OT Tablets

[John Dean]

I can hold out no longer - I must have a Tablet. But what to get. So I
thought my chums here would have experience they could share or know a
website that could help. Is the iPad all-conquering? Do I want Android. I
put myself in your hands.

[Boron Elgar]

I have an iPad. It is fabulous for reading magazines. The display is
peerless in tablets. Damned fucking pricey for a magazine reader. It
has only the most clunky of Usenet programs available, that is slow,
too. There are fabulous apps and games and things you can add to it if
that is to your pleasure. I have astronomy and bird things that I
adore on it. You can get a separate keyboard, and I have one, but I do
not find the on-screen one annoying - of course, I don't use it *that*
much that the keyboard makes a diff. I have the 2nd gen version and it
is two years old. You have your choice of the world with Apple apps.

TH has ASUS Transformer Pad Infinity TF700T and even though it, too
only has a bog-dreary Usenet program available, when the iPad dies,
that is the direction I'll head. Twin A has a version of the ASUS,
too. He loves it and has almost deserted his laptop. Both come with
detachable keyboards that serve as extra battery reserve and they work
almost like net books, rather than tablets. Although there are many,
many Android apps, you are limited in some ways in comparison to the
wealth of them for the iPad.

Which you chose depends on what you will be doing with it. What are
your plans?

Boron

[art...@yahoo.com]

Dunno, but my students really seem to like the Kindle FIre. I am
thinking of getting one. They are relatively cheap.

[Jeff Green]

And I shall be watching because, well, I'm there myself.

J

[Mike Muth]

On 19-Mar-2013, "art...@yahoo.com" <art...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Dunno, but my students really seem to like the Kindle FIre. I
> am thinking of getting one. They are relatively cheap.

I have a Fire HD 8.9" 32 GB and am completely satisfied with it.
I chose the unit without "offers." I am also wifi only. I
chose not to do the 3G or 4G thing. I just don't travel enough
for this to be worthwhile.

I have Amazon Prime, so I can stream free video. Or, I can use
netflix.

For reading, I like it - but not as much as I like my 3d Gen
Kindle. The older unit is lighter. On the other hand, the Fire
is backlit.

The range of apps is okay and getting better.

I have a remote desktop app. So, for stuff I can't run on the
Kindle, I connect to my desktop and run remotely.

Battery life sucks, but that's because the display sucks so much
power. I charge mine every night and use it heavily during the
day.


--
Mike

[rroger]

On Mar 19, 2:48 pm, "John Dean" <john-d...@FRAGmsn.com> wrote:

> I can hold out no longer - I must have a Tablet.
>
> But what to get.
>

A tablet. ; )

--
rr-rimshot-oger

[Dover Beach]

"John Dean" <john...@FRAGmsn.com> wrote in
news:aqrqa0...@mid.individual.net:

I have an iPad. I like it a lot. I don't think I do anything very
interesting with it. I read books and magazines, and watch the
occasional youtube video. I also check my email when I'm out and about.
It's a first generation iPad. I have no complaints.

My husband has a Galaxy Note 10.1 (Perhaps I should mention that both
the iPad and the Note are refurbished. We are refurb people.) He likes
it very much. He uses it primarily to hand-write notes during
depositions, meetings, etc., and then immediately e-mail the notes to
himself. The stylus and handwriting system work very well. AFAICT, the
only other thing he does with it is sudoku.

So we aren't really power users, but we like the devices fine for our
porpoises.

[John Dean]

"Boron Elgar" <boron...@hootmail.com> wrote in message
news:ltchk81ecdpeun1f2...@4ax.com...

I'm looking for general browsing, Google Earth, Wikipedia and IMDb from the
armchair, bit of YouTube. And Mrs Dean is interested (pretty much for the
first time - she doesn't use computers much) so Heaven knows *what* she will
do with it.

--
John Dean

[Boron Elgar]

On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 23:36:57 -0000, "John Dean"

I'd go with one of the Androids. I think the iPad, lovely though it
looks, it much more proprietary, skittish and demanding with its
programs, permissions and general high falutin' snobbishness.

You needn't stick with the ASUS, either. The Galaxy that Dover
mentions gets very good reviews, too. The advantage of my specific
recommendation is that its keyboard serves as cover and battery juicer
and stand. AND a keyboard only needs consideration if you feel you or
your wife will not be 100% comfortable with only swiping and
touchscreen.

I cannot speak at all for the readers, such as the Kindles. I just do
not know how they handle the programs you want to use. Mike will,
though.

Boron

[Les Albert]

On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 23:36:57 -0000, "John Dean"
<john...@FRAGmsn.com> wrote:


>"Boron Elgar" <boron...@hootmail.com> wrote

>> Which you chose depends on what you will be doing with it. What are
>> your plans?

>I'm looking for general browsing, Google Earth, Wikipedia and IMDb from the
>armchair, bit of YouTube. And Mrs Dean is interested (pretty much for the
>first time - she doesn't use computers much) so Heaven knows *what* she will
>do with it.

This should be of some assistance:
http://reviews.cnet.com/tablet-buying-guide/

Then when you are thoroughly confused you can look at this:
http://reviews.cnet.com/tablet-reviews/

Les

[Boron Elgar]

On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 17:09:05 -0700, Les Albert <lalb...@aol.com>
wrote:

I have never found cnet useful for any electronics reviews (even
though they seem to really like the ASUS and the iPad we have).

Still, I cannot say that I have any better recommendations for a
review or buying guide site for tablets.

