To David Von Pein/ everyone...
SecretServiceguy
I respect your opinion and I am glad to see you never become silly or
hateful in your dissent. I just thought I'd clear some matters up:
1) I DO have an ego (so what? Millions do...and don't tell me the
great Mr. Bugliosi, who I majorly respect does noe LOL)...but I also
consider myself a nice guy and NEVER consider myself to be BETTER than
anyone, per se, because of said ego, so to speak; not to sound all
religious (because I'm not LOL), but we're all mortal, all God's
children, we all have our faults and quirks, and we all have lives/
other interests. While I may be accomplished as a writer/ researcher
in my narrow field and a decent guitarist, there are countless areas I
am nowhere near as good at as others our; we ALL have our strengths
and weaknesses. Trust me, because it's free and fun, the net provides
MAJOR opportunities to go on "ego trips" that, in person, I never
"explore"...if you met me IN PERSON, you would say to yourself, "Gee,
that Vince doesn't seem at all like the egotistical asshole he is
online" LOL ;-)
2) Nothing has changed----I am still MAJORLY impressed with Bugliosi's
book (s) and the man, in general. That said, I STILL FIND MUCH OF
VALUE IN OTHER AUTHOR'S WORKS, REGARDLESS OF DISAGREEMENTS ON CERTAIN
POINTS AND/ OR CONCLUSIONS (and, no, it's not always because I am *in*
said books LOL---I have many 5-star reviews for books that I am not
in!). On a related matter:
3) Let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater: just because, as
much as it still pains me to admit (I think it always will), Oswald
did it in DALLAS, that does not mean there weren't mortal threats to
JFK's life, possibly conspiratorial forces APART FROM OSWALD'S
KNOWLEDGE that were glad to see what they hoped to accomplish carried
out by a lone nut (as Bill Greer said [see the YouTube video], perhaps
there was a conspiracy in another part of the country, despite
Oswald's sole act, independent of that conspiracy), there were/ are
many unanswered questions, and, as Posner and even Bugliosi admit, the
case isn't, nor will it ever be, closed (my only regret in my book
blurb is the "get a life" segment: that is cutting) [it is not illegal
or immoral to still look at the case: i.e. just because John Wilkes
Booth killed Lincoln does not mean that the Lincoln assassination is a
meaningless, closed matter...I mean, *you* post here, don't you???];
4) I am not innocent on this score, but why do we all have to be
enemies, like the civil war (lone nutters vs. CTers)?????? We are all
obviously fascinated with JFK's life and death, REGARDLESS OF OUR TAKE
ON HIS LIFE AND DEATH...let's all try to live together
Vince "the fence straddler" Palamara :)
On Jun 17, 10:04 pm, David Von Pein <davevonp...@aol.com> wrote:
> www.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/browse_thread/thread/131af532...
>
> Vincent Palamara doesn't seem to know which side of the fence he's on.
>
> Many months after fully endorsing Vincent Bugliosi's lone-assassin
> book, "Reclaiming History", we're treated to this strange 5-Star
> review written by Mr. Palamara for Jim Douglass' conspiracy-flavored
> book:
>
> www.amazon.com/review/R1SCRUKKJ2YSKQ
>
> It's perfectly fine to ride the JFK fence forever -- Jerry Dealey at
> JFKLancer.com does that very nicely, in fact. And I've enjoyed talking
> with Jerry on several occasions in the past.
>
> But Vince Palamara seems to be in a different category. And to be
> perfectly honest, I'm not entirely sure WHAT category of "JFK
> researcher" Mr. Palamara currently resides in. But he seems to be
> trying his darndest to play the entire field and to have it both ways.
> By reading some of his reviews for both anti-CT and pro-CT material,
> it would appear that Mr. Palamara believes in a unique "No Conspiracy
> Conspiracy" with respect to the death of John F. Kennedy.
>
> ~shrug~
>
> To quote Mr. Palamara directly, he claims that Vincent Bugliosi's book
> "is a devastating knock-out blow to those who, like me, once believed
> there was a conspiracy in the death of JFK. .... It is time to get a
> life, America: Oswald did indeed kill Kennedy, acting alone. Vince
> Bugliosi has done what I once thought was the impossible: he has
> convinced me of this notion".
