LEE HARVEY OSWALD THE STUPIDIST ASSASSIN EVER?
SCOTT ZIMMER
down as the dumbest assassin ever in recorded history. I believe if he
did do it the process he did to do it was so stupid it is the reason
that there are so many who doubt his guilt. In the annals of crime
when a criminal committing a crime proceeds with the crime he makes
plans and works out how to get away with it. An escape straight away
from the Texas Book Deposity the scene of the crime, a hideout to keep
low while the manhunt was on, an escape to another country or at least
state. Lee Harvey Oswald it seems would have none of that. If what
I have read is correct he made a request to go back to his wife the
night before and she turned him down so he decided "Damn, Marina wont
take me back I am going to kill the president" Really strange reaction
to a broken heart but who can figure? So next morning he wakes up and
thinks right todays the day - i kill JFK. I have my italian rifle
there. I can put it in a paper bag and take it to work then bang JFK
is dead. No thoughts of getting out of the place, he decides he will
play it by ear as the day unfolds. The only thing he can think of is
once i have killed him all i have to do is get down to the 2nd floor.
any cop who sees me will be told by one of my managers that i work
there and I get away with the crime of the century scott free. How
he had this precognition to tell him this and not that he will be
killed by Jack Ruby a couple of days later is open to speculation.
Of course Lee has forgotten that he has used a rifle that he ordered
through mail order to his alias, he has left his finger prints all
over the place on the 6th floor and shell casings are nicely left for
the police to find too. Maybe he realises this when the cop and his
manager find him on the 2nd floor or else he decides " hey me
innocently hanging around the 2nd floor might not be going to work. I
better get out of here. Better get my pistol too. I didnt need it
till now even though I assassinated the most powerful man on earth."
Lee, Lee?? He then decides " I know what I will do. I will go home
get my gun and walk over to the theatre. shoot any damn cops that try
and stop me.
It was not for Lee Harvey Oswald to hide his crime which any sensible
person would do. Gloves, a mask at least. Pick up the spent shells.
Instead he has left a nice trail which leads directly to him.
They say LHO was quite a reader. This suggests he was reasonably
intelligent. I am not familiar with his iq but because the crime he is
purported to have committed defies logic and is so ridiculous and
inept that any reasonable sane intelligent person would not do it and
is such a risky gamble I just can not accept he is guilty - of the
assassination anyway.
Once he learns of the assassination he thinks he needs a gun. I think
this suggests he knew he was in trouble and this is why he needs a gun
so he was aware of something.
There is no way that LHO if he was assassin could not have considered
there would a good change he would be arrested within 2 minutes of the
crime. How could he know that no coworkers would see him dashing down
the stairs. How could he know that the cop who saw him 90 seconds
after the shots would not have a witness with him saying "thats the
guy. he is the one i saw shooting the president" how could he know
that his boss would clear him initially with the police, how could he
know that the book depository would not be secured and he would be
stuck in there immediately, how could he know that he would have 90
seconds of the shot to get down to teh 2nd floor. It might have been
30 seconds. some cop could have come rushing in from the first shot.
There is no way he could know any of these things. and surely if he
decided to do the deed the night before after being spurned by his
wife he would have considered and made plans for what was going to go
down. He was not a martyr. nothing indicates he was suicidal.
Then once he is caught (and if he was guilty he would have been aware
of all the evidence the police had against him) he says he didnt do it
and he was a Patsy. Why bother. Just delaying the inevitable.
Lee Harvey Oswald wasnt stupid. He was a patsy.
Walt
You're right....and you have used commonsense in reaching your
conclusion.
Anybody with an ounce of commonsense would realize immediately that
the assassination smacked of a set up....Or as acting AG, Katenzenbach
himself said...."The whole senario seems to be just a little too pat
to be believable".
David Von Pein
Two words can easily debunk all of Scott Zimmer's silliness:
John Hinckley.
Bud
> If Lee Harvey Oswald was the lone assassin of JFK surely he must go
> down as the dumbest assassin ever in recorded history.
Yet ranks high in the more meaningful "successful" category.
> I believe if he
> did do it the process he did to do it was so stupid it is the reason
> that there are so many who doubt his guilt.
In other words, if he did do it, he fooled you. Really, how hard is
that?
> In the annals of crime
> when a criminal committing a crime proceeds with the crime he makes
> plans and works out how to get away with it.
Oswald gets an "A+" so far. Yet some feel the need to second guess
his success, offer means to improve on it decades after the fact. I
like to call such people "retards".
> An escape straight away
> from the Texas Book Deposity the scene of the crime, a hideout to keep
> low while the manhunt was on, an escape to another country or at least
> state. Lee Harvey Oswald it seems would have none of that.
He is smarter than you, he knows any of that effort would be futile.
He expected his name to be known by the time he got to the
boardinghouse, which is why he had the cab pass by, so he could see if
the coast was clear. He knew it wouldn`t be long before everyone saw
his face on TV, and his time as a free man, and probably a live man,
was limited. But he did have a small window of opportunity to grab his
gun, and take another crack at Walker.
> If what
> I have read is correct he made a request to go back to his wife the
> night before and she turned him down so he decided "Damn, Marina wont
> take me back I am going to kill the president" Really strange reaction
> to a broken heart but who can figure?
Not you. A person in this position might contemplate suicide, it
happens all the time. A political extremist, with the most powerful
politician in the world passing under his nose might contemplate an
extroverted suicide. Seeing all the ducks lining it up in a row, it
must have seemed like fate to him. And thats how it looks to me also.
> So next morning he wakes up and
> thinks right todays the day - i kill JFK. I have my italian rifle
> there.
You think it`s a coincidence he went to the location his rifle was
kept? No wonder you are stumped.
Ever wonder why Oswald owned a rifle at all? He didn`t hunt, well,
animals anyway.
> I can put it in a paper bag and take it to work then bang JFK
> is dead. No thoughts of getting out of the place, he decides he will
> play it by ear as the day unfolds.
The primary goal would be killing JFK. Everything might take a back
seat to that.
> The only thing he can think of is
> once i have killed him all i have to do is get down to the 2nd floor.
> any cop who sees me will be told by one of my managers that i work
> there and I get away with the crime of the century scott free. How
> he had this precognition to tell him this and not that he will be
> killed by Jack Ruby a couple of days later is open to speculation.
Pretty stupid to think he knew it would unfold like it did.
> Of course Lee has forgotten that he has used a rifle that he ordered
> through mail order to his alias, he has left his finger prints all
> over the place on the 6th floor and shell casings are nicely left for
> the police to find too.
<snicker> Brilliant. You conclude he must be innocent because there
is evidence indicating his guilt. You`ll fit in well with the other
retards here.
> Maybe he realises this when the cop and his
> manager find him on the 2nd floor or else he decides " hey me
> innocently hanging around the 2nd floor might not be going to work. I
> better get out of here. Better get my pistol too. I didnt need it
> till now even though I assassinated the most powerful man on earth."
Had he brought it, it might have hindered him from completing his
goal. Leaving it home did not.
> Lee, Lee?? He then decides " I know what I will do. I will go home
> get my gun and walk over to the theatre. shoot any damn cops that try
> and stop me.
No, likely he was going after Walker. The train station was in the
direction he was heading, which went right up into Walker`s neck of
the woods.
> It was not for Lee Harvey Oswald to hide his crime which any sensible
> person would do. Gloves, a mask at least. Pick up the spent shells.
> Instead he has left a nice trail which leads directly to him.
You suggest all kinds of things that would have been detrimental to
his success. Had he wore gloves or a mask, he might have seemed
suspicious from below. Gloves were worthless, because he had to know
that by the time prints were found, the matter would be decided one
way or the other anyway. A trial wasn`t a likely outcome. Picking up
the shells would have had him running straight into Baker. What Oswald
did worked, what you suggest might have caused him to fail, or not get
away.
> They say LHO was quite a reader. This suggests he was reasonably
> intelligent. I am not familiar with his iq but because the crime he is
> purported to have committed defies logic and is so ridiculous and
> inept that any reasonable sane intelligent person would not do it and
> is such a risky gamble I just can not accept he is guilty - of the
> assassination anyway.
I understand, I myself cannot accept that the Canadians won the gold
medal in ice hockey because I disagree with how they played.
> Once he learns of the assassination he thinks he needs a gun.
Well, this is Texas, I`m sure a lot of people went running for their
guns when they got the news.
> I think
> this suggests he knew he was in trouble and this is why he needs a gun
> so he was aware of something.
Yah, he was aware of something all right.
> There is no way that LHO if he was assassin could not have considered
> there would a good change he would be arrested within 2 minutes of the
> crime.
It seems something that would have been expected. If I was Oswald, I
would have expected half the crowd to turn and look towards my
location. Didn`t happen, and this is one of the reasons he got as far
as he did.
> How could he know that no coworkers would see him dashing down
> the stairs.
Would this bring JFK back to life?
