Another nutty circumcision story
Martin
interested in his son's penis, leading to another botched home
circumcision.
I particularly like the comments made by the judge about the father:
"Indeed his motivations could be characterized as selfish or even
deluded..."
Nutty circumcision enthusiasts keep telling us how popular their
little fetish is, and how men around the world are queuing up to be
circumcised. Perhaps this story highlights the mental state of the
"deluded" individuals they speak of.
<http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2009/10/16/bc-home-circumcision-charges.html>:
----- Begin Quote -----
A Vancouver-area father has been found guilty of negligence causing
bodily harm after botching a home-circumcision attempt on his
four-year-old son as part of a spiritual quest to make things right
with God.
The bizarre case centred on a battle over the religious freedoms of
the former Jehovah's Witness, who was trying to follow a literal
interpretation of the Bible after a series of misfortunes hit his
family.
During the trial, the B.C. Supreme Court heard that after a bad
motorcycle accident in 2002 left both the man and his wife with brain
injuries, he began the religious quest that eventually led him to
believe that both he and son needed to be circumcised to celebrate
Passover.
The man, identified only as D.J.W. to protect the identity of his son,
began researching home circumcision on the internet and in the Bible,
and by listening to a radio show.
His first attempt to circumcise himself ended up with his foreskin
turning black and only part of it cut off. When he couldn't stop the
bleeding, he called an ambulance, and a doctor in a hospital emergency
room ended up stitching up the bleeding wound.
Wonder Powder used to stop bleeding
The man later returned to the internet for more research and met some
other religious fundamentalists, who were also dog breeders. They
advised him they used a veterinary powder called BloodStop to halt any
bleeding when they circumcised their 13-year-old son.
At $30 a bottle, Blood Stop was too expensive for the man. But during
a trip to Washington state to celebrate Passover with a friend, the
man found another more affordable product, called Wonder Dust, meant
for horses.
The man also contacted several doctors and rabbis, all of whom refused
to do the operation either because the boy was too young for a general
anesthetic or because the family was not Jewish.
So after a trip to London Drugs to buy razor blades in January 2006,
he asked his son if he could cut off his foreskin, so he could be just
like dad.
No ice for the Israelites
The man testified in court that, after the boy consented to the
circumcision, he fed him some mead — a biblical beverage made from
honey — lay him on the kitchen floor, stretched his penis across a
cutting board and cut off part of the foreskin.
When asked in court whether the man used ice to ease the boy's pain,
he replied, "Where would the Israelites have found ice?"
He then applied the Wonder Dust, gave the boy some ice cream and told
him he could watch whatever movies he wanted that week, before heading
off to church, leaving the boy in the care of his mother, who could
not stand the sight of blood.
The boy spent the next few days walking with his legs wide apart,
until a social worker, who caught wind of the operation, brought two
police officers to the house to take the boy into protective custody
for a medical examination.
After the medical staff found the boy's penis coated in a thick cap of
black tarry substance from the Wonder Dust, they decided to remove the
rest of the family's children from the home.
Meanwhile, a surgeon removed "a beehive coating" from the boy's penis
before properly circumcising him, saying later in court that the boy
would likely have ended up with a disfigured penis had the operation
not been completed.
Religious freedom argued
In court, the man's lawyer, Douglas Christie, argued the man's desire
to fulfil his religious duty negated any criminal intent.
And in her ruling issued on Wednesday, Judge Marion Allan found the
man not guilty on charges of aggravated assault and assault with a
weapon, saying the man did not seriously harm the boy and the razor
blade was not used as a weapon.
But the judge also ruled the child could not have consented to the
operation and the father should have known he needed a trained
professional to perform it — especially given his own first-hand
experience — and found him guilty of negligence causing bodily harm.
"Indeed his motivations could be characterized as selfish or even
deluded insofar as he believed that he was unable to live in his home
at Passover with any uncircumcised male, including his four-year-old
son," wrote the judge in her ruling.
The man's lawyer is reportedly considering an appeal on constitutional
grounds, and a sentence has yet to be handed down.
----- End Quote -----
--
<http://www.hiv-poz.co.uk/>
5,392 days and counting...
Jake Waskett
> Nutty circumcision enthusiasts keep telling us how popular their little
> fetish is, and how men around the world are queuing up to be
> circumcised. Perhaps this story highlights the mental state of the
> "deluded" individuals they speak of.
So you think it's rational to extrapolate from one person to thousands, do
you?
Martin
wrote:
That's what those who believe HIV is the virus which causes AIDS do.
As do those who promote circumcision as a means to reduce the
likelihood of HIV transmission.
The actions of the 'caring' Father highlighted in the article aren't
unique or unusual. Millions of "deluded" parents foist circumcision
on their sons.
