Official call for regulation of self-help delivery
Serena Nordstrup
"A coroner says self-development counsellors should be subjected to
government regulation after finding that a woman's suicide was
directly related to having taken part in a self-help course. ... The
key recommendation from Mr MacPherson is that courses like the Turning
Point that promise self-development or counselling should be
regulated ..."
Simpatice
Serena
computeruser
Would a call for regulation by a coroner, be enough to move the
legislators/regulators into action? Do you think a law maker will actually
begin the process because of this "call for regulation"?
As far as I know there hasn't been much done in the way of self regulation
among the purveyors of self-development programs.
Serena Nordstrup
> Serena Nordstrup wrote...
> > http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/12/08/2765718.htm?section=aus...
>
> > "A coroner says self-development counsellors should be subjected to
> > government regulation after finding that a woman's suicide was
> > directly related to having taken part in a self-help course. ... The
> > key recommendation from Mr MacPherson is that courses like the Turning
> > Point that promise self-development or counselling should be
> > regulated ..."
>
> > Simpatice
> > Serena
>
> Would a call for regulation by a coroner, be enough to move the
> legislators/regulators into action? Do you think a law maker will actually
> begin the process because of this "call for regulation"?
I doubt that either consequence would follow automatically -- but
perhaps Bruno could comment on the circumstances and ~power~ of
coroners in Australia. Remember that Australia has one of those
federal-style systems where monarchs count for little and states and
shires can muscle in on the regulating.
Notwithstanding, the Press appears to have taken up this issue and to
have whipped the Australian Psychological Society into commenting as
well.
> As far as I know there hasn't been much done in the way of self regulation
> among the purveyors of self-development programs.
... not even in the context of their (self-portrayed) status as
"businesses...
Simpatice
Serena
computeruser
"Serena Nordstrup" <s_nor...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:a51db16c-d52b-4b94...@k32g2000prb.googlegroups.com...
Simpatice
Serena
-----------------
From: alt.clearing.avatar
Subject: Re: Self-Help Course Death
On Dec 8, 9:24 am, avrarat wrote:
> On Dec 8, 11:07 pm, Eldon wrote:
> > On Dec 8, 11:48 am, avrarat wrote:
> > > Tragic news out of Australia with the death of a young woman who had
> > > recently completed the 'self development' course "Turning Point".
>
> > > Anyone venture to make comparisons here? Is Avatar any more ethically
> > > scrupulous than Turning Point? What is the screening process for
> > > Avatar recruits? How is it conducted? By whom? With what (real)
> > > qualifications?
>
> > >http://www.smh.com.au/national/death-plunge-rebekah-put-through-a-psy...
>
> > So the coroner's findings are in. I read about this case, but it was
> > still in process. The findings are quite condemnatory. There's also
> > some recent noise from the brother of Edward McBride, who committed
> > suicide in 2007 after spending $25,000 (borrowed) on Scientology
> > courses.http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/11/23/2750746.htm?site=local
>
> > The Gloria Lopez trial is coming up before long in France. She spent a
> > huge amount of money she didn't have on Scientology, then walked in
> > front of a train.http://www.xenutv.com/blog/?p=3522
>
> > I know that an Avatar Master (C.H.) in Sydney spent some time in a
> > mental hospital, and was told not to do any course work for six
> > months. There was also an apparent suicide by a woman named Allison
> > Davidson in New Zealand not so long after she took the Avatar course.
> > Some people who took the course with her speculated that her Avatar
> > "experience" might have contributed, though the connection wasn't
> > investigated. So far, it appears that Hari has gotten off easy, though
> > there have been a number of psychotic breaks during courses.
>
> > Until a few years ago, there was no screening process, but now they
> > ask if prospective students are undergoing treatment for mental health
> > issues or are taking psychoactive medications. There is only one
> > psychiatrist Master that I know of: George Thompson of Lawrence,
> > Kansas, and a few people with psychology degrees (not including Hari),
> > so I doubt that anyone qualified is involved in making decisions. I
> > don't know if they actually turn anyone down or just try to keep an
> > eye on them during the course.
>
> > However, the association can't be helping Avatar's credibility. It was
> > one of several cults described in a two-part documentary that recently
> > aired in New Zealand. I haven't seen it, because the online viewing is
> > restricted, but I understand the producer is negotiating to air it in
> > Oz and other markets. I sent you the e-mail address of someone who may
> > have a DVD copy by now.
>
> Here is some further news:
>
> http://www.smh.com.au/national/fatal-psychosis-had-origins-in-selfhel...
>
> A discussion has arisen regarding the strict regulation of 'self-help'
> organisations here in Australia. Hmm, looks like Hari's cult may come
> under some pressure; check the credentialing required as one of the
> recommendations for running courses like Avatar.
>
> Also check out the related story
>
> http://www.smh.com.au/national/dangerous-disruption-to-brain-activity...
>
> Carmel Tebbutt is the no-nonsense NSW Minister for Health and Deputy
> Premier. She won't let this rest, I can tell you. There's an election
> in 14 months and she's keen to find and exploit an issue.
>
> Gee, wonder what would happen to Avatar if they found out Hari had a
> cease and desist order because his psychology qualifications were not
> real?
>
> Oh, and I notice Landmark gets a mention.
>
> I seem to recall saying a little while back that this was all going to
> happen very soon.
-
tubby Tanner
parties follow behind their recommendations.
However I just would like to know why the effervescent logical muse seems so
concerned with regulating self development counsellors, and yet
wholeheartedly accepts the qualified. educated, sophisticated Psychiatric
policies of drugging up our children.
Nothing wrong with that is there???????
They are all fully qualified and registered to behave in such a altruistic
way?????
Serena could highlight the spin though ???????
Christmas Greetings
from your boyfriend down south
US Kids Represent Psychiatric Drug Goldmine
Saturday 12 December 2009 from http://www.truthout.org/1213091
Prescriptions for psychiatric drugs increased 50 percent with children in
the US, and 73 percent among adults, from 1996 to 2006, according to a study
in the May/June 2009 issue of the journal Health Affairs. Another study in
the same issue of Health Affairs found spending for mental health care grew
more than 30 percent over the same ten-year period, with almost all of the
increase due to psychiatric drug costs.
On April 22, 2009, the US Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality
reported that in 2006 more money was spent on treating mental disorders in
children aged 0 to 17 than for any other medical condition, with a total of
$8.9 billion. By comparison, the cost of treating trauma-related disorders,
including fractures, sprains, burns, and other physical injuries, was only
$6.1 billion.
In 2008, psychiatric drug makers had overall sales in the US of $14.6
billion from antipsychotics, $9.6 billion off antidepressants, $11.3 billion
from antiseizure drugs and $4.8 billion in sales of ADHD drugs, for a grand
total of $40.3 billion.
The path to child drugging in the US started with providing adolescents with
stimulants for ADHD in the early 80s. That was followed by Prozac in the
late 80s, and in the mid-90s drug companies started claiming that ADHD kids
really had bipolar disorder, coinciding with the marketing of epilepsy drugs
as "mood stablizers" and the arrival of the new atypical antipsychotics.
Parents can now have their kids declared disabled due to mental illness and
receive Social Security disability payments and free medical care, and
schools can get more money for disabled kids. The bounty for the prescribing
doctors and pharmacies is enormous and the CEOs of the drug companies are
laughing all the way into early retirement.
