OMG: Martin admits Judyth is a fake--or Was That Vince?
Martin
determined to misrepresent here.
Since you wish to capitalize on the misrepresentation for some arcane
purpose of your own ego, let's let the group read your original message
(in which you make the silly claim that Judyth didn't surface until
2003) and my response.
Martin
The McAdams and Reitzes stuff is pure bullshit, Vince. McAdams began
attacking her even before he knew how to spell her name.
I consider her book a valuable contribution to our understanding of
Oswald's activities in the summer of 1963, his personality, etc. Because
of that, I made some real sacrifices to get her book published.
Whether you heard of her or not prior to 2003, she first surfaced, with
no intention of going public, to her professor in New Orleans in 1998,
showing him a series of letters she had written to her son (another prof
had sent her to him, saying he had an interest in the JFK case). There
was no thought of a book until the prof suggested it. I have talked with
the prof in person and via e-mail.
I have also talked with two of her children, her sister and her best
friend, who all confirm that she AVOIDED anything relating to the JFK
assassination prior to 1998. And yet the best-documented year of her
life is 1963--if that wasn't an unusually meaningful year for her, why
did she save it all?
If she invented things recently, why did her sister know about the
affair in 1964? Why did her kids know that she had known Oswald from
about 1980? Why did her best friend know most of the story in 1980?
McAdams has lied his eyes out about her. Reitzes was angry at me for not
denouncing Garrison, and took it out on both of us.
There was no manuscript until January 1999, and her first agent got her
a mention in Publisher's Weekly that April, so the time window was very
narrow. That same month, Salon.com had two columns about her, with
McAdams already on the attack.
She contacted me and Howard Platzman that May, and we put her through
the wringer for months, receiving thick packets of documentation and
getting her full account before we believed her, much less agreed to
assist her in any way. Before that process was final, we both went to
New Orleans to talk with her, with another witness (Anna Lewis), with
her prof, and to visit the locations connected with her account. Even
after that, we continued to challenge her and test her on things--in
fact, we continue to do that to a degree that sometimes upsets her.
McAdams and his ilk created the myth of a unified "Team Judyth"
believing everything she said. It's crap.
Chad Zimmerman rushed to buy her book so he could nitpick it to death
before others had a chance to read it--hoping that his version would be
accepted and people wouldn't buy the book and read it for themselves. He
seems to be having some success with this, with Lone Nutter allies
crawling out of the woodwork, and even some CTs falling into the belief
that Chad is "objective." He has always been a McAdams clone.
You can ignore the book if you wish, but I am proud to have helped it to
publication, and very happy to have it in my JFK library.
A number of prominent JFK researchers are currently reading the book
with interest. Harry, as you know, found it credible, and also made
sacrifices to see it published.
--A groundbreaking researcher on the Garrison investigation got two
copies of the book.
--A prominent British researcher has been corresponding with me as he
reads the book with interest.
--A prominent research group purchased multiple copies to study as a group.
--The best current reearcher on Jack Ruby recently purchased the book.
The newsgroups have never been a serious research forum, despite some
occasional worthwhile contributions by posters. To base your opinion on
newsgroup-based information is the height of folly. One
(alt.conspiracy.jfk) has largely gone off the deep end, and the other
(alt.assassination.jfk) is primarly McAdams' private preserve. The
Lifton-Fetzer band of morons allied with McAdams long ago.
I will place my faith in the relatively small core of serious
researchers still hard at work, and a significant portion of them is
already taking her book seriously. Two of them went out of their way to
help me get the book published. Now it's out there, and can be evaluated
on its own merits. I'm content with that.
Martin
Vince and Brenda Palamara wrote:
I'm trying to get you back for 1998 when you and Kathlee attacked me
several times a day---in fact, didn't you both take off a year of work
just to obsess about me (just kidding...I think lol)????? :O)
No, I don't want a war---with you or anyone. I just woudn't take Judyth
so personally: what is she to you anyway? I confess I don't have her
book. I am basing my thoughts off McAdams (heresy, I know lol), other
people's posts, Judyth's various pre-book statements on the net, and her
TMWKK appearance on dvd.
