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Fred Doyle  
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 More options Apr 15, 7:23 am
Newsgroups: alt.design.graphics
From: Fred Doyle <fdoy...@nycap.rr.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 07:23:38 -0400
Local: Tues, Apr 15 2008 7:23 am
Subject: Would you take the pledge?
I hadn't been aware of the Designers Accord until I saw it mentioned in
the NY times today. It seems like an interesting concept. Would you
participate in an organized movement like this?

http://www.designersaccord.org/index.html

Fred


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NotMe  
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 More options Apr 15, 1:04 pm
Newsgroups: alt.design.graphics
From: "NotMe" <m...@privacy.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 13:04:45 -0400
Local: Tues, Apr 15 2008 1:04 pm
Subject: Re: Would you take the pledge?
"Fred Doyle" <fdoy...@nycap.rr.com> wrote in message

news:4804905d$0$30235$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
|I hadn't been aware of the Designers Accord until I saw it mentioned in
| the NY times today. It seems like an interesting concept. Would you
| participate in an organized movement like this?
|
| http://www.designersaccord.org/index.html
|
| Fred

Good in principle but in practice ... little more than mental masturbation.


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Fred Doyle  
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 More options Apr 15, 2:31 pm
Newsgroups: alt.design.graphics
From: "Fred Doyle" <fdoy...@nycap.rr.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 14:31:19 -0400
Local: Tues, Apr 15 2008 2:31 pm
Subject: Re: Would you take the pledge?

"NotMe" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message

news:Ze5Nj.18$ZV2.3@newsfe05.lga...

> "Fred Doyle" <fdoy...@nycap.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:4804905d$0$30235$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
> |I hadn't been aware of the Designers Accord until I saw it mentioned in
> | the NY times today. It seems like an interesting concept. Would you
> | participate in an organized movement like this?
> |
> | http://www.designersaccord.org/index.html
> |
> | Fred

> Good in principle but in practice ... little more than mental
> masturbation.

So that's a no? You wouldn't participate? Or do you enjoy mental
masturbation? (stop that or you'll go blind, or maybe just stop dreaming if
you mentally masturbate)

Fred


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SewVeryCreative  
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 More options Apr 15, 2:48 pm
Newsgroups: alt.design.graphics
From: "SewVeryCreative" <sewcreativ...@knologyDOT.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 13:48:54 -0500
Local: Tues, Apr 15 2008 2:48 pm
Subject: Re: Would you take the pledge?
Check to see if he has hair on his brain. ;)

--
Connie :-)
FREE patterns n' FREE eZine at my blog:
http://sewverycreative.blogspot.com

"Fred Doyle" <fdoy...@nycap.rr.com> wrote in message

news:l8adnV6LZNgbaZnVnZ2dnUVZ_o6knZ2d@universityofalbany...


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Drew  
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 More options Apr 15, 4:55 pm
Newsgroups: alt.design.graphics
From: Drew <whoisthatmasked...@hotmail.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 16:55:06 -0400
Local: Tues, Apr 15 2008 4:55 pm
Subject: Re: Would you take the pledge?

Fred Doyle wrote:
> I hadn't been aware of the Designers Accord until I saw it mentioned in
> the NY times today. It seems like an interesting concept. Would you
> participate in an organized movement like this?

> http://www.designersaccord.org/index.html

> Fred

I would and could, yet I try to do all those things already.

So how 'bout you, Fred. Would you take the pledge? Give us the "whys"
and "why nots".

Drew


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ArtistMike  
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 More options Apr 15, 7:23 pm
Newsgroups: alt.design.graphics
From: ArtistMike <m...@artistmike.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 23:23:23 GMT
Local: Tues, Apr 15 2008 7:23 pm
Subject: Re: Would you take the pledge?
On Tue, 15 Apr 2008 13:55:06 -0700, Drew wrote
(in article <4805162a$0$22228$4c368...@roadrunner.com>):

> Fred Doyle wrote:
>> I hadn't been aware of the Designers Accord until I saw it mentioned in
>> the NY times today. It seems like an interesting concept. Would you
>> participate in an organized movement like this?

>> http://www.designersaccord.org/index.html

>> Fred

> I would and could, yet I try to do all those things already.

> So how 'bout you, Fred. Would you take the pledge? Give us the "whys"
> and "why nots".

> Drew

Quote from the site:

"educating ourselves and the public about the environmental impact of
consumption"

End Quote.

A shiny new logo from ArtistMike.com does not harm the environment.

Chuckle.