"Serena Nordstrup" <s_nor...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:a51db16c-d52b-4b94...@k32g2000prb.googlegroups.com...
HAPPYsamurai
provided by those other than the "self" in question that are under
scrutiny
i guess the coroner can declare the english language well and truly
dead
Serena Nordstrup
> "Serena Nordstrup" <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
> Coroners don't have much power unless the political will of the reigning
> parties follow behind their recommendations.
You make the place sound like a particracy. Fortunately you have the
skills and ~experience~ to overthrow such a system.
> However I just would like to know why the effervescent logical muse seems so
> concerned with regulating self development counsellors, and yet
> wholeheartedly accepts the qualified. educated, sophisticated Psychiatric
> policies of drugging up our children.
Show us where some "effervescent logical muse" "wholeheartedly accepts
the qualified. educated, sophisticated Psychiatric policies of
drugging up" children, let alone our children, and we could divert
from discussion of regulating pseudo-science in Australia at the
behest of an official figure like a coroner to chat about something
else going on someplace else.
Now that Australian regulatory authorities have shown themselves
willing to look into the "natural health" market, we might expect
great things from them in the exposure of "self-help" fraud too.
Weird. Some countries started inoculating kids centuries ago, let
alone dishing out pills.
Serena Nordstrup
> it seems the term "self" help needs reviewing - since it is the help
> provided by those other than the "self" in question that are under
> scrutiny
Like George Carlin said, there's "no such thing" as 'self-help': if
someone gets help from someone else, they don't technically get "self"
help; and if one accomplishes something by one's self, they didn't
need help to begin with.
> i guess the coroner can declare the english language well and truly
> dead
Or at least the literal meaning of "self-help". The descriptive phrase
seems to have fossilized into a set mantra some time ago...
Eldon
Well, if you read a book to learn some auto-hypnosis techniques and
then apply them, it could be said that you're engaging in self-help.
It's true that a guided class is more of a "personal transformation"
activity.
tubby Tanner
Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned about
regulating the so called
self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
Is it because the people behind this have all credited qualifications
and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue their
rich Gold diggings???????
Surely you don't also work for the pharmacutical Industry ???????
cheers
HAPPYsamurai
>
> Show us where some "effervescent logical muse" "wholeheartedly accepts
> the qualified. educated, sophisticated Psychiatric policies of
> drugging up" children, let alone our children, and we could divert
> from discussion of regulating pseudo-science in Australia at the
> behest of an official figure like a coroner to chat about something
> else going on someplace else.
>
> Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned about
> regulating the so called
whether it is about serena's focus or not - who can say - but one
might ask if it is to be considered on topic or not
>
> self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
what is more on topic - drugged kiddies of self help groups?
>
> syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
just because serena starts a thread on self help groups why would you
consider that this unequivocally means she ignores drugged kiddies?
does your fascination with muses mean you are ignoring the drugged
kiddies?
how many children have been drugged as a direct result?
>
> Is it because the people behind this have all credited qualifications
> and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue their
> rich Gold diggings???????
>
> Surely you don't also work for the pharmacutical Industry ???????
>
> cheers
>
rejection and acceptance are two sides of a given attribute - when you
accepted your responsibility as a parent thru the transformative
powers of LM you also chose to reject those previous thoughts and
habits that had held you back
timing can also then be added to the mix
Serena Nordstrup
Oi, Bruno, you forgot to show us where some "effervescent logical
muse" "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our
children ...
> Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned about
> regulating the so called
>
> self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
>
> syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
Well, now as well as showing us where some "effervescent logical muse"
"wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our children,
I'll ask you to show where I've even previously "as usual" focused on
~being~ concerned, let alone mentioning regulating "so called self
Help groups". Red herring number 2?
Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some sort
of "program", Bruno? Shall we compare apples and oranges? Shall I
compare thee to a summer's day?
> Is it because the people behind this have all credited qualifications
> and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue their
> rich Gold diggings???????
Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"? --
We might have to identify the people before we can assess their
qualifications. Then we might pass judgment on the issue.
> Surely you don't also work for the pharmacutical Industry ???????
How many industries can i work for? Last time I worked with
pharmaceutical stuff did my work help or hinder "the industry"? I
can't give a simple answer to that question -- perhaps you put it too
simplistically ...
> Now that Australian regulatory authorities have shown themselves
> willing to look into the "natural health" market, we might expect
> great things from them in the exposure of "self-help" fraud too.
>
>
>
> > Nothing wrong with that is there???????
>
> > They are all fully qualified and registered to behave in such a altruistic
> > way?????
Higher degrees in altruism?
tubby Tanner
No red herrings o fair Serena but just mere observations for all to see.
Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some sort
of "program", Bruno? Shall we compare apples and oranges? Shall I
compare thee to a summer's day?
Apples and Oranges Nuh.
You are so focused on that one tree in the forest namely your so called
self help groups,
that you forget or can't see where you are, and of course are clouded by the
rough texture of the bark all around you .
A mere bit woody for you???????????
> Is it because the people behind this have all credited qualifications
> and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue their
> rich Gold diggings???????
Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"? --
We might have to identify the people before we can assess their
qualifications. Then we might pass judgment on the issue.
There you go again pedantically analysing the word all mainly for mere
effect.
No need to pass judgement.
Its already signed sealed and delivered.
> Surely you don't also work for the pharmacutical Industry ???????
How many industries can i work for? Last time I worked with
pharmaceutical stuff did my work help or hinder "the industry"? I
can't give a simple answer to that question -- perhaps you put it too
simplistically ...
Is it maybe because you are so talented oh fair muse.
Your lucidity and authority , seems to stirs the cockles of Tom Booths
aura.
Has he flown the coup once more?
cheers
> Now that Australian regulatory authorities have shown themselves
> willing to look into the "natural health" market, we might expect
> great things from them in the exposure of "self-help" fraud too.
>
>
>
> > Nothing wrong with that is there???????
>
> > They are all fully qualified and registered to behave in such a
> > altruistic
> > way?????
Higher degrees in altruism?
You could say that.
tubby Tanner
"HAPPYsamurai" <profst...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:24f30328-c5ea-4868...@h14g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
On 17 Dec, 01:37, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> Show us where some "effervescent logical muse" "wholeheartedly accepts
> the qualified. educated, sophisticated Psychiatric policies of
> drugging up" children, let alone our children, and we could divert
> from discussion of regulating pseudo-science in Australia at the
> behest of an official figure like a coroner to chat about something
> else going on someplace else.
>
> Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned about
> regulating the so called
whether it is about serena's focus or not - who can say - but one
might ask if it is to be considered on topic or not
Does it really matter.
I'm just curious why she would place her focus on self help groups .
>
> self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
what is more on topic - drugged kiddies of self help groups?
>
> syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
just because serena starts a thread on self help groups why would you
consider that this unequivocally means she ignores drugged kiddies?
does your fascination with muses mean you are ignoring the drugged
kiddies?
Maybe .
how many children have been drugged as a direct result?
Only you would know that Happ as its part of your Industry????
>
> Is it because the people behind this have all credited qualifications
> and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue their
> rich Gold diggings???????
>
> Surely you don't also work for the pharmacutical Industry ???????
