White African-American boy suspended. PC gone mad
Jan
By the way, is there a "Distinguished European-American Student of the
Year" prize?
Laugh, weep or get all PC, your choice.<g>
White boy suspended for claiming 'African' prize
By Marcus Warren in New York
(Filed: 27/01/2004)
A white teenager who moved from South Africa to America six years ago
was suspended from school after nominating himself for a
"Distinguished African-American Student of the Year" prize. Trevor
Richards, 16, was accused of "showing disrespect" to black pupils at
Westside High School in Omaha, Nebraska. It is thought he is the only
pupil to have lived in Africa.
He and two friends put up campaign posters showing him making a
thumbs-up sign and all three were suspended.
"The posters were intended to be satire on the term
'African-American'," said one of his campaign managers, Scott Rambo.
The phrase is the current politically correct label for black
Americans. But the satire misfired, not least because it was aired on
Martin Luther King Day, a holiday marking the black preacher's role in
the civil rights struggle.
"It's disruptive," said the headmaster, John Crook. "It was offensive
to the individual being honoured and to some students."
http://urlcut.com/PolCor
Jan
"If you can't take a joke,you shouldn't have joined"
Bobbie
rather unfortunate extra line you put in your post to alt.fiftyplus.
Non PC is one thing but to suggest that few blacks could find Africa on a
map, is just a little too provocative for me.....
Sorry.
Bobbie
"Jan" <scrumpy...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d87d10htkr76p2q8q...@4ax.com...
Baba.Mung
My first thought was that there might be more to the offending teenager's
conduct than the quoted newspaper report brings to light. Mockery with
racist undertones is common enough among a sector of white South African
society which chafes at having to adjust to a new more democratic order.
However, it appears that the boy's mother has insisted that her family's
credentials are non-racist. She is reported to have said that her son has
both Bangladeshi and Egyptian friends. ( For what its worth Bangladeshis
are not usually also African and Egyptians don't necessarily see themselves
as "black").
.
In South African schools, still working hard to meet the challenge involved
in integrating pupils of different races and helping black children make up
for lost time, Trevor Richards behaviour would almost certainly have been
seen in a similarly critical light. At the least insensitive and more
probably downright subversive. Of course it is also likely that such
behaviour would have taken more nerve in South Africa where white children
are commonly greatly outnumbered by black children.
I understand the prize at issue had in the past been awarded to students of
Caucasian complexion but that a change in school policy restricted the award
to black students. I understand also that some commentators have suggested
the boy Richards was eminently qualified for the prize because he was the
only pupil to have actually been born in and/or lived in Africa. This may
be to overlook the requirement that the recipient should have distinguished
himself as a student - though there is obviously a sense in which he has
since distinguished himself abeit hardly in the sense intended by the
school.
For my part I can see that there might be a case in a nearly all-white
environ such as Westside High School for special incentives for children
belonging to traditionally disadvantaged minority groups. I can also imagine
that educators in Omaha might see themselves as having particular
historically-rooted reason for doing all they might to ensure black students
were well-treated in their schools. Omaha was the scene of a notoriously
brutal lynching* shortly after the end of the First World War, a lynching
which appeared to be racially motivated and which occurred against a
background of poor race relations and of ongoing incitement from newspapers
and others.Omaha was also the birthplace of one, Malcolm Little, whose
family was driven out of town by the Klu Klax Klan a few years later.**
More than that Nebraska's is currently seen as home to many blacks for whom
unemployment and poverty and attendant ills are more of a problem than in
better served states. Surveys have found that Nebraska's black babies suffer
a significantly higher mortality rate than the national average. I am sure
any well-minded school authority would see the need to 'live down' the
nastier bits of local history I've mentioned and the need also to do what
they might to redress the balance for black people living in the community
now.. One can't say as much for most newspapers which have covered this
latest Omaha event touching on relations between races.
That said, perhaps the school would have been wiser to designate its prize
as one reserved for "black" students while yet ensuring the best efforts of
other children would be similarly applauded. The term African-American, if
reserved only for black people, does run into the difficulty that a sizeable
minority of the people born in Africa, and regarding themselves as
belonging there in some sense, is not white.
Finally, I wonder if the school's head was aware that some pupils had
thoughts about the school's prize-giving arrangements. If not perhaps that
points to a need for the school to have devised a means for such things to
be discussed with pupils. Besides having educational potential in itself,
such debate might well have saved the school from the current unwelcome
publicity.
*Lynching of one William Brown elderly black man by a large mob which also
lynched the town's mayor burned buildings and beat up many other people in
an orgy of violence. .
**Malcolm Little aka Malcolm X
Voice for Children annual 'Kids Count' report .
also National Center For Statistics
http://omahahealthystart.org/
http://www.theplainsman.com/vnews/display.v/ART/2004/01/26/40157d6f67
Baba
DittyDu...@webtv.net
the map? It must have been censored before it got here. Or maybe you
had some private email that I didn't see?
Some time ago, there was all this to do about how deficient in geography
Americans are, but I didn't see any reference to that, either.
What surprised me about the post was the location of Omaha for the
school where this is supposed to have happened.
Blake
------------------------
smudge...@smithsonia.com (Bobbie)
Bobbie
was an addition, the one that I found provocative.
Bobbie:-)
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:9360-401...@storefull-3113.bay.webtv.net...
lonestar
Bobbie wrote:
> I might have agreed that PC is often taken to extremes Jan, but for the
> rather unfortunate extra line you put in your post to alt.fiftyplus.
> Non PC is one thing but to suggest that few blacks could find Africa on a
> map, is just a little too provocative for me.....
> Sorry.
>
> Bobbie
Truth hurts. Most teens don't even know who Cheney, Powell, Rice nor
Rumsfield are and they sure as hell don't have a clue regarding geography.
Robert
lonestar
Bobbie wrote:
> Blake read my post again. Jan posted this on alt.fiftyplus too, only there
> was an addition, the one that I found provocative.
> Bobbie:-)
So, why didn't you rebuke him in alt.fifty plus instead of here?
Robert
Bobbie
"lonestar" <"lonestar"@netscapedot.net> wrote in message
news:_eHRb.1597$r11...@newssvr31.news.prodigy.com...
have no idea if this was Jan's view, that was a bit ambiguous, I hardly
think so. but it was associated with the article which made it more racist
than non-PC.
It is not unknown for regular members here to pop over there and make
remarks about things said over here....if you get my drift.
I do take you point though Robert and will bar it in mind in future.
Bobbie....
DittyDu...@webtv.net
is why I wondered about your post. Did you crosspost it?
On the other hand, the term (A-A's) really is misleading when used
politically. We have many naturalized citizens who immigrated from
various parts of Africa, who might be correctly described thus. The
ones who claim the name are native born with ancestors who have been
here for centuries, but who refuse to assimilate, as most other
immigrants do.
The political football is the reason they refuse or are unable to
assimilate. But of course you can't know everything that goes on that
never gets reported in the media.
