Carroll Shelby, RIP

[Ferd Berfle]

Carroll Shelby, Car Builder Who Added Muscle to American Racing, Dies at 89
By RICHARD GOLDSTEIN
Published: May 11, 2012
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/12/sports/carroll-shelby-builder-of-cobra-sports-car-dies-at-89.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all&src=ISMR_AP_LO_MST_FB


http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2012/04/01/automobiles/collectibles/01cobra-slides.html?ref=sports

[HollywoodŽBoy]

Ferd Berfle wrote:
: Carroll Shelby, Car Builder Who Added Muscle to American Racing, Dies at

He did like his ponies . . .

[Son of Serpent Esq]

Hollywood®Boy wrote:
> Ferd Berfle wrote:
>: Carroll Shelby, Car Builder Who Added Muscle to American Racing, Dies at
>: 89
>: By RICHARD GOLDSTEIN
>: Published: May 11, 2012
>:
>

> He did like his ponies . . .

My 5.0 has more pep than any car I've ever owned. At 435 hp there
isn't much around that can keep up with it. The Shelby's are around
550 hp and up over 1000. I think they need to be under 1000 to be
legal off the track. The price jump going from the regular GT to a
Shelby is over double. Way too much for me.

It's been 2 years now so I'm thinking about something new. The most
functional and comfortable car I've ever had was a Jeep Laredo. I'm
thinking of trading the Mustang in for one of them again. But don't
get me wrong; the Mustang is a great car and I've had absolutely no
maintenace problems with it. Nice solid car. They are serious about
performance with them and they know what they are doing. The only
other car I'm thinking about is the Camero. Any opinions on that?

[HollywoodŽBoy]

Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

Man, you ast a good question: I don't have a clue about new Camero's.
Reason is, I haven't had my sniffer out for new vehicles for a long, long
time. Sad, but true. I get all disappointed if I go down that road now
days. Maybe later.

I do have friend that has a 2011 Shelby GT. It is Royal Blue, or the
Mustang Blue. He managed to keep all the decals off it. I think he said he
they showed him the car before they prepped it, and he said, "No! Leave it
just like that!" He does have the Cobra insignia by the front wheel
cowlings. Pretty car. He pops the hood, . . . A Gawd Damn Blower!!
Sheeit! I couldn't believe my eyes. Hood height STOCK blower on a tucked
under an admittedly slightly higher hood that closed down pretty like. You
would never know. Just amazing.

As far as a new Jeep, you can get them with Hemi's now. <VBG> No Laredo's
any more, but if you are talking new, hold out for the unit that can handle
the Hemi. I am just saying.

[Ferd Berfle]

"Hollywood®Boy" <"manny or borg"@spam.email.com> wrote in message
news:3eqdneg5z8PViizS...@earthlink.com...

I read somewhere that the Shelby uses the F150 engine without much change
except the blower. Imagine what could be cooked up by the hot rodders. But,
the variable cam timing is probably a little too much for the shade tree
mechanic.

I did run across this the other day. Maybe If I could get some shovel ready
jobs, I could buy one?

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupes/1206_nissan_gt_r_black_edition_vs_porsche_911_turbo_s_comparison/

[Son of Serpent Esq]

Ferd Berfle wrote:
>
> "Hollywood®Boy" <"manny or borg"@spam.email.com> wrote in message
> news:3eqdneg5z8PViizS...@earthlink.com...
>> Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

The Porsche sure looks better than the Nissan. They're both too
small for me unless it was like a second car for when I felt like
zooming around. I like my GT but I feel cramped in it. That's one
reason I'm thinking of something different... with more room for
comfort and actually having room to put stuff in. I look at the SUVs
like an old station wagon type thing. It's sort of like a pickup
with a camper top but you need a torch to remove the top.

And WTF is Woody talking about saying there's no Laredos any more? I
hope that's not true; the Laredo is the best SUV around in my
opinion. It's actually the same body and everything as the Grand
Cherokee Limited but it's 10 fucking thousand dollars cheaper. I
don't need all the fancy stuff; I just want something roomy that I
can throw shit in and not worry about dinging some fancy ass
interior. Also, the Jeep sits up higher and around here that's nice
to have during the rainy season. The Mustang would be floating in
something the Jeep would just cruise through with no trouble at all.
Even the 2 wheel drive handles great on the back roads. The 4x4 is
better for sure but they suck on long trips because the linkage in
the front end starts to wear you out. It's way too tight and hard to
steer on the interstate on long trips.

What size is the F150 engine? The GT 5.0 is really just a 305. It's
not the same these days; even something like the old classic Chevy
283 if you add all the electronics and fuel injection to them they
are a totally different engine. No comparison to the old stuff. They
have a hell of a lot more power and better fuel economy to boot.

[HollywoodŽBoy]

Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

: Ferd Berfle wrote:
::
:: "HollywoodÂŪBoy" <"manny or borg"@spam.email.com> wrote in message

:: news:3eqdneg5z8PViizS...@earthlink.com...
::: Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

http://www.edmunds.com/jeep/?ps=new&mktcat=tx-cities-jeep&kw=jeep+laredo&mktid=ga17628036&gclid=COKh6_7GgbACFQ5rhwodgBPSSg

The closest to body style in 2012 is Gran Cherokee. They have something now
called the Compas SUV. Hey, post some pics in the bin phroup of yer pony?