>
> cheers
>
rejection and acceptance are two sides of a given attribute - when you
accepted your responsibility as a parent thru the transformative
powers of LM you also chose to reject those previous thoughts and
habits that had held you back
timing can also then be added to the mix
I don't think I ever claimed I received transformative powers from LM.
It was a great ride as others have claimed, and a unique expereince .
Unfortunately it only gave you a glimse of what could be.
Good to see you back Happ.
cheers
HAPPYsamurai
> On Dec 17, 1:37 am, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> Oi, Bruno, you forgot to show us where some "effervescent logical
> muse" "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our
> children ...
it was inferred in the title of the thread?
>
> > Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned about
> > regulating the so called
>
> > self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
>
> > syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
>
> Well, now as well as showing us where some "effervescent logical muse"
> "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our children,
> I'll ask you to show where I've even previously "as usual" focused on
> ~being~ concerned, let alone mentioning regulating "so called self
> Help groups". Red herring number 2?
you and Bruno have "children" together?
>
> Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some sort
> of "program", Bruno? Shall we compare apples and oranges? Shall I
> compare thee to a summer's day?
the be-wending mystery that is the Colorado river?
>
> > Is it because the people behind this have all credited qualifications
> > and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue their
> > rich Gold diggings???????
>
> Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"? --
> We might have to identify the people before we can assess their
> qualifications. Then we might pass judgment on the issue.
bypassing the issue of drugged kiddies again..... tsk
perhaps if human beings lived in communities they could assess the
character of the kiddies and self-help purveyors thru daily
interaction
>
> > Surely you don't also work for the pharmacutical Industry ???????
>
> How many industries can i work for? Last time I worked with
> pharmaceutical stuff did my work help or hinder "the industry"? I
> can't give a simple answer to that question -- perhaps you put it too
> simplistically ...
a pharmaceutical industrialist is a person in your neighbourhood, in
your neighbourhood, in your neigh-bour-hood
a drugged kiddy is a person in your neighbourhood, in your
neighbourhood, in your neigh-bour-hood
>
> > Now that Australian regulatory authorities have shown themselves
> > willing to look into the "natural health" market, we might expect
> > great things from them in the exposure of "self-help" fraud too.
>
> > > Nothing wrong with that is there???????
>
> > > They are all fully qualified and registered to behave in such a altruistic
> > > way?????
are they bound by the hypocratic oath or similar?
>
> Higher degrees in altruism?
>
being nice to the drugged kiddy or pharmaceutical industrialist
sitting next to you on a plane?
Serena Nordstrup
Bruno, you forgot (again) to show us where some "effervescent logical
muse" "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our
children ...
> > Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned about
> > regulating the so called
>
> > self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
>
> > syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
>
> Well, now as well as showing us where some "effervescent logical muse"
> "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our children,
> I'll ask you to show where I've even previously "as usual" focused on
> ~being~ concerned, let alone mentioning regulating "so called self
> Help groups". Red herring number 2?
>
> No red herrings o fair Serena but just mere observations for all to see.
"Observations" without any supporting evidence. Where have I ever "as
usual" focused on ~being~ concerned, let alone mentioning regulating
"so called self Help groups"?
> Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some sort
> of "program", Bruno?
Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some sort
> of "program", Bruno?
> Shall we compare apples and oranges? Shall I
> compare thee to a summer's day?
>
> Apples and Oranges Nuh.
>
> You are so focused on that one tree in the forest namely your so called
> self help groups,
> that you forget or can't see where you are, and of course are clouded by the
> rough texture of the bark all around you .
Did the Coroner in the article mention self-help groups? Did he
mention kiddy-drugging?
> A mere bit woody for you???????????
>
> > Is it because the people behind this have all credited qualifications
> > and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue their
> > rich Gold diggings???????
>
> Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"? --
Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"?
> We might have to identify the people before we can assess their
> qualifications. Then we might pass judgment on the issue.
>
> There you go again pedantically analysing the word all mainly for mere
> effect.
Who introduced the word "all" into this discussion in the phrase "the
people behind this have all credited qualifications", Bruno?
Do you ever use words for effect, or do do you type randomly?
> No need to pass judgement.
> Its already signed sealed and delivered.
Let's take three steps back and get the facts straight before WE pass
OUR judgment, Bruno. Question one: Do all "the people behind this
have ... credited qualifications"?
> > Surely you don't also work for the pharmacutical Industry ???????
>
> How many industries can i work for? Last time I worked with
> pharmaceutical stuff did my work help or hinder "the industry"? I
> can't give a simple answer to that question -- perhaps you put it too
> simplistically ...
>
> Is it maybe because you are so talented oh fair muse.
We could test whether your question over-simplified by re-phrasing it
and seeing whether it becomes answerable.
On the other hand, eduction authorities strove for years to test
whether I had talent -- and never came up with a simple answer.
> Your lucidity and authority , seems to stirs the cockles of Tom Booths
> aura.
>
> Has he flown the coup once more?
>
> cheers
>
> > Now that Australian regulatory authorities have shown themselves
> > willing to look into the "natural health" market, we might expect
> > great things from them in the exposure of "self-help" fraud too.
>
> > > Nothing wrong with that is there???????
>
> > > They are all fully qualified and registered to behave in such a
> > > altruistic
> > > way?????
>
> Higher degrees in altruism?
>
> You could say that.
>
> > > Serena could highlight the spin though ???????
>
> > > Christmas Greetings
> > > from your boyfriend down south
>
> > > US Kids Represent Psychiatric Drug Goldmine
> > > Saturday 12 December 2009 fromhttp://www.truthout.org/1213091
Serena Nordstrup
> On 18 Dec, 00:37, Serena Nordstrup <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > On Dec 17, 1:37 am, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> > Oi, Bruno, you forgot to show us where some "effervescent logical
> > muse" "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> > Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our
> > children ...
>
> it was inferred in the title of the thread?
Ah, yes: I used the word "of", which evidently implies that some
"effervescent logical muse" somewhere or other "wholeheartedly accept
[s] the qualified. educated, sophisticated Psychiatric policies of
drugging up" children.
My apologies.
Would it help to ~try~ writing in Spanish?
> > > Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned about
> > > regulating the so called
>
> > > self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
>
> > > syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
>
> > Well, now as well as showing us where some "effervescent logical muse"
> > "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> > Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our children,
> > I'll ask you to show where I've even previously "as usual" focused on
> > ~being~ concerned, let alone mentioning regulating "so called self
> > Help groups". Red herring number 2?
>
> you and Bruno have "children" together?
I hadn't noticed -- but I'll let you know if any turn up.
> > Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some sort
> > of "program", Bruno? Shall we compare apples and oranges? Shall I
> > compare thee to a summer's day?
>
> the be-wending mystery that is the Colorado river?
... only at sunset.
> > > Is it because the people behind this have all credited qualifications
> > > and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue their
> > > rich Gold diggings???????
>
> > Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"? --
> > We might have to identify the people before we can assess their
> > qualifications. Then we might pass judgment on the issue.
>
> bypassing the issue of drugged kiddies again..... tsk
It feels like magnetic repulsion, always driving me away from the
terrible visions of drugged kiddies towards the topic of our newsgroup
and the subject of our thread....
Do you think medical or non-medical science will ever find a cure for
this debilitating condition?
> perhaps if human beings lived in communities they could assess the
> character of the kiddies and self-help purveyors thru daily
> interaction
Now that sounds like a good idea. We could set up a Community! -- In,
say, the jungles of Brazil.
