I finally bought a car

[**Dalin**]

I really, really did want an electric car, but they are just too
"iffy" now as dependability. Maybe a few years down the road.
So I narrowed it down to two cars, a really fun little car, the Honda
Fit Sport and the mid-sized Prius. The Prius was fun, like sitting in
an airplane cockpit with all the digital graphs and info you could get
even beamed onto your lower windshield so you didn't have to take your
eyes off the road. And it gets 50 mpg but the Fit gets 38 and at
half the price! And more fun to drive.

It wasn't much of a choice. I bought the Fit, had to order from the
factory because I think maybe I entered my second childhood, but I
picked a burnt orange metallic color. Totally black inside, dash,
seats, ceiling, floor and so dark they give you ambient blue lighting
on the floor. But that metallic burnt orange is me! LOL! I have to
wait about a month for it though, but I'll never lose my car in the
parking lot again. :-)

Dalin

[Sir Gregory Hall, Esq.]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message
news:4f71ecb0...@news.individual.net...

Let me be the first to congratulate you on a great decision. You did
good!!!

I think you'll find that Honda builds the best small fuel efficient cars
available. And, if you drive reasonably and don't do jack rabbit starts
and race around you might get closer to 40mpg.

--
Sir Gregory

[Joy]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message
news:4f71ecb0...@news.individual.net...

A bright color can definitely help in the parking lot! I'm glad mine is
blue, although I have mistaken another car for mine a time or two. Most
cars nowadays seem to be boring neutral colors.

Joy

[Joan F (MI)]

Good choice, I'm sure you'll love it as much as I love mine. Mine is a bit
more subdued, a bluish pearl color called Lunar Mist.

[Sir Gregory Hall, Esq.]

"Joy" <toa...@real-me.net> wrote in message
news:4f6cf8e3$0$10924$bd46...@news.dslextreme.com...

A bright colored car is probably safer as well. I see to many cars these
days that are almost the same color as the roadway. They just don't stick
out like a sore thumb like a bright colored car. As more and more baby
boomer with less than good eyesight continue to drive I'd not want to
drive a pavement-colored car. I've even caught myself not seeing them
sometimes when I turn my head back to take a quick look at oncoming
traffic before crossing the road especially when the sun's in my eyes.

--
Sir Gregory

[Independent old cuss]

We're all Honda fans around here. Motorcycles, Honda Element, Pilot
and that plaything they call a pickup. Best resale value in the
business I think. Don't know much about the Fit but at 6'9 I don't
think I could get in it.
---

H L Mencken got it right when he said:

"Elections are a battle between
those that work for a living and
those that vote for a living!"

An independent old cuss

[**Dalin**]

I test drove it up a road with a 45 mph limit and the little gauge
said I was getting 40 mpg. It's hard to figure an average, when I
took my foot off the gas it said 80 mph. <g>

Maybe I'll race around just a little bit at first. :-)

Dalin

[Sir Gregory Hall, Esq.]

"Independent old cuss" <cu...@exitin.com> wrote in message
news:eoupm75h3sc40qb15...@4ax.com...

How do you like that Element. It's a car on my short list when my old Ford
Aerostar gives up the ghost.

What kind of real world mileage are you getting with it.

Being a box does it get buffeted a lot when semis blow past?

How does it handle?

Any service problems with it yet?

--
Sir Gregory

[**Dalin**]

The neutral color cars are difficult to tell apart here in the winter.
(Except for this year) They are dirty, muddy, salt encaked, and all
look the same color.

I did notice when we went to the car show this year that VW had a
bright yellow little car, Hyundai makes a Veloster that is bright
orange or bright gold, Kia makes the Soul which is a bright lime
green. Fun colors, but generally for the younger crowd and the small
cars. Unless you're going into your second childhood like I and don't
care what people think of you driving an orange car. :-)

Dalin

[Sir Gregory Hall, Esq.]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message

news:4f74fc66...@news.individual.net...

Be easy on it at first until it's "broken in." New motors have various
moving parts that haven't really mated together yet. Piston rings and
valve seats, for example. If you hot rod your engine before it's broken in
you can cause metal to metal scouring and that's not a good thing. So wait
until about 300 miles of easy driving before you start to put your foot in
it.

Did you get the stick shift or the automatic?

--
Sir Gregory

[**Dalin**]

On Fri, 23 Mar 2012 18:29:12 -0400, "Joan F \(MI\)"
<jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote:

>Good choice, I'm sure you'll love it as much as I love mine. Mine is a bit
>more subdued, a bluish pearl color called Lunar Mist.

And I really appreciate your help in answering some of my questions in
e-mail Joan. :-) Knowing someone that really owns one and will vouch
for it is a lot better than reading the reviews on the internet.

I guess they've changed the colors since you got yours. Actually the
orange isn't REALLY bright but more of a burnt orange. But you just
don't see many orange cars around, or pink, or lavender either, or
pale green.

It will be a long month, hope there are no snags as happened to you.
It's such a fun car to drive. :-)

Dalin

[**Dalin**]

On Fri, 23 Mar 2012 18:53:44 -0400, " Sir Gregory Hall, Esq."

I got automatic. And I had forgotten about breaking a new car in. Is
that still true these days with all the fancy engines etc.? Thanks
for reminding me, I will ask the dealer when I pick it up. I have a
list of questions. this will go on the top. I know when David bought
his mew motorcycle last year he was very careful to break it in.