>How could he know that the cop who saw him 90 seconds
> after the shots would not have a witness with him saying "thats the
> guy. he is the one i saw shooting the president" how could he know
> that his boss would clear him initially with the police, how could he
> know that the book depository would not be secured and he would be
> stuck in there immediately, how could he know that he would have 90
> seconds of the shot to get down to teh 2nd floor. It might have been
> 30 seconds. some cop could have come rushing in from the first shot.
> There is no way he could know any of these things.
You are talking about events post-assassination. What if Oswald`s
primary goal of assassination outweighed all other considerations?
>and surely if he
> decided to do the deed the night before after being spurned by his
> wife he would have considered and made plans for what was going to go
> down. He was not a martyr. nothing indicates he was suicidal.
<snicker> Attacking police with guns trained on him in the Texas
Theater wasn`t suicidal?
You should also look into how he got to stay in Russia.
> Then once he is caught (and if he was guilty he would have been aware
> of all the evidence the police had against him) he says he didnt do it
> and he was a Patsy. Why bother. Just delaying the inevitable.
You are saying that if Oswald was guilty, he would have said so.
What do you base this on?
> Lee Harvey Oswald wasnt stupid. He was a patsy.
Of all the approaches I`ve seen tried to pretend Oswald was
innocent, this one has to be one of the stupidest.
Bud
He said a lot of stupid things, which earns him a pat on the back
from an idiot.
> Anybody with an ounce of commonsense would realize immediately that
> the assassination smacked of a set up....Or as acting AG, Katenzenbach
> himself said...."The whole senario seems to be just a little too pat
> to be believable".
You put that in quotes, but I`ll bet Katzenbach did not say what you
put the quotes.
aeffects
> Two words can easily debunk all of Scott Zimmer's silliness:
>
> John Hinckley.
did ya see your hero last week troll?
bigdog
> If Lee Harvey Oswald was the lone assassin of JFK surely he must go
> down as the dumbest assassin ever in recorded history. I believe if he
> did do it the process he did to do it was so stupid it is the reason
> that there are so many who doubt his guilt. In the annals of crime
> when a criminal committing a crime proceeds with the crime he makes
> plans and works out how to get away with it.
In the three previous Presidential assassinations, which of the
assassins got away with it. Only one even planned to get away with it.
Do you doubt their guilt too?
> An escape straight away
> from the Texas Book Deposity the scene of the crime, a hideout to keep
> low while the manhunt was on, an escape to another country or at least
> state. Lee Harvey Oswald it seems would have none of that. If what
> I have read is correct he made a request to go back to his wife the
> night before and she turned him down so he decided "Damn, Marina wont
> take me back I am going to kill the president" Really strange reaction
> to a broken heart but who can figure? So next morning he wakes up and
> thinks right todays the day - i kill JFK.
You seem to be lacking in basic knowledge. Oswald already had it in
mind to kill JFK which is why he had made the rifle bag before
returning to see Marina. Now we will never know if he would have acted
differently if she had taken him back. That is speculation. What we do
know is that he made a special trip on Thursday night to Ruth Paine's
house. If his purpose was to reconcile with Marina, that could have
waited until the weekend. Methinks he went to Ruth Paine's because
there was something that he needed to bring to work with him on
Friday, and it sure as hell wasn't curtain rods.
> I have my italian rifle there.
DING! DING! DING! DING! We have a winner.
> I can put it in a paper bag and take it to work then bang JFK
> is dead. No thoughts of getting out of the place, he decides he will
> play it by ear as the day unfolds. The only thing he can think of is
> once i have killed him all i have to do is get down to the 2nd floor.
> any cop who sees me will be told by one of my managers that i work
> there and I get away with the crime of the century scott free.
Do you really think he planned to encounter a cop on the second
floor?
> How
> he had this precognition to tell him this and not that he will be
> killed by Jack Ruby a couple of days later is open to speculation.
>
And mindless speculation at that.
> Of course Lee has forgotten that he has used a rifle that he ordered
> through mail order to his alias, he has left his finger prints all
> over the place on the 6th floor and shell casings are nicely left for
> the police to find too. Maybe he realises this when the cop and his
> manager find him on the 2nd floor or else he decides " hey me
> innocently hanging around the 2nd floor might not be going to work.
And maybe he had no expectation of getting away with it just like the
assassins of Garfield and McKinley.
> I better get out of here. Better get my pistol too. I didnt need it
> till now even though I assassinated the most powerful man on earth."
> Lee, Lee?? He then decides " I know what I will do. I will go home
> get my gun and walk over to the theatre. shoot any damn cops that try
> and stop me.
>
Well he got a lot farther than two of his three predecessors.
> It was not for Lee Harvey Oswald to hide his crime which any sensible
> person would do. Gloves, a mask at least. Pick up the spent shells.
> Instead he has left a nice trail which leads directly to him.
>
> They say LHO was quite a reader. This suggests he was reasonably
> intelligent. I am not familiar with his iq but because the crime he is
> purported to have committed defies logic and is so ridiculous and
> inept that any reasonable sane intelligent person would not do it and
> is such a risky gamble I just can not accept he is guilty - of the
> assassination anyway.
>
And the assassinations of Garfield and McKinley made sense how???
> Once he learns of the assassination he thinks he needs a gun. I think
> this suggests he knew he was in trouble and this is why he needs a gun
> so he was aware of something.
>
Uh, yeah. Like he would very soon become the most hunted man in
America.
> There is no way that LHO if he was assassin could not have considered
> there would a good change he would be arrested within 2 minutes of the
> crime. How could he know that no coworkers would see him dashing down
> the stairs. How could he know that the cop who saw him 90 seconds
> after the shots would not have a witness with him saying "thats the
> guy. he is the one i saw shooting the president" how could he know
> that his boss would clear him initially with the police, how could he
> know that the book depository would not be secured and he would be
> stuck in there immediately, how could he know that he would have 90
> seconds of the shot to get down to teh 2nd floor. It might have been
> 30 seconds. some cop could have come rushing in from the first shot.
> There is no way he could know any of these things. and surely if he
> decided to do the deed the night before after being spurned by his
> wife he would have considered and made plans for what was going to go
> down. He was not a martyr. nothing indicates he was suicidal.
>
> Then once he is caught (and if he was guilty he would have been aware
> of all the evidence the police had against him) he says he didnt do it
> and he was a Patsy. Why bother. Just delaying the inevitable.
>
> Lee Harvey Oswald wasnt stupid. He was a patsy.
No, LHO wasn't stupid. Certainly not as stupid as your premise. And he
wasn't the stupidest assassin of all time. That honor goes to Squeaky
Fromme who didn't even know she had to chamber a round before she
could fire her .45 semi-auto.
Chuck Schuyler
> If Lee Harvey Oswald was the lone assassin of JFK surely he must go
> down as the dumbest assassin ever in recorded history. I believe if he
> did do it the process he did to do it was so stupid it is the reason
> that there are so many who doubt his guilt. In the annals of crime
> when a criminal committing a crime proceeds with the crime he makes
> plans and works out how to get away with it. An escape straight away
> from the Texas Book Deposity the scene of the crime, a hideout to keep
> low while the manhunt was on, an escape to another country or at least
> state.
<snipping the kooktard rant>
Why does it need to "make sense" to you?
Oswald did it, and yes, it doesn't make sense. Murder is senseless.
Sh*t happens. The world/universe may have a grand design behind it,
but the creatures that move in time and space through it are beings of
free will, their actions motivated by the rational and irrational.
It doesn't need to make sense. The facts show Oswald killed Kennedy.
Let's take the kooktard viewpoint and grant that JFK was killed by a
cast of thousands for any of the hundreds of reasons they forward.
(Big Oil, Vietnam, CIA revenge for the Bay of Pigs, RFK's war against
organized crime, etc.)
If a grand conspiracy took JFK's life, why does that make more sense?
The conspiracy could've waited to see if JFK was reelected in 1964.
They could've killed him in any number of different ways that wouldn't
have involved the clusterf*ck plots you kooktards advance.
The problem with kooktards is that they let their emotions get in the
way of the facts. And unfortunately for the kooktard, all of the hard
evidence shows Oswald killed Kennedy. And Tippit. You can squawk and
stomp your feet all you want, but this fact will never change because
it is an established fact. If you had anything, the case would be
reopened, and you wouldn't be posting here.
Facts are stubborn. It's Oswald's rifle. He worked in the building
where witnesses saw shots being fired from at the motorcade. He left
the scene minutes after the shooting. He killed a cop in flight, and
there is massive eyewitness and forensic evidence to establish this
fact. To top it off, Oswald lied about everything under the sun after
being arrested, hardly the action of a so-called patsy.
The autopsy report will forever show that JFK was only struck twice,
and the shots were fired from behind, with one shot passing through
JFK and striking Connally. Argue all you want about extra shots,
snipers on the knoll, etc. but the cold hard facts show only two hits
on JFK. The ballistically testable fragments in the limo match
Oswald's rifle. CE399 ballistically matches Oswald's rifle.
I don't know why Oswald killed Kennedy. There are clues galore, and
it's fun to speculate, but Oswald took whatever definitive reason for
his 11/22/63 actions to his grave. He was a deeply disturbed man who
threw away his own life and caused endless grief in the lives of
others.
Stop trying to figure out how to make any of this seem sensible to
you. You can't do it. Look at the hard evidence. Oswald did it. A man
in a building shot at some men in a car.
It's that simple.
aeffects
it took you three weeks to compose this stock, lone nut response....
Geezzzuz you troll-morons need to get your act t-o-g-e-t-h-e-r.....
Jeff
> Lee Harvey Oswald wasnt stupid. He was a patsy.
Yes you are correct.
If you watch the 'Final Chapter' episode of The Men Who Killed Kennedy
called 'The Love Affair' Oswald's mistress talks about what they had
told Oswald before the assassination.
They told him something like they knew there was a team of killers who
wanted to kill JFK but Oswald was on their side and one of the good
guys. What exactly they told him would be very interesting to hear.
But whatever it was he was following orders.
This explains Oswald's bizarre behavior after the assassination like
going into the movie theater and almost getting himself killed by the
police. This was in fact what the conspirators intended which is why
they had an Oswald look alike murder a police officer immediately
after the assassination. The plan was that Oswald would be killed by
the police and never be taken into custody alive.
That part of the plan didn't work as expected for some reason. But
think about if it had. This would have tied up many loose ends with
the police themselves killing the bad guy. Case closed.
But when Oswald was taken into custody alive this created a major
problem for the conspirators. Something went wrong with an otherwise
perfectly executed plan.
Oswald was a loyal marine who was following orders. He did not
realize until it was much too late that he had gotten involved with
liars and ruthless killers.
You can watch those last three episodes of The Men Who Killed Kennedy
online on amazon.com. I also have them on DVDs which people sometimes
ask me for since I can copy them for free.
Those 'Final Chapter' episodes aired on The History Channel in 2003
for the 40th anniversary of the assassination. They name names about
who the conspirators were and Lyin' Lyndon is at the top of the
list.
Within a few short days of being shown on TV the Johnson family and
some other hypocrites like former president Carter took legal action
and had them pulled off the market. So the hypocrisy and lies
continue.
Not for me though. I want to make a movie about this assassination
based on The Men Who Killed Kennedy.
Well it's only a dream and will probably never happen but who knows.
It is a great story though. Greater than any Tom Clancey thriller
ever could be. The people who did this weren't stupid. A 4 hour
movie could be made about this with someone getting killed every 5
minutes and still not run out of material
The 'Final Chapter' episodes tell how Johnson was a ruthless killer
going back to his days as governor of Texas. He is still feared in
Texas even today from beyond the grave. Quite a few of Johnson's
political enemies were found in their car with a hose running from the
exhaust pipe. Johnson even had his own sister killed to shut her up.
All of this bloodshed, violence, and corruption took its toll on
Johnson psychologically I think. He went off the deep end in later
years. Perhaps he watched too many news reports about the air force
bombing the wrong targets with Napalm and roasting innocent civilians.
Like Pontius Pilate he perhaps realized too late what it was he had
become a part of. According to tradition Pilate committed suicide I
think. Like Jack Ruby Johnson got in too deep and couldn't save his
miserable soul.
The government could never admit that JFK was killed as a result of a
conspiracy. This would invalidate the entire Viet Nam war. The legal
ramifications of this would bring the entire government to a
standstill probably. They would be tied up in a legal quagmire for
100 years.
Jeff Marzano
Walt
As an adult, Lyin Bastard Johnson never had a soul..... or
conscience.... He did whatever was profitable or pleasing to
Lyndon......
Bud
You think Chuck spent three weeks composing a response to the post
Scott Zimmer made yesterday? Get your shit together, junkie, you`re
embarrassing Ben.
bigdog
> On Mar 28, 11:31 am, SCOTT ZIMMER <dvds...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Lee Harvey Oswald wasnt stupid. He was a patsy.
>
> Yes you are correct.
>
> If you watch the 'Final Chapter' episode of The Men Who Killed Kennedy
> called 'The Love Affair' Oswald's mistress talks about what they had
> told Oswald before the assassination.
>
along.
> They told him something like they knew there was a team of killers who
> wanted to kill JFK but Oswald was on their side and one of the good
> guys. What exactly they told him would be very interesting to hear.
> But whatever it was he was following orders.
>
CUCKOO! CUCKOO! CUCKOO!
> This explains Oswald's bizarre behavior after the assassination like
> going into the movie theater and almost getting himself killed by the
> police. This was in fact what the conspirators intended which is why
> they had an Oswald look alike murder a police officer immediately
> after the assassination. The plan was that Oswald would be killed by
> the police and never be taken into custody alive.
>
If the cops had wanted to kill Oswald, he would have never got out of
the theater alive. He had just murdered a fellow cop, he gave them
just cause when he pulled his gun on them, and they had the firepower
to blow him away. The DPD showed great restraint in taking him alive.
> That part of the plan didn't work as expected for some reason. But
> think about if it had. This would have tied up many loose ends with
> the police themselves killing the bad guy. Case closed.
>
Exactly, so we can pretty much rule out the DPD as being part of any
plan.
> But when Oswald was taken into custody alive this created a major
> problem for the conspirators. Something went wrong with an otherwise
> perfectly executed plan.
>
Oswald's plan was perfectly executed up through the time he fired the
third shot at JFK. After that, he was scrambling.
> Oswald was a loyal marine who was following orders. He did not
> realize until it was much too late that he had gotten involved with
> liars and ruthless killers.
>
Oh boy, are you gullible.
> You can watch those last three episodes of The Men Who Killed Kennedy
> online on amazon.com. I also have them on DVDs which people sometimes
> ask me for since I can copy them for free.
>
To paraphrase Al Michaels, "Do you believe in fairy tales?".
> Those 'Final Chapter' episodes aired on The History Channel in 2003
> for the 40th anniversary of the assassination. They name names about
> who the conspirators were and Lyin' Lyndon is at the top of the
> list.
>
And you bought it hook, line, and sinker. Have you ever tried thinking
for yourself?
> Within a few short days of being shown on TV the Johnson family and
> some other hypocrites like former president Carter took legal action
> and had them pulled off the market. So the hypocrisy and lies
> continue.
>
> Not for me though. I want to make a movie about this assassination
> based on The Men Who Killed Kennedy.
>
Oliver Stone beat you to it. They based TMWKK on is fairy tale.
> Well it's only a dream and will probably never happen but who knows.
> It is a great story though. Greater than any Tom Clancey thriller
> ever could be. The people who did this weren't stupid. A 4 hour
> movie could be made about this with someone getting killed every 5
> minutes and still not run out of material
>
This paragraph is most illuminating. This is what drives most CT
thinking. It is not a desire for the truth. It is a desire to solve an
intriguing murder mystery. No fan of murder mysteries wants to find
out the killer was the same guy who was the prime suspect in Chapter
1. They want a plot with lots of interesting twists and turns. The
idea that a twisted individual just stuck a rifle out a window and
shot JFK for reasons known only to him is just too damn boring.
> The 'Final Chapter' episodes tell how Johnson was a ruthless killer
> going back to his days as governor of Texas. He is still feared in
> Texas even today from beyond the grave. Quite a few of Johnson's
> political enemies were found in their car with a hose running from the
> exhaust pipe. Johnson even had his own sister killed to shut her up.
>
Carbon monoxide asphixiation is a very popular form of suicide.
> All of this bloodshed, violence, and corruption took its toll on
> Johnson psychologically I think. He went off the deep end in later
> years. Perhaps he watched too many news reports about the air force
> bombing the wrong targets with Napalm and roasting innocent civilians.
>
Are there any kooky theories you have actually rejected?
> Like Pontius Pilate he perhaps realized too late what it was he had
> become a part of. According to tradition Pilate committed suicide I
> think. Like Jack Ruby Johnson got in too deep and couldn't save his
> miserable soul.
>
Goddam it, I knew it. Pontius Pilate was the brains behind it all.
> The government could never admit that JFK was killed as a result of a
> conspiracy. This would invalidate the entire Viet Nam war. The legal
> ramifications of this would bring the entire government to a
> standstill probably. They would be tied up in a legal quagmire for
> 100 years.
>
> Jeff Marzano
This has to be one of the most entertaining posts on this board in a
long, long time. Thank you for the belly laugh. You remind me of the
joke about the lifelong CT who died and went to the Pearly Gates. He
asked St. Peter if he could speak to God. St. Peter told him that God
was very busy but would allow him one question. The CT asked God, "Who
was responsible for the murder of JFK?". God looked at him and said,
"Lee Harvey Oswald. He did it all by himself." The stunned CT turned
to St. Peter and said, "It goes higher up than we ever thought".
Ramon F Herrera
> Two words can easily debunk all of Scott Zimmer's silliness:
>
> John Hinckley.
LHO was not clinically insane. A little weird, yes.
-Ramon
Ramon F Herrera
Scott,
Your argumentation makes perfect sense. Allow me to add something:
If LHO was part of a conspiracy he did not shoot.
This is the crime of a century, very carefully orchestrated. Oswald
was there for one and only one role. The choreographers couldn't
afford him shooting and screwing up. The shooters had to be worldwide
class.
After the assassination, he realized he was alone. Something was amiss
- "I need my gun". He killed Tippit.
It is so telling when he said: "I need _someone_ to come forward".
IOW: "Hey, guys, here's your chance: WTF happened? Don't let me
hanging or I may start singing..."
-Ramon
Post-mortem meeting:
"Gentlemen, we lucked out: the poor bastard SOB actually killed a
cop!"
Bud
Typical of the kook creative writing approach to the assassination.
Oswald didn`t commit the murder at his work, but he did commit the
murder 45 minutes later. Stellar.
bigdog
Scott makes sense, your credibility is FUBAR.
> If LHO was part of a conspiracy he did not shoot.
>
> This is the crime of a century, very carefully orchestrated. Oswald
> was there for one and only one role. The choreographers couldn't
> afford him shooting and screwing up. The shooters had to be worldwide
> class.
>
Do you really think it takes "worldwide class" shooters to hit a man
twice with three shots all at a range of 88 yards or less?
> After the assassination, he realized he was alone. Something was amiss
> - "I need my gun". He killed Tippit.
>
> It is so telling when he said: "I need _someone_ to come forward".
> IOW: "Hey, guys, here's your chance: WTF happened? Don't let me
> hanging or I may start singing..."
>
> -Ramon
>
> Post-mortem meeting:
> "Gentlemen, we lucked out: the poor bastard SOB actually killed a
> cop!"- Hide quoted text -
>
If the assassination was a well orchestrated conspiracy as you claim,
Oswald wouldn't have been allowed to live long enough to kill Tippit.
They would have had a getaway car waiting for him and he would have
been driven to his death. If they found him at all, it would have been
lying in a ditch with a bullet hole in the back of his head. Do you
really think they would have left that much to chance? The way you
guys tell it, your conspirators were at once, both extremely smart and
incredibly stupid.
Walt
amiss- "I need my gun". He killed Tippit.
OK.... How did Oswald kill Tippit??... His land lady, Earlene
Roberts said that lee was standing on the sidewalk in front of the
rooming house at about 1:04...Mrs Helen Markham saw officer JD Tippit
murdered at 1:06. The site of Tippit's murder was nearly a mile
(9/10) away from the rooming house. How did Lee get from the rooming
house to the scene of Tippits murder in just TWO minutes????
>
> It is so telling when he said: "I need _someone_ to come forward".
> IOW: "Hey, guys, here's your chance: WTF happened? Don't let me
> hanging or I may start singing..."
>
> -Ramon
>
> Post-mortem meeting:
> "Gentlemen, we lucked out: the poor bastard SOB actually killed a
> cop!"- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Chuck Schuyler
>
> Typical of the kook creative writing approach to the assassination.
> Oswald didn`t commit the murder at his work, but he did commit the
> murder 45 minutes later. Stellar.
The JFK assassination has turned into a creative writing exercise for
the kooktards to wax poetic. Dealey plaza is their writing tablet and
the events and characters of the 60's are there to be moved around in
endless and fascinating combinations to satisfy the kooktard musings.
Like a toy snow globe, when the flakes have settled, the kooktard
gives the JFK goblet another shake and a whole new series of pleasing-
to-the-kooktard vistas is presented to share with their kooktard
friends.
Scott Zimmer will fit in well around here.
aeffects
> On Mar 29, 5:52 pm, Bud <sirsl...@fast.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Typical of the kook creative writing approach to the assassination.
> > Oswald didn`t commit the murder at his work, but he did commit the
> > murder 45 minutes later. Stellar.
>
> The JFK assassination has turned into a creative writing exercise for
> the kooktards to wax poetic.
sirdown ya fucking dipshit.... as you "wax poetic".... Jeeeeesz, do
they make all lone nut kook-tards as fucking stewpid as you?
Get out of those nylons and act like a man ya moron!
<snip the insane, lone nut bullshit>
Ramon F Herrera
Let's begin by the premise that the "kook CTs" are a low form of life.
What does that say about a group whose only purpose in life seems to
be to follow said kooks around and try to harass them?
At least the conspiracists have clear motivation and purpose. They
have achieved several investigations.
Note: I have respect for Prof. McAdams and serious researchers.
-Ramon
Walt
McAdams is a government paid disinformationalist......He's a liar and
a skunk who would sell his daughter for a buck.
>
> -Ramon- Hide quoted text -
Ramon F Herrera
Walt,
One thing I find hilarious is all those detective movies (Columbo,
Murder She Wrote, Monk, etc.) in which the accurate timing of events
is the fundamental basis to uncover the crime.
Who the hell goes around seeing things with a watch in their hands?
Even if they did, the Network Time Protocol (NTP) was not in use in
1963.
The paraffin test came negative in the cheeks, positive in his hands.
Having a lookalike (or anybody else) kill Tippit is too "Mission
Impossible" for me.
I happen to be a minimal CT.
-Ramon
Bud
An excellent place to start.
> What does that say about a group whose only purpose in life seems to
> be to follow said kooks around and try to harass them?
It says that how things seem to you and reality differ once more. I
don`t follow anyone, I wouldn`t walk across the street to meet, hinder
or dissuade a conspiracy kook.
> At least the conspiracists have clear motivation and purpose.
Yah, to subvert reality into something more to their liking.
You may be right when you imply that LNers motivations and purpose
aren`t clear, I`m not sure what mine are entirely. I`ve always been a
natural skeptic, I`ve always butted heads with the people who bought
into the "ancient astronaut" crap, the Bermuda Triangle crap, ghosts,
UFOs, bigfoot, ect. I never really looked at the assassination too
closely, but it always seemed that the authorities had what you have
when there is a guilty party. When I got a computer about 8 years ago,
I came here to see what all the fuss was about. What is immediately
obvious is that the conspiracy kooks go to the "amazing and
extraordinary" well way, Way, WAY too often for their ideas to have
any merit. I guess I just haven`t tired of pointing this out to them
yet.
>They
> have achieved several investigations.
Certainly the government hoped the investigations would still the
suspicions. I think they gave up on that hope.
> Note: I have respect for Prof. McAdams and serious researchers.
I find it hard to respect anyone who goes to the lengths conspiracy
kooks go to pretend Oswald wasn`t responsible for these crimes.
> -Ramon
bigdog
> What does that say about a group whose only purpose in life seems to
> be to follow said kooks around and try to harass them?
>
Kooktards can be fun to watch.
> At least the conspiracists have clear motivation and purpose. They
> have achieved several investigations.
>
If self deception can be described as a clear purpose.
> Note: I have respect for Prof. McAdams and serious researchers.
>
Walt
LBJ's hand picked, select "Blue Ribbon Committee", The Warren
Commission Established chronologies of events...THEY must have
thought it important...And rightfully so, The time the crime occurred
is CRUCIAL in any case.
>
> The paraffin test came negative in the cheeks, positive in his hands.
WHERE on the hands was the traces of nitrate found???.....Check the
FACTS....The traces of nitrate were found on PALM SIDE of Oswald's
hands. When a person fires a rovolver the nitrate is deposited on the
DORSAL side of the hand..NOT THE PALM SIDE!!!
>
> Having a lookalike (or anybody else) kill Tippit is too "Mission
> Impossible" for me.
The murder of the President of the United States was a desperate and
very dangerous act.... The men who planned to murder JFK wanted to
be sure that Oswald would hang for their crime. Do you think they
wouldn't have employed a Oswald look alike to be sure he was made the
patsy???
>
> I happen to be a minimal CT.
>
> -Ramon- Hide quoted text -
Jeff
> On Mar 29, 11:11 am, Jeff <rjmarz...@gmail.com> wrote:> On Mar 28, 11:31 am, SCOTT ZIMMER <dvds...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Lee Harvey Oswald wasnt stupid. He was a patsy.
>
> > Yes you are correct.
>
> long, long time. Thank you for the belly laugh. You remind me of the
> joke about the lifelong CT who died and went to the Pearly Gates. He
> asked St. Peter if he could speak to God. St. Peter told him that God
> was very busy but would allow him one question. The CT asked God, "Who
> was responsible for the murder of JFK?". God looked at him and said,
> "Lee Harvey Oswald. He did it all by himself." The stunned CT turned
> to St. Peter and said, "It goes higher up than we ever thought".
I don't know if you realize this bigdog but I'm not the only person in
America and the rest of the world who think Oswald didn't kill JFK. A
high percentage of the American public thinks this assassination
stinks to the high heavens.
And they are right !
Jeff Marzano
Jeff
I disagree.
What better way to deceive the public than to have the police shoot
Oswald ? It's perfect.
To take him away and shoot him would have been too suspicious. It
would have indicated that multiple people were involved. That's not
what they wanted.
But I just don't know what went wrong. Why didn't the plan work ?
Then things got messy when they had to have Ruby shoot Oswald in the
police station. This was not part of the plan !
The explanation ? Ruby, a red blooded American and patriot, was
outraged that Oswald had killed the president and so threw his entire
life away to serve up his own brand of patriotic justice.
Jeff Marzano
Jeff
Right !
It wasn't Oswald who shot officer Tippit in cold blood. It was an
Oswald look alike, maybe the same guy who made the big scene at that
foreign embassy down in Cuba or wherever it was.
It all makes perfect sense. Murder Tippit and then the police will
shoot Oswald on sight.
Jeff Marzano
Ben Holmes
Jeff says...
>
>On Mar 29, 2:42=A0pm, bigdog <jecorbett1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> On Mar 29, 11:11=A0am, Jeff <rjmarz...@gmail.com> wrote:> On Mar 28, 11:3=
>1=A0am, SCOTT ZIMMER <dvds...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > > Lee Harvey Oswald wasnt stupid. He was a patsy.
>>
>> > Yes you are correct.
>>
>> This has to be one of the most entertaining posts on this board in a
>> long, long time. Thank you for the belly laugh. You remind me of the
>> joke about the lifelong CT who died and went to the Pearly Gates. He
>> asked St. Peter if he could speak to God. St. Peter told him that God
>> was very busy but would allow him one question. The CT asked God, "Who
>> was responsible for the murder of JFK?". God looked at him and said,
>> "Lee Harvey Oswald. He did it all by himself." The stunned CT turned
>> to St. Peter and said, "It goes higher up than we ever thought".
>
>I don't know if you realize this bigdog but I'm not the only person in
>America and the rest of the world who think Oswald didn't kill JFK. A
>high percentage of the American public thinks this assassination
>stinks to the high heavens.
>
>And they are right !
>
> Jeff Marzano
"Bigdog" is one of our forum's more prolific trolls. He won't deal with the
evidence in this case, and generally isn't worth the time you spend reading his
posts.
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ben Holmes
Learn to Make Money with a Website - http://www.burningknife.com
Bud
> In article <e61c80ec-2f89-4707-a73a-05aab48d6...@y17g2000yqd.googlegroups.com>,
> Jeff says...
>
>
>
>
>
> >On Mar 29, 2:42=A0pm, bigdog <jecorbett1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> On Mar 29, 11:11=A0am, Jeff <rjmarz...@gmail.com> wrote:> On Mar 28, 11:3=
> >1=A0am, SCOTT ZIMMER <dvds...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > Lee Harvey Oswald wasnt stupid. He was a patsy.
>
> >> > Yes you are correct.
>
> >> This has to be one of the most entertaining posts on this board in a
> >> long, long time. Thank you for the belly laugh. You remind me of the
> >> joke about the lifelong CT who died and went to the Pearly Gates. He
> >> asked St. Peter if he could speak to God. St. Peter told him that God
> >> was very busy but would allow him one question. The CT asked God, "Who
> >> was responsible for the murder of JFK?". God looked at him and said,
> >> "Lee Harvey Oswald. He did it all by himself." The stunned CT turned
> >> to St. Peter and said, "It goes higher up than we ever thought".
>
> >I don't know if you realize this bigdog but I'm not the only person in
> >America and the rest of the world who think Oswald didn't kill JFK. A
> >high percentage of the American public thinks this assassination
> >stinks to the high heavens.
>
> >And they are right !
>
> > Jeff Marzano
>
> "Bigdog" is one of our forum's more prolific trolls. He won't deal with the
> evidence in this case, and generally isn't worth the time you spend reading his
> posts.
Ben`s inability to deal with the actual evidence in this case leads
him to hide from almost every poster who has the ability to expose
this uncomfortable truth about him.
robcap...@netscape.com
Jeff, ask yourself this, IF it was an LHO look alike, why did NONE of
the primary witnesses say it was LHO?? ONLY Markham would after much
prompting and assisting. IF the man who shot JDT looked like LHO then
EVERYONE should have said -- it was LHO (the look alike)!
IMO It was either Roscoe White or another cop that shot him as they
found another cop's uniform top in the back seat of JDT's car.
> It all makes perfect sense. Murder Tippit and then the police will
> shoot Oswald on sight.
And some others have said JDT's body was used for the autopsy of JFK
to hide the true nature of his wounds. I am NOT saying I buy this
100%, but NO-one can deny the rudeness and quickness used in
retrieving JDT's body! He supposedly looked a lot like JFK and his
fellow cops called him "Jack" in jest.
Just something to think about.
Walt
wrote:
You're a complete LOON!!.... JD Tippit looked as much like JFK as
J.Edgar Hoover did.
>
> Just something to think about.- Hide quoted text -
robcap...@netscape.com
IF you actually kept up to date with current research (current as in
the last 15 years) you would NOT make such a fool of yourself Walt.
There are quite a few who have made this point in their research, but
one of the earliest leaders of this suggestion was Robert
Morningstar! Here is a link to his some of his work in this area! I
suggest you read it and get up to speed you lying WC shill!
Walt
Hey Ya stupid Bastard.....I have two perfectly good eyes....I can look
at a photos and compare JFK and JD Tippit. Unlike you, I don't need
someone else telling me what to believe.
I can compare photos and SEE that Tippit looked about as much like JFK
as Walter Cronkite. Get your head outta yer ass and LOOK...and use
that tiny little pea brain of yours for once.
but
> one of the earliest leaders of this suggestion was Robert
> Morningstar! Here is a link to his some of his work in this area! I
> suggest you read it and get up to speed you lying WC shill!
>
> http://www.jfkresearch.com/morningstar/morningstar3-2.htm- Hide quoted text -
Jeff
wrote:
Right I have heard about how they doctored up the autopsy photos of
JFK.
Using modern photographic analysis techniques they can see that
morticians' wax was used to fill in the massive hole in the back of
JFKs head to make it look like an entry wound.
There's another theory that they removed Oswald's head from the grave
and replaced it or something along those lines.
Also they went into the funeral parlor and took Oswald's dead hand to
put fingerprints on the rifle.
Jeff
robcap...@netscape.com
YOU sure could fool me Walt, YOU believe almost every lie the WC tells
you!
> I can compare photos and SEE that Tippit looked about as much like JFK
> as Walter Cronkite. Get your head outta yer ass and LOOK...and use
> that tiny little pea brain of yours for once.
YOU must be blind moron, or a liar. I think both are applicable
myself.
robcap...@netscape.com
>
> - Show quoted text -
The main point is NO double shot JDT or LHO would have been ID'd, that
is the key point.
David Von Pein
>>> "The main point is NO double shot JDT or LHO would have been ID'd." <<<
I see that since joining the acj asylum in October 2007, Robby hasn't
gotten any better at investigation, because Retard Rob thinks LHO
wasn't IDed as Tippit's killer.
Can a kook's beliefs get any kookier than that?
Walt
Rob ....Let Jeff be a lesson to you..... Do you now see why it's
important to stop the bullshit.
They put Oswald's finger prints on the rifle by using Oswald's dead
hand!!... How utterly ridiculous!!!....Since Oswald's prints were
never found on the rifle.
>
> Jeff- Hide quoted text -
Walt
Helen Markham saw JD Tippit shot....She said the killer was "kinda
short", "and a little bit heavy"...with "dark bushy hair"....Does this
sound like Oswald to you??
David Von Pein
Markham IDed Oswald.
Scoggins IDed Oswald.
Callaway IDed Oswald.
Patterson IDed Oswald.
V. Davis IDed Oswald.
B. Davis IDed Oswald.
Reynolds IDed Oswald.
Lewis IDed Oswald.
Russell IDed Oswald.
And a kook named Robcap thinks nobody IDed Oswald at the Tippit murder
scene.
bigdog
>
> - Show quoted text -
Your last statement is the only one that makes any sense because that
is exactly what happened. I don't know about the red blooded American
and patriot part, but Ruby shot Oswald because he was outraged and he
did throw his whole life away. If Oswald's act was senseless, Ruby's
was even more so. Oswald coldly planned the murder of JFK for reasons
known only to him. Everything about Ruby's actions indicated it was a
spur of the moment decision. The only reason he went downtown was
because he received a phone call from one of his girls who needed to
be wired some money. Ruby was not even in the basement garage at the
time Oswald was scheduled to be transfered. He left his beloved dog in
the car. If Ruby had gone there with the idea of killing Oswald, he
would have known he would be apprehended immediately. Why would he
have brought his dog along under that circumstance? I don't believe
Ruby had any idea that he was going to shoot Oswald when he walked
into the basement garage. I think he went there as an afterthought and
for the same reason he had showed up on Friday night. He was a
curiousity seeker and that's where the action was. When he actually
saw Oswald's face, he flew into a rage and the fiery temper he was
famous for got the better of him. The nature of the attack itself
shows no evidence of purpose. A single gunshot to the gut is unlikely
to produce a kill. The only reason Oswald didn't survive the attack
was because the bullet happened to sever a major artery. It was a
fluke result. Someone who intended before hand to kill Oswald would
almost certainly not have left the result to such a remote chance. He
more likely would have aimed for the heart or the head to make a more
certain kill and probably would have fired multiple times. Ruby
certainly had time to do that before he was taken down.
bigdog
>
> - Show quoted text -
It is amazing the nonsense you guys will convince yourself of to deny
the obvious facts that Oswald shot and killed JFK and J.D. Tippit.
bigdog
>
> - Show quoted text -
At what point did you lose touch with reality?
bigdog
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
I love when the kooktards get into a pissing contest to determine
which of them is the biggest idiot. This one is a tough call.
bigdog
>
> - Show quoted text -
You're giving Robocrap and Waltards a real run for their money in the
contest to be the biggest kook on acj. The palm prints taken from
Oswald at the funeral parlor were standard black ink prints. The palm
print on the rifle was lifted with white adhesive power. The technique
is to sprinkle the adhesive powder on the surface where the print is
and the powder will adhere to the oils left by the print. Cellophane
tape is then placed over the powder and the print is lifted. There is
no way to create a white powder print from black ink prints.
bigdog
Don't ask such questions, David. Just when you think they can't get
any kookier, they prove you wrong.
Walt
Hey Von Pea Brain.... What words did Markham use in describing
Tippit's killer?
What words did Benavides use in describing the killer?
Markham and Benavides are the only two people who actually saw the
murder.
What words did the Davis sisters use in describing the killer?
What words did Barbara and Virginia Davis use in describing the man
they saw near the scene?
NONE of them DESCRIBED Oswald.
Later in the day when emotions were running high and the cops were
crowing that they had JFK's assassin these simple minded folk were
only too happy to jump in and help the police.
robcap...@netscape.com
Show us who ID'd him IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE SHOOTING DVP! Of course
Markham did many months later, but only after prompting by the WC
attorney. She intially said she recognized NO one like FOUR TIMES,
before he mentioned the #2 man!
LOL!
Walt
>
> - Show quoted text -
Ha,ha,ha,ha..hee,hee,hee.... What a moron.... Bighog you are an
idiot!!
Lt Day lifted the so called "palm print" from the WOODEN foregrip of
the rifle with CELLOPHANE tape ....Where the hell do you get "adhesive
powder" Ya stupid asshole...Have you ever saw sugar stuck in one
lump?? That's what would happen to any "adhesive powder" No wonder
you a LNer ....YOU ARE STUPID!!
Lt Day saw what he thought was a palm print on the WOODEN forgrip of
the rifle while examining it just minutes after he pulled it from
beneath the boxes of books where it had been CAREFULLY HIDDEN. Day
wanted to preserve that smudge before the wood of the foregrip
absorbed the oil of the "palm print' He sprinkled it with BLACK
finger print dustand gently blew away any of the BLACK finger print
dust that didn't adhere to the "palm print. He then took a strip of
2" cellophane tape and gently liad it on the smudge that he thought
could be a palm print. He rubbed the scotch tape lightly and lifted
the BLACK finger print powder that had clung to the oil of the print.
He then had the "palm print" on the cellophane tape. To protect and
preserve that "print he then placed the cellophane tape on a 3 x 5
white card and labeled the card...."from underside of rifle near
foregrip c2766" and dated and signed the card.
Thank you for exposing yourself to be an idiot!
robcap...@netscape.com
Cite their exact comments IMMEDITATELY after the shooting! I dare
you! Then cite their WC testimony for us DVP. But he won't.
Jeff
wouldn't have had his dog in the car.
Oswald was not getting out of the hospital alive in any case. If he
was alive when he got there he wasn't getting out.
Jeff
bigdog
>
> - Show quoted text -...
FUCKING A!!! Are you guys trying to laugh me to death. You just came
damn close. First Giltardo makes a post claiming Dr. Perry had
performed open heart massage on JFK but there was no mention of this
in the autopsy. Of course what Giltardo couldn't figure out was that
Perry was talking about the efforts he made to save Oswald, not JFK. A
dumber fuck doesn't exist. Or at least so I thought until I read this
latest FUBAR from Waltards. He starts off by claiming the palm print
came off the wooden foregrip. That would have been dumb enough. Then
he claims the print was lifted with cellophane tape without the use of
adhesive powder. Brilliant Waltards. If you apply cellophane tape to a
print without first dusting it with the fingerprint powder, you aren't
going to lift shit and will probably end up smearing the print in the
process. Of course, if Waltards had ever bothered to read the Warren
Report which he is so fond of bashing, he might have a clue about
where the print came from and how it was lifted. It is all right there
in Chapter 4. I have cut and pasted the key passage, adding my own
emphasis by placing key phrase in CAPS.
"Oswald's Palmprint on RIFLE BARREL
Based on the above evidence, the Commission concluded that Oswald
purchased the rifle found on the sixth floor of the Depository
Building. Additional evidence of ownership was provided in the form of
palmprint identification which indicated that Oswald had possession of
the rifle he had purchased.
A few minutes after the rifle was discovered on the sixth floor of the
Depository Building 44 it was examined by Lt. J. C. Day of the
identification bureau of the Dallas police. He lifted the rifle by the
wooden stock after his examination convinced him that the wood was too
rough to take fingerprints. Capt. J. W. Fritz then ejected a cartridge
by operating the bolt, but only after Day viewed the knob on the bolt
through a magnifying glass and found no prints.45 Day continued to
examine the rifle with the magnifying glass, looking for
Page 123
possible fingerprints. He applied fingerprint powder to the side of
the metal housing near the trigger, and noticed traces of two prints.
46 At 11:45 p.m. on November 22, the rifle was released to the FBI and
forwarded to Washington where it was examined on the morning of
November 23 by Sebastian F. Latona, supervisor of the Latent
Fingerprint Section of the FBI's Identification Division.47
In his testimony before the Commission, Latona stated that when he
received the rifle, the area where prints were visible was protected
by cellophane.48 He examined these prints, as well as photographs of
them which the Dallas police had made, and concluded that:
...the formations, the ridge formations and characteristics, were
insufficient for purposes of either effecting identification or a
determination that the print was not identical with the prints of
people. Accordingly, my opinion simply was that the latent prints
which were there were of no value.49
Latona then processed the complete weapon but developed no
identifiable prints.50 He stated that the poor quality of the wood and
the metal would cause the rifle to absorb moisture from the skin,
thereby making a clear print unlikely. 51
On November 22, however, before surrendering possession of the rifle
to the FBI Laboratory, Lieutenant Day of the Dallas Police Department
had "lifted" a palmprint from the UNDERSIDE OF THE GUN BARREL "near
the firing end of the barrel about 3 inches UNDER THE WOODSTOCK when I
took the woodstock loose." 52 "Lifting" a print involves the use of
ADHESIVE MATERIAL to remove the FINGERPRINT POWDER which adheres to
the original print. In this way the POWDERED impression is actually
removed from the object.53 The lifting had been so complete in this
case that there was no trace of the print on the rifle itself when it
was examined by Latona. Nor was there any indication that the lift had
been performed. 54 Day, on the other hand, believed that sufficient
traces of the print had been left on the rifle barrel, because he did
not release the lifted print until November 26, when he received
instructions to send "everything that we had" to the FBI.55 The print
arrived in the FBI Laboratory in Washington on November 29, mounted on
a card on which Lieutenant Day had written the words "OFF UNDERSIDE
GUN BARREL near end of grip C2766." 56 The print's positive identity
as having been lifted from the rifle was confirmed by FBI Laboratory
tests which established that the adhesive material bearing the print
also bore impressions of the same irregularities that appeared on the
BARREL OF THE RIFLE. "
So once again, Waltards has stepped in it. Once more he is challenging
Giltardo for the tile of STUPIDEST FUCKING SHIT ON PLANET EARTH. The
best part is when he called me a "stupid asshole". If I am a stupid
asshole, how fucking stupid does that make Waltards.
bigdog
wrote:
Cite a single post which indicates robocrap has any brain function
whatsoever. But he won't.
Walt
Hey Bighog....You're damned near as dumb and gullible as Rob Crapio.
Perhaps you should take a
trip to the police station and ask a detective for some WHITE
"adhesive powder" (hee,hee,hee) for lifting finger prints from a
surface. I'm sure he'd jerk your head out of your ass in a heartbeat,
and tell you that there is no such thing as "adhesive powder" Because
if the powder was adhesive it would stuck together in one big lump
like sugar in a humid atmosphere. ya stupid asshole!!
All of the above that you post is just another of the lies created by
the authorities who were framing Oswald. IF you could get your head
out of your ass you'd soon learn that the so called "palm print" was
nothing but a smudge that Lt Day saw on the WOODEN foregrip and
thought that it might be a palm print, so he lifted it. That smudge
on the cellophne tape was sent to the FBI lab in Washington DC at
midnight of 11 /22 /63. The FBI examined it on 11 / 23 /63 and
reported that it was wortless for identification purposes.
Later the authorities were DESPERATE to connect Oswald to the rifle
but had NO NO finger prints with which to prove that Oswald ever
handled that rifle. They then invent the tale about Day disassembling
the rifle and finding that print on the metal barrel "NEAR THE
FOREGRIP C 2766". However If you get your head out of your ass you
can see that there is a bayonet lug surrounding the barrel at the
point where Day claimed to have found that print. (see CE 1304 on page
132 of the WR) That bayonet lug would have prevented anybody from
depositing a palm print on the meatal barrel as Day claimed.
Furthermore the photo of the so called "palm print", CE 634 clearly
reveals that the "palm print" was lifted from the WOODEN surface of
the foregrip, because the grain of the wood is visible in the photo,
and the bayonet groove that is cut into that wooden foregrip is also
visible on the right hand side of the photo.
What a gullible sucker you are , Bighog...........
Ben Holmes
Jeff says...
>
>Good point. If Ruby was really planning on shooting Oswald he
>wouldn't have had his dog in the car.
Absolutely! We always expect murderers to have common sense! Particularly around
helpless animals.
>Oswald was not getting out of the hospital alive in any case. If he
>was alive when he got there he wasn't getting out.
>
> Jeff
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ben Holmes
Learn to Make Money with a Website - http://www.burningknife.com
bigdog
obviously have no idea how the process of lifting the print works.
Special fingerprint powders are used because of their adhesive
properties which allow the powder to adhere to the ridges of the
print. The rest of the powder can be blown away while the powder on
the ridges remains. Only then is cellophane tape applied to the powder
to lift it. You can't use just any powder because it lacks the proper
adhesive properties to adhere to the oils which form the fingerprint.
However you want to describe the powder, it must adhere to the print
and the point was made that the black ink prints could not have been
used to create the white powder print which Day lifter from the BARREL
of the rifle.
> All of the above that you post is just another of the lies created by
> the authorities who were framing Oswald. IF you could get your head
> out of your ass you'd soon learn that the so called "palm print" was
> nothing but a smudge that Lt Day saw on the WOODEN foregrip and
> thought that it might be a palm print, so he lifted it. That smudge
> on the cellophne tape was sent to the FBI lab in Washington DC at
> midnight of 11 /22 /63. The FBI examined it on 11 / 23 /63 and
> reported that it was wortless for identification purposes.
>
A little too much Jack Daniels today? You seem more confused than
usual. Day examined the woodstock of the rifle and found no usuable
prints. It was than he began to look at the metal parts for possible
prints.
> Later the authorities were DESPERATE to connect Oswald to the rifle
> but had NO NO finger prints with which to prove that Oswald ever
> handled that rifle. They then invent the tale about Day disassembling
> the rifle and finding that print on the metal barrel "NEAR THE
> FOREGRIP C 2766". However If you get your head out of your ass you
> can see that there is a bayonet lug surrounding the barrel at the
> point where Day claimed to have found that print. (see CE 1304 on page
> 132 of the WR) That bayonet lug would have prevented anybody from
> depositing a palm print on the meatal barrel as Day claimed.
Keep exposing your extreme stupidity Waltardo. Since the print was
found on a part of the barrel covered by the woodstock, the rifle had
to have been disassembled when the print was left on it. The bayonette
lug would not have been an issue.
> Furthermore the photo of the so called "palm print", CE 634 clearly
> reveals that the "palm print" was lifted from the WOODEN surface of
> the foregrip, because the grain of the wood is visible in the photo,
> and the bayonet groove that is cut into that wooden foregrip is also
> visible on the right hand side of the photo.
>
> What a gullible sucker you are , Bighog...........
What a stupid motherfucker you are, Waltards. The FBI confirmed that
Day had lifted the print from the barrel of the rifle since the lifted
print bore the same irregularities that were on the barrel of the
rifle. Another big swing and a miss by Waltards. Look out, Giltardo.
There's a new sheriff in Stupidville.
David Von Pein
>>> "Of course Markham did many months later, but only after prompting by the WC attorney." <<<
Markham positively IDed Oswald in a police line-up on the day of the
assassination, retard.
robcap...@netscape.com
Was the BEFORE OR AFTER she saw his picture on television Dave?? IF
it was AFTER, and it was, then her ID is meanignless in a court of law
due to rules prohibiting the police showing anyone a picture of the
accused BEFORE THEY ARE PICKED BY THE WITNESS!
Learn our laws Dave!
David Von Pein
Earth to Retard Rob------
There was NO COURT TRIAL OF LEE HARVEY OSWALD.
robcap...@netscape.com
> Earth to Retard Rob------
>
> There was NO COURT TRIAL OF LEE HARVEY OSWALD.
Then there is NO GUILTY verdict Dave, thus you cannot ACCUSE HIM OF
BEING THE MURDERER and NOT run the risk of being sued.
I am surprised Marina has NOT made a fortune off of suing folks for
NOT using alleged.
David Von Pein
>>> "Then there is NO GUILTY verdict Dave, thus you cannot ACCUSE HIM OF BEING THE MURDERER and NOT run the risk of being sued." <<<
Earth to Retard Rob------
Lee Oswald is dead. He's not going to sue anybody.
And any lawsuit coming from any Oswald family member cannot possibly
have any hope of being successful, because any such defamation lawsuit
cannot possibly get around these findings reached by the Warren
Commission in 1964 (and there's certainly no "alleged" being utilized
here):
"Lee Harvey Oswald...killed Dallas Police Officer J. D.
Tippit. .... The Commission has concluded that Lee Harvey Oswald was
the assassin of President Kennedy." -- Warren Report; Page 195
http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wr/html/WCReport_0110a.htm
>>> "I am surprised Marina has NOT made a fortune off of suing folks for NOT using alleged." <<<
Earth to Retard Rob------
Marina didn't kill the President and Tippit. Lee Harvey Oswald did.
(Plus: see my last comment above, in conjunction with the conclusion
of the OFFICIAL INVESTIGATIVE COMMISSION which was assigned the task
of finding out the details and the truth about JFK's murder.)
Plus: Marina knows full well her ex-husband killed two men in 1963.
She simply chooses not to believe the facts of the case now (probably
due to the junk she has heard since 1963 from the likes of kooks like
Jim Garrison, Mark Lane, Oliver Stone, et al).
But Marina knows LHO was guilty....and she said so (several times).
Here is one of those times:
"I have too much facts; and facts tell me that Lee shot
Kennedy." -- Marina Oswald; 1964
robcap...@netscape.com
> >>> "Then there is NO GUILTY verdict Dave, thus you cannot ACCUSE HIM OF BEING THE MURDERER and NOT run the risk of being sued." <<<
>
> Earth to Retard Rob------
>
> Lee Oswald is dead. He's not going to sue anybody.
Did I say HE was moron? NO, I said Marina (and his family too) COULD
AS YOU ARE SLANDERING A DEAD MAN!
What a coward you are!
> And any lawsuit coming from any Oswald family member cannot possibly
> have any hope of being successful, because any such defamation lawsuit
> cannot possibly get around these findings reached by the Warren
> Commission in 1964 (and there's certainly no "alleged" being utilized
> here):
LOL!!! The WC PROVED THERE WAS A CONSPIRACY, and while LHO may have
been involved the evidence shows he FIRED NO SHOTS ON 11/22/63! YOU
are a liar and a slanderer Dave!
> "Lee Harvey Oswald...killed Dallas Police Officer J. D.
> Tippit. .... The Commission has concluded that Lee Harvey Oswald was
> the assassin of President Kennedy." -- Warren Report; Page 195
Claims with NO evidence showing them to be correct is NOTHING but hot
air. YOU are slandering a DEAD MAN!
Do you beat up women too?
> http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wr/html/WCReport_0110a.htm
>
> >>> "I am surprised Marina has NOT made a fortune off of suing folks for NOT using alleged." <<<
>
> Earth to Retard Rob------
>
> Marina didn't kill the President and Tippit.
She was LEGALLY MARRIED TO THE MAN YOU ARE SLANDERING THOUGH, wasn't
she?
> Lee Harvey Oswald did.
> (Plus: see my last comment above, in conjunction with the conclusion
> of the OFFICIAL INVESTIGATIVE COMMISSION which was assigned the task
> of finding out the details and the truth about JFK's murder.)
The WC NEVER proved LHO murdered anyone, and even IF they had (and of
course they did NOT even come close) so what?? The WC was NOT a legal
court anyway so their PRONOUNCEMENT is meanignless!
The sheer fact she has NOT sued (or anyone from his family) shows you
the POWER of this conspiracy!
> Plus: Marina knows full well her ex-husband killed two men in 1963.
Really??? I have heard her say many times he was innocent. The POINT
is the WC was NOT a legal court Dave, their OPINION matters NO more
than YOURS!
> She simply chooses not to believe the facts of the case now (probably
> due to the junk she has heard since 1963 from the likes of kooks like
> Jim Garrison, Mark Lane, Oliver Stone, et al).
YOU are a coward and a slanderer.
> But Marina knows LHO was guilty....and she said so (several times).
> Here is one of those times:
>
> "I have too much facts; and facts tell me that Lee shot
> Kennedy." -- Marina Oswald; 1964
Do you have ANYTHING POST 1964 when she was NOT being DETAINED and
SEQUESTERED by the U.S. Government?