I am just afraid she is working backwards and making all of this up...I
never heard of her until 2003!!!!!!!!!!!
vince
Grizzlie Antagonist
I mean, how can anyone buy a used conspiracy theory from someone who
looks like this?
This is the face of conspiracy theory that I want everyone to see --
long hair, a beard, and a spoiled petulant grimace of privileged kids
on campus formenting Marxist rebellion, circa 1969.
What is someone who looks like this spending time on the JFK homicide
for anyway? He looks as though he should be organizing the
incineration of the administration building.
How many bombs have you thrown today, Martin? How many "pigs" have you
killed? Do you have a few words that you'd like to say on behalf of
Uncle Ho?
Phil Ossofee
to be sure, very high IQ's, now Reitzes, Zimmerman, and McAdams that's
pure bullshit. How right you are there Shack. Phil D.
SecretServiceguy
Tony Marsh crack me up! :)
vince
JLeyd...@aol.com
Judyth and her family and her pre-selected witness, Anna Lewis -- is
any indication that you really ever did any original research. I've
pointed out numerous times that you never even interviewed her
ex-husband to get his comments on her tales of their life together. I
mean they were married for 25+ years and had five kids together, he
must have some insights. All you ever do is offer excuses for not
doing the job right. The result is a self-published book that no real
publisher would even touch. And you want $49.99 for it.
JGL
JLeyd...@aol.com
chronology story: Judyth had "no intention of going public" but she
showed some material to her professor in New Orleans (a confirmed CT)
and he said go for it. But Judyth told another story in a Nov. 2000
email posted by McAdams as "Judyth on attempts to sell her book." She
said her agent, Peter Cox (you remember, Shack, he's the guy you had to
grovel before to keep him from suing you for slander) "presented her
book just a few weeks after receiving it to New York... I at the time
had not even found my witnesses for which I had moved to Louisiana to
find." IOW, Judyth already was planning a book when she moved to
Louisiana (1996, I think). Probably had just finished reading the
Haslam book and saw an opportunity to insert herself in the secret
cancer lab so as not to come off in the book as just Oswald's bimbo.
Classic Judyth stuff.
JGL
Martin
several corrections in the past, when they seemed warranted. I don't
consider them a bad thing at all, but the right thing to do.
As for Leyden, he has never corrected a single one of his lies or
distortions, as far as I've seen.
Grizzlie, of course, remains simply an idiot.
Martin
Grizzlie Antagonist
Ha ha ha. If I'm an "idiot", it's not my fault because I was born an
"idiot" but you could choose to get a shave and a haircut and become a
clean-living LN at any time, and you're morally culpable because you
won't do these things.
Martin
Here's the chronology he's trying his best to confuse:
1996:
Judyth moves to Louisiana to attend college. She also wonders if there is anyone left who remembers the events of the summer of 1963, but she is busy with children still in school.
She has no JFK books in the home, and refuses to read or watch anything about the assassination, going so far as to turn off the television if something about it comes on. Her son has to watch "JFK" on video at a friend's house, as she refuses to rent it. .
1998:
Judyth's last child graduates.
Early summer: Judyth writes a series of letters to her son about her affair with Oswald
Her son talks her into watching "JFK," which she had previously refused to watch.
She skims the book "Marina and Lee," looks at the Warren Report at the library for the first time, and decides that her ex-lover Lee was being portrayed falsely.
Fall: Judyth shows copies of the letters to a professor, who suggests that she show them to another professor who has an interest in the assassination. The second professor suggests that she turn the letters into a manuscript.
Late in the year: Judyth writes them up into a manuscript.
1999:
January: She shows the manuscript to an agent, a woman, who doesn't make much progress with it.
Early that year: She is approached by another agent, who woos her with talk of a "million-dollar book," and talks her into changing agents.
Judyth has some contact, apparently, with Robert Harris, a newsgroup poster.
