Know this.
Michael Christ
Michael Christ
bob young
Michael Christ wrote:
> Please, it is not about trying to do what is right, it is about faith.
>
> Michael Christ
Faith is cold as ice. Why are little ones born only to suffer for the
want
of immunity or a bowl of rice? Well, who would hold a price on the heads
of
the innocent children if there's some immortal power to control the dice?
[Rush, Roll the Bones]
Faith may be defined briefly as an illogical belief in the occurrence of
the improbable.
[H.L. Mencken]
pegleg
> Michael Christ wrote:
> > Please, it is not about trying to do what is right, it is about faith.
>
> > Michael Christ
>
> Faith is cold as ice. Why are little ones born only to suffer for the
> want
> of immunity or a bowl of rice? Well, who would hold a price on the heads
> of
> the innocent children if there's some immortal power to control the dice?
Pegleg:
U blame God because these poor little children's parents had sex?
ThomM
Of course not
There is NO real god to blame - that can be proven to exist
It is the humans who created the nonsense who are to blame
That they hide behind a all powerful creature in the sky who
apparently likes seeing little children starve to death or get abused
or molested by those humans is their story. Anyone who believes that
their story is true - needs professional mental help!
pegleg
>
> - Show quoted text -
Pegleg:
So, why talk about One you do not believe? Why not just say, these
stupid people need to STOP having unprotected sex....and if they don't
know the means of how to do this.....they should STOP having sex!
Thommadura
This is an OPEN Usenet discussion group - on the christian Mythology
In an OPEN group - ALL sides of the issue can be presented - including
those of what is PROVEN to be true.
However - the religion teaches against having protected sex
IN Africa - with an Aids epidemic - they were against use of condoms.
As far as stop having sex - even priests don;t do that one
pegleg
Pegleg:
Oh....what has been proven?
> However - the religion teaches against having protected sex
> IN Africa - with an Aids epidemic - they were against use of condoms.
Pegleg:
Do u want to blame God for Aids, too?
>
> As far as stop having sex - even priests don;t do that one- Hide quoted text -
bob young
pegleg wrote:
> On Nov 9, 5:19 am, bob young <alaspect...@netvigator.com> wrote:
> > Michael Christ wrote:
> > > Please, it is not about trying to do what is right, it is about faith.
> >
> > > Michael Christ
> >
> > Faith is cold as ice. Why are little ones born only to suffer for the
> > want
> > of immunity or a bowl of rice? Well, who would hold a price on the heads
> > of
> > the innocent children if there's some immortal power to control the dice?
>
> Pegleg:
>
> U blame God because these poor little children's parents had sex?
I blame god when they arrive:
Epileptic
Mentally retarded
with left palates
Crippled
Deformed
Blind
Deaf
On occasions both blind and deaf [think of that]
Dyslexic etc. etc. etc. and ad infinitum
[Then there are those fetus which arrive so horribly deformed the parents are
not even allowed to see it - One in every 400,000 births - some god !]
Bob
Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist Brit.
Man creates his gods in his own image,
then spends the rest of his life
manipulating them to his heart's content
R E L I G I O N - it is all in the mind,
an escape from life's realities and hardships,
sixty percent ritual, forty percent fantasy
bob young
pegleg wrote:
Atheists don't blame any gods for anything
atheists reject their very existence.
We do object however
to gods being pushed down the throats of
otherwise innocent children at any age prior to fourteen.
Thommadura
Nothing that the theists say!
Thommadura
Theists claim he created everything - therefore it is YOU who should be
blaming your god.
After all - your bible states clearly that your god created evil
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil:
I the Lord do all these things.
�Isaiah 45:7
Where does your religion allow for MULTIPLE creators?
Where does it say that your god gave the power of creation to another?
The monotheist has only ONE choice - if there is only one god that
created everything - then that god has to be the source of all evil -
and therefore cannot be ALL good.
pegleg
Pegleg:
So, u believe in God, but are angry with Him?
> Bob
> Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist Brit.
>
> Man creates his gods in his own image,
> then spends the rest of his life
> manipulating them to his heart's content
>
> R E L I G I O N - it is all in the mind,
> an escape from life's realities and hardships,
> sixty percent ritual, forty percent fantasy
>
>
>
>
>
> > > [Rush, Roll the Bones]
>
> > > Faith may be defined briefly as an illogical belief in the occurrence of
> > > the improbable.
> > > [H.L. Mencken]- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
pegleg
Pegleg:
The two most important things in my life I do not apologize for. One
being America and the other being God. 8-)
> After all - your bible states clearly that your god created evil
>
> I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil:
> I the Lord do all these things.
>
> —Isaiah 45:7
>
> Where does your religion allow for MULTIPLE creators?
> Where does it say that your god gave the power of creation to another?
>
> The monotheist has only ONE choice - if there is only one god that
> created everything - then that god has to be the source of all evil -
> and therefore cannot be ALL good.- Hide quoted text -
Pegleg:
Isa. 45:7 I form the light and create disaster; I, the Lord, do all
these things.
Wanna know why? 8-)
Somewhere along the way...mankind got the idea it's all about him. No
need to go further....u are just a little babe and can not understand.
8-)
Thommadura
No - there is no proven god
If there was - he would be guilty of Genocide - murder - rape - and a
bunch of other capital crimes - based on the bible
Thommadura
>>
>> Where does your religion allow for MULTIPLE creators?
>> Where does it say that your god gave the power of creation to another?
>>
>> The monotheist has only ONE choice - if there is only one god that
>> created everything - then that god has to be the source of all evil -
>> and therefore cannot be ALL good.- Hide quoted text -
>
> Pegleg:
> Isa. 45:7 I form the light and create disaster; I, the Lord, do all
> these things.
>
> Wanna know why? 8-)
>
> Somewhere along the way...mankind got the idea it's all about him. No
> need to go further....u are just a little babe and can not understand.
Actually somewhere along the line - leaders of uneducated and illiterate
cave dwellers - found out that SCARING then with stories of incredible
things was a way of keeping them somewhat in order.
Today - people are largely educated - and are taught to expect proof of
extraordinary claims - or dismiss them as folly.
Some of us actually do that
Others apparently lack the intelligence to.
pegleg
>
> >> Where does your religion allow for MULTIPLE creators?
> >> Where does it say that your god gave the power of creation to another?
>
> >> The monotheist has only ONE choice - if there is only one god that
> >> created everything - then that god has to be the source of all evil -
> >> and therefore cannot be ALL good.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > Pegleg:
> > Isa. 45:7 I form the light and create disaster; I, the Lord, do all
> > these things.
>
> > Wanna know why? 8-)
>
> > Somewhere along the way...mankind got the idea it's all about him. No
> > need to go further....u are just a little babe and can not understand.
>
> Actually somewhere along the line - leaders of uneducated and illiterate
> cave dwellers - found out that SCARING then with stories of incredible
> things was a way of keeping them somewhat in order.
>
> Today - people are largely educated - and are taught to expect proof of
> extraordinary claims - or dismiss them as folly.
>
> Some of us actually do that
>
Pegleg:
Ok, let me ask you the same question I put tp Free Lunch. I really
would be interested in your answer.
Everything is made of atoms, right....what sustains these atoms?
Oh,btw, This very question is the one I had to research.....when I
didn't believe in God.
soooo, dodn't try to bs me. 8-)
Michael Christ
"pegleg" <pegleg...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:14c27249-5352-4b3f...@d21g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
:-).
They don't know what they believe.
Michael Christ
bob young
pegleg wrote:
And you, apparently, live in a dream world all of your own
<PLONK>
bob young
pegleg wrote:
In your Great Great grandfather's day man could not transplant a human heart.
By the way, which god is it you are crazy about? The one which allowed cancer suffer's
two thousand years ago to die horribly and in ignorance ?
any of these gods yours ?