You know, we as a group may insult and fight, but when someone wants
to know something, like I did about electric cars and voltage,
everyone comes through with help.

Dalin

[NotMe]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message

news:4f7802d8...@news.individual.net...

For the most part current manufacturing tolerances don't have a long break
in period. Best to follow what's in the manual.

Most cars have a 5K oil change cycle. Unless you're real hard on the use
(bad roads, lots of dust etc) that should be sufficient.

Keep good records.

[Sir Gregory Hall, Esq.]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message

news:4f7802d8...@news.individual.net...

Here's a good discussion on break-in.

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=543897

[Joan F (MI)]

Yes, they change the colors a bit every year, they don't make my color
anymore. Cathy's is purple but a very dark purple, more of a purplish
black. I doubt you'll have as much trouble, the supply chain has loosened
up, when I got mine they didn't even have any models on the showroom floor,
now whenever I go by the dealer there are some in their lot. Did you get
the automatic or stick?

[Joan F (MI)]

You might be surprised. For one thing, it is higher off the ground that a
lot of small cars, makes it easier to get in and out of.

[Joan F (MI)]

They say no but I still adhere to a bit of breaking in. For one thing,
don't drive too long at a constant speed, vary it a bit.

[Joan F (MI)]

The Fit tells you when to change the oil, one of the settings on the
odometer tells you the percentage of life left in the oil, when it gets
below 20% it's time to think about a change.

[Joan F (MI)]

I wouldn't mind lime green but I'm not fond of orange.

[Chazz]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message
news:4f71ecb0...@news.individual.net...

Congrats, Dalin! Easy choice and jazzy color combo! :)

[NotMe]

"Joan F (MI)" <jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote in message
news:D5qdnecm3ZG4iPDS...@giganews.com...

> The Fit tells you when to change the oil, one of the settings on the
> odometer tells you the percentage of life left in the oil, when it gets
> below 20% it's time to think about a change.

Is that a response to the condition of the oil or a preprogrammed notice
from the factory?

[Joan F (MI)]

Not from the factory. I think it's some kind of algorithm based on mileage,
time and perhaps type of driving.

[**Dalin**]

Always. I only put about 3,000 miles a year on it, but the oil gets
changed twice a year anyway, with half synthetic and half real.

Dalin
>

[**Dalin**]

On Fri, 23 Mar 2012 19:42:31 -0400, " Sir Gregory Hall, Esq."

Thanks! Helps to know why I'm breaking it in. :-)
Dalin

[**Dalin**]

On Fri, 23 Mar 2012 20:22:45 -0400, "Joan F \(MI\)"
<jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote:

>Yes, they change the colors a bit every year, they don't make my color
>anymore. Cathy's is purple but a very dark purple, more of a purplish
>black. I doubt you'll have as much trouble, the supply chain has loosened
>up, when I got mine they didn't even have any models on the showroom floor,
>now whenever I go by the dealer there are some in their lot. Did you get
>the automatic or stick?

I got the automatic. They had one model on the showroom floor and it
was my color too, but didn't have the navigation system in it that I
wanted. So I wait, and it better not be as long as you had to wait.
<g>

[**Dalin**]

On Fri, 23 Mar 2012 20:36:20 -0400, "Joan F \(MI\)"
<jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote:

>I wouldn't mind lime green but I'm not fond of orange.

Well it's kind of muted. I would call it a Burnt Orange.

[**Dalin**]

Thanks. :-) I figure if you're going to get a sporty looking car,
might as well have a sporty color. Fellow up the street just bought a
new Veloster. Really different looking car, quite sporty. Comes in a
bright, bright orange or a bright, bright gold, all metallic too, and
he bought black! Now that car doesn't stand out at all.

Dalin
>

[Norma]

On Mar 23, 7:17 pm, **Dalin** <l...@usa.net> wrote:
> On Fri, 23 Mar 2012 18:53:44 -0400, "  Sir Gregory Hall, Esq."
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

> <gregh...@home.fake> wrote:
> >"**Dalin**" <l...@usa.net> wrote in message

> >news:4f74fc66...@news.individual.net...
> >> On Fri, 23 Mar 2012 18:06:49 -0400, "  Sir Gregory Hall, Esq."

> >> <gregh...@home.fake> wrote:
>
> >>>"**Dalin**" <l...@usa.net> wrote in message

When I bought my Corolla 3 years ago, I promptly took it on a 500 mile
road trip. I have never had any problems with it and get a
consistent 32 mpg whether I am on the road or just noodling around
town. Maybe I would get better gas mileage if I had not driven it so
far, so fast, so soon. I'll never know.
Norma

[Crusher]

A recent study found that the average car on the road is now 11 years old,
up from a historical 9 years that prevailed for quite some time. The
reason, surprisingly, is not entirely because of the recession. Stories
abound of people driving their vehicles for hundreds of thousands of miles,
often with few or any major repairs. A total engine rebuild, onc a regular
occurence, is now quite rare, and a car with 100,000 miles on it is
commonplace. Cars are indeed of far better quality than they once were, and
the public has and is saving a lot of money because of it.

--Bob--

[Joy]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message

news:4f73b6b2...@news.individual.net...

Of course, you have to be on your best behavior when you're driving a car
that stands out. When I took traffic school years ago, I learned that
yellow cars are more likely to get tickets than any other car. The main
reason is that it's easy to spot them doing something wrong.

