You wanted an impeachable offense? Now you have one
lubow
Bush and/or Cheney. Sometimes I responded that such an action would destroy
our system of government. It would change our Federal system to something
like the British Parliamentary system.
Now I have news for you. Our system of government is officially destroyed.
There's a cancer in the Executive Branch that has already percolated into
the Judiciary. It will take guts from the House Democrats to eradicate it.
So far they have proven to be the gutless wonders. Doing the easy stuff.
Passing new unemployment insurance. Getting rid of political appointees.
Now it's time for them to stand up for whatever decency is left in the
government of the United States of America.
If it can be shown to the satisfaction of the House Judiciary Committee
(Where's Peter Rodino when we need him?) that Libby's pardon (or whatever
you want to call it) was done to buy his silence in protecting Cheney and/or
Bush we have an impeachable offense for both Bush and Cheney.
Now it's time to see some courage from the House Democrats in general, and
Judiciary Committee chairman John Conyers in particular.
The country is calling on you, Chairman Conyers. Do you have what it takes
to run with this hot potato?
---Lubow
Foxtrot
>For months we have seen the posts from leftists calling for impeachment of
>Bush and/or Cheney. Sometimes I responded that such an action would destroy
>our system of government. It would change our Federal system to something
>like the British Parliamentary system.
>
>Now I have news for you. Our system of government is officially destroyed.
>There's a cancer in the Executive Branch that has already percolated into
>the Judiciary. It will take guts from the House Democrats to eradicate it.
>So far they have proven to be the gutless wonders. Doing the easy stuff.
>Passing new unemployment insurance. Getting rid of political appointees.
>Now it's time for them to stand up for whatever decency is left in the
>government of the United States of America.
>
>If it can be shown to the satisfaction of the House Judiciary Committee
>(Where's Peter Rodino when we need him?) that Libby's pardon (or whatever
>you want to call it) was done to buy his silence in protecting Cheney and/or
>Bush we have an impeachable offense for both Bush and Cheney.
There's already widespread public disgust for congress, Lubowel
Movement. They will disgust voters even more if they partake in such
a partisan attack.
Besides BJ pardoned INTERNATIONAL FUGITIVE Marc Rich and other
lowlifes including his own cocaine trafficking brother Roger. Your side
did it so STFU while Repubs do it too.
Alcoholic@crawfordl.net AmericanPeople
"Foxtrot" <fox...@null.com> wrote in message
news:b16j83lrb26469sv7...@4ax.com...
You left out the part where Marc Rich had to pay millions in fines and spend
his life on Parole
He still hasn't turned himself in.
Bush must be legally dealt with immediately, and harshly.
lubow
anyone. Marc Rich didn't have any information that could put anyone into
jail. But..
...Libby does.
And buying off someone's silence is a Federal crime. This isn't about cum
on a blue dress.
Just as the Watergate break-in was an over-reaction to the McGovern
campaign, pardoning Libby was an over-reaction to what Libby can possibly
tell the FBI. In words that even a piece of fox shit can understand, it is
an impeachable crime to buy the silence of a material witness.
Can we count on the Democrats to show some guts? I'm not sure. So far they
have avoided the tough issues of getting our youngsters out of Iraq and
concentrated on unemployment, Federal prosecutors and the mess with the Army
medical corps. The country demands those morons in the West Wing to be
kicked out of town and it's up to Sheriff Conyers and Marshal Pelosi to
round 'em up and kick their respective behinds into the Home for Disgraced
Politicians at Danbury.
--
Lubow
3581 Dead
>"lubow" <lu...@lubow-industries.com> wrote:
>
>>For months we have seen the posts from leftists calling for impeachment of
>>Bush and/or Cheney. Sometimes I responded that such an action would destroy
>>our system of government. It would change our Federal system to something
>>like the British Parliamentary system.
>>
>>Now I have news for you. Our system of government is officially destroyed.
>>There's a cancer in the Executive Branch that has already percolated into
>>the Judiciary. It will take guts from the House Democrats to eradicate it.
>>So far they have proven to be the gutless wonders. Doing the easy stuff.
>>Passing new unemployment insurance. Getting rid of political appointees.
>>Now it's time for them to stand up for whatever decency is left in the
>>government of the United States of America.
>>
>>If it can be shown to the satisfaction of the House Judiciary Committee
>>(Where's Peter Rodino when we need him?) that Libby's pardon (or whatever
>>you want to call it) was done to buy his silence in protecting Cheney and/or
>>Bush we have an impeachable offense for both Bush and Cheney.
>
>There's already widespread public disgust for congress, Lubowel
>Movement. They will disgust voters even more if they partake in such
>a partisan attack.
Congress lost ground because they would NOT go after those sleazy,
cowardly criminals in the WH.
>
>Besides BJ pardoned INTERNATIONAL FUGITIVE Marc Rich and other
>lowlifes including his own cocaine trafficking brother Roger. Your side
>did it so STFU while Repubs do it too.
Big fucking deal. Do you have any idea how pathetic and servile you
sound?
--
One of the [Gold Star mothers], Elaine Johnson, recounted a meeting that she had with
President Bush in which he gave her a presidential coin and told her
and five other families: "Don't go sell it on eBay."
--from interview broadcast on NPR
Putsch: leading America to asymetric warfare since 2001
Not dead, in jail, or a slave? Thank a liberal!
Pay your taxes so the rich don't have to.
For the finest in liberal/leftist commentary,
http://www.zeppscommentaries.com
For news feed (free, 10-20 articles a day)
http://groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/zepps_news
For essays (donations accepted, 2 articles/week)
http://groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/zepps_essays
a.a. #2211 -- Bryan Zepp Jamieson
Docky Wocky
"Now I have news for you. Our system of government is officially destroyed.
There's a cancer in the Executive Branch that has already percolated into
the Judiciary. It will take guts from the House Democrats to eradicate
it..."
_________________________________
Beyond the almost Hollywoodish overstatement and exaggeration mouthpiecing
the left-wing line demands of it's useful idiots, this one conjures-up the
tried and true image of heroic Chicken Little lefties, the noble House
Democratics, convinced that the sky is falling, climbing up on the ramparts
to defend the republic from those evil conservatives.
These lines positively reek of unrestrained DNC input from the, "We've Got
To Save The Union Wing," of union-approved propagandists.
ZNUYBV
Clinton also pardoned a major drug dealer from Los Angeles after his
son donated $250,000 to the Clinton Library and Message Parlor.
Liberalhere
news:b16j83lrb26469sv7...@4ax.com:
I'll use small words so you can keep up, fox-urine. Clinton didn't commute
or pardon anyone in order to protect himself from impeachment. Did he
pardon Susan McDougal? Rethugs judically raped her in the hope she'd agree
to tell lies about Clinton. Bush knew full well that a week after starting
his prison sentence, libby would have turned state's evidence against ol'
Shotgun Cheney. who, in turn, would spill his guts about Bush.
It's called rethug self-preservation. Many rethugs are doing this today;
see "Abramoff". I hear ol' Killer Cunningham is singing, "I wanna protect
the virgin ass of mine." Do little Doolittle will soon be da Duke's bitch.
Again.
zzbu...@netscape.net
> For months we have seen the posts from leftists calling for impeachment of
> Bush and/or Cheney. Sometimes I responded that such an action would destroy
> our system of government. It would change our Federal system to something
> like the British Parliamentary system.
The assholes already did that 30 years ago, when they sold Alaska
to BP.
So, it's just only a matter now of the Republican idiots
appointing Ann Coulter as Sir something or other of Coney Island.
And the Democrat idiots having Bono write a new Constitution
or something like Venuzula Forever.
Docky Wocky
pardoners didn't give enough of a crap about Susan McDougal to pardon her?
She sure protected his ass when the chips were down. Almost a religious
devotion to the Great Bubba...or possibly to the Great Boobah.
So what did she get? Or, should I say, "what kind of an offer she couldn't
refuse did she get?"
lubow
> pardoners
Olympic grade pardoner? Are you referring to Reagan who pardoned about 300
more felons than Clinton? Or Eisenhower who pardoned TWICE as many
criminals as Clinton.
I guess you morons and GOP lemmings who comprise the 28% who think Bush has
done good for America also are the party of criminals and pardoners
--
Lubow
lubow
> appointing Ann Coulter as Sir something or other of Coney Island.
Hey, stop making fun of Coney Island. We Brooklynites are very sensitive
when someone pokes fun at one of our neighborhoods.
--
Lubow
<zzbu...@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:1183513313.1...@n2g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
> On Jul 2, 8:01 pm, "lubow" <l...@lubow-industries.com> wrote:
>> For months we have seen the posts from leftists calling for impeachment
>> of
>> Bush and/or Cheney. Sometimes I responded that such an action would
>> destroy
>> our system of government. It would change our Federal system to
>> something
>> like the British Parliamentary system.
>
> The assholes already did that 30 years ago, when they sold Alaska
> to BP.
> And the Democrat idiots having Bono write a new Constitution
ZNUYBV
wrote:
>What foxshit forgot is that Clinton didn't buy anyone's silence in pardoning
>anyone. Marc Rich didn't have any information that could put anyone into
>jail. But..
>
>...Libby does.
>
>And buying off someone's silence is a Federal crime. This isn't about cum
>on a blue dress.
>
>Just as the Watergate break-in was an over-reaction to the McGovern
>campaign, pardoning Libby was an over-reaction to what Libby can possibly
>tell the FBI. In words that even a piece of fox shit can understand, it is
>an impeachable crime to buy the silence of a material witness.
>
>Can we count on the Democrats to show some guts? I'm not sure. So far they
>have avoided the tough issues of getting our youngsters out of Iraq and
>concentrated on unemployment, Federal prosecutors and the mess with the Army
>medical corps. The country demands those morons in the West Wing to be
>kicked out of town and it's up to Sheriff Conyers and Marshal Pelosi to
>round 'em up and kick their respective behinds into the Home for Disgraced
>Politicians at Danbury.
No chance of impeachment. As unpopular as Bush is he' far more
popular than the House or the Senate.
The people really hate Reid and Pelosi.
David Moffitt
"Docky Wocky" <mrc...@lst.net> wrote in message
news:ySDii.2896$Np2.1194@trnddc07...
%%%% He did pardon her and many more of his co-defendents.
“Me? I already understand how little I actually know..” --- Kunt
Harrington Sunday, December 03, 2006 6:57 PM
>
>
Docky Wocky
There is no aura of sleeze connected with Eisenhower, or Reagan. Only the
Great Bubba handed out pardons for cash.
I guess us morons and GOP lemmings are still the so-called 28% who know Bush
has not done nearly enough in the pardon department to even approach the
league Bubba was in when it came to cashing in on pardons for sale.
