Knight Sabers' training system
Alemann
training hand to hand combat when she's using her ribbons and the
knuckle bomber? And the holographs aren't realistic enough to emulate
real fighting situations. Their attack isn't a real limb attack and
they can't recreate projectiles.
Alemann
Dustin Kopplin
Because that is late 1980's technology set 40 years in the future,
what did you expect?
Well, yea Linna realize on her ribbons and knuckle bomber attacks, but
its always good to be prepared in case she doesnt have those. Shoot,
look at how under powered they were in Red Eyes. If your going to
question they fighting sim, you might as well question that whole
scene in the first place, the only purpose was to show that Nene
gained weight and needs to fight better, and girl time, everyone wants
to see more girl time.
At least Linna can put up a better fight than Nene, but Nene has a
satellite weapon at her disposal, so why should she fight, she really
good at camping while picking boomers of from space...
Alemann
> Because that is late 1980's technology set 40 years in the future,
> what did you expect?
The episode was released in early 91'.
> Well, yea Linna realize on her ribbons and knuckle bomber attacks, but
> its always good to be prepared in case she doesnt have those.
Dustin, those suits have long range weapons as their primary
offensive. After them, high-tech melee weapons like Sylia's sword and
Linna's ribbons. They aren't build so the Knight Sabers can be
brawlers as last resort.
> Shoot,
> look at how under powered they were in Red Eyes.
So, if they couldn't destroy them with firearms, they will with bare
hands and feet?
If your going to
> question they fighting sim, you might as well question that whole
> scene in the first place, the only purpose was to show that Nene
> gained weight and needs to fight better, and girl time, everyone wants
> to see more girl time.
It would have made more sense if Linna wore a mock-up hard suit
connected to the simulator mainframe, sending feedback for analysis.
> At least Linna can put up a better fight than Nene, but Nene has a
> satellite weapon at her disposal, so why should she fight, she really
> good at camping while picking boomers of from space...
Nene doesn't have the Black Box. Her backpack, whose function is
whatever plot demands at that moment, calibrated Linna's particle gun.
It doesn't have control over the satellites.
Alemann
Dartz
Oh no. Not Again.
It wasn't a training excersise. It was for gathering data for a new
hardsuit model, IIRC. Hence a controlled, predictable environment.
Measure the wearers performance, and tweak the equipment to match is
what it seems to be.
/participation in this thread
-Dartz
Amanda Stair
On Oct 1, 11:15 am, Alemann <zanzibar.h...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 1 list, 18:36, Dustin Kopplin <apexffspe...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Because that is late 1980's technology set 40 years in the future,
> > what did you expect?
>
> The episode was released in early 91'.
The majority of the series WAS released in the late 80's though.
>
> > Well, yea Linna realize on her ribbons and knuckle bomber attacks, but
> > its always good to be prepared in case she doesnt have those.
>
> Dustin, those suits have long range weapons as their primary
> offensive. After them, high-tech melee weapons like Sylia's sword and
> Linna's ribbons. They aren't build so the Knight Sabers can be
> brawlers as last resort.
Did you forget Priss' portion of the fight scene in Born to Kill? She
got knocked around like a rag doll by the female Boomer because she
had no melee weapons at the time. She did/does her best work at
range. Thankfully Sylia gave her some Knuckle and Leg Bombers for her
second suit, or her second wind against the HyperBoomers and Largo
would have ended VERY badly.
>
> > Shoot,
> > look at how under powered they were in Red Eyes.
>
> So, if they couldn't destroy them with firearms, they will with bare
> hands and feet?
>
> If your going to
>
> > question they fighting sim, you might as well question that whole
> > scene in the first place, the only purpose was to show that Nene
> > gained weight and needs to fight better, and girl time, everyone wants
> > to see more girl time.
>
> It would have made more sense if Linna wore a mock-up hard suit
> connected to the simulator mainframe, sending feedback for analysis.
Ok, so get a time machine, go back to late '90, and tell the directors
just that.
>
> > At least Linna can put up a better fight than Nene, but Nene has a
> > satellite weapon at her disposal, so why should she fight, she really
> > good at camping while picking boomers of from space...
>
> Nene doesn't have the Black Box. Her backpack, whose function is
> whatever plot demands at that moment, calibrated Linna's particle gun.
> It doesn't have control over the satellites.