Aeron War [goddess] Wales War
Aeval [goddess] Love, Magic. Ireland
Ahura Mazda
Agrona [goddesss] Destroyer of life
Achall [goddess]Earth and Nature; unhappiness. Ireland
Achtan [goddess] Hunting and wild animals. Ireland
Allah
Adsullata [goddess]
Aphrodite, Ares, Athena, Apollo, Artemis, Abalim[Judaic] Abba Amona[Judaic]
Abraxis[Judaic]
Adam Beliyya'al'[Judaic] Adam Kadmon[Judaic]
Adonai[Judaic] Adonaiel[Judaic]
Aibell [goddess] Beauty; Arts; Magic
Aille [goddess]Justice. Ireland
Aige [goddess] Demi-animals
Aimend [goddess] Sun and Day. Ireland
Aine [goddess] Love and Sexuality
Ailinn [goddess] Love. Ireland
Aidin [goddess] [Aideen] Love and sexuality. Ireland
Aibheaog [goddess] Fire.
Airmed [goddess] Health and healing; Immortality Ireland
Aide [goddess] Water. Ireland - Wife of the Irish god Enna
Artio [goddess] Hunting and Wild Animals Switzerland
Akatriel-Yah[Judaic] Alitha[Judaic]
Alukah(Arpad Yiddish: Estrie)[Judaic] Anafiel[Judaic]
Angels[Judaic] Archons[Judaic] Asherah(Asherah)[Judaic]
Asmodeus(Asmodaios)[Judaic [goddess] Goodness. Ireland
Abaangui Guarani
Aba-khatun [goddess] Russia
Abaris Greek
Abas Greek
Abassi Nigeria/Africa
Abderus Greek
Abeguwo [goddess] Oceania
Abeona [goddess] Roman
Abere [goddess] Oceania
Ab Kin Xoc Maya
Abnoba [goddess] Celtic
Abraxas Roman
Abuk [goddess] Dinka/Africa
Abundantia [goddess] Roman
Acamas Greek
Acantha [goddess] Greek
Acat Maya
Acaviser [goddess] Roman
Acca [goddess] Roman
Acca Larentia [goddess] Roman
Achall [goddess] Irish
Achelois [goddess] Greek
Achelous Greek
Achilles Greek
Achtan [goddess] Irish
Achtland [goddess] Celtic
Acis Greek
Aclla [goddess] Inca
Acna [goddess] Maya/Mexico
Actaeon Greek
Adad Babylonian
Adamanthea [goddess] Greek
Adamisil Wedo [goddess] Haiti
Adapa Babylonian
Adaro Oceania
Adeona [goddess] Roman
Aditi [goddess] Asian
Adityas Asian
Admeta [goddess] Roman
Admete [goddess] Greek
Admetus Greek
Adonis Greek
Adrammelech Babylonia
Adrastus Greek
Adsagsona [goddess] Celtic
Adu Ogyinae Ashanti/Africa
Aeacus Greek
Aebh [goddess] Celtic
Aed Celtic
A don [goddess] Greek
Aedos [goddess] Roman
Aega [goddess] Greek
Aegeria [goddess] Roman
Aegeus Greek
Aegina [goddess] Greek
Aegir Norse
Aegis Greek
Aegisthus Greek
Aegyptus Greek
Aello [goddess] Greek Amazon
Aeneas Greek
Aeneas Roman
Aeolus Greek
Aero [goddess] Greek
Aeron Celtic
Aerope [goddess] Greek
Aesculapius Asclepius Greek
Aesir Norse
°s S£dhe Celtic
Aestas [goddess] Roman
Aether Greek
Aethra [goddess] Greek
Aetna [goddess] Roman
Afekan [goddess] Oceania
Agaman Nibo [goddess] Haiti
Agamedes Greek
Agamemnon Greek
Agasaya [goddess] Semite
Agave [goddess] Greek
Agdos [goddess] Asia Minor
Ag Dahomey/Africa
Aglaia [goddess] Greek
Aglauros [goddess] Greek
Agni India
Agwe [goddess] Benin/Africa
Agwe [goddess] Haiti
Agweta [goddess] Haiti
Ahat [goddess] Egypt
Ahau Chamahez Maya
Ahau Kin [goddess] Maya
Ah Chuy Kak Maya
Ah Cun Can Maya
Ahemait [goddess] Egypt
Ah Kinchil Maya
Ahmakiq Maya
Ahnt Alis Pok' [goddess] Mexico
Ahnt Kai [goddess] Mexico
Ah Puch Maya
Ahriman Persia
Ahsonnutli Navajo
Ahti [goddess] Egypt
Ah Uaynih [goddess] Haiti
Ah Uaynih [goddess] Guatemala
Ahuic [goddess] Aztec/Mexico
Ahulane Maya
Ahura Mazda Persia
Ahurani [goddess] Persia
Ah Wink-ir Masa [goddess] Guatemala
Ai-ada Turkey . . . . . . . . .
"I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one
fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods,
you
will understand why I dismiss yours."
[Stephen Roberts]
bob young
pegleg wrote:
IDIOT - I reject all gods as being the work of man
THERE ARE NO GODS outside of human imagination
bob young
pegleg wrote:
Oh by the weay, your inablity to address the medical issues above and why some
'god' sits by and does nothing, duly noted
bob young
Michael Christ wrote:
Oh dear . . .the funniest post I have read in months.
When we pass in review the opinions of former times which are now recognized
as absurd, it will be found that nine times out of ten they were such as to
justify the infliction of suffering. Take, for instance, medical practice.
When anesthetics were invented they were thought to be wicked as being an
attempt to thwart God's will. Insanity was thought to be due to diabolic
possession, and it was believed that demons inhabiting a madman could be
driven out by inflicting pain upon him, and so making them uncomfortable. In
pursuit of this opinion, lunatics were treated for years on end with
systematic and conscientious brutality. I cannot think of any instance of an
erroneous medical treatment that was agreeable rather than disagreeable to the
patient. (Bertrand Russell)
>
>
Thommadura
Your question is worthless.
Even Muslims are made of atoms - are you now saying ALLAH exists
Even Hindus are made of atoms - does that prove Vishnu exists
Ancient Egyptians are made of atoms - does that prove that all their
Pharaohs were gods too?
Ancient Romans were made of atoms - does that prove the Roman Pantheon
of gods?
Ancient Greeks were made of atoms - does that prove Zeus is real?
THe problem with using "creation" as proof of a deity - is that there is
no way to connect it to any particular belief - or god - or groups of
gods. And it is just as easy to use the "creation" claims of those and
YOUR religion - to disprove your statement
If a god is all knowing - he cannot make an error.
IF the "scripture" is the word of god - then it should accurately
describe the Universe as we know it is today - regardless of the Legends
of Myths of the ancients who wrote it - since the god supposedly created
that universe - and should KNOW how he did it. While getting it right
might not be proof - since that could happen in a number of religions -
getting it wrong is PROOF against the religion's scripture being written
by an all knowing god.
Yet - not ONE ancient story of religion accurately depicts the solar
system - the earth rotating on its axis - and the earth orbiting the sun
- NOT ONE OF THEM.
Oh - by the way - Nutrition sustains life in those atoms. (even plants
require it)
If you do not eat - and depend on a god to do it - you will DIE.
Try it for yourself and prove me wrong!
Thommadura
WE don't believe at all
We accept what is PROVEN to be truth
And you have NEVER proven anything about gods to be TRUTH
pegleg
> "pegleg" <pegleg.dup...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> - Show quoted text -
Pegleg:
They are hard to figure out.....you know, when I didn't believe in
~The God~ I never blamed HIm ....not ~one~ thing.
pegleg
Pegleg:
Just what is it you believe God ~owes~ mankind?
pegleg
Pegleg:
What ~nutrition~ would that be? And where does it come from?