[Son of Serpent Esq]

Hollywood®Boy wrote:
> Son of Serpent Esq wrote:
>: Ferd Berfle wrote:

>:: "Hollywood®Boy" <"manny or borg"@spam.email.com> wrote in message

>:: news:3eqdneg5z8PViizS...@earthlink.com...
>::: Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

> The closest to body style in 2012 is Gran Cherokee. They have something now
> called the Compas SUV. Hey, post some pics in the bin phroup of yer pony?

Fuck you had me worried. The Laredo is still there and of course is
supposed to be better than last year's model. Here's what the
Edmunds site has to say and you can see that the difference between
the Limited and the Laredo is just the options/trim package. Now all
I need to do is decide on a color. I know the lighter colors are
better in those long hot summers but the Black Forest Green looks
pretty nice to me.

Maybe you were confused because they are both called Grand Cherokees
but there are different models.

http://www.edmunds.com/jeep/grand-cherokee/2012/?style=101341596&trim=laredo&sub=suv#fullreview

Body Styles, Trim Levels, and Options

The 2012 Jeep Grand Cherokee is a five-passenger midsize SUV that
comes in Laredo, Limited and Overland trims. Each is available with
4x2 or 4x4 drivetrains.

Standard equipment includes 17-inch alloy wheels, automatic
headlights, foglamps, cruise control, dual-zone air-conditioning, a
tilt-and-telescoping leather-wrapped steering wheel and a
six-speaker sound system with a CD player and an auxiliary audio
jack. An optional package adds keyless entry/ignition, a power
driver seat (including lumbar adjustment), satellite radio and a
USB/iPod interface. The Security and Convenience package includes
remote engine start, Bluetooth, a cargo cover, an auto-dimming
rearview mirror and a USB/iPod interface. A back-up camera, a power
passenger seat, heated front seats, leather upholstery and a
nine-speaker premium sound system (with satellite radio, HD radio,
digital music storage and a touchscreen interface) are also
available.

The Limited gets all the Laredo's optional equipment plus 18-inch
wheels, additional chrome trim, bi-xenon headlights, rear parking
sensors, a Garmin navigation system, automatic wipers, auto-dimming
exterior mirrors, a dual-pane panoramic sunroof, a power passenger
seat, dual-zone automatic climate control, driver memory functions,
heated front and rear seats and a leather-wrapped shift knob. The
Limited model's options include a power liftgate, a power and heated
tilt-and-telescoping steering wheel, ventilated front seats and an
upgraded navigation system with real-time traffic. Big 20-inch
wheels are also optional.

[Ferd Berfle]

"Son of Serpent Esq" <inv...@not-for-mail.invalid> wrote in message
news:74a8ae0475fc1091...@not-for-mail.invalid...

> Ferd Berfle wrote:
>>
>> "Hollywood®Boy" <"manny or borg"@spam.email.com> wrote in message
>> news:3eqdneg5z8PViizS...@earthlink.com...
>>> Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

They are 5.8L. Block looks a little similar to the old 351 W (that was in my
1970 Shelby GT 350)
http://www.ford.com/cars/mustang/specifications/engine/

[Son of Serpent Esq]

Ferd Berfle wrote:
> "Son of Serpent Esq" <inv...@not-for-mail.invalid> wrote in message
> news:74a8ae0475fc1091...@not-for-mail.invalid...
>> Ferd Berfle wrote:
>>> "Hollywood®Boy" <"manny or borg"@spam.email.com> wrote in message
>>> news:3eqdneg5z8PViizS...@earthlink.com...
>>>> Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

The 350 seems to be about the best engine around. I had a Chevy with
a 350 and I loved it. It's weird though, back in the good old days
when you could work on those things with a 9/16" and do just about
anything those things only did a little over 300 hp. The Shelby GT
350 gets over 600 hp with the same engine. I'm talking about the new
Shelbys. Do you remember what your 1970 did? The 305 (5.0 liter)
does great in my Mustang but I had another car with a 305 and that
engine sucked big time... but it didn't have fuel injection or
anything. They've really learned how to make them things put out the
power now.

[Ferd Berfle]

"Son of Serpent Esq" <inv...@not-for-mail.invalid> wrote in message

news:865bdf2fb5c5b94b...@not-for-mail.invalid...

> Ferd Berfle wrote:
>> "Son of Serpent Esq" <inv...@not-for-mail.invalid> wrote in message
>> news:74a8ae0475fc1091...@not-for-mail.invalid...
>>> Ferd Berfle wrote:
>>>> "Hollywood®Boy" <"manny or borg"@spam.email.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:3eqdneg5z8PViizS...@earthlink.com...
>>>>> Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

I had a friend that bought a 307 Chevelle. His mother borrowed it and when
she came back, complained about it not having any power. He never did live
that down.

The 351 was rated at 310 or 320 hp I think. The only engine mods in the 1970
GT 350 were Shelby alumimum intake and valve covers with a hot hydraulic cam
and valve springs. Auto transmission had some mods and the rear end was
limited slip. Suspension and brakes were great on it with huge sway bars.

The new Shelby has 354 ci.
The Boss engine is a 302 with 444 hp.

I was amazed to see that you can run 87 octane in the GT even with the 11:1
compression. Computer apparently adjusts the ignition and cam timing to
match octane.
(2013 specs)
Mustang GT
Engine Type5.0L Ti-VCT V-8 Engine
Engine ElectronicsPCM
Displacement5.0L (302 cu.in)
Horsepower (SAE net @ rpm)Regular Fuel: 402 @ 6,500, Premium Fuel: 420 @
6,500
Torque (lb.-ft. @ rpm)Regular Fuel: 377@4250, Premium Fuel: 390 @ 4,250
Compression Ratio11.0:1

Good article here:
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupes/1111_2013_ford_shelby_gt500_and_2013_mustang_lineup/viewall.html

[Ferd Berfle]

"Son of Serpent Esq" <inv...@not-for-mail.invalid> wrote in message

news:865bdf2fb5c5b94b...@not-for-mail.invalid...