David Moffitt
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pardon Hillary
She blasts Bush over Libby case, but the Clintons abused the power
One of the weaknesses of Sen. Hillary Clinton's campaign is that imagining
her in the Oval Office brings to mind the scandals that marked her husband's
time as President. Especially now, when she is trotting old Bubba out to rev
up the faithful, the sordid past undermines her and boosts Barack Obama's
promise for a different kind of politics.
The list of investigations, allegations and a few convictions during the
Clinton administration was so long and tangled that the cases now morph into
a fog. Distinctions among Travelgate and Whitewater and FileGate and
GiftGate and the $100,000 commodities windfall get lost, with only Monica
and the stained blue dress forever vivid.
Now and then, that fog is pierced by something that reminds us what a grubby
time it was. The case of Lewis (Scooter) Libby does that.
When President Bush commuted Libby's prison sentence Monday, Sen. Clinton
was quick to denounce him. Under Bush, she said, "cronyism and ideology
trump competence and justice."
She's right in general, though the arguments on Bush's behalf this time are
considerable. But when I stumbled on a list of Bill Clinton's pardons posted
on the Drudge Report, I was instantly back on Jan. 20, 2001. That's when
Clinton, in his final hours as President, opened the floodgates, issuing 140
pardons and 36 commutations.
The list of people Clinton let off the hook was a rogue's gallery of drug
dealers, petty criminals and the politically well-connected. One was Bill
Clinton's brother Roger, one was a college friend and another was a former
business partner. Their lawyers' connections were key in others, including
the lawyer for a man who laundered more than $100 million for the Cali
cartel.
Some cases reeked of blatant corruption. Hillary's brother, Hugh Rodham,
collected $400,000 from two big-time criminals who got pardons. When the
news of the payments broke, the Clintons claimed surprise and demanded
Rodham give the money back.
But Bill Clinton never gave Denise Rich her money back. The former wife of
disgraced financier Marc Rich gave $450,000 to Clinton's presidential
library and raised and contributed more than $1 million to campaigns of the
Clintons and other Democrats. Her husband, who had fled the country rather
than fight charges of massive tax fraud and trading with Iran during the
1979 hostage crisis, suddenly received a pardon. "Utterly false," Bill
Clinton later said about charges he sold the pardon. "There was absolutely
no quid pro quo."
Among those he cited who supported the pardon was Scooter Libby, a lawyer
for Marc Rich.
Denise Rich, asked on TV whether she "bought" access to the Clintons, said,
"Oh yes, that's true, of course." A grand jury looked at it, but no charges
were brought.
Another Clinton pardon that drew a grand jury probe involved four Hasidic
men from suburban New York. They had cheated the government out of tens of
millions in anti-poverty programs and received prison sentences of up to
6-1/2 years. They, too, got a get-out-of-jail card, though it was not
necessarily free.
As Daily News reporters later proved, leaders of the sect the men belonged
to hoped that by supporting Hillary's 2000 Senate campaign, they would be
rewarded with a pardon.
"They thought if they unilaterally showed support for Hillary, maybe they
would get a pardon," their lawyer told The News.
And that's just what happened. On the advice of the group's rabbi, the
community voted for Clinton over Republican Rick Lazio by 1,400-to-12. A
month later, that rabbi had a White House meeting with Bill and Hillary
Clinton and pleaded for the pardon. He got it. Again, a grand jury came up
empty.
Clinton said yesterday that her husband didn't play politics with pardons,
but that Bush has with Libby. Depends on how you define politics.
I'm not going to have some reporters pawing through our papers We are the
president. ---- Hillary Clinton
gringo
> There is only one Olympic Grade pardoner. That is the creep, Bubba Clinton.
>
> There is no aura of sleeze connected with Eisenhower, or Reagan. Only the
> Great Bubba handed out pardons for cash.
>
prove it.
> I guess us morons and GOP lemmings are still the so-called 28% who know Bush
> has not done nearly enough in the pardon department to even approach the
> league Bubba was in when it came to cashing in on pardons for sale.
>
>
>
yeah, you morons. since you obviously can read, you are as obviously
willfully ignorant. Therefore, you are traitorously ignorant of the
facts, and intend to remain so.
--
"Sarah, if the American people had ever known the truth about what we Bushes have done to this nation, we would be chased down in the streets and lynched."
--- George Herbert Walker Bush, in an interview with Sarah McClendon, 1992
gringo
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Pardon Hillary
>
> She blasts Bush over Libby case, but the Clintons abused the power
> One of the weaknesses of Sen. Hillary Clinton's campaign is that imagining
> her in the Oval Office brings to mind the scandals that marked her husband's
> time as President. Especially now, when she is trotting old Bubba out to rev
> up the faithful, the sordid past undermines her and boosts Barack Obama's
> promise for a different kind of politics.
>
Bill Clinton would be reelected in a landslide not even Diebold machines
could defeat.
> The list of investigations, allegations and a few convictions during the
> Clinton administration was so long and tangled that the cases now morph into
> a fog. Distinctions among Travelgate and Whitewater and FileGate and
> GiftGate and the $100,000 commodities windfall get lost, with only Monica
> and the stained blue dress forever vivid.
>
> Now and then, that fog is pierced by something that reminds us what a grubby
> time it was. The case of Lewis (Scooter) Libby does that.
>
> When President Bush commuted Libby's prison sentence Monday, Sen. Clinton
> was quick to denounce him. Under Bush, she said, "cronyism and ideology
> trump competence and justice."
>
> She's right in general, though the arguments on Bush's behalf this time are
> considerable. But when I stumbled on a list of Bill Clinton's pardons posted
> on the Drudge Report, I was instantly back on Jan. 20, 2001. That's when
> Clinton, in his final hours as President, opened the floodgates, issuing 140
> pardons and 36 commutations.
>
drudged report. LOL. What did his pal michaela savage have to say?
> The list of people Clinton let off the hook was a rogue's gallery of drug
> dealers, petty criminals and the politically well-connected. One was Bill
> Clinton's brother Roger, one was a college friend and another was a former
> business partner. Their lawyers' connections were key in others, including
> the lawyer for a man who laundered more than $100 million for the Cali
> cartel.
>
among ghwb's "pardons" were those who bilked S&L's out of billions. His
own son benefited more than $100 million, and he was not required to pay
it back.
> Some cases reeked of blatant corruption. Hillary's brother, Hugh Rodham,
> collected $400,000 from two big-time criminals who got pardons. When the
> news of the payments broke, the Clintons claimed surprise and demanded
> Rodham give the money back.
>
> But Bill Clinton never gave Denise Rich her money back. The former wife of
> disgraced financier Marc Rich gave $450,000 to Clinton's presidential
> library and raised and contributed more than $1 million to campaigns of the
> Clintons and other Democrats. Her husband, who had fled the country rather
> than fight charges of massive tax fraud and trading with Iran during the
> 1979 hostage crisis, suddenly received a pardon.
you can bet your ass the man was involved with the reagan/bush
administrations if he was a broker of the Iran/Contra scandal. I
suspect that Clinton granted the pardon rather than get into a fight
with republiCONS Baker, rumsfeld, the many bushes and the the thieves of
the pentagon.
> "Utterly false," Bill
> Clinton later said about charges he sold the pardon. "There was absolutely
> no quid pro quo."
>
> Among those he cited who supported the pardon was Scooter Libby, a lawyer
> for Marc Rich.
>
> Denise Rich, asked on TV whether she "bought" access to the Clintons, said,
> "Oh yes, that's true, of course." A grand jury looked at it, but no charges
> were brought.
>
> Another Clinton pardon that drew a grand jury probe involved four Hasidic
> men from suburban New York. They had cheated the government out of tens of
> millions in anti-poverty programs and received prison sentences of up to
> 6-1/2 years. They, too, got a get-out-of-jail card, though it was not
> necessarily free.
>
> As Daily News reporters later proved, leaders of the sect the men belonged
> to hoped that by supporting Hillary's 2000 Senate campaign, they would be
> rewarded with a pardon.
>
> "They thought if they unilaterally showed support for Hillary, maybe they
> would get a pardon," their lawyer told The News.
>
> And that's just what happened. On the advice of the group's rabbi, the
> community voted for Clinton over Republican Rick Lazio by 1,400-to-12. A
> month later, that rabbi had a White House meeting with Bill and Hillary
> Clinton and pleaded for the pardon. He got it. Again, a grand jury came up
> empty.
>
Empty= INNOCENT
> Clinton said yesterday that her husband didn't play politics with pardons,
> but that Bush has with Libby. Depends on how you define politics.
>
> mgoo...@nydailynews.com
>
> I'm not going to have some reporters pawing through our papers We are the
> president. ---- Hillary Clinton
>
>
>
$60-$80 million of taxpayer money wasted by special prosecutor: final
judgment INNOCENT.
Docky Wocky
A concession from a gringo level leftie.
"...since you can obviously read..." (I AM GOING TO PRINT THAT AND FRAME
IT)
Now, you have to decide between, "willfully ignorant," or "traitorously
ignorant," as it has to be one or the other to satisfy your Moon god.
bval...@aol.com
> Congress lost ground because they would NOT go after those sleazy,
> cowardly criminals in the WH.
Nope. Congress' numbers are about HALF that of President Bush's.
So, unless you're saying that there are people out there who support
the President, but who want to see he taken down...
> >Besides BJ pardoned INTERNATIONAL FUGITIVE Marc Rich and other
> >lowlifes including his own cocaine trafficking brother Roger. Your side
> >did it so STFU while Repubs do it too.
> Big fucking deal. Do you have any idea how pathetic and servile you
> sound? ''
Not nearly as pathetic and servile as you sound when you try and dodge
the point.
3581 Dead
>
>> Congress lost ground because they would NOT go after those sleazy,
>> cowardly criminals in the WH.
>
>Nope. Congress' numbers are about HALF that of President Bush's.
>So, unless you're saying that there are people out there who support
>the President, but who want to see he taken down...
You might want to check the latest polls. Dems have about a 36%
favorable rating, and Putsch the the GOP in Congress have about a 26%.
Even in Valala land, that's not less than half. In fact...
>
>
>> >Besides BJ pardoned INTERNATIONAL FUGITIVE Marc Rich and other
>> >lowlifes including his own cocaine trafficking brother Roger. Your side
>> >did it so STFU while Repubs do it too.
>
>> Big fucking deal. Do you have any idea how pathetic and servile you
>> sound? ''
>
>Not nearly as pathetic and servile as you sound when you try and dodge
>the point.
What point? Did Rich commit perjury and obstruct justice with an eye
to damaging his country's security for partisan gain like that dirtbag
Scooter Libby did?