Boron

[Les Albert]

On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 20:25:02 -0400, Boron Elgar
<boron...@hootmail.com> wrote:
>On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 17:09:05 -0700, Les Albert <lalb...@aol.com>
>wrote:
>>On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 23:36:57 -0000, "John Dean"
>><john...@FRAGmsn.com> wrote:
>>>"Boron Elgar" <boron...@hootmail.com> wrote

>>>> Which you chose depends on what you will be doing with it. What are
>>>> your plans?

>>>I'm looking for general browsing, Google Earth, Wikipedia and IMDb from the
>>>armchair, bit of YouTube. And Mrs Dean is interested (pretty much for the
>>>first time - she doesn't use computers much) so Heaven knows *what* she will
>>>do with it.

>>This should be of some assistance:
>>http://reviews.cnet.com/tablet-buying-guide/
>>Then when you are thoroughly confused you can look at this:
>>http://reviews.cnet.com/tablet-reviews/

>I have never found cnet useful for any electronics reviews (even
>though they seem to really like the ASUS and the iPad we have).
>Still, I cannot say that I have any better recommendations for a
>review or buying guide site for tablets.

That's interesting because I have always found CNet useful when I am
trying to decide between new gadgets. They are also a trusted site
for downloading free programs.

Mr. Dean should also googoo on "Mossberg reviews tablets". Mossberg
has been a very respected source of *all* computer stuff for several
years.

Les

[Boron Elgar]

On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 17:50:04 -0700, Les Albert <lalb...@aol.com>

I had no problem with the programs, but I haven't gotten any from them
in years.

>
>Mr. Dean should also googoo on "Mossberg reviews tablets". Mossberg
>has been a very respected source of *all* computer stuff for several
>years.

Mossberg is an Apple junkie.

Boron

[Les Albert]

On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 20:57:20 -0400, Boron Elgar

You dismiss a respected source without looking at what he has to say
about tablets. If you read his tablet reviews (there are several of
them) you will see that his Apple junkiness doesn't seem to apply.

This discussion that we are having should point out to Mr. Dean what I
have said here many times: the opinions that one asks for here about
electronic equipment are interesting, but should not be the place for
deciding on a selection. I have a couple of tablets that I have owned
for some time and am completely satisfied with, but I wouldn't suggest
them to him. They are tablets that I decided on after I researching
several tablets, looked at in the store, and decided they were good
for my uses. After listening to everyone who responds, including this
discussion, he should do the same.

Les

[Xho Jingleheimerschmidt]

On 03/19/2013 11:48 AM, John Dean wrote:
> I can hold out no longer - I must have a Tablet. But what to get. So I
> thought my chums here would have experience they could share or know a
> website that could help.

I'd go with aspirin. Unless you have ulcers.

Xho

[Mara]

I *love* my iPad.

>J

--
The little birds sang sweet amid the scene of death and destruction.
-- Elisha Hunt Rhodes, 2nd R.I., May 4, 1864

[Snidely]

On Tuesday, Boron Elgar exclaimed wildly:

> I have an iPad. It is fabulous for reading magazines. The display is
> peerless in tablets. Damned fucking pricey for a magazine reader. It
> has only the most clunky of Usenet programs available, that is slow,
> too. There are fabulous apps and games and things you can add to it if
> that is to your pleasure. I have astronomy and bird things that I
> adore on it.

This article is almost enough to make me want an iPad
(cross-thread alert for Arty)

<http://www.popsci.com/gadgets/article/2010-04/exclusive-making-elements-one-ipads-most-magical-apps>
or <http://tinyurl.com/PaddedTable>

/dps

--
"I am not given to exaggeration, and when I say a thing I mean it"
_Roughing It_, Mark Twain

[Snidely]

Tuesday, Boron Elgar quipped:

> I cannot speak at all for the readers, such as the Kindles. I just do
> not know how they handle the programs you want to use. Mike will,
> though.

I went low on the ladder because I wasn't convinced that this year's
tablets (esp the Android ones) were quite ready for serious use, and
the closest-to-ready were serious battery chewers.

I got a Nook Simple Touch, and like the light weight and long battery
life, and b&w is fine for book reading. I may try to do my own
newsreader on it, but I'm not sure anyone else would like the result,
any more than they'd agree with how I adjust the driver's seat and
mirrors.

I have a smart phone with color, and do sometimes watch Youtubings on
it, and listen to mp3's and use the KUSC streaming app. Each of those
chews up battery, so it's nice that the NST doesn't.

/dps

--
I have always been glad we weren't killed that night. I do not know
any particular reason, but I have always been glad.
_Roughing It_, Mark Twain

[Snidely]

Mara noted that:

> On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 17:34:31 -0400, Jeff Green <jeffin...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 3/19/2013 2:48 PM, John Dean wrote:
>>> I can hold out no longer - I must have a Tablet. But what to get. So I
>>> thought my chums here would have experience they could share or know a
>>> website that could help. Is the iPad all-conquering? Do I want Android. I
>>> put myself in your hands.

I'd rather you put a tablet in our hands.

>> And I shall be watching because, well, I'm there myself.

It's hard to hold on to you cold-weather types. Maybe I can get some
ski gloves sent from Mammoth Mountain.

>
> I *love* my iPad.

I wonder how well it simulates a Frisbee? I won't ask you to try it,
though, not until it croaks.

/dps

--
"This is all very fine, but let us not be carried away be excitement,
but ask calmly, how does this person feel about in in his cooler
moments next day, with six or seven thousand feet of snow and stuff on
top of him?"
_Roughing It_, Mark Twain.