> Ferd Berfle wrote:
>> "Son of Serpent Esq" <inv...@not-for-mail.invalid> wrote in message
>> news:74a8ae0475fc1091...@not-for-mail.invalid...
>>> Ferd Berfle wrote:
>>>> "Hollywood®Boy" <"manny or borg"@spam.email.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:3eqdneg5z8PViizS...@earthlink.com...
>>>>> Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

Lots of details on your engine here:
http://www.mustang50magazine.com/techarticles/m5lp_1003_2011_ford_mustang_gt_50_coyote_engine/viewall.html

[Betty]

I've almost got myself talked into a new vehicle. But ... I've still got
that '69 Le Mans to deal with, plus my truck isn't worth much as a trade
in. Is there such a thing as an automobile buying consultant for
inexperienced car-buying women?

Maybe I should just have the Le Mans painted a new color!

[Son of Serpent Esq]

Betty wrote:
> I've almost got myself talked into a new vehicle. But ... I've still got
> that '69 Le Mans to deal with, plus my truck isn't worth much as a trade
> in. Is there such a thing as an automobile buying consultant for
> inexperienced car-buying women?
>
> Maybe I should just have the Le Mans painted a new color!

Yes!!! Keep that LeMans, it's a classic. Get it painted, get the
seats covered, have a good mechanic, like Mona Lisa Vito, get its
engine all fixed up. That was a Pontiac Tempest in My Cousin Vinny
but the LeMans was sort of an upgrade to that car. That sucker is
worth money, honey! And it's a great riding car; they don't make
cars like that anymore. Oh, my, my, etc., etc...

[Betty]

Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

The interior is in almost mint condition. It needs very little, except
to replace the chrome strip on the driver's side interior door panel.
I've got the strip, I just can't get it back into place.

It's on its third color now and the paint job still looks okay except
for a few nicks, and where I scraped it trying to get into the garage
around the neighbor's junk.

I'm thinking of painting it that pearlized white that I see ... or maybe
a really silvery silver. I do love my car. It drives great.

I saw a Crossfire in a parking lot a few days ago that made my heart
skip a beat. It was really good looking. I came home and looked for one
on the Internet. I didn't know that Chrysler had stopped making them in
2007. 'Course if I had $127,000 I'd still like to have that Audi Spyder
I saw.

http://models.audiusa.com/r8-spyder

[Son of Serpent Esq]

Betty wrote:
> Son of Serpent Esq wrote:
>> Betty wrote:
>>> I've almost got myself talked into a new vehicle. But ... I've still got
>>> that '69 Le Mans to deal with, plus my truck isn't worth much as a trade
>>> in. Is there such a thing as an automobile buying consultant for
>>> inexperienced car-buying women?
>>>
>>> Maybe I should just have the Le Mans painted a new color!
>>
>> Yes!!! Keep that LeMans, it's a classic. Get it painted, get the
>> seats covered, have a good mechanic, like Mona Lisa Vito, get its
>> engine all fixed up. That was a Pontiac Tempest in My Cousin Vinny
>> but the LeMans was sort of an upgrade to that car. That sucker is
>> worth money, honey! And it's a great riding car; they don't make
>> cars like that anymore. Oh, my, my, etc., etc...
>
> The interior is in almost mint condition. It needs very little, except
> to replace the chrome strip on the driver's side interior door panel.
> I've got the strip, I just can't get it back into place.
>
> It's on its third color now and the paint job still looks okay except
> for a few nicks, and where I scraped it trying to get into the garage
> around the neighbor's junk.
>
> I'm thinking of painting it that pearlized white that I see ... or maybe
> a really silvery silver. I do love my car. It drives great.

Mint condition? Wow. You know a classic like that will only increase
in value. They are getting up to around 30 or 40 thousand for those
things now. In a few years who knows how much you could get for it.
I'm assuming you keep it in the garage? That would be smart.

> I saw a Crossfire in a parking lot a few days ago that made my heart
> skip a beat. It was really good looking. I came home and looked for one
> on the Internet. I didn't know that Chrysler had stopped making them in
> 2007. 'Course if I had $127,000 I'd still like to have that Audi Spyder
> I saw.
>
> http://models.audiusa.com/r8-spyder

Nice car. But how can such a small thing like that get such lousy
gas mileage. I guess people who can afford to pay that kind of money
for a car don't worry about things like that. Do you play the lotto?

[Betty]

Yes ... it's kept in the garage. I tried to start it a few days ago and
it wouldn't start. I think it's out of gas!! The transmission needs to
be sealed. I've always kept it up mechanically to the best of my
ability. I'm thinking I need to join AAA so they can come put some gas
in it for me. Or ... I may just call a wrecker to come and take it to
the shop. (long, silly story)

The man who owns the shop where I take it for inspection said it's only
worth $6000 (according to the book), but I think it's worth whatever
someone will pay for it. Would sell easier if it was a GTO. It's got
around 85,000 miles (or less) on it.

