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Pumpov
May 8, 2012, 1:58:23 PM5/8/12
to
Hello, honourable participants!
In our country we have a collocation something like "jewish
alternative" or "jewish decision" or, word for word, "JEWISH VARIANT".
That means that when you have a problem you can avoid some
difficulties by making skilful and sly decision. For instance, when I
don't know should I use 'the' before the word I try to write a pronoun
instead.
In our country we have a collocation something like "jewish
alternative" or "jewish decision" or, word for word, "JEWISH VARIANT".
That means that when you have a problem you can avoid some
difficulties by making skilful and sly decision. For instance, when I
don't know should I use 'the' before the word I try to write a pronoun
instead.
Glenn Knickerbocker
May 8, 2012, 3:01:51 PM5/8/12
to
On 5/8/2012 1:58 PM, Pumpov wrote:
> In our country we have a collocation something like "jewish
> alternative" or "jewish decision" or, word for word, "JEWISH VARIANT".
"Variant" is the word I'd use in translating this to English--like a
> In our country we have a collocation something like "jewish
> alternative" or "jewish decision" or, word for word, "JEWISH VARIANT".
variant of an opening in chess. A common expression for this in English
doesn't come to mind right off. We might talk about cutting the Gordian
knot, but not very often. Similar expressions we use in the US are more
about making do with available materials than avoiding pitfalls:
"Yankee ingenuity"; "jury/jerry-rig" (and a more indelicate version from
the South).
ŹR
Don Phillipson
May 8, 2012, 6:46:40 PM5/8/12
to
"Pumpov" <dimap...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:9620c0e0-171d-42f9...@l7g2000vbz.googlegroups.com...
> In our country we have a collocation
> . . . word for word, "JEWISH VARIANT".
that give a national or racial character to actions, e.g. English
verb gyp = to cheat (from Gypsy)
verb welsh = to repudiate an obligation (from Wales/Welsh)
phrase to take French leave = to flee or hide (from France/French.)
These say more about past history than current attitudes.
--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)
news:9620c0e0-171d-42f9...@l7g2000vbz.googlegroups.com...
> In our country we have a collocation
> That means that when you have a problem you can avoid some
> difficulties by making skilful and sly decision. For instance, when I
> don't know should I use 'the' before the word I try to write a pronoun
> instead.
Many languages have a (small) repertoire of pejorative adjectives
> difficulties by making skilful and sly decision. For instance, when I
> don't know should I use 'the' before the word I try to write a pronoun
> instead.
that give a national or racial character to actions, e.g. English
verb gyp = to cheat (from Gypsy)
verb welsh = to repudiate an obligation (from Wales/Welsh)
phrase to take French leave = to flee or hide (from France/French.)
These say more about past history than current attitudes.
--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)
hls
May 8, 2012, 8:06:46 PM5/8/12
to
"Don Phillipson" <e9...@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> wrote in message
> These say more about past history than current attitudes.
>
> --
> Don Phillipson
> Carlsbad Springs
> (Ottawa, Canada)
>
Odysseus
May 9, 2012, 3:27:01 AM5/9/12
to
In article
<9620c0e0-171d-42f9...@l7g2000vbz.googlegroups.com>,
A common term for a similar action is "workaround", but it carries
little connotation of notable cunning or skill. In the context of
computer-programming there's the "hack" -- which might range from a
hasty 'bandaid' repair to a brilliant feat of "thinking outside the box".
Convoluted reasoning or argumentation is sometimes called "rabbinical"
or "midrashic", usually with negative connotations.
--
Odysseus
<9620c0e0-171d-42f9...@l7g2000vbz.googlegroups.com>,
little connotation of notable cunning or skill. In the context of
computer-programming there's the "hack" -- which might range from a
hasty 'bandaid' repair to a brilliant feat of "thinking outside the box".
Convoluted reasoning or argumentation is sometimes called "rabbinical"
or "midrashic", usually with negative connotations.
--
Odysseus
Yusuf B Gursey
May 9, 2012, 3:49:54 AM5/9/12
to
On May 8, 6:46 pm, "Don Phillipson" <e...@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> wrote:
> "Pumpov" <dimapum...@gmail.com> wrote in message
"slave"comes from "Slav"
> "Pumpov" <dimapum...@gmail.com> wrote in message
Peter Duncanson (BrE)
May 9, 2012, 6:12:14 AM5/9/12
to
fact in a state of what we would now know as "slavery".