Jake Waskett
> On Sun, 18 Oct 2009 09:13:56 GMT, Jake Waskett <ja...@waskett.org> wrote:
>>On Sun, 18 Oct 2009 02:30:45 +0100, Martin wrote:
>
>>>Nutty circumcision enthusiasts keep telling us how popular their little
>>>fetish is, and how men around the world are queuing up to be
>>>circumcised. Perhaps this story highlights the mental state of the
>>>"deluded" individuals they speak of.
>
>>So you think it's rational to extrapolate from one person to thousands,
>>do you?
>
> That's what those who believe HIV is the virus which causes AIDS do. As
> do those who promote circumcision as a means to reduce the likelihood of
> HIV transmission.
Care to elaborate?
> The actions of the 'caring' Father highlighted in the article aren't
> unique or unusual. Millions of "deluded" parents foist circumcision on
> their sons.
What's unusual, of course, is a father getting the idea into his head that
he could do it himself, with no training or - apparently - skill.
Jack
"Indeed his motivations could be characterized as selfish or even
deluded insofar as he believed that he was unable to live in his home
at Passover with any uncircumcised male, including his four-year-old
son," wrote the judge in her ruling.
The judge is even deluded.
David Z
news:1b4d7a2c-9194-42ab...@33g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
She's probably stoned, like you.
Jack
> "Jack" <furgfurgf...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
You're really interested in talking about being stoned or being drunk.
David Z
***********************************************
It explains why you're so deluded.
Jack
> "Jack" <furgfurgf...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:fea92773-49dd-4aad...@z34g2000vbl.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 21, 2:24 pm, "David Z" <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
>
> > "Jack" <furgfurgf...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:1b4d7a2c-9194-42ab...@33g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > "Indeed his motivations could be characterized as selfish or even
> > > deluded insofar as he believed that he was unable to live in his home
> > > at Passover with any uncircumcised male, including his four-year-old
> > > son," wrote the judge in her ruling.
>
> > > The judge is even deluded.
>
> > She's probably stoned, like you.
>
> You're really interested in talking about being stoned or being drunk.
>
> ***********************************************
>
> It explains why you're so deluded.
There's not much to respond to, in regard to vague generalizations
like that.
David Z
***************************************************
LOL! Most of your postings are "vague generalizations." In fact , you'll
find some above, stoner.
Jack
> "Jack" <furgfurgf...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:94767724-2291-42c9...@e34g2000vbc.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 21, 5:10 pm, "David Z" <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "Jack" <furgfurgf...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:fea92773-49dd-4aad...@z34g2000vbl.googlegroups.com...
> > On Oct 21, 2:24 pm, "David Z" <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
>
> > > "Jack" <furgfurgf...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> > >news:1b4d7a2c-9194-42ab...@33g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > > "Indeed his motivations could be characterized as selfish or even
> > > > deluded insofar as he believed that he was unable to live in his home
> > > > at Passover with any uncircumcised male, including his four-year-old
> > > > son," wrote the judge in her ruling.
>
> > > > The judge is even deluded.
>
> > > She's probably stoned, like you.
>
> > You're really interested in talking about being stoned or being drunk.
>
> > ***********************************************
>
> > It explains why you're so deluded.
>
> There's not much to respond to, in regard to vague generalizations
> like that.
>
> ***************************************************
>
> LOL! Most of your postings are "vague generalizations." In fact , you'll
>
> - Show quoted text -
I'm not so deluded as those who think that acceptable pain management
is used neonates born in the United States.--Which is probably most
people.
David Z
I'm not so deluded...
****************************************************
Yes, you are.
Jack
>
> - Show quoted text -
You're welcome to explain why you think so.
David Z
You're welcome to explain why you think so.
******************************************************
Not necessary. Your postings are prima facie evidence.
Jack
>
> - Show quoted text -
I'm willing to have a conversation but you'll have to do more than not
just fire off overused insults.
David Z
--
--
"Jack" <furgfu...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4bf9e925-cdc0-463b...@j9g2000vbp.googlegroups.com...
********************************************************
I'm willing to have a conversation...
*******************************************************
Bullshit. You've demonstrated repeatedly that you're either unwilling or
unable to participate in a real conversation. While I suspect the former,
it's probably a combination of both.
Jack
> --
> --"Jack" <furgfurgf...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
Any examples? Do you have anything specific at all, David Z?
David Z
******************************************************
How many times do I have to go around this merry-go-round with you? All
that weed and booze has destroyed your memory.
If you don't see it by now, no one can explain it to you.
Jack
>
> - Show quoted text -
You never really have anything to say.
David Z
--
--
"Jack" <furgfu...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:f986fa71-feb2-4cf1...@k17g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
****************************************************
You always have something to say, but you always say nothing.
Jack
>
> - Show quoted text -
Newborn babies in pain isn't nothing and you don't seem to have any
opinion on the matter.
David Z
****************************************************
I've expressed my opinion on it many times. Apparently you don't
remember....again.
Jack
>
> - Show quoted text -
Apparently not and how could I forget something as important as your
opinion?
David Z
news:90450157-30c6-46cc...@a21g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
*****************************************************
Schmuck, if you want to know what people think about the issue, you should
just go back and reread the responses from the last 50 times you posted it.