Kurt Nicklas
> > So, it's just only a matter now of the Republican idiots
> > appointing Ann Coulter as Sir something or other of Coney Island.
>
> Hey, stop making fun of Coney Island. We Brooklynites are very sensitive
> when someone pokes fun at one of our neighborhoods.
Brooklyn is a trashpit.
Now tell us what "high crime" Bush has committed that makes him
impeachable.
3581 Dead
Obstruction of justice.
Steve
<zepp22...@finestplanet.com> wrote:
>On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 20:15:10 -0000, Kurt Nicklas
><nick...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
>>On Jul 4, 12:19 am, "lubow" <l...@lubow-industries.com> wrote:
>>> > So, it's just only a matter now of the Republican idiots
>>> > appointing Ann Coulter as Sir something or other of Coney Island.
>>>
>>> Hey, stop making fun of Coney Island. We Brooklynites are very sensitive
>>> when someone pokes fun at one of our neighborhoods.
>>
>>Brooklyn is a trashpit.
>>
>>Now tell us what "high crime" Bush has committed that makes him
>>impeachable.
>
>Obstruction of justice.
This from Zepp, whose actions got him barred from citizenship.....
and by the way, in some cases, pretending to be citizen when you're
not is against the law....
"I have the right to vote against him in the next
election."
--Zepp Jamieson, 1996
http://www.google.com/groups?as_umsgid=4l6trj%24iq4%40news.snowcrest.net
"I will throw my vote away on a 3rd party candidate."
--Zepp Jamieson,2000/02/15
http://www.google.com/groups?selm=38a8c8d3.16637502%40news.snowcrest.net
"I can just as easily vote once now--in my local Congressional race"
--Zepp Jamieson, 1996
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.politics.usa.misc/msg/a6fa6287419ce925?hl=en&
"You just doubled the value of my vote."
--Zepp Jamieson, 2000/04/25
http://www.google.com/groups?selm=3905050c.66719349%40news.snowcrest.net
"I -can- vote"
--Zepp Jamieson, 2000/04/25
http://www.google.com/groups?selm=4lmnit%24eiv%40news.snowcrest.net
[...] if we decide elections by square miles, my vote is worth
200 Los Angeles votes.
--Zepp Jamieson, 2000-12-18
http://www.google.com/groups?selm=tbit3tc60l1a6c1mj89b4o285anpe11kqa%404ax.com&oe=UTF-8
"Legal resident alien Zepp Jamieson, a Canadian who has lived
in the United States for more than 30 years, said his status
changed dramatically with the Patriot Act."
http://www.mtshastanews.com/archives/index.inn?loc=detail&doc=/2003/June/04-1695-news11.txt
Legal resident aliens aren't allowed to vote, Jamieson.
Why were you lying and pretending to be a citizen?
Kurt Nicklas
> On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 13:57:56 -0700, 3581 Dead
>
>
>
>
>
> ><nickl...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
> >>On Jul 4, 12:19 am, "lubow" <l...@lubow-industries.com> wrote:
> >>> > So, it's just only a matter now of the Republican idiots
> >>> > appointing Ann Coulter as Sir something or other of Coney Island.
>
> >>> Hey, stop making fun of Coney Island. We Brooklynites are very sensitive
> >>> when someone pokes fun at one of our neighborhoods.
>
> >>Brooklyn is a trashpit.
>
> >>Now tell us what "high crime" Bush has committed that makes him
> >>impeachable.
>
> >Obstruction of justice.
>
> This from Zepp, whose actions got him barred from citizenship.....
> and by the way, in some cases, pretending to be citizen when you're
> not is against the law....
You haven't heard the half of it.....
> "I have the right to vote against him in the next
> election."
> --Zepp Jamieson, 1996http://www.google.com/groups?as_umsgid=4l6trj%24iq4%40news.snowcrest.net
>
> "I will throw my vote away on a 3rd party candidate."
> --Zepp Jamieson,2000/02/15http://www.google.com/groups?selm=38a8c8d3.16637502%40news.snowcrest.net
>
> "I can just as easily vote once now--in my local Congressional race"
> --Zepp Jamieson, 1996http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.politics.usa.misc/msg/a6fa628...
>
> "You just doubled the value of my vote."
> --Zepp Jamieson, 2000/04/25http://www.google.com/groups?selm=3905050c.66719349%40news.snowcrest.net
>
> "I -can- vote"
> --Zepp Jamieson, 2000/04/25http://www.google.com/groups?selm=4lmnit%24eiv%40news.snowcrest.net
>
> [...] if we decide elections by square miles, my vote is worth
> 200 Los Angeles votes.
> --Zepp Jamieson, 2000-12-18http://www.google.com/groups?selm=tbit3tc60l1a6c1mj89b4o285anpe11kqa%...
>
> "Legal resident alien Zepp Jamieson, a Canadian who has lived
> in the United States for more than 30 years, said his status
> changed dramatically with the Patriot Act."http://www.mtshastanews.com/archives/index.inn?loc=detail&doc=/2003/J...
>
> Legal resident aliens aren't allowed to vote, Jamieson.
> Why were you lying and pretending to be a citizen?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
lubow
> Brooklyn is a trashpit.
>
If Brooklyn is the standard you use as a trashpit, then you must be a
walking pile of dogshit.
--
Lubow
lubow
> You haven't heard the half of it.....
>
What would a walking pile of dogshit like yourself know about anything?
--
Lubow
bval...@aol.com
> >> Big fucking deal. Do you have any idea how pathetic and servile you
> >> sound? ''
> >Not nearly as pathetic and servile as you sound when you try and dodge
> >the point.
> What point? Did Rich commit perjury and obstruct justice with an eye
> to damaging his country's security for partisan gain like that dirtbag
> Scooter Libby did?>
Interesting point - yes, Marc did, in fact, damage America's security
by trading illegally with Iran.
Second, Scooter didn't damage America's security. He wasn't charaged
with ratting out Plame - that honor goes to Deputy Secretary of State
Department Richard Armitage. Of course, Armitage is a big lefty, so
you don't scream for his blood, do you?
If you'd like to talk about people who damaged America's security, how
about Sandy Berger, who received a slap on the wrist for stealing and
destroying top secret documents during a time of war.
gringo
incompetent and traitorous Administration, yours is not merely a
personal failing; it contributes in some small measure to the
malfeasance of the neoCONS.
gringo
3581 Dead
>
>> >> Big fucking deal. Do you have any idea how pathetic and servile you
>> >> sound? ''
>
>> >Not nearly as pathetic and servile as you sound when you try and dodge
>> >the point.
>
>> What point? Did Rich commit perjury and obstruct justice with an eye
>> to damaging his country's security for partisan gain like that dirtbag
>> Scooter Libby did?>
>
>Interesting point - yes, Marc did, in fact, damage America's security
>by trading illegally with Iran.
Did he trade arms with Iran?
>
>Second, Scooter didn't damage America's security. He wasn't charaged
>with ratting out Plame - that honor goes to Deputy Secretary of State
>Department Richard Armitage. Of course, Armitage is a big lefty, so
>you don't scream for his blood, do you?
Yes, he did, by outing Plame. Armitage is no "big lefty" -- he's
another right wing dirtbag, which is why YOU aren't screaming for his
scalp.
>
>If you'd like to talk about people who damaged America's security, how
>about Sandy Berger, who received a slap on the wrist for stealing and
>destroying top secret documents during a time of war.
Sandy Bergers offenses were trivial.
Now, how do you feel about the fact that Putsch is obviously trying to
prevent the investigation into the Plame thing from moving forward?
lubow
> about Sandy Berger, who received a slap on the wrist for stealing and
> destroying top secret documents during a time of war.
>
OK... You win. I shall never vote for Bill Clinton again. Meanwhile let's
talk about using a pardon as a substitute for hush money in a case involving
national security.
On Wednesday the House Judiciary Committee starts hearings in its duty,
under the Constitution to investigate. What did Libby know and when did he
know it? Were his lies to the FBI in defense of higher government
officials? (dumb question).
Also on Wednesday we shall if Judiciary Chairman John Conyers is going to
wimp-out like the Democrats have already done when it came to financing a
war nobody wanted or needed or be a man in the tradition of former Judiciary
Chairman, the late Peter Rodino.
--
Lubow
lubow
because we have morons who allow radio talk jockeys/drug addicts do their
thinking for them.
--
Lubow
"gringo" <gri...@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:wR%ii.11103$3a....@bignews9.bellsouth.net...
gringo
>>>> Big fucking deal. Do you have any idea how pathetic and servile you
>>>> sound? ''
>>>>
>
>
>>> Not nearly as pathetic and servile as you sound when you try and dodge
>>> the point.
>>>
>
>
>> What point? Did Rich commit perjury and obstruct justice with an eye
>> to damaging his country's security for partisan gain like that dirtbag
>> Scooter Libby did?>
>>
>
> Interesting point - yes, Marc did, in fact, damage America's security
> by trading illegally with Iran.
>
>
in tandem with neoCONs Rumsfeld, Baker, Cheney, Reagan and other members
of the Bush crime family.
> Second, Scooter didn't damage America's security. He wasn't charaged
> with ratting out Plame - that honor goes to Deputy Secretary of State
> Department Richard Armitage. Of course, Armitage is a big lefty, so
> you don't scream for his blood, do you?
>
A Lefty working for Bush?
In late 1980, Armitage became a foreign policy advisor to
President-elect Ronald Reagan. Following that role, he was made a Deputy
Assistant Secretary of Defense for East Asia and Pacific Affairs, a
high-ranking post in The Pentagon. He served in this position from 1981
to 1983. In June 1983, he was promoted to Assistant Secretary of Defense
for International Security Policy. While there, he represented the
Department of Defense in developing political-military relationships and
initiatives throughout the world, spearheaded U.S. Pacific security
policy including the U.S.-Japan and U.S.-China security relationships,
managed all Defense security assistance programs, and provided oversight
of policies related to the law of the sea, U.S. special operations, and
counter-terrorism. He played a leading role in Middle East security
policies.
In 1998, Armitage signed "The Project for the New American Century"
letter (PNAC Letter) to President Bill Clinton. The letter urged Clinton
to target the removal of Saddam Hussein's regime from power in Iraq due
to erosion of the Gulf War Coalition's containment policy and the
resulting possibility that Iraq might develop weapons of mass
destruction. The letter's intended purpose of removing Hussein was to
protect Israel.
Hardly a "Lefty." In fact, he was and is a flaming Bushite neo-CON.
> If you'd like to talk about people who damaged America's security, how
> about Sandy Berger, who received a slap on the wrist for stealing and
> destroying top secret documents during a time of war.