>
> www.ReclaimingHistory.com/?page_id=8
>
> And yet, months later, Vince P. continues to write positive reviews
> for pro-conspiracy publications (probably because Mr. Palamara's name
> is in the index of most or all of these conspiracy-favoring books).
>
> Strange behavior, IMO. But, YMMV.
>
> LINKS TO JFK ASSASSINATION COVERAGE (RADIO & TV):www.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/99818ff90f77fc43www.box.net/static/flash/box_explorer.swf?widgetHash=7x7co2jkkg
>
> --------------
>
> FOOTNOTE:
>
> I recently sent Vincent Bugliosi's secretary (Rosemary Newton) the
> following e-mail, mainly to highlight a matter concerning David
> Mantik's review for Bugliosi's JFK book. Rosemary, as she has done
> previously with e-mails I've sent her, faxed the mail to Mr. Bugliosi.
> "I know he'll be interested," Rosemary told me via a follow-up e-mail
> message. .....
>
> ====================================
>
> Subj: Reclaiming History Website
> Date: 6/12/2008
> To: Rosemary Newton
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
> Hi again Rosemary,
>
> A thought just jumped into my cranium that I had previously wanted to
> mention to you and Vince Bugliosi, but I forgot to tell you in my
> other mails:
>
> I know this is none of my business at all, but IMO somebody should
> consider removing the David Mantik review snippet that is currently on
> the ReclaimingHistory.com website. And that's because Mantik does NOT
> endorse VB's "RH" book--at all.
>
> In fact, Mantik hates the book for the most part and rips it (and
> Vince) to shreds--or attempts to--in his full review [linked below].
>
> www.assassinationresearch.com/v5n1/v5n1mantik.pdf
>
> I'm actually kind of embarrassed for Vince when I see those two brief
> review blurbs of Mantik's showing up online at the RH site, because
> they are also taken totally out of context. Mantik is actually bashing
> the book and its author--not praising it/him.
>
> And what's worse is that the same out-of-context blurbs appear in VB's
> "Four Days In November" paperback now too--which is absurd. I have a
> feeling that W.W. Norton put those blurbs in the "4 Days" book and on
> the RH site (and possibly without Vince B. even knowing what Mantik's
> FULL opinion was of "Reclaiming History").
>
> Anyway, I just thought I'd point this out....because apparently nobody
> has seemed to notice that a person who actually has a severely
> negative opinion about "RH" (David Mantik) is showing up with
> seemingly-glowing remarks about it on the RH site.
>
> But if you'll read Mantik's entire review, you'll see I'm 100% right,
> and that Mantik's "It is a masterpiece" remark is really NOT a
> compliment at all. Because the next words out of Mantik's mouth after
> "masterpiece" are "—a truly brilliant prosecutorial brief".
>
> And we both know that Vince does not intend for his Magnum Opus to be
> looked upon as only a "prosecutorial brief".
>
> Also:
>
> I doubt that Mr. Bugliosi knows about this following hunk of info
> either (regarding Vince Palamara, who recently switched from being a
> conspiracy-lover to a lone-assassin believer--or so he says--and who
> has a review posted at the RH website and in the book "4 Days" as
> well):
>
> Months after going on record as having said that VB's JFK book
> completely changed his mind about a conspiracy in Kennedy's murder,
> Mr. Palamara continues to write 5-Star reviews for pro-conspiracy
> books. The latest example being his 5-Star Amazon review for Jim
> Douglass' latest piece of pro-conspiracy fiction.
>
> Mr. Palamara, to put it bluntly, has a huge ego to feed...and, in my
> own opinion, he saw a perfect opportunity to do so by embracing VB's
> "Reclaiming History".
>
> Palamara loves to see his name in print. I fear he doesn't really know
> what side of the JFK fence he's really on. As long as his ego is fed,
> he's happy. That's sad, but I think it's true. And just one look at
> his Amazon reviews will tend to bear me out on that. Or by watching
> this YouTube video by Mr. Palamara [linked below], which is filled
> with non-stop self-promotion.