ThomM
WE don't either
We simply point out that IF a god actually did exist - and is almighty
and all knowing - then he would be a depraved pervert - and would
deserve to be executed for his crimes.
However - AS you noted - there are NO gods proven to exist - and the
claims of humans about gods are unsupported nonsense.
ThomM
In the United States - there is a law called Depraved Indifference
It says that IF you KNOW about a crime that is going to happen - and
fail to report it or "if you have the ability"you do not attempt to
stop it - then you are guilty of depraved indifference - ie allowing
it to happen. Terry Nichols was convicted under this statute in the
Oklahoma city bombing incident as an example. THe penalty can be equal
to committing the crime yourself.
Today - around the world - thousands of well underage children will be
abused - neglected - or molested, children who are WELL under the age
of knowledgeable consent.. Anyone who has the knowledge of such
actions has a duty to report them or prevent them.
If there truly was an ALL KNOWING god - then he would KNOW about these
crimes (And all others for that matter) - and it would be his DUTY to
prevent them. Obviously - there are exception for people who fear for
their own life - but a god of YOUR definition can hardly claim that
one either.
IF he knows - and just watches the molestation going on - he is a
pervert
If he knows - and does nothing - he is both a pervert and a depraved
indifferent
Since none are proven to exist - the actual situation is moot though.
However - any theists who claim they have an all knowing almighty ALL
GOOD god - watching over us - is simply WRONG. That you want people
to WORSHIP and PRAISE these lack of actions actions because YOU
believe a god exists - is beyond terrible.
ThomM
YOu are attempting to say that everthing has to have a beginning - and
YOU do not even agree with that one - since you claim your god to be
eternal - no beginning and no end.
However - since we can PROVE that ENERGY has always existed (THe
Joule experiment - which has been tested and repeated thousands of
time per year for over a century proves energy cannot be created or
destroyed) - that means that - by relativity - MATTER has also always
existed.
Since we essentially define the Universe as EVERTHING - EVERYWHERE -
at EVERY TIME - if something ALWAYS existed - as we KNOW energy has -
the UNIVERSE also has always existed.
And since nutritition comes from eternal matter and energy - no go is
needed to provide it.
bob young
pegleg wrote:
Nothing since gods do not exist
pegleg
>
> > What ~nutrition~ would that be? And where does it come from?
>
> YOu are attempting to say that everthing has to have a beginning - and
> YOU do not even agree with that one - since you claim your god to be
> eternal - no beginning and no end.
Pegleg:
Thom, have u ever heard a tree-frog? They are these little tiny
frogs, but they have a set of lungs that sound
like a bullfrog! 8-)
Sorry to say, but u and those like u, that run around ~blaming~ God,
remind me of that little frog! You have a LOUD voice screaming about
One u don't believe in......much less KINOW!
Give me a break.....give us all a break! Admit u are ignorant when it
comes to understanding ANYTHING about God....that goes for good or
bad!
> However - since we can PROVE that ENERGY has always existed (THe
> Joule experiment - which has been tested and repeated thousands of
> time per year for over a century proves energy cannot be created or
> destroyed) - that means that - by relativity - MATTER has also always
> existed.
> Since we essentially define the Universe as EVERTHING - EVERYWHERE -
> at EVERY TIME - if something ALWAYS existed - as we KNOW energy has -
> the UNIVERSE also has always existed.
>
> And since nutritition comes from eternal matter and energy - no go is
> needed to provide it.- Hide quoted text -
Thommadura
WHO CARES?
>
> Sorry to say, but u and those like u, that run around ~blaming~ God,
> remind me of that little frog! You have a LOUD voice screaming about
> One u don't believe in......much less KINOW!
SINCE YOU DO NOT KNOW anything about a god - you are the one claiming
all sorts of things about them - I simply reject your statements as
having no basis in fact
>
> Give me a break.....give us all a break! Admit u are ignorant when it
> comes to understanding ANYTHING about God....that goes for good or
> bad!
Provide a list of all the things you can prove are true - along with the
absolute proof that is accepted BY everyone and can be tested and
verified - that I am ignorant about gods (You have three for instance)
Don't bother with the bible or any other scripture - since they will
cancel each other - and are NOT proven truth. In fact - you can
normally contradict a statement of the bible with another statement from
the same bible.
ALSO - don't bother talking generalities - which cannot be directly and
ONLY connected to your god and beliefs - and no other gods or beliefs.
What you need to do is admit the list is EMPTY - and that there is
NOTHING I am actually ignorant ABOUT that you can prove is true.
ANd that goes for good and bad
>
>
>> However - since we can PROVE that ENERGY has always existed (THe
>> Joule experiment - which has been tested and repeated thousands of
>> time per year for over a century proves energy cannot be created or
>> destroyed) - that means that - by relativity - MATTER has also always
>> existed.
>> Since we essentially define the Universe as EVERTHING - EVERYWHERE -
>> at EVERY TIME - if something ALWAYS existed - as we KNOW energy has -
>> the UNIVERSE also has always existed.
>>
>> And since nutritition comes from eternal matter and energy - no god is
pegleg
Pegleg:
U don't like frogs? 8-)
> > Sorry to say, but u and those like u, that run around ~blaming~ God,
> > remind me of that little frog! You have a LOUD voice screaming about
> > One u don't believe in......much less KINOW!
>
> SINCE YOU DO NOT KNOW anything about a god - you are the one claiming
> all sorts of things about them - I simply reject your statements as
> having no basis in fact
>
>
>
> > Give me a break.....give us all a break! Admit u are ignorant when it
> > comes to understanding ANYTHING about God....that goes for good or
> > bad!
>
> Provide a list of all the things you can prove are true - along with the
> absolute proof that is accepted BY everyone and can be tested and
> verified - that I am ignorant about gods (You have three for instance)
>
> Don't bother with the bible or any other scripture - since they will
> cancel each other - and are NOT proven truth. In fact - you can
> normally contradict a statement of the bible with another statement from
> the same bible.
>
> ALSO - don't bother talking generalities - which cannot be directly and
> ONLY connected to your god and beliefs - and no other gods or beliefs.
>
> What you need to do is admit the list is EMPTY - and that there is
> NOTHING I am actually ignorant ABOUT that you can prove is true.
>
> ANd that goes for good and bad
>
Pegleg:
I DON'T THINK SO !!!!!!!!!!!! Everything u have on your list......IS
ON MY LIST. U have ~faith~ in science......well, my FAITH is in God.
At the end of the day.....we'll just see who wins! 8-)
>
>
>
> >> However - since we can PROVE that ENERGY has always existed (THe
> >> Joule experiment - which has been tested and repeated thousands of
> >> time per year for over a century proves energy cannot be created or
> >> destroyed) - that means that - by relativity - MATTER has also always
> >> existed.
> >> Since we essentially define the Universe as EVERTHING - EVERYWHERE -
> >> at EVERY TIME - if something ALWAYS existed - as we KNOW energy has -
> >> the UNIVERSE also has always existed.
>
> >> And since nutritition comes from eternal matter and energy - no god is
> >> needed to provide it.- Hide quoted text -
>
> >> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
ThomM
As an Agnostic - There is NOTHING on my list - since there is NOTHING
PROVEN about gods and religions - and since YOU now say that everthing
on MY list is the same as yours - YOU agree that YOU have nothing on
your list as well.
Thank you for your agreement
pegleg
Pegleg:
That is a feeble argument.....and you know it.
I believe billions and billions of years ago the earth, planets, stars
and universe came in to being......what do you believe? I believe this
was the beginning of the universe, but not the beginning of all that
is.....what do you believe?
