Re: HENRY RYBKA, DON LAWTON, AND THE SECRET SERVICE
David Von Pein
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JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID:
[Vince] Palamara calls what happened in Dallas—the altering of the
motorcycle formation and cutting it in half, and the removal of agents
from standing on the rear of the car—“security stripping”.
This clearly resulted in the assassins having a much better
opportunity to hit their target than if the proper procedures had been
followed.
No surprise, [Vincent] Bugliosi apparently did not think any of this
was important in discussing Secret Service complicity in the
assassination.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
The whole Secret Service topic is total nonsense, mainly because we
know (and can prove) that the security for President Kennedy's
motorcade on November 22nd, 1963, in Dallas, Texas, was absolutely no
different in any substantial way from other pre-11/22/63 motorcades
that Mr. Kennedy rode in during his 1,037 days as the 35th U.S. Chief
Executive.
Vince Palamara is constantly making a huge deal out of the fact that
the Secret Service agents did not continuously ride on the back
bumpers of JFK's limousine in Dallas (and particularly, of course, in
Dealey Plaza).
But the SS configuration in Dealey Plaza was no different than many
other pre-Nov. 22 parades, as the photos below amply demonstrate (and
JFK is even STANDING UP in these first three examples--making himself
an even bigger target in the limousine--and there's no SS agents
riding the back bumpers at all; so much for the crap about the Dallas
motorcade being completely different than other JFK caravans):
And I can dig up about half-a-dozen other examples of photos showing
NO AGENTS AT ALL riding the bumper of JFK's car while Kennedy was
riding in his open limousine.
So, does Vince Palamara think that the plot was so sophisticated and
elaborate so as to have the SS agents avoiding JFK's bumper in many
PRE-November 22 motorcades, just to make it SEEM like the security was
no different at all in Dallas? Obviously, nobody can believe such a
nonsensical thing.
Therefore, the "Secret Service Was To Blame" argument goes absolutely
nowhere, and proves nothing, just like all other speculative theories
introduced by hundreds of conspiracy promoters worldwide since 1963.
JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID:
Talk about cherry picking!
Why not show all the other pictures Vince [Palamara] has shown at his
video presentations which contravene those photos you show--which look
like they are from Hawaii: a real danger zone right Davey Boy?
[...]
Question for DVP: Do us all a favor. Ask Vince [Bugliosi] why he did
not...print Edwin Black's fantastic article on the Chicago Plot as an
appendix. .... Can you get on this right away Davey Boy?
There is no doubt in any objective mind--which eliminates DVP--that if
the SS had not covered up the Chicago Plot, what happened in Dallas
would not have occurred. In fact I will go this far: It COULD not have
occurred.
To cover up for the SS at this late date, even after they deliberately
destroyed key evidence AFTER the ARRB was created, is just beyond the
pale.
But with DVP, its par for the course.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Oh, goodie! Now DiEugenio is adding the U.S. Secret Service to his
list of liars and cover-up operatives. Lovely.
Next week -- Actors Gregory Peck and Richard Basehart are going to be
part of DiEugenio's cover-up. After all, each man narrated an "Oswald
Did It Alone" documentary within one year of the assassination. So
they must be lying charlatans.
No matter how many people have to be lying and part of the vast
conspiracy--it's never enough for the DiEugenios of the world. They'll
heap more liars onto the pile with each passing day.
Good case in point (recently) -- DiEugenio's dragging Buell Wesley
Frazier down into the mud. And Linnie Mae Randle goes with him.
Was there anybody in the state of Texas who wasn't trying to nail poor
schnook Oswald to the wall, Jimbo? Anybody at all?
And DiEugenio's "cherry-picking" remark regarding the four photos I
presented above is beyond laughable. Those pictures PROVE (for all
time) that Palamara is wrong regarding the "agents riding the bumpers"
rule he loves to prop up so much. But Jimbo calls it "cherry picking".
Beautiful.
And Jimbo's Hawaii remark is a bladder-buster too. I guess the Secret
Service should have stayed home altogether when Kennedy went to the
Aloha state, huh Jim? Nobody owns a gun in that whole state, eh?
DOUG WELDON SAID:
David:
There were many differences in protocol by the Secret Service in
Dallas. In MIDP [Jim Fetzer's book, "Murder In Dealey Plaza"], I even
name the person from the Protective Services Division who was
responsible for seeing that storm drains were sealed and windows
closed in Dallas.