>
> Alemann
"Whatever plot demands"? How 'bout that, eh? Maybe THAT would
explain why Sylvie was able to pilot the Orca IV, eh? Sure wouldn't
have had much of an episode there if she didn't know how, or if she
was the only one with those skills and ended up dying instead of, say,
Lou! =P
(/sarcasm)
I'm tired. And you're nitpicking waaay more than you should be. It's
an anime. And besides, that's why the DYN list was compiled ten-odd
years ago. But I'm sure you've given THAT a look already. Also go
take a look at the Anime Laws of Physics. It's good for an easy
laugh.
And hey, on THAT note, I have one to add: notice that Priss' bike was
blue when Nene pulled her over, but when Mackie was fixing it up later
on (and afterwards when she drove off), it was very clearly red? (And
yes, it IS the same bike, she blamed getting pulled over on it
spazzing out on her)
Amanda
Alemann
> Oh no. Not Again.
Oh, yes. Again.
> It wasn't a training excersise. It was for gathering data for a new
> hardsuit model, IIRC.
The new hardsuit data gathering comprises regular training in the
holographic room AND body data measurement which *I haven't mentioned
at all*. The event you're thinking happened two times. Once during
Scoop Chase and once during 2031 when Sylia was making the original
hardsuits. Holographic training occurs between the OVAs on a regular
basis.
> Hence a controlled, predictable environment.
The artificial environment doesn't come near actual cyberdroid combat
situations.
> Measure the wearers performance, and tweak the equipment to match is
> what it seems to be.
Useless data; waste of time.
Alemann
Alemann
> The majority of the series WAS released in the late 80's though.
Not an excuse for bad writing.
> Did you forget Priss' portion of the fight scene in Born to Kill? She
> got knocked around like a rag doll by the female Boomer because she
> had no melee weapons at the time. She did/does her best work at
> range. Thankfully Sylia gave her some Knuckle and Leg Bombers for her
> second suit, or her second wind against the HyperBoomers and Largo
> would have ended VERY badly.
Where do they ever use hand to hand combat techniques? Always ranged
(Priss's rail gun), pseudo-melee (Knuckle bomber), or melee weapons
(Sylia's blade and Linna's ribbons). Only Priss in Scoop Chase tries
it, and that's because she's a moron.
> Ok, so get a time machine, go back to late '90, and tell the directors
> just that.
Right after you, dear.
> "Whatever plot demands"? How 'bout that, eh? Maybe THAT would
> explain why Sylvie was able to pilot the Orca IV, eh?
Nene's backpack is a minor element that doesn't detract from the plot.
Sylvie's piloting skills are a crucial story element. Not explaining
it bespeaks bad writing, because you add up such crucial plot elements
whenever it suits you that can't be glossed over like Nene's
backpack.
> Sure wouldn't
> have had much of an episode there if she didn't know how, or if she
> was the only one with those skills and ended up dying instead of, say,
> Lou! =P
And that's exactly why it can't be compared to Nene's backpack and
explained away with "the plot demands it." Without it, no plot.
> I'm tired. And you're nitpicking waaay more than you should be. It's
> an anime.
God is in the detail.
> And besides, that's why the DYN list was compiled ten-odd
> years ago. But I'm sure you've given THAT a look already.
I did, and they didn't see many interesting things.
> And hey, on THAT note, I have one to add: notice that Priss' bike was
> blue when Nene pulled her over, but when Mackie was fixing it up later
> on (and afterwards when she drove off), it was very clearly red? (And
> yes, it IS the same bike, she blamed getting pulled over on it
> spazzing out on her)
The blue bike was the substitution while the red one was in repair.
The blue one didn't "weird out", to use Priss's expression, or broke.
Nene made her pull over.
Alemann
Amanda Stair
Did you read what I just said? She was pulled over on a BLUE bike,
and said when she picked it up from Mackie (and it magically changed
to RED) that "I got caught because you weirded out on me. Now hold
together this time." It IS the same bike.
I have to wonder, do you even like BGC at all? You're sure cherry-
picking it to death for someone who says they do.
Amanda
Dustin Kopplin
1991 was still 1989 to everyone by then. By 1993 hit, humankind
officially hit the 90's and the 80's officially ended. The same
happend back in 2002/03.