> > > Surely you don't also work for the pharmacutical Industry ???????
>
> > How many industries can i work for? Last time I worked with
> > pharmaceutical stuff did my work help or hinder "the industry"? I
> > can't give a simple answer to that question -- perhaps you put it too
> > simplistically ...
>
> a pharmaceutical industrialist is a person in your neighbourhood, in
> your neighbourhood, in your neigh-bour-hood
>
> a drugged kiddy is a person in your neighbourhood, in your
> neighbourhood, in your neigh-bour-hood
>
>
>
> > > Now that Australian regulatory authorities have shown themselves
> > > willing to look into the "natural health" market, we might expect
> > > great things from them in the exposure of "self-help" fraud too.
>
> > > > Nothing wrong with that is there???????
>
> > > > They are all fully qualified and registered to behave in such a altruistic
> > > > way?????
>
> are they bound by the hypocratic oath or similar?
When we have identified them, we'll give them the third degree and
drag off any Hippcratic body-thetans.
Serena Nordstrup
> "HAPPYsamurai" <profstock...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
>
> news:24f30328-c5ea-4868...@h14g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
> On 17 Dec, 01:37, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Show us where some "effervescent logical muse" "wholeheartedly accepts
> > the qualified. educated, sophisticated Psychiatric policies of
> > drugging up" children, let alone our children, and we could divert
> > from discussion of regulating pseudo-science in Australia at the
> > behest of an official figure like a coroner to chat about something
> > else going on someplace else.
>
> > Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned about
> > regulating the so called
>
> whether it is about serena's focus or not - who can say - but one
> might ask if it is to be considered on topic or not
>
> Does it really matter.
I may matter if as a result we get sidetracked away from discussing
calls for regulation in Australia to discussing patterns of drug usage
in the US.
> I'm just curious why she would place her focus on self help groups .
We could talk about cults as well. Or about pseudo-science.
> > self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
>
> what is more on topic - drugged kiddies of self help groups?
>
>
>
> > syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
>
> just because serena starts a thread on self help groups why would you
> consider that this unequivocally means she ignores drugged kiddies?
>
> does your fascination with muses mean you are ignoring the drugged
> kiddies?
>
> Maybe .
>
> how many children have been drugged as a direct result?
>
> Only you would know that Happ as its part of your Industry????
>
>
>
> > Is it because the people behind this have all credited qualifications
> > and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue their
> > rich Gold diggings???????
>
> > Surely you don't also work for the pharmacutical Industry ???????
>
> > cheers
>
> rejection and acceptance are two sides of a given attribute - when you
> accepted your responsibility as a parent thru the transformative
> powers of LM you also chose to reject those previous thoughts and
> habits that had held you back
>
> timing can also then be added to the mix
>
> I don't think I ever claimed I received transformative powers from LM.
The so-called ~transfomative powers~ belong to ~landmark education~ --
not to mere acolytes, who get fobbed off with ~responsibility~. No
need to deny claims that mis-represent the discussion (straw man
fallacy).
> It was a great ride as others have claimed, and a unique expereince .
Does not Sufism offer a similar ~experience~, Bruno?
> Unfortunately it only gave you a glimse of what could be.
For which we might give profound thanks.
Serena Nordstrup
> "HAPPYsamurai" <profstock...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
>
> news:24f30328-c5ea-4868...@h14g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
> On 17 Dec, 01:37, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Show us where some "effervescent logical muse" "wholeheartedly accepts
> > the qualified. educated, sophisticated Psychiatric policies of
> > drugging up" children, let alone our children, and we could divert
> > from discussion of regulating pseudo-science in Australia at the
> > behest of an official figure like a coroner to chat about something
> > else going on someplace else.
>
> > Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned about
> > regulating the so called
>
> whether it is about serena's focus or not - who can say - but one
> might ask if it is to be considered on topic or not
>
> Does it really matter.
>
> I'm just curious why she would place her focus on self help groups .
I've made 3595 postings on alt.fan.landmark over the years. When I
search the archives for "nordstrup +self +help +groups", I find one
(1) posting outside of the current thread:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.landmark/msg/fb9afeee95cd0797?dmode=source
where my posting happened to contain someone else's phraseology.
So where does this alleged "focus on self help groups" come from,
Bruno?
Slimily
Serena
HAPPYsamurai
> On Dec 18, 1:39 am, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
>
>
> > I'm just curious why she would place her focus on self help groups .
>
>
> So where does this alleged "focus on self help groups" come from,
> Bruno?
>
> Slimily
> Serena
Bruno - like Dave on ACA, may be in tune with-all-that-is and
therefore know you better than your (~implied~? ~inferred~?
~alleged~?) denial allows you to know yourself ?
still - good on you for "asking" and having the courage to "take a
stand" and participate in the "transformational conversation" you are
engaging in
but back to the "experiential" criteria
just how many "kiddies" have you and Bruno "drugged" ?
can we also how many kiddies were drugged while Bruno was distracted
by focussing on his "curiosity"?
also, why Bruno's questioning is seen as curiosity while your
questions are seen as "logical musings" or "nit-picking" - is this a
quaint cultural custom?
and can you, like I, focus on the plight of the drugged kiddies while
also contemplating these questions
http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&source=hp&q=drugged+kiddies&btnG=Search+Images&gbv=1
tubby Tanner
My apologies.
Since you are the annointed muse you could be blessed
with a Virgin birth ?????
HAPPYsamurai
> "Serena Nordstrup" <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>
Serena Nordstrup
> On 20 Dec, 20:30, Serena Nordstrup <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > On Dec 18, 1:39 am, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> > > I'm just curious why she would place her focus on self help groups .
>
> > So where does this alleged "focus on self help groups" come from,
> > Bruno?
>
> > Slimily
> > Serena
>
> Bruno - like Dave on ACA, may be in tune with-all-that-is and
> therefore know you better than your (~implied~? ~inferred~?
> ~alleged~?) denial allows you to know yourself ?
"In tune" eh? -- That would explain a few things.
Would you suspect Bruno of such hubris?
> still - good on you for "asking" and having the courage to "take a
> stand" and participate in the "transformational conversation" you are
> engaging in
>
> but back to the "experiential" criteria
>
> just how many "kiddies" have you and Bruno "drugged" ?
Hard to tell. Bruno peddles a limited and limiting range of drugs,
while I ~try~ to spread around as many broad-spectrum antidotes as
possible. The sets of recipients may not always overlap.
> can we also how many kiddies were drugged while Bruno was distracted
> by focussing on his "curiosity"?
Hmm. We could probably calculate an average number of ingestions per
day or per hour. But measuring Bruno's period of distraction could
prove difficult.
> also, why Bruno's questioning is seen as curiosity while your
> questions are seen as "logical musings" or "nit-picking" - is this a
> quaint cultural custom?
Correct.
Bruno hisself once defined "curiosity" for us:
"Curiosity in my mind is looking at natural phenomena which we have no
explanations for whether they are taboo areas or not."
See http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.landmark/msg/ef8667a8144a2085?dmode=source
Does that extremely narrow definition account for anything?
> and can you, like I, focus on the plight of the drugged kiddies while
> also contemplating these questions
>
> http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&source=hp&q=drugged+kiddies&btn...