OED:
Etymology: < Old French esclave (also modern French),... medieval
Latin sclavus , sclava , identical with the racial name Sclavus (see
Slav n. and adj.), the Slavonic population in parts of central
Europe having been reduced to a servile condition by conquest;...
--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.english.usage)
David Dyer-Bennet
May 9, 2012, 11:57:10 AM5/9/12
to
"hls" <h...@nospam.nix> writes:
> "Don Phillipson" <e9...@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> wrote in message
>
>> These say more about past history than current attitudes.
> "Don Phillipson" <e9...@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> wrote in message
>
>> These say more about past history than current attitudes.
> I wish that I believed this were true, but, frankly, I dont think so.
I think many Americans wouldn't recognize that 'gyp' was ethnic at all
(and they'd probably spell it "gip" at least). That's never been a
particularly American ethnic category (though some of the people of that
category do live here).
--
David Dyer-Bennet, dd...@dd-b.net; http://dd-b.net/
Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/
Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/
Dragaera: http://dragaera.info
Anton Shepelev
May 9, 2012, 2:37:19 PM5/9/12
to
Pumpov:
> In our country we have a collocation something
> like "jewish alternative" or "jewish decision" or,
> word for word, "JEWISH VARIANT". That means that
> when you have a problem you can avoid some diffi-
Jewish decision, but I'll have to make a little in-
troduction for the non-Russians.
In the 1980s, there were build many large multia-
partment houses with horrible sound isolation, or,
rather, without any isolation; so upon sneezing you
could hear the usual "Be healthy" from an adjacent
apartment. And if you mumbled, to yourself, a
silent "Thanks", there were chances you'd hear "Not
at all".
Now, to the joke:
The parents gave their little boy a drum as a
birthday present, and invited a neighbor to the
party. Seeing how busy the boy was with his new
presnet, and what loud a beating he made, the
wise man asked the child, in a most innocent
tone: "Say, do you know what's inside?"
--
() ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail
/\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments
> In our country we have a collocation something
> like "jewish alternative" or "jewish decision" or,
> word for word, "JEWISH VARIANT". That means that
> culties by making skilful and sly decision. For
> instance, when I don't know should I use 'the' be-
> fore the word I try to write a pronoun instead.
I think I know a joke in which a man makes truly a
Jewish decision, but I'll have to make a little in-
troduction for the non-Russians.
In the 1980s, there were build many large multia-
partment houses with horrible sound isolation, or,
rather, without any isolation; so upon sneezing you
could hear the usual "Be healthy" from an adjacent
apartment. And if you mumbled, to yourself, a
silent "Thanks", there were chances you'd hear "Not
at all".
Now, to the joke:
The parents gave their little boy a drum as a
birthday present, and invited a neighbor to the
party. Seeing how busy the boy was with his new
presnet, and what loud a beating he made, the
wise man asked the child, in a most innocent
tone: "Say, do you know what's inside?"
--
() ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail
/\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments
occam
May 13, 2012, 11:53:42 AM5/13/12
to
On 08/05/2012 21:01, Glenn Knickerbocker wrote:
> On 5/8/2012 1:58 PM, Pumpov wrote:
>> In our country we have a collocation something like "jewish
>> alternative" or "jewish decision" or, word for word, "JEWISH VARIANT".
>
> On 5/8/2012 1:58 PM, Pumpov wrote:
>> In our country we have a collocation something like "jewish
>> alternative" or "jewish decision" or, word for word, "JEWISH VARIANT".
>
> A common expression for this in English
> doesn't come to mind right off.
Goldberg variations :-)?
> doesn't come to mind right off.
George Hardy
May 14, 2012, 7:59:34 AM5/14/12
to
GFH
Jerry Avins
May 15, 2012, 2:23:50 PM5/15/12
to
they found gainful employment at Los Alamos. The expulsion of large
numbers of their theoreticians and experimentalists also explains why
Germany failed to produce a nuclear bomb.