[Boron Elgar]

On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 18:27:37 -0700, Les Albert <lalb...@aol.com>
wrote:

>On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 20:57:20 -0400, Boron Elgar
><boron...@hootmail.com> wrote:
>

>
>>Mossberg is an Apple junkie.
>
>
>
>You dismiss a respected source without looking at what he has to say
>about tablets. If you read his tablet reviews (there are several of
>them) you will see that his Apple junkiness doesn't seem to apply.

You make it sound as if I do not know anything at all about Mossberg,
whom I have been reading for over a decade. He's an Apple junkie.

>This discussion that we are having should point out to Mr. Dean what I
>have said here many times: the opinions that one asks for here about
>electronic equipment are interesting, but should not be the place for
>deciding on a selection. I have a couple of tablets that I have owned
>for some time and am completely satisfied with, but I wouldn't suggest
>them to him. They are tablets that I decided on after I researching
>several tablets, looked at in the store, and decided they were good
>for my uses. After listening to everyone who responds, including this
>discussion, he should do the same.
>

That is all well and good, Les, but I don't consider myself a luddite
or a neophyte when it comes to tech discussion online. I happen to
find both your recommendations to be generally bland, often seeming in
the pockets of one or more manufacturers, and at times, fawning,
rather than accurate or dispassionate and impartial in reviews.

There is no reliable review source online for this kind of tech. There
is an enormous amount of writing to be sure, but little I have found
reliable and objective, and surely no *one* site that should be
considered a go-to when looking for info.

Boron

[Boron Elgar]

On Wed, 20 Mar 2013 00:17:22 -0700, Snidely <snide...@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Tuesday, Boron Elgar exclaimed wildly:
>
>> I have an iPad. It is fabulous for reading magazines. The display is
>> peerless in tablets. Damned fucking pricey for a magazine reader. It
>> has only the most clunky of Usenet programs available, that is slow,
>> too. There are fabulous apps and games and things you can add to it if
>> that is to your pleasure. I have astronomy and bird things that I
>> adore on it.
>
>This article is almost enough to make me want an iPad
>(cross-thread alert for Arty)
>
><http://www.popsci.com/gadgets/article/2010-04/exclusive-making-elements-one-ipads-most-magical-apps>
>or <http://tinyurl.com/PaddedTable>
>
>/dps

I have it. Wow.

It is the availability of such spectacular apps/books that make the
iPad hard to beat. I could lose whole years playing with those things,
and as elegant and breathtaking as it is for those items, I also find
it clunky and stubborn for many everyday tasks and operations.

Basically, I find the iPad unparalleled for visuals and periodicals
and many types of books, but too quirky for plain and simple tasks
that are a usually a breeze on a netbook or bigger. In fact, it is
often easier to accomplish things on an Android smartphone than on the
iPad. This may be wholly due to the types of tasks I, myself, perform
on a daily basis.

Boron

[John Dean]

"Les Albert" <lalb...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:30vhk89mvv6p9650s...@4ax.com...

> On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 23:36:57 -0000, "John Dean"
> <john...@FRAGmsn.com> wrote:
>
>
>>"Boron Elgar" <boron...@hootmail.com> wrote
>>> Which you chose depends on what you will be doing with it. What are
>>> your plans?
>
>>I'm looking for general browsing, Google Earth, Wikipedia and IMDb from
>>the
>>armchair, bit of YouTube. And Mrs Dean is interested (pretty much for the
>>first time - she doesn't use computers much) so Heaven knows *what* she
>>will
>>do with it.
>
>
>
> This should be of some assistance:
> http://reviews.cnet.com/tablet-buying-guide/

It was indeed of some assistance

>
> Then when you are thoroughly confused you can look at this:
> http://reviews.cnet.com/tablet-reviews/
>

I wasn't thoroughly confused until *after* I looked there.
But thanks.

--
John Dean

[John Dean]

"Boron Elgar" <boron...@hootmail.com> wrote in message

news:4a2ik8lv9efmm4oea...@4ax.com...

Does his Momma wear army boots?

--
John Dean

[Les Albert]

On Wed, 20 Mar 2013 07:34:09 -0400, Boron Elgar

You miss the point of the recommendations, as you always seem to do
when someone doesn't agree with what you have to say. You take
offense and immediately accuse the other side of impugning your
intelligence and experience. Then you attack: "I happen to

find both your recommendations to be generally bland, often seeming in
the pockets of one or more manufacturers, and at times, fawning,

rather than accurate or dispassionate and impartial in reviews.".

I'm surprised you didn't tell me to go fuck myself. It's getting
old, and makes people (me) uncomfortable to discuss things with you.
The places I suggested were meant for Mr. Dean to get some idea of
what's available, and what some reviewers are saying about the items.

Les

[Boron Elgar]

On Wed, 20 Mar 2013 08:48:36 -0700, Les Albert <lalb...@aol.com>
wrote:

>You miss the point of the recommendations, as you always seem to do
>when someone doesn't agree with what you have to say. You take
>offense and immediately accuse the other side of impugning your
>intelligence and experience. Then you attack: "I happen to
>find both your recommendations to be generally bland, often seeming in
>the pockets of one or more manufacturers, and at times, fawning,
>rather than accurate or dispassionate and impartial in reviews.".
>
>I'm surprised you didn't tell me to go fuck myself. It's getting
>old, and makes people (me) uncomfortable to discuss things with you.
>The places I suggested were meant for Mr. Dean to get some idea of
>what's available, and what some reviewers are saying about the items.
>
>Les

Les, perhaps it is you who are being more than a tad prickly, which I
can very easily toss out as what happens with you when ever anyone
disagrees with you.

In fact, though, I was criticizing the websites you mentioned as bland
and in the pockets of manufacturers. Surely, you don't think I was
saying YOU were in the pocket of some manufacturer, do you? What
purpose would that serve.