>> I saw a Crossfire in a parking lot a few days ago that made my heart
>> skip a beat. It was really good looking. I came home and looked for one
>> on the Internet. I didn't know that Chrysler had stopped making them in
>> 2007. 'Course if I had $127,000 I'd still like to have that Audi Spyder
>> I saw.
>>
>> http://models.audiusa.com/r8-spyder
>
> Nice car. But how can such a small thing like that get such lousy
> gas mileage. I guess people who can afford to pay that kind of money
> for a car don't worry about things like that. Do you play the lotto?

Yes ... I play the lotto, though I haven't bought a ticket lately. Three
of my numbers came up Wednesday, but I didn't have a ticket so I missed
that three bucks. [g]

[DAB]

Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

Get the jeep...I think Boi will agree with me on that ;-)

--
Thank you very fucken much for your post!

(='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste Bunny into your
(")_(") signature to help him gain world domination.

[HollywoodŽBoy]

DAB wrote:

: Son of Serpent Esq wrote:
:: HollywoodŽBoy wrote:
::: Ferd Berfle wrote:
:::: Carroll Shelby, Car Builder Who Added Muscle to American Racing,
:::: Dies at 89
:::: By RICHARD GOLDSTEIN
:::: Published: May 11, 2012
::::
:::
::: He did like his ponies . . .
::
:: My 5.0 has more pep than any car I've ever owned. At 435 hp there
:: isn't much around that can keep up with it. The Shelby's are around
:: 550 hp and up over 1000. I think they need to be under 1000 to be
:: legal off the track. The price jump going from the regular GT to a
:: Shelby is over double. Way too much for me.
::
:: It's been 2 years now so I'm thinking about something new. The most
:: functional and comfortable car I've ever had was a Jeep Laredo. I'm
:: thinking of trading the Mustang in for one of them again. But don't
:: get me wrong; the Mustang is a great car and I've had absolutely no
:: maintenace problems with it. Nice solid car. They are serious about
:: performance with them and they know what they are doing. The only
:: other car I'm thinking about is the Camero. Any opinions on that?
:
: Get the jeep...I think Boi will agree with me on that ;-)

I agree with this poast.

[HollywoodŽBoy]

Betty wrote:
: Son of Serpent Esq wrote:
:: Betty wrote:

5 or 6k, that was what popped into my head a couple of days ago. mint,
would be a different level. show ready, is a whole level of anal retentive
way and above. all these levels have their price spreads. all that said,
here are the issues affecting price. Seals: you have issues with the
carburetion seals and seats drying up and shrinking. you didn't say you had
fuel injection, but they have fewer issues from sitting around. Seals all
over the engine and transmission. that could be the major reason you got a
puddle under it now, seals. I assume it is an automatic, you didn't mention
stick, but stick transmissions leak they grease too. Rubber & Hoses: these
get brittle and crack, and leak whatever they are supposed to hold - air,
water, fuel, or colored fluid. Suspension: ball joints and bushings have
their own seals and coverings that crack and expose sensitive areas that
should not be. if alignment ("and if has not been greased") has not been
kept close in tolerance, then you got king pin like problems. tops and
bottoms of carriers in the front wheel assemblies get tweaked and worn at
angles they shouldn't. Body Bushings: these are the real annoyance from a
car sitting and not moving for extended periods. these are the bushing that
(should be) are between your frame and body. also, bushings on the top and
bottoms of shock absorbers start squeaking too. the squeaking I am
generally talking about is when you drive over a hump at an angle slowly,
and you hear creaking and crap when you crawl yer car over it. could be
coming from torsion bars underneath too (suspension component). all this I
am spewing out is to give you an idea what a used car in primo condition is
supposed to be "without". if you have 85k miles on a 1969, that is low
miles, not extremely low miles. if it went back and forth to church and the
grocery store, and never got on the freeway, you got problems. sustained
driving before you shut the engine down evaporates all condensation in the
engine. short trips never, never do! water/oil builds sludge that causes a
plethora of other problems, but nothing that can not be over come. what I
really am trying to say is, you try and push the price past six, you will
wait a while. put some wax on it (or, if it needs paint), steam clean the
engine a little, new shocks, tune it up, see what you can get if you can
wait. 20 or 40k is for dream boats taken down to the frame, and built back
up. got some time and a garage? <grin>

::: I saw a Crossfire in a parking lot a few days ago that made my heart

::: skip a beat. It was really good looking. I came home and looked for one
::: on the Internet. I didn't know that Chrysler had stopped making them in
::: 2007. 'Course if I had $127,000 I'd still like to have that Audi Spyder
::: I saw.
:::
::: http://models.audiusa.com/r8-spyder
::
:: Nice car. But how can such a small thing like that get such lousy
:: gas mileage. I guess people who can afford to pay that kind of money
:: for a car don't worry about things like that. Do you play the lotto?
:
: Yes ... I play the lotto, though I haven't bought a ticket lately. Three
: of my numbers came up Wednesday, but I didn't have a ticket so I missed
: that three bucks. [g]

5 or 6k, that was what popped into my head a couple of days ago. mint,
would be a different level. show read, is a whole level of anal retentive
way and above. all these levels have their price spreads. all that said,
here are the issues affecting price. Seals: you have issues with the
carboration seals and seats drying up and shrinking. you didn't say you had
fule injection, but they have fewer issues from sitting around. Seals all
over the engine and transmission. that could be the major reason you got a
puddle under it now,

[Son of Serpent Esq]

Hollywood®Boy wrote:
> DAB wrote:
>: Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

OK that settles it. Yesterday I saw a new Cherokee that was I guess
a new color they have; "Maximum Steel Metallic" and it really looked
nice. I've decided to go with a 4X2 Laredo X because it looks like
you need to upgrade to the "X" model, whatever the fuck that means,
in order to get the 5.7L V8. The standard Laredo only comes with a
3.6L V6 which is not a bad engine but the Laredo is too heavy, in my
opinion, and needs a little more engine than that. I've driven one
with a V6 and it just seemed like the engine was working too hard.
The way I look at this is, the engine will last longer if it is
sized right for the vehicle; if the engine is too small and has to
strain then it will wear out sooner. That's my story and I'm
sticking to it dammit!