Joy

[Independent old cuss]

One of the grandkids drive it now. We put a hundred thousand miles on
it and all we ever did was take it in every time the owners manual
called for it. I probably rode in it 10 times and it was fine. My wife
is very upset that they stopped making them. She drives the toy pickup
now, it's just a pilot with a pickup bed but it's pretty nice.

The Element never got less than 24mpg and it had some road noise but I
don't recall any reports of buffeting in the wind. One of the best
handling vehicles I've ever driven but then, I drive big dually
pickups and Honda don't make those.

[Joan F (MI)]

Black cars show the dirt worse than any other color I think. And they
absorb heat in the summer. I prefer a lighter color although I do like a
British Racing Green.

[Sir Gregory Hall, Esq.]

"Independent old cuss" <cu...@exitin.com> wrote in message

news:msesm7dtu8c8fk7c4...@4ax.com...

Thanks, I sure didn't know Honda stopped making it.

[Séimí mac Liam]

"Joan F \(MI\)" <jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote in
news:WImdnUdCGNK53vPS...@giganews.com:

In the 'good old days', the cars with the straightest, truest bodies were
chosen to be painted black. Not so much any more.

--
Saint Séimí mac Liam
Carriagemaker to the court of Queen Maeve
Prophet of The Great Tagger
Canonized December '99

[**Dalin**]

On Sat, 24 Mar 2012 17:57:09 -0400, "Joan F \(MI\)"
<jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote:

>Black cars show the dirt worse than any other color I think. And they
>absorb heat in the summer. I prefer a lighter color although I do like a
>British Racing Green.

I've always had white cars before this and they are very slow to show
dirt. You would think it would be the other way round though, being
white. I like green cars too; you hardly ever see any.

[Joy]

When I bought my current car, I really wanted a bronze-colored one.
However, I got an exceptionally good price on this one. The color is
"Mystic Teal". It's a fairly deep, slightly greenish, blue. I love it! My
son was jealous when he saw it. When he got his last car, he tried to get
the same color, but it was no longer available, so he settled for a deeper
blue.

--
Joy

Nothing is impossible. Some things are just less likely than others. --
Jonathan Winters

"Joan F (MI)" <jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote in message

news:WImdnUdCGNK53vPS...@giganews.com...

[**Dalin**]

On 24 Mar 2012 22:03:49 GMT, "Séimí mac Liam"

<gwy...@comcast.nospam.net> wrote:

>"Joan F \(MI\)" <jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote in
>news:WImdnUdCGNK53vPS...@giganews.com:
>
>> Black cars show the dirt worse than any other color I think. And they
>> absorb heat in the summer. I prefer a lighter color although I do
>> like a British Racing Green.
>>
>> **Dalin** wrote:
>>|
>>| Thanks. :-) I figure if you're going to get a sporty looking car,
>>| might as well have a sporty color. Fellow up the street just bought
>>| a new Veloster. Really different looking car, quite sporty. Comes
>>| in a bright, bright orange or a bright, bright gold, all metallic
>>| too, and he bought black! Now that car doesn't stand out at all.
>>|
>>| Dalin
>>
>
>In the 'good old days', the cars with the straightest, truest bodies were
>chosen to be painted black. Not so much any more.

Weren't they the more 'sedate' cars that most everyone bought?
Back when a lot of people didn't even own a car as they were so
expensive for the average family?

Dalin

[Séimí mac Liam]

**Dalin** <lj...@usa.net> wrote in
news:4f79545f...@news.individual.net:

Before robotic construction, all cars were not created equal.
Ferinstance, you didn't want to buy a car built on Monday(everyone was
hungover). When someone ordered a black car, they sorted to cars on the
line for the best, straightest body, because if the body wasn't perfect,
every little imperfection glared right out at you. Not so with cars
painted light colors. Now, with robotic constuction methods cars are
pretty uniform as they go to paint and it doesn't matter so much. Also,
robots don't stay drunk all weekend.

[Joy]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message

news:4f79545f...@news.individual.net...

Of course way, way back, Henry Ford is supposed to say that you could have a
Ford in any color you wanted, as long as it was black.

Joy

[Jean B.]

**Dalin** wrote:
> I really, really did want an electric car, but they are just too
> "iffy" now as dependability. Maybe a few years down the road.
> So I narrowed it down to two cars, a really fun little car, the Honda
> Fit Sport and the mid-sized Prius. The Prius was fun, like sitting in
> an airplane cockpit with all the digital graphs and info you could get
> even beamed onto your lower windshield so you didn't have to take your
> eyes off the road. And it gets 50 mpg but the Fit gets 38 and at
> half the price! And more fun to drive.
>
> It wasn't much of a choice. I bought the Fit, had to order from the
> factory because I think maybe I entered my second childhood, but I
> picked a burnt orange metallic color. Totally black inside, dash,
> seats, ceiling, floor and so dark they give you ambient blue lighting
> on the floor. But that metallic burnt orange is me! LOL! I have to
> wait about a month for it though, but I'll never lose my car in the
> parking lot again. :-)
>
> Dalin

That sounds very pretty, Dalin. I hope you enjoy your F..., er
car, for a long time.

--
Jean B.

[Jean B.]