>
> http://www.newmediaexplorer.org/sepp/NoToDrugs.jpeg
>
> http://www.monstercookies.ca/calvin.jpg
~possibility~ in rosenbergism allegedly opens all doors ...
Simpatice
Serena
Serena Nordstrup
> "Serena Nordstrup" <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>
> news:c8d0a5ac-c281-430e...@f18g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 18, 9:07 am, HAPPYsamurai <profstock...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > On 18 Dec, 00:37, Serena Nordstrup <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Dec 17, 1:37 am, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> > > Oi, Bruno, you forgot to show us where some "effervescent logical
> > > muse" "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> > > Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our
> > > children ...
>
> > it was inferred in the title of the thread?
>
> Ah, yes: I used the word "of", which evidently implies that some
> "effervescent logical muse" somewhere or other "wholeheartedly accept
> [s] the qualified. educated, sophisticated Psychiatric policies of
> drugging up" children.
>
> My apologies.
>
> Would it help to ~try~ writing in Spanish?
Well, would it, Bruno?
> > > > Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned about
> > > > regulating the so called
>
> > > > self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
>
> > > > syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
>
> > > Well, now as well as showing us where some "effervescent logical muse"
> > > "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> > > Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our children,
> > > I'll ask you to show where I've even previously "as usual" focused on
> > > ~being~ concerned, let alone mentioning regulating "so called self
> > > Help groups". Red herring number 2?
>
> > you and Bruno have "children" together?
>
> I hadn't noticed -- but I'll let you know if any turn up.
>
> Since you are the annointed muse you could be blessed
> with a Virgin birth ?????
That might leave you rather impotent, Bruno, in the face of "our
children".
Besides, when did the anointing take place? I don't recall anyone
anointing me.
> > > Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some sort
> > > of "program", Bruno? Shall we compare apples and oranges? Shall I
> > > compare thee to a summer's day?
>
> > the be-wending mystery that is the Colorado river?
>
> ... only at sunset.
>
> > > > Is it because the people behind this have all credited qualifications
> > > > and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue
> > > > their
> > > > rich Gold diggings???????
>
> > > Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"? --
Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications",
Bruno? - yes or no?
tubby Tanner
On Dec 23, 12:23 pm, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
> "Serena Nordstrup" <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>
> news:c8d0a5ac-c281-430e...@f18g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 18, 9:07 am, HAPPYsamurai <profstock...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > On 18 Dec, 00:37, Serena Nordstrup <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Dec 17, 1:37 am, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> > > Oi, Bruno, you forgot to show us where some "effervescent logical
> > > muse" "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> > > Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our
> > > children ...
>
> > it was inferred in the title of the thread?
>
> Ah, yes: I used the word "of", which evidently implies that some
> "effervescent logical muse" somewhere or other "wholeheartedly accept
> [s] the qualified. educated, sophisticated Psychiatric policies of
> drugging up" children.
>
> My apologies.
>
> Would it help to ~try~ writing in Spanish?
Well, would it, Bruno?
How about Italian, you could handle that!!!!!
> > > > Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned about
> > > > regulating the so called
>
> > > > self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
>
> > > > syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
>
> > > Well, now as well as showing us where some "effervescent logical muse"
> > > "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> > > Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our children,
> > > I'll ask you to show where I've even previously "as usual" focused on
> > > ~being~ concerned, let alone mentioning regulating "so called self
> > > Help groups". Red herring number 2?
>
> > you and Bruno have "children" together?
>
> I hadn't noticed -- but I'll let you know if any turn up.
>
> Since you are the annointed muse you could be blessed
> with a Virgin birth ?????
That might leave you rather impotent, Bruno, in the face of "our
children".
No problem fair Muse.Just look and who I am hooked up with.
Besides, when did the anointing take place? I don't recall anyone
anointing me.
You were the annointed one from birth.
Didn't you say the educational authorities couldn't figure you out????
Doesn't that remind you of Jesus in the temple discussing and challenging
the wisdom of the day with the educationalists of the day????
> > > Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some sort
> > > of "program", Bruno? Shall we compare apples and oranges? Shall I
> > > compare thee to a summer's day?
>
> > the be-wending mystery that is the Colorado river?
>
> ... only at sunset.
>
> > > > Is it because the people behind this have all credited
> > > > qualifications
> > > > and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue
> > > > their
> > > > rich Gold diggings???????
>
> > > Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"? --
Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications",
Bruno? - yes or no?
Does it really matter????
What nitpicking o fair Muse????
cheers
tubby Tanner
Yes you are right again, I am getting forgetful these days.
Just randomly will do especially when conversing with you. I am just
fascinated by your enquiring mind. Just fascinated.
Its so flexible and understanding.
> No need to pass judgement.
> Its already signed sealed and delivered.
Let's take three steps back and get the facts straight before WE pass
OUR judgment, Bruno. Question one: Do all "the people behind this
have ... credited qualifications"?
In what context o fair Serena???
And is it really that important in regards to the main points we are
discussing.
> > Surely you don't also work for the pharmacutical Industry ???????
>
> How many industries can i work for? Last time I worked with
> pharmaceutical stuff did my work help or hinder "the industry"? I
> can't give a simple answer to that question -- perhaps you put it too
> simplistically ...
>
> Is it maybe because you are so talented oh fair muse.
We could test whether your question over-simplified by re-phrasing it
and seeing whether it becomes answerable.
On the other hand, eduction authorities strove for years to test
whether I had talent -- and never came up with a simple answer.
There you are the annointed one. The child prodigy????
I envy you and your childhood. So fascinating!!!!!!
Can you tell us more about it.
cheers
tubby Tanner
> On 23 Dec, 12:23, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>> "Serena Nordstrup" <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>>
> how's life Bruno?
All well Happ.
My son is getting married in February, I'm working a couple of days a week
for the present, and my wife and I are hopefuly going to live in Europe for
a couple of months in early June or July.
We are hopefully exchanging homes with some unknown partners that may want
to visit Melbourne around that time.
Maybe you could pop over to see us one day when we get to Europe.
And Yourself???
Have you sorted things out???
Cheers Bruno
>
HAPPYsamurai
> On Dec 21, 5:54 pm, HAPPYsamurai <profstock...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > On 20 Dec, 20:30, Serena Nordstrup <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Dec 18, 1:39 am, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> > > > I'm just curious why she would place her focus on self help groups .
>
> > > So where does this alleged "focus on self help groups" come from,
> > > Bruno?
>
> > > Slimily
> > > Serena
>
> > Bruno - like Dave on ACA, may be in tune with-all-that-is and
> > therefore know you better than your (~implied~? ~inferred~?
> > ~alleged~?) denial allows you to know yourself ?
>
> "In tune" eh? -- That would explain a few things.
>
> Would you suspect Bruno of such hubris?
LOL
well he is australian after all
tho they seem to exhibit one of the more down to earth forms
>
> > still - good on you for "asking" and having the courage to "take a
> > stand" and participate in the "transformational conversation" you are
> > engaging in
>
> > but back to the "experiential" criteria
>
> > just how many "kiddies" have you and Bruno "drugged" ?
>
> Hard to tell. Bruno peddles a limited and limiting range of drugs,
> while I ~try~ to spread around as many broad-spectrum antidotes as
> possible. The sets of recipients may not always overlap.
;)
anything for snake-bites?
>
> > can we also how many kiddies were drugged while Bruno was distracted
> > by focussing on his "curiosity"?