>
>
Berger took copies of documents stored in the national archives.
Obviously trying to review details before giving Senate testimony. No
evidence was lost by his actions; the security of the US was not
compromised by his act.
liber...@yahoo.com
> There is only one Olympic Grade pardoner. That is the creep,
> Bubba Clinton.
>
> There is no aura of sleeze connected with Eisenhower, or
> Reagan. Only the Great Bubba handed out pardons for cash.
No aura of sleaze around Eisenhower??? Heh, *NIXON*, *CHECKERS
SPEECH*! As for Eisenhower himself: read up on his driver during
WWII. One bit of proof that the media wouldn't tell tales about
Eisenhower is that the story about his heart attacks while
president were being hushed up.
No aura of sleaze around Reagan??? Read up on Iran/Contra. Read
up on his pardon of Casper Weinberger who was about to be
indicted for perjury and obstruction of justice after claiming he
had made no contemporeous notes about presidential meetings
regard Iran/Contra. Oh, then Weinberger claimed a tax deduction
for diaries he had kept as SecDef.
As for Clinton's "pardons for cash," looks like he did. But
that's better than Bush's "Legislation for Cash" and "Wars for
Cash.
>
> I guess us morons and GOP lemmings are still the so-called
> 28% who know Bush has not done nearly enough in the pardon
> department to even approach the league Bubba was in when it
> came to cashing in on pardons for sale.
>
>
>
Again, Clinton traded a couple of pardons for cash, Bush has
traded one commutation (to be upgraded to full pardon) in
exchange for silence about a crime of treason. Gee, which sounds
worse to even you?
Docky Wocky
Eisenhower is that the story about his heart attacks while
Oh, my!
My, oh my! (2) " Read up on his pardon of Casper Weinberger who was about to
be
indicted for perjury and obstruction of justice after claiming he
had made no contemporeous notes about presidential meetings
regard Iran/Contra..."
No contemporaneous notes...Well that just depends on what the meaning of
contemporaneous means, dosn't it?
Imagine. The media wouldn't tell tales about Ike's heart attacks...and look
at the piddling detail of
facing prison for claiming he didn't make "contenooraneous notes." Gee! I
can see why the whole country
was so upset about Weinberger. Think of the horror of claiming he didn't
make contemporaneous notes.
But thanks for your admission that Bubba traded some "pardons for cash."
It is only a tiny step now to admitting he also traded a lot of stuff for
cash, some legislation for cash, made wars for cash, and committed treason
for cash.
All this will be made clear to you as soon as he croaks.
liber...@yahoo.com
> My. (1) "One bit of proof that the media wouldn't tell tales
> about Eisenhower is that the story about his heart attacks
> while president were being hushed up..."
>
> Oh, my!
>
> My, oh my! (2) " Read up on his pardon of Casper Weinberger
> who was about to be
> indicted for perjury and obstruction of justice after
> claiming he had made no contemporeous notes about
> presidential meetings regard Iran/Contra..."
>
> No contemporaneous notes...Well that just depends on what the
> meaning of contemporaneous means, dosn't it?
>
> Imagine. The media wouldn't tell tales about Ike's heart
> attacks...and look at the piddling detail of
> facing prison for claiming he didn't make "contenooraneous
> notes." Gee! I can see why the whole country
> was so upset about Weinberger. Think of the horror of
> claiming he didn't make contemporaneous notes.
....when the FBI asked, under oath, whether he had made
contemptoraneous notes? Perhaps your problem is with the FBI.
>
> But thanks for your admission that Bubba traded some "pardons
> for cash."
>
> It is only a tiny step now to admitting he also traded a lot
> of stuff for cash, some legislation for cash, made wars for
> cash, and committed treason for cash.
Nope. That would require a high dive into deep psychosis. I'll
leave that sport for you wacko reichwing liars.
>
> All this will be made clear to you as soon as he croaks.
>
>
>
Obviously you couldn't understand what I posted. Ask your care
giver for assistance.
bval...@aol.com
> >> What point? Did Rich commit perjury and obstruct justice with an eye
> >> to damaging his country's security for partisan gain like that dirtbag
> >> Scooter Libby did?>
> >Interesting point - yes, Marc did, in fact, damage America's security
> >by trading illegally with Iran.
> Did he trade arms with Iran?
The fugitive oil broker renounced his American citizenship, illegally
bought oil from Iran during the American trade embargo and hid the
$200 million in trading (and over $100 million in profits) with Iraq
using dummy transactions in off-shore corporations. I wonder how many
American's died because of the 100 million Marc piped into the hands
of a terrorist state?
And you're bent out of shape over Shooter not remembering all the
details of an event that happened a few years earlier?
And speaking of terrorism, let's not forget the sixteen members of the
terrorist gang, the FALN, a Puerto Rican nationalist group responsible
for over 130 bombings in the U.S. - attacking the N.Y. office of the
FBI, military recruiting headquarters, and even former president Jimmy
Carter's Chicago campaign office. Six people died and dozens more were
injured as a result of FALN's actions. These terrorists never even
asked for a pardon, but because Hillary wanted to ingratiate herself
with the Hispanic population in New York during her first Senate race,
they were suddenly granted a commutation of their sentences.
Although the commutations were opposed by the FBI and the Clinton
Justice Department, Bill Clinton granted them to all 16 terrorists.
Once again, Hillary claimed to have "no involvement in or prior
knowledge of the decision." Her statement is ridiculous. Two days
before the announcement of the pardons, New York City Councilman Jose
Rivera personally presented Hillary with a packet of materials
including a letter asking her to "speak to the president and ask him
to consider granting executive clemency to the prisoners." What a
coincidence - the sentences were immediately commuted!
I can see why Democrats have spent the past six hears having fits when
Clinton's name was mentioned. How many times had Democrats
desperately implied anyone who pointed out Clinton's criminal past as
being homosexuals who were obsessed with "Clinton's penis"? Here's a
few of the examples that you, yourself, have posted:
"We haven't heard so many howls about Clinton's penis..."
"And while the media was distracting them with abortion, immigration
and Clinton's penis,..."
"...those unemployment rates down around 4 percent were all the
imagination of bill clinton's penis."
"Do you think you'll ever get over your obsession with Clinton's
penis, Fucksnot? "
"Sniffing Clinton's penis was as close to legitimacy and public
acceptance as Foxy's"
"Nothing like Clinton's penis to make all the right wingers stand
erec..."
"your fixation on Clinton's penis."
"In a similar reflection that Clinton's penis..."
"Don't you need to spend another ten years obsessing over Clinton's
penis?"
"I mean, look at all the years you've spent obsessing over Clinton's
penis."
"Oh, and everything is to be blamed on Clinton's penis."
Expect to hear a LOT about the criminal activity that the Clinton's
have pulled. In a way, you and your ilk have done the Republicans a
huge service - by surpressing Clinton's criminal past, you've kept it
fresh. It wouldn't have had nearly the impact if we had been going
over and over it again and again over the past six years. This time
around, their vicious activities can been seen full and uncut.
This is going to be a fun election.
> >Second, Scooter didn't damage America's security. He wasn't charaged
> >with ratting out Plame - that honor goes to Deputy Secretary of State
> >Department Richard Armitage. Of course, Armitage is a big lefty, so
> >you don't scream for his blood, do you?
> Yes, he did, by outing Plame. >
Scooter did no such thing - Armitage did!
>Armitage is no "big lefty" -- >
The Hell he's not.
>he's another right wing dirtbag, which is why YOU aren't screaming for his scalp.
I'm not? I would love to see Armitage, Joe Wilson, and Plame in front
of a Senate congressional hearing, and let THEM explain their
actions.
Oh, and while we're at it, let's hold them to the same standard of
proof that they demand of Scooter. They would be expected to remember
every detail from years old events perfectly.
And the fun part? It might just happen.
I strongly suspect that Rudy is going to be the Republican nominee,
and Hillary will be the Democrat. Hillary has a 52% negative number,
and it's impossible to get those negative numbers down. So, if you
comfort yourself with the certainty that Hillary is a shoe-in, let me
be the first to pop that balloon. The only chance Hillary has is if a
modern Ross Perot steps in to sphyon off Republican votes, and trust
me, the Republicans are in no mood for a modern Ross Perot. Although
I must admit, Gore is just barely arrogant enough to pull that stunt.
If you're holding out hopes that Bloomberg will be your savior,
don't. Those numbers you heard that a third party Bloomberg
presidency run would pull more strongly from the Republicans than the
Democrats were polled in New Jersey - a state where they've at least
heard of the guy. Trust me, Republcans think of Bloomberg as the
classic Rhino.
What will be great about President Rudy is that he's not a
compassionate conservative. He's more of a "Kick The Dirtbags In The
Teeth" conservative. President Bush's compassion has been used
consistantly against him - the Republican base is sick of it. And
unlike the toy poddle Democrat base, the Republican core supporters
are not shy about letting their wants be heard.
> >If you'd like to talk about people who damaged America's security, how
> >about Sandy Berger, who received a slap on the wrist for stealing and
> >destroying top secret documents during a time of war.
> Sandy Bergers offenses were trivial.
The documents Berger stole - each copy of the millennium report is
said to be in the range of 15 to 30 pages - were highly secret. They
were classified at what is known as the "code word" level, which is
the government's highest tier of secrecy. Any person who is authorized
to remove such documents from a special secure room is required to do
so in a locked case that is handcuffed to his or her wrist.
That he hid them on his person, and admitted destroying them. He did
so to cover up Clinton's criminal incompetence.
He should have gone to jail. But then, he's a Clinton Made Man, isn't
he?
> Now, how do you feel about the fact that Putsch is obviously trying to
> prevent the investigation into the Plame thing from moving forward?
Where did that come from? I would LOVE is see Plame in front of a
Senate Comittee, explaining her contradictory statements. I would
love to see Armadige being asked why he sat on his hands, knowing who
blew the whistle on Plame, and let millions of dollars and tens of
thousands of manhours be squandered. I would also love to ask Fritz
why he continuted an investigation when it became obvious within a few
days that: 1. There was no crime and 2. He know who did it?
bval...@aol.com
> > If you'd like to talk about people who damaged America's security, how
> > about Sandy Berger, who received a slap on the wrist for stealing and
> > destroying top secret documents during a time of war.
> OK... You win. I shall never vote for Bill Clinton again.>
Will you vote for Hillary if she strongarms the nomination? Of course
you will - so the subject is very much alive.
>Meanwhile let's talk about using a pardon as a substitute for hush money in a case involving national security.
OK, prove it.
