Thanks to Dale Myers
Robert Harris
Discovery Channel is much more than an outrageous attempt to misrepresent
the facts associated with that shot. It is also a powerful corroboration
of what I have been saying for a long time.
Over the years, both the WC and the HSCA have struggled with the problem
of trying to point that trajectory back to Lee Harvey Oswald. The WC
placed the entry wound in the back, much too high, trying to generate an
angle that was steep enough to point back to the sixth floor.
The HSCA tried to explain the too-wide lateral angle, by moving John
Connally, far to his left, to a position that made no sense at all.
Dale Myers, with the benefit of computer technology did something a bit
more subtle. He pushed the images of the two victims together, causing
both the vertical and horizontal angles to shrink, and appear to point
back to the alleged sniper's nest.
To do that, he could not use the positions as depicted in his original
simulation, since it was actually, fairly accurate. So, he took out the
segment on the SBT, reduced the background to wireframes which made the
process easier and faster, and then slid the two models roughly 50% closer
than they were originally.
These videos, which Myers attempted to ban from Youtube, will make that
very clear:
http://jfkhistory.com/myersx/myersx.mov
and
http://jfkhistory.com/silent3/silent3.mov
If you have any problem accessing these video, you can view them on
Youtube here,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJrH62TkCWE
and
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkXoAUTVbxE
But this is not just about Mr. Meyers' shenanigans. It's about the fact
that when we position the men correctly, the flatter vertical angle and
the narrower horizontal angle, match perfectly with the third floor
windows on the west side of the Daltex building - which is exactly where
the only professional criminal to be apprehended in DP that day, was
located.
And if that isn't coincidence enough, the man also turned up at the same
hotel with Jack Ruby on the eve of the assassination, accompanied by
Lawrence Myers, whom HSCA investigators connected to the longtime suspect,
David Ferrie.
Myers of course, is acutely aware of this little problem with the angles,
which is why he had to rearrange the models in his DC presentation. His
actions were deliberate and for the obvious purpose of trying to create
the appearance that the trajectory pointed back at Oswald.
I couldn't have asked for a better corroboration if I had hired the guy:-)
Robert Harris
David Von Pein
>>> "Dale Myers...pushed the images of the two victims [JFK & JBC] together, causing both the vertical and horizontal angles to shrink, and appear to point back to the alleged sniper's nest." <<<
As Mr. Harris is aware, Dale Myers has fully explained that visual
anomaly on his website:
www.jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2008/08/youtube-pied-pipers.html
EXCERPTS FROM THE ABOVE ARTICLE:
"Mr. [Robert] Harris makes the foolish claim that he can measure
a two dimensional still frame of a computer rendering of the
presidential limousine and it’s occupants (as culled from the
Discovery Channel program, “Beyond the Magic Bullet”) and determine
the angle of a three-dimensional trajectory from the sniper’s
nest. ....
"Mr. Harris then adds this, “Okay, notice two things here. First
the car and the background are all wireframes. Also, he still has
Kennedy and Connally close together, so that 18 degree bullet
trajectory looks pretty reasonable. But as the car rotates, notice
that something happens. The wireframes disappear and right in the
middle of the rotation, Mr. Myers switches to a totally different
video. In this video he positions President Kennedy and Governor
Connally correctly.”
"What Mr. Harris doesn’t know is that the two renderings
(wireframe and solid form) depict THE SAME MODEL [Myers' emphasis].
"That’s right folks, the wireframe model that he claims has been
“jammed together” in order to mislead the American public and
perpetuate the cover-up, is the EXACT SAME MODEL [Myers' emphasis]
(and in the same position) as the solid form model which Mr. Harris
says depicts Kennedy and Connally correctly.
"For you tech junkies, the model of the single bullet moment was
simply rendered in a 360 degree rotational view multiple times with a
variety of surface settings (wireframe, solids, etc.), and then
combined with simple dissolves pulled between the various layers. ....