April: Publisher's Weekly runs a rather inaccurate note about her.
Salon.com columnist Amy Reiter does a column about her, also quite inaccurate.
John McAdams posts about the column, ridiculing the possibility she could be genuine.
A second Reiter column appears, quoting McAdams, and he posts about that as well.
May: Judyth contacts Martin Shackelford and Howard Platzman.
August: Judyth locates two people in New Orleans who recall seeing her and Lee together, and tape-records interview with both of them, Mac McCullough and Anna Vincent.
November: Judyth learns about Ed Haslam's book and becomes very excited. She purchase a copy from Amazon.com.
2000:
January: Judyth finishes the book and writes a review on the Amazon website.
She meets with Martin, Howard, Anna and her old prof in New Orleans, where another researcher videotapes interviews with her and Anna, and then follows them (on video) around New Orleans locations relating to Judyth's account.
It's clear what he's trying to do by sowing confusion about this, lacking any evidence for his version.
Martin
Grizzlie Antagonist
Martin wrote:
> Leyden just took me to task for accusing him of distortions, and then
> promptly posted another catalog of distortions here, not wasting any
> time to extend his record.
>
> Here's the chronology he's trying his best to confuse:
Why tell ME about it? You STILL have long hair and a beard, and what
you're trying to say means little or nothing in my young life.
JLeyd...@aol.com
post a "correction" to your slanders of Judyth's former agent, you
posted as "Clarification, Correction and Retraction Regarding Judyth's
Agent." A complete and humiliating surrender. Lurkers need to type
the title of that post into the Google archives search box and see what
we're talking about here and who we're talking about. The Shack
confesses to peddling inaccurate information, engaging in unwarranted
speculation and making false accusations. Among other things he
recanted allegations that the agent rewrote parts of Judyth's
manuscript without permission and got fired because of it. And, after
claiming for years that the agent was responsible for the disasterous
Cancun gaffe and other misstatements in said manuscript, the Shack had
to confess he made it all up and "there was no agent's messed-up
version" of the manuscript. I guess there is nothing like the threat
of a law suit to straighten out a man's thinking in these matters.
Makes me wonder if we couldn't institute some kind of class-action law
suit to compensate us for all the crap we've had to take from him all
these years. Just a thought.
JGL
JLeyd...@aol.com
can take it for what it's worth. All I know is that she said in a Nov.
2000 email: "I at the time had not even found my witnesses for which I
had moved to Louisiana [1996] to find." Seems pretty unequivocal to
me. If you want to call her a liar, fine. In fact, I would encourage
you to do so. It would show you have a little backbone left after the
way you caved in to Peter Cox with that "Clarification, Correction and
Retraction..." post.
One more comment regarding your statement that Judyth finally found out
in 1998 after doing some basic research that "her ex-lover Lee was
being portrayed falsely." And you wonder why we don't believe a word
Team Judyth says.