Joy wrote:
> When I bought my current car, I really wanted a bronze-colored one.
> However, I got an exceptionally good price on this one. The color is
> "Mystic Teal". It's a fairly deep, slightly greenish, blue. I love it! My
> son was jealous when he saw it. When he got his last car, he tried to get
> the same color, but it was no longer available, so he settled for a deeper
> blue.
>

Oh, I think my former neighbor had a Corolla that was that color.
I like it!

--
Jean B.

[Jean B.]

Mine has well over 100K. Haven't even needed brakes yet.

--
Jean B.

[**Dalin**]

On 24 Mar 2012 23:52:21 GMT, "Séimí mac Liam"

You learn something new every day in this group. :-)

[**Dalin**]

LOL! You know for such a sporty looking little car, I do wonder why
they named it Fit. It seems a strange name for a car. I wonder where
the name Prius came from?

Dalin

[Independent old cuss]

Let me explain something for you folks just from plain old common
sense. There is this faction that wants to eliminate everything that
might pollute the air. So they have been the squeaky wheel that has
caused the government to go into this knee jerk reaction that will
mandate that in 10 or 12 years all new cars will be required to get 54
miles per gallon or run on air, electricity, water or whatever. Now,
in order to accomplish that the price of cars will probably come close
to doubling, as you can see in the current offerings of electric and
hybrid cars. So, what is that going to do, you might ask? Well, it's
going to make people keep their cars for 20 years instead of 10 and
that my friends will mean more clunkers on the road. What a brilliant
way to reduce pollution. Do you government worshipping losers and
deadbeats ever think things out?

[**Dalin**]

I don't know the rules in other states, but in NY we have an annual
inspection and you have to pass an emission test. If you fail, you
have 10 days to get it fixed to pretty tough standards, or you can't
re-register your car.

I do wonder if down the road we buy more and more electric cars what
happens to our electrical grid. It's stretched pretty thin already.
Remember the rolling brown outs? With everyone plugging their cars in
every night, I wonder if we can handle it.

So we turn to NG to run our cars, which brings its own problems.

Dalin

[Joan F (MI)]

It's called the Jazz in Europe.

[Joan F (MI)]

But that's only a temporary effect. If you never start, you never get
there.

[Séimí mac Liam]

"Joan F \(MI\)" <jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote in

news:OuydnZojd6Sl1vLS...@giganews.com:

> But that's only a temporary effect. If you never start, you never get
> there.
>

Like homilies, do you? Here's a couple.
There aint no such thing as 'free lunch'.
Everytime some one gets something for nothing, some one, somewhere gets
nothing for something.

[**Dalin**]

On Sun, 25 Mar 2012 12:41:21 -0400, "Joan F \(MI\)"
<jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote:

>It's called the Jazz in Europe.

It seems to describe the car a lot better.

[Séimí mac Liam]

Joe Dolan <vi...@hush.ai> wrote in news:XnsA0216DDE48FC9auto@
94.75.214.39:

> "Joan F \(MI\)" <jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote in
> news:OuydnZojd6Sl1vLS...@giganews.com:

>
>> But that's only a temporary effect. If you never start, you
>> never get there.
>

> If you're going the wrong way, you also will not get there. <g>

>
>>
>> Independent old cuss wrote:
>>|
>>| Let me explain something for you folks just from plain old
>>| common sense. There is this faction that wants to eliminate
>>| everything that might pollute the air. So they have been the
>>| squeaky wheel that has caused the government to go into this
>>| knee jerk reaction that will mandate that in 10 or 12 years
>>| all new cars will be required to get 54 miles per gallon or
>>| run on air, electricity, water or whatever.
>

One of the things I learned as a professional driver is to have the
entire route planned out in my head before I put the car in gear.

[Séimí mac Liam]

Joe Dolan <vi...@hush.ai> wrote in news:XnsA02171538412Fauto@
94.75.214.39:

> "Séimí mac Liam" <gwy...@comcast.nospam.net> wrote in
> news:XnsA0216E...@74.209.136.91:

>
>> Joe Dolan <vi...@hush.ai> wrote in news:XnsA0216DDE48FC9auto@
>> 94.75.214.39:
>>
>>> "Joan F \(MI\)" <jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote in
>>> news:OuydnZojd6Sl1vLS...@giganews.com:
>>>
>>>> But that's only a temporary effect. If you never start, you
>>>> never get there.
>>>
>>> If you're going the wrong way, you also will not get there.
>>> <g>
>

>> One of the things I learned as a professional driver is to
>> have the entire route planned out in my head before I put the
>> car in gear.
>

> However, if you fully inform your riders of the details of your
> trip, they may not want to come along. (Obamacare) ;-)
>
>
>
>

My passengers dictated the destination, but only if they insisted did
they get to choose the route. By law I was required to take the shortest
route possible, but not necessarily the fastest or least expensive,
unless the passenger directed differently.

[S�im� mac Liam]

Joe Dolan <vi...@hush.ai> wrote in news:XnsA021746EFE171auto@
94.75.214.39:

> "S�im� mac Liam" <gwy...@comcast.nospam.net> wrote in
> news:XnsA02172...@74.209.136.91:

>
>> Joe Dolan <vi...@hush.ai> wrote in news:XnsA02171538412Fauto@
>> 94.75.214.39:
>>

>>> "S�im� mac Liam" <gwy...@comcast.nospam.net> wrote in
>>> news:XnsA0216E...@74.209.136.91:

>>> However, if you fully inform your riders of the details of
>>> your trip, they may not want to come along. (Obamacare) ;-)
>
>> My passengers dictated the destination, but only if they
>> insisted did they get to choose the route. By law I was
>> required to take the shortest route possible, but not
>> necessarily the fastest or least expensive, unless the
>> passenger directed differently.
>>
>

> What sort of vehicle?
>
>

Passenger car of some form or other.