Jerry
--
Engineering is the art of making what you want from things you can get.
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
Odysseus
May 15, 2012, 11:29:17 PM5/15/12
to
In article <Waxsr.18642$6Y6....@newsfe19.iad>,
<snip>
> > Nuclear physics was known as Jewish science.
>
> That's because the Nazis forced Jewish nuclear scientists to flee, and
> they found gainful employment at Los Alamos. The expulsion of large
> numbers of their theoreticians and experimentalists also explains why
> Germany failed to produce a nuclear bomb.
Partly: the bombing of their sole source of heavy water (a Norwegian
plant) was a major setback, and there were other technical obstacles;
overall I think it was a lack of time and material resources, more than
talent, that prevented the project from achieving results. Beside
enlisting some very bright people -- many of them indeed Jewish refugees
-- the Manhattan Project had enormous industrial resources at its
disposal.
Anyway, I believe the "Jewish science" notion arose before then; the
foundational theories of modern physics, relativity and quantum
mechanics, had already been so labelled because of Einstein's
background. The quite understandable early resistance to their
revolutionary implications began to be bolstered by antisemitic
rhetoric, from the likes of Philip Lenard, even as experimental evidence
in their favour mounted.
--
Odysseus
<snip>
> > Nuclear physics was known as Jewish science.
>
> That's because the Nazis forced Jewish nuclear scientists to flee, and
> they found gainful employment at Los Alamos. The expulsion of large
> numbers of their theoreticians and experimentalists also explains why
> Germany failed to produce a nuclear bomb.
plant) was a major setback, and there were other technical obstacles;
overall I think it was a lack of time and material resources, more than
talent, that prevented the project from achieving results. Beside
enlisting some very bright people -- many of them indeed Jewish refugees
-- the Manhattan Project had enormous industrial resources at its
disposal.
Anyway, I believe the "Jewish science" notion arose before then; the
foundational theories of modern physics, relativity and quantum
mechanics, had already been so labelled because of Einstein's
background. The quite understandable early resistance to their
revolutionary implications began to be bolstered by antisemitic
rhetoric, from the likes of Philip Lenard, even as experimental evidence
in their favour mounted.
--
Odysseus
Pumpov
May 19, 2012, 3:23:09 PM5/19/12
to
Isn't it a coincidence that "Jewelry" comes from "Jews"?
I suppose not. Maybe because jews have always been rich?
I suppose not. Maybe because jews have always been rich?
Peter Duncanson (BrE)
May 19, 2012, 4:22:24 PM5/19/12
to
On Sat, 19 May 2012 19:23:09 +0000 (UTC), Pumpov <dimap...@gmail.com>
wrote:
>Isn't it a coincidence that "Jewelry" comes from "Jews"?
>I suppose not. Maybe because jews have always been rich?
"Jewel(lery) does not come from "Jew".
The OED says of "jewel":
Etymology: < Anglo-Norman juel, jeual, = Old French joel
(nominative singular and obj. plural joeaus, joiaus), 12th cent. in
Hatzfeld & Darmesteter, 13–14th cent. jouel. 14– 15th cent. joiel.
joiau, modern French joyau: compare Provençal joell, joyel, Catalan
joyell, Spanish joyel, Italian gioiello; all apparently < French.
The etymology of the French word is still a matter of dispute; some
see in it a derivative of Latin gaudium (quasi *gaudiellum ), whence
French joie , joy; others of Latin joca-re , whence French jouer to
play, or of the cognate jocus , French jeu play, through a deriv.
joca-le . Compare also juelet n. The medieval Latin was (13th cent.)
joca-le, plural joca-lia. See Diez, Littré, Schéler, Hatzfeld &
Darmesteter, Körting Lat. Rom. Wbch. s.v. joca-lis.
ODO says:
http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/jewel?q=jewel
Origin:
Middle English: from Old French joel, from jeu 'game, play', from
Latin jocus 'jest'.
And this says:
http://education.yahoo.com/reference/dictionary/entry/jewel
ETYMOLOGY:
Middle English juel, from Anglo-Norman, perhaps from Vulgar Latin
*iocle, from neuter of *ioclis, of play, from Latin iocus, joke; see
yek- in Indo-European roots
wrote:
>Isn't it a coincidence that "Jewelry" comes from "Jews"?
