Can Anyone Name One Post , Idea or Video Gil Jesus Hasn't Ripped Off From Someone Else ?
cdddraftsman
tomnln
Your AIDS Test came back POSITIVE.
Move out from lowery's.
(they were NOT hemmoroids,,,they are SPEED BUMPS)
"cdddraftsman" <cdddra...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1184213412....@o61g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> Just Curious ?
>
MSwanberg
> Just Curious ?
Isn't it common philosophy that EVERY idea is a ripoff of someone
else?
The real question is does it make it invalid? If so, then how about I
tell other people the things you've said. Would that then invalidate
your ideas?
I, for one, am glad that Gil rips off others. I would certainly
rather hear, for example, Craig's ideas from his own mouth than to,
say, hear what Gil (or anyone else) said he said.
(I don't mean to speak for you, Gil... I hope you don't mind)
Thanks,
-Mike
Gil Jesus
> Just Curious ?
How about the idea that you're an asshole. I'm sure that I'm not the
only one who believes THAT.
Gil Jesus
Not at all. Everyone's entitled to their opinion. If I were to agree
with someone else's opinion and go to great lengths that even they
wouldn't go to defend it, does that mean I'm "ripping them off "?
Absoultely not.
You have to understand the nature of the beast here. The trolls (of
which cdddraftsman is one) are not here for any GOOD purpose.
They're here to disrupt and insult. Period.
When I first mentioned that I believed that JFK was trying to cough up
a bullet, the trolls said, prove it. So I went out and did not one
video, but three videos on the subject. They were in hysterics. How
could a throat stop a rifle bullet, they asked.
I never said that the shot in the throat was caused by a rifle bullet.
They did.
Then my research revealed that not only had there been instances of
people being shot in the throat (even at point blank range) and the
bullet did not exit, but at least once when a bullet was lodged in the
throat of a victim and he coughed it up at later time.
If someone presented someone else's finding and represented it as
their own (as Posner did with the movement of Rosemary Willis in
Zapruder ) then I would say yeah they ripped it off.
But I don't believe that I've EVER said that the concept of JFK
coughing up a bullet was my idea alone, nor did I say that I was the
first one who ever thought of it. I'm sure that a lot of my opinions
and positions on aspects of this case are shared by others. Does that
mean that I must remain silent on those aspects or be considered as
stealing those ideas ? It's foolishness of course.
Then again, consider the source (cdddraftsman).
It has been demonstrated by me that a bullet lodged in the throat is
at least POSSIBLE and coughing it up has OCCURRED in the past. The
trolls can no longer blow it off as ridiculous and maintain any
credibility.
As a result, all they have left is to attack me personally on the
subject, accusing me of being conceited or a thief. They can't debate
the message, so they go after the messenger, using any means at their
disposal to ellicit a response for me.
That's why they're called "trolls" as in trolling one's line for fish.
They troll their postings out there and hope to "hook" someone on it.
When they want to hook someone in particular, they'll post that
person's name in the subject line.
Since clowns like this (cdddraftsman) are irrelevant in this
newsgroup, so are their postings.
Ben Holmes
says...
Among Jewish scholars, there's the concept of being like a water vessel that
loses not a drop. They take a great deal of pride in being able to *exactly*
express the ideas they were taught.
When it comes to the JFK assassination - this isifar better than coming up with
speculative "common sense & logic" theories - something quite frequent in the
LNT community.
Keep 'em coming, Gil!
cdddraftsman
I'm glad you brought that up Mike , good post . Please do repeat and
you have my permission to quote anything I've said , for one line of
what I've said is worth Gil's Judas's entire stay here at acj ! :
On to Roger Craig and Gil's Judas's propensity to post only the most
outlandish and preposterous gibberish from JFK Conspiracy wacko's and
fellow kook's :
Roger Craig : http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/craig.htm
who testified to seeing Oswald flee the scene in a Rambler station
wagon with an accomplice, to seeing a Mauser recovered in the sixth
floor of the Depository, and to have witnessed a confrontation in
Dallas Policy headquarters that implicated Ruth Paine in the
assassination :
Dallas County Sheriff's Deputy Roger Craig had quite a lot of
interesting stories to tell. And in good storyteller fashion, his
stories got better over time.
Craig was one of the conspiracy witnesses that the Warren Commission
called to testify. He was given featured treatment in early conspiracy
works such as Mark Lane's Rush to Judgment. More recently, his
testimony is treated as credible in most conspiracy books. You can see
him in the video "Two Men in Dallas."
RC : Saw .45 slug in Dealey Plaza - with piece of Kennedy's head
Fact : Absolutely zero supporting evidence. Claim contradicts his own
Warren
Commission testimony, and the testimony of everyone else in
the area.
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/craig.htm#notseen
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/slug.htm
RC : Saw three hulls in Sniper's Nest - lined up an inch apart, all
pointing in the
same direction. Click here for illustration from video "Two
Men in Dallas"
Fact : Flatly contradicted by officers who discovered Sniper's Nest.