"...The only game players in this case are the conspiracy
diehards like Mr. Harris who refuse to accept the reality of what
happened in Dealey Plaza and prefer instead to prey on the young and
naïve who are more than happy to follow any video pied piper willing
to tell them whatever they want to hear about the Kennedy
assassination -- truth be damned." -- DALE K. MYERS; 08/18/2008
===============
Of course, Robert Harris refuses to accept the above explanation by
the animator himself. The conspiracy kooks would rather believe that
Myers has deliberately skewed the facts in some way.
But what I'd really like SBT critics to do is to logically and
reasonably answer the following questions regarding Myers' animation
(which are questions I've asked anti-SBTers in the past, and have
never once been treated to anything close to what could qualify as a
"reasonable" answer):
"If the animation project authored by Dale K. Myers is dead-
wrong...then I want to know HOW...it would have been even remotely
possible for Dale Myers to have stuck THAT CLOSE TO THE REAL EVIDENCE
in the case and to have produced a BOGUS animation (as CTers believe
he has done) that comes so incredibly CLOSE to what a true and NON-
BOGUS animation would have looked like?
"To clarify what I mean by that --- The depiction of the victims
(JFK & JBC) in Myers' animation...are certainly NOT so far "out of
whack" that any CTer can look at it and say this: "Myers is full of
shit here! He doesn't have this model even CLOSE to being accurate in
any way!"
"So, even if the anti-SBT crowd wants to nitpick about the size
of John Connally's head in Dale's 3D model, or about the height of the
limo's crossbar seen in the animation.....those same CTers haven't a
leg to stand on when it comes to the big-ticket question that no
conspiracist has EVER been able to reconcile--and that question is: If
the SBT is only a wet dream of "WC shills" (et al), then how in the
world did multiple gunmen firing multiple bullets...into the bodies of
two victims manage to MIMIC A PERFECT (or damn near perfect-looking)
SINGLE-BULLET EVENT with those multiple bullets?" -- DVP; 04/18/2008
www.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/de1c41667a7635b0
===============
ADDENDUM REMARKS:
"As I've said a thousand times before -- the luck of those
multiple shooters in Dealey Plaza apparently never ran out. Did it?
Those assassins were even able to fool Dale Myers' computer overlays
and key framing....with those crackerjack killers pummelling JBC & JFK
with several bullets (all of the vanishing variety, naturally) in just
such a pattern (and with ideal SBT-like timing to boot, per the Z-
Film) so that decades later a man at his computer could come up with
an animation -- BASED ON AN ACTUAL FILMED RECORD OF THE EVENT! -- that
would make this MULTI-shot event look exactly the same as the SBT
purported by the WC in 1964.
"Where's the champagne?! Those ever-efficient, magical assassins
deserve an endless supply of it for that magnificent hunk of "public
duping". Wouldn't you agree?" -- DVP; 05/19/2007
www.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/ed8d8ab92a74c7ee
===============
Anastase Vonsiatsky
The first person to mention the name Dale Meyers to me with an
implication
that Meyers allegedly was on the brink of some major new discovery was
none
other than Grodie Whineslow from Miami, who gets his kicks by flashing
some
sort of badge identifying him as the official City of Miami Archivist
and then trying
to twist facts to mesh into his own version of historical events. In
fact he is
probably either a snitch for some Federal Agency or just a dedicated
Lone Nut
theorist like Meyers. He denied that there ever was a planned Miami
Motorcade
around Nov. 18th when in fact the NY Times printed an article citing
the published
and circulated agenda produced by the Kennedy advance team. He also
denied
the story of Marita Lorenz which we now know was verified by E. Howard
Hunt during
his deathbed confession. I had considered taking the day off from
school to attend
the Miami motorcade, but changed my plans when the scheduled motorcade
was
cancelled apparently due to fears of an active and verifiable
assassination plot.