>
> http://youtube.com/watch?v=Zm842SWubNw
>
> As I said, these matters are really none of my business...and Vince
> Bugliosi (and you) have every right to tell me to go jump in the
> lake....but I really wanted Vince B. to know about these things (which
> I truly don't think he's aware of at all) -- especially the Mantik
> review blurbs, which, as mentioned, are just flat-out embarrassing
> after reading Mantik's WHOLE review.
>
> It makes it look as if the publisher (Norton) is so desperate for ANY
> kind of praise from the pro-conspiracy crowd that they are willing to
> bend the context of Mantik's words to suit their own pro-RH purposes.
> And that's not a good thing at all, in my view.
>
> Regards,
> David Von Pein
>
> ====================================
SecretServiceguy
should LOL :)
Vince dfjlvdjklverbvjkvvuivjkbjkw Palamara ;-)
> > LINKS TO JFK ASSASSINATION COVERAGE (RADIO & TV):www.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/99818ff90f77fc43www.box.n...
> > ====================================- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
aeffects
let me be blunt and to the point, Vince... The Lone Nuts need, NEED
this debate much more than CT's, those CT's that have been looking
into the WCR, volumes, evidence, testimony, exhibits for quite a bit
longer than even you, Vince.
If the CT's who are currently posting to this USENET board vanished
overnight, Lone Nuts on this board and .john's would create CT cyber-
types in order to fulfill their addiction and/or penance. We've known
that for what seems like forever, you apparently don't.
Bugliosi's Reclaiming History is nothing more than a overhauled WCR.
Only THIS time with the typical Lone Nut *pithy* attitude filled chock
full of whining and envy...
Good luck man...If we see your name on upcoming daBug-HBO subject
related programming, none will be surprised...
Also, I spoke to Rich (regarding our email[s]) at www.JFKResearch.com
a few weeks back, he suggested you simply sign up and he'll get you on
that board immediately for a few topic related questions
Thanks
DHealy
> > LINKS TO JFK ASSASSINATION COVERAGE (RADIO & TV):www.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/99818ff90f77fc43www.box.n...
robcap...@netscape.com
When you interviewed Marty Underwood in 1991 and he told you of a
foreknowledge regarding the murder in Dallas by the CIA, FBI and the
Mafia due to his contact with Win Scott, you never once concluded
(until recently) maybe they were wrong? I mean, LHO beat some powerful
forces to the punch, and this didn't make you suspicioius how he
achieved this feat until now? What about all the rumors Underwood was
hearing, where they about a "lone nut" or what?
> > LINKS TO JFK ASSASSINATION COVERAGE (RADIO & TV):www.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/99818ff90f77fc43www.box.n...
David Von Pein
To Vince Palamara,
Thank you for your thoughtful reply of June 18, 2008.
================================================
www.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/66ceef57607ad041
www.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/browse_thread/thread/ba770b29f3f0c58c
================================================
VINCE PALAMARA SAID:
>>> "I DO have an ego (so what? Millions do...and don't tell me the great Mr. Bugliosi, who I majorly respect, does not; LOL)." <<<
DAVID VON PEIN NOW SAYS:
LOL indeed, Vince P.
Good point. And a point well taken.
I, in fact, have even pointed that out in some posts about Mr.
Bugliosi that I've written on the Internet:
"Yes, Vince [Bugliosi] has a decent-sized ego. I readily admit
that. I think he does indeed. But I also think that that ego is a
DESERVED ONE. He's EARNED the right to have that ego re. certain books
he has had published." -- DVP; 06/03/2007
www.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/70cb3f7da25853ab
Mr. Palamara, like everyone else, has a right to his own opinions, and
he has a right to post any kind of reviews he chooses to post at
Amazon.com, or here, or wherever. It's a free country and the
Internet, as Vince P. pointed out, is a great tool with which to get a
particular point across (and for free).