--
Saint S�im� mac Liam

[Crusher]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message

news:4f7248bb...@news.individual.net...

> I do wonder if down the road we buy more and more electric cars what
> happens to our electrical grid. It's stretched pretty thin already.
> Remember the rolling brown outs? With everyone plugging their cars in
> every night, I wonder if we can handle it.
>
> So we turn to NG to run our cars, which brings its own problems.
>
> Dalin

Note that an electric car mostly transfers gasoline burning pollution to
coal burning pollution, at least in the East. And a transfer from privately
owned gas tankers to potentially publicly owned electric distribution
systems.

--Bob--

[Crusher]

"Independent old cuss" <cu...@exitin.com> wrote in message
news:0efum79egc0k6sevl...@4ax.com...

> Let me explain something for you folks just from plain old common
> sense. There is this faction that wants to eliminate everything that
> might pollute the air. So they have been the squeaky wheel that has
> caused the government to go into this knee jerk reaction that will
> mandate that in 10 or 12 years all new cars will be required to get 54
> miles per gallon or run on air, electricity, water or whatever. Now,
> in order to accomplish that the price of cars will probably come close
> to doubling, as you can see in the current offerings of electric and
> hybrid cars. So, what is that going to do, you might ask? Well, it's
> going to make people keep their cars for 20 years instead of 10 and
> that my friends will mean more clunkers on the road. What a brilliant
> way to reduce pollution. Do you government worshipping losers and
> deadbeats ever think things out?

> An independent old cuss

Do you ever attempt to keep up with the times? I bought a 1970 Maverick new
for $2,000 and a new '72 Pinto for $2,200. Their equivalents are now
approaching $20,000, nearly ten times as much. My son is driving an 18 year
old 1974 Plymouth Voyager with 85,000 miles that hasn't got a speck of rust
on it. It runs like a charm, has never had any major repairs. He is proud
of the car's condition and plans to continue driving it indefinitely. What
makes you think that engineering changes to increase gas mileage is, all by
itself, going to double the cost of a car? Inflation alone will vastly
increase the price of a car far beyond doubling it, as has been the case in
the past. As I wrote in another message, people are already keeping their
cars on average 11 years, mostly because of increases in quality- 20 may not
be that far in the future, and people will NOT be driving clunkers.

--Bob--

[Joan F (MI)]

Well, as I see it the choice is cheap gas or clean air. I prefer the air
myself as we can't live without it.

[Joan F (MI)]

But you can't do that when you keep switching drivers who each have their
own different route planned out.

[NotMe]

"Crusher" <nospa...@roadrunner.com> wrote in message
news:jkl2ie$lh8$1...@dont-email.me...

>A recent study found that the average car on the road is now 11 years old,
>up from a historical 9 years that prevailed for quite some time. The
>reason, surprisingly, is not entirely because of the recession. Stories
>abound of people driving their vehicles for hundreds of thousands of miles,
>often with few or any major repairs. A total engine rebuild, onc a regular
>occurence, is now quite rare, and a car with 100,000 miles on it is
>commonplace. Cars are indeed of far better quality than they once were,
>and the public has and is saving a lot of money because of it.
>

Much of that is the fall out of software, metallurgy and other techniques
developed for the space program and the aircraft industry.

[NotMe]

"Joan F (MI)" <jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote in message
news:WImdnUdCGNK53vPS...@giganews.com...

> Black cars show the dirt worse than any other color I think. And they
> absorb heat in the summer. I prefer a lighter color although I do like a
> British Racing Green.

One of the truisms in N. Texas is that anyone with a black car either
purchased it when they were living elsewhere or has not lived here long.

[NotMe]

"Independent old cuss" <cu...@exitin.com> wrote in message
news:0efum79egc0k6sevl...@4ax.com...

There is one solution that is well proven and can be done for between $1500
to $3000 on existing cars (any thing over 2 years old). cut emissions,
maintenance cost, reduces dependence on foreign oil, is cheaper per mile and
does not require any refining. (there are other benefits but the list is
long and those are minor).

The Senate just 86ed the enabling legislation that would make the conversion
go faster.

[NotMe]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message
news:4f7248bb...@news.individual.net...

Projections on the load for recharging indicate that 'load' will be off peak
which tends to make the generator system more efficent. (the only real
varable is the cost of fuel for the generators).

> So we turn to NG to run our cars, which brings its own problems.

CNG (compressed NG) is a long proven product and is currently in over
abundance (some NG wells have been shut in for lack of demand).

The Senate just recently 86ed legislation that would have made the
conversion both faster and easier. This based on lobbying by the Kock Bros
and other oil interest. (who are heavy into gasoline, diesel and
refineries). CNG will cut demand for all those products as well as
eliminate the need for refineries.

[NotMe]

"Crusher" <nospa...@roadrunner.com> wrote in message

news:jkntnn$vdd$1...@dont-email.me...

New electric plants are being build based on NG as a fuel. Coal plants are,
potentially, being converted to run on NG as well. Side benefit this will
cut down on MTR (mountain top removal) mining. (might mention that that
process is a major source of heavy metals into the environment)

[NotMe]

"Séimí mac Liam" <gwy...@comcast.nospam.net> wrote in message
news:XnsA02164...@74.209.136.90...