The fucking crooks! At the jeep dot com site doing the build & price
the powertrain option says $0 to switch from the V6 to the V8 but
when you select it a window pops up saying you need to upgrade from
a 5-speed transmission to a 6-speed and something to do with the
rear axle ratio... and this will cost $1,695. Is that weird or what?
There's no mention of a price difference between the two engines.
Whatever, that's about what I figured the price difference would be
anyway.

These are the options I picked:
Grand Cherokee Laredo X 4X2
Color: Maximum Steel Metallic Clear Coat Exterior Paint
Laredo E Group (trim package)
5.7-Liter V8 VVT Engine with Fuel Saver Technology
Trailer Tow Group IV

The trim package upgrade to E group gets added when you select the X
series and you don't have a choice. It adds power driver seat and
and a few other gadgets like XM radio and what they call "Keyless
Enter-N-Go" ... do I really need all that shit?

Everything else I left at default settings. Not important unless I
see something on the lot that I just got to have.

After setting the options for what I wanted, it told me there were
fucking 78 of them within 25 miles of me. What should I do?

[Betty]

Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

[...]

> After setting the options for what I wanted, it told me there were
> fucking 78 of them within 25 miles of me. What should I do?

Write them on paper, put them in a hat(?), and draw one. If you don't
like that one ... pick another. (dammit!)

[HollywoodŽBoy]

Son of Serpent Esq wrote:
: Hollywood®Boy wrote:

I was going to start out by saying, you could get more bells and whistles
here in Kalifornia. I don't know if that is true any more. I am talking
about the state of the economy, etc. with all the mexicans, and all the
people with money moving out of here, this might not be the test market it
used to be. for decades, southern Kalifornia was the test tube for cars.
special South West packages, or Kalifornia labeled trim packages, etc. auto
makers are not stupid, so hard telling where test markets are now. maybe
Texas. at least that is where people seem to be going.

back on subject: take yer lil' print out of specifics and go deal shopping.
at this particular time, it sounds like they have a large inventory, which
is good for bargaining. just don't take the first deal, and walk to the
next place. this suggestion is obvious, but it needs to be said out loud to
help make you move for the door looking for a better price. just don't
settle for a simple fluffer extra. settle for price. your warranty will be
taken care of anywhere.

or, don't. (he,he)

[Son of Serpent Esq]

Goddamn stickers leave that gummy stuff all over the windows and
chrome. I was wasting my time with windex and paper towels when I
noticed a can of WD-40 on the shelf in the garage. I sprayed a
little on a paper towel and it desolved that sticky stuff better
than I expected. Make a note of that.

Anyway, I sort of knew the options I had with the dealers around me.
I ruled out the ones I knew always tried to rip you off and went
right to the guys I knew would treat me right. They did. Here's a
nice video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WncUgZxlzk

The audio could be better but the guy gives you a pretty thorough
look at what the car has. And the Hemi 5.7 ain't bad... doesn't
really compare with the Mustang 5.0 but there's a lot more weight in
the Jeep. They quieted the road noise down almost to nothing. The
one I had before was not quiet at all. The radio and touch screen is
prettty slick. The video shows it and you can see that it is very
clear and can handle the afternoon light and still be readable. The
backup camera is awesome. I was sort of complaining that all the
gadgets were a mandatory thing in order to get the V8 but after
getting a look at them it's like wow man all those shiny buttons
everywhere. Yes, I miss the Mustang but there were too many times
that I wanted the comfort and functionality that the Jeep has. I
might keep this one for awhile.

[Betty]

Golly ... gee whiz ... after all that, I may as well just give it away!
I think buying a new car would be cheaper than restoring the Le Mans.

My landlord had a '32 Ford Roadster built from scratch, and pictures of
the entire process are online, but I don't think it would be advisable
for me to post a link in Usenet. He ran (produced?) the Dallas Autorama
for more than thirty years. We used to go every year because they gave
us free tickets, but after the International Show Car Assn. took over
... it wasn't as much fun. He also has an original '32 Ford Roadster in
his garage.

I take it that you know a lot about cars. Are you involved in
restoration, mechanics, or you just like cars?

How do you like this one?

<http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/10/automobiles/packard-81-is-a-youngster-to-its-driver.html?_r=2>

[Betty]

Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

[...]

> Goddamn stickers leave that gummy stuff all over the windows and
> chrome. I was wasting my time with windex and paper towels when I
> noticed a can of WD-40 on the shelf in the garage. I sprayed a
> little on a paper towel and it desolved that sticky stuff better
> than I expected. Make a note of that.

Not on your subject but, WD-40 is the best thing there is for removing
oil-based enamel from your hands. Almost instant clean-up ... if the
paint is fresh.

> Anyway, I sort of knew the options I had with the dealers around me.
> I ruled out the ones I knew always tried to rip you off and went
> right to the guys I knew would treat me right. They did. Here's a
> nice video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WncUgZxlzk

Snazzy vehicle! Don't have a wreck playing with the radio!