One of the key differences was placing the press bus way back of the
motorcade. As you can see in your top picture the press bus is very
close to Kennedy's limo. Also note a third person in the front seat.
Blaine's book emphasizes that it was Lawton, not Rybka, shrugging. In
doing so, he is able to innocently explain Rybka's puzzlement while,
in fact, there appears to be much more to it.
John Tunheim said that the Secret Service was the least cooperative of
any agency the AARB [sic] dealt with. They continued to destroy
records as they were being ordered to turn them over to the [ARRB].
The records of the previous motorcades in the weeks before the
assassination were supposedly destroyed. After the publication of "The
Dark Side of Camelot" agents and former agents were given a hush
order.
To suggest that all of the SS agents were enamored with Kennedy is
simply an effort to create a whitewash. I have friends who have been
or who were part of the SS, FBI, and DEA. I have interviewed many of
the officers in the motorcade in Dallas. They either maintain silence
or are very critical of the security in Dallas.
Best,
Doug Weldon
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
The "all windows closed" junk is nonsense too. Just look at how many
times THAT (supposed) rule was broken during JFK's administration--
virtually every motorcade I've ever seen in pictures, including
Hawaii, plus Ireland, plus Florida, etc.
That's just one more example of the Dallas parade being no different
whatsoever from other motorcades.
And the "press buses were in the back" is another silly one,
particularly when we know that a network TV cameraman (Dave Wiegman)
DID film the scene of the murder before Kennedy's car even cleared the
Underpass. SS-100-X is even visible in Wiegman's film! And Mal Couch
filmed the scene too. So it's not like there were no cameras rolling
on Elm Street. There were.
Bottom Line -- Even with tighter SS security on Elm Street, nobody
could have prevented Lee Harvey Oswald from shooting JFK -- unless
Clint Hill and John Ready had decided to become a human shield and
hover over Kennedy's body during those eight seconds in Dealey.
DOUG WELDON SAID:
David:
Why did the SS feel it was necessary to destroy their records on the
motorcades just prior to Dallas?
The press bus was moved to the back for the Dallas motorcade. It is
not simply a question of filming. It is a question of witnessing.
Nobody is suggesting that anyone tried to prevent any photos or
filming in Dealey Plaza.
The buildings were to be checked and there was to be no non-law
enforcement people on the overpass.
Actually, it IS EXACTLY THE DUTY of Secret Service Agents to be HUMAN
SHIELDS. Ready was called back as he started to move to the limo after
the first shots.
Please see my chapter in MIDP [to see] how the third person was
removed from the front seat and the reason that was given. I believe
this created the opportunity for a shot to be fired through the front
of the windshield from the south knoll area to hit Kennedy in the
front.
[DVP INTERJECTION: Hilarious, Doug. So, evidently the goofy assassins
WANTED to shoot through the windshield and planned it that way in
advance, eh? Hilarious!]
You are entrenched in your position and I am not going to pretend that
any amount of evidence I present is going to persuade you any
differently. You are entitled to your own opinion but not to your own
facts.
BTW, I also agree that Four Days in November is a great film.
Also, if you know my background, you will know that I did not seek nor
did I want to find the evidence that I did. I simply cannot ignore it
or call so many witnesses mistaken or lying. I wanted to resist the
conclusions I was forced to reach.
Unless you have sat down with and/or discussed the case with many of
the witnesses you cannot understand what happened in Dallas in the
same way. History is the myth that people choose to believe. Believe
as you will.
Best,
Doug Weldon
JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID:
Thanks for admitting your comparison was Hawaii.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
My photo comparison wasn't ONLY Hawaii, Jimbo. I provided FOUR
different pictures from FOUR different motorcades. Why in the world do
you think they ALL depict JFK in Hawaii? They don't. And I can provide
several more examples from still more cities.
And what difference does it make what CITY he's in? He was still going
to receive the same SS protection in each city--whether it was
Honolulu or Walla Walla.
Do you think the Secret Service was "standing down" in Hawaii, Jim? If
not, then where are the SS agents on the back of the car that Palamara
is always insisting should always be there?
LATER, DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Subject: Secret Service Confusion
Date: 11/15/2010 11:05:51 PM Eastern Standard Time
From: David Von Pein
To: Gary Mack
-------------------------------
[Gary,]
So, you're saying that BOTH [Don] Lawton and [Henry] Rybka must have
peeled off just after the motorcade started rolling, correct?