Blake
Blake
----------------------
smudge...@smithsonia.com (Bobbie)
LoneStar
Bobbie wrote:
I didn't post the msg as "criticism", I was just curious.
Robert
>
>
Bobbie
understand or abide by, for the most part. In this instance, and without
the knowledge of a Native born American I can only form my opinion on what
I read. Some may say that as a middleclass 'white' I have no right to feel
offended about a remark made about Blacks, the same could equally apply to
my dislike of the word 'wetback'. With out the words that were added, I
would have been as surprised as most about the article.
Since the original article was not cross posted, Robert was right to point
out that I should not have mentioned it at all here. I am a sensitive soul
Blake and found is necessary to comment. sorry that I did it here and not
where the post was made.
I make no apology for finding the words provocative.
Bobbie:-)
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:23997-40...@storefull-3111.bay.webtv.net...
Bobbie
"LoneStar" <west...@ditdot.net> wrote in message
news:A3RRb.1675$_g2...@newssvr31.news.prodigy.com...
soul, and a liberal to boot.
BTW did you manage to Good, happy, sunny morning....
Bobbie;-)
>
> >
> >
>
Wanda
"LoneStar" <west...@ditdot.net> wrote in message
news:A3RRb.1675$_g2...@newssvr31.news.prodigy.com...
>
>
Okay, this is driving me crazy; I am posting this in alt.fifty-plus.friends,
is there another AFP that you all are talking about?
Wanda
--
The only true wisdom is in knowing that you know nothing.
Socrates
Jean B.
Interesting. Seems like he might be a good candidate--and maybe
the ONLY candidate
--
Jean B.
Bobbie
>
> Okay, this is driving me crazy; I am posting this in
alt.fifty-plus.friends,
> is there another AFP that you all are talking about?
>
> Wanda
> --
> The only true wisdom is in knowing that you know nothing.
>
> Socrates
Hello Wanda, the answer is no, There is only one alt.fifty-plusfriends,
that is this one. There is however an alt.fiftyplus, and an alt.sixtyplus.
Both quite separate, but both having many subscribers from this group
too.......I wrongly brought a post from there, (AFP) to here and commented
on it. Very wrong of me.
I hope that makes it a lot clearer for you. <vbg>
I hope you are enjoying your time with us, I truly hope you never have any
reason to leave.
Bobbie:-)
>
>
Jean B.
>
> Truth hurts. Most teens don't even know who Cheney, Powell, Rice nor
> Rumsfield are and they sure as hell don't have a clue regarding geography.
> Robert
>
Speaking of geography, I may have said this, but I was thrilled
that Leah was finally getting a course in geography this year.
But, woe is me. It turns out that geography has very little to do
with finding out where other countries are and learning about
their capitals and, er, geography. It is now another dumbed-down,
touchy-feely subject. Any such learning is only incidental. Does
anyone suppose this might be one reason why kids now don't know
where anything is??????????????????????????
--
Jean B.
Wolfie
out the lights and lock up. The early crew is always looking for something to
whine about.
Peace, Wolfie
seq
Last summer's project for Andrew, age 9, was being able to
identify on a map every country in the world. (The maps had
an outline of the country, no name :))
Parents or others at home must become involved if our children
are to receive a decent education. The public schools are not
doing their job. Oh, and I must say that at least one kid knows
where things are.
k
Jan
<smudge...@smithsonia.com> wrote:
>I might have agreed that PC is often taken to extremes Jan, but for the
>rather unfortunate extra line you put in your post to alt.fiftyplus.
>Non PC is one thing but to suggest that few blacks could find Africa on a
>map, is just a little too provocative for me.....
>Sorry.
>
>Bobbie
>
Bobbie,
Your innocence is rather endearing. Do you not recall that a short
time ago on this very group there was a discussion about students in
the US not being able to locate America, the Pacific Ocean and the
Atlantic Ocean, among other places?
From my own experience when a group of University Graduates in
Philadelphia asked me in all sincerity, "Where's Canada?" it does not
take a great leap of faith to imagine that those who choose the rather
ridiculous identity of Afro-American should be unable to find the land
of their questionable origins. In view of the above I am at a loss to
understand why you should find the comment "provocative".
It is also rather disappointing that you completely missed the irony
in the story.
Bobbie
It certainly looks that way doesn't it Jan?.....do you think it might have
something to do with the fact that once I read the piece about Most Blacks
not being able to find Africa on a map, I tended to read the rest with a
jaundiced view.
As I said in another post, this student was possibly the only one who
could truly use the title, so the article was certainly ironic.
Jan I love your posts, I admire you knowledge, you have a very eloquent
way of putting your point, but I did find those words provocative, in just
the same way as I dislike to hear the word wetback. It should not bother
you, after all most other folks found it fun. I make no apology for
feelings.
My Geography isn't too hot either, but I think I could find Scotland, the
land of my fathers.
Be not dismayed Dear Sir, I am so glad you are back and posting.
Bobbie....
Dink
>From my own experience when a group of University Graduates in
>Philadelphia asked me in all sincerity, "Where's Canada?" it does not
>take a great leap of faith to imagine that those who choose the rather
>ridiculous identity of Afro-American should be unable to find the land
>of their questionable origins
Ah, yes, Jan. But if _all_ students are inept in geography, you should
have said just that. By singling out the ones who have African heritage,
you seemed to associate an ethnic or racial factor with the ignorance.
Dink
N 30.21, W 97.81
"The past is never dead. It's not even past."
~~ William Faulkner:_Requiem For A Nun_
Jan
wrote:
>
>"Jan" <scrumpy...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:d87d10htkr76p2q8q...@4ax.com...
<Snipped for brevity>
Baba,
My responses are interspersed below:
>
>My first thought was that there might be more to the offending teenager's
>conduct than the quoted newspaper report brings to light.
Why would you think that, and why would you use the term 'offending',
this is assumption of guilt. Oh, of course, it was a 'white' kid
involved wasn't it?
>Mockery with racist undertones is common enough among a sector of white South African
>society which chafes at having to adjust to a new more democratic order.
>However, it appears that the boy's mother has insisted that her family's
>credentials are non-racist. She is reported to have said that her son has
>both Bangladeshi and Egyptian friends. ( For what its worth Bangladeshis
>are not usually also African and Egyptians don't necessarily see themselves
>as "black").
What relevance does this have, apart from introducing your own biased
agenda? This kid has lived in the US for 6 years or so, he is not in
South Africa and probably thinks he's better off out of there. What
relevance does listing his friends, together with one of your usual
snide comments that Bangladeshi and Egyptian kids do not consider
themselves 'black' have? Perhaps he is quite a discerning child and
does not mingle with blacks, surely his choice of friends is his
decision and his alone.
>.
>In South African schools, still working hard to meet the challenge involved
>in integrating pupils of different races and helping black children make up
>for lost time, Trevor Richards behaviour would almost certainly have been
>seen in a similarly critical light. At the least insensitive and more
>probably downright subversive. Of course it is also likely that such
>behaviour would have taken more nerve in South Africa where white children
>are commonly greatly outnumbered by black children.