Meanwhile, would you like to talk about politically expedient
pardons? How about sixteen members of the terrorist gang, the FALN, a
Puerto Rican nationalist group responsible for over 130 bombings in
the U.S. - attacking the N.Y. office of the FBI, military recruiting
headquarters, and even former president Jimmy Carter's Chicago
campaign office. Six people died and dozens more were injured as a
result of FALN's actions. These terrorists never even asked for a
pardon, but because Hillary wanted to ingratiate herself with the
Hispanic population in New York during her first Senate race, they
were suddenly granted a commutation of their sentences.
Although the commutations were opposed by the FBI and the Clinton
Justice Department, Bill Clinton granted them to all 16 terrorists.
Once again, Hillary claimed to have "no involvement in or prior
knowledge of the decision." Her statement is ridiculous. Two days
before the announcement of the pardons, New York City Councilman Jose
Rivera personally presented Hillary with a packet of materials
including a letter asking her to "speak to the president and ask him
to consider granting executive clemency to the prisoners." What a
coincidence - the sentences were immediately commuted!
How about the four New Square pardons. There, the Hasidic defendants
were convicted of pocketing $40 million of federal scholarship money.
Hillary visited the community, and on Election Day the community
supported Hillary 1400 to 12. Weeks later, on December 22, 2000,
President Clinton met with the New Square leaders to discuss a pardon.
Hillary attended the meeting, but claims that she did not speak.
Apparently, she didn't have to - the pardons were granted.
You want to talk about Hillary's brothers were paid more than $500,000
to lobby the president for pardons that were then granted to con
artists and drug dealers. For a fee of $400,000, Hugh Rodham
successfully pushed for a pardon for drug kingpin Carlos Anabel
Vignali, convicted of shipping a half-ton of cocaine from L.A. to
Minnesota. His father was a big contributor to the Democratic Party -
he gave more than $150,000 to the Los Angeles Democrats. Obviously,
the investment was a shrewd one.
Tony Rodham advocated a pardon for Edgar and Vanna Jo Gregory. The
Gregorys, who owned a carnival company, defrauded a federal bank. When
the pardon was publicized, Hillary stated that Tony was "not paid" by
the Gregorys for his work on the pardon. Tony repeated that line on
the Larry King Show.
After an investigation, the House Government Operations Committee
disagreed and announced that Hillary's statement was inaccurate. Now,
a federal bankruptcy court overseeing the carnival company's
bankruptcy is about to rule on whether over $100,000 paid to Tony
Rodham at the time of the pardons was a loan or payment for
"consulting."
The Gregorys contributed over $100,000 to Hillary's campaign and other
Democratic causes. These folks were well known to the Clintons - they
visited them at Camp David and were hired to stage two carnivals on
the White House grounds - paid for by the taxpayers.
When the Rodham brothers' exploits were made public, Bill and Hillary
announced that they were "shocked and saddened" by the disclosure. At
the time of the pardons, the Rodham brothers were actually living in
the White House with the Clintons and had made contact with the
highest level of presidential assistants. But the Clintons claimed
that they were totally unaware of what Hugh and Tony were doing.
But, it wasn't just Hillary's family who benefited from the Clinton
cronyism. Bill's brother Roger was pardoned for his drug conviction,
and he was allegedly paid $30,000 to promote six felons - although
those pardons were never granted.
bval...@aol.com
> On Sat, 07 Jul 2007 09:48:45 -0700, "bvall...@aol.com"
>
> <bvall...@aol.com> wrote:
> >The fugitive oil broker renounced his American citizenship, illegally
> >bought oil from Iran during the American trade embargo and hid the
> >$200 million in trading (and over $100 million in profits) with Iraq
> >using dummy transactions in off-shore corporations. I wonder how many
> >American's died because of the 100 million Marc piped into the hands
> >of a terrorist state?
> Still evades the issue, ValleyLoon
> Rich did NOT trade arms for hostages as your lying sack
> of shit did
I agree. Rich didn't illegally gave the terrorists a hundred million
dollars to buy their own shiney weapons to use against Americans to
free Americans. He gave 100,000,000 dollars to a terrorist state to
enrich himself personally.
For DECADES, you've been bitching about the pieces of junk traded to
the Iranians to free Americans - weapons used to kill Saddam's
people. Why is it that you're so forgiving of the 100,000,000 dollars
Marc piped into a terrorist state? After all, one can buy a lot of
American death for $100,000,000.
lubow
with his 400 pardons, what Ike did with his over 1000 pardons and what
Reagan did with his over 500 pardons has nothing to do with using a pardon
Now, I'm going to make this so easy, even a purveyor of excuses and
non-sequiturs like this bvallely character could understand. What we know
is that somewhere there was a breach of national security. We also know
that Libby was spreading this classified information around. Some have
charged this breach of security was done to irritate a political opponent.
We don't know the facts right now.
In the past we had a rubber stamp congress. Now it is not. Congress will
exercise its constitutional rights to investigate what did Libby know. It
will investigate why he lied to the FBI. It will investigate the sources of
his information.
It is an investigation that may lead nowhere. But like Watergate, it may
lead to income tax evasion, secret bank accounts in Mexico City, other
break-ins involving other political opponents or other crimes and
misdemeanors. We don't know. But what we do know forms the basis of an
investigation.
Now, was that so difficult to comprehend?
--
Lubow
<bval...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1183827464....@e16g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
bval...@aol.com
> You are utilizing non-sequiturs as a substitute for logic. What Clinton did
> with his 400 pardons, what Ike did with his over 1000 pardons and what
> Reagan did with his over 500 pardons has nothing to do with using a pardon
> as a substitute for hush money in a case involving national security.
Prove it. Oh, wait, you can't, because you're just making things up,
aren't you?
> Now, I'm going to make this so easy, even a purveyor of excuses and
> non-sequiturs like this bvallely character could understand. What we know
> is that somewhere there was a breach of national security. >
No, we don't. There's no evidence that Plame was a covert agent.
> We also know that Libby was spreading this classified information around. >
No, we don't. It was Armatage who ratted out Plame, and he was
against the Iraq war.
> Some have charged this breach of security was done to irritate a political opponent.
And we had a big, long, expenseive investingation, even though Fritz
know the truth within a few days.
> We don't know the facts right now.
Sure, we do. Anti-war Armatage ratted out Plame, Scooter is
completely innocent of that crime.
> In the past we had a rubber stamp congress.>
No, we didn't.
> Now it is not. Congress willexercise its constitutional rights to investigate what did Libby know. It will investigate why he lied to the FBI. It will investigate the sources of his information.
Will it investigate the lies that Plame told? That Wilson told? Will
it drag Wilson in front of a panel, and ask him why his editorial
differed from the report he gave the FBI?
> It is an investigation that may lead nowhere. But like Watergate, it may
> lead to income tax evasion, secret bank accounts in Mexico City, other
> break-ins involving other political opponents or other crimes and
> misdemeanors. We don't know. But what we do know forms the basis of an
> investigation.
This is called a "fishing exposition". It's what corrupt politicians
do to punish people they don't like.
> Now, was that so difficult to comprehend?
What is it about you liberals and your insistance that you're more
intelligent than everyone else? Why are you so insecure about your
intelligence.
In any case, got any more softballs that you'd like me to knock out of
the park?
bval...@aol.com
> On Sat, 07 Jul 2007 09:57:44 -0700, "bvall...@aol.com"
>
> <bvall...@aol.com> wrote:
> >>Meanwhile let's talk about using a pardon as a substitute for hush money in a case involving national security.
> >OK, prove it.
> >Meanwhile, would you like to talk about politically expedient
> >pardons? How about sixteen members of the terrorist gang, the FALN, a
> >Puerto Rican nationalist group responsible for over 130 bombings in
> >the U.S. - attacking the N.Y. office of the FBI, military recruiting
> >headquarters, and even former president Jimmy Carter's Chicago
> >campaign office.
> Tell us why they were in jail, ValleyLoon
They were caught making bombs and working with people who instigated
armed robberies.
bval...@aol.com
> On Sat, 07 Jul 2007 09:57:44 -0700, "bvall...@aol.com"
>
> <bvall...@aol.com> wrote:
> >before the announcement of the pardons, New York City Councilman Jose
> >Rivera personally presented Hillary with a packet of materials
> >including a letter asking her to "speak to the president and ask him
> >to consider granting executive clemency to the prisoners." What a
> >coincidence - the sentences were immediately commuted!
> Conjecture, speculation, inferring, and insinuation
And Hillary looking guilty as Hell.
Mitchell Holman
news:1183853247.6...@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
> On Jul 7, 12:27 pm, "lubow" <l...@lubow-industries.com> wrote:
>> You are utilizing non-sequiturs as a substitute for logic. What
>> Clinton did with his 400 pardons, what Ike did with his over 1000
>> pardons and what Reagan did with his over 500 pardons has nothing to do
>> with using a pardon as a substitute for hush money in a case involving
>> national security.
>
> Prove it. Oh, wait, you can't, because you're just making things up,
> aren't you?
>
>
>> Now, I'm going to make this so easy, even a purveyor of excuses and
>> non-sequiturs like this bvallely character could understand. What we
>> know is that somewhere there was a breach of national security. >
>
> No, we don't. There's no evidence that Plame was a covert agent.
>
So why did the Bush Justice Dept appoint a prosecutor
to investigate her outing?
lubow
> So why did the Bush Justice Dept appoint a prosecutor
> to investigate her outing?
>
>
Don't bother bvallely with facts or logic. He's still hung up on Ike's
1000+ pardons. Or was it Reagan's 500+ pardons? Or maybe it was Pres.
Harding's screwing around.. or maybe Clinton's screwing around. or maybe
JFK's peccadilloes?.. I mean who the hell knows what's in the mind of one of
those 28 percenters?
Twenty-eight percenters? Those are the mental midgets that think Bush is
doing a good job.
--
Lubow
lubow
> And Hillary looking guilty as Hell.
>
>
Yeah... why even bother with trials and juries... We have this bvallely
creep to judge people. Just to prove he's a great judge of people, he
listens to drugged-out talk jockeys and believes them.
You cannot find more intelligence than that outside of the RNC.
--
Lubow
<bval...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1183853351.9...@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
bval...@aol.com
bval...@aol.com
> > No, we don't. There's no evidence that Plame was a covert agent.
> So why did the Bush Justice Dept appoint a prosecutor
> to investigate her outing?
It was the prosecutor who discovered there was no evidence that she
was a covert agent.
lubow
And do yourself a favor. You look like a moron echoing everything those
right wing drug addicts on the radio tell you. Learn to think for yourself.
--
Lubow
<bval...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1183867472.1...@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
bval...@aol.com
> > And Hillary looking guilty as Hell.
