on the farm and ate at a
shared table. The free room and board was one of the attractions
of the job.