He should be shunned and abhorred like every other deliberate
disinformation
artist. When he started getting chummy with Kram Diaz, he was put on
my
to be shunned list. Why Gaeton Fonzi was chummy with Diaz in
Providence
is still causing me some guilt by association issues as well. Fonzi
also denied
the veracity of the Marita Lorenz claims, despite strong evidence to
the contrary.
curtjester1
It just goes to show that people will use an 'air of authority' to
cause deception. It's nothing more than a rehash of Arlen Specter's
gambit which is so provably false. A real analysis will get the
'path' a good 10 inches down from JFK's throat wound. They simply
have to lie to get it to go any other way's. Of course they don't
deal with people that have not come to terms with their 'findings',
and claim they haven't dealt with their evidence, which just makes the
lying even more profound.
SBT:
http://whokilledjfk.net/single_bullet.htm
Lattimer:
http://whokilledjfk.net/Lattimer.htm
Live Earth Cam ..Sixth Floor TSBD
THROAT WOUND-ENTRANCE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-ViRMc29W0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QLFOzwsYSM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Sl6V-0nK3c
All these thanks to Tom Rossely who has been studying this case longer
than any of these gov't shills.
CJ
Chuck Schuyler
> As Mr. Harris is aware, Dale Myers has fully explained that visual
> anomaly on his website:
>
> www.jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2008/08/youtube-pied-pipers.html
I'll bet Bob has never telephoned Dale Myers to have him 'explain'
some aspect of his JFK computer reconstruction work to him.
He's probably never traded emails with Dale on the issue Bob harps
about.
Never offered to visit him in Michigan and look around or interview
Dale on the technical aspects involved in the motorcade/Z film
computer animated reconstruction.
He's never called the third party team ABC hired to verify Dale's work
for the Beyond Conspiracy program.
In other words, Bob just makes sh*t up to fit his template. He's not
interested in learning anything, and he's not interested in 'solving'
the JFK assassination. If he was interested in solving it, he most
certainly wouldn't spend time posting here.
No one on the CT or LN side even agrees with his odd theory--that a
man in the Elm St. sewer fired a shot that flew right through the open
skull flap seen at Z313. Talk about a magic bullet!
Of course, just because no one agrees with a certain theory doesn't
make it wrong, as I'm sure Bob is fond of pointing out to his family,
worn-out from conspiracy blather, but Bob certainly has a high
mountain to climb before his Sewer Man Shot JFK Through The Open Wound
Seen At Zapruder 313 is an accepted fact.
Here is a tip for Bob:
Instead of trying to tear down the work of others, focus on your
theory. Do your own computer animated work. Get it peer reviewed for
accuracy. Convince a few researchers that a man in a sewer fired a
bullet through JFK's open skull flap wound. Lobby congress. Write
Caroline Kennedy. Print up some more 'Bob Harris, JFK Assassination
Researcher' business cards and petition someone to open the case up.
Get crackin'. You have a lot of work to do.
Robert Harris
<f4db08fd-8b81-4a5d...@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com>,
David Von Pein <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
> >>> "Dale Myers...pushed the images of the two victims [JFK & JBC] together,
> >>> causing both the vertical and horizontal angles to shrink, and appear to
> >>> point back to the alleged sniper's nest." <<<
>
> As Mr. Harris is aware, Dale Myers has fully explained that visual
> anomaly on his website:
Yes, David and Myers idiotic "rebuttal" has been proven wrong on every
count.
>
> www.jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2008/08/youtube-pied-pipers.html
>
> EXCERPTS FROM THE ABOVE ARTICLE:
>
> "Mr. [Robert] Harris makes the foolish claim that he can measure
> a two dimensional still frame of a computer rendering of the
> presidential limousine and itąs occupants (as culled from the
> Discovery Channel program, łBeyond the Magic Bullet˛) and determine
> the angle of a three-dimensional trajectory from the sniperąs
> nest. ....
LOL!!
Myers pretends that I was the one who created that trajectory line, when
he knows very well that I simply extended HIS line, which he had to chop
off after switching to the correct view of the victims.
Myers is a deliberate liar.