>
> > > >> However - since we can PROVE that ENERGY has always existed (THe
> > > >> Joule experiment - which has been tested and repeated thousands of
> > > >> time per year for over a century proves energy cannot be created or
> > > >> destroyed) - that means that - by relativity - MATTER has also always
> > > >> existed.
> > > >> Since we essentially define the Universe as EVERTHING - EVERYWHERE -
> > > >> at EVERY TIME - if something ALWAYS existed - as we KNOW energy has -
> > > >> the UNIVERSE also has always existed.
>
> > > >> And since nutritition comes from eternal matter and energy - no god is
> > > >> needed to provide it.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > >> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> ...
>
> read more »- Hide quoted text -
Thommadura
Sure -= your claim WAS a feeble argument - and I did know it.
>
> I believe billions and billions of years ago the earth, planets, stars
> and universe came in to being......what do you believe? I believe this
> was the beginning of the universe, but not the beginning of all that
> is.....what do you believe?
Since that is NOT the story of creation of the bible - then ALL your are
doing is PROVING that your belief is NOT inspired by a god - but created
by you.
I rely on what I know to explain things - and do not try to make up a
story that has no basis in fact -like the bible does - and many other
scriptures as well.
Since I know that energy cannot be created or destroyed - and that has
been PROVEN by JOULE in an experiment that has been readily tested and
verified thousands of times in the last century - then I know that the
UNIVERSE had no beginning - it is eternal
WE define the universe as EVERYTHING - EVERYWHERE - for ALL TIMES (you
can come up with something more complicated but that is a good basic
description).
Since energy does exist - and cannot be created or destroyed - then
ENERGY always existed - it is eternal
AS long as energy existed - then a Universe existed. Sure - it has
evolved over the millenia - but there NEVER a point where NOTHING existed.
pegleg
Pegleg:
What I have told you.....is absolutely Biblical.
Have u never proven the creation from the Bible?
> I rely on what I know to explain things - and do not try to make up a
> story that has ...
>
> read more »- Hide quoted text -
ThomM
>
> Pegleg:
>
>
> Have u never proven the creation from the Bible?
Even as a theist for years - and having gone to catholic school as
well - I knew early on that creation in the bible is clearly a MYTH -
and has already been proven not to be true
> I rely on what I know to explain things - and do not try to make up a story
So you rely on the fiction of others - hardly an accomplishment to be
proud of.
Ther are so many holes in the story of creation in the bible as to
render it COMICAL today.
pegleg
Pegleg:
No, there's not ~any~ holes.....just what is it that you know. Why can
u not answer the questions I ask u?
Thommadura
> On Nov 13, 8:02 pm, ThomM <tommad...@optonline.net> wrote:
>> On Nov 13, 4:53 pm, pegleg > > by you.
>>
>>
>>
>>> Pegleg:
>>> Have u never proven the creation from the Bible?
>> Even as a theist for years - and having gone to catholic school as
>> well - I knew early on that creation in the bible is clearly a MYTH -
>> and has already been proven not to be true
>>
>>> I rely on what I know to explain things - and do not try to make up a story
>> So you rely on the fiction of others - hardly an accomplishment to be
>> proud of.
>>
>> Ther are so many holes in the story of creation in the bible as to
>> render it COMICAL today.
>
> Pegleg:
>
> No, there's not ~any~ holes.....just what is it that you know. Why can
> u not answer the questions I ask u?
Why have YOU not provided the one thing I asked of YOU - way back at the
beginning
Simply provide testable and verifiable proof of your god - proof that
convinces the highest Iman of Islam to renounce his religion - and tell
all muslims to to the same.
IF there were NO holes in the bible (THe christ story has a 30 year HOLE
in it) - there would only be ONE religion.
There is not even only ONE christian religion.
>
> I believe billions and billions of years ago the earth, planets,
> stars
> and universe came in to being......what do you believe? I believe
> this
> was the beginning of the universe, but not the beginning of all that
> is.....what do you believe?
Again - I answered this before - the universe has ALWAYS exsited.
I do not need to create FAIRY tales to explain things that I do not
actually know anything about. That you do - may explain your mental
mindset. BUT why create a story that has no basis in fact - it really
doesn't provide any answers. YOu may as well believe ALL the stories of
religious creation - alternating then one day at a time - since ALL of
them have facts PROVABLY wrong.
If you actually went to school - you would have learned that energy
cannot be created nor destroyed. So It it therefore eternal - and has
always existed. That was PROVEN in a testable and verifiable manner by
JOULE - and his famous experiment has been repeated thousands of times a
year for the last century by college students - I know I was one of
them. As this is something I actually KNOW is proven TRUTH - not the
LEGEND and myth of a bunch of goat herders and cave dwellers.
ANd since the UNIVERSE is defined as everything - everywhere- at all
times (monkfish would say everywhen) - then if SOMETHING existed - a
UNIVERSE exsited.
That is what I know to be TRUE.
Based on dating - I also will agree that parts of the Universe are
Billions of years old as well - including the earth - which negates the
timeline of the bible creation alone. Based on the timeline in the bible
- as I have posted before - the earth would have been created in 4004BCE
- which is complete NONSENSE.
I also know that all plants and animals did NOT appear in one six day
period. THe fossil record not only shows us that - but it also - show us
fossil records of Australia that are over 3 Billion years old - and
neither the word "billion" nor the word "million" when referring to time
- appear in the bible.
I also know that there were HUMANS on earth 200,000 years ago - from the
dating of Human skulls from Ethiopia - also long before the
Judeo/christian creation timelime of 4004 BCE. In fact - virtually all
of the ancient religions date the earth in THOUSANDS Of years - not
Billions. Only the Hindu - allows for MORE than enough time.
I also know that the Morning and Evening on earth are caused by the
rotation of the earth on its axis - in relation to the sun. SO -there
could not have been morning and evening (Notice I did not say darkeness
- and light - which are not the same thing) - until AFTER the sun would
have been created. Of course - since it is the SUN that the earth orbits
around - the sun would pre-date the earth too. THat is simple Physics.
I also know that over the centuries - hundreds of thousands of different
religions - with hundreds of thousands of sects - and millions of gods -
have been "Created" by humans in their fairy tales of creation. And none
of them actually created OUR earth - because the descriptions of the
earth in those stories are provably WRONG.
pegleg
> > > Pegleg:
>
> > No, there's not ~any~ holes.....just what is it that you know. Why can
> > u not answer the questions I ask u?
>
> Why have YOU not provided the one thing I asked of YOU - way back at the
> beginning
>
> Simply provide testable and verifiable proof of your god - proof that
> convinces the highest Iman of Islam to renounce his religion - and tell
> all muslims to to the same.
>
> IF there were NO holes in the bible (THe christ story has a 30 year HOLE
> in it) - there would only be ONE religion.
~~~~
Pegleg:
There's no hole in the life of Christ. Remember when I told you it's
not about mankind? This still stands.
~~~~
> There is not even only ONE christian religion.
~~~~
Pegleg:
There is only ONE religion, ONE way and that has to be God's way. I do
not know that it's a ~named~ religion or just a group of people that
God shows His way to. Also, the Jews were entrusted with His
word.....so, they have much to teach us.
~~~~
> I believe billions and billions of years ago the earth, planets,
> > stars
> > and universe came in to being......what do you believe? I believe
> > this
> > was the beginning of the universe, but not the beginning of all that
> > is.....what do you believe?
>
> Again - I answered this before - the universe has ALWAYS exsited.
~~~~
Pegleg:
Prove it.
~~~~
> I do not need to create FAIRY tales to explain things that I do not
> actually know anything about. That you do - may explain your mental
> mindset. BUT why create a story that has no basis in fact - it really
> doesn't provide any answers. YOu may as well believe ALL the stories of
> religious creation - alternating then one day at a time - since ALL of
> them have facts PROVABLY wrong.