> "Joan F \(MI\)" <jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote in
> news:OuydnZojd6Sl1vLS...@giganews.com:
>
>> But that's only a temporary effect. If you never start, you never get
>> there.
>>
>
> Like homilies, do you? Here's a couple.
> There aint no such thing as 'free lunch'.
> Everytime some one gets something for nothing, some one, somewhere gets
> nothing for something.

I recall the claims that cars would be too expensive to produce if the
mileage requirement where increased. Back then anything bigger than a VW
bug had a mpg rating of 10 to 12 mpg. If it was a muscle machine even less.

Mini vans currently get 20 to 22 mpg and that on average. The major
difference is computers (fall out of NASA programs) and the application of
fuel injection systems (that technology goes back decades, before WWII in
fact) If I'm not mistake the Dr. Diesel call it 'an in-spurt motor"

And yes they cost more but then so does everything else. The reality is
that the ROI over time for the current cars is better than when you could
buy a VW for $2000. FWIW the expected useful life of a VW motor was 60,000
miles. At that point the motor was typically shot and needed a full
rebuild. BTDT a *lot* of times.

Today it's not unusual to have a car with 150K and still going strong.

There is always the homilies that you get what you pay for. Efficiency is
one of those variables that cost money but in the long term machines become
more efficient for less money.

Good example we converted a 26ft moving truck to run on CNG. A 2400 mile
round trip cost at today's prices cost ~ $1600 based on last weeks cost. We
sent a CNG converted truck on this same run and the fuel cost was $800.00
these are not estimates but numbers taken from the same truck before and
after conversion.

Now the conversion cost $2500.00 (admittedly low but it was a DIY) now if we
make three trips like that in a month that cost is recovered. Did we get
something for nothing or did we get something for planning ahead?

[NotMe]

"Joe Dolan" <vi...@hush.ai> wrote in message
news:XnsA021715...@94.75.214.39...

> "Séimí mac Liam" <gwy...@comcast.nospam.net> wrote in

> news:XnsA0216E...@74.209.136.91:

>
>> Joe Dolan <vi...@hush.ai> wrote in news:XnsA0216DDE48FC9auto@
>> 94.75.214.39:
>>
>>> "Joan F \(MI\)" <jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote in
>>> news:OuydnZojd6Sl1vLS...@giganews.com:
>>>
>>>> But that's only a temporary effect. If you never start, you
>>>> never get there.
>>>
>>> If you're going the wrong way, you also will not get there.
>>> <g>
>

>> One of the things I learned as a professional driver is to
>> have the entire route planned out in my head before I put the
>> car in gear.
>

> However, if you fully inform your riders of the details of your
> trip, they may not want to come along. (Obamacare) ;-)

That's assuming someone else is not filling the discussion with
misinformation.

[NotMe]

"Crusher" <nospa...@roadrunner.com> wrote in message

news:jknve8$aub$1...@dont-email.me...

We had a 1910 Model T it require an oil change and a grease job every 400
miles more if it were used on dirt roads (when this was built a paved road
was rare).

Every 10K the engine needed a rebuilt. Breaks were not great to begin with
but since most folk coasted to a stop ...

As to cabin heat. Every hear of 'honey hugging weather'.

[Crusher]

"NotMe" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message news:jkoi8i$ask$3...@dont-email.me...

In 1960 I lived in El Paso while working at White Sands. One of my coworkers
bought a practically new Buick convertible, with AC. Ran with AC on during
the day with the top up and at night with the AC off and the top down.
Entirely practical operation. :-)

--Bob--

[Crusher]

"NotMe" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message news:jkoi8i$ask$2...@dont-email.me...

Actually, much of the reason machines last longer is due to far better
seals, lubricants and closer tolerance machining and metal finishes. High
pressure lubes keep metal surfaces apart, and if they never touch because
the seals keep the dirt out and the lube in the metal never wears out. That
applies to all sorts of machines.

--Bob--

[VickieB]

"**Dalin**" wrote in message news:4f71ecb0...@news.individual.net...

I really, really did want an electric car, but they are just too
"iffy" now as dependability. Maybe a few years down the road.
So I narrowed it down to two cars, a really fun little car, the Honda
Fit Sport and the mid-sized Prius. The Prius was fun, like sitting in
an airplane cockpit with all the digital graphs and info you could get
even beamed onto your lower windshield so you didn't have to take your
eyes off the road. And it gets 50 mpg but the Fit gets 38 and at
half the price! And more fun to drive.

It wasn't much of a choice. I bought the Fit, had to order from the
factory because I think maybe I entered my second childhood, but I
picked a burnt orange metallic color. Totally black inside, dash,
seats, ceiling, floor and so dark they give you ambient blue lighting
on the floor. But that metallic burnt orange is me! LOL! I have to
wait about a month for it though, but I'll never lose my car in the
parking lot again. :-)

Dalin

~
That's exactly the one I would buy! Because Joan - who knows cars, who raced
cars, who can probably repair cars - always speaks so highly of hers. Happy
driving!

v .. wondering if they have one in lipstick red

[Jean B.]