Nene in BG Crash used a satellite weapon against the merc army in
"Illegial Army", so this is something she has used before. Well when i
watched it 3 years ago, i didnt put my MIT mindset into it like you do
Alen, so to you i could be "TOTALLY WRONG".
Ah, ...gah, whatever, you can move the next piece, i really dont care.
Alemann
> Did you read what I just said? She was pulled over on a BLUE bike,
> and said when she picked it up from Mackie (and it magically changed
> to RED) that "I got caught because you weirded out on me. Now hold
> together this time." It IS the same bike.
Her talk at Raven's implies the bike did something („wierded out“)
that caused her to get caught. She attributes the ticket to her bike's
malfunction that Mackie had to fix.
When she was stopped by Nene, she went over the speed limit herself,
not because of the bike. The motorycle behaved just fine. Furthermore,
she blamed Nene for the ticket, while at Raven's, she blamed her bike.
If she told Nene she'll get her for this, why did she scold the bike?
She got two tickets. One when she drove her bike, the original red
one; other when she drove the spare bike while the personal one was at
the shop. Therefore, two motorbikes. No goof.
> I have to wonder, do you even like BGC at all? You're sure cherry-
> picking it to death for someone who says they do.
If I didn't love it, would I analyze it so much? I might sound harsh
and as if I'm rebuking, but it's my love for the show that's motivates
me to go to such lengths.
Alemann
Alemann
> Nene in BG Crash used a satellite weapon against the merc army in
> "Illegial Army", so this is something she has used before. Well when i
> watched it 3 years ago, i didnt put my MIT mindset into it like you do
> Alen, so to you i could be "TOTALLY WRONG".
I don't recall she had satellite control in Crash. Regardless, I
reject Crash as canon, so it doesn't count if it's true.
Alemann
Amanda Stair
Occam's Razor: the simplest explanation is probably the right one, in
this case is probably an error on part of the animator, forgetting
that in the first part of the episode her bike was blue (because she
usually has a red one, except for her red-white-blue one in Revenge
Road and the one she stole in Tinsel City). It wouldn't be the first
time it's been done: look at Cynthia's outfit in Tinsel City. Her
collar is white instead of blue in some of her close-up shots before
Frederick starts absorbing her legs. Unless you're gonna try to play
that off as her somehow changing her outfit after getting separated
from Priss!
Don't expect me to reply again. I'm done.
Amanda
Alemann
> Occam's Razor: the simplest explanation is probably the right one,
Amandsa, Ockham's razors states we shouldn't posit entities beyond
necessity. It doesn't state a simpler theory is always true, only it
should be preferred ceterus paribus. But in our case, there's no
ceterus paribus. My theory explains Priss's dialogue, you're doesn't.
Based on this, my explanations should be preferred given its
explanatory scope.
> It wouldn't be the first
> time it's been done: look at Cynthia's outfit in Tinsel City. Her
> collar is white instead of blue in some of her close-up shots before
> Frederick starts absorbing her legs. Unless you're gonna try to play
> that off as her somehow changing her outfit after getting separated
> from Priss!
No, that's a coloring goof.
Alemann
Dustin Kopplin
Its still part of the series either way, and thats something you cant
deny. Same as G Savior, as much as gundam fans want to forget that
exsist, its still there and part of the series...
Dartz
Hmmm
So a collar changing colour is a colour goof... but a motorcycle
changing colour isn't?
Eh?
You don't debate. You don't listen to others. You tell us what you
think, and cling on to it no matter what anyone tells you, desperately
hanging on to thinner and flimsier reasoning. I don't know if you're
just arrogant, or if you're a troll.... either way, you've managed to
annoy the hell out of me.
> Useless data; waste of time.
Just like your posts
Good day
-Dartz
Alemann
> Its still part of the series either way, and thats something you cant
> deny.
Yes, officially it's canon; I'm not denying this. I don't consider it
as official continuation on a personal level.
Alemann
Alemann
> So a collar changing colour is a colour goof... but a motorcycle
> changing colour isn't?
I would consider it as goof, but then how to explain Priss's words to
Mackie? How did her blue/red bike "wierd out"? Does she have a speed
reader blocking device installed in the bike that malfunctioned?
> You don't debate.
This exchange proves otherwise.
> You don't listen to others.
I always make a reply.
> You tell us what you
> think,
Basis of all communication.