~~~
Pegleg:
I only believe ~one~ story and that is written in the Bible.
~~~~
>
> If you actually went to school - you would have learned that energy
> cannot be created nor destroyed.
~~~~
Pegleg:
Says who? All the scientist have are ~theories~. Iam here to tell
you.......ENERGY must be sustained! Write it down! 8-)
~~~~
So It it therefore eternal - and has
> always existed. That was PROVEN in a testable and verifiable manner by
> JOULE - and his famous experiment has been repeated thousands of times a
> year for the last century by college students - I know I was one of
> them. As this is something I actually KNOW is proven TRUTH - not the
> LEGEND and myth of a bunch of goat herders and cave dwellers.
~~~~
Pegleg:
But WHO set these principles in place?
~~~~
>
> ANd since the UNIVERSE is defined as everything - everywhere- at all
> times (monkfish would say everywhen) - then if SOMETHING existed - a
> UNIVERSE exsited.
~~~~
Pegleg:
By who's definition? Just because a bunch of men, in white coats
( scientist), stand in front of a classroom and told you so?!
~~~~
> That is what I know to be TRUE.
~~~~
Pegleg
Nope.....
~~~~
> Based on dating - I also will agree that parts of the Universe are
> Billions of years old as well - including the earth - which negates the
> timeline of the bible creation alone.
~~~~
Pegleg:
Does not.
~~~~~
Based on the timeline in the bible
> - as I have posted before - the earth would have been created in 4004BCE
> - which is complete NONSENSE.
~~~~
Pegelg:
U have not done much studying of the Bible, have u? Because if u had
u would know this does not mean what u have implied.
~~~~
> I also know that all plants and animals did NOT appear in one six day
> period.
~~~~
Pegleg:
You are half right.
~~~~
THe fossil record not only shows us that - but it also - show us
> fossil records of Australia that are over 3 Billion years old -
~~~~
Pegleg:
Yes, this is so.
~~~~
and
> neither the word "billion" nor the word "million" when referring to time
> - appear in the bible.
~~~~
Pegleg:
I know. 8-) Isn't it wonderful how God teaches His! 8-)
~~~~
> I also know that there were HUMANS on earth 200,000 years ago - from the
> dating of Human skulls from Ethiopia -
~~~~
Pegleg:
Yes, this is so.
~~~~
also long before the
> Judeo/christian creation timelime of 4004 BCE. In fact - virtually all
> of the ancient religions date the earth in THOUSANDS Of years - not
> Billions. Only the Hindu - allows for MORE than enough time.
>
> I also know that the Morning and Evening on earth are caused by the
> rotation of the earth on its axis - in relation to the sun.
~~~~
Pegleg:
But WHO set it in place? It was no accident.
~~~~
SO -there
> could not have been morning and evening (Notice I did not say darkeness
> - and light - which are not the same thing) - until AFTER the sun would
> have been created. Of course - since it is the SUN that the earth orbits
> around - the sun would pre-date the earth too. THat is simple Physics.
~~~~
Pegleg:
It amazes me how ~smart~ God is! 8-)
~~~~
> I also know that over the centuries - hundreds of thousands of different
> religions - with hundreds of thousands of sects - and millions of gods -
> have been "Created" by humans in their fairy tales of creation. And none
> of them actually created OUR earth - because the descriptions of the
> earth in those stories are provably WRONG.- Hide quoted text -
~~~~
Pegleg:
It all depends on ~where~ you look in the BOOK ( Bible). 8-)
~~~~
Ike E 11/05/09
> There's no hole in the life of Christ. Remember when I told you it's
> not about mankind? This still stands.
Cabbalistic nonsense.
[snip]
Ike
Thommadura
> <snip>
>>>> Pegleg:
>>> No, there's not ~any~ holes.....just what is it that you know. Why can
>>> u not answer the questions I ask u?
>> Why have YOU not provided the one thing I asked of YOU - way back at the
>> beginning
>>
>> Simply provide testable and verifiable proof of your god - proof that
>> convinces the highest Iman of Islam to renounce his religion - and tell
>> all muslims to to the same.
Gee - NO PROOF ?
I will accept that one as your admission that you have none
>>
>> IF there were NO holes in the bible (THe christ story has a 30 year HOLE
>> in it) - there would only be ONE religion.
>
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
>
> There's no hole in the life of Christ. Remember when I told you it's
> not about mankind? This still stands.
I agree - it is FICTIONAL MYTH and they forgot to make that part up -
much like a birth date as well. (we don't even have a death date - that
changes every year as well too)
I note - YOU again failed to provide that proof of your god
> ~~~~
>
>> There is not even only ONE christian religion.
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
>
> There is only ONE religion,
Sorry - but the is nonsense - there are Hundreds of THOUSANDS of them
ONE way and that has to be God's way.
All of them claim the same things about their religions too
And none of them provide any proof - just LIKE you!
I do
> not know that it's a ~named~ religion or just a group of people that
> God shows His way to. Also, the Jews were entrusted with His
> word.....so, they have much to teach us.
ROFL
There are over 39,000 different christian relgions alone - and hundreds
of thousands of others
> ~~~~
>
>
>
>> I believe billions and billions of years ago the earth, planets,
>>> stars
>>> and universe came in to being......what do you believe? I believe
>>> this
>>> was the beginning of the universe, but not the beginning of all that
>>> is.....what do you believe?
>> Again - I answered this before - the universe has ALWAYS exsited.
>
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
> Prove it.
Definition - the Universe - everything that exists EVERYWHERE - for ALL
time.
THerefore - if ANYTHING existed - the Universe existed
The JOULE experiment PROVES that energy is constant - cannot be created
nor destroyed = so energy has always existed - and BY relativity (Which
I agree is a theory) - matter is likely to have always existed as well.
So - since ENERGY has always existed - so has a UNIVERSE
WHile the Universe is CONSTANTLY changing - the BIG BAND "theory" - if
it is correct - would prove that there was both energy and matter BEFORE
it happened.
> ~~~~
>
>> I do not need to create FAIRY tales to explain things that I do not
>> actually know anything about. That you do - may explain your mental
>> mindset. BUT why create a story that has no basis in fact - it really
>> doesn't provide any answers. YOu may as well believe ALL the stories of
>> religious creation - alternating then one day at a time - since ALL of
>> them have facts PROVABLY wrong.
>
> ~~~
> Pegleg:
>
> I only believe ~one~ story and that is written in the Bible.
So - you believe the earth is flat - has four corners but is also a
circle (which of course CANNOT actually happen)- ALL of its kingdoms can
be seen from a high place - it has a great ocean above the clouds where
rain comes from - that there is a proper way to sell your daughter into
slavery - and it is correct to stone a misbehaving son to death - since
ALL of that is in the bible.
And you believe in a god who ORDERED Genocide against populations -
telling his people to kill all the women and children - EXCEPT - the
young virgins who you can keep for yourselves!
You believe in an all knowing god - who did not know that the Fig tree
was out of season - and who "punished" the tree for that one too.
How many people have YOU stoned to death?
Have you ever actually read the bible - it does not appear that way.
> ~~~~
>
>
>> If you actually went to school - you would have learned that energy
>> cannot be created nor destroyed.
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
> Says who? All the scientist have are ~theories~. Iam here to tell
> you.......ENERGY must be sustained! Write it down! 8-)
Why =- what PROOF do YOU have of that one?
THe JOULE experiment is PROOF of what I said - and it is both testable
and verifiable = and repeatable- and has been repeated countless
thousands of time by college students (including me - my father - and my
son) over the last century.