Again, other than your own agenda, what does this have to do with a
kid who is attending school in the US?
>
>I understand the prize at issue had in the past been awarded to students of
>Caucasian complexion
Why not use the term 'white students' or is that anathema to your
bigoted thinking?
>but that a change in school policy restricted the award to black students.
> I understand also that some commentators have suggested
>the boy Richards was eminently qualified for the prize because he was the
>only pupil to have actually been born in and/or lived in Africa. This may
>be to overlook the requirement that the recipient should have distinguished
>himself as a student - though there is obviously a sense in which he has
>since distinguished himself abeit hardly in the sense intended by the
>school.
Once again your bigoted agenda is showing. Fact, the kid is white,
fact, the kid is from South Africa, fact, he obviously considered
himself eligible for the prize, fact, he is entitled to call himself
African-American, more so than any black who was born and raised in
the US. Conjecture on your part, he may not have distinguished
himself, whatever that means to you.
>
>For my part I can see that there might be a case in a nearly all-white
>environ such as Westside High School for special incentives for children
>belonging to traditionally disadvantaged minority groups.
Why not just say, "More special treatment for blacks than whites?"
Doesn't this stink of racial segregation? If blacks want to be equal,
they should play on a level field, not one that is slanted in their
favour to the detriment of others not of black hue.
> I can also imagine
>that educators in Omaha might see themselves as having particular
>historically-rooted reason for doing all they might to ensure black students
>were well-treated in their schools. Omaha was the scene of a notoriously
>brutal lynching* shortly after the end of the First World War, a lynching
>which appeared to be racially motivated and which occurred against a
>background of poor race relations and of ongoing incitement from newspapers
>and others.Omaha was also the birthplace of one, Malcolm Little, whose
>family was driven out of town by the Klu Klax Klan a few years later.**
>More than that Nebraska's is currently seen as home to many blacks for whom
>unemployment and poverty and attendant ills are more of a problem than in
>better served states. Surveys have found that Nebraska's black babies suffer
>a significantly higher mortality rate than the national average.
Once again you have to introduce your own agenda. That was then, we
are talking about now.
>I am sure
>any well-minded school authority would see the need to 'live down' the
>nastier bits of local history I've mentioned and the need also to do what
>they might to redress the balance for black people living in the community
>now.. One can't say as much for most newspapers which have covered this
>latest Omaha event touching on relations between races.
Oh, now we get into the history revision process do we? All part of
your agenda.
>
> That said, perhaps the school would have been wiser to designate its prize
>as one reserved for "black" students while yet ensuring the best efforts of
>other children would be similarly applauded.
No, the wisest course would have been to treat all students as equal
and distribute the prizes accordingly.
> The term African-American, if reserved only for black people, does
> run into the difficulty that a sizeable minority of the people born in
> Africa, and regarding themselves as belonging there in some sense, is not white.
Again, what does this have to do with a kid in an American school,
who, by virtue of the fact that he is from South Africa is entitled to
call himself African-American? Just because blacks and politically
correct nincompoops want to make this a purely black description does
not make it so. Perhaps the blacks will have to come up with another
term to describe themselves, I can think of one, but I think you'd
have apoplexy if I mentioned it, not to mention others on the
group.<g>
>
>Finally, I wonder if the school's head was aware that some pupils had
>thoughts about the school's prize-giving arrangements. If not perhaps that
>points to a need for the school to have devised a means for such things to
>be discussed with pupils. Besides having educational potential in itself,
>such debate might well have saved the school from the current unwelcome
>publicity.
Or perhaps the kids themselves were fed-up with the pandering that is
done for blacks and wanted to make a very valid statement.
>
>*Lynching of one William Brown elderly black man by a large mob which also
>lynched the town's mayor burned buildings and beat up many other people in
>an orgy of violence. .
>
>**Malcolm Little aka Malcolm X
More of the left wing politically correct agenda.
It's a great pity that you couldn't or wouldn't see the irony in the
article.
>
>Baba
Yoj
assimilate", whatever that means. However, it doesn't matter whether or
not the assimilate. As long as people are classed by race or color,
labels will be used. If people are going to be labeled, they should
have the right to choose the label that is used. That said, I
sympathize with the boy who caused the flap, because I consider myself a
native American. However, that term, with a capital "N", has been
co-opted by people who used to be called Indians. As I said, I wish we
could do away with all the labels and see people as individuals.
--
Joy
Life is what happens to you while you are planning to do something else.
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:23997-40...@storefull-3111.bay.webtv.net...
Yoj
news:401803CB...@rcn.com...
What are they teaching in that case? When I was in school, it was all
memorizing maps, capitols, and lists of principle products. I found
that intensely boring and retained very little of it. It's too bad
there isn't a way to combine the teaching of locations along with
information about what life is like in those places.
OTOH, when I was a kid, my parents bought us a jigsaw puzzle that was a
map of the United States. Except for the smaller ones in the northeast,
each state was a puzzle piece. We put that puzzle together many times,
and I know much more about the locations and shapes of many states than
I do about the rest of the world. I've forgotten a lot of it, but I
still retain more from that puzzle than from any geography class I ever
had.
Joy
Yoj
Yoj
statement like this: "Perhaps he is quite a discerning child and does
not mingle with blacks, surely his choice of friends is his decision and
his alone."
His choice of friends may be his decision, but to say he is "discerning
and does not mingle with blacks" is extremely bigoted.
--
Joy
Life is what happens to you while you are planning to do something else.
"Jan" <scrumpy...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d1dg109s42rq3m0qf...@4ax.com...
Jan
Fairy nuff<g>
Jan
Dink
I think this is picking nits.<g> The whole article centred around a
white kid who claimed he was African-American. To the best of my
knowledge, and please correct me if I'm wrong, the only people who use
the term 'African-American' are blacks. One would therefor expect
that those claiming a cultural heritage would know where that heritage
was situated on this poor little world of ours. However, based on
personal experience of US college grads who professed not to know
where Canada was, plus the discussion of not too long ago regarding US
students not being able to find the US on a blank map I think it was a
reasonable assumption to make.
Jan
wrote:
>It is interesting that you accuse Baba of bigotry and then make a
>statement like this: "Perhaps he is quite a discerning child and does
>not mingle with blacks, surely his choice of friends is his decision and
>his alone."
>
>His choice of friends may be his decision, but to say he is "discerning
>and does not mingle with blacks" is extremely bigoted.
Perhaps in your mind, not in mine. Try looking up the word
'discerning' and then show me how it is bigoted.
DittyDu...@webtv.net
be Americans, like everybody else. They comprise only a small group of
a race, or mixed race, as the case may be.
So what are you? A Caucasian American? A European American?
So who is the bigot here?
