#40 religious whacks guard Moore's rock
The Fair and Balanced Weasel
Friday August 22, 2003 1:29 PM
By BOB JOHNSON
Associated Press Writer
MONTGOMERY, Ala. (AP) - About 40 supporters of an Alabama judge's Ten
Commandments monument stood watch over it early Friday, hoping to keep
anyone from removing it from the rotunda of the state judicial
building.
Chief Justice Roy Moore went home after spending much of Thursday
vowing to do everything within his power to keep the monument in
place. His eight colleagues on the state Supreme Court had ordered the
monument taken out early in the day after a federal judge's midnight
removal deadline passed.
Moore's supporters kept vigil Friday morning from their sleeping bags
and bedrolls strewn outside the courthouse.
The Rev. Herman Henderson of Believers' Tabernacle in Birmingham opted
to nap on the concrete with his head resting on sheet music for the
song, ``I Shall Not Be Moved.''
They remained quiet throughout the night, prompting police to retreat
to their post across the street.
U.S. District Judge Myron Thompson set the midnight deadline after
deciding that sitting in the public rotunda, the monument violated the
Constitution's ban on government promotion of a religious doctrine.
Thompson has said it could be moved to a private place still within
the building.
The judge had threatened $5,000-a-day fines if Moore left the monument
in the rotunda.
Building manager Graham George was instructed by the state's high
court to ``take all steps necessary to comply'' with the removal
order, justice Gorman Houston said. George declined to comment when
asked when, how or where the monument would be moved.
Moore condemned his fellow judges for their orders. In their ruling,
the Alabama justices stated they were ``bound by solemn oath'' to
uphold the law.
``I will never deny the God upon whom our laws and country depend,''
Moore said Thursday in defending the 5,300-pound granite marker, which
he installed two years ago and contends is representation of the moral
foundation of American law.
``Not only did Judge Thompson put himself above the law, but above God
as well,'' Moore told supporters.
The chief justice had appealed to the U.S. Supreme Court for an
emergency stay of the removal order, but the court rejected it
Wednesday. Moore said Thursday he would file a formal appeal with the
high court soon ``to defend our constitutional right to acknowledge
God.''
``I cannot forsake my conscience,'' he said.
Richard Cohen, an attorney for the Southern Poverty Law Center - which
sued along with the American Civil Liberties Union and Americans
United for Separation of Church and State - praised the eight
justices.
``Their courageous actions reflect that Justice Moore is a disgrace to
the bench and ought to resign or be removed from office,'' Cohen said.
Still, protesters outside the building said they were willing to stand
in the heat and risk arrest for days or weeks to keep the monument
inside. Twenty-one were arrested Wednesday night on trespassing
charges.
Stephen Hopkins, pastor of Burnet Bible Church in Burnet, Texas, was
one of those arrested. He said he was willing to be arrested even
though he has 10 children.
``This is a great hypocrisy,'' Hopkins said. ``This is an assault on
God. They're saying we're going to cover up God.''
Impeachments. Court appointments. Gerrymanderings. Recalls. Plane crashes.
Don't Republicans believe in honest elections any more?
Not dead, in jail, or a slave? Thank a liberal!
Pay your taxes so the rich don't have to.
For the finest in liberal/leftist commentary,
http://www.zeppscommentaries.com
Michael
get past some racial bigots. Now, they can escort out another symbol, to
get past some current religious bigots.
"The Fair and Balanced Weasel" <zeppn...@finestplanet.com> wrote in
message news:n46ckvkgj486289ls...@4ax.com...
Jeffrey Turner
> Backers Guard Ten Commandments Monument
>
>
> Friday August 22, 2003 1:29 PM
>
>
> By BOB JOHNSON
>
> Associated Press Writer
>
> MONTGOMERY, Ala. (AP) - About 40 supporters of an Alabama judge's Ten
> Commandments monument stood watch over it early Friday, hoping to keep
> anyone from removing it from the rotunda of the state judicial
> building.
>
> Chief Justice Roy Moore went home after spending much of Thursday
> vowing to do everything within his power to keep the monument in
> place. His eight colleagues on the state Supreme Court had ordered the
> monument taken out early in the day after a federal judge's midnight
> removal deadline passed.