> ~~~~
>
>
>
> So It it therefore eternal - and has
>> always existed. That was PROVEN in a testable and verifiable manner by
>> JOULE - and his famous experiment has been repeated thousands of times a
>> year for the last century by college students - I know I was one of
>> them. As this is something I actually KNOW is proven TRUTH - not the
>> LEGEND and myth of a bunch of goat herders and cave dwellers.
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
> But WHO set these principles in place?
NO ONE
Since it was already there all the time - no one was needed for that one.
> ~~~~
>> ANd since the UNIVERSE is defined as everything - everywhere- at all
>> times (monkfish would say everywhen) - then if SOMETHING existed - a
>> UNIVERSE exsited.
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
>
> By who's definition? Just because a bunch of men, in white coats
> ( scientist), stand in front of a classroom and told you so?!
Funny - I was told that by a Nun dressed in Black.
> ~~~~
>
>> That is what I know to be TRUE.
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg
>
> Nope.....
Sorry - but your statement is unsupported in facts
and dismissed as stated unsupported by you
> ~~~~
>
>
>> Based on dating - I also will agree that parts of the Universe are
>> Billions of years old as well - including the earth - which negates the
>> timeline of the bible creation alone.
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
>
> Does not.
Yes it does
> ~~~~~
>
> Based on the timeline in the bible
>> - as I have posted before - the earth would have been created in 4004BCE
>> - which is complete NONSENSE.
>
> ~~~~
> Pegelg:
>
> U have not done much studying of the Bible, have u?
Actually - I have - I was raised a christian - MY father memorized the
bible at an early age - and I can follow the timeline- something YOU
apparently cannot do
http://home1.gte.net/bridavis/timeline.htm
Beginning with the archeological landmark event of the fall of Jerusalem
(which has now been corrected to 588 B.C., instead of 586-587 B.C.) and
counting backwards the prophesied number of years between this event and
the division of Solomon's kingdom (390 yrs. + 40 yrs., according to
Ezekiel 4:4-7), brings us to 1018 B.C.
From the end of Solomon's 40-year reign to the start of the Temple in
the 4th year of his reign takes us back another 37 years to 1055 B.C.
From the start of Solomon's Temple "in the 480th year" (1 Kings 6:1)
back to the Exodus from Egypt (hence 479 years previous) brings us to
near 1534 B.C.
From the Exodus out of Egypt to Abraham's entering Canaan from Haran
was exactly 430 years to the day (Gen 12:10/ Exodus 12:40/ Gal 3:17),
thus around 1964 B.C.
Since Abraham entered Canaan at age 75 (Gen 12:4), he was born
approximately 2039 B.C.
From Abraham's birth to Noah's grandson (Shem's son), Arpachshad's
birth, 2 years after the Flood started, was 290 years (Gen 11:11-26),
this places the onset of the Flood at around 2331 B.C. [definitely
4,300-4,400 years ago].
The genealogy of Genesis 5:3-32 precludes any gaps due to its tight
chronological structure and gives us 1,656 years between Creation and
the Flood, thus bringing Creation Week back to near 3987 B.C. or
approximately 4000 B.C.
Because if u had
> u would know this does not mean what u have implied.
Sorry - I can support MY statements - even those about the bible -
Apparently YOU cannot
> ~~~~
>
>
>> I also know that all plants and animals did NOT appear in one six day
>> period.
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
>
> You are half right.
Sorry - I am ALL correct on that one.
THe fossil record PROVES that one
We have new animals and plants evolving every year - that is PROVEN.
>
> THe fossil record not only shows us that - but it also - show us
>> fossil records of Australia that are over 3 Billion years old -
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
>
> Yes, this is so.
> ~~~~
>
>
> and
>> neither the word "billion" nor the word "million" when referring to time
>> - appear in the bible.
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
>
> I know. 8-) Isn't it wonderful how God teaches His! 8-)
Since the bible is a Human created story- provide a list of all the
thing YOU can PROVE were directly from a god.
The answer is NONE - and YOu will sidestep that as well
> ~~~~
>
>> I also know that there were HUMANS on earth 200,000 years ago - from the
>> dating of Human skulls from Ethiopia -
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
>
> Yes, this is so.
> ~~~~
>
>
>
> also long before the
>> Judeo/christian creation timelime of 4004 BCE. In fact - virtually all
>> of the ancient religions date the earth in THOUSANDS Of years - not
>> Billions. Only the Hindu - allows for MORE than enough time.
>>
>> I also know that the Morning and Evening on earth are caused by the
>> rotation of the earth on its axis - in relation to the sun.
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
>
> But WHO set it in place? It was no accident.
Since we already KNOW that the universe always existed - obvioulsy NO
One did.
> ~~~~
>
>
>
> SO -there
>> could not have been morning and evening (Notice I did not say darkeness
>> - and light - which are not the same thing) - until AFTER the sun would
>> have been created. Of course - since it is the SUN that the earth orbits
>> around - the sun would pre-date the earth too. THat is simple Physics.
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
>
> It amazes me how ~smart~ God is! 8-)
And how DUMB your is tooo!
> ~~~~
>
>
>> I also know that over the centuries - hundreds of thousands of different
>> religions - with hundreds of thousands of sects - and millions of gods -
>> have been "Created" by humans in their fairy tales of creation. And none
>> of them actually created OUR earth - because the descriptions of the
>> earth in those stories are provably WRONG.- Hide quoted text -
>
> ~~~~
> Pegleg:
>
> It all depends on ~where~ you look in the BOOK ( Bible). 8-)
Since the BIBLE is a belief - not PROOF -= your statement is simply not
true - there is no PROOF in the bible at all
> ~~~~
pegleg
wrote:
> "pegleg" <pegleg.dup...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:7d55e645-a659-427b...@s15g2000yqs.googlegroups.com...
>
> > There's no hole in the life of Christ. Remember when I told you it's
> > not about mankind? This still stands.
>
> Cabbalistic nonsense.
Pegleg:
It is the trurh......did you overlook it?
24 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father,
when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. 25 For He
must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet.
1 Cor 15:24-25 (NKJV)
> [snip]
>
> Ike
pegleg
The post has gotten so jumbled up.....I can't figure out who said
what. 8-) Maybe we will talk again some time. 8-)
Ike E 11/05/09
> On Nov 15, 2:59 am, "Ike E 11/05/09" <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>> "pegleg" <pegleg.dup...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
>> news:7d55e645-a659-427b...@s15g2000yqs.googlegroups.com...
>
>>> There's no hole in the life of Christ. Remember when I told you it's
>>> not about mankind? This still stands.
>
>> Cabbalistic nonsense.
> It is the trurh......did you overlook it?
> Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father,
> when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. For He
> must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet.
> 1 Cor 15:24-25 (NKJV)
How on earth does this insinuate that the story "is not about mankind?"
Your Cabbalistic statement sounds like the teachings of the Stoics, and as
if there is no connection between man, angel, and godhood.
Ike
pegleg
wrote:
> "pegleg" <pegleg.dup...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:8f9024a6-63a8-41e8...@j24g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
>
> > On Nov 15, 2:59 am, "Ike E 11/05/09" <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >> "pegleg" <pegleg.dup...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >>news:7d55e645-a659-427b...@s15g2000yqs.googlegroups.com...
>
> >>> There's no hole in the life of Christ. Remember when I told you it's
> >>> not about mankind? This still stands.
>
> >> Cabbalistic nonsense.
> > It is the trurh......did you overlook it?
> > Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father,
> > when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. For He
> > must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet.
> > 1 Cor 15:24-25 (NKJV)
>
> How on earth does this insinuate that the story "is not about mankind?"
Pegleg:
It's about the Kingdom of God. The Kingdom that is in heaven (Glory)
that will be brought to earth.
Matt.3:9 And do not think you can say to yourselves," We have Abraham
as our father." I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up
children of Abraham.