Blake
-----------------
jgay...@earthlink.net (Yoj)
DittyDu...@webtv.net
realize that children do see the difference. They also notice the
difference in cultures, if it is there. You and PC's assume that this
is taught by parents, but I can assure you that is not always the case.
In fact, around here, it is not usually the case.
In places where there is a black community of any size, you can watch
and see that, if left alone, they gather in like groups, simply because
they are more comfortable in like groups. In communities where there
are only one or two of either group, they are more readily accepted
into the opposite group.
I believe James Bond, 007, was described as " a man of taste and
discrimination." There is another meaning to such words.
Blake
-----------------------
lonestar
I didn't post the msg as "criticism", I was just curious.
>>Robert
Bobbie wrote:
> That's OK, Robert. I was out of order, and as I said to Blake, a
sensitive
> soul, and a liberal to boot.
> BTW did you manage to Good, happy, sunny morning....
>
> Bobbie;-)
After the temp dropping to 21º F this morning, the sun shown brightly
all day and the temp rose to 52º. Tomorrow night it is supposed to drop
to 16º or 18º and we don't even have any pretty snow.
Robert
lonestar
Okay, this is driving me crazy; I am posting this in alt.fifty-plus.friends,
> is there another AFP that you all are talking about?
>
> Wanda
Yes, it is alt.fiftyplus. I think this group evolved from that one.
Robert
lonestar
you about the post. I just wondered what it was about.
Robert
lonestar
Jean B. wrote:
That is disheartening Jean. I remember think how neat it was that Leah
was getting the opportunity to learn Geography.
Robert
>
Baba.Mung
> On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 21:59:03 -0000, "Baba.Mung" <Ahab@Nospamthanks>
> wrote:
> Baba,
> My responses are interspersed below:
> >
> >My first thought was that there might be more to the offending teenager's
> >conduct than the quoted newspaper report brings to light.
>
> Why would you think that, and why would you use the term 'offending',
> this is assumption of guilt.
*He obviously offended against the school's headteacher notions of what was
appropriate behaviour. That was why I used the term. Now that you
mention it, I recall that his behaviour was also seen as insensitive
implying perhaps that he was seen as giving offence to black pupils or
others who thought a day in honour of Martin Luther King was not an
appropriate time for such pranks if the incident can be so caharacterised
Oh, of course, it was a 'white' kid
> involved wasn't it?
>
*No it wasn't simply that he was white. I used the term for the reason I
have already outlined.
> >Mockery with racist undertones is common enough among a sector of white
South African
> >society which chafes at having to adjust to a new more democratic
order...
>
> ..What relevance does this have, apart from introducing your own biased
> agenda? This kid has lived in the US for 6 years or so, he is not in
> South Africa and probably thinks he's better off out of there.
*I was suggesting that the boy's ill-judged conduct may have been the
outcome of earlier years spent in a country where resentment of, and the
mocking or taunting of, black people was a common behaviour among some
people in the apartheid years and subsequently. I don't see that staying in
the US for a few years with its own history of such things would
necessarily have ameliorated any such influence upon him.
> What
> relevance does listing his friends, together with one of your usual
> snide comments that Bangladeshi and Egyptian kids do not consider
> themselves 'black' have?
*His mother listed his friends in support of her assertion that her son had
not been acting out of racist sentiment.
> Perhaps he is quite a discerning child and
> does not mingle with blacks......
*I wonder if I understand you correctly. Are you saying not mingling with
blacks is indicative of a discerning attitude? Discerning of what?
>....... surely his choice of friends is his decision and his alone
*Sure, assuming his chosen persons wish to reciprocate.
> >.
> >In South African schools, still working hard to meet the challenge
involved
> >in integrating pupils of different races and helping black children make
up
> >for lost time, Trevor Richards behaviour would almost certainly have been
> >seen in a similarly critical light. At the least insensitive and more
> >probably downright subversive. Of course it is also likely that such
> >behaviour would have taken more nerve in South Africa where white
children
> >are commonly greatly outnumbered by black children.
>
> Again, other than your own agenda, what does this have to do with a
> kid who is attending school in the US?
> >
*What you call my agenda is in this particular instance quite simple. It is
to try to inject a little balance into the sometimes obviously biased
treatment given to situations in which issues of race come up. The boy is
white in a predominantly white school in a city in which blacks have little
reason historically to feel welcome and well-known reasons for seeing
themselves as disadvantaged. His idea of fun seems to have been to indulge
in a prank which was obviously likely to conflict with the school's efforts
to take such things into account having in view the interests of the
relatively small number of black pupils in the student body.. I mention
South African schools as an example of a situation in which it would have
taken more courage to try the same sort of prank because there it would have
been him and his friends who were vastly outnumbered and not the pupils on
the receiving end of his prank
> >I understand the prize at issue had in the past been awarded to students
of
> >Caucasian complexion
>
> Why not use the term 'white students' or is that anathema to your
> bigoted thinking?
>
*Isn't that a term commonly used in the US to distinguish whites from
so-called African Americans?
> >but that a change in school policy restricted the award to black
students.
> > I understand also that some commentators have suggested
> >the boy Richards was eminently qualified for the prize because he was the
> >only pupil to have actually been born in and/or lived in Africa. This
may
> >be to overlook the requirement that the recipient should have
distinguished
> >himself as a student - though there is obviously a sense in which he
has
> >since distinguished himself abeit hardly in the sense intended by the
> >school.
>
> Once again your bigoted agenda is showing. Fact, the kid is white,
> fact, the kid is from South Africa, fact, he obviously considered
> himself eligible for the prize, fact, he is entitled to call himself
> African-American, more so than any black who was born and raised in
> the US. Conjecture on your part, he may not have distinguished
> himself, whatever that means to you.
*Bigotry has connotations of unseeing narrowness. But it seems to me that
of the two of us, it is actually you who wishes to keep to the narrower
frame. It appears to be true that the boy is white and that he is from
South Africa, yes. But it is also true that there were other children at the
centre of this story - black children who are entitled by custom to call
themselves African Americans and to whom the prize was intended to go.
There is nothing to say that the white boy saw himselfd as entitled to the
prize. He claimed that his poster campaign was intended primarily as
satire.
> >For my part I can see that there might be a case in a nearly all-white
> >environ such as Westside High School for special incentives for children
> >belonging to traditionally disadvantaged minority groups.
>
> Why not just say, "More special treatment for blacks than whites?"
*Because what I did say means something different. Perhaps you don't see
that. Or perhaps you don't wish to.
> Doesn't this stink of racial segregation?
*Racial segregation is normally used to describe a situation in which people
of different race or colour are physically separated. Unless you can tell
me different I will go on assuming black and white pupils are taught in the
same classrooms at the same time by the same teachers at Westside High
School.
> If blacks want to be equal,
> they should play on a level field, not one that is slanted in their
> favour to the detriment of others not of black hue.
>
* I am sure black people in the US would like to be treated equally before
the law and have the same educational and job opportunities open to them as
to white people. But most of the evidence I know of suggests that the
playing field is in fact often slanted in such a way as to deny many blacks
such equalities.