>
> Hmm. We could probably calculate an average number of ingestions per
> day or per hour. But measuring Bruno's period of distraction could
> prove difficult.
>
> > also, why Bruno's questioning is seen as curiosity while your
> > questions are seen as "logical musings" or "nit-picking" - is this a
> > quaint cultural custom?
>
> Correct.
>
> Bruno hisself once defined "curiosity" for us:
>
> "Curiosity in my mind is looking at natural phenomena which we have no
> explanations for whether they are taboo areas or not."
>
> Seehttp://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.landmark/msg/ef8667a8144a2085?...
>
> Does that extremely narrow definition account for anything?
I guess we now need to acknowledge the pros and cons of tunnel vision
does this count as a modern example?
the fed was curious to discover the results of free market boom and
bust so blinkered out data from the great depression
>
> > and can you, like I, focus on the plight of the drugged kiddies while
> > also contemplating these questions
>
> >http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&source=hp&q=drugged+kiddies&btn...
>
> >http://www.newmediaexplorer.org/sepp/NoToDrugs.jpeg
>
> >http://www.monstercookies.ca/calvin.jpg
>
> ~possibility~ in rosenbergism allegedly opens all doors ...
the door to the pit of rotating blades being included in the
definition of ALL ?
>
> Simpatice
> Serena
HAPPYsamurai
> "Serena Nordstrup" <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>
> That might leave you rather impotent, Bruno, in the face of "our
> children".
>
> No problem fair Muse.Just look and who I am hooked up with.
>
> Besides, when did the anointing take place? I don't recall anyone
> anointing me.
>
not "vinegar" anointing?
HAPPYsamurai
> "HAPPYsamurai" <profstock...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
>
> news:e63769db-4f42-4ded...@g22g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
>
> > On 23 Dec, 12:23, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
> >> "Serena Nordstrup" <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>
> > how's life Bruno?
>
> All well Happ.
> My son is getting married in February, I'm working a couple of days a week
> for the present, and my wife and I are hopefuly going to live in Europe for
> a couple of months in early June or July.
ah marriage - that metaphor for the holiest of anointings
> We are hopefully exchanging homes with some unknown partners that may want
> to visit Melbourne around that time.
>
> Maybe you could pop over to see us one day when we get to Europe.
sushi with Eldon and Bruno and mrs Bruno my heart soars like an eagle
at the very thought
>
> And Yourself???
> Have you sorted things out???
life always throws up new challenges
but I think I have enough age under my belt to rally with
effectiveness where necessary, in my own small way
>
> Cheers Bruno
>
>
Serena Nordstrup
No, but I might take on a salesbody of snake-oil.
> > > can we also how many kiddies were drugged while Bruno was distracted
> > > by focussing on his "curiosity"?
>
> > Hmm. We could probably calculate an average number of ingestions per
> > day or per hour. But measuring Bruno's period of distraction could
> > prove difficult.
>
> > > also, why Bruno's questioning is seen as curiosity while your
> > > questions are seen as "logical musings" or "nit-picking" - is this a
> > > quaint cultural custom?
>
> > Correct.
>
> > Bruno hisself once defined "curiosity" for us:
>
> > "Curiosity in my mind is looking at natural phenomena which we have no
> > explanations for whether they are taboo areas or not."
>
> > See http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.landmark/msg/ef8667a8144a2085?...
>
> > Does that extremely narrow definition account for anything?
>
> I guess we now need to acknowledge the pros and cons of tunnel vision
>
> does this count as a modern example?
>
> the fed was curious to discover the results of free market boom and
> bust so blinkered out data from the great depression
I reckon we could take that as an example.
> > > and can you, like I, focus on the plight of the drugged kiddies while
> > > also contemplating these questions
>
> > >http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&source=hp&q=drugged+kiddies&btn...
>
> > >http://www.newmediaexplorer.org/sepp/NoToDrugs.jpeg
>
> > >http://www.monstercookies.ca/calvin.jpg
>
> > ~possibility~ in rosenbergism allegedly opens all doors ...
>
> the door to the pit of rotating blades being included in the
> definition of ALL ?
... as it so happens
> > Simpatice
> > Serena
Serena Nordstrup
How sad.
I'll remind you though to show us where some "effervescent logical
muse" "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our
children ...
> > > Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned about
> > > regulating the so called
>
> > > self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
>
> > > syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
>
> > Well, now as well as showing us where some "effervescent logical muse"
> > "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> > Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our children,
> > I'll ask you to show where I've even previously "as usual" focused on
> > ~being~ concerned, let alone mentioning regulating "so called self
> > Help groups". Red herring number 2?
>
> > No red herrings o fair Serena but just mere observations for all to see.
>
> "Observations" without any supporting evidence. Where have I ever "as
> usual" focused on ~being~ concerned, let alone mentioning regulating
> "so called self Help groups"?
Another reminder, Bruno: where can you adduce evidence that I have
ever "as usual" focused on ~being~ concerned, let alone mentioning
regulating "so called self Help groups"?
> > Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some sort
> > of "program", Bruno?
>
> Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some sort
>
> > of "program", Bruno?
Hey Bruno: does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute
some sort of "program"?
> > Shall we compare apples and oranges? Shall I
> > compare thee to a summer's day?
>
> > Apples and Oranges Nuh.
>
> > You are so focused on that one tree in the forest namely your so called
> > self help groups,
> > that you forget or can't see where you are, and of course are clouded by
> > the
> > rough texture of the bark all around you .
>
> Did the Coroner in the article mention self-help groups? Did he
> mention kiddy-drugging?
I can answer one of these questions: the Deputy New South Wales
Coroner (Malcolm MacPherson) in the article (
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/12/08/2765718.htm?section=australia
) recommended as follows: "The key recommendation from Mr MacPherson
is that courses like the Turning Point that promise self-development
or counselling should be regulated and that those offering those
services under titles like psychotherapist or counsellor should be
required to show qualifications."
Now over to you, Bruno. Did Mr MacPherson mention kiddy-drugging ?
> > A mere bit woody for you???????????
>
> > > Is it because the people behind this have all credited qualifications
> > > and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue their
> > > rich Gold diggings???????
>
> > Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"? --
>
> Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"?
>
> > We might have to identify the people before we can assess their
> > qualifications. Then we might pass judgment on the issue.
>
> > There you go again pedantically analysing the word all mainly for mere
> > effect.
>
> Who introduced the word "all" into this discussion in the phrase "the
> people behind this have all credited qualifications", Bruno?
>
> Do you ever use words for effect, or do do you type randomly?
>
> Just randomly will do especially when conversing with you. I am just
> fascinated by your enquiring mind. Just fascinated.
> Its so flexible and understanding.
... and entirely free of consequences.
How about reading: do you assign random meanings and implications to
the ~words~ you read as well as the ~words~ you write?
> > No need to pass judgement.
> > Its already signed sealed and delivered.
>
> Let's take three steps back and get the facts straight before WE pass
> OUR judgment, Bruno. Question one: Do all "the people behind this
> have ... credited qualifications"?
>
> In what context o fair Serena???
In the context in which you wrote in this thread back about December
15, 2009: "They are all fully qualified and registered to behave in
such a altruistic way?????"
> And is it really that important in regards to the main points we are
> discussing.
We have a requirement of disentangling your claimed randomness in
alt.an.landmark. Whereas if you had posted to alt.non.sequitur ...