I voiced no criticism of you, but of the websites you mentioned. You,
then, came after me and accused me of not knowing enough about
Mossberg to make a judgment about him.

So yeah, fuck you.

Boron

[Les Albert]

On Wed, 20 Mar 2013 11:58:03 -0400, Boron Elgar
<boron...@hootmail.com> wrote:

>On Wed, 20 Mar 2013 08:48:36 -0700, Les Albert <lalb...@aol.com>
>wrote:
>
>>You miss the point of the recommendations, as you always seem to do
>>when someone doesn't agree with what you have to say. You take
>>offense and immediately accuse the other side of impugning your
>>intelligence and experience. Then you attack: "I happen to
>>find both your recommendations to be generally bland, often seeming in
>>the pockets of one or more manufacturers, and at times, fawning,
>>rather than accurate or dispassionate and impartial in reviews.".
>>
>>I'm surprised you didn't tell me to go fuck myself. It's getting
>>old, and makes people (me) uncomfortable to discuss things with you.
>>The places I suggested were meant for Mr. Dean to get some idea of
>>what's available, and what some reviewers are saying about the items.
>>
>>Les
>
>
>Les, perhaps it is you who are being more than a tad prickly, which I
>can very easily toss out as what happens with you when ever anyone
>disagrees with you.
>In fact, though, I was criticizing the websites you mentioned as bland
>and in the pockets of manufacturers. Surely, you don't think I was
>saying YOU were in the pocket of some manufacturer, do you? What
>purpose would that serve.
>I voiced no criticism of you,

Yes, you did.

>but of the websites you mentioned. You,
>then, came after me and accused me of not knowing enough about
>Mossberg to make a judgment about him.

No, I didn't.


>So yeah, fuck you.


Okay.

Les

[Derek J Decker]

On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 18:48:57 +0000, John Dean wrote:

> I can hold out no longer - I must have a Tablet. But what to get. So I
> thought my chums here would have experience they could share or know a
> website that could help. Is the iPad all-conquering? Do I want Android.
> I put myself in your hands.

Not being a big fan of walled gardens, I went android with my tablets.

You'll want to consider whether you want a 7 inch tablet or a 10 inch.
The one I purchased for myself was a 10 inch machine, but it's large
enough that they don't often leave the house with me. My daughter takes
her 7 inch tablet with here everywhere, finds it very useful.

You'll want to consider whether you want to make a monthly payment to a
cell phone company for having internet access everywhere, or whether wifi
connectivity alone is enough.

You'll want to consider what sensors and capabilities are important to
you - I really wanted a model with a barometer as well as a GPS, but that
might not matter to more sane people.

You'll want to consider what the prospects are for operating system
updates for the selected machines. You'll also want to consider what your
budget is.

What I did:

My Tablet: Used 10 in Xoom from Cowboom, $189. It's a Google Experience
machine, though there's only one more update pending for it to Android
4.2.1, has a full sensor suite including GPS and the coveted barometer.
I pay Verizon for Internet access monthly. I can turn that on and off
from an app on the tablet if I want. It's worked out really well.

My E-Reader: Nook Simple Touch. I like E-Ink for serious reading (as
opposed to browsing). It's light, small, cheap, great battery life, easy
to use. Because I do these things, I rooted it to install a few tablet-
ish apps and things on it - web browser, etc. It's a crappy tablet, but I
use it every day for reading books.

Daughter's tablet: Google Nexus 7, 16 GB, $200 new from Google. This is
a seriously nice machine - much faster than my Xoom, complete support for
upgrades/updates, full sensor suite (My daughter doesn't care about air
pressure, but the barometer is there. I don't understand my children
sometimes). I had thought the smaller display would limit its
functionality more than is actually the case. This is my vote for best
price/performance in a current tablet right now.

I have an old Viewsonic gTablet as well, which was pretty much abandoned
by Viewsonic at launch, and has a display with a very narrow useful
viewing angle. It's obsoleted itself pretty quickly. Someday I need to
dive back into the world of third party ROMs for this thing, see if I can
make it useful again.

Anyway, there's some stuff to consider. I recommend going somewhere you
can get hands-on time with a variety of tablets, to check for display
quality and usefulness of screen sizes as well.

-Derek

[Mary]

On Mar 19, 7:06 pm, Boron Elgar <boron_el...@hootmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 23:36:57 -0000, "John Dean"
>
>
>
>
>

> <john-d...@FRAGmsn.com> wrote:
>
> >"Boron Elgar" <boron_el...@hootmail.com> wrote in message

I have a Motorola Xoom, and like it a lot.

Mary

[Hactar]

In article <mn.a01b7dd3bc7bcae1.127094@snitoo>,

Snidely <snide...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Tuesday, Boron Elgar quipped:
>
> > I cannot speak at all for the readers, such as the Kindles. I just do
> > not know how they handle the programs you want to use. Mike will,
> > though.
>
> I went low on the ladder because I wasn't convinced that this year's
> tablets (esp the Android ones) were quite ready for serious use, and
> the closest-to-ready were serious battery chewers.

I was going to get a Nook and jailbreak it to be a generic Android tablet,
but we got an actual Android tablet for a wedding gift. It's something by
Dell, probably something near the bottom of the range last summer. No
complaints, except the on-screen keyboard. It's OK as far as virtual
keyboards go, but virtual keyboards _suck_. I got an ssh client, but
using it is so painful I find another machine to use for that. We got a
rubber skin and a screen protector for it.