>
> Moore's supporters kept vigil Friday morning from their sleeping bags
> and bedrolls strewn outside the courthouse.
>
> The Rev. Herman Henderson of Believers' Tabernacle in Birmingham opted
> to nap on the concrete with his head resting on sheet music for the
> song, ``I Shall Not Be Moved.''
>
> They remained quiet throughout the night, prompting police to retreat
> to their post across the street.
Don't they have vagrancy laws in Montgomery?
Nah, for that big a cover-up they'd have to put Nixon in charge.
--Jeff
--
"an enormous Proportion of Property vested in
a few Individuals is dangerous to the Rights,
and destructive of the Common Happiness, of
Mankind; and therefore every free State hath
a Right by its Laws to discourage the Possession
of such Property."
Ben Franklin
"To delight in war is a merit in the soldier,
a dangerous quality in the captain, and a
positive crime in the statesman."
George Santayana
"Bring them on."
George W. Bush
Ninure Saunders
<Po...@RecoveryByDiscovery.com> wrote:
-Sort of like when federal marshals had to escort in a tan girl to school, to
-get past some racial bigots. Now, they can escort out another symbol, to
-get past some current religious bigots.
You equate protcting the life of a human child past a mon of screaming
asults who wish to KILL her, with a stone (idol)?
Boy, you sure have some warped priorities, besides tossing the term
"religious bigot" around lossely.
Why not simply KEEP the 10 commandments?
I mean when hundreds of thousands of living "momuements" speak a lot
louder than any stone?
I mean if you truly are a Christian, is not the "Law" of God written on
your hearts?
Now if you really are "zealous" about your faith", and keeping the "commands":
You might be a little concerned that your loyality to these stome slabs,
and signs and such just might be making "idols" out them, I would hope.
I mean you also might want tell your family no more shopping trips on
the Sabbath, no more watching TV, or particpating in sports events, for
example?
Or no more "little white lies" about anything are permitted, tight, if upi
are actually keeping the "commands"?
No more "borrowing" stuff from work or school, would I am sure speak volumes.
You married conservatives, remeber how Jesus said even looking at someone
with "desire" is the same as the actual act of adultery? No more watching
those pagents, and super models!!
Beter yet, why not keep the Royal Law?
Rom. 13:9 The commandments, łDo not commit adultery,˛ łDo not murder,˛
łDo not steal,˛ łDo not covet,˛ and whatever other commandment there may
be, are summed up in this one rule: łLove your neighbor as yourself.˛
Gal. 5:14 The entire law is summed up in a single command: łLove your
neighbor as yourself.˛
James 2:8 If you really keep the royal law found in Scripture, łLove
your neighbor as yourself,˛ you are doing right.
Ninure Saunders aka Rainbow Christian
http://Rainbow-Christian.tk
http://Ninure-Saunders.tk
My Yahoo Group
http://Ninure.tk
My Online Diary
http://www.ninure.deardiary.net
-
Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches
http://www.MCCchurch.org
To send e-mail, remove nohate from address
Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,
Michael wrote:
>
> Sort of like when federal marshals had to escort in a tan girl to school, to
> get past some racial bigots. Now, they can escort out another symbol, to
> get past some current religious bigots.
>
The bigots are the people who would prevent the freedom of speech that
that rendition of the 10 Commandants is.
Peacenik
<std...@backpacker.com> wrote in message
news:3F4642AB...@backpacker.com...
THe government does NOT have the freedom to promote religion. This is not a
freedom of speech issue; rather it is a violation of the separation of
church and state.
--
Chris
Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,
Kurt Lochner wrote:
>
> Shrill Blonde, one of many Unbalanced Conservatives, <std...@mail.com> whined:
> >
> > Michael wrote:
> >
> > > Sort of like when federal marshals had to escort in a tan girl to school, to
> > > get past some racial bigots. Now, they can escort out another symbol, to
> > > get past some current religious bigots.
> >
> >The bigots are the people who would prevent the freedom of speech[..]
>
> So tell us how you don't delete text/context to suit your opinions?
>
> --Which is why you're a known liar and shill, Blonde..
>
You are an idiot, Kurt. What did I delete? OTOH, look at what you
deleted.
Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,
Peacenik wrote:
>
> "Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,"
> <std...@backpacker.com> wrote in message
> news:3F4642AB...@backpacker.com...
> >
> >
> > Michael wrote:
> > >
> > > Sort of like when federal marshals had to escort in a tan girl to
> school, to
> > > get past some racial bigots. Now, they can escort out another symbol,
> to
> > > get past some current religious bigots.
> > >
> > The bigots are the people who would prevent the freedom of speech that
> > that rendition of the 10 Commandants is.
>
> THe government does NOT have the freedom to promote religion.
>
So that means that there can't be any art at any public building?
Zepp, No Weasels in the Bush
The judge has every right in the world to park it on his front lawn.
*******************
"But always remember, my friend: when politicians begin demanding patriotism of the people of a country, fascism has arrived."
-- Shaffik, in Ken Finkleman's "More Tears"
To subscribe to Zepp's News http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zepps_News/join
For essays ONLY, http://groups.yahoo.com/group/zepps_...@yahoogroups.com/join
For my fiction, http://www.finestplanet.com/~zepp/
Zepp, No Weasels in the Bush
<jtu...@localnet.com> wrote:
>The Fair and Balanced Weasel wrote:
>> Backers Guard Ten Commandments Monument
>>
>>
>> Friday August 22, 2003 1:29 PM
>>
>>
>> By BOB JOHNSON
>>
>> Associated Press Writer
>>
>> MONTGOMERY, Ala. (AP) - About 40 supporters of an Alabama judge's Ten
>> Commandments monument stood watch over it early Friday, hoping to keep
>> anyone from removing it from the rotunda of the state judicial
>> building.
>>
>> Chief Justice Roy Moore went home after spending much of Thursday
>> vowing to do everything within his power to keep the monument in
>> place. His eight colleagues on the state Supreme Court had ordered the
>> monument taken out early in the day after a federal judge's midnight
>> removal deadline passed.
>>
>> Moore's supporters kept vigil Friday morning from their sleeping bags
>> and bedrolls strewn outside the courthouse.
>>
>> The Rev. Herman Henderson of Believers' Tabernacle in Birmingham opted
>> to nap on the concrete with his head resting on sheet music for the
>> song, ``I Shall Not Be Moved.''
>>
>> They remained quiet throughout the night, prompting police to retreat
>> to their post across the street.
>
>Don't they have vagrancy laws in Montgomery?
Nah. They would have to arrest the police if they did.
*******************
Zepp, No Weasels in the Bush
Most art is not religious in nature.
Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,
Kurt Lochner wrote:
>
> Shrill Blonde, one of many Unbalanced Conservatives, <std...@mail.com> whined about:
> >
> > Kurt Lochner was laughing at:
> > >
> > >Shrill Blonde, one of many Unbalanced Conservatives, <std...@mail.com> whined:
> > > >
> > > > Michael wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Sort of like when federal marshals had to escort in a tan girl to school, to
> > > > > get past some racial bigots. Now, they can escort out another symbol, to
> > > > > get past some current religious bigots.
> > > >
> > > >The bigots are the people who would prevent the freedom of speech[..]
> > >
> > > So tell us how you don't delete text/context to suit your opinions?
> > >
> > > --Which is why you're a known liar and shill, Blonde..
> >
> >You are an idiot, Kurt.
>
> You are a liar, Shrill Bonehead..
>
> >What did I delete? [..]
>
> This part..
>
Which was underneath the top posted material I was replying to. Do you
actually want everything from the entire thread, even things said by
someone else posting ten posts back, left in? Does anyone agree with
Lochner on this? Does anyone want *nothing* cut from replies? (Oh, and
note that Lochner always cuts from the poster he is replying to. He has
no moral ground to stand on.)
> --And that's why you're known as a lying shill, Bonde..
Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,
"Zepp, No Weasels in the Bush" wrote:
>
> On Fri, 22 Aug 2003 09:19:55 -0700, "Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and
> Balanced Conservatives," <std...@backpacker.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >Michael wrote:
> >>
> >> Sort of like when federal marshals had to escort in a tan girl to school, to
> >> get past some racial bigots. Now, they can escort out another symbol, to
> >> get past some current religious bigots.