> Yeah... why even bother with trials and juries... We have this bvallely
> creep to judge people.>>
My goodness, after six years of spreading every rumor against Bush,
Cheney and Rove as Gospel, Democrats have rediscovered the presumption
of innocence. I can't even point out that Hillary looks guilty as
Hell.
>Just to prove he's a great judge of people, he listens to drugged-out talk jockeys and believes them.>
Good, good - you got in your Daily Kos talking point. No doubt
they'll send you a Scooby snack.
> You cannot find more intelligence than that outside of the RNC. >
What is it with the left and their desperate insecurity about their
intelligence?
bval...@aol.com
> > So why did the Bush Justice Dept appoint a prosecutor
> > to investigate her outing?
> Don't bother bvallely with facts or logic. >
She asked a question that I knocked out of the park.
> He's still hung up on Ike's 1000+ pardons. >
I never mentioned that event.
> Or was it Reagan's 500+ pardons?>
I never mentioned that event.
> Or maybe it was Pres.
> Harding's screwing around.. or maybe Clinton's screwing around. or maybe
> JFK's peccadilloes?.. I mean who the hell knows what's in the mind of one of
> those 28 percenters? >
OK, at this point, you're just babbling.
bval...@aol.com
> Let's let congress sort it out.>
No, that issue has been investigated and resolved. Congress is just
posturing for the camera.
> And do yourself a favor. You look like a moron echoing everything those
> right wing drug addicts on the radio tell you. Learn to think for yourself.
You did very well are parroting the Daily Kos talking point.
3599 Dead
A pure lie, Bill. Try again.
--
One of the [Gold Star mothers], Elaine Johnson, recounted a meeting that she had with
President Bush in which he gave her a presidential coin and told her
and five other families: "Don't go sell it on eBay."
--from interview broadcast on NPR
Putsch: leading America to asymetric warfare since 2001
Not dead, in jail, or a slave? Thank a liberal!
Pay your taxes so the rich don't have to.
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a.a. #2211 -- Bryan Zepp Jamieson
Mitchell Holman
@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
1) Proof?
2) You didn't answer the question. Why was a special
prosecutor appointed at all?
bval...@aol.com
> >> > No, we don't. There's no evidence that Plame was a covert agent.
> >> So why did the Bush Justice Dept appoint a prosecutor
> >> to investigate her outing?
> > It was the prosecutor who discovered there was no evidence that she
> > was a covert agent.
> 1) Proof?
The fact that Armatage is not in jail.
> 2) You didn't answer the question. Why was a special
> prosecutor appointed at all?
New York senator Charles Schumer demanded the appointment of a special
prosecutor, and Bush went along.
This is why our next Republican President won't be compassionate.
bval...@aol.com
> >> > No, we don't. There's no evidence that Plame was a covert agent.
> >> So why did the Bush Justice Dept appoint a prosecutor
> >> to investigate her outing?
> >It was the prosecutor who discovered there was no evidence that she
> >was a covert agent.
> A pure lie, Bill.
Then why isn't Armatage in jail?
Mitchell Holman
@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
Why isn't Libby in jail?
bval...@aol.com
> >> >It was the prosecutor who discovered there was no evidence that she
> >> >was a covert agent.
> >> A pure lie, Bill.
> > Then why isn't Armatage in jail?
> Why isn't Libby in jail?
Because he got a semi-pardon. Are you saying that Armatage got a
presidential pardon? If so, please feel free to present any evidence
you have.
Mitchell Holman
@m37g2000prh.googlegroups.com:
>
>> >> > No, we don't. There's no evidence that Plame was a covert agent.
>
>> >> So why did the Bush Justice Dept appoint a prosecutor
>> >> to investigate her outing?
>
>> > It was the prosecutor who discovered there was no evidence that she
>> > was a covert agent.
>
>> 1) Proof?
>
> The fact that Armatage is not in jail.
Neither is Libby. Bush DOES put his friends above the law,
you know.
>
>> 2) You didn't answer the question. Why was a special
>> prosecutor appointed at all?
>
> New York senator Charles Schumer demanded the appointment of a special
> prosecutor, and Bush went along.
Like Bush cares what anyone, much less a democrat, thinks.
> This is why our next Republican President won't be compassionate.
>
There won't BE a "next Republican president", at least
not in your lifetime.
--
Mitchell Holman
The smallest unit of time ever measured is the interval
between the mention of a failure of the Bush administration
and rightwingers changing the subject to Clinton.
last...@rogers.com
> "bvall...@aol.com" <bvall...@aol.com> wrote in news:1183904638.643757.264740
> @x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
Because it was a fix between the judge and fitzgerald.
They both know that it would not stand up on appeal
so they tried to get him into jail before the appeal.
-- --
"My friends, be men, and fear dishonor; quit
yourselves in battle so as to win respect from
one another.
Men who respect each other's good opinion
are less likely to be killed than those who do
not, but in flight there is neither gain nor glory."
** The Iliad of Homer
bval...@aol.com
> "bvall...@aol.com" <bvall...@aol.com> wrote in news:1183904590.033509.98800
> @m37g2000prh.googlegroups.com:
>
>
>
> >> >> > No, we don't. There's no evidence that Plame was a covert agent.
>
> >> >> So why did the Bush Justice Dept appoint a prosecutor
> >> >> to investigate her outing?
>
> >> > It was the prosecutor who discovered there was no evidence that she
> >> > was a covert agent.
>
> >> 1) Proof?
>
> > The fact that Armatage is not in jail.
>
> Neither is Libby.>
Libby recieved a semi-pardon. Are you saying that Armatage received a
pardon? If so, please present your evidence right here
-------------------->
> Bush DOES put his friends above the law, you know.>
Actually, no I don't. Clinton is the one who used his pardon to
release friends and family.
> >> 2) You didn't answer the question. Why was a special
> >> prosecutor appointed at all?
> > New York senator Charles Schumer demanded the appointment of a special
> > prosecutor, and Bush went along.
> Like Bush cares what anyone, much less a democrat, thinks.
You have been so spoiled by Bush's desperate need to get along with
the Democrats, it's going to be a great deal of fun when Rudy assumes
the White House. This is a guy who's NOT a compassionate
conservative. He's going to start handing you back the same crap
you've been dishing for the past six years.
> > This is why our next Republican President won't be compassionate.
> There won't BE a "next Republican president", at least
> not in your lifetime.
Hillary has a 52% disapproval rating. Without a Ross Perot to bail
you out, Hillary's chances of winning are, to be generious,
challenging.
bval...@aol.com
> The smallest unit of time ever measured is the interval
> between the mention of a failure of the Bush administration
> and rightwingers changing the subject to Clinton.
That's mostly because Clinton is a pig, who's done just about every
awful thing imaginable.
I'm curious - are you going to continue to insist that the Clinton's
are offbase while Hitlery runs for Der Furer?
Mitchell Holman
news:1183907459....@n60g2000hse.googlegroups.com:
> On Jul 8, 10:58 am, Mitchell Holman <Noem...@comcast.com> wrote:
>> "bvall...@aol.com" <bvall...@aol.com> wrote in
>> news:1183904638.643757.264740 @x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
>
>> >> >> > No, we don't. There's no evidence that Plame was a covert
>> >> >> > agent.
>>
>> >> >> So why did the Bush Justice Dept appoint a prosecutor
>> >> >> to investigate her outing?
>>
>> >> >It was the prosecutor who discovered there was no evidence that she
>> >> >was a covert agent.
>>
>> >> A pure lie, Bill.
>>
>> > Then why isn't Armatage in jail?
>>
>> Why isn't Libby in jail?
>
> Because it was a fix between the judge and fitzgerald.
Another whacko conspiracy theory emerges. Don't you have
your hands full with the "faked moon landings" one?
But just for grins, show us your proof of this "fix".
> They both know that it would not stand up on appeal
The sentence already HAS stood up on appeal.
"Earlier Monday, a federal appeals panel ruled Libby could
not delay his prison term in the CIA leak case."
http://www.cbn.com/CBNnews/188202.aspx
Appeals court won't delay Libby prison term
Mon Jul 2, 2007
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Former vice presidential aide Lewis
"Scooter" Libby on Monday lost his bid to delay serving his
2 1/2-year prison sentence while he appeals his conviction
in the CIA leak case.
http://www.reuters.com/article/domesticNews/idUSN0236131820070702
> so they tried to get him into jail before the appeal.
Heaven forbid that a Bush appointee sentenced to prison
actually GO to prison. Only "the little people" have to do that.
bval...@aol.com
> > Because it was a fix between the judge and fitzgerald.
> Another whacko conspiracy theory emerges. >
I didn't write that. What I wrote was "Because he got a semi-pardon.
Are you saying that Armatage got a presidential pardon? If so, please
feel free to present any evidence you have. "
>Don't you have your hands full with the "faked moon landings" one?>
So, the party of John Dean, Daily Kos and Michael Moore have the
stones to condemn conspiracy theories? I read a while back that over
40% of the Democrat Party believes that George Bush was invovled in
911 - which means that 40% of the Democrat Party is stark raving mad.
> The sentence already HAS stood up on appeal.
> "Earlier Monday, a federal appeals panel ruled Libby could
> not delay his prison term in the CIA leak case."http://www.cbn.com/CBNnews/188202.aspx
I'm sorry, but that sentence simply doesn't say what you claim it
says. The quote doesn't say that Scooter has exhausted his appeal
options, only that the judge wants him to do hard time anyway.
> > so they tried to get him into jail before the appeal.
> Heaven forbid that a Bush appointee sentenced to prison
> actually GO to prison. Only "the little people" have to do that >
And the quarter of a million dollar fine and two years of probation
doesn't factor in your equation, does it? Your lust to see somebody,
anybody, do jail time will cause untold havoc for the Democrat Party
in years to come.
Mitchell Holman
news:1183908219.0...@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com:
> On Jul 8, 8:09 am, Mitchell Holman <Noem...@comcast.com> wrote:
>> "bvall...@aol.com" <bvall...@aol.com> wrote in
>> news:1183904590.033509.98800 @m37g2000prh.googlegroups.com:
>>
>>
>>
>> >> >> > No, we don't. There's no evidence that Plame was a covert
>> >> >> > agent.
>>
>> >> >> So why did the Bush Justice Dept appoint a prosecutor
>> >> >> to investigate her outing?
>>
>> >> > It was the prosecutor who discovered there was no evidence that
>> >> > she was a covert agent.
>>
>> >> 1) Proof?
>>
>> > The fact that Armatage is not in jail.
>>
>> Neither is Libby.>
>
> Libby recieved a semi-pardon.
There is no such thing as a "semi-pardon"
> Are you saying that Armatage received a
> pardon?