>
> "Mr. Harris then adds this, łOkay, notice two things here. First
> the car and the background are all wireframes. Also, he still has
> Kennedy and Connally close together, so that 18 degree bullet
> trajectory looks pretty reasonable. But as the car rotates, notice
> that something happens. The wireframes disappear and right in the
> middle of the rotation, Mr. Myers switches to a totally different
> video. In this video he positions President Kennedy and Governor
> Connally correctly.˛
>
> "What Mr. Harris doesnąt know is that the two renderings
> (wireframe and solid form) depict THE SAME MODEL [Myers' emphasis].
No they are not. Myers was lying again.
If it was the same scene, the distance between Connally and Kennedy
would have been the same but they were obviously, not. If they had been,
his own trajectory line would have intersected with Connally at the same
place in both scenes.
>
> "Thatąs right folks, the wireframe model that he claims has been
> łjammed together˛ in order to mislead the American public and
> perpetuate the cover-up, is the EXACT SAME MODEL [Myers' emphasis]
> (and in the same position) as the solid form model which Mr. Harris
> says depicts Kennedy and Connally correctly.
The "model" may have been the same, but the distance between the two
objects that represented JFK and JBC was changed.
Any idiot with a ruler, or a simple CAD program can prove that.
>
> "For you tech junkies, the model of the single bullet moment was
> simply rendered in a 360 degree rotational view multiple times with a
> variety of surface settings (wireframe, solids, etc.), and then
> combined with simple dissolves pulled between the various layers. ....
Duh... just like all 3D models. Is this supposed to mean something?
>
> "...The only game players in this case are the conspiracy
> diehards like Mr. Harris who refuse to accept the reality of what
> happened in Dealey Plaza and prefer instead to prey on the young and
> naďve who are more than happy to follow any video pied piper willing
> to tell them whatever they want to hear about the Kennedy
> assassination -- truth be damned." -- DALE K. MYERS; 08/18/2008
I wonder if I am the only one to notice that Myers didn't display even a
single image from his presentation, which you would think, would be the
first thing he would do, if he hoped to prove that he didn't cheat.
But you know what?
If you read his ENTIRE "rebuttal" you will make an amazing discovery!
He NEVER ONCE, denied that he shrank the distance between the two
victims. He ONLY said he used the same "model" :-)
Interested lurkers should watch the videos very carefully, and then read
Mr. Myers attempt to defend his little scam. At the very least, you will
get a good laugh.
>
> ===============
>
> Of course, Robert Harris refuses to accept the above explanation by
> the animator himself.
What "explanation"? He never denied my allegation - not even once.
> The conspiracy kooks would rather believe that
> Myers has deliberately skewed the facts in some way.
No, he skewed the images, because he knows as well as the rest of us,
that the trajectory from Oswald's (apparent) location was too steep to
align with the known wound locations.
>
> But what I'd really like SBT critics to do is to logically and
> reasonably answer the following questions regarding Myers' animation
> (which are questions I've asked anti-SBTers in the past, and have
> never once been treated to anything close to what could qualify as a
> "reasonable" answer):
>
> "If the animation project authored by Dale K. Myers is dead-
> wrong...
No David, it was NOT dead wrong. It was actually, fairly accurate and
THAT was his problem.
An accurate depiction of the scene clearly proved that the shot did not
come from Oswald. That's why he had to adjust the positions of the
models.
Look at my second video, David. Tell me with a straight face, that the
distance between JFK and Connally, was not drastically different in the
wirerame scene that in ALL others he presented.
Robert Harris
Robert Harris
<46cf51f3-1ff3-44f2...@k1g2000prb.googlegroups.com>,
Chuck Schuyler <chu...@am-mtg.com> wrote:
> On Feb 6, 12:23 am, David Von Pein <davevonp...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > As Mr. Harris is aware, Dale Myers has fully explained that visual
> > anomaly on his website:
> >
> > www.jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2008/08/youtube-pied-pipers.html
>
> I'll bet Bob has never telephoned Dale Myers to have him 'explain'
> some aspect of his JFK computer reconstruction work to him.