> > I can also imagine
> >that educators in Omaha might see themselves as having particular
> >historically-rooted reason for doing all they might to ensure black
students
> >were well-treated in their schools. Omaha was the scene of a notoriously
> >brutal lynching* shortly after the end of the First World War, a
lynching
> >which appeared to be racially motivated and which occurred against a
> >background of poor race relations and of ongoing incitement from
newspapers
> >and others.Omaha was also the birthplace of one, Malcolm Little, whose
> >family was driven out of town by the Klu Klax Klan a few years later.**
> >More than that Nebraska's is currently seen as home to many blacks for
whom
> >unemployment and poverty and attendant ills are more of a problem than in
> >better served states. Surveys have found that Nebraska's black babies
suffer
> >a significantly higher mortality rate than the national average.
>
> Once again you have to introduce your own agenda. That was then, we
> are talking about now.
>
*Why do you describe my views as "an agenda"? Is it to avoid taking on
board some points of the points I make? Do you really think it irrelevant
that blacks in the US were persecuted in the past by the likes of the Klu
Klux Klan? Or is just that that particular fact doesn't fit with what you'd
prefer to believe about these things.
> >I am sure
> >any well-minded school authority would see the need to 'live down' the
> >nastier bits of local history I've mentioned and the need also to do what
> >they might to redress the balance for black people living in the
community
> >now.. One can't say as much for most newspapers which have covered this
> >latest Omaha event touching on relations between races.
>
> Oh, now we get into the history revision process do we? All part of
> your agenda.
> >
*Why don't you spell out what you believe my "agenda" to be. Or say what
you mean by "history revision process" . Or do you resort to these terms to
avoid spelling anything out which might not stand up to proper debate..
*Baba
Baba.Mung
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:15867-40...@storefull-3115.bay.webtv.net...
Joy, if you had more experience among black communities, you would
In places where there is a black community of any size, you can watch
and see that, if left alone, they gather in like groups, simply because
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------
In my experience that is also how many Europeans behave when they find
themselves abroad and surrounded by others who are racially or culturally
different. They form expatriate communities of their own, set up their own
clubs, schools and other amenities.
Baba
Jim Chandler
animals, humans (regardless of race)included, behave. They tend to
group in the most comfortable setting and that setting is usually with
their own. Now get off of it, you're beating this thing to death
needlessly.
JimC
Jim Chandler
off.... I forgot the please.
JimC
DittyDu...@webtv.net
----------------------------------
In places where there is a black community of any size, you can watch
and see that, if left alone, they gather in like groups, simply because
they are more comfortable in like groups... Blake
Jean B.
>
> What are they teaching in that case? When I was in school, it was all
> memorizing maps, capitols, and lists of principle products. I found
> that intensely boring and retained very little of it. It's too bad
> there isn't a way to combine the teaching of locations along with
> information about what life is like in those places.
>
> OTOH, when I was a kid, my parents bought us a jigsaw puzzle that was a
> map of the United States. Except for the smaller ones in the northeast,
> each state was a puzzle piece. We put that puzzle together many times,
> and I know much more about the locations and shapes of many states than
> I do about the rest of the world. I've forgotten a lot of it, but I
> still retain more from that puzzle than from any geography class I ever
> had.
>
different areas of the world. That is not geography, to me
anyway.
I have done extensive searches for decent jigsaw puzzles and have
not found anything to my liking--or the ones closest to what I am
looking for are VERY expensive.
--
Jean B.
DittyDu...@webtv.net
Part of the trouble with learning the names of the countries is that the
borders are always changing and so are the names. I think physical
geography is much more interesting. But who knows what a teenager finds
interesting?
Have you tried to find a wall map, Jean? There used to be some 36 inch
by 24 inch ones, (or thereabouts,) that you could find in a school
supply store. They were rather cheap, too. $2 or $3 -- probly $10 now.
Maybe you have no space for a wall map. Possibly you could put it in a
poster frame and stand it up somewhere.
Does Leah like history? I think historical atlases are very useful.
Hardly anything is named the same thing as it was in the era you are
studying. There are paperback atlases for that, relatively inexpensive,
too.
Blake.
------------------------
Jean B.
>
> That is disheartening Jean. I remember think how neat it was that Leah
> was getting the opportunity to learn Geography.
> Robert
>
pleased when I heard this. Sure it can be boring to memorize
where countries, cities, etc. are and to learn to find them on a
map, but if you don't...
--
Jean B.
Dink
>Part of the trouble with learning the names of the countries is that the
>borders are always changing and so are the names.
Yep. I had just got used to Myanmar when they changed it back to Burma.
And then I heard Mumbai for the first time. The books in most schools
are at least two years old. Kids haven't a chance of learning many of
the current names in school.
Dink
Dink
Natcherly this reminds me of a song...
Istanbul (Not Constantinople)
Written by J Kennedy and N Simon,
published by Chappell & Co. 1953.
Original recording by The Four Lads
Istanbul was Constantinople,
now it's Istanbul, not Constantinople,
Been a long time gone, Constantinople,
Now it's a turkish delight on a moonlit night,
Every gal in Constantinople,
Lives in Istanbul, not Constantinople,
so if you've got a date
in Constantinple,
she'll be waiting in Istanbul
Even old New York,
was once New Amsterdam, why they changed it i can't say,
People just liked it better that way
So take me back to Constantinople,
No you can't go back to Constantinole,
been a long time gone, Constantinople,
Why did Constantinople get the works?
That's nobody's business but the turks!
Istanbul
Dink
Yoj
--
Joy
Life is what happens to you while you are planning to do something else.
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:15866-40...@storefull-3115.bay.webtv.net...
Yoj
"Discerning: Showing insight and understanding"
To say that a discerning person "does not mingle with blacks" shows a
distinct prejudice against people who prefer to be known as
African-American or Black (with a capital "B").
IMO, a discerning person does not mingle with people who judge others by
the color of their skin.
Joy
Yoj
against them. There are all sorts of cultural differences which have
nothing to do with people getting along. My son-in-law is from Maine
and my daughter is a native Californian. There are definite cultural
differences between them, but they get along just fine. It is only when
people refuse to recognize the true worth of people from other cultures,
and judge them by their culture, or skin color, or national origin, that
problems arise. Those problems are perpetuated by the use of derogatory
terms to refer to a particular group of people. I am well aware that no
group, whatever type of classification is used, is free of prejudice.
This does not make it right.
--
Joy
Life is what happens to you while you are planning to do something else.
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:15867-40...@storefull-3115.bay.webtv.net...
DittyDu...@webtv.net
life, even when the names change. The cities stay in the same place,
along with the mountains, rivers, and deserts, I can still recite
Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania . . . and Maine, Vermont, New Hampshire,
Connecticut, New Jersey, Rhode Island, Maryland, Delaware.
Hmmm I guess I lost New York.
Blake
--------------------
DittyDu...@webtv.net
Not I.
Get it?