My wife uses it much more than I do, for browsing the web, listening to
music or audiobooks, and playing games. I think she even types stuff on
it, which is kinda crazy considering she has a netbook with an actual
(albeit small) keyboard.

--
-eben QebWe...@vTerYizUonI.nOetP royalty.mine.nu:81
LIBRA: A big promotion is just around the corner for someone
much more talented than you. Laughter is the very best medicine,
remember that when your appendix bursts next week. -- Weird Al

[Mac]

On Wed, 20 Mar 2013 09:07:34 -0700, Les Albert <lalb...@aol.com>
wrote:


>

>>So yeah, fuck you.
>
>
>Okay.
>
>Les

...and tommorrow, we have the Holly and the Ivy accusing each other of
greenness.

Bring yer own popcorn.

[John Dean]

"Derek J Decker" <de...@decker.net> wrote in message
news:5149e1cc$0$2123$d94e...@news.iglou.com...

> On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 18:48:57 +0000, John Dean wrote:
>
>> I can hold out no longer - I must have a Tablet. But what to get. So I
>> thought my chums here would have experience they could share or know a
>> website that could help. Is the iPad all-conquering? Do I want Android.
>> I put myself in your hands.
>
> Not being a big fan of walled gardens, I went android with my tablets.
>
> You'll want to consider whether you want a 7 inch tablet or a 10 inch.
> The one I purchased for myself was a 10 inch machine, but it's large
> enough that they don't often leave the house with me. My daughter takes
> her 7 inch tablet with here everywhere, finds it very useful.
>

<snip>

Thanks mucho for all that and thanks to all who responded.

--
John Dean

[Xho Jingleheimerschmidt]

On 03/19/2013 03:00 PM, Mike Muth wrote:
> On 19-Mar-2013, "art...@yahoo.com" <art...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Dunno, but my students really seem to like the Kindle FIre. I
>> am thinking of getting one. They are relatively cheap.
>
> I have a Fire HD 8.9" 32 GB and am completely satisfied with it.
> I chose the unit without "offers." I am also wifi only. I
> chose not to do the 3G or 4G thing. I just don't travel enough
> for this to be worthwhile.

If you don't travel much, what is the advantage of a tablet over a
laptop? Is it the fun of playing with a touch screen, or does the
laptop not sit comfortably on your lap? Or do you like to wonder around
your house and yard, reading from an upside down Kindle like a modern
Hamlet?

>
> I have a remote desktop app. So, for stuff I can't run on the
> Kindle, I connect to my desktop and run remotely.

Wow. I'm surprised that is a workable thing to do. Do you use a stylus?

Xho

[Snidely]

On Wednesday or thereabouts, Mac declared ...

> On Wed, 20 Mar 2013 09:07:34 -0700, Les Albert <lalb...@aol.com>
> wrote:

[Boron:]

>>> So yeah, fuck you.
>>
>>
>> Okay.
>>
>> Les
>
> ...and tommorrow, we have the Holly and the Ivy accusing each other of
> greenness.
>
> Bring yer own popcorn.

I think there has been a recent increase of prickliness around here,
even though some of the lightning rods haven't been around much for
awhile.

I don't think the Oscar program did anything to defuse this,

/dps "puzzling"

--
Killing a mouse was hardly a Nobel Prize-worthy exercise, and Lawrence
went apopleptic when he learned a lousy rodent had peed away all his
precious heavy water.
_The Disappearing Spoon_, Sam Kean

[Les Albert]

On Wed, 20 Mar 2013 21:38:43 -0700, Snidely <snide...@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Wednesday or thereabouts, Mac declared ...
>> On Wed, 20 Mar 2013 09:07:34 -0700, Les Albert <lalb...@aol.com>
>> wrote:
>
>[Boron:]
>>>> So yeah, fuck you.
>>>
>>>
>>> Okay.
>>>
>>> Les
>>
>> ...and tommorrow, we have the Holly and the Ivy accusing each other of
>> greenness.
>>
>> Bring yer own popcorn.

>I think there has been a recent increase of prickliness around here,
>even though some of the lightning rods haven't been around much for
>awhile.

>I don't think the Oscar program did anything to defuse this,
>/dps "puzzling"

Your teapot is very small. You said so yourself.

Les

[S. Checker]

Xho Jingleheimerschmidt <xho...@gmail.com> wrote:

> If you don't travel much, what is the advantage of a tablet over a
> laptop? Is it the fun of playing with a touch screen, or does the
> laptop not sit comfortably on your lap? Or do you like to wonder around
> your house and yard, reading from an upside down Kindle like a modern
> Hamlet?

I have a Nook, and a couple of times recently I've wandered into a
darkened room while reading and become vaguely annoyed that a) I no
longer can read my book or magazine and b) said reading material is not
lighting up the room for me.

I've had it since the summer and generally use it for
* "Long Tail" books. I bought two of the Psmith books, half a dozen
Chesterton books, a Maugham novel and some other works. The only real
bust was, I think, Augustine's Confessions, which had been OCRed with
absolutely hilarious results whenever it hit Greek words.
* Movies. I watch Netflix on it while on the elliptical.
* Very occasional Web surfing. I prefer a laptop but if I just want to
check Wikipedia or something it's better than using my phone.
* "Real" books. I bought _The Disappearing Spoon_ on someone here's
recommendation, and one or two others. But I've also bought the same
amount or more of physical books - the new Pratchett, the new Mario
Vargas Llosa, and I don't feel ready to give up on those. There's
something about just *having* a book that makes it worth the extra
storage space.
--
But I stand on the shoulders of the people alongside whom I work. I also
keep my feet flat on the ground, my shoulder to the wheel, and my eyes
on the stars. It's a _very_ uncomfortable position.
M. Andrews, Monk

[D.F. Manno]

In article <5149e1cc$0$2123$d94e...@news.iglou.com>,

Derek J Decker <de...@decker.net> wrote:

> Not being a big fan of walled gardens, I went android with my tablets.