> >>
> >The bigots are the people who would prevent the freedom of speech that
> >that rendition of the 10 Commandants is.
>
> The judge has every right in the world to park it on his front lawn.
>
So you are saying that no references to any religion are allowed in any
art on the grounds of anything publicly owned? Because you can't be just
saying that nothing referencing Christian religious tradition is
disallowed and then allow other religious traditions. That would be
hypocritical in the extreme, wouldn't it?
Ninure Saunders
Fair and Balanced Conservatives," <std...@backpacker.com> wrote:
-"Zepp, No Weasels in the Bush" wrote:
->
-> On Fri, 22 Aug 2003 09:19:55 -0700, "Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and
-> Balanced Conservatives," <std...@backpacker.com> wrote:
->
-> >
-> >
-> >Michael wrote:
-> >>
-> >> Sort of like when federal marshals had to escort in a tan girl to
school, to
-> >> get past some racial bigots. Now, they can escort out another symbol, to
-> >> get past some current religious bigots.
-> >>
-> >The bigots are the people who would prevent the freedom of speech that
-> >that rendition of the 10 Commandants is.
->
-> The judge has every right in the world to park it on his front lawn.
->
-So you are saying that no references to any religion are allowed in any
-art on the grounds of anything publicly owned?
Nothing that PROMOTES one religion over another...
There is a big difference between a "referrence", a work of aer, and
saying this "represents the "fact" the USA is a Christian nation".
Evem Moore, unlike you is "honest: ebought to admit that is ewexactly what
he is doing, promotin HIS cersion of Chrsitianity over all other
chhristians, all other relogions, atheists, and ahnostics...because not
even he used the dodge of a "wprh of art". (He might have won that one,
too.)
Ninure Saunders aka Rainbow Christian
http://Rainbow-Christian.tk
The Lord is my Shepherd and He knows I'm Gay
Ken
"Zepp, No Weasels in the Bush" <ze...@zeppscommentaries.com> wrote in message
news:07uckvg6geiahd1om...@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 22 Aug 2003 12:45:51 -0700, "Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and
> Balanced Conservatives," <std...@backpacker.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >Peacenik wrote:
> >>
> >> "Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,"
> >> <std...@backpacker.com> wrote in message
> >> news:3F4642AB...@backpacker.com...
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Michael wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > Sort of like when federal marshals had to escort in a tan girl to
> >> school, to
> >> > > get past some racial bigots. Now, they can escort out another
symbol,
> >> to
> >> > > get past some current religious bigots.
> >> > >
> >> > The bigots are the people who would prevent the freedom of speech
that
> >> > that rendition of the 10 Commandants is.
> >>
> >> THe government does NOT have the freedom to promote religion.
> >>
> >So that means that there can't be any art at any public building?
>
> Most art is not religious in nature.
Umm..you must be kidding, or either you have no formal education in the fine
arts. You will NEVER find a college art professor that will agree with your
statement.
"Art always and everywhere has been a medium through which people have
sought to express their religious beliefs, or a vehicle through which
societies have sought to have their religion represented. Probably the
majority of European artworks produced in the past thousand years and more
have had an overtly religious content, celebrating or representing Biblical
narratives or seeking to express a human sense of the divine."
From "Religion and Art" by Trevor Pateman, former proffessor of Arts and
Philosophy at the University of Sussex.
Ken
Zepp, No Weasels in the Bush
I'll stand by my statement. That much traditional European art is
religious is true, but most art being produced these days exists
independently of church funding.
>
>"Art always and everywhere has been a medium through which people have
>sought to express their religious beliefs, or a vehicle through which
>societies have sought to have their religion represented. Probably the
>majority of European artworks produced in the past thousand years and more
>have had an overtly religious content, celebrating or representing Biblical
>narratives or seeking to express a human sense of the divine."
>
>From "Religion and Art" by Trevor Pateman, former proffessor of Arts and
>Philosophy at the University of Sussex.
Doesn't hurt that the church funded most artists during that period.
>
>Ken
Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,
"Zepp, No Weasels in the Bush" wrote:
>
> On Fri, 22 Aug 2003 12:45:51 -0700, "Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and
> Balanced Conservatives," <std...@backpacker.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >Peacenik wrote:
> >>
> >> "Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,"
> >> <std...@backpacker.com> wrote in message
> >> news:3F4642AB...@backpacker.com...