>I suppose not. Maybe because jews have always been rich?
The OED says of "jewel":
Etymology: < Anglo-Norman juel, jeual, = Old French joel
(nominative singular and obj. plural joeaus, joiaus), 12th cent. in
Hatzfeld & Darmesteter, 13–14th cent. jouel. 14– 15th cent. joiel.
joiau, modern French joyau: compare Provençal joell, joyel, Catalan
joyell, Spanish joyel, Italian gioiello; all apparently < French.
The etymology of the French word is still a matter of dispute; some
see in it a derivative of Latin gaudium (quasi *gaudiellum ), whence
French joie , joy; others of Latin joca-re , whence French jouer to
play, or of the cognate jocus , French jeu play, through a deriv.
joca-le . Compare also juelet n. The medieval Latin was (13th cent.)
joca-le, plural joca-lia. See Diez, Littré, Schéler, Hatzfeld &
Darmesteter, Körting Lat. Rom. Wbch. s.v. joca-lis.
ODO says:
http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/jewel?q=jewel
Origin:
Middle English: from Old French joel, from jeu 'game, play', from
Latin jocus 'jest'.
And this says:
http://education.yahoo.com/reference/dictionary/entry/jewel
ETYMOLOGY:
Middle English juel, from Anglo-Norman, perhaps from Vulgar Latin
*iocle, from neuter of *ioclis, of play, from Latin iocus, joke; see
yek- in Indo-European roots
Jerry Avins
May 21, 2012, 5:36:19 PM5/21/12
to
On 5/19/2012 3:23 PM, Pumpov wrote:
> Isn't it a coincidence that "Jewelry" comes from "Jews"?
> I suppose not. Maybe because jews have always been rich?
Do you mean that all Jews have always been rich (Would that that were
> Isn't it a coincidence that "Jewelry" comes from "Jews"?
> I suppose not. Maybe because jews have always been rich?
so!) or that there have always been rich Jews? I presume that there have
always been rich non-Jews as well.
Anton Shepelev
Jul 22, 2012, 5:11:31 PM7/22/12
to
Yusuf B Gursey <ygu...@gmail.com>:
> "slave" comes from "Slav"
Never heard of this.
At school I was taught two etymologies of 'Slav':
self-named from 'slava' -- glory and from 'slo-
vo' -- word. Accordingly, foregners were called
'nemcy' -- those who could not talk and be under-
stood. Now this is the common Russian term for Ger-
mans. Some linguists consider the usage of 'a' in-
stead of 'o' very recent.
Later I read that in the old Slavic-Arian religion,
Slavi was one the four 'worlds'.
As for the etymology of 'slave', in the Russian
Wikipedia I read that Slavs, being the most numerous
people in Europe, were prevalent on the slave market
and the Greek 'sklabos' was formed from the name of
the people and entered many West-European languages
by means of the Latin.
Yet another version is from Greek 'skyleuo' -- to
get spoils of war, and is simply homonimous with the
name of the Slavs.
> "slave" comes from "Slav"
Never heard of this.
At school I was taught two etymologies of 'Slav':
self-named from 'slava' -- glory and from 'slo-
vo' -- word. Accordingly, foregners were called
'nemcy' -- those who could not talk and be under-
stood. Now this is the common Russian term for Ger-
mans. Some linguists consider the usage of 'a' in-
stead of 'o' very recent.
Later I read that in the old Slavic-Arian religion,
Slavi was one the four 'worlds'.
As for the etymology of 'slave', in the Russian
Wikipedia I read that Slavs, being the most numerous
people in Europe, were prevalent on the slave market
and the Greek 'sklabos' was formed from the name of
the people and entered many West-European languages
by means of the Latin.
Yet another version is from Greek 'skyleuo' -- to
get spoils of war, and is simply homonimous with the
name of the Slavs.
Glenn Knickerbocker
Jul 23, 2012, 12:12:15 AM7/23/12
to
On Sun, 22 Jul 2012 21:11:31 +0000 (UTC), Anton Shepelev wrote:
>Yusuf B Gursey <ygu...@gmail.com>:
>> "slave" comes from "Slav"
>Never heard of this.