> and cling on to it no matter what anyone tells you,
I don't find others argument cogent, so I stick to my reasoning. That
doesn't mean I don't tolerate dissenting opinion.
> desperately hanging on to thinner and flimsier reasoning.
Or you on begged questions, but that's how life goes.
> I don't know if you're
> just arrogant, or if you're a troll.... either way, you've managed to
> annoy the hell out of me.
Calm down, dude, we're discussing over a friggin' cartoon. It's
supposed to be a relaxed atmosphere here, taking a break from our
regular lives.
> Just like your posts
Isn't there a fanfic you're supposed to be writing?
Alemann
Amanda Stair
Dude...you're taking it WAY more seriously than ANY of us are. So
much for a relaxing break from your life.
And yes, both Dartz AND me are working on stories. Doesn't mean we
can't take a break from THAT every now and then. Plus there's, oh,
Real Life to deal with too. And trust me, if you only KNEW what I've
seen in MY life, you would know why I would NEED to relax.
Amanda
Rob Kelk
<ksyume...@aol.com> wrote:
>On Oct 4, 2:28=A0pm, Alemann <zanzibar.h...@gmail.com> wrote:
<snip>
>> Calm down, dude, we're discussing over a friggin' cartoon. It's
>> supposed to be a relaxed atmosphere here, taking a break from our
>> regular lives.
>>
>> > Just like your posts
>>
>> Isn't there a fanfic you're supposed to be writing?
>>
>> Alemann
>
>Dude...you're taking it WAY more seriously than ANY of us are. So
>much for a relaxing break from your life.
>
>And yes, both Dartz AND me are working on stories. Doesn't mean we
>can't take a break from THAT every now and then. Plus there's, oh,
>Real Life to deal with too. And trust me, if you only KNEW what I've
>seen in MY life, you would know why I would NEED to relax.
Amanda, you don't need to go there. If he asks, I'll tell him... but
only the big one that you've made public knowledge.
Alemann, you're spending what I think is way too much time analysing
BGC, and I'm the current BGC FAQ maintainer. (But that's my opinion.)
And calming down is a two-way street - this isn't a place for formal
logic, it's a place to chat about a set of cartoons.
I wouldn't mind if everybody (myself included) took a step back and
didn't post to this group for a day. Let's all let the tempers that are
starting to show cool off, don't add any fuel to the fire, and consider
that there are people behind the posts. That's how we usually defuse
this sort of situation...
--
Rob Kelk <http://robkelk.ottawa-anime.org/> e-mail: s/deadspam/gmail/
"They were engaged in a calm and dignified discussion of important
issues of the day. No, wait, that was somebody else. *These* two
were all but screaming at each other at the tops of their lungs."
- from "Drunkard's Walk V/Oh My Brother II"
Alemann
> Dude...you're taking it WAY more seriously than ANY of us are. So
> much for a relaxing break from your life.
Relaxing doesn't necessarily mean simplistic. I really enjoying what
I'm doing. It's my personality, a quirk, okay? But I am relaxing. It's
just that my brain has to work constantly. You can loosen your body
muscles and create relaxation, but your heart, a muscle, still has to
beat, right? But you can't say you're not relaxed. That's the
situation with me.
Alemann
Alemann
> Amanda, you don't need to go there. If he asks, I'll tell him... but
> only the big one that you've made public knowledge.
Rob, I'm aware what Amanda has been through, and it's not necessary to
mention it. She, like everybody else, has the right not to be reminded
of it. I like this newsgroup and it's friendly, no emotional baggage
atmosphere. Let's leave it this way, and leave Amanda alone.
> Alemann, you're spending what I think is way too much time analysing
> BGC, and I'm the current BGC FAQ maintainer. (But that's my opinion.)
That's my nature. If someone finds my approach to picky and overdone
relative to the subject, I cannot argue against it. But such approach
brings me the biggest joy and is an integral part of my personality. I
hope everybody has understanding for me just as I have for everybody
else.
> And calming down is a two-way street - this isn't a place for formal
> logic, it's a place to chat about a set of cartoons.
People, I am calm. LOL!
> I wouldn't mind if everybody (myself included) took a step back and
> didn't post to this group for a day. Let's all let the tempers that are
> starting to show cool off, don't add any fuel to the fire, and consider
> that there are people behind the posts. That's how we usually defuse
> this sort of situation...
I'll do this too. I'm taking a short break.
Alemann