If the choice is between a "walled garden" and a dense jungle complete
with predators, I'll take the garden.

Apps are developed for iOS first and Android later if at all, because
iOS is where the money is.

And you can always jailbreak an iOS device.

--
D.F. Manno | dfm...@mail.com
GOP delenda est!

[Greg Goss]

"John Dean" <john...@FRAGmsn.com> wrote:

>I can hold out no longer - I must have a Tablet. But what to get. So I
>thought my chums here would have experience they could share or know a
>website that could help. Is the iPad all-conquering? Do I want Android. I
>put myself in your hands.

I've had three no-name 7 inch Android pads. Two broke their power
switches after falls, and the third ran into a software problem
(failure to boot). The first no-name pad had a temporary video driver
problem that fixed itself after a week or so.

Seven inches is sort of halfway between a phone and the full iPad
size. I like it because fitting into a shirt pocket is a critical
requirement to me (just don't bend over to look at something on your
scooter with it in the pocket.) Decide whether you want a full pad or
the middle size

I paid $140 for the first one, $92 for the second, $70 for the third
and $74 for the fourth one (currently on its way from Hong Kong.

The first one had two USB sockets - one for connecting to the computer
(mini-USB) and the second a full-size one as a host (for mouse or
memory stick or keyboard or hard drive). On the second or third, the
host could be done by an OTG ("on the go") adapter cable. However, I
generally lose track of the coaxial charger and just use the USB for
charging. (On the first one, the USB charged about a third the speed
of the coax connection. On the other two, they charged about the same
speed on either.)

The first one used a "mini" USB, while the other two used the "micro"
USB connector. A lot more peripherals use the micro, but I find the
mini to be sloppy and wear out faster.

(Sure someone quoted a spec sheet the last time I said that the micro
felt much less sure. Since then I've had two phones whose connectors
has worn VERY badly, while I've never had a mini connector go loose.)

For the third one, I bought a book-cover-style case that included a
keyboard for $12.
--
I used to own a mind like a steel trap.
Perhaps if I'd specified a brass one, it
wouldn't have rusted like this.

[Howard Hale]

Greg Goss <go...@gossg.org> wrote in

> I paid $140 for the first one, $92 for the second, $70 for the third
> and $74 for the fourth one (currently on its way from Hong Kong.
>
> The first one had two USB sockets - one for connecting to the computer
> (mini-USB) and the second a full-size one as a host (for mouse or
> memory stick or keyboard or hard drive). On the second or third, the
> host could be done by an OTG ("on the go") adapter cable. However, I
> generally lose track of the coaxial charger and just use the USB for
> charging. (On the first one, the USB charged about a third the speed
> of the coax connection. On the other two, they charged about the same
> speed on either.)

What did you use them for? I'm tempted to get one of the cheapies as a
portable video player that I can load with 8-10 or so hours of video for
those times when I want something a little bigger than a three-finger
sized screen, and that I can feel OK with lending someone for a week or
so. But I have a hard time telling from reviews whether the video and
headphone-audio quality is decent or not, especially since there seem to
be so many models from so many manufacturers when you're talking about
the low end. I'm not expecting super great quality, but I'd like to
know it doesn't freeze up or have a weird buzzing sound or stuff like
that.

[Derek J Decker]

On Fri, 22 Mar 2013 16:00:13 -0400, D.F. Manno wrote:

> In article <5149e1cc$0$2123$d94e...@news.iglou.com>,
> Derek J Decker <de...@decker.net> wrote:
>
>> Not being a big fan of walled gardens, I went android with my tablets.
>
> If the choice is between a "walled garden" and a dense jungle complete
> with predators, I'll take the garden.

It's a question of personal preference. I think you overstate how
dangerous the 'dense jungle' really is. It's more of a rich ecosystem -
for instance, I'm looking at sprucing up my old gTablet, and there are
three or four competing open Android Jelly Bean implementations I could
try. Or, I have the Android Dev Kit installed here, I could roll my own
if I wanted to. The board on the gTablet has a spot for a GPS chip - I
could solder one in (that one's been done quite a few times) and add a GPS
capability. I like tinkering like this (not everyone does) and having the
freedom to tinker is important to me.

The other factor here is how much money I have to pay for equivalent
functionality.

> Apps are developed for iOS first and Android later if at all, because
> iOS is where the money is.

There may have been a time when that was true. Now that Android's market
share has increased tremendously, it's no longer the case.

> And you can always jailbreak an iOS device.

And then what?

Anyway, apart from that particular personal preference, just about all
the decision points I mentioned for tablet choices still hold with Apple
devices - full-sized iPad or Mini? Wifi-only or cell network? 1st, 2nd,
generation or Retina? New or refurb? You'll just pay more money, and be
more restricted in what you're allowed to do with the device.

-Derek

[D.F. Manno]

In article <514de223$0$30155$d94e...@news.iglou.com>,

Derek J Decker <de...@decker.net> wrote:

> On Fri, 22 Mar 2013 16:00:13 -0400, D.F. Manno wrote:
>
> > Apps are developed for iOS first and Android later if at all, because
> > iOS is where the money is.
>
> There may have been a time when that was true. Now that Android's market
> share has increased tremendously, it's no longer the case.

