IF THIS WERE NOT A CONSPIRACY.......
Gil Jesus
the result of a last minute decision by a crazed lone nut assassin to
kill the President of the United States, how is it that Kennedy was
warned in advance not to go to Dallas ?
bigdog
We was warned not to go because Dallas was thought to be a hostile
environment as evidenced by the jostling Adlai Stevenson had received
a few weeks earlier. No one who warned JFK not to go to Dallas had any
knowledge of a specific threat. If they did have such knowledge, it
would mean they were part of the conspiracy. Why would someone who was
in on the plot warn the intended victim to stay away from Dallas? Once
more, Giltardo shows his completel inability to think through a
situation.
David Von Pein
This reminds me of the conspiracy theorists who insist it was Jack
Ruby who called the DPD on Saturday night, to warn the police that
Oswald was going to be rubbed out the following morning.
But why on Earth would Ruby (who is a guy that almost all conspiracy
theorists think was really and truly part of a "plot" to rub out Lee
Oswald) have wanted to call up the DPD and WARN THEM IN ADVANCE that
he'd be shooting LHO the next day?
It makes no sense whatsoever.
Walt
> On Mar 21, 7:30 am, Gil Jesus <gjjm...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > If the murder of John F. Kennedy in Dallas on November 22, 1963 was
> > the result of a last minute decision by a crazed lone nut assassin to
> > kill the President of the United States, how is it that Kennedy was
> > warned in advance not to go to Dallas ?
>
> >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlugQbWSb6c
>
> We was warned not to go because Dallas was thought to be a hostile
> environment as evidenced by the jostling Adlai Stevenson had received
> a few weeks earlier. No one who warned JFK not to go to Dallas had any
> knowledge of a specific threat. If they did have such knowledge, it
> would mean they were part of the conspiracy.
Utter nonsense..... Richard Case Nagell had ABSOLUTE knowledge that
there was going to be an attempt to murder JFK in Dallas. He sent a
letter to JE Hoover warning Hoover about the plot. Hoover had him
thrown in the Springfield Missiouri insane assylum where nobody would
have access to him. Abraham Bolton also suffered the same fate for
revealing that there was a plot to murder JFK. Bolton also found
himself in Springfield.
bigdog
>
> - Show quoted text -
OK, I give. What specific knowledge did Nagell have about an
assassination plot? How did he find out about it? Same questions about
Bolton.
Walt
Richard Case Nagell was CIA..... I don't know how much he knew....I
only know he signed an affidavit when he finally was released from
Springfield long after the public gave up caring about the murder of
our President. The signed affidavit said that he had sent a
registered letter to Hoover on September (23?) 1963 notifying Hoover
that there was a plot affot to murder JFK . The plot involved some
CIA renegades, BOP survivors, and right wing extremists. Only a
couple of months after Nagell was released from springfield, the CIA
gave him a mission to East germany, where he was caught by the
communists and put in prison there. ( Which is probably exactly what
the CIA had planned.)
At the time he was arrested by the FBI on September 23,1963 Nagel had
ID cards with Oswald's name and vital statistics, and also ID cards
with the name Alex Hidell on them.
How did he find out about it? Same questions about
> Bolton.- Hide quoted text -
Walt
Abraham Bolton didn't know what Hoover thought he knew....Hoover
thought that Bolton had uncovered some of the details of the plot to
murder JFK, and in his paranoia he had Bolton arrested and sent to
Springfield to "get his mind right". If you've seen the movie "Cool
Hand Luke" you'll know what I mean about "getting his mind
right"....Only in Springfield they didn't resort to the brutal
torture ....The just used mind altering drugs........
Bud
> the result of a last minute decision by a crazed lone nut assassin to
> kill the President of the United States, how is it that Kennedy was
> warned in advance not to go to Dallas ?
"Dallas was a dangerous place in 1963, especially for Kennedys..."
-Gil Jesus, 2002
I guess retards just get stupider with age.
Jeff
Ruby is one of those tragic figures in history who sold his soul to
those forces of darkness but had regrets about it.
Why would he call the police and warn them ? He may have felt some
remorse about having to kill an innocent man. But beyond that it had
to do with self preservation. He didn't want to have to kill Oswald
and throw his own life away. There was absolutely zero chance that
Ruby was going to get away with murdering Oswald since he did it on
national television.