Blake
----------------
jgay...@earthlink.net (Yoj)
DittyDu...@webtv.net
Turkish girl named Rafika, took me to the top of the WTC. I think she
lived on Staten Island. Anyway, I sang it for her. It was the first
time she ever heard it.
Blake
------------------
Baba.Mung
"Yoj" <jgay...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:f4iSb.2163$uM2....@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> Of course people prefer to gather with those who do not discriminate
> against them. There are all sorts of cultural differences which have
> nothing to do with people getting along. My son-in-law is from Maine
> and my daughter is a native Californian. There are definite cultural
> differences between them, but they get along just fine. It is only when
> people refuse to recognize the true worth of people from other cultures,
> and judge them by their culture, or skin color, or national origin, that
> problems arise. Those problems are perpetuated by the use of derogatory
> terms to refer to a particular group of people. I am well aware that no
> group, whatever type of classification is used, is free of prejudice.
> This does not make it right.
>
> --
> Joy
>
> Life is what happens to you while you are planning to do something else.
>
Well said, Joy. A clear exposition of some important points. Thank you.
Baba
Baba.Mung
"Jean B." <jb...@rcn.com> wrote in message news:401986FB...@rcn.com...
Maybe Leah could have it both ways. Do the memorising at home while yet
being able to take advantage of what her teachers have to offer?
Baba
DittyDu...@webtv.net
do not judge people by their cultures etc. and actively seek to meld
into groups of people with other cultures? Yet, you chastise those whom
you deem to be bigots; you assume they discriminate against others, use
terms you deem derogatory because of something you imagine? I give up.
Blake
---------------------
Of course people prefer to gather with those who do not discriminate
against them. There are all sorts of cultural differences which have
nothing to do with people getting along.
. . . . . . . . . .
It is only when people refuse to recognize the true worth of people
from other cultures, and judge them by their culture, or skin color, or
national origin, that problems arise. Those problems are perpetuated by
the use of derogatory terms to refer to a particular group of people. I
am well aware that no group, whatever type of classification is used, is
free of prejudice. This does not make it right.
--
Joy
In places where there is a black community of any size, you can watch
and see that, if left alone, they gather in like groups, simply because
they are more comfortable in like groups. In communities where there are
only one or two of either group, they are more readily accepted into the
opposite group.
Blake
-----------------------
lonestar
DittyDu...@webtv.net wrote:
> But you, of course, have no prejudices,
> do not judge people by their cultures etc. and actively seek to meld
> into groups of people with other cultures? Yet, you chastise those whom
> you deem to be bigots; you assume they discriminate against others, use
> terms you deem derogatory because of something you imagine? I give up.
> Blake
Don't you dare give up. You always have a good explanation for your views,
Robert
lonestar
DittyDu...@webtv.net wrote:
> Well, so are most of the rest of us. So who gave the A-A's their label?
> Not I.
> Get it?
> Blake
Yep, it is an idiotic term.
Robert
Yoj
If you must have a label, you should be able to choose it. I'd rather
see all labels done away with.
--
Joy
Life is what happens to you while you are planning to do something else.
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:207-4019...@storefull-3118.bay.webtv.net...
Yoj
move beyond them. Yes, indeed, I have actively sought to meld into
groups of people with other cultures. In college, I was active in the
"International Club", which was made up of students from a number of
countries. I dated an Arab for several months. I currently attend a
church which has many gay and lesbian members. I enjoyed going to Gay
Night at Disneyland with a number of my church friends, both gay and
straight. I live in a mixed neighborhood. My Toastmasters clubs have
had members from a number of countries, and I have enjoyed learning from
them.
No, I am not perfect, nor do I claim I am. However, I try to follow my
grandmother's advice, "Get the goody out of people." In other words,
appreciate the good points of everyone you encounter, and try not to
focus on the things you don't like about them. I also try to learn from
the differences of others, but to appreciate the similarities. I am
happy that I grew up in East Los Angeles and attended school with people
of various races and ethnicities.
Joy
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:206-4019...@storefull-3118.bay.webtv.net...
Bobbie
Bobbie:-)
"Yoj" <jgay...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:zDoSb.3143$F23....@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
Baba.Mung
"Yoj" <jgay...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:zDoSb.3143$F23....@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> Of course I have some prejudices. Everybody does. However, I try to
> move beyond them. Yes, indeed, I have actively sought to meld into
> groups of people with other cultures. In college, I was active in the
> "International Club", which was made up of students from a number of
> countries. I dated an Arab for several months. I currently attend a
> church which has many gay and lesbian members. I enjoyed going to Gay
> Night at Disneyland with a number of my church friends, both gay and
> straight. I live in a mixed neighborhood. My Toastmasters clubs have
> had members from a number of countries, and I have enjoyed learning from
> them.
>
> No, I am not perfect, nor do I claim I am. However, I try to follow my
> grandmother's advice, "Get the goody out of people." In other words,
> appreciate the good points of everyone you encounter, and try not to
> focus on the things you don't like about them. I also try to learn from
> the differences of others, but to appreciate the similarities. I am
> happy that I grew up in East Los Angeles and attended school with people
> of various races and ethnicities.
>
> Joy
>
I agree with Bobbie. Well said, Joy.
Baba
Jean B.
It is just called "world geography". Ah, I see in the blurb they
say it is mostly cultural geography--not what I was looking
forward to her learning about.
>
> Part of the trouble with learning the names of the countries is that the
> borders are always changing and so are the names.
Sure, but kids need to learn where the countries and cities are
even if they do change.
I think physical
> geography is much more interesting. But who knows what a teenager finds
> interesting?
It varies by child.
>
> Have you tried to find a wall map, Jean? There used to be some 36 inch
> by 24 inch ones, (or thereabouts,) that you could find in a school
> supply store. They were rather cheap, too. $2 or $3 -- probly $10 now.
> Maybe you have no space for a wall map. Possibly you could put it in a
> poster frame and stand it up somewhere.
Yup. The only wall for it is in Leah's playroom though, and she
never goes down there. I like the idea of putting maps on poster
boards. I think I'll do that. A world map and the continents. I
want to go into the map store in Harvard Square anyway. I love
maps. (Come to think of it where IS my map collection. Probably
in storage or lost.)
>
> Does Leah like history? I think historical atlases are very useful.
> Hardly anything is named the same thing as it was in the era you are
> studying. There are paperback atlases for that, relatively inexpensive,
> too.
Leah likes very little. :-(
--
Jean B.
Jean B.
>
> Yep. I had just got used to Myanmar when they changed it back to Burma.
> And then I heard Mumbai for the first time. The books in most schools
> are at least two years old. Kids haven't a chance of learning many of
> the current names in school.
>
--
Jean B.
Jean B.
>
> Maybe Leah could have it both ways. Do the memorising at home while yet
> being able to take advantage of what her teachers have to offer?
>
idea. I'm going to have to be trickier than that--maybe find
games that encompass geography. Hmmm. I wonder if there are
songs? There seem to be songs about everything. Those, of
course, would not help her visualize where the places are though.
