A blast from the past
Greg Widdicombe
but ...
Supposedly, it is possible to listen to sounds that existed in the
past by "playing" ancient pottery. When the potter was making the
pot, objects in contact with the wet clay or glaze vibrated because of
ambient noise, and were transcribed ono the material. My guess is
that you just need a similar material to be able to play it again.
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Doug S. Caprette Bldg. 28 W191 x3892
>I can't remember if I heard this from a FOAF, or read it in a SF book
>but ...
>
>Supposedly, it is possible to listen to sounds that existed in the
>past by "playing" ancient pottery. When the potter was making the
>pot, objects in contact with the wet clay or glaze vibrated because of
>ambient noise, and were transcribed ono the material. My guess is
>that you just need a similar material to be able to play it again.
>
>
Cleveland (Ohio, U.S.) Plain Dealer something like twenty years ago. The
claim was that when the pots were 'played back' conversations between the
pottery workers could be heard. The pots were supposed to be Babylonian,
or Sumerian, or some such. The column appeared at the bottom of the comic
section, if that's any kind of a hint as to how reliable it was!
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William Logan Lee
>but ...
>
>Supposedly, it is possible to listen to sounds that existed in the
>past by "playing" ancient pottery.
From the esteemed "New Scientist" of a few years ago, in the Ariadne
section. From here they used to describe plausible inventions that,
like perpetual motion machines, had at least one teeny, tiny flaw that
would prevent this wonderful invention working.
Bill Lee
(Come to think of it, I think that the Jindalee over-the-horizon radar
has similar problems with its high noise environment. Now if we could
get thousands of pots made simultaneously, and synchronised their
sound pick-ups, we may get somewhere...)
Barry Shein
From: widd...@ADS.COM (Greg Widdicombe)
>Supposedly, it is possible to listen to sounds that existed in the
>past by "playing" ancient pottery. When the potter was making the
>pot, objects in contact with the wet clay or glaze vibrated because of
>ambient noise, and were transcribed ono the material. My guess is
>that you just need a similar material to be able to play it again.
This was on an episode of Arthur Clarke's show (what's its name, I
forget.)
It was sort of interesting, at least as an idea. The pot was Roman.
The sound roughly resembled a potter's wheel going round (ok, not too
fascinating) and it sounded like perhaps something dropped in the
studio at one point, a bit of a crash.
--
-Barry Shein
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Christopher Neufeld
>In article <1992Feb11.0...@ads.com> widd...@ADS.COM (Greg Widdicombe) writes:
>>I can't remember if I heard this from a FOAF, or read it in a SF book
>>but ...
>>
>>Supposedly, it is possible to listen to sounds that existed in the
>>past by "playing" ancient pottery.
>
>From the esteemed "New Scientist" of a few years ago, in the Ariadne
>section.
>
book _The Inventions of Daedalus_ without permission:
Sir, - This is one of those very, very odd coincidences, I am sure.
I refer to the *New Scientist* of 6 February, p. 308, where
Daedalus...`points out that a trowel, like any flat plate, must
vibrate in response to sound: thus, drawn over the wet surface by the
singing plasterer, it must emboss a gramophone-type recording of his
song in the plaster. Once the surface is dry, it may be played
back' (etc.)...
How very odd, that I should have sent to *Nature*, a paper (dated
13 January, 1969) entitled `*Acoustic Recordings from Antiquity*';
which paper was perfunctorily rejected as being `too specialized'.
In my paper I noted my early experiments (1961) in the recording
of sound (music, voices, etc.) on clay pots and on paint strokes
applied to canvas (as in oil paintings) and the *successful*
reproduction of such sound using a crystal phono pickup and a
spatulate, wooden `needle'.
[ stuff deleted ]
Richard G. Woodbridge, III
The book goes on to point out that "Dr. Woodbridge finally published his
paper in the *Proceedings of the IEEE (Vol 57(8), August 1969, p.1465)."
I haven't looked up the IEEE paper, but I think we can mark this one as
true.
--
Christopher Neufeld....Just a graduate student | Blessed are the meek,
neu...@helios.physics.utoronto.ca Ad astra | for they shall
| inhibit the Earth.
"Don't edit reality for the sake of simplicity" |
David P. Murphy
>I can't remember if I heard this from a FOAF, or read it in a SF book but ...
>
>Supposedly, it is possible to listen to sounds that existed in the
>past by "playing" ancient pottery. When the potter was making the
>pot, objects in contact with the wet clay or glaze vibrated because of
>ambient noise, and were transcribed ono the material. My guess is
>that you just need a similar material to be able to play it again.
>
oh yes indeed it is from a science-fiction story. however i have forgotten
who/what/where/etc.
could the r.a.sf.w. gurus please assist us on this? thanks.
ok
dpm
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DSTE...@cmsa.gmr.com
------------------------- Original Article -------------------------
ne...@helios.physics.utoronto.ca writes:
>
> stuff deleted
> The book goes on to point out that "Dr. Woodbridge finally published his
>paper in the *Proceedings of the IEEE (Vol 57(8), August 1969, p.1465)."
