Oswald line up.
Maggsy
arguing with officers before the line up and the eyewitnesses could
hear him.Scoggins and other witnesses couldn't fail to id Oswald.
sirs...@fast.net
You think the reason they conduct line-ups is to point out the guy
with a black eye?
Maggsy
No I'm not sying that at all, but it's abit of a give away when one
has a black eye.
dreitzes@aol.com (Dave Reitzes)
For the sake of argument, let's say that none of the eyewitness
testimony means a thing.
Do you think it makes a difference that Oswald's rifle, to the
exclusion of all other weapons in the world, was linked by verifiable
ballistic markings to the shooting of the President; and that Oswald's
revolver, to the exclusion of all other weapons in the world, was
linked by verifiable ballistic markings to the murder of Officer J. D.
Tippit?
Dave
Gil Jesus
<dreit...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> Do you think it makes a difference .............that Oswald's
> revolver, to the exclusion of all other weapons in the world, was
> linked by verifiable ballistic markings to the murder of Officer J. D.
> Tippit?
>
> Dave
>
> http://www.jfk-online.com
WHERE DID YOU GET THAT ONE FROM ?
Mr. RHYNE. And with respect to the bullets that were found in the body
of Officer Tippit, you testified that you could not be positive that
they were fired by this weapon, Exhibit 143.
Mr. CUNNINGHAM. I could not identify those bullets as having been
fired from that gun
( 3 H 482 )
Gil Jesus
WERE THE POLICE LINEUPS CONDCUTED FAIRLY ?
sirs...@fast.net
Give away what? The witnesses are the there to pick out the person
they saw, whether they are yelling or quiet, marked or unmarked.
Gil Jesus
>
> � Give away what? The witnesses are the there to pick out the person
> they saw, whether they are yelling or quiet, marked or unmarked.
Gil Jesus
MORE WC TESTIMONY FOR REITZES
Mr. EISENBERG. Now, were you able to determine whether those bullets
have been fired in this weapon?
Mr. CUNNINGHAM. No; I was not.
Mr. EISENBERG. Can you explain why?
Mr. CUNNINGHAM. Yes, sir.
First of all, Commission Exhibit No. 602 was too mutilated. There were
not sufficient microscopic marks remaining on the surface of this
bullet, due to the mutilation, to determine whether or not it had been
fired from this weapon.
However, Commission Exhibits 603, 604, and 605 do bear microscopic
marks for comparison purposes, but IT WAS NOT POSSIBLE from an
examination and comparison of these bullets TO DETERMINE whether or
not they had been fired--these bullets themselves--had been fired from
one weapon, or WHETHER OR NOT THEY HAD BEEN FIRED FROM OSWALD'S
WEAPON..
Further, it was not possible, using .38 Special ammunition, to
determine whether or not consecutive test bullets obtained from this
revolver had been fired in this weapon.
( 3 H 475 )
David Von Pein
>>> "REITZES: 'TIPPIT BULLETS MATCHED OSWALD HANDGUN "TO THE EXCLUSION OF ALL OTHER WEAPONS'. " <<<
Learn to read, idiot.
Dave Reitzes did not claim that the BULLETS themselves were positively
linked to LHO's revolver (although, as we know and as all CTers must
ignore, Joe Nicol did say that 1 of the 4 bullets COULD, indeed, be
tied to LHO's gun "to the exclusion").
But what Dave R. said is:
"Oswald's revolver, to the exclusion of all other weapons in the
world, was linked by verifiable ballistic markings to the murder of
Officer J. D. Tippit?" -- DR
Where did Dave R. say anything about "BULLETS" specifically there?
Answer: He didn't.
Dave was referring (no doubt) to the 4 bullet shell casings that were
linked ("to the exclusion") to Oswald's gun.
Gil Jesus
>
> - Show quoted text -
EVEN MORE TESTIMONY FOR REITZES...THIS TIME FROM THE HSCA
Mr. EDGAR. Regarding CE-143, Oswald's revolver, do your test-fired
bullets match, microscopically, with CE-602, 603, 604, and 605?