> > > Surely you don't also work for the pharmacutical Industry ???????
>
> > How many industries can i work for? Last time I worked with
> > pharmaceutical stuff did my work help or hinder "the industry"? I
> > can't give a simple answer to that question -- perhaps you put it too
> > simplistically ...
>
> > Is it maybe because you are so talented oh fair muse.
>
> We could test whether your question over-simplified by re-phrasing it
> and seeing whether it becomes answerable.
>
> On the other hand, eduction authorities strove for years to test
> whether I had talent -- and never came up with a simple answer.
>
> There you are the annointed one. The child prodigy????
I think not. The system tested all the children in the cohort.
> I envy you and your childhood. So fascinating!!!!!!
> Can you tell us more about it.
If it had a shred of relevance, I might.
> ...
>
> read more »
Serena Nordstrup
> "Serena Nordstrup" <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>
> news:fd0c89a8-9c94-4394...@u36g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 23, 12:23 pm, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
>
>
> > "Serena Nordstrup" <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:c8d0a5ac-c281-430e...@f18g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> > On Dec 18, 9:07 am, HAPPYsamurai <profstock...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > > On 18 Dec, 00:37, Serena Nordstrup <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Dec 17, 1:37 am, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> > > > Oi, Bruno, you forgot to show us where some "effervescent logical
> > > > muse" "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> > > > Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our
> > > > children ...
>
> > > it was inferred in the title of the thread?
>
> > Ah, yes: I used the word "of", which evidently implies that some
> > "effervescent logical muse" somewhere or other "wholeheartedly accept
> > [s] the qualified. educated, sophisticated Psychiatric policies of
> > drugging up" children.
>
> > My apologies.
>
> > Would it help to ~try~ writing in Spanish?
>
> Well, would it, Bruno?
>
> How about Italian, you could handle that!!!!!
Yeah, would that help, Bruno?
> > > > > Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned about
> > > > > regulating the so called
>
> > > > > self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
>
> > > > > syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
>
> > > > Well, now as well as showing us where some "effervescent logical muse"
> > > > "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> > > > Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our children,
> > > > I'll ask you to show where I've even previously "as usual" focused on
> > > > ~being~ concerned, let alone mentioning regulating "so called self
> > > > Help groups". Red herring number 2?
>
> > > you and Bruno have "children" together?
>
> > I hadn't noticed -- but I'll let you know if any turn up.
>
> > Since you are the annointed muse you could be blessed
> > with a Virgin birth ?????
>
> That might leave you rather impotent, Bruno, in the face of "our
> children".
>
> No problem fair Muse.Just look and who I am hooked up with.
Good to hear that impotence holds no terrors for you.
> Besides, when did the anointing take place? I don't recall anyone
> anointing me.
>
> You were the annointed one from birth.
I didn't know that. You can produce reliable witnesses?
> Didn't you say the educational authorities couldn't figure you out????
> Doesn't that remind you of Jesus in the temple discussing and challenging
> the wisdom of the day with the educationalists of the day????
No, it doesn't.
> > > > Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some sort
> > > > of "program", Bruno? Shall we compare apples and oranges? Shall I
> > > > compare thee to a summer's day?
>
> > > the be-wending mystery that is the Colorado river?
>
> > ... only at sunset.
>
> > > > > Is it because the people behind this have all credited
> > > > > qualifications
> > > > > and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue
> > > > > their
> > > > > rich Gold diggings???????
>
> > > > Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"? --
>
> Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications",
> Bruno? - yes or no?
>
> Does it really matter????
It matters that you have made a claim/assertion but failed to support
it.
> What nitpicking o fair Muse????
Nitpicking in a worthy cause.
HAPPYsamurai
> On Dec 24, 2:11 am, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> > How about Italian, you could handle that!!!!!
>
> Yeah, would that help, Bruno?
>
>
might help the pope join in?
>
> > Didn't you say the educational authorities couldn't figure you out????
> > Doesn't that remind you of Jesus in the temple discussing and challenging
> > the wisdom of the day with the educationalists of the day????
they'd probably accuse him of messing with their "religious freedom"
today Bruno...
>
> No, it doesn't.
>
>
>
> > > > > Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"? --
>
> > Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications",
> > Bruno? - yes or no?
>
> > Does it really matter????
>
> It matters that you have made a claim/assertion but failed to support
> it.
>
> > What nitpicking o fair Muse????
>
> Nitpicking in a worthy cause.
>
was jesus nit-picking when he challenged the educators of the day?
perhaps spraying Bruno's random speculations with a metaphoric nit-
shampoo or diesel might be more of a modern device
perhaps if you took more care of your metaphoric head then Serena
would have less opportunity to pick for nits
playing victim?
still there is less of a nit stigma these days
tubby Tanner
On Dec 24, 2:11 am, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
> "Serena Nordstrup" <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>
> news:fd0c89a8-9c94-4394...@u36g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 23, 12:23 pm, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
>
>
> > "Serena Nordstrup" <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:c8d0a5ac-c281-430e...@f18g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> > On Dec 18, 9:07 am, HAPPYsamurai <profstock...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > > On 18 Dec, 00:37, Serena Nordstrup <s_nordst...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Dec 17, 1:37 am, "tubby Tanner" <tub...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> > > > Oi, Bruno, you forgot to show us where some "effervescent logical
> > > > muse" "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated,
> > > > sophisticated
> > > > Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our
> > > > children ...
>
> > > it was inferred in the title of the thread?
>
> > Ah, yes: I used the word "of", which evidently implies that some
> > "effervescent logical muse" somewhere or other "wholeheartedly accept
> > [s] the qualified. educated, sophisticated Psychiatric policies of
> > drugging up" children.
>
> > My apologies.
>
> > Would it help to ~try~ writing in Spanish?
>
> Well, would it, Bruno?
>
> How about Italian, you could handle that!!!!!
Yeah, would that help, Bruno?
It may.
I would have to check out your accent though to see whether
your Italian was acceptable.
> > > > > Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned
> > > > > about
> > > > > regulating the so called
>
> > > > > self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
>
> > > > > syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
>
> > > > Well, now as well as showing us where some "effervescent logical
> > > > muse"
> > > > "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> > > > Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our
> > > > children,
> > > > I'll ask you to show where I've even previously "as usual" focused
> > > > on
> > > > ~being~ concerned, let alone mentioning regulating "so called self
> > > > Help groups". Red herring number 2?
>
> > > you and Bruno have "children" together?
>
> > I hadn't noticed -- but I'll let you know if any turn up.
>
> > Since you are the annointed muse you could be blessed
> > with a Virgin birth ?????
>
> That might leave you rather impotent, Bruno, in the face of "our
> children".
>
> No problem fair Muse.Just look and who I am hooked up with.
Good to hear that impotence holds no terrors for you.
Yes but was Mary as intelligent as you.
She was never potrayed as a Muse and did not demonstrate your creative
skills in discussion.
There is a difference o fair Muse!!!!!!
> Besides, when did the anointing take place? I don't recall anyone
> anointing me.
>
> You were the annointed one from birth.
I didn't know that. You can produce reliable witnesses?
What about your parents. Did they not believe you were special
> Didn't you say the educational authorities couldn't figure you out????
> Doesn't that remind you of Jesus in the temple discussing and challenging
> the wisdom of the day with the educationalists of the day????