--
Jean B.
Yoj
--
Joy
Life is what happens to you while you are planning to do something else.
"Bobbie" <smudge...@smithsonia.com> wrote in message
news:bvd92h$p9j$1...@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk...
Yoj
news:6YrSb.3166$Q63...@news-binary.blueyonder.co.uk...
Thank you, Baba.
Joy
Yoj
Are the Carmen Sandiego games still around?
Joy
Baba.Mung
"Yoj" <jgay...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:W2FSb.4138$F23....@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> "Jean B." <jb...@rcn.com> wrote in message
> news:401AED12...@rcn.com...
>
> Are the Carmen Sandiego games still around?
>
> Joy
>
>
That's an idea! I think I saw some Carmen Diego software on a shop shelf
quite recently.
Baba
Knut Willy
"Jean B." <jb...@rcn.com> skrev i melding news:401AED12...@rcn.com...
_____________________
Perhaps she might find it interesting to learn new languages? Norwegian?
We are two persons around (Kelly & me) who can help.
AND - Kelly is a professional teacher !!
AND - it wouldn't cost you anything! Long live Internet.
Knut Willy
Kelly Petit
"Knut Willy" <kwja...@c2i.net> a écrit dans le message de
news:tGNSb.31863$BD3.7...@juliett.dax.net...
LOL
let's teach her a Norwegian song!
"Eg heiter Håvard Hedde, eg er so gjev ein kar..."
Kelly
DittyDu...@webtv.net
enough, they will all get changed back.
Blake
----------------
jb...@rcn.com (Jean B.)
DittyDu...@webtv.net
justify your attempts to join diverse groups. No need to recite who
your friends are. IMO Your opinions have been shaped by the ones you
associate with, -----not by the ones you do not associate with.
And I think you have missed something. If you are satisfied with that,
so be it.
Blake
--------------------------
jgay...@earthlink.net (Yoj)
beyond them. Yes, indeed, I have actively sought to meld into groups of
people with other cultures. In college, I was active in the
"International Club", which was made up of students from a number of
countries. I dated an Arab for several months. I currently attend a
church which has many gay and lesbian members. I enjoyed going to Gay
Night at Disneyland with a number of my church friends, both gay and
straight. I live in a mixed neighborhood. My Toastmasters clubs have had
members from a number of countries, and I have enjoyed learning from
them.
No, I am not perfect, nor do I claim I am. However, I try to follow my
grandmother's advice, "Get the goody out of people." In other words,
appreciate the good points of everyone you encounter, and try not to
focus on the things you don't like about them. I also try to learn from
the differences of others, but to appreciate the similarities. I am
happy that I grew up in East Los Angeles and attended school with people
of various races and ethnicities.
Joy
Yet, you chastise those whom you deem to be bigots; you assume they
discriminate against others, use terms you deem derogatory because of
differences. Blake
---------------------
people from other cultures, and judge them by their culture, or skin
color, or national origin, that problems arise.
Why do you assume this is true? Is it because you have been told this?
Read it somewhere? People are just people everywhere. Some get along.
Others don't. If two little white boys fight, it's just a couple of
boys fighting. Same if it's two little black boys fighting. But if you
have one of each, suddenly it's a Racial Incident and a whole group is
tainted.
It's all part of the hype.
Blake
------
Those problems are perpetuated by the use of derogatory terms to refer
to a particular group of people.
Joy
I believe the term Afr-Am was coined by one of the black activist
leaders who lived at least most of his life in the north. I do not
recall now who it was. It is all part of the hype IMO.
Blake
---------------
I am well aware that no group, whatever type of classification is used,
is free of prejudice. This does not make it right.
Joy
So which specific groups are you referring to here?
Blake
-----------------------
"Perhaps he is quite a discerning child and does not mingle with
blacks, surely his choice of friends is his decision and his alone." His
choice of friends may be his decision, but to say he is "discerning and
does not mingle with blacks" is extremely bigoted.
Joy
Or else he doesn't want to get beaten up.
Blake
DittyDu...@webtv.net
Adirondaks or the Smokies -- it's the Rockies. Take her to Las Vegas.
Do you have an IMAX anywhere around? There are some good films that
show terrain, such as the Grand Canyon. It's almost like flying through
there yourself.
Will she look at videos? Probly not. She might listen to them while
doing something with her hands===didn't you say she likes art work?
Just listening will sink into her head at this age. Kids learn so fast
in spite of themselves.
Your description of Leah's tastes reminds me so much of a cousin's
daughter, who is artisticly bent. They finally took her out of school
and began home school, because she wasn't learning there. She is very
much focused on her art work, has done some inked comic strips even. I
saw an oil of an eagle she painted that was very lifelike. She has
progressed to college age, and doesn't want to go to college, of course
-- wants to go to an art school. Probly would do well there.
Hey, how about a map making course?
Blake
-----------------
Jean B.
Hmmm. I don't know. I was aware of computer games, but were
there ever any board games? I'm going to have to do a search and
look. Thanks, Joy. BTW, I think Leah was more into geography
back when she was watching that program many years ago.
--
Jean B.
Jean B.
>
> Perhaps she might find it interesting to learn new languages? Norwegian?
> We are two persons around (Kelly & me) who can help.
> AND - Kelly is a professional teacher !!
> AND - it wouldn't cost you anything! Long live Internet.
>
--
Jean B.
Jean B.
>
> Well, when she sings about "purple mountain majesties", it's not the
> Adirondaks or the Smokies -- it's the Rockies. Take her to Las Vegas.
>
> Do you have an IMAX anywhere around? There are some good films that
> show terrain, such as the Grand Canyon. It's almost like flying through
> there yourself.
>
> Will she look at videos? Probly not. She might listen to them while
> doing something with her hands===didn't you say she likes art work?
> Just listening will sink into her head at this age. Kids learn so fast
> in spite of themselves.
>
> Your description of Leah's tastes reminds me so much of a cousin's
> daughter, who is artisticly bent. They finally took her out of school
> and began home school, because she wasn't learning there. She is very
> much focused on her art work, has done some inked comic strips even. I
> saw an oil of an eagle she painted that was very lifelike. She has
> progressed to college age, and doesn't want to go to college, of course
> -- wants to go to an art school. Probly would do well there.
>
> Hey, how about a map making course?
>
> Blake
Well, that all sounds familiar, but it is hard to accept it when
she is an EXTREMELY bright kid. I do wish she was more interested
in using her mind and not just doing as little as she can get away
with (while getting good grades). In retrospect, she probably
would have done better if I had home-schooled her from the very
beginning. She has learned so very little since she started
school, and her attitude has gone in one direction.
--
Jean B.
Knut Willy
"Jean B." <jb...@rcn.com> skrev i melding news:401BEE5F...@rcn.com...
________________________
I AM IMPRESSED !!!