Hulls were
photographed in place, and Deputy Luke Mooney marked
photograph
showing their locations : http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/hulls.jpg
Evaluation : The assassins had just got done blowing JFK's
brains all over
Dealey Plaza , but they didn't want to leave a mess in the
snipers nest !
Judas should give gack the 30 pieces of silver , he certainly
hasn't earned
it by mentioning Roger ' The Dodger ' Craig !
RC : Saw inscription "7.65 Mauser" on recovered rifle
Fact : Contradicted by testimony of all officers present - newsfilm at
scene shot
by Tom Alyea shows rifle to be Mannlicher-Carcano. Here is
one frame from
his 16 mm. film, and here is another. In 1968, Craig gave a
contradictory
account : http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/day1.jpg
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/day2.jpg
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/craig.htm#mauser
RC : Confronted Oswald in Fritz' office - Oswald said Rambler was
Mrs. Paine's
station wagon
Fact : Contradicted by officers present in Fritz' office. Dallas
Police documents
show that Mrs. Paine's station wagon was a Chevrolet :
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/wagon1.gif
The Station Wagon that Changed Color
The following is from David Perry's essay, "The Rambler Man."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
It was one thing for Mrs. Paine to own a station wagon with a luggage
rack but was the vehicle a Nash Rambler? Was it green? Why did Buddy
Walthers bring the subject up? Why was Craig not positive but only
believed someone went by the house? Who was the "they" that went to
the Paine home to check on the car?
Craig's autobiographical declaration that "Mrs. Ruth Paine, the woman
Marina Oswald lived with in Irving, Texas, owned a Rambler station
wagon, at that time, of this same color." was on the verge of
collapse. What is more important, Fritz challenged not only Craig's
story but his credibility as well. . . .
What about the color of the station wagon? Craig made it a point to
claim his testimony was changed with respect to the color of the car.
"I said the Rambler station wagon was light green. The Warren
Commission: Changed [it] to a white station wagon . . ."
Curious, I went back to Craig's deposition of November 25, 1963. I
concluded the Warren Commission could alter the testimony but would
have to go to extreme lengths to change a document obtained three days
after the assassination. FBI Special Agent Benjamin O. Keutzer took
Craig's statement. It appears in Commission Exhibit No. 1993, [CE
1993].
"He stated he also noticed an automobile traveling west on Elm, which
he feels was a white Nash Rambler station wagon with a luggage rack on
top."
This seemed to confirm that Craig originally thought the car was
white. I still couldn't understand why color was so important. Why was
it necessary for the station wagon to be green rather than white? A
little more research resolved the issue. In Warren Commission Volume
II, pg. 506, [2H506] the following exchange takes place.
Mr. Jenner: "Describe your automobile, will you please?"
Mrs. Paine: "It is a 1955 Chevrolet station wagon, green, needing
paint, which we bought secondhand. It is in my name."
I thought I was seeing things! Ruth Paine owned a green Chevrolet not
a Nash Rambler?
. . . One can almost picture Roger Craig, trying to stir the
assassination conspiracy pot. Failing to verify facts, depending upon
memories inactive for four years, assuming "they" whoever "they" were
checked the automobile at the Paine house, relying on Buddy Walthers
spotty remarks, accusing the Warren Commission of altering testimony
so the color of the vehicles matched . . . . To what purpose? To
implicate Ruth Paine in the plot? If not, why the great charade?
The Bullet Not Seen
The following is from the Warren Commission testimony of Craig:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mr. CRAIG. Well, I looked around for a little bit, you know, just
observing the people and things. . . . And then it was either Lemmy
Lewis or Buddy Walthers-(spelling) W-a-l-t-h-e-r-s, one of our other
criminal investigators, said that one of the bullets had ricocheted
off the south curb of Elm Street. So, Officer Lewis and I crossed-
walked down the hill and crossed Elm Street to look for the place
where the bullet might have hit.
Mr. BELIN. Did he say why he believed one of the bullets ricocheted
off the south curb of Elm?
Mr. CRAIG. No; he just said that someone said that one of them had. So
we checked it.
Mr. BELIN. So, you searched the south curb of Elm?
Mr. CRAIG. Right.
Mr. BELIN. Did you find anything there to indicate the ricocheted
bullet?
Mr. CRAIG. No; we didn't find anything at that time. (6H265)
So Craig originally said he saw no bullet near the south curb of Elm
Street. But by the 1970s (when he recorded the interview found in "Two
Men in Dallas") he was giving a vivid description of the discovery of
the supposed .45 slug.
The "Mauser"
Early reports said the rifle recovered on the 6th floor of the
Depository was a Mauser, but this was quickly corrected when the
Dallas police had sufficient time to examine the rifle. Craig's early
account, as given to the Los Angeles Free Press (March 1968), provides
an interesting variation on the "Mauser" story. In the following, "FP"
is "Free Press," "RC" is "Roger Craig," and "PJ" is conspiracist
newspaperman "Penn Jones."