JGL
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> <html>
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> Leyden just took me to task for accusing him of distortions, and then
> promptly posted another catalog of distortions here, not wasting any
> time to extend his record.<br>
> <br>
> Here's the chronology he's trying his best to confuse:<br>
> 1996:<br>
> Judyth moves to Louisiana to attend college. She also wonders if there
> is anyone left who remembers the events of the summer of 1963, but she
> is busy with children still in school.<br>
> She has no JFK books in the home, and refuses to read or watch anything
> about the assassination, going so far as to turn off the television if
> something about it comes on. Her son has to watch "JFK" on video at a
> friend's house, as she refuses to rent it. .<br>
> 1998:<br>
> Judyth's last child graduates. <br>
> Early summer: Judyth writes a series of letters to her son about her
> affair with Oswald<br>
> Her son talks her into watching "JFK," which she had previously refused
> to watch.<br>
> She skims the book "Marina and Lee," looks at the Warren Report at the
> library for the first time, and decides that her ex-lover Lee was being
> portrayed falsely. <br>
> Fall: Judyth shows copies of the letters to a professor, who suggests
> that she show them to another professor who has an interest in the
> assassination. The second professor suggests that she turn the letters
> into a manuscript.<br>
> Late in the year: Judyth writes them up into a manuscript.<br>
> 1999:<br>
> January: She shows the manuscript to an agent, a woman, who doesn't
> make much progress with it.<br>
> Early that year: She is approached by another agent, who woos her with
> talk of a "million-dollar book," and talks her into changing agents.<br>
> Judyth has some contact, apparently, with Robert Harris, a newsgroup
> poster. <br>
> April: Publisher's Weekly runs a rather inaccurate note about her.<br>
> Salon.com columnist Amy Reiter does a column about her, also
> quite inaccurate.<br>
> John McAdams posts about the column, ridiculing the
> possibility she could be genuine.<br>
> A second Reiter column appears, quoting McAdams, and he posts
> about that as well.<br>
> May: Judyth contacts Martin Shackelford and Howard Platzman. <br>
> August: Judyth locates two people in New Orleans who recall seeing her
> and Lee together, and tape-records interview with both of them, Mac
> McCullough and Anna Vincent. <br>
> November: Judyth learns about Ed Haslam's book and becomes very
> excited. She purchase a copy from Amazon.com.<br>
> 2000:<br>
> January: Judyth finishes the book and writes a review on the Amazon
> website.<br>
> She meets with Martin, Howard, Anna and her old prof in
> New Orleans, where another researcher videotapes interviews with her
> and Anna, and then follows them (on video) around New Orleans locations
> relating to Judyth's account. <br>
> <br>
> It's clear what he's trying to do by sowing confusion about this,
> lacking any evidence for his version.<br>
> <br>
> Martin<br>
> <br>
> John Leyden wrote:<br>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: "Times New Roman";">There
> is no hope
> for the Shack. He's still going with the phony <br>
> chronology story: Judyth had "no intention of going public" but she <br>
> showed some material to her professor in </span><st1:City><st1:place><span
> style="font-family: "Times New Roman";">New Orleans</span></st1:place></st1:City><span
> style="font-family: "Times New Roman";"> (a confirmed CT) <br>
> and he said go for it. But Judyth told another story in a Nov. 2000 <br>
> email posted by McAdams as "Judyth on attempts to sell her book."
> She <br>
> said her agent, Peter Cox (you remember, Shack, he's the guy you had to
> <br>
> grovel before to keep him from suing you for slander) "presented her
> <br>
> book just a few weeks after receiving it to </span><st1:State><st1:place><span
> style="font-family: "Times New Roman";">New York</span></st1:place></st1:State><span
> style="font-family: "Times New Roman";">... I at the time <br>
> had not even found my witnesses for which I had moved to </span><st1:State><st1:place><span
> style="font-family: "Times New Roman";">Louisiana</span></st1:place></st1:State><span
> style="font-family: "Times New Roman";"> to <br>
> find." IOW, Judyth already was planning a book when she moved to <br>
> </span><st1:State><st1:place><span
> style="font-family: "Times New Roman";">Louisiana</span></st1:place></st1:State><span
> style="font-family: "Times New Roman";"> (1996, I think). Probably
> had just
> finished reading the <br>
> Haslam book and saw an opportunity to insert herself in the secret <br>
> cancer lab so as not to come off in the book as just Oswald's bimbo. <br>
> Classic Judyth stuff. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
> <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span
> style="font-family: "Times New Roman";">JGL <o:p></o:p></span></p>
> <br>
> </body>
> </html>
>
> --------------070209030409040704000009--
Frans Lupschen
About Judyth as I call her still Judy; she knows what that means, Martin put
some key answers to the whole scene "Livingstone"; that person made her live
hell at the time she was here in The Netherlands, even called her "a bitch",
Judy didn't want him to publish anything but she was afraid that Livingstone
would take the book away from her. Looks like that did happen, and you
Martin just think that's fine. I wonder what Judy has to say about that
part?