God does NOT need mankind......and it has been Satan strategy to fill
man's head with the nonsense that He does.
> Your Cabbalistic statement sounds like the teachings of the Stoics, and as
> if there is no connection between man, angel, and godhood.
>
> Ike
Pegleg:
I do not know who ~Stoics~ are. Mankind, the angels and the godhood
will make up the KINGDOM of GOD. It will NOT be known as the kingdom
of mankind or the kingdom of angels, but will be called what it IS:
THE KINGDOM OF GOD.
Fred Thomas
Pegleg:
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
Apparently it does, other wise why would it go through all the bother of making
mankind?
ThomM
>
> God does NOT need mankind......and it has been Satan strategy to fill
> man's head with the nonsense that He does.
>
Actually - gods NEED mankind - since NO gods existed until Humans
created them.
As far as satan - just another abominable creation of your god - vie
the Human mind - nothing true to say otherwise.
Ike E 11/05/09
> On Nov 15, 1:11 pm, "Ike E 11/05/09" <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>> "pegleg" <pegleg.dup...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
>> news:8f9024a6-63a8-41e8...@j24g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
>
>>> On Nov 15, 2:59 am, "Ike E 11/05/09" <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> "pegleg" <pegleg.dup...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
>>>>news:7d55e645-a659-427b...@s15g2000yqs.googlegroups.com...
>
>>>>> There's no hole in the life of Christ. Remember when I told you it's
>>>>> not about mankind? This still stands.
>
>>>> Cabbalistic nonsense.
>>> It is the trurh......did you overlook it?
>>> Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father,
>>> when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. For He
>>> must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet.
>>> 1 Cor 15:24-25 (NKJV)
>
>> How on earth does this insinuate that the story "is not about mankind?"
> It's about the Kingdom of God.
Which is made up of WHAT?
> The Kingdom that is in heaven (Glory)
> that will be brought to earth.
Gosh, Jesus said the Kingdom is WITHIN US, i.e. PEOPLE.
> Matt.3:9 And do not think you can say to yourselves," We have Abraham
> as our father." I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up
> children of Abraham.
> God does NOT need mankind...
You moron: THE BELIEVERS ARE THE "STONES."
> ...and it has been Satan strategy to fill man's head with the nonsense
> that He does.
You can't be that dumb: The eternal "temple" isn't made with BRICK AND
MORTAR. It's a METAPHORICAL CONSTRUCT of PEOPLE.
The twelve foundation stones = the Disciples of the Lamb, i.e. Israel as it
"is."
The twelve gates = the sons of Israel, i.e. Israel as it "was."
And the thickness of the wall is 12 x 12 (144) "cubits," representing the
Israel that "will be," starting with the dualistic Remnant of the End of the
Age.
The WHOLE THING is about "people."
>> Your Cabbalistic statement sounds like the teachings of the Stoics, and
>> as
>> if there is no connection between man, angel, and godhood.
>
>> Ike
> I do not know who ~Stoics~ are.
Well, you should, because you're teaching the same separatist nonsense THEY
taught.
> Mankind, the angels and the godhood will make up the KINGDOM of GOD.
LOL
THEY'RE THE SAME THING in DIFFERENT STATES OF TRANSITION.
Stars = angels = ministers of the Word?
The Seven Candlesticks = The Seven Spirits = The Seven Congregations of God?
Get it yet?
<chuckle>
> It will NOT be known as the kingdom of mankind or the kingdom of angels,
> but will be called
> what it IS: THE KINGDOM OF GOD.
LOL
What do you think the Kingdom of God IS, chucklehead?
Lu 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the
kingdom of God is WITHIN YOU.
Do you know what "stones" represent in prophecy?
CHILDREN.
Want to get with the program?
Ike
pegleg
Pegleg:
Mankind (physical) is not the first of God's creation......and it will
not be the only part of God's KIngdom.
Why did He (God) bother to create anything? I believe because He is
truly a God of love.
The first of His creation (spiritual), the morning stars, all of the
angels ....did not stay true to HIm.... just as with mankind.
But He IS going to have a Kingdom that WILL stay true to Him and it
will be by their choice.
> > Your Cabbalistic statement sounds like the teachings of the Stoics, and as
> > if there is no connection between man, angel, and godhood.
>
> > Ike
>
> Pegleg:
> I do not know who ~Stoics~ are. Mankind, the angels and the godhood
> will make up the KINGDOM of GOD. It will NOT be known as the kingdom
> of mankind or the kingdom of angels, but will be called what it IS:
> THE KINGDOM OF GOD.- Hide quoted text -
pegleg
Pegleg:
You are wrong....there's not going to be one (physical) or the other
(spiritual)...there willl be both.
pegleg
> On Nov 15, 1:44 pm, pegleg > children of Abraham.
>
>
>
> > God does NOT need mankind......and it has been Satan strategy to fill
> > man's head with the nonsense that He does.
>
> Actually - gods NEED mankind - since NO gods existed until Humans
> created them.
Pegleg:
gods may need mankind.....but God does not. He created mankind, He
could turn around and create mankind....BETTER!
if that's what He wanted.. But He wants beings that want to love and
serve Him. This is the WHY He has bothered with the spiritual and
physical realms
Fred Thomas
(you)
Pegleg:
Mankind (physical) is not the first of God's creation......and it will
not be the only part of God's KIngdom.
(me)
And you know this how?
(you)
Why did He (God) bother to create anything? I believe because He is
truly a God of love.
(me)
Really? Why would a god of love allow the creature it created to own one another
then? Why would this "loving god" pick one group of people over the other and
demand the others be killed? Seems to me your sick.
(you)
The first of His creation (spiritual), the morning stars, all of the
angels ....did not stay true to HIm.... just as with mankind.
(me)
Oh, I'm sorry! I did not know that stars were "spiritual", I was under the
impression they were really big balls of fusion of hydrogen atoms!
(you)
But He IS going to have a Kingdom that WILL stay true to Him and it
will be by their choice.
(me)
yea I see. Good point. Let me know how that works out for ya!
Fred Thomas
On Nov 15, 2:17 pm, ThomM <tommad...@optonline.net> wrote:
> On Nov 15, 1:44 pm, pegleg > children of Abraham.
>
>
>
> > God does NOT need mankind......and it has been Satan strategy to fill
> > man's head with the nonsense that He does.
>
> Actually - gods NEED mankind - since NO gods existed until Humans
> created them.
(you)
Pegleg:
gods may need mankind.....but God does not. He created mankind, He
could turn around and create mankind....BETTER!
(me)
Well then, you seem to have a direct line to god, tell us, why doesn't god, ask
him will ya?
(you)
if that's what He wanted.. But He wants beings that want to love and
serve Him.
(me)
So do you feel that all the slaves god allowed to be owned felt love?
(you)
This is the WHY He has bothered with the spiritual and
physical realms
(me)
Really? Do tell!
pegleg
> "pegleg" <pegleg.dup...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:835db585-3f4f-492a...@m38g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
> On Nov 15, 2:17 pm, ThomM <tommad...@optonline.net> wrote:
>
> > On Nov 15, 1:44 pm, pegleg > children of Abraham.
>
> > > God does NOT need mankind......and it has been Satan strategy to fill
> > > man's head with the nonsense that He does.
>
> > Actually - gods NEED mankind - since NO gods existed until Humans
> > created them.
>
> (you)
> Pegleg:
>
> gods may need mankind.....but God does not. He created mankind, He
> could turn around and create mankind....BETTER!
> (me)
> Well then, you seem to have a direct line to god, tell us, why doesn't god, ask
> him will ya?
>
> (you)
> if that's what He wanted.. But He wants beings that want to love and
> serve Him.
>
> (me)
> So do you feel that all the slaves god allowed to be owned felt love?