There is nothing to "explain" Chuck.
But why don't you tell Mr. Myers to put in an appearance here at ACJ and
we can talk about it in public. He's been here many times before and
we've had our share of discussions:-)
If he does that, I will post scenes from his video at my website, along
with CAD measurements, and we can let him tell ALL of us about it.
If he prefers, AAJ is fine with me, as well.
And I'm sorry Chuck, but I don't get chummy with people who deliberately
misrepresent important aspects of this case. And that goes for some
conspiracy folks, too.
Robert Harris
aeffects
> >>> "Dale Myers...pushed the images of the two victims [JFK & JBC] together, causing both the vertical and horizontal angles to shrink, and appear to point back to the alleged sniper's nest." <<<
>
> As Mr. Harris is aware, Dale Myers has fully explained that visual
> anomaly on his website:
>
> www.jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2008/08/youtube-pied-pipers.html
ya can't generate a court accurate 3D world out of 2D (Zapruder film)
imagery -- fools folly!
Myers mistake is simple, at the start, he assumed the alleged in-
camera original Zapruder Film is a frame accurate depiction of what
happened on Elm Street. It went downhill from there. Cute, but no
banana... you've been wowed by bullshit!
What would be interesting is have DMyers render out a version with a
shooter in the position Robert Harris suggests: in the Dal-Tex
building (? floor), then post THAT clip on the net. Should take about
15 minutes tops to tun the scenario....
Sam McClung
news:b9b8ef2c-fba7-4e91...@v18g2000pro.googlegroups.com...
<snipped to>
> It just goes to show that people will use an
> 'air of authority' to cause deception. It's nothing
> more than a rehash of Arlen Specter's gambit
> which is so provably false.
speaking of specter, the broom used in skull and bones
weddings, the brooms in the photo with specter, maybe
they're all broom people
working for the owl on the dollar bill
chauncey may have been better off staying in kanetuck and
running the family still
he wasn't a broom person so the beans he did spill
mentioning coca cola and some cia place in the afterstate
of beverly hills
the rifles, the bullets, the fake id's
holt mentioned other things and these
naming names, he once even worked on the trapeze
and he said it all in engligh and not cia-ese
since it was the cia holt worked for and a cia shop where
the rifles, bullets, and id's originated, surely the cia
will be forthcoming in explaining it all, to champion
specter, perhaps the original harry potter
Chuck Schuyler
> In article
> <46cf51f3-1ff3-44f2-a155-5e47598ca...@k1g2000prb.googlegroups.com>,
> Chuck Schuyler <chu...@am-mtg.com> wrote:
>
> > On Feb 6, 12:23 am, David Von Pein <davevonp...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > > As Mr. Harris is aware, Dale Myers has fully explained that visual
> > > anomaly on his website:
>
> > >www.jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2008/08/youtube-pied-pipers.html
>
> > I'll bet Bob has never telephoned Dale Myers to have him 'explain'
> > some aspect of his JFK computer reconstruction work to him.
>
> There is nothing to "explain" Chuck.
>
> But why don't you tell Mr. Myers to put in an appearance here at ACJ and
> we can talk about it in public. He's been here many times before and
> we've had our share of discussions:-)
>
> If he does that, I will post scenes from his video at my website, along
> with CAD measurements, and we can let him tell ALL of us about it.
>
> If he prefers, AAJ is fine with me, as well.
>
> And I'm sorry Chuck, but I don't get chummy with people who deliberately
> misrepresent important aspects of this case. And that goes for some
> conspiracy folks, too.
>
> Robert Harris
Bob,
Where is the entry wound on JFK for the Sewer man shot, and what is
your best guess for the entrance based on Z frame reference (Z315, for
example)?
Did the Sewer Man shot miraculously fly through the wound we all see
at Z313?