If Armitage is the leaker why hasn't the
Bush Justice Dept prosecuted him?
>
>> Bush DOES put his friends above the law, you know.>
>
> Actually, no I don't. Clinton is the one who used his pardon to
> release friends and family.
>
After they served their sentences. Unlike Bush.
>
>> >> 2) You didn't answer the question. Why was a special
>> >> prosecutor appointed at all?
>
>> > New York senator Charles Schumer demanded the appointment of a
>> > special prosecutor, and Bush went along.
>
>> Like Bush cares what anyone, much less a democrat, thinks.
>
> You have been so spoiled by Bush's desperate need to get along with
> the Democrats, it's going to be a great deal of fun when Rudy assumes
> the White House. This is a guy who's NOT a compassionate
> conservative. He's going to start handing you back the same crap
> you've been dishing for the past six years.
Oh, yes, cross-dressing Rudy, the Republican who
is pro-choice, pro-gun control, pro-affirmative action
and a trial lawyer to boot.
And to think that is the best the GOP can come
up with any more............
>
>> > This is why our next Republican President won't be compassionate.
>
>> There won't BE a "next Republican president", at least
>> not in your lifetime.
>
> Hillary has a 52% disapproval rating.
That's why Obama will get the nomination.
And win the election.
lubow
who tells us that pardoning a material witness is OK because Clinton
pardoned around 400 guys. And that Reagan pardoned over 500 and that Ike
pardoned over a thousand. Want to talk about pardoning? What about GOP
president U.S. Grant pardoning Robert E. Lee and Jefferson Davis, the master
terrorists of all, responsible for the death of millions and responsible for
enslaving hundreds of freed black people?
Then this bozo-breadth and king of the non-sequiturs tells us that Libby
should be freed because Clinton screwed around with Monica. But why stop
with Clinton? What about when Ike screwed around with Kay Somersby while
thousands were getting cut down on Anzio and Omaha Beach and that FDR
screwed around with Lucy Mercer and Pres. Harding's illegitimate kid on K
Street showed the reporters the President's toothbrush and when we say
George Washington slept here, do you really think the father of our country
slept alone? Look at all the black people named Washington, then answer
that question.
In short these Republican clowns have nothing to argue about. When you box
them into criminal activity, they talk about Monica, as if no GOP president
ever screwed around... And, while we're at it, what in hell does pardoning a
criminally and a material witness in a national security case have to do
with any of that?
--
Lubow
"Mitchell Holman" <Noe...@comcast.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9967CCFF8...@216.196.97.131...
bval...@aol.com
> >> >> >> > No, we don't. There's no evidence that Plame was a covert
> >> >> >> > agent.
> >> >> >> So why did the Bush Justice Dept appoint a prosecutor
> >> >> >> to investigate her outing?
> >> >> > It was the prosecutor who discovered there was no evidence that
> >> >> > she was a covert agent.
> >> >> 1) Proof?
> >> > The fact that Armatage is not in jail.
> >> Neither is Libby.>
> > Libby recieved a semi-pardon.
> There is no such thing as a "semi-pardon"
I'm sorry, I confused you with an informed adult. There are all
shapes and sizes of pardons - ranging from a full pardon to what I
like to call a semi-pardon. Such semi-pardons include: conditional
pardons, commutations of sentence, conditional commutations of
sentence, remissions of fines and forfeitures, respites and
amnesties. Scooter received a commutation of sentence; that is, he
doesn't have to serve any jail time, but he has to pay a quarter of a
million dollar fine, loose the right to vote, face disbarment and
report to a probation officer every two years.
All this for not remembering years-old details perfectly.
And still that's not enough for you.
> > Are you saying that Armatage received a
> > pardon?
> If Armitage is the leaker why hasn't the
> Bush Justice Dept prosecuted him?
Because there's no evidence that he committed a crime.
> >> Bush DOES put his friends above the law, you know.>
> > Actually, no I don't. Clinton is the one who used his pardon to
> > release friends and family.
> After they served their sentences. Unlike Bush.
Until Clinton was paid enough money to let them skate.
> >> >> 2) You didn't answer the question. Why was a special
> >> >> prosecutor appointed at all?
> >> > New York senator Charles Schumer demanded the appointment of a
> >> > special prosecutor, and Bush went along.
> >> Like Bush cares what anyone, much less a democrat, thinks.
> > You have been so spoiled by Bush's desperate need to get along with
> > the Democrats, it's going to be a great deal of fun when Rudy assumes
> > the White House. This is a guy who's NOT a compassionate
> > conservative. He's going to start handing you back the same crap
> > you've been dishing for the past six years.
> Oh, yes, cross-dressing Rudy, the Republican who
> is pro-choice, pro-gun control, pro-affirmative action
> and a trial lawyer to boot.
You left out divorced. Ronald Reagan was a socialist, signed the
first pro-abortion law in history, was divorced, declared Wicca a
religion - all those experiences were needed to allow him to grow into
the giant he was. So it is with Rudy.
Personally, I think that the Democrats have gone to the "Whispering"
well once too often.
Oh, one other quick point - since you're so fond of mentioning "cross
dressing", Algore once did a sketch on Saturday Night Live where,
during a homosexual parody of "the Bachelor," Al stripped naked, and
climbed into a hot tub with a Joe Lieberman look-a-like where they
crossed arms and drank bubbling wine and came very close to french
kissing.
> And to think that is the best the GOP can come
> up with any more............
Let's see who the top tier Republicans are.
One is a real war hero - not the "seven months and three scratches and
I'm out of here" Kerry. A POW who refused to leave him men behind
when given the chance.
Next, we had the Mayor of New York who guided that city safely through
9/11, and who turned New York from the cesspool it was in the 80s to
the gleaming city it has become. And on a personal note, I lived in
New York before Rudy took over (23rd street and 6th Ave). It was a
war zone. Rudy saved the city, once from the Democrats, and once from
the terrorists. Democrats are reduced to repeated showing a photo
taken when Guilliani performed a comedy sketch.
Then we have Mitt Romney, a wildly successful businessman, who was
governor of Mass. Within one year of taking office, Romney eliminated
a 3 billion dollar budget deficit. During this time he did not raise
taxes or debt. He also proceeded to end his term with a 1 billion
dollar surplus as well as lower taxes and a lower unemployment rate.
Democrats have been reduced to attacking Gov. Romney religion.
Now, let's compare to the Dem's top tier:
Hillary - 52% negative numbers. She, of course, is by far the most
likely to win the nomination.
Hussein. His record on the national level is limited to two Senate
years. Not "terms." Years. Has shown no evidence that he can take a
political punch. He's far to the left, and even the press can only
cover that for so long. Oh, and he's openly admitted to hating whites
and doing blow as a youth. How long will Hussein's empty platitudes
last in a debate against a seasoned pro like Rudy?
The Breck Girl. Made a fortune on junk science while driving doctors
out of business. Releases press releases attacking poverty in
America, while building a Charles Foster Cain type mansion - the
largest in his county. Sends his wife out to fight his battles for
him. Last we heard, has spent $1,200 on a haircut, but to be fair,
that DID come with a pedicure. At least when Gulianni put on a dress,
it was a joke.
> >> > This is why our next Republican President won't be compassionate.
> >> There won't BE a "next Republican president", at least
> >> not in your lifetime.
> > Hillary has a 52% disapproval rating.
> That's why Obama will get the nomination.
> And win the election.
To quote the Chairman of the Board, Frances Albert Sinatra "...some
people they get their kicks, stompin' on a dream."
You know that dream you have of a Hussein presidency? STOMP!!!! :->
How shall I put it? Which way will be most painful for you?
You know how you LOVED how Clinton fought dirty against the
Republicans? How you giggled as he destroyed Ken Starr's life? You
found his ruthlessness sexy? You took it as a badge of honor that you
could overlook his hypocrisies? The butch way that Clinton would
destroy anyone who got between him and what he wanted?
Hussein now stands between Clinton and something Clinton wants.
What makes you think that this lightweight, this neophyte, this
unicorn lovin' nothing will be able rise to battle against the Clinton
machine? What in Hussein's history leads you to believe that he can
take a political punch - not to mention having his character
destroyed? This is a person who has bragged about his cocaine use and
his hatred for whites. This is the stuff we know - what makes you
think that Hillary doesn't have ten inch file of stink bombs to drop
on Hussein right before critical elections?
All the while, you'll mumble "but, but, Hillary, it's best for the
party that you step down." Except Hillary doesn't give a shit about
your party - or much of anything except herself.
Nice playing softball with you.
STOMP!!!!!! Another dream bites the dust.
bval...@aol.com
> Mr. Holman, stop attempting to discuss what it logical with some character
> who tells us that pardoning a material witness is OK because Clinton
> pardoned around 400 guys.>
Why is it unfair to point out that Democrats embraced far worse
activity than the one it currently condemns when done by their own?
> Then this bozo-breadth and king of the non-sequiturs tells us that Libby
> should be freed because Clinton screwed around with Monica.>
I said no such thing. You are a liar.
3607 Dead
>
>> Mr. Holman, stop attempting to discuss what it logical with some character
>> who tells us that pardoning a material witness is OK because Clinton
>> pardoned around 400 guys.>
>
>Why is it unfair to point out that Democrats embraced far worse
>activity than the one it currently condemns when done by their own?
Did Clinton engage in any preemptive pardons that interfere with
ongoing criminal investigations like your cowardly little dirtbag just
did?
>
>
>> Then this bozo-breadth and king of the non-sequiturs tells us that Libby
>> should be freed because Clinton screwed around with Monica.>
>
>I said no such thing. You are a liar.
>
>
bval...@aol.com
> >Why is it unfair to point out that Democrats embraced far worse
> >activity than the one it currently condemns when done by their own?
> Did Clinton engage in any preemptive pardons that interfere with
> ongoing criminal investigations like your cowardly little dirtbag just
> did?
Clinton pardoned out and out terrorists, despite the pleading of the
FBI, to court a political bloc in New York for his wifes campaign.
Yes, that is far, far worse than communting a purjury charge.
3607 Dead
>
>> >Why is it unfair to point out that Democrats embraced far worse
>> >activity than the one it currently condemns when done by their own?
>
>> Did Clinton engage in any preemptive pardons that interfere with
>> ongoing criminal investigations like your cowardly little dirtbag just
>> did?
>
>Clinton pardoned out and out terrorists, despite the pleading of the
>FBI, to court a political bloc in New York for his wifes campaign.
You're talking about three radicals who were tried and jailed in 1952
for plots against the US on behalf of an independent Puerto Rico.
1952. They were old men who had done their time.
You right wing morons have such phony moral values its hard to imagine
what would happen if you ever tried to be sincere about something.