Ruby was involved with the mafia and people think his life depended on
killing Oswald. He was a nervous wreck in jail until he found out
that Oswald was dead at which point he relaxed and asked for a
cigarette.
Ruby's shooting of Oswald right in police headquarters should make
even the most extreme skeptics stop and think. This event makes no
sense whatsoever in any context other than the involvement of the
mafia and a conspiracy.
The mafia is a secretive organization. They like to keep a low
profile. I think it's reasonable to say that the mafia would not, by
themselves, assassinate the president. This is too big for them and
they probably could not even have done it by themselves. Even if they
could the mafia would not want anyone associated with them to be
openly involved in something like this. So they must have known that
the security agencies would not put the pressure on them after Ruby
shot Oswald. Yes they knew because they were working with the CIA.
How else can we explain it ? By what that dim wit Bugliosi says in
his 1600 page book that 'Ruby loved JFK." ? Ruby was a two bit strip
club owner and criminal. He's going to throw his life away because
he's outraged that someone killed the president ? The mafia is not a
patriotic organization.
How the hell did he even get that close to Oswald in the first
place ? Or how did Ruby even get into the building ? That's another
big question mark.
As I have mentioned already the plan was that Oswald would be killed
by the police and never be taken into custody alive. But that part of
the plan didn't go as expected. When Oswald was taken alive into jail
this created a major problem for Johnson and the other conspirators.
They had to silence Oswald at all costs.
Once Ruby shot Oswald many people began to wonder about this
assassination. It was the one sloppy part of an otherwise perfectly
executed plan. Something must have gone wrong. Maybe they had some
corrupt police officers who were going to shoot Oswald but they
couldn't get close enough to him at the movie theater or something.
Notice they had an Oswald look alike murder officer Tippit immediately
after the assassination so that the police would think Oswald was a
cop killer.
Oswald was completely isolated from all human contact while in custody
to prevent him from saying anything incriminating about what really
happened. There are many people who would have liked to talk to
Oswald. He really knew what happened and how he had been set up as
the patsy as he said. Oswald was a walking dead man as soon as
Kennedy was killed. The clock was ticking for him.
The techniques used for this assassination, including setting up
someone to take the blame, were used by the CIA in other countries to
assassinate political figures, create chaos, and overthrow
governments.
Unfortunately for JFK they turned this terrorism machine on him.
Ruby's testimony on TV is interesting. He hints about those people
who had so much to gain. You get the feeling watching this testimony
that he had things he wanted to say but knew he never could.
As I said Ruby sold his soul to those dark forces. This I guess is
similar to how people can sell their soul to the devil. Once those
forces of darkness reach a certain point it cannot be stopped.
Ruby didn't last long in jail. They probably gave him some of their
cancer formula that they had intended for Castro's milkshake.
Jeff Marzano
bigdog
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
The only source for Nagell's claims is Nagell himself. Nothing he
claims can be corroborated and much of it is demonstrably false. Even
if you want to accept this tall tale, where is there anything in
Nagell's story specific information about a assassination attempt in
Dallas, which is the premise this thread started with.
bigdog
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Wait a minute. Nagell claimed it was a CIA operation. Now you're
claiming the FBI was behind it. Who was running this show?
bigdog
> On Mar 21, 9:01 am, David Von Pein <davevonp...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > This reminds me of the conspiracy theorists who insist it was Jack
> > Ruby who called the DPD on Saturday night, to warn the police that
> > Oswald was going to be rubbed out the following morning.
>
> > But why on Earth would Ruby (who is a guy that almost all conspiracy
> > theorists think was really and truly part of a "plot" to rub out Lee
> > Oswald) have wanted to call up the DPD and WARN THEM IN ADVANCE that
> > he'd be shooting LHO the next day?
>
> > It makes no sense whatsoever.
>
> Ruby is one of those tragic figures in history who sold his soul to
> those forces of darkness but had regrets about it.
>
> Why would he call the police and warn them ? He may have felt some
> remorse about having to kill an innocent man. But beyond that it had
> to do with self preservation. He didn't want to have to kill Oswald
> and throw his own life away. There was absolutely zero chance that
> Ruby was going to get away with murdering Oswald since he did it on
> national television.