FP: Did you handle that rifle?
RC: Yes, I did. I couldn't give its name because I don't know foreign
rifles, I know it was foreign made, and you loaded it downward into a
built-in clip. The ID man took it and ejected one live round from it.
The scope was facing north, the bolt facing upwards and the trigger
south.
But there was another rifle, a Mauser, found up on the roof of the
depository that afternoon.
FP: A Mauser on the roof? Who found it?
PJ: I don't know who found it, but I do know that a police officer
verified its existence.
In later years, however, Craig's account changed and he adopted the
orthodox conspiracy version that has the Mauser found on the 6th
floor. In his memoir When They Kill a President Craig claims:
Lt. Day inspected the rifle briefly, then handed it to Capt. Fritz who
had a puzzled look on his face. Seymour Weitzman, a deputy constable,
was standing beside me at the time. Weitzman was an expert on weapons.
He had been in the sporting goods business for many years and was
familiar with all domestic and foreign weapons. Capt. Fritz asked if
anyone knew what kind of rifle it was. Weitzman asked to see it. After
a close examination (much longer than Fritz or Day's examination)
Weitzman declared that it was a 7.65 German Mauser. Fritz agreed with
him. Apparently, someone at the Dallas Police Department also loses
things but, at least, they are more conscientious. They did replace it
- even if the replacement was made in a different country. (See Warren
Report for Italian Mannlicher-Carcano 6.5 Caliber).
It now seems that the Mauser on the roof, which Craig didn't claim to
have seen, has become the Mauser on the 6th floor. A few years later,
when he was interviewed for "Two Men in Dallas," Craig claimed to have
viewed the rifle close-up and seen the notation "7.65 Mauser."
Tippit Shot by 1:06?
The time of the Tippit shooting is an important issue, since the
Warren Commission placed it at about 1:15 p.m. If Tippit was shot
substantially earlier than this, it could not have been Lee Oswald who
did it, since Oswald would not have had time to walk from his rooming
house at 1026 North Beckley to the corner of 10th and Patton where the
shooting happened.
In When They Kill a President Craig claims that Tippit had to have
been shot before 1:06.
At that exact moment [of the discovery of the rifle] an unknown Dallas
police officer came running up the stairs and advised Capt. Fritz that
a Dallas policeman had been shot in the Oak Cliff area. I
instinctively looked at my watch. The time was 1:06 p.m. A token force
of uniformed officers was left to keep the sixth floor secure and
Fritz, Day, Boone, Mooney, Weitzman and I left the building.
The first problem with this is that the rifle was in fact discovered
about 1:22 p.m. (7H109). Yet Craig describes the officer announcing
the death of Tippit after the discovery of the rifle.
But another problem is the fact that this "1:06 p.m." account seems to
be a late addition to his story. In the March 1968 Los Angeles Free
Press is an interview with Craig and Penn Jones:
http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Senate/5439/Craig_and_Jones_10.html
RC: Tippit went to Oak Cliff, and subsequently was killed. Why he went
to Oak Cliff I can't tell you; I can only make an observation. He was
going to meet somebody.
FP: Do you know what time he was killed?
RC: It was about 1:40 -
PJ: No, I think it was a little before 1:15.
RC: Was it?
PJ: Yes, Bill Alexander -
RC: Oh, that's right. The broadcast was put out shortly after 1:15 on
Tippit's killer, and it had not been put out yet on Oswald as the
assassin of President Kennedy.
So Craig, rather than saying that he knew that Tippit had been killed
before 1:06, estimates it was at 1:40 - and then accepts Penn Jones'
correction that it was "a little before 1:15."
You might want to read Craig's unpublished biography, When They Kill a
President :
http://www.ratical.org/ratville/JFK/WTKaP.html
It details his claims of Warren Commission distortion of his
testimony, his firing from the Dallas County Sheriff's office, and the
Garrison investigation.
A Mysterious Death?
Given the "interesting" stories that Roger Craig was telling, it might
seem quite logical that a conspiracy would want to silence him. So
Craig's death at age 39 in 1975 by suicide (conspiracy books usually
put quotes around "suicide") might seem suspicious. But do the details
of his death actually seem suspicious? :
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/craig_death.htm
justm...@gmail.com
>
> read more ยป- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
The trolls (of
which cdddraftsman is one) are not here for any GOOD purpose.
They're here to disrupt and insult. Period.
And we do a fantastic job of it too....Cough Cough....there goes
another bullet!
Gil Jesus
While we're on the subject of questioning the credibility of sources,
let's take a look at yours, McAdams:
Then we can discuss how:
Craig wasn't the only one who identified the rifle as a Mauser.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybvfnZ3vDYw
Craig wasn't the only one who saw the .45 slug on the south side of
Elm.
Buddy Walthers picked it up and later showed it to Al Maddox.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbvpCGQP3oo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7MXX72_g28
Craig never mentioned in Fritz's office that the car was a Rambler.
And it was OSWALD who called the car a station wagon, not Craig.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Myi5aifMFzs