No: how do you feel about a sitting president who just used the power
of the pardon to disrupt on going criminal investigations?
>
>Yes, that is far, far worse than communting a purjury charge.
No, it isn't.
robx...@nowhere.com
Actually it HASN'T. The ruling you cited was an appeal of the judge's
order to report to prison before the appeal process has been gone
through. But, Mitchie's never been one for accuracy.
Mitchell Holman
@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
>
>> >Why is it unfair to point out that Democrats embraced far worse
>> >activity than the one it currently condemns when done by their own?
>
>> Did Clinton engage in any preemptive pardons that interfere with
>> ongoing criminal investigations like your cowardly little dirtbag just
>> did?
>
> Clinton pardoned out and out terrorists, despite the pleading of the
> FBI, to court a political bloc in New York for his wifes campaign.
>
Whereas Bush doing the same thing to get Florida votes
is just dandy. Your famous Double Standards are alive and
well, it seems.
"Orlando Bosch (also known as Orlando Bosch Avila) is a Cuban exile
and former CIA-backed criminal, head of CORU organization, which the
FBI has described as "an anti-Castro terrorist umbrella organization."
Attorney General Dick Thornburgh called Bosch an "unrepentant terrorist."
He has been accused of taking part in Operation Condor and several other
terrorist attacks, including the October 6, 1976 bombing of a Cuban
civilian airliner in which all 73 people on board were killed, including
many young members of a Cuban fencing team and 5 North Koreans.
Bosch was pardoned of all American charges by President George H.W. Bush
on July 18, 1990"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orlando_Bosch
Mitchell Holman
news:1183953140.0...@e16g2000pri.googlegroups.com:
>
>> >> >> >> > No, we don't. There's no evidence that Plame was a covert
>> >> >> >> > agent.
>
>> >> >> >> So why did the Bush Justice Dept appoint a prosecutor
>> >> >> >> to investigate her outing?
>
>> >> >> > It was the prosecutor who discovered there was no evidence that
>> >> >> > she was a covert agent.
>
>> >> >> 1) Proof?
>
>> >> > The fact that Armatage is not in jail.
>
>> >> Neither is Libby.>
>
>> > Libby recieved a semi-pardon.
>
>> There is no such thing as a "semi-pardon"
>
>
> I'm sorry, I confused you with an informed adult. There are all
> shapes and sizes of pardons - ranging from a full pardon to what I
> like to call a semi-pardon.
Bingo. There is no such legal term as a "semi-pardon".
As you admitted, you just made up the word.
Such semi-pardons include: conditional
> pardons, commutations of sentence, conditional commutations of
> sentence, remissions of fines and forfeitures, respites and
> amnesties. Scooter received a commutation of sentence; that is, he
> doesn't have to serve any jail time, but he has to pay a quarter of a
> million dollar fine, loose the right to vote, face disbarment and
> report to a probation officer every two years.
>
> All this for not remembering years-old details perfectly.
>
> And still that's not enough for you.
>
>
>> > Are you saying that Armatage received a
>> > pardon?
>
>> If Armitage is the leaker why hasn't the
>> Bush Justice Dept prosecuted him?
>
> Because there's no evidence that he committed a crime.
So who is the leaker?
>
>> >> Bush DOES put his friends above the law, you know.>
>
>> > Actually, no I don't. Clinton is the one who used his pardon to
>> > release friends and family.
>
>> After they served their sentences. Unlike Bush.
>
> Until Clinton was paid enough money to let them skate.
>
You cannot "skate" a sentence you already served, dimbulb.
>> >> >> 2) You didn't answer the question. Why was a special
>> >> >> prosecutor appointed at all?
>
>> >> > New York senator Charles Schumer demanded the appointment of a
>> >> > special prosecutor, and Bush went along.
>
>> >> Like Bush cares what anyone, much less a democrat, thinks.
>
>> > You have been so spoiled by Bush's desperate need to get along with
>> > the Democrats, it's going to be a great deal of fun when Rudy assumes
>> > the White House. This is a guy who's NOT a compassionate
>> > conservative. He's going to start handing you back the same crap
>> > you've been dishing for the past six years.
>
>> Oh, yes, cross-dressing Rudy, the Republican who
>> is pro-choice, pro-gun control, pro-affirmative action
>> and a trial lawyer to boot.
>
> You left out divorced. Ronald Reagan was a socialist, signed the
> first pro-abortion law in history, was divorced, declared Wicca a
> religion - all those experiences were needed to allow him to grow into
> the giant he was.
OK, I'll bite: Lets see your proof of the above claims.
Or do you need a "semi-pardon" from making them......;)
lubow
> Or do you need a "semi-pardon" from making them......;)
>
Forget about the semi-pardons (sic). This serious logic is beyond the
regime of this purveyor of non-sequiturs.
This clown is going to prove that pardoning Libby is justified in view of
Clinton fooling around with Monica!
--
Lubow
bval...@aol.com
> On Sun, 08 Jul 2007 21:46:56 -0700, "bvall...@aol.com"
>
> <bvall...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> >> >Why is it unfair to point out that Democrats embraced far worse
> >> >activity than the one it currently condemns when done by their own?
>
> >> Did Clinton engage in any preemptive pardons that interfere with
> >> ongoing criminal investigations like your cowardly little dirtbag just
> >> did?
>
> >Clinton pardoned out and out terrorists, despite the pleading of the
> >FBI, to court a political bloc in New York for his wifes campaign.
>
> You're talking about three radicals who were tried and jailed in 1952
> for plots against the US on behalf of an independent Puerto Rico.
> 1952. They were old men who had done their time.
You're a liar.
It wasn't "three radicals", it was sixteen terrorists.
They weren't arrested in 1952, but 1972 - 1980. They were not old men
when released, they had many good terrorist years ahead of them.
The commutation was opposed by U.S. Attorney's Office, the FBI, and
the Federal Bureau of Prisons and criticized by many including former
victims of FALN terrorist activities, the Fraternal Order of Police,
and members of Congress. Congress condemned the action, with a vote of
95-2 in the Senate and 311-41 in the House.
> You right wing morons have such phony moral values its hard to imagine
> what would happen if you ever tried to be sincere about something.
And yet, you just causally lied about Clinton freeing terrorists.
> No: how do you feel about a sitting president who just used the power
> of the pardon to disrupt on going criminal investigations?
The U.S. House Committee on Government Reform held an investigation on
the pardoning of FALN terrorists, but the Justice Department prevented
FBI officials from testifying.President Clinton cited executive
privilege for his refusal to turn over some documents to Congress
related to his decision to offer clemency to members of the FALN
terrorist group.
> >Yes, that is far, far worse than communting a purjury charge.
> No, it isn't. >
Yes, it is.
idontlik...@hotmail.com
Snip...
> Oh, and while we're at it, let's hold them to the same standard of
> proof that they demand of Scooter. They would be expected to remember
> every detail from years old events perfectly.
>
When Libby lied to Federal Prosecutors who were investigating the
outing of an undercover CIA operative, the events were only a few
weeks old...try again.
Snip
haran...@yahoo.com
> What foxshit forgot is that Clinton didn't buy anyone's silence in pardoning
> anyone. Marc Rich didn't have any information that could put anyone into
> jail. But..
>
> ...Libby does.
How do you know? Did you ask him? It's hard to believe he'd tell you
since he has no reason to tell you a damned thing. He's out the back,
Jack, flipping you the bird and enjoying his freedom. This of course
is why you all seethe with impotent rage and bark demands that
powerful people do this or that.
> And buying off someone's silence is a Federal crime.
Indeed, bribing a public official is a federal crime, as is witness
tampering. Point out where that has happened.
[brilliant blue-dress insight snipped]
> Just as the Watergate break-in was an over-reaction to the McGovern
> campaign, pardoning Libby was an over-reaction to what Libby can possibly
> tell the FBI.
It doesn't matter how you see the pardon. The President can pardon
anyone, and he needn't tell anyone why, so unless he confessed, or
wrote as much in a memo, you can't know why. You can back up your
mouth with even more mouth, and repeat over and over that the pardon
was illegal, which is stupid on its face. A pardon is manifestly
legal.
> In words that even a piece of fox shit can understand, it is
> an impeachable crime to buy the silence of a material witness.
In words I hope, but doubt, that you can understand, a check on the
Judicial Branch isn't much of a check if the Judicial Branch can
persecute you for using it.
> Can we count on the Democrats to show some guts? I'm not sure.
You mean, can you count on them to do via the legal system what they
can't do via the political system? I would say not, but don't take my
word for it. Ask Al Gore.
[...]
haran...@yahoo.com
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Pardon Hillary
For being a loud-mouthed jackass? I can't.
> She blasts Bush over Libby case,
Blasts? Try blabs. That's all she's good for. The most she can do
is make inflammatory statements that she'll never have to back up. No
one will ever challenge that statement to her face in a public forum,
so she pops off some incoherent blather, smiles for all the flashes,
walks off, and that's that. Those who were against her can only get
so nauseated, and those who were for her pump triumphant fists into
the air, for reasons they don't really know.
Then comes the next statement, and the next one, blah blah blah. One
is against Rumsfeld. The next against Bush, then Cheney, and on, and
on, but what the hell else does she do? What has she accomplished
other than alot of obnoxious nagging?
> but the Clintons abused the power
Sure, but using them for a yardstick is like using Willie Sutton as a
yardstick for proper banking etiquette.
[...]
> Especially now, when she is trotting old Bubba out to rev
> up the faithful,
Shouldn't he be out building houses? Or is that Jimmy Carter? I
always confuse the two. It was once easy to tell them apart, but now
Bill looks like someone sprayed him in the face with a firehose for an
hour. But then, if I was married to Hilarity, I'd age quickly too.
> the sordid past undermines her and boosts Barack Obama's
> promise for a different kind of politics.
>
> The list of investigations, allegations and a few convictions during the
> Clinton administration was so long and tangled that the cases now morph into
> a fog. Distinctions among Travelgate and Whitewater and FileGate and
> GiftGate and the $100,000 commodities windfall get lost, with only Monica
> and the stained blue dress forever vivid.
And him sitting like a dumbass getting his hair cut on the LAX
tarmac. They should have just given him a banjo and an old dusty hat.
> Now and then, that fog is pierced by something that reminds us what a grubby
> time it was. The case of Lewis (Scooter) Libby does that.
>
> When President Bush commuted Libby's prison sentence Monday, Sen. Clinton
> was quick to denounce him. Under Bush, she said, "cronyism and ideology
> trump competence and justice."
Heilary Clinton wouldn't know competence if someone substituted it for
her premarin.
[...]