>At school I was taught two etymologies of 'Slav':
I think you read Yusuf's sentence backwards. He said just what you say
>Yusuf B Gursey <ygu...@gmail.com>:
>> "slave" comes from "Slav"
>Never heard of this.
>At school I was taught two etymologies of 'Slav':
later on:
>and the Greek 'sklabos' was formed from the name of
>the people and entered many West-European languages
>by means of the Latin.
http://users.bestweb.net/~notr/engel.html --Ida Husted Harper
Anton Shepelev
Jul 23, 2012, 6:20:23 AM7/23/12
to
Glenn Knickerbocker:
> Anton Shepelev:
>
> > Yusuf B Gursey:
Initially I did, but then I also wrote about an al-
ternative etymology of 'slave' unconnected with
'Slav'.
> Anton Shepelev:
>
> > Yusuf B Gursey:
> >
> > > "slave" comes from "Slav"
> >
> > Never heard of this. At school I was taught two
> > etymologies of 'Slav':
> > [...]
> > > "slave" comes from "Slav"
> >
> > Never heard of this. At school I was taught two
> > etymologies of 'Slav':
>
> I think you read Yusuf's sentence backwards. He
> said just what you say later on:
> [...]
> I think you read Yusuf's sentence backwards. He
> said just what you say later on:
Initially I did, but then I also wrote about an al-
ternative etymology of 'slave' unconnected with
'Slav'.
Yusuf B Gursey
Jul 24, 2012, 2:57:24 AM7/24/12
to
On Jul 22, 5:11 pm, anton...@freeshell.de (Anton Shepelev) wrote:
> Yusuf B Gursey <ygur...@gmail.com>:
Muslims (Slavs were sold as slaves in Spain) and Christians didn't
have scruples reducing them to slavery. also in Arabic al-Saqa:liba(t)
(plural from Saqlab) refered to a variety of Northern peoples, many of
which were Slavs.
> Yusuf B Gursey <ygur...@gmail.com>:
>
> > "slave" comes from "Slav"
>
> Never heard of this.
>
> At school I was taught two etymologies of 'Slav':
> self-named from 'slava' -- glory and from 'slo-
> vo' -- word. Accordingly, foregners were called
> 'nemcy' -- those who could not talk and be under-
> stood. Now this is the common Russian term for Ger-
> mans. Some linguists consider the usage of 'a' in-
> stead of 'o' very recent.
>
> Later I read that in the old Slavic-Arian religion,
> Slavi was one the four 'worlds'.
>
> As for the etymology of 'slave', in the Russian
> Wikipedia I read that Slavs, being the most numerous
> people in Europe, were prevalent on the slave market
> and the Greek 'sklabos' was formed from the name of
> the people and entered many West-European languages
> by means of the Latin.
>
I think the reason was that most were pagans until fairly late, so
> > "slave" comes from "Slav"
>
> Never heard of this.
>
> At school I was taught two etymologies of 'Slav':
> self-named from 'slava' -- glory and from 'slo-
> vo' -- word. Accordingly, foregners were called
> 'nemcy' -- those who could not talk and be under-
> stood. Now this is the common Russian term for Ger-
> mans. Some linguists consider the usage of 'a' in-
> stead of 'o' very recent.
>
> Later I read that in the old Slavic-Arian religion,
> Slavi was one the four 'worlds'.
>
> As for the etymology of 'slave', in the Russian
> Wikipedia I read that Slavs, being the most numerous
> people in Europe, were prevalent on the slave market
> and the Greek 'sklabos' was formed from the name of
> the people and entered many West-European languages
> by means of the Latin.
>
Muslims (Slavs were sold as slaves in Spain) and Christians didn't
have scruples reducing them to slavery. also in Arabic al-Saqa:liba(t)
(plural from Saqlab) refered to a variety of Northern peoples, many of
which were Slavs.
John Varela
Jul 24, 2012, 3:44:06 PM7/24/12
to
On Tue, 24 Jul 2012 06:57:24 UTC, Yusuf B Gursey <ygu...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> I think the reason was that most were pagans until fairly late, so
> Muslims (Slavs were sold as slaves in Spain) and Christians didn't
> have scruples reducing them to slavery.