>
> I haven't looked up the IEEE paper, but I think we can mark this one as
>true.
I did look up the IEEE "paper." It is, in fact, a letter (complete ref:
R. G. Woodbridge, III, "Acoustic Recordings from Antiquity", IEEE Proceedings
Letters, Vol 57, No 8, Aug. 1969, 1465-6.
In it he describes experiments in which he made pots and paintings (with modern
equipment) and then tried to playthe surfaces back to hear the hum of the
potting wheel motor, etc. He does give one oblique reference in which he
claims to have extracted the word "blue" from a blue patch on a painting, but
doesn't identify the painting. Seems like a load of horseshit to me.
BTW, they give his address as Box 111, Princeton Junction, NJ, 08550, and
indicate that he would be pleased to receive business cards.
David Van Allen
Gregory Benford..."Time Shards" (c)1979 in "In Alien Flesh"
a collection of his short stories... the pottery played in the story
was from medieval England and snatches of middle English speech are
heard...the potter arguing about converting to CHristianity with his assis-
tant... potter tells his pal to speakinto the pot while the wheel spins
that his words will be held by spirits in the pottery for his progeny..
his buddy passes on such usefull information as" Mark ye! Hie not
ta strags in the house of Lutes. They carry the red pox! ...beware
the Kinseps-they bugger all they rule! An' while pot-charrin, mix the fair
smelt wi' greeno erst, 'ere ye'll flux it fair speedy. Ne'er leave a sheep
near a lean house, ne '..."((c) G. Benford)
. The scientists listening in are involved in their own project to pass
something on to posterity, 'the Vault', and have a crisis of faith
that their attempt would fare any better than the potter's to leave a
comprehendable legacy. Greg Benford, that's the guy.
---
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Jason E Levine
:but ...
:
:Supposedly, it is possible to listen to sounds that existed in the
:past by "playing" ancient pottery. When the potter was making the
:pot, objects in contact with the wet clay or glaze vibrated because of
:ambient noise, and were transcribed ono the material. My guess is
:that you just need a similar material to be able to play it again.
This theory was offered by someone (I cannot remember who), and then that
person was subsequently laughed at by almost every scientist who had the
patience to listen to his explanations. Needless to say, NOBODY accepts
this as real.
Jason Levine
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``I admire Ted Kennedy. How | Jason Levine / Columbia University many 59-year-olds do you know | * INET: je...@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu
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Mark Brader
back accidental sound recordings from ancient pottery. (The idea, of
course, is that a tool dragged along the wet clay might serve as a
phonograph stylus.) Was it fact, science fiction, urban legend or what?
An article from DSTE...@cmsa.gmr.com identifies some factual basis...
> I did look up the IEEE "paper." It is, in fact, a letter (complete ref:
> R. G. Woodbridge, III, "Acoustic Recordings from Antiquity", IEEE Pro-
> ceedings Letters, Vol 57, No 8, Aug. 1969, 1465-6). In it he describes
> experiments in which he made pots and paintings (with modern equipment)
> and then tried to play the surfaces back to hear the hum of the potting
> wheel motor, etc. He does give one oblique reference in which he claims
> to have extracted the word "blue" from a blue patch on a painting, but
> doesn't identify the painting. Seems like a load of horseshit to me.
...but I know I've read a science fiction story about it as well.
I have the impression it was written around 1980, give or take a few
years, but I read it in an anthology so I could be quite a bit off.
In the story, one or more scientists did succeed in playing back such
accidental recordings from ancient pottery, and promptly discovered
things that would make the historians of the relevant period *very*
unhappy...
Can someone identify the story? If so, email me (I repeat: email me!
Never post followups to story requests!), and I'll post a followup
to both of the groups in which this appears.
--
Mark Brader, SoftQuad Inc., Toronto, utzoo!sq!msb, m...@sq.com
"[Jupiter's] satellites are invisible to the naked eye and therefore can
have no influence on the Earth and therefore would be useless and
therefore do not exist." -- Francesco Sizi, quoted by T. Cox
This article is in the public domain.
Mark Brader
> There was a question in alt.folklore.urban about a claim of playing
> I know I've read a science fiction story about it as well.
... a week-older article from David Van Allen (dv...@auvm.american.edu)
in alt.folklore.urban was trudging its way to my site with the answer.
The story is from 1979: "Time Shards" by Gregory Benford, found in his
collection "In Alien Flesh". Thanks to David and also to Bill Morrow
who emailed me a partial answer.
Cross-posted only because I said I would. Followups to a.f.u.
--
Mark Brader "Anyone who can handle a needle convincingly
SoftQuad Inc., Toronto can make us see a thread which is not there."
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