[...]

[HollywoodŽBoy]

Betty wrote:
: "Hollywood"

Hey, I sorta just have had backyard experience. In high school, I was in a
small crowd of guys that took their cars and made hot rods outta' them. so,
I got to know chain hoists early in life. what I was trying to do is let
you know what makes something worth more in the restoration bidness'. this
link you posted about the Packard is an example of way, way out of site type
restoration. you can bet that baby has clear coat finish on the nuts and
bolts! (not really, but close.) an old timer hot rod builder said to me a
long time ago, "You will never get all your money and labor back on
restoring a car." you can increase your return in some places, but not get
it all back. what I was trying establish is a reference for you in what
someone looks for in a condition of a used car. if your le mans has not had
a teenager drive it much, that is also good. everybody should know that
those squeaks and crap I mentioned show up earlier when you have a lead
foot. what guys look for that are restoring a muscle car is a unit in worse
condition than yours. there is also a crowd that likes "original equipment"
in their cars, so that is another buyer side to get to know. if you want to
keep the le mans for a while longer, plan your trips with it to burn up at
least a quarter tank. that will give it enough time to warm all the fluids,
lubricate where it should, etc. make it a twice a month funlandia! you
just can't say, "See the country in a Chevrolet". <grin>

[Son of Serpent Esq]

Yes, I'd say he does know quite a bit. And what he said is the ugly
truth about taking care of a classic car. The mention of king pins
made me think of the ordeal I went through trying to replace those
suckers in a 55 chevy. Not fun at all. The king pins are sort of
important when you think those little things can make the difference
between being able to actually steer you car... or not. Anyway,
that's just one of the little details involved in keeping an old car
in good working condition. One of many, as you can tell by the
things Hollywood listed. I'm focusing on this because that old chevy
was the only vehicle I had for quite awhile... back when I was
young and poor. I did some very stupid things way back then but I
wasn't a complete bonehead and sometimes when I wasn't totally
wasted or actually when I was... I'd think about things related to
safety and things like bearings and brakes and various other stuff
that could fail and totally ruin my day or others maybe not quite as
young, poor and stupid as I was back then.

I'm saying this assuming that you actually do drive that old car
more than just down the road to a car show or something. Safety is
a big, big deal here. With an old car, for me anyway, it's not about
money; it's the joy of owning something like that. You gotta love it
and be really into it or have enough money to pay someone who knows
what they are doing. Night and day between working on a new car and
an old car. Not trying to hurt your feelings but anyone who would
need to call AAA to put gas in a car better have tons and tons of
money if they decide to restore an old classic. Give it away? Wow,
now that is a dilemma. You will do someone a really great turn by
giving the LeMans away, if that person was someone that had what it
takes to restore it. You would be giving away something very
valuable. A treasure. Is there a relative or friend that you would
like to make happy? Do you have enough room in your garage to keep
it out of the elements until you can decide what to do? Are you
sorry you brought this up? LOL

[Betty]

"Hollywood Boy" wrote:

[...]

> Hey, I sorta just have had backyard experience. In high school, I was in a
> small crowd of guys that took their cars and made hot rods outta' them. so,
> I got to know chain hoists early in life. what I was trying to do is let
> you know what makes something worth more in the restoration bidness'. this
> link you posted about the Packard is an example of way, way out of site type
> restoration. you can bet that baby has clear coat finish on the nuts and
> bolts! (not really, but close.) an old timer hot rod builder said to me a
> long time ago, "You will never get all your money and labor back on
> restoring a car." you can increase your return in some places, but not get
> it all back. what I was trying establish is a reference for you in what
> someone looks for in a condition of a used car. if your le mans has not had
> a teenager drive it much, that is also good. everybody should know that
> those squeaks and crap I mentioned show up earlier when you have a lead
> foot. what guys look for that are restoring a muscle car is a unit in worse
> condition than yours. there is also a crowd that likes "original equipment"
> in their cars, so that is another buyer side to get to know. if you want to
> keep the le mans for a while longer, plan your trips with it to burn up at
> least a quarter tank. that will give it enough time to warm all the fluids,
> lubricate where it should, etc. make it a twice a month funlandia! you
> just can't say, "See the country in a Chevrolet". <grin>
>
>
>

I am the only teenager who has ever driven my car. [g] I never let my
husband drive it either, except when he used to take it for inspection
... at his insistence.
I did once trade cars for a month with a gay friend because he had a
T-top Corvette that I wanted to drive.

I'll get around to doing something ... sooner or later. Every time I
drive it someone asks me if I want to sell it, and I always say "Yes",
but that's as far as it goes. I've got three catalogs for ordering parts
and I did order a metering valve from Chicago when I had the brakes done
(long story). Turns out you could only use a certain brake fluid, and
that didn't happen, so the fluid was leaking like crazy. The company
replaced the valve without charging me and said they had changed the
type seal(?) so that it would handle other brake fluids. I can't be
bothered with that kind of thing because I don't know anything about cars.

OTOH ... if I had a new Chevrolet ... I *could* see the country. [g]

[Betty]

Son of Serpent Esq wrote:
> Betty wrote:

[...]

