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Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2011 02:00:14 -0500
From: Martin Ambuhl <mamb...@earthlink.net>
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Subject: Re: Atheist and Labels in General
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On 2/25/2011 1:05 AM, Gary Eickmeier wrote:
> "Damaeus"<no-m...@damaeus.earthlink.invalid>  wrote in message
> news:l62em61cddjhiq1sgbblnvjemhq6k9p221@4ax.com...
>
>> I consider Jesus. If Jesus really could perform miracles and create
>> objects out of thin air, raise the dead and whatnot, then the power of God
>> would have to be beyond infinite.

Gary didn't remark, but I will:
"Beyond infinite" is without meaning (and if you think the "power of 
God" is a transfinite number, you are beyond hope).  Nor is the "logic" 
in any way correct; the ability to convince others of miracles and 
"create objects out of thin air" (where is the scriptural basis for 
this?) might require only a finite power, and not much of it.

The rest of this paragraph depends on the above stupidity, so can safely 
be ignored, except to note that "Damaeus" has insisted that his Jesus is 
just as impotent as his God.  Why does Damaeus think it important to 
have beliefs about God and Jesus when they, according to his story, 
haven't the ability to do anything?

Now, for Gary:
> Damaeus, sweetheart, Jesus was a fictional character, the last in a long
> line of godmen who walked the Earth, born of a virgin, who died to save us
> all from our sins and rose again on the third day.

I believe you have overstated your case.  The behavior of people who 
later became known as the early church suggests that there was an actual 
person of great charisma who inspired a good number of people.

> His tale grew in the
> telling, until by the 4th century when the favorite stories were canonized
> into the New Testament, he became a historical character.

The stories have a number of possible sources.  For example,
a) some may relate things done or said by a real person, as understood 
by those relating the stories.
b) some may reflect what people were sure _must_ have been done or said 
by a person with the characteristics they remember or had been told about.
c) some may reflect people's trying to understand their own reactions to 
that person.
d) some _were_ created solely to insure that someone's interpretation of 
Hebrew sacred writings as prophecy were fulfilled.

There is no doubt that the legends grew over time.

> All other versions
> of the Christ cult were persecuted and burned out of existence, along with
> most pagan literature - leading to the dark ages.

The dark ages weren't so dark, if you actually read the history.  We can 
be glad that many of these versions disappeared.  Many of the apocryphal 
gospels reveal a mean-spirited, selfish Jesus, indulging in frankly evil 
acts simply so the writers could point to his "miraculous" power (beyond 
infinite?).