VickieB wrote:
> That's exactly the one I would buy! Because Joan - who knows cars, who
> raced
> cars, who can probably repair cars - always speaks so highly of hers. Happy
> driving!
>
> v .. wondering if they have one in lipstick red

Heh! I went to drop my excise tax payment in the box last night
and a man showed up. I was about to leave when he came over to
ask about my Prius. We ended up talking a bit, and the discussion
segued into Korean cars. I THINK they have surpassed Japanese
cars in quality, because the Japanese companies have become
RELATIVELY complacent. (That may have started reversing though; I
really don't know. I am WAY behind on my reading on such things.)
--
Jean B.

[Marian]

On Sunday, March 25, 2012 4:33:12 PM UTC-4, Crusher wrote:
> "Independent old cuss" wrote in message ...

Wise words.

EAARTH: Fossil Fuels? ARE We Thinking?
http://www.picturetrail.com/gid23214128

Marian

[Séimí mac Liam]

"Joan F \(MI\)" <jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote in

news:sOGdnZwTVZeeWfLS...@giganews.com:

It's not a matter of the route but of the destination, and if you want
the same driver all the time you could go to Saudi Arabia or some
hellhole of a dictatership.

[NotMe]

"Crusher" <nospa...@roadrunner.com> wrote in message

news:jkosbs$hrg$1...@dont-email.me...

The tendency here (E Texas) is to come out get in a very hot (black) car
turn on the AC and it's still hot (over 80) when you get home.

Come out with a light colored car it's how but you're reasonable comfortable
before you get out of the parking lot.

If it's Houston it's like a sauna due to the humidity. N. Texas that's a
consideration but not as much as Houston. I expect El Paso is much less so
as 'swamp coolers' work there and don't most of the rest of Texas.

[NotMe]

"Crusher" <nospa...@roadrunner.com> wrote in message

news:jkosn7$j5g$1...@dont-email.me...

Again all those issue are, to a great extent, fall out of work
done/procedures developed for aero space industry.

[Joan F (MI)]

Yes, Milano Red http://automobiles.honda.com/Fit/. Quite a nice red. I
like the Blue Raspberry Metallic they have this year. Good view of Dalin's
orange. Click on Colors on the first page to see them all.

[VickieB]

"Joan F (MI)" wrote in message
news:V9SdnQVOroO4gOzS...@giganews.com...

Yes, Milano Red http://automobiles.honda.com/Fit/. Quite a nice red. I
like the Blue Raspberry Metallic they have this year. Good view of Dalin's
orange. Click on Colors on the first page to see them all.

~
Thanks. Yes, a lovely red .. my kind of red. Oh, don't get me started .. I
was lost on that site for almost an hour .. tell me, anyone, what I should
ask for, watch out for, if I pay cash for a car? CB always paid cash, but he
never shared the best way to go about it.
v

[VickieB]

"Jean B." wrote in message news:9tbfp9...@mid.individual.net...

~
I recently read that Hyundai pushed Honda and Toyota from the top of the
best fuel economy rankings.
v

[**Dalin**]

On Tue, 27 Mar 2012 06:46:52 -0500, "VickieB" <vict...@privacy.net>
wrote:

>"Joan F (MI)" wrote in message
>news:V9SdnQVOroO4gOzS...@giganews.com...
>
>Yes, Milano Red http://automobiles.honda.com/Fit/. Quite a nice red. I
>like the Blue Raspberry Metallic they have this year. Good view of Dalin's
>orange. Click on Colors on the first page to see them all.
>~
>Thanks. Yes, a lovely red .. my kind of red. Oh, don't get me started .. I
>was lost on that site for almost an hour .. tell me, anyone, what I should
>ask for, watch out for, if I pay cash for a car? CB always paid cash, but he
>never shared the best way to go about it.
>v

I'm not sure Vickie, but I doubt it makes a difference. I know our
Fit dealer wrote the whole contract for the car first and then asked
if we needed help financing it and we said "no".

Dalin

[Joy]

"VickieB" <vict...@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:jks9bn$7em$1...@dont-email.me...

I wonder if Hyundai can match the other two in durability and low
maintenance costs?

Joy

[Joy]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message

news:4f71b435...@news.individual.net...

The difference it makes is that if you pay cash, you won't be paying
interest, and you won't have a big chunk coming out of your monthly income.
IMNSHO, if you can afford to pay cash, it's the only way to go!

Joy (who paid cash for both my Toyotas and has never regretted it)

Words - so innocent and powerless as they are, as standing in a dictionary,
how potent for good and evil they become in the hands of one who knows how
to combine them.
--Nathaniel Hawthorne

[Séimí mac Liam]

"Joy" <toa...@real-me.net> wrote in
news:4f71f6fa$0$11265$bd46...@news.dslextreme.com:

They offer 100,000 mile/10 year warrantees. My daughter has a Kia Rio
and is quite pleased. Kia is owned by Hyundai and offers the same
warrantee. Hers is the elcheapo model so it's not going to compare with
high end Toyotas, but does well against her sister's Yaris.

[**Dalin**]

Our other car is a Hyundai Sante Fe, five and a half years old, and
purchased because of its safety record and excellent review by
Consumer Reports. We've had no problems with it at all, just regular
maintenance. No rattles, no loose parts, no safety recalls. Gas
mileage isn't great, 26 mpg in the city, because we got the larger V6
engine so we could pull the camper. OTOH, 26 city miles isn't bad at
all for a V-6. It's a very high quality car with excellent trade-in
value.