Mr. LUTZ. Are these the bullets that were recovered from Officer
Tippit?
Mr. EDGAR. These were the bullets that were recovered from the body of
Officer Tippit.
Mr. LUTZ. Our microscopic examination and comparison of these bullets
FAILED TO POSITIVELY IDENTIFY THIS REVOLVER AS THE ONE THAT FIRED
THOSE BULLETS. We did find the class characteristics that were
present, the number of lands and grooves, the width of those lands and
grooves, to be the same. However, THE INDIVIDUAL CHARACTERISTICS WERE
NOT PRESENT IN SUFFICIENT QUANTITIES THAT WE COULD SAY THAT THAT
REVOLVER AND NO OTHER REVOLVER FIRED THEM.
( 1 HSCA 486 )
Which makes you a liar, Reitzes.
Gil Jesus
> >>> "REITZES: 'TIPPIT BULLETS MATCHED OSWALD HANDGUN "TO THE EXCLUSION OF ALL OTHER WEAPONS'. " <<<
>
> Learn to read, idiot.
> Dave was referring (no doubt) to the 4 bullet shell casings that were
> linked ("to the exclusion") to Oswald's gun.
Gee you sure get upset for someone who isn't Dave Reitzes.
And you sure know what he's talking about ( no doubt ) :-)
DID THE 4 CARTRIDGES KILL TIPPIT OR DID THE BULLETS ?
dreitzes@aol.com (Dave Reitzes)
>
> <dreit...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > Do you think it makes a difference .............that Oswald's
> > revolver, to the exclusion of all other weapons in the world, was
> > linked by verifiable ballistic markings to the murder of Officer J. D.
> > Tippit?
>
> > Dave
>
> >http://www.jfk-online.com
>
> WHERE DID YOU GET THAT ONE FROM ?
WCR, pp. 171-72:
http://www.archives.gov/research/jfk/warren-commission-report/chapter-4.html
<QUOTE ON>--------------------------------------
Murder Weapon
When Oswald was arrested, he had in his possession a Smith & Wesson 38
Special caliber revolver, serial number V510210. (See Commission
Exhibit No. 143, p. 170). Two of the arresting officers placed their
initials on the weapon and a third inscribed his name. All three
identified Exhibit No. 143 as the revolver taken from Oswald when he
was arrested.569 Four cartridge cases were found in the shrubbery on
the corner of 10th and Patton by three of the eyewitnesses--Domingo
Benavides, Barbara Jeanette Davis, and Virginia Davis.570 It was the
unanimous and unequivocal testimony of expert witnesses before the
Commission that these used cartridge cases were fired from the
revolver in Oswald's possession to the exclusion of all other weapons.
(See app. X, p. 559.)
Cortlandt Cunningham, of the Firearms Identification Unit of the FBI
Laboratory, testified that he compared the four empty cartridge cases
found near the scene of the shooting with a test cartridge fired from
the weapon in Oswald's possession when he was arrested. Cunningham
declared that this weapon fired the four cartridges to the exclusion
of all other weapons. Identification was effected through breech face
marks and firing pin marks.571 Robert A. Frazier and Charles Killion,
other FBI firearms experts, independently examined the four cartridge
cases and arrived at the same conclusion as Cunningham. 572 At the
request of the Commission, Joseph D. Nicol, superintendent of the
Illinois Bureau of Criminal Identification Investigation, also
examined the four cartridge cases found near the site of the homicide
and compared them with the test cartridge cases
Page 172
fired from the Smith & Wesson revolver taken from Oswald. He concluded
that all of these cartridges were fired from the same weapon.573
Cunningham compared four lead bullets recovered from the body of
Patrolman Tippit with test bullets fired from Oswald's revolver. 574
He explained that the bullets were slightly smaller than the barrel of
the pistol which had fired them. This caused the bullets to have an
erratic passage through the barrel and impressed upon the lead of the
bullets inconsistent individual characteristics which made
identification impossible. Consecutive bullets fired from the revolver
by the FBI experts could not be identified as having been fired from
that revolver.575 (See app. X, p. 559.) Cunningham testified that all
of the bullets were mutilated, one being useless for comparison
purposes. All four bullets were fired from a weapon with five lands
and grooves and a right twist 576 which were the rifling
characteristics of the revolver taken from Oswald. He concluded,
however, that he could not say whether the four bullets were fired
from the revolver in Oswald's possession.577 "The only thing I can
testify is they could have on the basis of the rifling
characteristics--they could have been." 578
Nicol differed with the FBI experts on one bullet taken from Tippit's
body. He declared that this bullet 579 was fired from the same weapon
that fired the test bullets to the exclusion of all other weapons. But
he agreed that because the other three bullets were mutilated, he
could not determine if they had been fired from the same weapon as the
test bullets.580
<QUOTE OFF>-------------------------------------
For more information, please see:
http://www.jfk-online.com/jfk100tippit.html
Dave
Gil Jesus
> Dave was referring (no doubt) to the 4 bullet shell casings that were
> linked ("to the exclusion") to Oswald's gun.