Really? From CNET:

> iOS app revenues four times higher than Google Play
>
> A research report shows that mobile apps for iOS bring in far
> more revenue than their Android counterparts. But Google's app
> store is growing much faster.
>
> by Daniel Terdiman
> November 29, 2012
>
> Apple's iOS platform generates four times as much revenue as
> Google's app store, Google Play, according to a new study.
>
> In its first research report (PDF), App Annie Intelligence, an
> app analytics company, reported that Apple is pulling in four
> times as much revenue from iOS sales as Google does from sales
> of apps for the Android platform....

<http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-57556246-37/ios-app-revenues-four-time
s-higher-than-google-play/>

[Xho Jingleheimerschmidt]

On 03/23/2013 12:26 PM, D.F. Manno wrote:
> In article <514de223$0$30155$d94e...@news.iglou.com>,
> Derek J Decker <de...@decker.net> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 22 Mar 2013 16:00:13 -0400, D.F. Manno wrote:
>>
>>> Apps are developed for iOS first and Android later if at all, because
>>> iOS is where the money is.
>>
>> There may have been a time when that was true. Now that Android's market
>> share has increased tremendously, it's no longer the case.
>
> Really? From CNET:
>
>> iOS app revenues four times higher than Google Play

revenue != market share.

Xho
--
This has been another episode of easy answers to brain-damaged questions.

[Greg Goss]

I had no problem with audio pausing or distortion on any of mine. I
am not too discriminating with audio, so I can't really be a judge.

I generally used mine as a colour Kindle. Did a bit of (wi-fi) web
browsing. And played commentary podcasts.

When the first one recovered from its video problems AFTER we'd bought
its replacement, my wife's first one became mine. She plays simple
games, some web browsing, and reading books on hers.

I never really did much video watching with any of mine. The (local)
guy who sold me the first one tried to sell me an HDMI cable for it --
he demo'ed the unit with video on his 52 inch HD television - it
looked better than my TV. Many of these claim 1080p video output, but
I no longer remember where the cable was plugged into. I'm sure that
there was no dedicated HDMI out socket on the pad.

[Greg Goss]

ebenZ...@verizon.net (Hactar) wrote:

>complaints, except the on-screen keyboard. It's OK as far as virtual
>keyboards go, but virtual keyboards _suck_. I got an ssh client, but
>using it is so painful I find another machine to use for that. We got a
>rubber skin and a screen protector for it.

We bought a "wallet" for our third 7" android pad that included a
small keyboard. My wife hates the on-screen keyboards and loves this
case. (the stylus was useless on her screen)

http://dx.com/p/protective-pu-leather-keyboard-carrying-case-with-stand-stylus-for-7-tablets-black-137898
http://tinyurl.com/c8ebqg6

The closing strap and the stand-up leg are held closed with magnets.
You can tell the floppy-era computer owner by our horror at the idea
of strong magnets near computers.

I don't remember whether her case came with the OTG adapter or whether
I bought the OTG separately. That plug is wrong for most tablets
without an OTG adapter.

For myself, I'm perfectly happy using a "swype" type keyboard. I
liked the name-brand "Swype" on my original Symbian phone, but it gets
sucky reviews on iPhone and doesn't seem to be available on Android.
So I use "TouchPal" as a keyboard.

My only objection to TouchPal as a keyboard is that my phone seems to
keep resetting its input device back to the generic Android Keyboard.

[Greg Goss]

Les Albert <lalb...@aol.com> wrote:

>That's interesting because I have always found CNet useful when I am
>trying to decide between new gadgets. They are also a trusted site
>for downloading free programs.

They have occasionally built near-viruses into their downloader
interfaces, sometimes modifying browser action or loading unwanted
programs without permission. I think that their current downloader
interface asks permission before rearranging your computer.

[Les Albert]

On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 09:29:49 -0600, Greg Goss <go...@gossg.org> wrote:
>Les Albert <lalb...@aol.com> wrote:

>>That's interesting because I have always found CNet useful when I am
>>trying to decide between new gadgets. They are also a trusted site
>>for downloading free programs.

>They have occasionally built near-viruses into their downloader
>interfaces, sometimes modifying browser action or loading unwanted
>programs without permission. I think that their current downloader

>interface asks permission before rearranging your computer.\



I never had the problem you describe, and within the last few months I
have downloaded a sound file converter, a couple of HDR photo
programs, and a photo image converter.

Les

[Snidely]

On Sunday, Greg Goss pointed out that ...

> For myself, I'm perfectly happy using a "swype" type keyboard. I
> liked the name-brand "Swype" on my original Symbian phone, but it gets
> sucky reviews on iPhone and doesn't seem to be available on Android.
> So I use "TouchPal" as a keyboard.

My G2 says, "You pressed the Swype key ..." I don't feel like going
through the tutorial to find if they hid the link to the web site
there.

Of course, my G2 is approaching antique status; last update was 2.3.4,
and I've had it since late 2010 (very late, so only about 2.25 years
ago).

/dps

--
Who, me? And what lacuna?

[Greg Goss]

"John Dean" <john...@FRAGmsn.com> wrote:

>"Les Albert" <lalb...@aol.com> wrote in message

>> This should be of some assistance:
>> http://reviews.cnet.com/tablet-buying-guide/
>
>It was indeed of some assistance

An Android phone is not an Android tablet, but ...

>If you're planning to buy an Android tablet, choose a vendor that has
>a reputation for updating to the latest version of Android on a timely
>basis. Asus and Motorola have good track records with this; Samsung,
>not so much.

My wife bought a Motorola Spice phone used. The original owner bought
it in March of 2011.