We had lenght of talks with Judy and I am not that stupid, that what Judy
told us was the truth if it comes down to knowledge about the area she
worked on at that time (back in 62/63 etc...) I do not say that all her
claims are true or false; but her knowledge about cancer and other related
science is the truth. Why do I know that well I had some degree of
University, that is also why I came up with Termate; anyway people take my
word for what it is worth. Some people here also claim that they are JFK
Researchers; than please RESEARCH as a team not fighting about subjects like
this one. I can only tell you what we (my wife and me) know because Judy was
here for some months, and Martin one remark for you, you where NOT here, are
you just going on hearsay? I have seen all these message between, you and
others because Judy showed us......so who made her confused, think again.
Received from Judy (Thursday, December 30, 2004 6:33 AM):
From: "Judyth Vary Baker"
To: "Frans Lupschen"
Cc: "Angie Heeren"
Subject: Judyth Vary Baker
Date: Thursday, December 30, 2004 6:33 AM
Judyth Vary Baker (1961)
As you may recall, I was engaged in cancer research, and seemed to drop out
of sight. Until now, I could not have mentioned
what was going on in my life. The military paramilitary and intelligence
communities had interest in me, and I became
involved in a dual life: outwardly a student, clandestinely, continuing in
sophisticated research In service to my country
as an asset to the CIA. Didn't you ever wonder why I, who had won national
recognition for my magnesium project, and whose
cancer research project gained me Honors in the Westinghouse Science Talent
Search, plus a trip to Buffalo to work in the
nation's oldest cancer laboratories, did NOT get the science award on
graduation night?
Larry Jerome got it. I got the art award instead! Even then, efforts had
begun to pull me out of the spotlight.
After my initial training I had been sponsored by Senator Smathers and
others, in anti-Castro factions, including
Dr. Harold Diehl and Dr. Alton Ochsner.
Between 1961 and 1963, I was trained to do special cancer research. I can't
even discuss the impact of this project, but
suffice that by spring of 1963, I was in New Orleans, ostensibly working for
Reily coffee company (my boss former FBI agent
William Monaghan) but I was actually engaged in clandestine cancer research
with 'Dr.' David W. Ferrie (supposedly committed
suicide but was probably murdered during the Garrison investigation) and
renowned medical specialist Dr. Mary Sherman
(brutally murdered July 21, 1964 for her part in the scenario I am about to
describe). You may recall that I took Russian
(all fees paid) at Manatee (then Jr.) Community College. I spoke crude
conversational Russian by 1963, when I was introduced
in New Orleans to Lee Harvey Oswald. I was almost a dead ringer for Marina
Oswald when I wore my hair and makeup the same -
was same height, weight, and spoke Russian. Lee Oswald and I worked together
for the CIA in an anti-Castro project which
included delivery of live biological weapons into Cuba, one of them aimed to
kill Castro. Not only was Oswald an innocent
man, he was framed in Dallas.
He was a patriot who, had he defended himself, would have led our deaths. We
had endured the Cuban Missile Crisis in 1962,
and the threat of communism spreading throughout Central and South America.
I have been unable to speak about this for all
these years, and indeed went into hiding after the events of Nov. 22-24,
1963. I am writing this to let light fall at last
upon what must have seemed my many mysterious activities even in high
school - such as meeting with Nobel Prize winners in
St. Petersburg, and why I was never to become a doctor or research
scientist.
Within weeks or days of the reunion this matter will come to light before
the public.
My book (will be called "JUDYTH AND LEE") will deal with these events, and
of my love affair with Lee. (Name Deleted*) and
can verify my history. I suggest you order his book from Amazon.com. We
expect movie and television productions, etc. I am
sorry I cannot attend the reunion, and felt an explanation was in order. If
any attendees remember my science research
project, etc., please give them my email address. I think now you know why
the email address is so named. Rec'd an AA degree
in 1965 from U of FL Gainesville. I rec'd a B.S. degree in anthropology from
U of Houston. Rec'd M.A. from University of
central Florida in Creative Writing/Linguisitics. ABD University of
Louisiana. Had five children: Susan - M.A. Creighton U.
she has three children. Josiah has six degrees. Professor at U. of Central
FL, economics. World traveled, was present in
Berlin year of Fall of Berlin Wall. Recent trips to Russia, Europe, spent
year in Japan Has two children. James; graduated
valedictorian (rank #1), SE H.S. 1991. Won Gold Feather Award. Has B.S. &
M.A. from Vanderbilt U. Computer guru.