Dalin

[Joy]

"Séimí mac Liam" <gwy...@comcast.nospam.net> wrote in message
news:XnsA0236A...@74.209.136.97...

I hope it holds up as well as my Corollas. I drove my first one for 14
years and 156,000 miles. The only major repair was replacing a broken
timing belt. I've had my current Corolla for 12 years, and have had nothing
but routine maintenance. I've only driven it about 63,000 miles so far, but
I'm still happy.

Joy

[NotMe]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message
news:4f71b435...@news.individual.net...

The thing you need to watch for is the F&I (fiance and insurace) people they
are well known for being creative.

things like a fee for engraving the VIN number of various parts. The
selling point is if the car is stolen.

My responce if the car is stolen it;s the problem of the insurance
company. I'll give you their number and see if they are interested.

Fees for Scotch gard, clear coat, and floor mats. Thoes are typically
included from the factory.

Extended warranty is usually a high ticket item but that's a personal
decision and often (you NEED to keep the paperwork) it's refrunded if not
used. Even there it's trickly as some dealers bill the extended warranty
for items that should be warranty or even if you paid for the work.

[**Dalin**]

But those things would hold true if you financed or not wouldn't they?

Perhaps we actually had an honest dealer but he told us those things
were included when I asked about them. The only thing we paid extra
for was the Armor-All on the undercarriage because of the salt damage
done to cars here in our area.

Car buyers are lucky now to have the internet where they can look up
the car they are interested in and all the standard things that come
with a car are listed and all the options too, so you can pick and
choose anything extra you want. I don't think, if you have the
internet, anyone has to go in blind now to buy a car.

Dalin
>

[Joan F (MI)]

Not much to worry about when buying a new car. They'll probably want you to
get a Cashier's check or a certified check. More traps in financing where
they can hide charges.

[NotMe]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message

news:4f8336c7...@news.individual.net...

No argument. The industry calls those folk F&I because they typically
handle those items for the dealership. My caution was based on years of
personal experience in buying vehicles plus having one son that worked as a
car salesman for a major dealership. He resigned over those and other
ethical issues.

[Crusher]

"Joan F (MI)" <jjf...@removethisameritech.net> wrote in message

news:GdWdnbzstthqpe_S...@giganews.com...

Bought a car around 1990 for cash and the salesman didn't know how to handle
the transaction. Said he had never sold a car for cash before. Bought a
van for cash in 1995 but couldn't get the dealer to hold or finance the deal
for a week while we sold some securities to get the money. Wife cleverly
bought the car on a Shell credit card, knowing we had more than a week till
the bill came due. We got free gas on the car for months afterward.

--Bob--

[**Dalin**]

I do think if I wanted to finance a car I might go to my own bank and
check before I let the dealer try and finance it for me. I remember
one time when we were young and dumb and we traded in a junk car for a
used car and the dealer added thousands to the junk car trade in and
added those thousands to the price of the new car. Of course we had
to finance the larger amount and pay the tax on the larger amount.
But it made sense at the time. 'Cuz we were young and dumb.

Dalin

[**Dalin**]

this reminds me of the time we bought my new 2001 Subaru in the fall
of 2000 for cash. They told me the amount I needed in a bank check
and when we went to pick up the car the salesman who sold it to us
wasn't there and a young new salesman handed me the keys, but never
asked for the money. I was half tempted to drive the car off, but I
knew he probably would get fired and the police would be looking for
me, so I reminded him he needed the check.

Dalin

[NotMe]

"Crusher" <nospa...@roadrunner.com> wrote in message

news:jktf2m$lff$1...@dont-email.me...

In the late 60's my wife went into a Houston dealership with a *big*
certified check to buy a vehicle for her company. F&I manager made the
mistake of telling her to come back later with her husband before he would
commit to the deal.

She and the deal walked and not quietly. The GM was sputtering trying to
save the sale.

[Joy]

"**Dalin**" <lj...@usa.net> wrote in message

news:4f8336c7...@news.individual.net...

I agree, and you can also find out where you can get the best price for what
you want. I used CarMax to find my current car. I selected the features
and color I wanted, and a couple of days later, I got a call from a dealer,
with an offer. The price was actually less than what I had expected to pay,
even though it was a slightly more upscale model than I had requested. The
only 'problem' was that the color wasn't what I had requested. However,
I've ended up loving the color I got.

Joy

[**Dalin**]

Sometimes things turn out right. :-)

[NotMe]

"Joy" <toa...@real-me.net> wrote in message
news:4f7248dd$0$11245$bd46...@news.dslextreme.com...

years ago I gave my boys a '63 VW. They had objections to the effect 'it
has no pick up' my response 'Come the weekend it will have all the pick up
you can stand.'

At the time we lived on right on Venice Beach in LA.

They had no concept number of girls a one owner 63 VW with original hippie
colors could collect. I got it from a older cousin of my wife that had
lived the hippie life *all* of her life.

Nothing like getting what you really really want even if you don't know you
wanted it.

[VickieB]

"Joan F (MI)" wrote in message

news:GdWdnbzstthqpe_S...@giganews.com...

Not much to worry about when buying a new car. They'll probably want you to
get a Cashier's check or a certified check. More traps in financing where
they can hide charges.

~~
Thanks Joan, and everyone who tried to help me .. I know better what to
research.
v

[Jean B.]

VickieB wrote:

I would think seriously about a Hyundai or some other Korean car
if I was in the market for a car.

--
Jean B.