DEAR SHITFORBRAINS:
The cartridge cases that you claim as "evidence" were not received by
the FBI until November 30, 1963, eight days after the Tippit murder.
Of course, there's no room for substitution there.
Mr. EISENBERG. Now, I handed you earlier four cartridge cases in a
plastic envelope marked Q-74, Q-75, Q-76, and Q-77, also marked C47-
C50. Are you familiar with these cartridge cases?
Mr. CUNNINGHAM. I am. I have previously looked at them.
Mr. EISENBERG. Do they have your mark on them?
Mr. CUNNINGHAM. They do. Right on the side of each one, right there.
Mr. EISENBERG. When did you receive these cartridge cases?
Mr. CUNNINGHAM. These cartridge cases were received from the Dallas
office of the FBI on November 30, 1963.
( 3 H 465 )
robc...@netscape.com
You have MANY problems here Dave, and as a former CTer you are
familiar with them but I will recap them anyway.
Firstly, how do you prove LHO ordered AND received a 40" Carcano like
the one found in the TSBD after the shooting?
Secondly, when did the DPD, FBI and the WC prove the bullet fragments
and CE399 were ever INSIDE the victims?
Thirdly, when did the DPD, FBI and the WC ever prove LHO fired a rifle
on 11/22/63?
Fourthly, we have the same issue with the pistol, when did the DPD,
FBI and the WC prove LHO received the pistol?
Fifthly, how do YOU explain the FACT the DPD, FBI and WC could NOT
match the bullets taken FROM JDT's body to LHO's allegee pistol?
Sixthly, how do YOU explain the FACT the DPD, FBI and WC could NOT
match-up the bullets taken FROM JDT's body to the alleged shell
casings found in the street. I say alleged as NONE because there is
serious doubt to that any of the shell casings presented by the WC
were ACTUALLY the ones found after the shooting.
Finally, when did the DPD, FBI and WC prove LHO brought a 40" Carcano
to work on 11/22/63?
Please do NOT confuse claims with proof, okay?
dreitzes@aol.com (Dave Reitzes)
Whenever I've tried to engage Robcap in discussion, he's either called
me names or bailed out, so I would simply encourage lurkers to check
out the facts for themselves. The entire Warren Report and HSCA Final
Report are both online. Please see:
http://www.jfk-online.com/jfklinks.html
Dave
Walt
wrote:
> TOP POST
>
> Whenever I've tried to engage Robcap in discussion, he's either called
> me names or bailed out,
Yes, unfortunately that is Rob's way of debating......He's read too
many funnybooks and has his head full of nonsense.
HOWEVER....He occasionally does make raise valid points of contention
by asking questions like....
Secondly, when did the DPD, FBI and the WC prove the bullet fragments
and CE399 were ever INSIDE the victims?
Thirdly, when did the DPD, FBI and the WC ever prove LHO fired a rifle
(or any other gun) on 11/22/63?