Has one child. John: graduated valedictorian SE High school 1992 (rank #0, a
'higher' rank than #1, as he also graduated
PRIOR to H.S. graduation from MCC with an AA in engineering and had a GPA
that was off the chart). Won Golden Herald Award
in Mathematics, 1992. Works for a company that does projects for the CIA.
Grad. U of Central FL and Penn State with MS in
computer engineering. Sarah: graduated 1998, valedictorian of her class at
North Central HS, Lafayette area, Louisiana.
Married and attends U of LA in Lafayette. Plans to be a chemistry teacher.
Just as her siblings did, she attends on full
scholarships. I never had to pay a nickel's tuition or fees for any of these
five children.
I am very proud of them. I was married 24 years - divorced after I left the
Mormon Church, which we had both joined in 1969
(I wanted to clear my conscience of the project and the pain of it all - I
had seen Lee get shot on TV, and it almost
destroyed me.) I had married Robert Baker just after meeting Lee, and had
planned to divorce him after Lee and I fell in
love (Lee was not getting along with his wife at all). Lee Oswald had been
sent into Russia so that he could then be sent
into Cuba. there is much, much more, but he was betrayed. They knew he would
not betray any of us, and he was a handy
scapegoat. He knew he was going to be set up, but hoped he could do
something to save Kennedy.
This is the man who is blamed for Kennedy's death. The cruelty of the way
Lee Oswald was treated is unbelievable to me.
I had even met Jack Ruby, who had liked Lee. The mafia forced Ruby to murder
Lee, or they would have exposed his part in
everything, as he had been a longtime FBI informant, and I believe the mob
held the life of his sister, Eva, over his head.
He knew about the cancer research project. He even thought he had been
injected with live cancer cells (he died of sudden
lung cancer - which was what our project revolved around originally). Lee
was a courageous man - as will come out soon.
I really don't expect you to believe any of this without documentation and
proof. Don't be concerned: I've got the proof.
Disinformation people sponsored by the CIA may try to muddy up my
reputation. They have even claimed on the internet that
I never did any cancer research in high school, and many other lies. It
doesn't matter. I have my defenders and I've been
able to prove everything I'm saying. I did want my class to have this
information in case they become aware of the
situation, which should occur at any time between early September and
November 22, 2001. I've lived in Mexico and Norway
as well as having traveled extensively. I have spent the past five years
teaching college English in Louisiana, while
gathering witnesses on tape and film who knew about me and Lee.
Now I am living in Dallas, and I'm receiving some harrassment, along with my
investigative team. Our wonderful physics/
science seminar instructor Col. Phillip Doyle knew some of what was going
on. David Tracy, class of 1960, who also was
trained in Russian, ran into me a few times in nuclear research facility at
UF where I should not have had clearances, but
did.
By 1963 I could handle radiation experiments on human tissues via a special
private permit at UF.
Those permits were rescinded early in 1964 as everyone became firghtened
about tracking down people like me and finding out
how much funding was done through NSF, NIH, NCI, and ACS with CIA behind
distribution of funds.
You can trust (Name Deleted*) and what he may say about me (if he will
talk - it's up to him. Many people have been too
frightened to speak up, even now). Now you know. I send my very best wishes
to Angie and you Frans.
Judyth (From e-mail)
This message was before she came here, we had first all kind of private
communications, I can only share "one" the above one. and again people take
my word for what it is worth. Martin didn't want me to post Livingstone
letters in here to Judy, and he used colorfull words I may say; so I do not
out of respect but I think ya'll got my drift.