Rybka said he was at "the rear" of JFK's car when he was moving with
it:
"I [proceeded] to the follow-up car 679-X and stationed myself
at the right front fender of 679-X and the rear of 100-X. There I
stopped everyone from going in between the cars. Once the motorcade
began to move, I moved along with it, until the motorcade picked up
speed." -- Henry Rybka [Via CE2554, below]
http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh25/html/WC_Vol25_0409a.htm
I'm now wondering who the agent is on the LEFT side of the cars in
this still image from the WFAA tape (arrow points to him). I'm
wondering if this could be Rybka on the LEFT side of the cars. Perhaps
he switched from the RIGHT FENDER of 679X to the LEFT side when the
cars began to move. I suppose that's possible:
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_6kYzhJGqq2M/TOIBpqEMw3I/AAAAAAAAGsE/giA4ApokPKY/s1600/SS.jpg
http://JFK-Arrives-In-Dallas.blogspot.com
DVP
============================================
Subject: RE: Secret Service Confusion
Date: 11/16/2010 3:46:54 PM Eastern Standard Time
From: Gary Mack
To: David Von Pein
-------------------------------
Dave,
A Dillard photo a few seconds before departure shows an agent behind
the right front fender of 679-X, another agent, apparently Rybka, at
the bumper on the back end of 100-X, and a third agent wearing a
darker suit standing even with JFK. All three men have their left
hand on the car they are next to but, unfortunately, their faces
cannot be seen.
Since the source isn’t in the book [Gerald Blaine's "The Kennedy
Detail"], I asked writer Lisa McCubbin how the Lawton identification
was confirmed and here is what she wrote: 'Confirmed by Clint Hill,
Paul Landis, and Don Lawton'.
The logical explanation is that Rybka was farther behind 100-X and
just barely out of camera range before and shortly after the motorcade
departed. Rybka’s report stating he “moved along with” the motorcade
makes sense if he had dropped behind 679-X when that car appeared on
camera, thus putting himself impossible to see at that moment.
Gary Mack
============================================
Thank you, Gary, as always.
Gary Mack has now convinced me that "Shrugging Man" is, indeed, SS
agent Donald Lawton and not Henry Rybka.
I was convinced when Gary mentioned the existence of a Tom Dillard
photograph which depicts THREE Secret Service men in just about the
same location on the right side of the cars (probably Lawton standing
right next to JFK on the right side of SS-100-X, and probably Rybka
BEHIND Lawton, and then yet another unknown agent behind the person
who is probably Rybka).
Gary Mack's explanation now makes perfect sense (thanks to his
mentioning that Dillard picture).
Once again--thank you, Mr. Mack, for your valuable input (even
regarding such an extremely unimportant matter such as this one
concerning the exact identity of a Secret Service agent who was merely
doing his job at Love Field as JFK's motorcade departed for downtown
Dallas).
However, the information about the "shrugging" SS agent being Lawton
instead of Rybka is important in one way:
It should forever silence the conspiracists who like to talk about how
the security for JFK's motorcade was being "stripped away" at Love
Field.
Why should it silence them with respect to the shrugging agent?
Because, as far as I am aware (via Emory Roberts' assignment sheets),
Donald Lawton was never assigned to be a part of the team of agents in
the follow-up car (SS-679-X).
Lawton's assignment was "to remain at the airport to effect security
for the President's departure" (a direct quote from Lawton's 11/30/63
report, via CE2554):
http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh25/html/WC_Vol25_0408b.htm
The conspiracy theorists have always been able to argue that Emory
Roberts had initially penciled in Henry Rybka's name to be one of the
SS agents assigned to sit in the follow-up car during the Dallas
parade. But no such argument can be made regarding Don Lawton, because
Lawton knew what his assignment that day was going to be--to stay at
Love Field and help out with security at the airport.
Therefore, we can know with 100% certainty that if Lawton is the
"shrugging" agent who looks confused and bewildered just as JFK's
motorcade is departing Love Field (and I now think that Lawton
definitely is that Secret Service agent), then his actions cannot
possibly have anything to do with any kind of "security stripping" at
the airport.
The conspiracy believers can, of course, continue to use their
previous "stripping" argument when it comes to Rybka specifically, but
not with Lawton.
Chalk it up as just one more conspiracy myth knocked down--and it took
almost 47 years to do it.
lazu...@webtv.net
kicking your ass...laz