Sixthly, how do YOU explain the FACT the DPD, FBI and WC could NOT
match-up the bullets taken FROM JDT's body to the alleged shell
casings found in the street.
I believe Rob wants to know if you can account for the fact that three
of the four bullets that hit Tippit were manufactured by Western
Cartridge Co. and one was manufactured by Remington Peters, while the
spents shells allegedly found at the scene were two Westren Cartridge
co. and two Remington Peters???
I say alleged as NONE because there is serious doubt to that any of
the shell casings presented by the WC
were ACTUALLY the ones found after the shooting.
Rob, (God bless his muddled brain) raises a valid question...... Are
the spent shells in evidence actually the spent shells that were
picked up at the scene of Tippit's murder?? I seriously doubt that
they are..... I KNOW beyond a shadow of doubt that the authorities
were framing the dead Oswald....and since I KNOW that to be true, I'm
inclined to believe they created the spent shells using Oswald's
pistol and substituted those shells for the ones that had been bicked
up at the scene.
Finally, when did the DPD, FBI and WC prove LHO brought a 40" Carcano
to work on 11/22/63?
If you don't want to trply to Rob, just answer the questions for
everybody.
> > Please do NOT confuse claims with proof, okay?- Hide quoted text -
robc...@netscape.com
<dreit...@aol.com> wrote:
> TOP POST
>
> Whenever I've tried to engage Robcap in discussion, he's either called
> me names or bailed out, so I would simply encourage lurkers to check
> out the facts for themselves.
Running, huh? I have never called you a name, in fact, I have never
called DVP a name but once (I think I made a German reference to his
name once like "Dave of Dumb" since Von can be traslated as "of" or
"from" in German.) and I rarely call anyone else a name. Recently I
have made some references to Bud, YoHarvey and CD...but this is rare
for me UNLESS I am attacked like Ben and Timmy have done.
I am NOT bailing out Reitzes, thus you can feel free to answer my
points anytime you want. YOU asked me to provide affadavits from a
private litagation case (in regards to Batchelor letting in Ruby), and
sadly to say I can't locate them, but I was quoting a book, and surely
the author did view them or he could be sued for making false claims.
MY point stands, NO one can prove that Ruby came down the Main St.
ramp as the WC proposed.
robc...@netscape.com
> On 24 Feb, 21:34, "dreit...@aol.com (Dave Reitzes)" <dreit...@aol.com>
> wrote:
>
> > TOP POST
>
> > Whenever I've tried to engage Robcap in discussion, he's either called
> > me names or bailed out,
>
> Yes, unfortunately that is Rob's way of debating......He's read too
> many funnybooks and has his head full of nonsense.
LOL!!!! Walt is up to his OLD TRICKS OF LYING again! I was very civil
to Walt, still am compared to what he calls me, but a steady diet of
"stupid b**stard" and other nasty assorted names made me do other
things. I love how he blames me, can Walt EVER tell the truth? What
IF a gun was to his head, would he still lie then?
> HOWEVER....He occasionally does make raise valid points of contention
> by asking questions like....
>
> Secondly, when did the DPD, FBI and the WC prove the bullet fragments
> and CE399 were ever INSIDE the victims?
>
> Thirdly, when did the DPD, FBI and the WC ever prove LHO fired a rifle
> (or any other gun) on 11/22/63?
>
> Sixthly, how do YOU explain the FACT the DPD, FBI and WC could NOT
> match-up the bullets taken FROM JDT's body to the alleged shell
> casings found in the street.
>
> I believe Rob wants to know if you can account for the fact that three
> of the four bullets that hit Tippit were manufactured by Western
> Cartridge Co. and one was manufactured by Remington Peters, while the
> spents shells allegedly found at the scene were two Westren Cartridge
> co. and two Remington Peters???
>
> I say alleged as NONE because there is serious doubt to that any of
> the shell casings presented by the WC
> were ACTUALLY the ones found after the shooting.
>
> Rob, (God bless his muddled brain) raises a valid question......
"Muddled" brain means "clear thinker" in Walt's venacular I guess.
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -