Re: A new Discovery Channel documentary?
Robert Harris
<735f66de-857b-4cfa...@b2g2000yqi.googlegroups.com>,
John Schwanik <jsch...@gmail.com> wrote:
> http://tvbythenumbers.com/2009/11/12/was-there-an-oswaldruby-cover-up-did-the-
> mob-kill-jfk-premieres-november-22/33492
This will be another disinformation piece, like the Discovery Channel has
become famous for. I'm betting they will claim that Ruby went to the
Western Union office to send money to Karen Carlin, but forget to mention
what she said that same day when she was interrogated by the Secret
Service.
"At the beginning of the above interview Mrs. Carlin was highly agitated
and was reluctant to make any statement to me. She stated to me that she
was under the impression that Lee Harvey Oswald, Jack Ruby and other
individuals unkown to her, were involved in a plot to assassinate
President Kennedy and that she would be killed if she gave any information
to the authorities. It was only through the aid of her husband that she
would give any information at all. She twisted in her chair, stammered in
her speech, and seemed on the point of hysteria."
Robert Harris
David Von Pein
www.google.com/group/alt.assassination.jfk/msg/cdc1d5dd8994cffc
>>> "I'm betting they will claim that Ruby went to the Western Union office to send money to Karen Carlin, but forget to mention what she said that same day when she was interrogated by the Secret Service. .... "At the beginning of the above interview Mrs. Carlin was highly agitated and was reluctant to make any statement to me. She stated to me that she was under the impression that Lee Harvey Oswald, Jack Ruby and other individuals unknown to her were involved in a plot to assassinate President Kennedy and that she would be killed if she gave any information to the authorities. It was only through the aid of her husband that she would give any information at all. She twisted in her chair, stammered in her speech, and seemed on the point of hysteria." " <<<
So?
What do Karen Carlin's erroneous "impressions" about a Ruby/Oswald
connection have to do with anything at all?
Answer: Nothing.
Carlin's nervous and agitated state on 11/24/63 when she spoke with
the authorities doesn't change any of the following facts (which are
facts that certainly do not lead down the road marked "JACK RUBY
KILLED LEE HARVEY OSWALD AS PART OF A PRE-PLANNED CONSPIRACY PLOT"):
1.) In order to obtain a $25 advance from her employer, Karen Carlin
called Jack Ruby at Ruby's apartment after 10:00 AM CST on 11/24/63.
2.) Ruby, as a result of Carlin's phone call, went to the Western
Union office in downtown Dallas, a very short distance from the Dallas
City Hall where Oswald was being held.
3.) Ruby took his "wife" (his dog, Sheba) with him when he went
downtown.
4.) Ruby wired $25 to Karen Carlin at 11:17 AM CST.
5.) Ruby then strolled to the nearby City Hall (DPD) basement after
exiting the Western Union office.
6.) Ruby couldn't have been inside the DPD basement garage for more
than one minute (tops) before he shot and killed Oswald.
None of the above occurrences change in any way (or suddenly take on
any kind of a "conspiratorial" meaning) just because the person who
made the telephone call to Jack Ruby on the morning of November 24th
was "highly agitated" and was "reluctant to make any statement" to the
authorities after Ruby killed Oswald.
And none of the above six facts change in any way at all just because
Mrs. Carlin was "under the impression that Lee Harvey Oswald, Jack
Ruby and other individuals unknown to her were involved in a plot to
assassinate President Kennedy".
It's quite obvious that Karen Carlin was merely taking a wild stab in
the dark when she said she was "under the impression" that Ruby and
Oswald were "involved in a plot to assassinate President Kennedy".
But it's only AFTER Ruby kills Oswald that Carlin gets scared and
starts to think that Ruby might have been involved in the killing of
JFK.
But so what? A whole lot of people around the world had the very same
kind of "impressions" and thoughts going through their heads right
after the assassin of the President was himself murdered. Who WOULDN'T
have had such thoughts of conspiracy at that point in time?
But how does Carlin's being scared and afraid to talk CHANGE THE ABOVE
SIX FACTS?
Or would Robert Harris now like to slap handcuffs on Mrs. Karen
Bennett Carlin and pretend that she, too, was a co-conspirator in the
murders of both JFK and Lee Oswald?
Some conspiracy theorists have, indeed, pointed an accusing finger of
guilt at Carlin. In fact, they are almost FORCED to point a finger of
guilt at Carlin....because if they don't, and if Carlin was merely an
innocent stripper who needed 25 bucks to pay her rent, then Jack
Ruby's actions on November 24, 1963, begin to look more and more like
exactly what they really were -- the spontaneous actions of a man (who
happened to own a .38 snub-nosed revolver) who was distraught over the
murder of a President he greatly admired, with those actions playing
out in a manner that can only be deemed pure happenstance, not
conspiratorial planning.
"The "happenstance" and "mere coincidence" trail is significant
here. It's either happenstance, or the most remarkable hunk of
conspiratorial coordination I've ever encountered (including little
Sheba being left in the car to make things look spontaneous in
nature)." -- DVP; March 2007
www.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/77edb3f67ec3350a
lazu...@webtv.net
the nutters or Establishment.- I think the first program on the mob
sounds very similiar to one they had with Blakey, Bolden, Waldron and
Scheim which was't bad overall...I guess though the first one with the
mob focus is new because of the Marcello info.? Anyway, listen to the
goddamn horseshit that the Discovery Channel put out in their press
release-paraphrasing- Ruby and Oswald must have acted alone because it
would have taken 100's of people to be involved...so, I'm not gonna be
jerked around by these assholes at Disc or History Channel again-if they
wanna believe in magic bullets, neurospasms, jet effects, no knoll
shooters,no other shooters, and the dubious authenticity of easily
disprovable evidence, and deny dozens of medical witnesses, and dozens
and dozens of witnesses in Deaey Plaza, Mexico City, New Orleans,
florida etc fine...but, fortunately most of us don't......
aeffects
<snip the Von Pein lunacy>
and of course..... no advertising shithead.....
curtjester1
Yup, Jeff, and even Ruby mentioned Freudian Slipwise that Carlin would
have to part of the conspiracy. He had a way of mentioning conspiracy
at other times as well, didn't he? Of course Carlin saying that there
was a plot to murder JFK from the Carousel is about as straight
forward of talk as can be also backed up by Jarrigan on Oct 4. What
extremes people will go to for their denial excuses is always an
amusement.
CJ
lazu...@webtv.net
cter's that Ruby was just called in to silence Oswald is bogus-from
Armstrong, Mellen, Waldron and Scott's books we see Ruby was an integral
part of the plot from the get go..he knew one of the Oswalds for a long
time, whether an imposter, or the Harvey Lee scenario...and he knew
Oilmen, Businessman etc. that were extremely anti Kennedy, as well as
hooked into the Campisi, Civello, Marcello, Trafficante, Giancana
network of Drugs, prostituition and gunrunning... as well as extensive
law enforcement contacts, and might well have recruited Roscoe White, or
Tippit into the plot...Laz
lazu...@webtv.net
have some good stuff -In the new PB Edition of Legacy Of Secrecy is 50
pages detailing the alleged involvement of Bernard Barker and this is
supposed to be on the program with the Marcello confession according to
Waldron who was on Thom Hartmann.
Robert Harris
<2ede131d-0632-47ae...@j19g2000yqk.googlegroups.com>,
David Von Pein <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
> >>> "I'm betting they will claim that Ruby went to the Western Union office
> >>> to send money to Karen Carlin, but forget to mention what she said that
> >>> same day when she was interrogated by the Secret Service. .... "At the
> >>> beginning of the above interview Mrs. Carlin was highly agitated and was
> >>> reluctant to make any statement to me. She stated to me that she was
> >>> under the impression that Lee Harvey Oswald, Jack Ruby and other
> >>> individuals unknown to her were involved in a plot to assassinate
> >>> President Kennedy and that she would be killed if she gave any
> >>> information to the authorities. It was only through the aid of her
> >>> husband that she would give any information at all. She twisted in her
> >>> chair, stammered in her speech, and seemed on the point of hysteria." "
> >>> <<<
>
> So?
>
> What do Karen Carlin's erroneous "impressions" about a Ruby/Oswald
> connection have to do with anything at all?
David, did you know Jack Ruby?
Karen Carlin did.
Do you know what the "information" was, that she would be killed for
disclosing to the government?
I think she did, don't you?
Do you think she was terrified to state that Ruby only went to the WU
office to send her twenty five bucks??
Or do you think there just might have been a bit more on her mind, that
had her so worried?
Do you think she might have been concerned about admitting that the only
reason she called Ruby, was that he told her to?
Even today, Texas still has a "crime of passion" law which drastically
reduces the penalty for unpremeditated murder, David. Ruby was just
doing what he was known best for. He was looking out for Jack Ruby.
That's also why he phoned the DPD, desperately trying to get them to
change their arrangements for moving Oswald, so that he would have an
excuse for not carrying out the murder.
Robert Harris