":^)

Mike
Site at: http://www.artistmike.com
=========================================================

Certificate Design at: http://www.artistmike.com/CertificateDesigns/1.html

Logos at: http://www.artistmike.com/NewLogos2002/Logos2002.08a.html

AdSense PodCast at: http://www.artistmike.com/AdSensePodCast/1.html

=========================================================  


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Drew  
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 More options Apr 15, 8:36 pm
Newsgroups: alt.design.graphics
From: Drew <whoisthatmasked...@hotmail.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 20:36:58 -0400
Local: Tues, Apr 15 2008 8:36 pm
Subject: Re: Would you take the pledge?

ArtistMike wrote:
> Quote from the site:

> "educating ourselves and the public about the environmental impact of
> consumption"

> End Quote.

> A shiny new logo from ArtistMike.com does not harm the environment.

Oh, but the massacre of all those innocent bevels.

Alas, the pity.

Drew


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Fred Doyle  
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 More options Apr 15, 8:38 pm
Newsgroups: alt.design.graphics
From: Fred Doyle <fdoy...@nycap.rr.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 20:38:37 -0400
Local: Tues, Apr 15 2008 8:38 pm
Subject: Re: Would you take the pledge?

I'm sure you now by now, I don't have a simple yes or no, why or why not
to the question.

I'm focused on the web for the next 18-24 months at a minimum. I'm not
sure how the web would fit in with this manifesto. How does that role
fit in with, "Initiate a dialogue about environmental impact and
sustainable alternatives with each and every client." Should I be
encouraging people to view the site with renewable electric energy sources?

I should "Rework client contracts to favor environmentally responsible
design and work processes." Huh? How does that fit in with a web focus.
What's an environmentally "responsible design and work process" when
your talking about the web. I encourage people to recycle their coffee
cups and soda bottles at work. Is that enough? What else should I do?

Educational institutions (like my employer) are one of the specific
groups they invite to participate in this effort. According to the
guidelines they should, "Measure the carbon/greenhouse gas footprint of
your firm (includes operations and client engagements), and pledge to
reduce your footprint annually." Already there.

They should also, "Initiate a dialogue about environmental impact and
sustainable alternatives with every student and colleague in your
educational program. Rework curricula and assignments to emphasize
environmentally responsible design and work processes. Provide course
content, lectures, and assignments that focus on strategic and material
alternatives for sustainable design." They already do.

Those are an organizational commitment. I already work for a fairly
environmentally conscious employer. We have an Office of Environmental
Sustainability and a substantial "Go Green" effort.
(http://www.albany.edu/gogreen/)  We've hired a Director of
Environmental Sustainability. We're making investments to reduce waste
and our carbon footprint.

Personally, I've helped the effort by helping them prepare materials and
promote their efforts, but that's not even listed on the guidelines of
things to do.

I think I already did, "Advance the understanding of environmental
issues from a design perspective by contributing actively to the
communal knowledge base for sustainable design" just by posting this
here. Is that enough?

They admit that "The barrier to entry for adopting the Designers Accord
is deliberately low" but is what I do already enough? They are not only
low, they are vague.

And just because I can't help but be a curmudgeon, they also say, "The
goal of the Designers Accord is to bring the creative community together
as a social and cultural force to create positive impact. We will do
this by educating ourselves and our teams about environmental issues,
and talking to each and every client and customer about environmental
consequence."

Ok. If I want to bring the creative community together and create a
positive impact by pointing about all the sources that postulate that
global warming is a myth thereby educating us and every client and
customer about the hyperbole of the stated environmental consequences,
is that OK too? (I'm asking a question, not saying I believe that). I
believe as much in debate and the marketplace of ideas as I do in
environmental sustainability. Could I take their pledge and still do that?

Fred


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NotMe  
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 More options Apr 15, 9:09 pm
Newsgroups: alt.design.graphics
From: "NotMe" <m...@privacy.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 21:09:22 -0400
Local: Tues, Apr 15 2008 9:09 pm
Subject: Re: Would you take the pledge?

"SewVeryCreative" <sewcreativ...@knologyDOT.net> wrote in message

news:72416$4804f7f0$18d6c25a$13413@KNOLOGY.NET...
| Check to see if he has hair on his brain. ;)

LOL!


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NotMe  
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 More options Apr 15, 9:08 pm
Newsgroups: alt.design.graphics
From: "NotMe" <m...@privacy.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 21:08:57 -0400
Local: Tues, Apr 15 2008 9:08 pm
Subject: Re: Would you take the pledge?
"Fred Doyle" <fdoy...@nycap.rr.com> wrote in message

news:l8adnV6LZNgbaZnVnZ2dnUVZ_o6knZ2d@universityofalbany...
|
| "NotMe" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message

| news:Ze5Nj.18$ZV2.3@newsfe05.lga...
| > "Fred Doyle" <fdoy...@nycap.rr.com> wrote in message
| > news:4804905d$0$30235$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
| > |I hadn't been aware of the Designers Accord until I saw it mentioned in
| > | the NY times today. It seems like an interesting concept. Would you
| > | participate in an organized movement like this?
| > |
| > | http://www.designersaccord.org/index.html
| > |
| > | Fred
| >
| > Good in principle but in practice ... little more than mental
| > masturbation.
| >
| >
|
| So that's a no? You wouldn't participate?