>
> Ruby was involved with the mafia and people think his life depended on
> killing Oswald. He was a nervous wreck in jail until he found out
> that Oswald was dead at which point he relaxed and asked for a
> cigarette.
>
> Ruby's shooting of Oswald right in police headquarters should make
> even the most extreme skeptics stop and think. This event makes no
> sense whatsoever in any context other than the involvement of the
> mafia and a conspiracy.
>
Whoever said senseless acts are supposed to make sense?
> The mafia is a secretive organization. They like to keep a low
> profile. I think it's reasonable to say that the mafia would not, by
> themselves, assassinate the president. This is too big for them and
> they probably could not even have done it by themselves. Even if they
> could the mafia would not want anyone associated with them to be
> openly involved in something like this. So they must have known that
> the security agencies would not put the pressure on them after Ruby
> shot Oswald. Yes they knew because they were working with the CIA.
>
As Bugliosi said, if this were either a CIA or Mafia operation, there
would have been a car waiting for Oswald at the TSBD to drive him to
his death.
> How else can we explain it ? By what that dim wit Bugliosi says in
> his 1600 page book that 'Ruby loved JFK." ? Ruby was a two bit strip
> club owner and criminal. He's going to throw his life away because
> he's outraged that someone killed the president ? The mafia is not a
> patriotic organization.
>
Ruby's actions have all the earmarks of a spur of the moment decision
which is consistent with his temperment. He had a fiery temper and was
prone to violence when he lost control of it. This eliminates the need
to answer why Ruby would have thrown his life away. He apparently
never weighed the consequences of his actions. If Ruby had planned
this murder out in advance, why wasn't he in position at the time
Oswald was supposed to be transfered. If Oswald had not asked to have
his sweater brought to him before being transfered, he probably would
have been in the armored car on his way to the county jail when Ruby
arrived.
> How the hell did he even get that close to Oswald in the first
> place ? Or how did Ruby even get into the building ? That's another
> big question mark.
>
Walked in?
> As I have mentioned already the plan was that Oswald would be killed
> by the police and never be taken into custody alive. But that part of
> the plan didn't go as expected. When Oswald was taken alive into jail
> this created a major problem for Johnson and the other conspirators.
> They had to silence Oswald at all costs.
>
Why did that part go wrong. If the cops were supposed to kill Oswald,
he certainly gave them just cause when he pulled a gun on the
arresting officer. He could have died in a hail of bullets in the
Texas Theater and it would easily have been judged to be a justifiable
homicide with the cops acting in self defense.
> Once Ruby shot Oswald many people began to wonder about this
> assassination. It was the one sloppy part of an otherwise perfectly
> executed plan. Something must have gone wrong. Maybe they had some
> corrupt police officers who were going to shoot Oswald but they
> couldn't get close enough to him at the movie theater or something.
>
> Notice they had an Oswald look alike murder officer Tippit immediately
> after the assassination so that the police would think Oswald was a
> cop killer.
>
Cuckoo!!! Cuckoo!!! Cuckoo!!!
How did the Oswald look alike manage to get Oswald's gun and how did
he get it back in Oswald's hands before the arrest?
> Oswald was completely isolated from all human contact while in custody
> to prevent him from saying anything incriminating about what really
> happened.
Total bullshit. His brother Robert spoke to him. The president of the
Dallas Bar Association met with him. He talked to a roomful of
reporters. If they were trying to keep him quiet, parading him in
front of the reporters was a pretty stupid thing to do.
> There are many people who would have liked to talk to
> Oswald.
And many people did.
> He really knew what happened
Of course he did. He was the one who did it.
> and how he had been set up as
> the patsy as he said. Oswald was a walking dead man as soon as
> Kennedy was killed. The clock was ticking for him.
>
Right. That's why he was allowed to live for 44 hours and given ample
opportunity to tell what he knew.
> The techniques used for this assassination, including setting up
> someone to take the blame, were used by the CIA in other countries to
> assassinate political figures, create chaos, and overthrow
> governments.
>
> Unfortunately for JFK they turned this terrorism machine on him.
>
> Ruby's testimony on TV is interesting. He hints about those people
> who had so much to gain. You get the feeling watching this testimony
> that he had things he wanted to say but knew he never could.