>> I take it that you know a lot about cars. Are you involved in
>> restoration, mechanics, or you just like cars?
>
> Yes, I'd say he does know quite a bit. And what he said is the ugly
> truth about taking care of a classic car. The mention of king pins
> made me think of the ordeal I went through trying to replace those
> suckers in a 55 chevy. Not fun at all. The king pins are sort of
> important when you think those little things can make the difference
> between being able to actually steer you car... or not. Anyway,
> that's just one of the little details involved in keeping an old car
> in good working condition. One of many, as you can tell by the
> things Hollywood listed. I'm focusing on this because that old chevy
> was the only vehicle I had for quite awhile... back when I was
> young and poor. I did some very stupid things way back then but I
> wasn't a complete bonehead and sometimes when I wasn't totally
> wasted or actually when I was... I'd think about things related to
> safety and things like bearings and brakes and various other stuff
> that could fail and totally ruin my day or others maybe not quite as
> young, poor and stupid as I was back then.

Okay ... but ... it's more fun to be young, poor, and stupid. [g]

> I'm saying this assuming that you actually do drive that old car
> more than just down the road to a car show or something. Safety is
> a big, big deal here. With an old car, for me anyway, it's not about
> money; it's the joy of owning something like that. You gotta love it
> and be really into it or have enough money to pay someone who knows
> what they are doing. Night and day between working on a new car and
> an old car. Not trying to hurt your feelings but anyone who would
> need to call AAA to put gas in a car better have tons and tons of
> money if they decide to restore an old classic. Give it away? Wow,
> now that is a dilemma. You will do someone a really great turn by
> giving the LeMans away, if that person was someone that had what it
> takes to restore it. You would be giving away something very
> valuable. A treasure. Is there a relative or friend that you would
> like to make happy? Do you have enough room in your garage to keep
> it out of the elements until you can decide what to do? Are you
> sorry you brought this up? LOL

I'm not sorry I brought it up, but I'm learning more than I wanted know.
I think I'd rather stay stupid!

I just need someone to put gas in it so I can get it out of the garage
to wash it, and take it for inspection. [g] I used to drive it a lot
more, but my last two neighbors have made it difficult for me to get the
thing out of the garage so I don't bother. I start it and let it run for
15 or 20 minutes.That's why it *may* be out of gas. I do drive it around
when I take it for inspection, but that's about it.

I don't have to share the garage with another car, and the neighbor I
have now doesn't have a lot of junk so I'm okay there. I'll keep it
until I can make up my mind to force myself to decide to take care of
the situation.

[Son of Serpent Esq]

Betty wrote:
> Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

>> [hsss etc., etc...]

>> as young, poor and stupid as I was back then.
>
> Okay ... but ... it's more fun to be young, poor, and stupid. [g]

Who said, "You can never be too rich or too thin? Great quote from
someone who was most likely too rich.... but not too stupid.

>> [hsss etc., etc...]

>> Are you sorry you brought this up? LOL
>
> I'm not sorry I brought it up, but I'm learning more than I wanted know.
> I think I'd rather stay stupid!
>
> I just need someone to put gas in it so I can get it out of the garage
> to wash it, and take it for inspection. [g] I used to drive it a lot
> more, but my last two neighbors have made it difficult for me to get the
> thing out of the garage so I don't bother. I start it and let it run for
> 15 or 20 minutes.That's why it *may* be out of gas. I do drive it around
> when I take it for inspection, but that's about it.
>
> I don't have to share the garage with another car, and the neighbor I
> have now doesn't have a lot of junk so I'm okay there. I'll keep it
> until I can make up my mind to force myself to decide to take care of
> the situation.

And don't take everything we're saying too serious. It's a guy
thing. It sounds to me like you want to keep it. You should keep it.
What is there to gain by not keeping it. You will never get what it
is really worth. My point was mainly the safety side of this but you
mentioned that you had the brakes serviced and that is a damn good
start. We need to come up with a list of just the basics that are
important with something like that. You already did what I think
should be at the top of the list. I think next would be making sure
the engine is in good condition and tuned up and all that. I think
it would be better to drive that car. Hollywood mentioned at least
twice a month for about an hour or so. From what you said about it
being painted (more than once) I'm guessing the body is in fairly
good condition? That's not a safety issue but I'd put that one near
the top of the list. Oh wait... just remembered something; you
should keep the tank topped off. The reason you need to drive it for
more than a mile or so is to keep the moisture out. If you keep the
gas tank full this will stop condensation in there anyway. The other
point was about water in the oil. Hell, why not just tell your
mechanic to change the oil and filter more often than normal unless
you are driving it more than a couple times a month? Maybe twice a
year? I'm thinking it would be better to not let it sit too long
without driving it because of the mechanical side of this. The other
part is; what's the point of keeping it if you're just going to let
it sit in the garage? Whatever, need someone else to give their
input here.

[Betty]

Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

[...]

< From what you said about it being painted (more than once) I'm
guessing the body is in fairly
> good condition?

The name of the file is a joke ... (you bet your sweet bippy)

It started out gold (not the color I wanted) with a full, black vinyl
top ... then white ... now this blue, with stripes, and a new vinyl top.

http://s1212.photobucket.com/albums/cc450/Zula113/?action=view&current=bippy.jpg

[Betty]

Interior of Le Mans ...

http://s1212.photobucket.com/albums/cc450/Zula113/?action=view&current=interior.jpg

[Son of Serpent Esq]

Betty wrote:
> Interior of Le Mans ...

Wow! I mean fucking wow!!! I never expected it to look THAT good.

[HollywoodŽBoy]

Betty wrote:
: Interior of Le Mans ...
:
:
http://s1212.photobucket.com/albums/cc450/Zula113/?action=view&current=interior.jpg

damn, girl! like snake said, never thought it would look that good!