But when I see Mr. Palamara posting comments like the one quoted
below, it just makes me wonder what Mr. Palamara's current beliefs
truly are with respect to many of the specific issues brought up in
Vincent Bugliosi's mega-tome on the JFK assassination ("Reclaiming
History"), including the Single-Bullet Theory?
The quote below is currently attached to one of Vince Palamara's June
2008 YouTube videos, which means this was posted by Vince P. MANY
MONTHS after he had already gone on record as fully supporting and
endorsing Mr. Bugliosi's book; which, in effect, also means he had
gone on record, by necessity, as fully supporting and endorsing THE
SINGLE-BULLET THEORY.
Mr. Palamara says this in the area at YouTube.com reserved for a
video's description:
"This ultra-rare classic from the vast Vince Palamara archives
(trust me, it's humongous!) finds Dr. Robert Shaw, Governor John
Connally's chief surgeon, in a Parkland Hospital press conference
(WFAA/ ABC tv), telling the amassed news media (and millions in tv
land) that "the bullet is in the leg: it hasn't been removed...it will
be removed...left thigh...before he goes to the recovery room [note
the time
sequence!]" ...what?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
Single Bullet Theory..." -- Vince Palamara; 06/17/2008
http://youtube.com/watch?v=7OyI0P6WYIY
Now, to anyone viewing that video of Dr. Shaw (which is a rarely-seen
clip, I'll admit....thankfully, I too have it in my own WFAA VHS video
archives as well), and to anyone also reading Mr. Palamara's
descriptive blurb he provides to accompany the video at the above
webpage, it would certainly seem that Vince P. is hinting that the SBT
is quite possibly just what most long-time conspiracy theorists think
it is -- a theory which is untrue and has no basis in FACT.
But if Vince Palamara were to have added a few more words to his
descriptive passage there at YouTube, he could have explained that Dr.
Robert Shaw was one of only THREE different doctors who were
responsible for treating injured Texas Governor John Connally at
Parkland Hospital.
Dr. Shaw, in point of fact, was in charge of caring for Connally's
chest wounds, not the wounds the Governor sustained to his wrist or
thigh. Dr. Charles Gregory and Dr. Tom Shires were the Parkland
physicians who treated Connally's wrist and thigh wounds,
respectively. Not Shaw.
And Vince P. could have added the following quote from Dr. Gregory
with respect to any bullet being lodged in Governor Connally's thigh:
DR. GREGORY -- "I think again that bullet, Exhibit 399, could very
well have struck the thigh in a reverse fashion and have shed a bit of
its lead core into the fascia immediately beneath the skin, yet never
have penetrated the thigh sufficiently so that it eventually was
dislodged and was found in the clothing.
I would like to add to that we were disconcerted by not finding a
missile at all. Here was our patient with three discernible wounds,
and no missile within him of sufficient magnitude to account for them,
and we suggested that someone ought to search his belongings and other
areas where he had been to see if it could be identified or found,
rather."
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/gregory1.htm
In addition, Mr. Palamara might have also wanted to mention the
following comments made to the Warren Commission by Dr. George Thomas
Shires, who was in charge of treating Connally's leg/thigh injury:
DR. SHIRES -- "The X-rays of the left leg showed only a very small 1-
millimeter bullet fragment imbedded in the femur of the left leg. ....
So, it appeared, therefore, that the skin wound was either a
tangential wound or that a larger fragment had penetrated or stopped
in the skin and had subsequently fallen out of the entrance wound."
ARLEN SPECTER -- "What size fragment was there in the Governor's leg
at that time?"
DR. SHIRES -- "We recovered none. The small one that was seen was on X-
ray and it was still in the femur and being that small, with no tissue
damage after the debridement, it was thought inadvisable to remove
this small fragment."
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/shires.htm
Yes, Dr. Shaw DID, indeed, think that a bullet was probably still
lodged in John Connally's left thigh at the time of his Parkland press
conference on the afternoon of November 22, 1963.
But he would discover very soon afterward that NO SUCH BULLET EXISTED
in the Governor's body at all. The bullet fell out of the wound
instead of becoming lodged in the leg. And Dr. Shaw NEVER SAW ANY
BULLET in the thigh of Governor Connally. And Shaw's WC testimony
bears out that fact:
ARLEN SPECTER -- "Dr. Shaw, what wounds, if any, did the Governor
sustain on his left thigh?"