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Michael wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > Sort of like when federal marshals had to escort in a tan girl to
> >> school, to
> >> > > get past some racial bigots. Now, they can escort out another symbol,
> >> to
> >> > > get past some current religious bigots.
> >> > >
> >> > The bigots are the people who would prevent the freedom of speech that
> >> > that rendition of the 10 Commandants is.
> >>
> >> THe government does NOT have the freedom to promote religion.
> >>
> >So that means that there can't be any art at any public building?
>
> Most art is not religious in nature.
>
I don't know that I would be so bold to make that claim. Religious
references permeate art. In the West, they are usually from the
Judaeo-Christian tradition but certainly not always. Consider the
Quetzalcoatl art thing in San Jose.
Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,
You've got the gravitas to make it orbit around you.
> That much traditional European art is
> religious is true, but most art being produced these days exists
> independently of church funding.
>
He didn't mention church funding, did he?
Bill Anderson
Broadly speaking, this is a trickier question than most people on either
side would be willing to admit. In this particular case, though, it isn't
really tricky at all. Judge Moore openly proclaims that the purpose of the
display is to make use of his government office to promote his personal
religious beliefs.
Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,
The US is a Christian nation. In any case, how is incorporating the Ten
Commandments in art promoting one religion over another?
> Evem Moore, unlike you is "honest: ebought to admit that is ewexactly what
> he is doing, promotin HIS cersion of Chrsitianity over all other
> chhristians, all other relogions, atheists, and ahnostics...because not
> even he used the dodge of a "wprh of art". (He might have won that one,
> too.)
>
I wish you'd get a spell checker. I don't claim any religious beliefs on
usenet therefore I can't claim that this art work promotes my religious
beliefs. I don't see how that is dishonest.
Mitchell Holman
>
>
>>
> The US is a Christian nation.
You don't say.
Show where "Christ" or "Christian" is
mentioned in the Declaration of Independence,
the Constitution or the Bill of Rights.
Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,
I don't even know the man. I don't even care about him in any way. I'd
like to see the Ten Commandments stay and I don't even claim any
religious views. I, as an atheist Jesus hater, am being disenfranchised
here. Please help. Please, God.
banjocat
Bondummy, biblethumper lost his case. The laws of the "Constitution"
were applied. It's time for you nutcases to move on.
Peacenik
No. You DO know that most art does not have the explicit purpose of
promoting religion, don't you?
--
Chris
Abhijit Bhattacharya
> Ninure Saunders wrote:
>
> The US is a Christian nation.
And you're the one calling everyone *else* a kook?
Regards,
Abhijit
Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,
Peacenik wrote:
>
> "Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,"
> <std...@backpacker.com> wrote in message
> news:3F4672EF...@backpacker.com...
> >
> >
> > Peacenik wrote:
> > >
> > > "Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,"
> > > <std...@backpacker.com> wrote in message
> > > news:3F4642AB...@backpacker.com...
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Michael wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Sort of like when federal marshals had to escort in a tan girl to
> > > school, to
> > > > > get past some racial bigots. Now, they can escort out another
> symbol,
> > > to
> > > > > get past some current religious bigots.
> > > > >
> > > > The bigots are the people who would prevent the freedom of speech that
> > > > that rendition of the 10 Commandants is.
> > >
> > > THe government does NOT have the freedom to promote religion.
> > >
> > So that means that there can't be any art at any public building?
>
> No. You DO know that most art does not have the explicit purpose of
> promoting religion, don't you?
>
No, I do not know that. I think you are ignorant, illiterate and stupid
though.
Ninure Saunders
Fair and Balanced Conservatives," <std...@backpacker.com> wrote:
-Ninure Saunders wrote:
->
-> In article <3F46823E...@backpacker.com>, "Bill Bonde, one of many
-> Fair and Balanced Conservatives," <std...@backpacker.com> wrote:
->
-> -"Zepp, No Weasels in the Bush" wrote:
-> ->
-> -> On Fri, 22 Aug 2003 09:19:55 -0700, "Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and
-> -> Balanced Conservatives," <std...@backpacker.com> wrote:
-> ->
-> -> >
-> -> >
-> -> >Michael wrote:
-> -> >>
-> -> >> Sort of like when federal marshals had to escort in a tan girl to
-> school, to
-> -> >> get past some racial bigots. Now, they can escort out another
symbol, to
-> -> >> get past some current religious bigots.