You do need to get it on the road a little more than you have been. twice a
month for about an hour is the lowest you should get for suggestions [sic].
Only for resale market - you will be looking for guys that like them
original. the paint should not be a big deal to some, but you never know.
the thing I would remember: IT IS PAID FOR!! <grin> keep it.

[Hollywood�Boy]

Son of Serpent Esq wrote:
: Hollywood®Boy wrote:

you got one! now with the new car smell, you need a can of ode' de la
sixteen-year-girl-thighs. you would be set. reason is suggest a can of
spray is because the real thing will never happen for you! besides, the
price you would pay to get the real thing would be 10 to 15.

[Son of Serpent Esq]

All I can do is laugh cuz it's too goddamn true.

But hey, the computer in that thing is way cool. 40 gig HD which is
kind of small actually but it's more than enough for podcasts and
mp3 files. You can copy stuff to it from the usb port. I hooked my
droid up to it and you can browse and copy anything. I tried the
iPod but sort of expected it not to work... anything Apple you might
as well forget about it. It will play the files as long as it's
hooked up but what is the point in that. Apple is way too closed.
Anyway, it's basically a computer in the dash. Might think about
trying to root it if I get brave. I don't know what operating system
it is but I bet there's already sites about it. This thing is way
too powerful to just leave it alone. Haven't had much luck finding
any hacking sites about it. It's called the Media Center 430n and
from what I see so far the 430n comes from the Garmin 430n NAV
systems even though the NAV is just part of what it does.

Question about the Hemi: The valve noise is pretty noticable; is
that normal? It almost sounds like a diesel.

[HollywoodŽBoy]

Son of Serpent Esq wrote:
: Hollywood®Boy wrote:
:: Son of Serpent Esq wrote:
::: Hollywood®Boy wrote:

I bet that dash computer is some sort of Linux. hell, it could be Android,
but Google pretty much is keeping it with phones and tablets. haven't heard
anything in the grapevine about android getting into other things yet.
never no.

the hemi's that I personally have heard up close do have a more distinct
explosion. the hemi noise could be just that, or you might have some solid
components in your rocker assemblies. if you have that cruising engine set
up, where half the pistons shut off, they might need a more solid rocker
assembly to tighten it up so a computer can turn on and off things. there
is a lot of engine technology that I haven't kept up with. going back to
the hemi explosion, you also could be hearing your tuned exhaust too. if
you haven't had headers on a vehicle that you drove a lot, they some times
give a ticking sound when idling. that would be the hot gases hitting the
much cooler tuned header tube for that piston. those are my guesses unless
you want to bring it to Kalifornia? <grin>

get some damn mud on it!

[Ferd Berfle]

"HollywoodŽBoy" <"manny or borg"@spam.email.com> wrote in message
news:c7idneofa7FeySDS...@earthlink.com...

Paid for ........... and you know the real history, maintenance, etc.

[Ferd Berfle]

"Son of Serpent Esq" <inv...@not-for-mail.invalid> wrote in message
news:6176e50cdcd302a1...@not-for-mail.invalid...

> HollywoodŽBoy wrote:
>> Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

>>: HollywoodŽBoy wrote:
>>:: DAB wrote:
>>::: Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

You going to have to buy something else to drive out to the fishing spots.
That thing is too nice to get in the mud.

[Son of Serpent Esq]

Ferd Berfle wrote:
> "Son of Serpent Esq" <inv...@not-for-mail.invalid> wrote in message
> news:6176e50cdcd302a1...@not-for-mail.invalid...

>> Hollywood®Boy wrote:
>>> Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

>>>: Hollywood®Boy wrote:
>>>:: DAB wrote:
>>>::: Son of Serpent Esq wrote:

Oh hell no. That's what it's for. The Mustang does not do off-road;
they can barely handle a little mud puddle. You don't really
appreciate a Jeep until you get it on a nice little dirt road with
stuff that would destroy your average car. I think boi still has a
Wrangler and he will give you an amen on that. There is nothing that
does off-road better than a Jeep. The Laredo is a lot quieter than a
Wrangler but the suspension is very tight... even in the Limited
version which is the top of the line. You feel the little bumps that
you wouldn't feel in the typical family type car. I let this guy I
know drive it that has a bigass new pickup and when he went over a
little pothole on your average city road he looks over at me like
there's something wrong with the car... I didn't even try to
explain. It's a Jeep thing, he wouldn't understand.

[Son of Serpent Esq]

Hollywood®Boy wrote:
> Son of Serpent Esq wrote:
>: Question about the Hemi: The valve noise is pretty noticable; is
>: that normal? It almost sounds like a diesel.
>

> the hemi's that I personally have heard up close do have a more distinct
> explosion. the hemi noise could be just that, or you might have some solid
> components in your rocker assemblies. if you have that cruising engine set
> up, where half the pistons shut off, they might need a more solid rocker
> assembly to tighten it up so a computer can turn on and off things. there
> is a lot of engine technology that I haven't kept up with. going back to
> the hemi explosion, you also could be hearing your tuned exhaust too. if
> you haven't had headers on a vehicle that you drove a lot, they some times
> give a ticking sound when idling. that would be the hot gases hitting the
> much cooler tuned header tube for that piston. those are my guesses unless
> you want to bring it to Kalifornia? <grin>

Ah. Yep. I guess the key word was "diesel" because it's really more
of that type of sound instead of lifters. I guess it's normal then.

> get some damn mud on it!

First thing I did.