Christians and Muslims had no scruples about enslaving one another.
Captured sailors were routinely turned into galley slaves by both
sides.
The Barbary pirates were enslaving Europeans into the 19th century.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbary_pirates
"Historian Robert C. Davis estimated that between 1530 and 1780
1?1.25 million Europeans were captured and taken as slaves to North
Africa, principally Algiers, Tunis, and Tripoli, but also Istanbul
and Sal�."
Miguel de Cervantes, the author of Don Quijote, spent five years as
a slave of the Muslims.
--
John Varela
wrote:
> I think the reason was that most were pagans until fairly late, so
> Muslims (Slavs were sold as slaves in Spain) and Christians didn't
> have scruples reducing them to slavery.
Captured sailors were routinely turned into galley slaves by both
sides.
The Barbary pirates were enslaving Europeans into the 19th century.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbary_pirates
"Historian Robert C. Davis estimated that between 1530 and 1780
1?1.25 million Europeans were captured and taken as slaves to North
Africa, principally Algiers, Tunis, and Tripoli, but also Istanbul
and Sal�."
Miguel de Cervantes, the author of Don Quijote, spent five years as
a slave of the Muslims.
--
John Varela
Yusuf B Gursey
Jul 25, 2012, 3:04:23 AM7/25/12
to
On Jul 24, 3:44 pm, "John Varela" <newla...@verizon.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 24 Jul 2012 06:57:24 UTC, Yusuf B Gursey <ygur...@gmail.com>
> On Tue, 24 Jul 2012 06:57:24 UTC, Yusuf B Gursey <ygur...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > I think the reason was that most were pagans until fairly late, so
> > Muslims (Slavs were sold as slaves in Spain) and Christians didn't
> > have scruples reducing them to slavery.
>
> Christians and Muslims had no scruples about enslaving one another.
> Captured sailors were routinely turned into galley slaves by both
> sides.
>
yes, but not subjects.
>
> > I think the reason was that most were pagans until fairly late, so
> > Muslims (Slavs were sold as slaves in Spain) and Christians didn't
> > have scruples reducing them to slavery.
>
> Christians and Muslims had no scruples about enslaving one another.
> Captured sailors were routinely turned into galley slaves by both
> sides.
>
John Varela
Jul 25, 2012, 2:28:05 PM7/25/12
to
On Wed, 25 Jul 2012 07:04:23 UTC, Yusuf B Gursey <ygu...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> On Jul 24, 3:44 pm, "John Varela" <newla...@verizon.net> wrote:
> > On Tue, 24 Jul 2012 06:57:24 UTC, Yusuf B Gursey <ygur...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I think the reason was that most were pagans until fairly late, so
> > > Muslims (Slavs were sold as slaves in Spain) and Christians didn't
> > > have scruples reducing them to slavery.
> >
> > Christians and Muslims had no scruples about enslaving one another.
> > Captured sailors were routinely turned into galley slaves by both
> > sides.
> >
>
> yes, but not subjects.
I'm unsure what you mean by that remark.
The Ottomans took Christian boys from their families, converted them
to Islam, and enslaved them as soldiers in an elite army called the
"Janissaries". This was a benign form of slavery, but nonetheless
slavery.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janissary
wrote:
> On Jul 24, 3:44 pm, "John Varela" <newla...@verizon.net> wrote:
> > On Tue, 24 Jul 2012 06:57:24 UTC, Yusuf B Gursey <ygur...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I think the reason was that most were pagans until fairly late, so
> > > Muslims (Slavs were sold as slaves in Spain) and Christians didn't
> > > have scruples reducing them to slavery.
> >
> > Christians and Muslims had no scruples about enslaving one another.
> > Captured sailors were routinely turned into galley slaves by both
> > sides.
> >
>
> yes, but not subjects.