-> -> >>
-> -> >The bigots are the people who would prevent the freedom of speech that
-> -> >that rendition of the 10 Commandants is.
-> ->
-> -> The judge has every right in the world to park it on his front lawn.
-> ->
-> -So you are saying that no references to any religion are allowed in any
-> -art on the grounds of anything publicly owned?
->
-> Nothing that PROMOTES one religion over another...
->
-> There is a big difference between a "referrence", a work of aer, and
-> saying this "represents the "fact" the USA is a Christian nation".
->
-The US is a Christian nation.
Okay Bill, in what way is the USA a "Christian nation"?
Does it, as a nation believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God?
Does it, as a nation, follow the teaching and commands of Jesus Christ?
-
In any case, how is incorporating the Ten Commandments in art promoting
one religion over another?
Never took a course in relgion have you?
Moore's fixation on the 10 Commandments and claim that it the expression
of Christianity might be true for him, but it is not true f9or all
Christians.
There are any number of Christians who say, teach and believe based on
what Jesus, and the writers of the letters to the younc churches of the
first century (commonly known as the Epsitles) have "said" that the 10
Commandments were replaced by the Royal Law (Do you have any idea what
that is?)
Therefore he is promoting one version of Christianity over another at the
very least. Noy yo mention that there is at least
25% of the population who is neither Christian, nor Jewish and gor whom
the 10 Commandments are not relevant.
-
-
-> Evem Moore, unlike you is "honest: ebought to admit that is ewexactly what
-> he is doing, promotin HIS cersion of Chrsitianity over all other
-> chhristians, all other relogions, atheists, and ahnostics...because not
-> even he used the dodge of a "work of art". (He might have won that one,
-> too.)
->
-I wish you'd get a spell checker. I don't claim any religious beliefs on
-usenet therefore I can't claim that this art work promotes my religious
-beliefs. I don't see how that is dishonest.
You claim that momunent is a "work of art".
No even Moore makes that claim.
He has specifically and repeatedly made the claim that it is an expression
of HIS religion.
And so do his supporters.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"The commandments carry no internal evidence of divinity with them; they
contain some good moral precepts, such as any man qualified to be a
law-giver, or a legislator, could produce himself, without any recourse to
supernatural intervention" -- Thomas Paine, Founder
Equality Of Rights For Sects
" Among the features peculiar to the Political system of the United
States, is the perfect equality of rights which it secures to every
religious Sect. And it is particularly pleasing to observe in the good
citizenship of such as have been most distrusted and oppressed elsewhere,
a happy illustration of the safety and success of this experiment of a
just and benignant policy. Equal law protecting equal rights, are found as
they ought to be presumed, the best guarantee of loyalty and love of
country; as well as best calculated to cherish that mutual respect and
good will among Citizens of every religious denomination which are
necessary to social harmony and most favorable to the advancement of
truth."
- James Madison: Letter to Jacob de la Motta, August 1820
³It is a truism that almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its
creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so, and will
follow it by suppressing opposition, subverting all education to seize
early the minds of the young, and by killing, locking up, or driving
underground all heretics. This is equally true whether the faith is
Communism or Holy-Rollerism; indeed it is the bounden duty of the faithful
to do so. The custodians of the True Faith cannot logically admit
tolerance of heresy to be a virtue."
Robert A. Heinlein, 1951
Peacenik
Go back several hunderd years, and yes, art was mostly religious. Among the
most superb examples include Michelangelo's "Pieta" and Da Vinci's "Last
Supper". There are also architectural works like Westminster Abbey, the
Parthenon and Angkor Wat. Even then, when I gaze upon them, religion is far
from my mind. I am looking at masterpieces in beauty and execution.
A lot has happened since then, though, and most art is now non-religious in
nature.