Dave Reitzes
> that when we position the men correctly, the flatter vertical angle and
> the narrower horizontal angle, match perfectly with the third floor
> windows on the west side of the Daltex building - which is exactly where
> the only professional criminal to be apprehended in DP that day, was
> located.
>
> And if that isn't coincidence enough, the man also turned up at the same
> hotel with Jack Ruby on the eve of the assassination, accompanied by
> Lawrence Myers, whom HSCA investigators connected to the longtime suspect,
> David Ferrie.
Here we go again:
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/factoid.htm
More about "suspect" Ferrie:
http://www.jfk-online.com/ferriepre.html
Dave
curtjester1
The simple fact is that if you align all the factors up especially
where the bullet(S) were shown to be in JFK's back, it would come out
at least 10 inches below the neck wound. Nevermind the proposed
silliness afterwards.
SBT:
http://whokilledjfk.net/single_bullet.htm
Lattimer:
http://whokilledjfk.net/Lattimer.htm
Live Earth Cam ..Sixth Floor TSBD
THROAT WOUND-ENTRANCE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-ViRMc29W0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QLFOzwsYSM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Sl6V-0nK3c
CJ
curtjester1
If Arlen Specter was caught in a bunch of lies, how is Dale Myers to
fare better? The gist is that when all the clear pictures of the
wounds and the alignments are made, the direct route from the sixth
floor would have been at least 10 inches below the neck wound from the
back wound. It just gets more hilarious as it goes on.
curtjester1
Isn't is simply amazing that they can take what Arlen Specter did and
try to pawn the same stuff off??!! Anyone that has studied the case
knows that when one aligns either of the wounds in the back looking to
appear like bullet holes that it will come a minimum of ten inches
below the throat wound. Of course going beyond that goes into the
geometric impossible. Then, of course they have this air of
'authority' that is so shallow and condescening in nature for support,
and citation, and logic that they refuse to look at what confronts
them!! I guess it doesn't cost much to sell a soul these days....:).
Gerry Simone
Beyond the Magic Bullet (have DVD but can't recall) or Inside The Target Car
(didn't see it).
Thanks.
"Robert Harris" <reha...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:reharris1-E7A1E...@70-3-168-216.pools.spcsdns.net...
Robert Harris
<013ce467-4d6b-4fe3...@u18g2000pro.googlegroups.com>,
Chuck Schuyler <chu...@am-mtg.com> wrote:
Chuck, if you will reword your question to eliminate the childish
ridicule, I will be happy to address it.
In the meantime, please consider that you need to earn the right to
ridicule a particular idea, by proving it is deserving.
I don't recall you ever being up to that.
Robert Harris
David Von Pein
>>> "Myers idiotic "rebuttal" has been proven wrong on every count." <<<
Gee, what a surprise -- a conspiracist (Harris) rejects the
explanations of an LNer (Myers). You could knock me over with the
passing breeze of Mr. Harris' imaginary Z285 bullet.
Worth repeating:
Robert Harris
<2a373a4d-63fd-4fef...@d32g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>,
David Von Pein <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
> >>> "Myers idiotic "rebuttal" has been proven wrong on every count." <<<
>
> Gee, what a surprise -- a conspiracist (Harris) rejects the
> explanations of an LNer (Myers). You could knock me over with the
> passing breeze of Mr. Harris' imaginary Z285 bullet.
>
>
> Worth repeating:
>
>
> "As I've said a thousand times before -- the luck of those
> multiple shooters in Dealey Plaza apparently never ran out. Did it?
> Those assassins were even able to fool Dale Myers' computer overlays
No-one "fooled" Dale Myers, David.
He is a liar and a phony. The only ones being fooled, are his fans.
As usual, you have deleted the links which point to the absolute prove
that fact,
http://jfkhistory.com/myersx/myersx.mov
and
http://jfkhistory.com/silent3/silent3.mov
If you have any problem accessing these video, you can view them on
Youtube here,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJrH62TkCWE
and
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkXoAUTVbxE
Robert Harris