It runs the "Eclair" version of Android. We had to email the
publisher to get a version of the book reader program that I like that
would work on her system. I'm not sure why Motorola was selling an
antique version of the software on a 2011 phone, but this seems to
severely contradict the "track record" cited.

[Greg Goss]

Snidely <snide...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Mara noted that:

>> I *love* my iPad.
>
>I wonder how well it simulates a Frisbee? I won't ask you to try it,
>though, not until it croaks.

I gave away the two previous Android pads when my wife and I each
broke the "on" switch on ours within a week of each other. You could
turn mine on by reaching into the hole where the switch used to be and
fishing around with a metal knife, but that didn't feel like a winner
long-term strategy.

The next pad failed to boot at about eight months of age. If you want
to try the frisbee thing, or perhaps a nice glass chopping block
( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGVTp7eCWBo ) email me your address.

[Greg Goss]

Greg Goss <go...@gossg.org> wrote:

>"John Dean" <john...@FRAGmsn.com> wrote:
>
>>"Les Albert" <lalb...@aol.com> wrote in message
>
>>> This should be of some assistance:
>>> http://reviews.cnet.com/tablet-buying-guide/
>>
>>It was indeed of some assistance
>
>An Android phone is not an Android tablet, but ...
>
>>If you're planning to buy an Android tablet, choose a vendor that has
>>a reputation for updating to the latest version of Android on a timely
>>basis. Asus and Motorola have good track records with this; Samsung,
>>not so much.
>
>My wife bought a Motorola Spice phone used. The original owner bought
>it in March of 2011.

Meant to say 2012.

[Les Albert]

On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 20:01:05 -0600, Greg Goss <go...@gossg.org> wrote:

>"John Dean" <john...@FRAGmsn.com> wrote:
>
>>"Les Albert" <lalb...@aol.com> wrote in message
>
>>> This should be of some assistance:
>>> http://reviews.cnet.com/tablet-buying-guide/
>>
>>It was indeed of some assistance

>An Android phone is not an Android tablet, but ...

>>If you're planning to buy an Android tablet, choose a vendor that has
>>a reputation for updating to the latest version of Android on a timely
>>basis. Asus and Motorola have good track records with this; Samsung,
>>not so much.

>My wife bought a Motorola Spice phone used. The original owner bought
>it in March of 2011.
>It runs the "Eclair" version of Android. We had to email the
>publisher to get a version of the book reader program that I like that
>would work on her system. I'm not sure why Motorola was selling an
>antique version of the software on a 2011 phone, but this seems to
>severely contradict the "track record" cited.

You may be right, but you are lost in the attributions: I never posted
that statement above saying Motorola has a good track record.

Les

[Kevin]

On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 09:15:52 -0700, Les Albert <lalb...@aol.com>
wrote:

I don't know if it's still a problem, but they were widely pilloried
for this last year:

http://insecure.org/news/download-com-fiasco.html#news

I stopped using them and never went back.

--
Kevin

[Les Albert]

I wasn't aware of this problem. It seems to have occurred in 2011. My
downloads were after their fix, and I have not had any problems
because of them.

Les

[Derek J Decker]

On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 20:10:44 -0600, Greg Goss wrote:


>>>If you're planning to buy an Android tablet, choose a vendor that has a
>>>reputation for updating to the latest version of Android on a timely
>>>basis. Asus and Motorola have good track records with this; Samsung,
>>>not so much.
>>
>>My wife bought a Motorola Spice phone used. The original owner bought
>>it in March of 2011.
> Meant to say 2012.
>
>
>>It runs the "Eclair" version of Android. We had to email the publisher
>>to get a version of the book reader program that I like that would work
>>on her system. I'm not sure why Motorola was selling an antique version
>>of the software on a 2011 phone, but this seems to severely contradict
>>the "track record" cited.

Motorola has been recently purchased by Google. Prior to the purchase,
Motorola was not all that good about updating. There is a transition now,
as Google decides which Motorola devices to keep, and which to let go.

Motorola phones and tablets that have been designated 'Google Experience'
devices should have reasonable upgrade paths. I would stay away from the
ones that have not been given this designation.

Another factor in upgrades is that devices that connect to the cell
network (cell phones and tablets with data connections) require the
permission of the carriers to upgrade - this can delay upgrades by
several months or more as the carriers perform testing or whatever it is
they do.

Many android devices have attracted developer communities that produce
custom android roms, often with significant feature upgrades. You may or
may not be interested in this sort of thing.

So, the upshot is that a Motorola Android Device purchased recently may
or may not have upgrade paths, depending.

-Derek

[Derek J Decker]

On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 09:28:09 -0600, Greg Goss wrote:


> For myself, I'm perfectly happy using a "swype" type keyboard. I liked
> the name-brand "Swype" on my original Symbian phone, but it gets sucky
> reviews on iPhone and doesn't seem to be available on Android. So I use
> "TouchPal" as a keyboard.
>

I've been using the Swype beta for Android from http://www.swype.com/ and
it's been working pretty well for me.

-Derek

[Greg Goss]

Derek J Decker <de...@decker.net> wrote:

>Many android devices have attracted developer communities that produce
>custom android roms, often with significant feature upgrades. You may or
>may not be interested in this sort of thing.
>
>So, the upshot is that a Motorola Android Device purchased recently may
>or may not have upgrade paths, depending.

A local dealer for the telco that her phone is locked to tried to
"root" her phone for me, and failed. The program that does that for
him would identify the phone, state that it was about to update it,
then would go into "not responding". The non-techie guy manning the
mall booth didn't know much more about it than rebooting the PC and
trying again, which didn't help.

I presume that a "custom ROM" is upgraded from a rooted state, not by
actually replacing a chip.