No, it doesn't.
It doesn't???? Could have fooled me!!!!!
> > > > Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some
> > > > sort
> > > > of "program", Bruno? Shall we compare apples and oranges? Shall I
> > > > compare thee to a summer's day?
>
> > > the be-wending mystery that is the Colorado river?
>
> > ... only at sunset.
>
> > > > > Is it because the people behind this have all credited
> > > > > qualifications
> > > > > and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue
> > > > > their
> > > > > rich Gold diggings???????
>
> > > > Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"? --
>
> Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications",
> Bruno? - yes or no?
>
> Does it really matter????
It matters that you have made a claim/assertion but failed to support
it.
> What nitpicking o fair Muse????
Nitpicking in a worthy cause.
A mocking cause maybe????????
Serena Nordstrup
You start off in Italian, then, and the rest of us will profit from
your acceptable example. Topic: the regulation of self-help delivery
in Australia.
> > > > > > Well as usual you are so focused in being oooh sooo concerned
> > > > > > about
> > > > > > regulating the so called
>
> > > > > > self Help groups that you totally ignore the drugged kiddy
>
> > > > > > syndrome a more severe and dangerous program.
>
> > > > > Well, now as well as showing us where some "effervescent logical
> > > > > muse"
> > > > > "wholeheartedly accepted the qualified. educated, sophisticated
> > > > > Psychiatric policies of drugging up" children, let alone our
> > > > > children,
> > > > > I'll ask you to show where I've even previously "as usual" focused
> > > > > on
> > > > > ~being~ concerned, let alone mentioning regulating "so called self
> > > > > Help groups". Red herring number 2?
>
> > > > you and Bruno have "children" together?
>
> > > I hadn't noticed -- but I'll let you know if any turn up.
>
> > > Since you are the annointed muse you could be blessed
> > > with a Virgin birth ?????
>
> > That might leave you rather impotent, Bruno, in the face of "our
> > children".
>
> > No problem fair Muse.Just look and who I am hooked up with.
>
> Good to hear that impotence holds no terrors for you.
>
> Comparehttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1236575/Semi-nude-M...
>
> Yes but was Mary as intelligent as you.
I'll take that as a Yes and ignore the red herring.
> She was never potrayed as a Muse and did not demonstrate your creative
> skills in discussion.
> There is a difference o fair Muse!!!!!!
Unproven negative claims on an irrelevant diversion.
> > Besides, when did the anointing take place? I don't recall anyone
> > anointing me.
>
> > You were the annointed one from birth.
>
> I didn't know that. You can produce reliable witnesses?
>
> What about your parents. Did they not believe you were special
You've spoken to my parents? All of them? (They never mentioned
annointing at birth to me... but besides, I asked for reliable
witnesses. Can you produce any?)
> > Didn't you say the educational authorities couldn't figure you out????
> > Doesn't that remind you of Jesus in the temple discussing and challenging
> > the wisdom of the day with the educationalists of the day????
>
> No, it doesn't.
>
> It doesn't???? Could have fooled me!!!!!
... and ~possibly~ did...
> > > > > Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some
> > > > > sort
> > > > > of "program", Bruno? Shall we compare apples and oranges? Shall I
> > > > > compare thee to a summer's day?
>
> > > > the be-wending mystery that is the Colorado river?
>
> > > ... only at sunset.
Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some sort
of "program", Bruno?
> > > > > > Is it because the people behind this have all credited
> > > > > > qualifications
> > > > > > and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue
> > > > > > their
> > > > > > rich Gold diggings???????
>
> > > > > Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"? --
>
> > Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications",
> > Bruno? - yes or no?
>
> > Does it really matter????
>
> It matters that you have made a claim/assertion but failed to support
> it.
>
> > What nitpicking o fair Muse????
>
> Nitpicking in a worthy cause.
>
> A mocking cause maybe????????
I cannot tell as yet. If you can answer the question as to whether
"the people behind this have ... credited qualifications" then we can
proceed from there. Until you answer, you damage your credibility.
From your reluctance to justify your claims I might deduce that you
have little interest in discussing the regulation of self-help
delivery in Australia.
HAPPYsamurai
bruno's feelings and diversions are irrelevant to he who experiences
them
at least he "feels" they are not
i think there is always at least a seed of truth in all Bruno's
musings
but the metaphors around it seem to take on a life of their own -
still Dave QT2theme on ACA is purer candidate - the difference between
being brought in near the bewending influence of the bewending
colorado as opposed to that glorified sewer near bruno - still the
bridges are a work of art
>
> > > Besides, when did the anointing take place? I don't recall anyone
> > > anointing me.
>
> > > You were the annointed one from birth.
>
> > I didn't know that. You can produce reliable witnesses?
>
> > What about your parents. Did they not believe you were special
>
> You've spoken to my parents? All of them? (They never mentioned
> annointing at birth to me... but besides, I asked for reliable
> witnesses. Can you produce any?)
order of the royal stool?
>
> > > Didn't you say the educational authorities couldn't figure you out????
> > > Doesn't that remind you of Jesus in the temple discussing and challenging
> > > the wisdom of the day with the educationalists of the day????
I think 2 of jesus' causes were
addressing Hypocrisy
and
combining money lending with the spiritual pursuits of others
>
> > No, it doesn't.
>
> > It doesn't???? Could have fooled me!!!!!
>
> ... and ~possibly~ did...
>
> > > > > > Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some
> > > > > > sort
> > > > > > of "program", Bruno? Shall we compare apples and oranges? Shall I
> > > > > > compare thee to a summer's day?
>
> > > > > the be-wending mystery that is the Colorado river?
>
> > > > ... only at sunset.
>
> Does the existence of so-called self-help groups constitute some sort
> of "program", Bruno?
an informal curriculum - no - you miss the depth of the history -
these origins are shrouded in the miracle past of theories in sales
motivation
every day in the jungle the lion and the antelope wake up - what will
you be today ?
a lion or an antelope -
shades of victim mentality and Cannibalism?
>
>
>
> > > > > > > Is it because the people behind this have all credited
> > > > > > > qualifications
> > > > > > > and are using research and double Blind studies to further pursue
> > > > > > > their
> > > > > > > rich Gold diggings???????
>
> > > > > > Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications"? --
>
> > > Do all "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications",
> > > Bruno? - yes or no?
>
> > > Does it really matter????
>
> > It matters that you have made a claim/assertion but failed to support
> > it.
>
> > > What nitpicking o fair Muse????
>
> > Nitpicking in a worthy cause.
>
> > A mocking cause maybe????????
>
> I cannot tell as yet. If you can answer the question as to whether
> "the people behind this have ... credited qualifications" then we can
> proceed from there. Until you answer, you damage your credibility.
I guess this is why no one bothers to actually look into the issues in
werners teaching
werner gives a discourse on keeping one's word - which implies it
matters enough for him to "enroll" others into that" conversation"
but it doesn't matter enough for Bruno to be enrolled into a
conversation about werner keeping his word
> From your reluctance to justify your claims I might deduce that you
> have little interest in discussing the regulation of self-help
> delivery in Australia.
perhaps Bruno could invite Werner to lecture the Govt on the value of
keeping their "word" to "maintain" the "workability" of their mandate
and duty in this area
still methinks Bruno is more into the "evocative" than the pragmatic
in regard to this issue