> http://media2.myfoxdfw.com/html/JFKvideo/video/jfk014.html
bigdog
wrote:
Are you really this dumb or is it just an act. Do you know they a dead
man cannot be libeled? That a dead man cannot sue? That a dead man has
no rights whatsoever? Legally, a dead man does not even exist. All he
owned in life passes to his estate at death. The estate replaces the
deceased as a legal entity, but estate cannot be libeled nor can it
file suit for slanderous statements made against the deceased.
Even if it were possible for an estate to sue for libel, there is no
way it could win. If someone had accused LHO of being a murderer, as
plaintiff, the burden would be on the estate to prove that it was
untrue, which of course would be impossible. It would not be enough to
establish reasonable doubt, which would also impossible. The plaintiff
would have to prove by a preponderance of the evidence that the
accusations were untrue.
So despite your total ignorance, we a free to call LHO exactly what he
was, a murderer, just as John Wilkes Booth a century before him was a
murderer. Adolf Hitler was also never tried or convicted for his
crimes either. The fact that none was ever brought to trial does not
exhonorate them. It's a good thing they don't let idiots like you
write the history books. You'd probably claim that Japan allegedly
attacked the United States at Pearl Harbor.
David Von Pein
>>> "The WC PROVED THERE WAS A CONSPIRACY." <<<
Really? That's news to me. You'd better contact CNN about this
bombshell, because the news media must have the wrong copy of the WCR.
All of their copies say just the OPPOSITE -- i.e., LHO was a lone
killer, and there was NO conspiracy.
Perhaps Rob has the edition of the WCR that was printed just for
retards, wherein all references to OSWALD as the LONE KILLER have been
removed and replaced with "JIMMY FILES DID IT!"
>>> "The WC NEVER proved LHO murdered anyone." <<<
Still having trouble figuring out the easy stuff, eh Rob?
Maybe you'd better throw out your Retard Edition of the Warren Report,
and get this version instead:
http://Amazon.com/gp/reader/0312082576/ref=sib_dp_pt#reader-link
>>> "The sheer fact she [Marina Oswald] has NOT sued (or anyone from his family) shows you the POWER of this conspiracy!" <<<
LOL. A retard at work. I love it.
robcap...@netscape.com
> >>> "The WC PROVED THERE WAS A CONSPIRACY." <<<
>
> Really? That's news to me.
YOUR ignorance of the evidence is NO defense Dave.
> You'd better contact CNN about this
> bombshell, because the news media must have the wrong copy of the WCR.
Why would I waste my time when they are part of the coverup?
> All of their copies say just the OPPOSITE -- i.e., LHO was a lone
> killer, and there was NO conspiracy.
OF course their copies say the opposite because they are told to lie
to us! YOU can't show one piece of evidence that shows without any
doubt that LHO killed anyone on 11/22/63.
> Perhaps Rob has the edition of the WCR that was printed just for
> retards, wherein all references to OSWALD as the LONE KILLER have been
> removed and replaced with "JIMMY FILES DID IT!"
NO Dave, I have knowledge of their evidence, ALL of it shows LHO was
innocent of the crimes they accused him of.
> >>> "The WC NEVER proved LHO murdered anyone." <<<
>
> Still having trouble figuring out the easy stuff, eh Rob?
NO, you are still lying about the evidence and what it shows.
> Maybe you'd better throw out your Retard Edition of the Warren Report,
> and get this version instead:
What version of the WC's report is NOT retarted?
> http://Amazon.com/gp/reader/0312082576/ref=sib_dp_pt#reader-link
>
> >>> "The sheer fact she [Marina Oswald] has NOT sued (or anyone from his family) shows you the POWER of this conspiracy!" <<<
>
> LOL. A retard at work. I love it.
YOU are a paid liar so who cares what you think?
David Von Pein
>>> "YOU are a paid liar[,] so who cares what you think?" <<<
And I should get a huge raise after every conversation with an
evidence-mangling retard like you.
robcap...@netscape.com
> On Apr 2, 1:21 pm, "robcap...@netscape.com" <robcap...@netscape.com>
> wrote:
>
> > On Apr 2, 1:13 pm, David Von Pein <davevonp...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > > Earth to Retard Rob------
>
> > > There was NO COURT TRIAL OF LEE HARVEY OSWALD.
>
> > Then there is NO GUILTY verdict Dave, thus you cannot ACCUSE HIM OF
> > BEING THE MURDERER and NOT run the risk of being sued.
>
> > I am surprised Marina has NOT made a fortune off of suing folks for
> > NOT using alleged.
>
> Are you really this dumb or is it just an act. Do you know they a dead
> man cannot be libeled? That a dead man cannot sue? That a dead man has
> no rights whatsoever? Legally, a dead man does not even exist. All he
> owned in life passes to his estate at death. The estate replaces the
> deceased as a legal entity, but estate cannot be libeled nor can it
> file suit for slanderous statements made against the deceased.
YOU cannot slander anyone and not expect their family NOT to sue.
Just because some dies does NOT mean you can go around and CLAIM THEY
DID WHATEVER YOU WANT BigCon!
> Even if it were possible for an estate to sue for libel, there is no
> way it could win.
What?? LHO was NEVER found guilty of the crimes YOU claim he did! YOU
could, and should be sued (along with all the other liars on here).
> If someone had accused LHO of being a murderer, as
> plaintiff, the burden would be on the estate to prove that it was
> untrue, which of course would be impossible.
LOL!! ALL they had to do was produce the WC's evidence and after the
judge stopped laughing he would settle for the plantiff!
> It would not be enough to
> establish reasonable doubt, which would also impossible.
YOU don't need to establish beyond a reasonable doubt in CIVIL law.
> The plaintiff
> would have to prove by a preponderance of the evidence that the
> accusations were untrue.
That is as easy as 1-2-3! OR IOW, just present the crap the WC called
evidence.
> So despite your total ignorance, we a free to call LHO exactly what he
> was, a murderer, just as John Wilkes Booth a century before him was a
> murderer.
IT is a free country supposedly, but I am shocked Marina has NOT made
fortune off of liar like you! Too bad you will NEVER be able to show
or prove your claim though!
> Adolf Hitler was also never tried or convicted for his
> crimes either.
Why focus on just him?? Do you know how many Nazis were NEVER tried??
> The fact that none was ever brought to trial does not
> exhonorate them.
Hitler did NOT live in the U.S. BigCon, LHO did!
> It's a good thing they don't let idiots like you
> write the history books.
God forbid, the TRUTH might get into them!
> You'd probably claim that Japan allegedly
> attacked the United States at Pearl Harbor.
Oh they attacked, but they were duped into doing so. Read YOUR
history for once and learn something.
aeffects
well shithead, no CTer is surprised at watching you TWO do your highly
choreographed lone nut shuffle.... you morons need to be a bit more
opaque...
Carry on, trolls!
David Von Pein
So, am I supposedly bigdog now too, Healy?
bigdog
> So, am I supposedly bigdog now too, Healy?
That would make me David Von Pein.
Walt
Apparently you're not only stupid, you're also gutless.....afraid to
pull your head out of your ass and THINK for yourself. If you had
the guts to get your head out of your ass then you could SEE CE 634
and SEE with your own eyes that the so called "palm print" is nothing
but a smudge and it was lifted from a WOODEN surface. That wooden
surface was the wooden foregrip of a model 91/38 Mannlicher Carcano.
There's no doubt about it.....Because a person who doesn't have his
head in his ass can clearly see the bayonet slot cut into the wooden
foregrip in that photo.
Carry on stupid.......
Jeff
> >>> "Then there is NO GUILTY verdict Dave, thus you cannot ACCUSE HIM OF BEING THE MURDERER and NOT run the risk of being sued." <<<
>
> Earth to Retard Rob------
>
> Lee Oswald is dead. He's not going to sue anybody.
>
> And any lawsuit coming from any Oswald family member cannot possibly
> have any hope of being successful, because any such defamation lawsuit
> cannot possibly get around these findings reached by the Warren
> Commission in 1964 (and there's certainly no "alleged" being utilized
> here):
>
> "Lee Harvey Oswald...killed Dallas Police Officer J. D.
> Tippit. .... The Commission has concluded that Lee Harvey Oswald was
> the assassin of President Kennedy." -- Warren Report; Page 195
>
> http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wr/html/WCReport_0110a.htm
>
> >>> "I am surprised Marina has NOT made a fortune off of suing folks for NOT using alleged." <<<
>
> Earth to Retard Rob------
>
> Marina didn't kill the President and Tippit. Lee Harvey Oswald did.
> (Plus: see my last comment above, in conjunction with the conclusion
> of the OFFICIAL INVESTIGATIVE COMMISSION which was assigned the task
> of finding out the details and the truth about JFK's murder.)
>
Still this is an interesting question.
What if the Viet Nam veterans got together and submitted a wrongful
death lawsuit against the government, saying that the Kennedy
assassination was a conspiracy and the Viet Nam war should have never
happened.
The evidence is overwhelming that this is all true.
But the government could never allow such a law suit to proceed. They
would become embroiled in a legal quagmire that would last for
decades.
Jeff
Marzano