Something is extreme wrong here, and it ain't Judy, its a bit deeper, I
might know what it is but can't share that at this time.
Respectfully,
Frans Lupschen
Martin
correction as a lack of "backbone." He will say whatever further's his
biases--and that's "all he knows."
He also continues to cling to the "Team Judyth" myth invented by the
McAdams attack group.
And keep trying to think, Leyden--it's good exercise, and you get so
little of that with your posts.
Martin
Martin
e-mails, but then you produce your own highly distorted version of their
contents, apparently in the hope that I will demand that you prove your
statements--giving you the opportunity to post more of the private
e-mails. It's a cheap trick. And you also begin the post the private
e-mails you said you were "too ethical" to post. A good indication of
your "ethics," Frans, of which there has been so little evidence already.
According to Judyth, it was YOU who "made her life hell" when she was in
Holland, Frans. There are a great many e-mails that support that, you know.
You claim to be basing your "knowledge" on what was said by her in
Holland, and yet, well after she moved back to the U.S., she proceeded
through contract negotiations with Harry, and then she and I spent a
number of weeks going through the book chapter by chapter making
corrections. No one "took the book away from her"--the copyright is in
her name, and she is the author of record, and the person who will
receive all royalties due the author.
You, who claim to be her advocate here, recently accused her of stealing
from you, among other allegations. You also claimed that she got all of
her belongings back--which is a false statement.
She has also asked that her children's names not be publicized--yet you
post an e-mail with their names.
And, of course, you end with suggestions of dark things you can't talk
about.
From beginning to end, Frans, you have acted without honor.
Martin
Frans Lupschen
Nice little scheme, Martin? No I can do be better then that, and I didn't
use any cheap trick Martin.
Everbody has his secrets, don't you? Where he/she can't talk about so pardon
me, neither I said I was her advocate did I?
About ethical is it ethical to stay in the car of WD while he knocks the
glass in from the frontdoor, ask Judy she should know, if she would claim
not to remember, where are her ethics; about the truth, Judy is lying about
the fact that I or we made her live hell, and that I can proof we have also
a GREAT part of emails that support and proof that (a trick) NO a fact!
The email is from 2004 there isn't any secret in there and that she has also
asked that her children's names not be publicized I didn't know that either,
so what is wrong with this picture Martin?
If Judy didn't receive all her items as you claim; well they should have
sent a big truck, it didn't fit you see and we are not some packing house,
I'll come back to that later; if Judy would like to ask me something she can
call me collect.
She is welcome anytime and also welcome to call us collect; nobody else. If
so let her contact me at webm...@dreamcastle-entertainment.com or Angie at
blue...@dreamcastle-entertainment.com you see we have nothing to hide.
Be advised Martin don't go to deep in this; its not your thing, and if you
have contact with Judy as you said ask her where the promised book is, we
would get one if it was out, didn't see/hear anything, neither did Angie.
You have no idea Martin what is and was going on; so keep your conclusions
in your note book before we open things up BIG TIME! You nor somebody else
want to see that BOX going open believe me, maybe it is a kind of Pandora
BOX, and our ethics are based on that, just let Judy and me or us handle
things of in peace.
Repectfully,
Frans Lupschen and Angie Heeren.
"Martin" <msh...@concentric.net> wrote in message
news:ea49t1$r...@dispatch.concentric.net...
JLeyd...@aol.com
humiliatomg/ But your "correction" is actually much more -- a
"Clarification, Correction and Retraction Regarding Judyth's Agent."
talking about here.) In this document, you confesses to slandering and
defaming this man and, if anyone paid you any attention (which they
don't), you could have seriously injured his ability to earn a living
as a literary agent. You told potential clients this man can not be
trusted. He will make unauthorized changes to your ms. and generally
"mess" it up. Really nasty stuff... and from a retired social worker,
too. But you certainly folded your tent in a hurry when the agent
and/or his lawyer leaned on you. Why don't you offer some insight into
that discussion? Oh, that's right, you agreed to close your trap and
say not more.