>
> As I said Ruby sold his soul to those dark forces. This I guess is
> similar to how people can sell their soul to the devil. Once those
> forces of darkness reach a certain point it cannot be stopped.
>
Oh, the devil made him do it!!!
> Ruby didn't last long in jail. They probably gave him some of their
> cancer formula that they had intended for Castro's milkshake.
>
And just how many years did they allow Ruby to live before they rubbed
him out. And cancer? Like they couldn't have come up with a quicker
way to get the job done.
David Von Pein
>>> "...it had to do with self preservation. He [Ruby] didn't want to have to kill Oswald and throw his own life away." <<<
But he decided to go ahead and do it anyway....right?
Poor Sparky.
Walt
I think you're getting in way over your head in your ability to
understand how secret organizations and criminals operate.....
But a thumbnail sketch for you.... The plot Originated with CIA
renegades who realized they could take advantage of the seething
hatred for JFK by some of the Cuban's involved in the BOP
fiasco..... Hoover with his wide net of agents learned of the
plot.... He simply turned a blind eye to it and quietly supported the
assassination. An honest investigation would have reaved Hoover's
perfidity .... but of course there was no HONEST investigation,
because Hoover and Johnson held the reins.
Richard
"Walt" <papakoc...@evertek.net> wrote in message
news:dd085eb1-1c79-4c23...@d37g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
On Mar 21, 7:42 am, bigdog <jecorbett1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Mar 21, 7:30 am, Gil Jesus <gjjm...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > If the murder of John F. Kennedy in Dallas on November 22, 1963 was
> > the result of a last minute decision by a crazed lone nut assassin to
> > kill the President of the United States, how is it that Kennedy was
> > warned in advance not to go to Dallas ?
>
> >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlugQbWSb6c
>
> We was warned not to go because Dallas was thought to be a hostile
> environment as evidenced by the jostling Adlai Stevenson had received
> a few weeks earlier. No one who warned JFK not to go to Dallas had any
> knowledge of a specific threat. If they did have such knowledge, it
> would mean they were part of the conspiracy.
Utter nonsense..... Richard Case Nagell had ABSOLUTE knowledge that
there was going to be an attempt to murder JFK in Dallas. He sent a
letter to JE Hoover warning Hoover about the plot. Hoover had him
thrown in the Springfield Missiouri insane assylum where nobody would
have access to him. Abraham Bolton also suffered the same fate for
revealing that there was a plot to murder JFK. Bolton also found
himself in Springfield.
I hate to nitpick (filled with hate as I am!) but his name is B-O-L-D E N.
Not Bolton.
Walt
> "Walt" <papakochenb...@evertek.net> wrote in message
>
> news:dd085eb1-1c79-4c23...@d37g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
> On Mar 21, 7:42 am, bigdog <jecorbett1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On Mar 21, 7:30 am, Gil Jesus <gjjm...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > > If the murder of John F. Kennedy in Dallas on November 22, 1963 was
> > > the result of a last minute decision by a crazed lone nut assassin to
> > > kill the President of the United States, how is it that Kennedy was
> > > warned in advance not to go to Dallas ?
>
> > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlugQbWSb6c
>
> > We was warned not to go because Dallas was thought to be a hostile
> > environment as evidenced by the jostling Adlai Stevenson had received
> > a few weeks earlier. No one who warned JFK not to go to Dallas had any
> > knowledge of a specific threat. If they did have such knowledge, it
> > would mean they were part of the conspiracy.
>
> Utter nonsense..... Richard Case Nagell had ABSOLUTE knowledge that
> there was going to be an attempt to murder JFK in Dallas. He sent a
> letter to JE Hoover warning Hoover about the plot. Hoover had him
> thrown in the Springfield Missiouri insane assylum where nobody would
> have access to him. Abraham Bolton also suffered the same fate for
> revealing that there was a plot to murder JFK. Bolton also found
> himself in Springfield.
>
> I hate to nitpick (filled with hate as I am!) but his name is B-O-L-D E N.
> Not Bolton.
Thank You.... You're right..... I also said that Richard Case Nagell
was sent to Springfield Missiouri....The prison is in Springfield
Illinios.....
> Why would someone who was
>
>
>
> > in on the plot warn the intended victim to stay away from Dallas? Once
> > more, Giltardo shows his completel inability to think through a