Do you have any clue why you've been nicknamed the "broken record?"
Jack
> "Jack" <furgfurgj...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
no
David Z
no
**************************************************************
That's why you're incapable of having a real conversation.
QED
ProfQ
individual’s constitutional rights.
Clearly evident is this practice must be forced to stop. It is baseless,
useless, does not prevent AIDS, and serves very little purpose.
Find the man guilty of assault and put him in jail.
Martin wrote:
> Oh dear. Here's another story about a parent who was a little too
> interested in his son's penis, leading to another botched home
> circumcision.
>
> I particularly like the comments made by the judge about the father:
> "Indeed his motivations could be characterized as selfish or even
> deluded..."
>
> Nutty circumcision enthusiasts keep telling us how popular their
> little fetish is, and how men around the world are queuing up to be
> circumcised. Perhaps this story highlights the mental state of the
> "deluded" individuals they speak of.
>
> <http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2009/10/16/bc-home-circumcision-charges.html>:
>
> ----- Begin Quote -----
>
> A Vancouver-area father has been found guilty of negligence causing
> bodily harm after botching a home-circumcision attempt on his
> four-year-old son as part of a spiritual quest to make things right
> with God.
>
> The bizarre case centred on a battle over the religious freedoms of
> the former Jehovah's Witness, who was trying to follow a literal
> interpretation of the Bible after a series of misfortunes hit his
> family.
>
> During the trial, the B.C. Supreme Court heard that after a bad
> motorcycle accident in 2002 left both the man and his wife with brain
> injuries, he began the religious quest that eventually led him to
> believe that both he and son needed to be circumcised to celebrate
> Passover.
>
> The man, identified only as D.J.W. to protect the identity of his son,
> began researching home circumcision on the internet and in the Bible,
> and by listening to a radio show.
>
> His first attempt to circumcise himself ended up with his foreskin
> turning black and only part of it cut off. When he couldn't stop the
> bleeding, he called an ambulance, and a doctor in a hospital emergency
> room ended up stitching up the bleeding wound.
>
> Wonder Powder used to stop bleeding
>
> The man later returned to the internet for more research and met some
> other religious fundamentalists, who were also dog breeders. They
> advised him they used a veterinary powder called BloodStop to halt any
> bleeding when they circumcised their 13-year-old son.
>
> At $30 a bottle, Blood Stop was too expensive for the man. But during
> a trip to Washington state to celebrate Passover with a friend, the
> man found another more affordable product, called Wonder Dust, meant
> for horses.
>
> The man also contacted several doctors and rabbis, all of whom refused
> to do the operation either because the boy was too young for a general
> anesthetic or because the family was not Jewish.
>
> So after a trip to London Drugs to buy razor blades in January 2006,
> he asked his son if he could cut off his foreskin, so he could be just
> like dad.
>
> No ice for the Israelites
>
> The man testified in court that, after the boy consented to the
> circumcision, he fed him some mead — a biblical beverage made from
> honey — lay him on the kitchen floor, stretched his penis across a
> cutting board and cut off part of the foreskin.
>
> When asked in court whether the man used ice to ease the boy's pain,
> he replied, "Where would the Israelites have found ice?"
>
> He then applied the Wonder Dust, gave the boy some ice cream and told
> him he could watch whatever movies he wanted that week, before heading
> off to church, leaving the boy in the care of his mother, who could
> not stand the sight of blood.
>
> The boy spent the next few days walking with his legs wide apart,
> until a social worker, who caught wind of the operation, brought two
> police officers to the house to take the boy into protective custody
> for a medical examination.
>
> After the medical staff found the boy's penis coated in a thick cap of
> black tarry substance from the Wonder Dust, they decided to remove the
> rest of the family's children from the home.
>
> Meanwhile, a surgeon removed "a beehive coating" from the boy's penis
> before properly circumcising him, saying later in court that the boy
> would likely have ended up with a disfigured penis had the operation
> not been completed.
>
> Religious freedom argued
>
> In court, the man's lawyer, Douglas Christie, argued the man's desire
> to fulfil his religious duty negated any criminal intent.
>
> And in her ruling issued on Wednesday, Judge Marion Allan found the
> man not guilty on charges of aggravated assault and assault with a
> weapon, saying the man did not seriously harm the boy and the razor
> blade was not used as a weapon.
>
> But the judge also ruled the child could not have consented to the
> operation and the father should have known he needed a trained
> professional to perform it — especially given his own first-hand
> experience — and found him guilty of negligence causing bodily harm.
>
> "Indeed his motivations could be characterized as selfish or even
> deluded insofar as he believed that he was unable to live in his home
> at Passover with any uncircumcised male, including his four-year-old
> son," wrote the judge in her ruling.
>
> The man's lawyer is reportedly considering an appeal on constitutional
> grounds, and a sentence has yet to be handed down.
>
> ----- End Quote -----