JGL
Frans Lupschen
Judy.... what I type here to you!
Because I know what she told me and it's in great details like this here:
I will never give up trying to exonerate Lee Oswald. PLEASE find a copy of
THE LOVE AFFAIR on eBay, or write for one of Dankbaar's CD's, or buy (best
of all) the unauthorized book that, nevertheless, contains a lot of evidence
and information I did provide Dr. Livingstone and Mr. Shackelford, along
with all the text that you'll see there (NB some things were removed or
mis-labeled, and 30 pages are missing form the end...and you need a
magnifying glass to read the End Notes).
THE TRUTH CAN ONLY BE TOLD ONE WAY. THOSE WHO DO NOT RESPECT THE TRUTH
CAN TELL AN INFINITE VARIETY OF LIES. AS FAR AS MEMORY CAN RECONSTRUCT, I
HAVE DONE MY VERY BEST TO BRING FORTH THE TRUTH. I MAY NOT LIVE TO SEE IT,
BUT IN THE END, I HAVE PROVIDED ENOUGH EVIDENCE AND IMPORTANT LEADS TO LEAD
TO THE REAL KILLERS, AND TO EXONERATE LEE.
AMERICA SUFFERED HUGE LOSSES WHEN KENNEDY WAS KILLED BY THE PLOTTERS,
MANY OF WHOM THEN TOOK OVER OUR GOVERNMENT, AND STILL INFLUENCE OUR
COUNTRY TODAY.
And that may be the reason you can't find my name on google associated
with Lee, why Sixty Minutes couldn't film me, why the documentary THE LOVE
AFFAIR was quashed, and why two researchers decided to publish my book even
without my permission, fearing that the book would never be published (I had
not taken the book to a publisher since it was rewritten: it had NEVER been
' shopped around' to any publisher, but I was still collecting evidence and
trying to find additional witnesses when they published the book without
telling me).
God bless my country, and all who love the truth. I hope to live to see Lee
Oswald vindicated. Then I will be content.
Judyth Vary Baker
Now who is not a man of honor Martin, at least I try to correct my mistakes
to Judy ONLY, not to you nor others, you start to piss me of.
Judy wanted her book, she had her ideas and knowledge about the events at
that time, the correct timelines and so on, J. Files knows her Martin does
he know you? I'll forward these and related information to Bruce and Jimmy
Files so they know what for game is in the play.
That what you and Livingstone pulled of is not ethical, releasing a
distorted version of Judy's work; I know her orginal story and its not what
has been released, there where demands in Judy's direction and worse, what
is it an opportunity to make money or what? I am not done yet, this is the
line; let Judy know what I told to you, I'll know if you did believe me.
David and Frans .
"Martin" <msh...@concentric.net> wrote in message
news:ea49t1$r...@dispatch.concentric.net...
Martin
As for Leyden, the usual crap.
Martin
JLeyd...@aol.com
exactly what Shackelford is accused of doing now by Judyth herself.
Time for another of those "Clarification, Correction and Retraction"
posts.
JGL
Frans Lupschen
knock those to the other end of the globe. want to see your threaths and
those of your friends at the time Judy was here?
That would blow up some dust don't you think.
Frans
"Martin" <msh...@concentric.net> wrote in message
news:ea76fd$5...@dispatch.concentric.net...
Frans Lupschen
Try me Martin, just have that in you I like that, just try me..I am not an
idiot as you may think.
> As for Leyden, the usual crap.
Leyden the usual crap and what is with yours, sounds to me like a moving t
shirt at his best.
Yea that is you, how did you figur that out Martin?
> Martin
Frans
F.J.H Lupschen
You are right, I don't know where you talking about with threats doesn't
sound professional in my point of view thus I can say now I don't know where
I am talking about, but don't be upset about me I still can go to a doctor
if it gets worse.
Respectfully,
Frans Lupschen
"Martin" <msh...@concentric.net> wrote in message
news:ea76fd$5...@dispatch.concentric.net...