The Ottomans took Christian boys from their families, converted them
to Islam, and enslaved them as soldiers in an elite army called the
"Janissaries". This was a benign form of slavery, but nonetheless
slavery.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janissary
Yusuf B Gursey
Jul 25, 2012, 10:36:46 PM7/25/12
to
On Jul 25, 2:28 pm, "John Varela" <newla...@verizon.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 25 Jul 2012 07:04:23 UTC, Yusuf B Gursey <ygur...@gmail.com>
justified.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janissary
> On Wed, 25 Jul 2012 07:04:23 UTC, Yusuf B Gursey <ygur...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > On Jul 24, 3:44 pm, "John Varela" <newla...@verizon.net> wrote:
> > > On Tue, 24 Jul 2012 06:57:24 UTC, Yusuf B Gursey <ygur...@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > I think the reason was that most were pagans until fairly late, so
> > > > Muslims (Slavs were sold as slaves in Spain) and Christians didn't
> > > > have scruples reducing them to slavery.
>
> > > Christians and Muslims had no scruples about enslaving one another.
> > > Captured sailors were routinely turned into galley slaves by both
> > > sides.
>
> > yes, but not subjects.
>
> I'm unsure what you mean by that remark.
>
> The Ottomans took Christian boys from their families, converted them
> to Islam, and enslaved them as soldiers in an elite army called the
> "Janissaries". This was a benign form of slavery, but nonetheless
> slavery.
yes, I know, nad it is one of history's mysterys as to how it was
>
> > On Jul 24, 3:44 pm, "John Varela" <newla...@verizon.net> wrote:
> > > On Tue, 24 Jul 2012 06:57:24 UTC, Yusuf B Gursey <ygur...@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > I think the reason was that most were pagans until fairly late, so
> > > > Muslims (Slavs were sold as slaves in Spain) and Christians didn't
> > > > have scruples reducing them to slavery.
>
> > > Christians and Muslims had no scruples about enslaving one another.
> > > Captured sailors were routinely turned into galley slaves by both
> > > sides.
>
> > yes, but not subjects.
>
> I'm unsure what you mean by that remark.
>
> The Ottomans took Christian boys from their families, converted them
> to Islam, and enslaved them as soldiers in an elite army called the
> "Janissaries". This was a benign form of slavery, but nonetheless
> slavery.
justified.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janissary
Mr Pumpov
Aug 10, 2012, 7:00:42 AM8/10/12
to
Anton Shepelev and I are waiting Jewish-alternative stories from native
speakers.
For instance:
When it was New Year holiday my friend was not keen to invite me at his
place. When it was 2 a.m. his parents went to bed. He was sleepy too. We
had agreed that I would come only if he called me. And I decided to send
him subterfuge-message: "Me and my girl acquaintance have big troubles
and we are going to your place!" My friend couldn't bear with the
curiosity and rang me up! So we came.
Mr. Pumpov
speakers.
For instance:
When it was New Year holiday my friend was not keen to invite me at his
place. When it was 2 a.m. his parents went to bed. He was sleepy too. We
had agreed that I would come only if he called me. And I decided to send
him subterfuge-message: "Me and my girl acquaintance have big troubles
and we are going to your place!" My friend couldn't bear with the
curiosity and rang me up! So we came.
Mr. Pumpov
Glenn Knickerbocker
Aug 11, 2012, 12:43:04 AM8/11/12
to
On Fri, 10 Aug 2012 15:00:42 +0400, Mr Pumpov wrote:
>Anton Shepelev and I are waiting Jewish-alternative stories from native
>speakers.
Native speakers of what?
>Anton Shepelev and I are waiting Jewish-alternative stories from native
>speakers.
ŹR http://users.bestweb.net/~notr/arkville.html
"Doesn't that shred your buns?" --T.M. Pederson
Anton Shepelev
Aug 11, 2012, 6:27:59 PM8/11/12
to
Glenn Knickerbocker:
> > Anton Shepelev and I are waiting Jewish-alterna-
> > Anton Shepelev and I are waiting Jewish-alterna-
> > tive stories from native speakers.
>
> Native speakers of what?
Of the native language of H.P. Lovecraft :-)
>
> Native speakers of what?
Mr Pumpov
Aug 16, 2012, 8:57:38 AM8/16/12
to
Anton Shepelev wrote:
> Of the native language of H.P. Lovecraft :-)
It's interesting, do they study the art of H.P. Lovecraft at school?
> Of the native language of H.P. Lovecraft :-)
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