DR. SHAW -- "He sustained a small puncture-type wound on the medial
aspect of the left thigh."
MR. SPECTER -- "Did you have an opportunity to examine that closely?"
DR. SHAW -- "No."
MR. SPECTER -- "Did you have an opportunity to examine it sufficiently
to ascertain its location on the left thigh?"
DR. SHAW -- "No, I didn't examine it that closely, except for its
general location. .... I didn't examine the wound of the thigh so I
can't testify as to that. Dr. Gregory, I think, was there at the time
that the debris was carried out and he may have more knowledge than I
have." ....
MR. SPECTER -- "Now, as to the wound on the thigh, could that bullet
have gone into the Governor's thigh without causing any more damage
than appears on the face of that bullet [CE399]?"
DR. SHAW -- "If it was a spent bullet, yes. As far as the bullet is
concerned, it could have caused the Governor's thigh wound as a spent
missile."
MR. SPECTER -- "Why do you say it is a spent missile, would you
elaborate on what your thinking is on that issue?"
DR. SHAW -- "Only from what I have been told by Dr. Shires and Dr.
Gregory, that the depth of the wound was only into the subcutaneous
tissue, not actually into the muscle of the leg, so it meant that
missile had penetrated for a very short period. Am I quoting you
correctly, Dr. Gregory?"
MR. SPECTER -- "May the record show Dr. Gregory is present during this
testimony..."
DR. GREGORY -- "I will say yes."
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/shaw1.htm
Does Vince Palamara want people watching his YouTube video to get the
impression that Vince P. does NOT believe that the Single-Bullet
Theory is an ironclad FACT? (And virtually all "LNers" who endorse Mr.
Bugliosi's book, like Vince P., certainly are of the opinion that the
SBT is, indeed, an ironclad fact. Right? I am definitely of that
opinion.)
=================
Baseball Addendum:
Hey Vince P.,
Since you are a big Pittsburgh sports fan, I wonder if you have an
archived video copy of portions of Game 5 of the 1972 baseball
playoffs (the NLCS) between your Pirates and my Cincinnati Reds?
(That's probably a silly question, since your Bucs lost that series in
five games. You probably hate that year's NLCS with a passion. But
Game 5 was a classic finale anyway.)
"Back goes Clemente! At the fence!! She's gone!!!" -- Al Michaels;
10/11/1972
muc...@gmail.com
It's never too late for a man with your qualifications to jump on the
gravy train, Healy. You've been cheerleading for *Lady in Yellow
Pants* theorist Ben Holmes at acjfk for how long now?
aeffects
sitdown Munchless.... when you achive speaking status around here one
will ponder(not long) your idiotic statements... Till then, do work on
that hairdo....
> ...
>
> read more »
SecretServiceguy
>
> HeyVinceP.,
>
> Since you are a big Pittsburgh sports fan, I wonder if you have an
> archived video copy of portions of Game 5 of the 1972 baseball
> playoffs (the NLCS) between your Pirates and my Cincinnati Reds?
> (That's probably a silly question, since your Bucs lost that series in
> five games. You probably hate that year's NLCS with a passion. But
> Game 5 was a classic finale anyway.)