My experience with most green 501C3 originations is that they are high on
rhetoric and low on effective impact.

As to being green I've been green since engineering school.  I had a pilot
bio diesel project going until the state demanded a $2500 bond and permit
fees just for the right to have the paper work to pay the fuel tax.
(disregarding the fuel was for heating)

Also had a gray water system that produced legally potable water or did
until the state sent me a letter advising that the system was agin the
rules. (This in the middle of the worst drought this area had had in
decades.)

| (stop that or you'll go blind, or maybe just stop dreaming if
| you mentally masturbate)

Can I continue until I need glasses?


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NotMe  
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 More options Apr 15, 10:23 pm
Newsgroups: alt.design.graphics
From: "NotMe" <m...@privacy.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 22:23:22 -0400
Local: Tues, Apr 15 2008 10:23 pm
Subject: Re: Would you take the pledge?

"Fred Doyle" <fdoy...@nycap.rr.com> wrote in message

news:48054ab0$0$9531$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
| Drew wrote:

| > Fred Doyle wrote:
| >> I hadn't been aware of the Designers Accord until I saw it mentioned
| >> in the NY times today. It seems like an interesting concept. Would you
| >> participate in an organized movement like this?
| >>
| >> http://www.designersaccord.org/index.html
| >>
| >> Fred
| >
| > I would and could, yet I try to do all those things already.
| >
| > So how 'bout you, Fred. Would you take the pledge? Give us the "whys"
| > and "why nots".
| >
| > Drew
|
| I'm sure you now by now, I don't have a simple yes or no, why or why not
| to the question.
|
| I'm focused on the web for the next 18-24 months at a minimum. I'm not
| sure how the web would fit in with this manifesto. How does that role
| fit in with, "Initiate a dialogue about environmental impact and
| sustainable alternatives with each and every client." Should I be
| encouraging people to view the site with renewable electric energy
sources?
|
| I should "Rework client contracts to favor environmentally responsible
| design and work processes." Huh? How does that fit in with a web focus.
| What's an environmentally "responsible design and work process" when
| your talking about the web. I encourage people to recycle their coffee
| cups and soda bottles at work. Is that enough? What else should I do?
|
| Educational institutions (like my employer) are one of the specific
| groups they invite to participate in this effort. According to the
| guidelines they should, "Measure the carbon/greenhouse gas footprint of
| your firm (includes operations and client engagements), and pledge to
| reduce your footprint annually." Already there.
|
| They should also, "Initiate a dialogue about environmental impact and
| sustainable alternatives with every student and colleague in your
| educational program. Rework curricula and assignments to emphasize
| environmentally responsible design and work processes. Provide course
| content, lectures, and assignments that focus on strategic and material
| alternatives for sustainable design." They already do.
|
| Those are an organizational commitment. I already work for a fairly
| environmentally conscious employer. We have an Office of Environmental
| Sustainability and a substantial "Go Green" effort.
| (http://www.albany.edu/gogreen/)  We've hired a Director of
| Environmental Sustainability. We're making investments to reduce waste
| and our carbon footprint.
|
| Personally, I've helped the effort by helping them prepare materials and
| promote their efforts, but that's not even listed on the guidelines of
| things to do.
|
| I think I already did, "Advance the understanding of environmental
| issues from a design perspective by contributing actively to the
| communal knowledge base for sustainable design" just by posting this
| here. Is that enough?
|
| They admit that "The barrier to entry for adopting the Designers Accord
| is deliberately low" but is what I do already enough? They are not only
| low, they are vague.
|
| And just because I can't help but be a curmudgeon, they also say, "The
| goal of the Designers Accord is to bring the creative community together
| as a social and cultural force to create positive impact. We will do
| this by educating ourselves and our teams about environmental issues,
| and talking to each and every client and customer about environmental
| consequence."
|
| Ok. If I want to bring the creative community together and create a
| positive impact by pointing about all the sources that postulate that
| global warming is a myth thereby educating us and every client and
| customer about the hyperbole of the stated environmental consequences,
| is that OK too? (I'm asking a question, not saying I believe that). I
| believe as much in debate and the marketplace of ideas as I do in
| environmental sustainability. Could I take their pledge and still do that?
|
| Fred

You just made my point for me.


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Shank