The old worn-out Stetson flies off again
Knut Willy, who invites y'all to a look at
http://www.picturetrail.com/knutwilly
Knut Willy
"Jean B." <jb...@rcn.com> skrev i melding news:401C5C04...@rcn.com...
__________________
... an EXTREMELY bright kid.. Was that a joke, or is she her mother's
daughter?? Bright as her mother?
:-) :-) :-) kidding
Knut Willy
"Kelly Petit" <kelly...@wanadoo.invalid> skrev i melding
news:bvge80$q58$7...@news-reader5.wanadoo.fr...
But fact is: Leah is NOT a "kar" (a guy) she is a young girl.
Kelly Petit
"Knut Willy" <kwja...@c2i.net>
>
> But fact is: Leah is NOT a "kar" (a guy) she is a young girl.
>
> Knut Willy, who invites y'all to a look at
> http://www.picturetrail.com/knutwilly
>
But, but, he HH is marvellous lad and he wanted to get married...
Those pictures are just beautiful and I envy you a lot!
kelly
Jean B.
> >
> > --
> > Jean B.
>
> ________________________
>
> I AM IMPRESSED !!!
> The old worn-out Stetson flies off again
>
learning it! I hope the tutor is still willing to take on a
child, and is somewhat affordable.
--
Jean B.
Jean B.
>
> ... an EXTREMELY bright kid.. Was that a joke, or is she her mother's
> daughter?? Bright as her mother?
>
> :-) :-) :-) kidding
>
than I am.
--
Jean B.
Dink
There are 3 flavors of Japanese: hiragana, katakana, and kanji.
Dink
Jean B.
Well, yes. Written flavors. I am thinking more of oral
Japanese--and writing. Leah is already teaching herself to read
Japanese, or so she claims. She seems to know at least some
hiragana.
--
Jean B.
Knut Willy
"Dink" <m...@privacy.net> skrev i melding
news:dltq10d42181nesej...@4ax.com...
______________________
Damn! My hat is torn off, encore un fois.
I'm I M P R E S S E D A G A I N!!
What you know, man!
Knut Willy, the ignorant
Knut Willy
"Jean B." <jb...@rcn.com> skrev i melding news:401D7131...@rcn.com...
___________________
Is that possible? To be even brighter, I mean. What about a membership in
the local MENSA Club?
Knut Willy
Jean B.
>
> Is that possible? To be even brighter, I mean. What about a membership in
> the local MENSA Club?
>
from Mensa.
--
Jean B.
Yoj
news:n9nTb.32023$BD3.7...@juliett.dax.net...
That is a thought, Jean, if her IQ is high enough to qualify. Many
Mensa groups have activities for young people. The Los Angeles group
has a very active Young Mensans group.
Joy
Yoj
There are some board games. I know of at least one where the objective
is to rule the world. It does use a map to show the various areas you
have taken over. My son-in-law has it, and if you think you (or Leah)
might be interested, I'll ask him the name, and also ask if he has any
others to suggest. He's very much into playing games.
Joy
Yoj
Knut Willy,
Anyone who writes English, when it is not his first language, as well as
you do, can't call himself ignorant. I know a little bit of Spanish, a
little bit of American Sign Language, and a few words is many other
languages. However, the only language in which I can really communicate
in is English, which I have been learning all my life. *My* chapeau is
off to *you* and the others who post here in a language that is not the
one they grew up with.
Joy
Knut Willy
"Yoj" <jgay...@earthlink.net> skrev i melding
news:1ESTb.10790$F23....@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
Thanks soooo much Joy.
Knut Willy
lamb
>Knut Willy,
>
>Anyone who writes English, when it is not his first language, as well as
>you do, can't call himself ignorant. I know a little bit of Spanish, a
>little bit of American Sign Language, and a few words is many other
>languages. However, the only language in which I can really communicate
>in is English, which I have been learning all my life. *My* chapeau is
>off to *you* and the others who post here in a language that is not the
>one they grew up with.
>
>Joy
>
>
Thank you, Joy!
Kusje!
(kiss)
--
Loes
Kelly Petit
"Yoj" <jgay...@earthlink.net>
> > ______________________
> >
> > Damn! My hat is torn off, encore un fois.
> > I'm I M P R E S S E D A G A I N!!
> > What you know, man!
> >
> > Knut Willy, the ignorant
>
> Knut Willy,
>
> Anyone who writes English, when it is not his first language, as well as
> you do, can't call himself ignorant. I know a little bit of Spanish, a
> little bit of American Sign Language, and a few words is many other
> languages. However, the only language in which I can really communicate
> in is English, which I have been learning all my life. *My* chapeau is
> off to *you* and the others who post here in a language that is not the
> one they grew up with.
>
> Joy
>
Kelly
Bobbie
"lamb" <lambwil...@chello.nl> wrote in message
news:bvovfq$s6bu9$2...@ID-85759.news.uni-berlin.de...
perfect English with the most delightful Dutch Accent. <gg>
Kusje!
Naughty Nanc.....
Knut Willy
"lamb" <lambwil...@chello.nl> skrev i melding
news:bvovfq$s6bu9$2...@ID-85759.news.uni-berlin.de...
Who was that kusje to? Moi or Joy?
returning kutsjes to everyone
knut w.
lamb
>> Thank you, Joy!
>> Kusje!
>> (kiss)
>>
>> --
>> Loes
>>
>__________________________
>
>Who was that kusje to? Moi or Joy?
>
>returning kutsjes to everyone
>
>knut w.
>
>
Joy of course! She was being very nice to us.
But you can have one too! Kusje, Knut!
--
Loes
Yoj
as I can tell, what I have missed is the idea that all people of any
category can be classed the same. Am I satisfied with that? You bet.
Joy
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:29789-401...@storefull-3112.bay.webtv.net...
Jean B.
>
> That is a thought, Jean, if her IQ is high enough to qualify. Many
> Mensa groups have activities for young people. The Los Angeles group
> has a very active Young Mensans group.
>
something at school, but...
--
Jean B.
Jean B.
>
> There are some board games. I know of at least one where the objective
> is to rule the world. It does use a map to show the various areas you
> have taken over. My son-in-law has it, and if you think you (or Leah)
> might be interested, I'll ask him the name, and also ask if he has any
> others to suggest. He's very much into playing games.
>
relatively palatable approach. Thanks!
--
Jean B.
Jean B.
>
> "Yoj" <jgay...@earthlink.net> skrev i melding
> news:1ESTb.10790$F23....@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> > Anyone who writes English, when it is not his first language, as well as
> > you do, can't call himself ignorant. I know a little bit of Spanish, a
> > little bit of American Sign Language, and a few words is many other
> > languages. However, the only language in which I can really communicate
> > in is English, which I have been learning all my life. *My* chapeau is
> > off to *you* and the others who post here in a language that is not the
> > one they grew up with.
> >
> > Joy
> >
> _____________________
>
> Thanks soooo much Joy.
>
> Knut Willy
Look outside. It's raining (or snowing) chapeaux....
--
Jean B.