>
> "Back goes Clemente! At the fence!! She's gone!!!" -- Al Michaels;
> 10/11/1972
>
> www.JohnnyBench.com
I wish i did...why, do you? :)
That game was amazing: Clemente's final game, the bitter ending to
arguably the greatest Pirates team ever (even though they won the
World Series the previous year, many pundits agree that the '72 team
was slightly better)...and Bob Moose, who threw the bizarre wild
pitch, would meet his end on his 29th birthday, 10/9/76, in Martin's
Ferry, Ohio, in a car with 2 women who weren't his wives (they
survived)...the very next day, Joe Turkey Jones of the Cleveland
Browns pile-drove Steelers QB Terry Bradshaw into the ground,
handicapping arguably the greatest STEELERS team ever: the 1976
Steelers (even though they didn't win the SB that year, again, many
pundits fee this team was the best). So, to sum up: OHIO WAS A BAD
PLACE TO BE BETWEEN 1972-1976!!!!!!!!!!!! :)
P.S. I confess: the Shaw video description was a tease...it is
compelling, though
David Von Pein
www.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/736e67c593b9fe6e
>>> "I wish I did [have a video copy of the entire fifth and final game of the 1972 NLCS between the Cincinnati Reds and Pittsburgh Pirates at Cincy's two-year-old Riverfront Stadium on the banks of the O-hi-o]...why, do you?" <<<
No. The only portions of that '72 playoff game I have on video are the
Johnny Bench home run to lead off the ninth inning against your top
Pirates' reliever (Dave Giusti) and the Bob Moose wild pitch a few
minutes later, which allowed Reds' pinch-runner George Foster (running
for the slow-footed Tony Perez) to score the pennant-clinching run
from third base (as pinch-hitter Hal McRae leaped up and down
hysterically at home plate).
Those two NBC-TV video clips, with Curt Gowdy at the mike for NBC, can
be found at the beginning of the official 1972 World Series film:
www.amazon.com/1972-WORLD-SERIES/review/RQGYE4NGVUN3E
And Al Michaels' chilling radio description of Johnny Bench's dramatic
Game-Five home run can be heard whenever the following webpage is
refreshed:
>>> "That game [G.5 of the '72 N.L. Playoffs] was amazing: Clemente's final game, the bitter ending to arguably the greatest Pirates team ever (even though they won the World Series the previous year, many pundits agree that the '72 team was slightly better)...and Bob Moose, who threw the bizarre wild pitch, would meet his end on his 29th birthday, 10/9/76, in Martin's Ferry, Ohio, in a car with 2 women who weren't his wives (they survived)...the very next day, Joe Turkey Jones of the Cleveland Browns pile-drove Steelers QB Terry Bradshaw into the ground, handicapping arguably the greatest STEELERS team ever: the 1976 Steelers (even though they didn't win the SB that year, again, many pundits fee this team was the best)." <<<
Wow. That was quite a mini-lesson into Pittsburgh sports history.
Thanks. <grin>
Would you like to now hear a little about some Cincinnati Reds'
history? An interesting baseball franchise indeed:
www.amazon.com/DAY-BY-DAY-IN-REDS-HISTORY/review/R28A35GZAV84MT
www.amazon.com/THE-RELENTLESS-REDS/review/RTTRAVFVFEVQG
>>> "So, to sum up: OHIO WAS A BAD PLACE TO BE BETWEEN 1972-1976!!!!!!" <<<
Not for me, brother! It was a great place to be from '72 to
'76....particularly in 1975 and 1976, when Sparky Anderson's "Big Red
Machine" won back-to-back World Series titles.
And in '75, the Redlegs swept Vince Palamara's Bucs in three straight
NLCS games to get to the World Series. (Sorry, Vince. That was cruel
of me to rub that salt in your festering Pirates' wound. But you can
always come back and boast about how your Pirates blasted my Reds out
of the water by sweeping them in 3 straight in the 1979 Playoffs, en
route to the Bucs' "We Are Family" World Series win over
Baltimore.) :)
After sweeping Pittsburgh in the '75 NLCS, the Reds and Red Sox, of
course, engaged in a 7-game battle for the 1975 world
championship....which is a World Series that is still regarded by many
sports fans today to be THE greatest Series ever played.
More '75 Series Talk:
www.hometheaterforum.com/htf/showpost.php?p=2888297
www.amazon.com/gp/customer-media/product-gallery/B0009PLM6W/ref=cm_ciu_pdp_images_all
www.amazon.com/1975-WORLD-SERIES/review/R3AA0Q4J7OEFWG
Good talking baseball with you, Vince.
BTW, the 1979 World Series Collector's Edition 7-Disc DVD set is a
good collection to pick up too. (But you probably have that one
already I'm sure.)
www.amazon.com/1979-WORLD-SERIES-DVD/dp/B000CRR3CY