Is Warhol's "Campbells Soup Cans" religious? Is Grant Wood's "American
Gothic" religious? Are Jackson Pollock's splatter paintings religious? Are
Henry Moore's bronze sculptures religious? Are Van Gogh's paintings
religious? Or any of the impressionists?
And if religious art masterpieces are displayed in government buildings
(e.g. the Smithsonian, which does indeed contain a lot of religious art), is
the purpose of their display to promote religion? Of course not. Now
consider Moore's monument. Why did he install it? Look at his own statements
and his history. It was installed for the sole purpose of promoting the idea
of American law being founded on monotheistic religion. If he wants to
install it on the grounds of his church or his private property, he is free
to do so. But he is trying to use a government building to push religion.
This is illegal and immoral; indeed, it is a breech not only of the First
Amendment he hates so, but of his own supposedly cherished Third
Commandment - he is taking god's name in vain by using god's name in an
effort to promote his own petty agenda.
--
Chris
George Patton
> message news:n46ckvkgj486289ls...@4ax.com...
> > Backers Guard Ten Commandments Monument
> >
> >
> > Friday August 22, 2003 1:29 PM
> >
> >
> > By BOB JOHNSON
> >
> > Associated Press Writer
> >
> > Still, protesters outside the building said they were willing to stand
> > in the heat and risk arrest for days or weeks to keep the monument
> > inside. Twenty-one were arrested Wednesday night on trespassing
> > charges.
> >
> > Stephen Hopkins, pastor of Burnet Bible Church in Burnet, Texas, was
> > one of those arrested. He said he was willing to be arrested even
> > though he has 10 children.
> >
> > ``This is a great hypocrisy,'' Hopkins said. ``This is an assault on
> > God. They're saying we're going to cover up God.''
I believe their stone god is going to be moved. But, the stone god
won't care, being made of stone, it can't think any better than those
stone heads who try to protect it.
Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,
Certainly not because you are here.
Ninure Saunders
Fair and Balanced Conservatives," <std...@backpacker.com> wrote:
-Ninure Saunders wrote:
->
-> In article <3F46CA99...@backpacker.com>, "Bill Bonde, one of many
-> Fair and Balanced Conservatives," <std...@backpacker.com> wrote:
->
-> -Ninure Saunders wrote:
-> ->
-> -> In article <3F46823E...@backpacker.com>, "Bill Bonde, one of many
-> -> Fair and Balanced Conservatives," <std...@backpacker.com> wrote:
-> ->
-> -> -"Zepp, No Weasels in the Bush" wrote:
-> -> ->
-> -> -> On Fri, 22 Aug 2003 09:19:55 -0700, "Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and
-> -> -> Balanced Conservatives," <std...@backpacker.com> wrote:
-> -> ->
-> -> -> >
-> -> -> >
-> -> -> >Michael wrote:
-> -> -> >>
-> -> -> >> Sort of like when federal marshals had to escort in a tan girl to
-> -> school, to
-> -> -> >> get past some racial bigots. Now, they can escort out another
-> symbol, to
-> -> -> >> get past some current religious bigots.
-> -> -> >>
-> -> -> >The bigots are the people who would prevent the freedom of speech that
-> -> -> >that rendition of the 10 Commandants is.
-> -> ->
-> -> -> The judge has every right in the world to park it on his front lawn.
-> -> ->
-> -> -So you are saying that no references to any religion are allowed in any
-> -> -art on the grounds of anything publicly owned?
-> ->
-> -> Nothing that PROMOTES one religion over another...
-> ->
-> -> There is a big difference between a "referrence", a work of aer, and
-> -> saying this "represents the "fact" the USA is a Christian nation".
-> ->
-> -The US is a Christian nation.
-> Okay Bill, in what way is the USA a "Christian nation"?
->
-> Does it, as a nation believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God?
->
-Certainly not because you are here.
Gee that so clever...
You a real piece of work Bonde.
Can you EVER actually answer a question qith anything remotely approaching
honesty, or must you, when ever you are unable to arhye like a grown man,
resort to "argumentum ad hominem"?
Now I simply asked you to "defend your staement', you typed, "the US is a
Christian nation".
Van you defend that staement ir not?
Bill Bonde, one of many Fair and Balanced Conservatives,
I know, I'm scary clever.