Pegleg:
Are you a slave? I know King David was a slave and He knew God loved
him.....and he loved God.
> (you)
> This is the WHY He has bothered with the spiritual and
> physical realms
>
> (me)
> Really? Do tell!
>
>
>
>
>
> > As far as satan - just another abominable creation of your god - vie
> > the Human mind - nothing true to say otherwise.- Hide quoted text -
Fred Thomas
Pegleg:
No The character King David was not a slave. Not up on your own myth book are
you?
Ike E 11/05/09
> You are wrong...
Great. The cultist completely bypassed what the WORD says to proclaim "Ike
is wrong," without one stitch of scriptural support whatsoever.
FACT: The "stones" of God, the HOLY CITY, NEW JERUSALEM WHICH IS ABOVE,
which comes into existence after the story is over, but has been with God
since before the story began, is the COLLECTIVE BODY OF BELIEVERS, you dolt.
> .there's not going to be one (physical) or the other (spiritual)...there
> willl be both.
LOL
Bullshit.
There is ONE eternal Holy City, and it will be the collective body of
believers.
Yes, the Lord will reveal the Kingdom in the world for a time, but then
He'll "lift all things up to the Father."
You haven't a CLUE as to what you're talking about, but I DO now know where
you got your Cabbalistic garbage from--the WWCG CULT.
Ike
Ike E 11/05/09
[snip]
> gods may need mankind.....but God does not.
Idiot: God WAS "mankind." His Name was called "Jesus."
> He created mankind, He could turn around and create mankind....BETTER!
Hmmmm.
You just implied God is incompetent.
There IS no "better." There is no "worse."
God is doing and getting precisely what He set out to do and get.
Too bad you don't have a clue as to what that is.
[snip]
Ike
Thommadura
It is A MYTH -= IKE
THere is NOTHING about it that YOU can prove - other than the story was
told by HUMANS. IT has no more credibility than that of any other religion
Thommadura
Since no gods are proven to exist - and since the PHYSICAL has ALWAYS
existed - the only part of your gods kingdom that will exist is the
FAIRY TALE itself, but it will eventually be placed next to the Roman
Pantheon - as obvious nonsense
Thommadura
Since YOU have presented NO supporting PROOF of your statement - there
is NO reason to believe it has ANY validity -
The word "spiritual" is nonsense - a religious created fiction
Thommadura
> On Nov 15, 2:17 pm, ThomM <tommad...@optonline.net> wrote:
>> On Nov 15, 1:44 pm, pegleg > children of Abraham.
>>
>>
>>
>>> God does NOT need mankind......and it has been Satan strategy to fill
>>> man's head with the nonsense that He does.
>
>> Actually - gods NEED mankind - since NO gods existed until Humans
>> created them.
>
> Pegleg:
>
> gods may need mankind.....but God does not. He created mankind,
Sorry - but PROVABLY - it is HUMANS who created GODS - all the texts
about gods were written by humans - and NO gods are proven to exist - so
gods themselves - since they do not exist as defined by relgiions (Which
define them in a way that is impossible) - need nothing - they are NOT real.
pegleg
Pegleg:
David did not have freedom under Saul...this made him a slave. When he
became a fugitive and outlaw....he became a ~run away slave~. Through
all of this he NEVER lost sight that God loved him and that he loved
God.
So, don't whine to me about slaves, because GOD has used slaves down
through history and will do so again!
> > (you)
> > This is the WHY He has bothered with the spiritual and
> > physical realms
>
> > (me)
> > Really? Do tell!
>
> > > As far as satan - just another abominable creation of your god - vie
> > > the Human mind - nothing true to say otherwise.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
pegleg
wrote:
> "pegleg" <pegleg.dup...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
Pegleg:
I hate to think how abusive you must be to your family. You know,
people like you do this thinking it gives them power, It's not going
to work with me. When you learn how to have a decent
conversation......maybe we will talk.
ThomM
Nonsense - you have NO way of establishing that one
>
> So, don't whine to me about slaves, because GOD has used slaves down
> through history and will do so again!
Humans who CLAIMED to have the authority of a god or claimed to BE
gods- have used SLAVES over the years.However - thing that do not
actually exist as defined by religion do not have that power.
ANd yes - there will be those idiots who do not look beyond their own
noses - who will allow themselves to be enslaved for nothing
worthwhile- theists do that ALL the time!
ThomM
You miss the obvious here -
If you look at the posts - the non-believers have REAL names -
sometimes combined - but still identifiable by a reasonably
intelligent person.
Then look at the names of the theists
One is a :Christ - the second coming maybe
One is man who claims to be a female fish (monkfish)
We have a duke - I doubt a real one as well
THere are all sorts of PASTORS - none of which are actually that.
And lots of other false names - including HOLY FOOL (An apt name if
ever there was one)
And then there is ANDREW Chung - who is hardly the poster boy for
religion
anyone would want as well.
Obviously - those who have to hide their identity are not actually how
they appear here - it is all an act for them - since their alter ego
really doesn't exist - just like their gods!
Fred Thomas
Pegleg:
People have used slaves through history, gods (including yours ) so far have
been proven to not exist.
pegleg
>
> > > Pegleg:
>
> > > Are you a slave? I know King David was a slave and He knew God loved
> > > him.....and he loved God.
>
> > > No The character King David was not a slave. Not up on your own myth book are
> > > you?
>
> > Pegleg:
>
> > David did not have freedom under Saul...this made him a slave. When he
> > became a fugitive and outlaw....he became a ~run away slave~. Through
> > all of this he NEVER lost sight that God loved him and that he loved
> > God.
>
> Nonsense - you have NO way of establishing that one
Pegleg:
You don't think the Israelites had Israelites for
slaves?!/!?!!!!!!!!! You don't think Saul had Israelites as
slaves?!?!?!?!?
For that matter, you don't think King David had Israelites as
slaves?!?!?!?!?
Israelites that had been sold into slavery, for debt, to another
Israelite were to be released in the Year of Jubilee (Lev.).....look
it up!!!!!!!
Ex.21:2 If you buy a Hebrew servant, he is to serve you for six years.
But in the seventh year, he shall go free, without paying anything.
Deut.15:12
Hebrews bought Hebrews, period. I do not believe David had the
freedom to leave Saul....Even when Samuel anointed David....it was
done secretly.
>
> > So, don't whine to me about slaves, because GOD has used slaves down
> > through history and will do so again!
>
> Humans who CLAIMED to have the authority of a god or claimed to BE
> gods- have used SLAVES over the years.However - thing that do not
> actually exist as defined by religion do not have that power.
>
> ANd yes - there will be those idiots who do not look beyond their own
> noses - who will allow themselves to be enslaved for nothing
> worthwhile- theists do that ALL the time!- Hide quoted text -
Pegleg:
Well, you know, Thom, you just can't get through life without being a
~slave~ to something. This goes for all of us.
I have been through a lot with different religions....but this time
it's different. This time it really is just me and God.
It's a heck of a lot harder...I have no one to tell me....I am the one
doing the searching...the reading....the praying...8-)
And yeah, sometimes I get it wrong....like MAYBE about King David.
8-) But it will take God to show me I'm wrong and
not some man.
pegleg
Pegleg:
I use the name ~pegleg~ because I have a set of screws in one of my
ankles......that cost a LOT of money. 8-)
How I came up with the name ~pegleg~ is in Sticky Fingers there is a
board that tells your ~Blues~ name from the
first letter of you name.....this is my Blues name.
Pegleg Sugarland Dupree 8-)
> Obviously - those who have to hide their identity are not actually how
> they appear here - it is all an act for them - since their alter ego
> really doesn't exist - just like their gods!- Hide quoted text -
Pegleg:
I'm just what you see.....8-)
Thommadura
> <snip>ThomM
>>>> Pegleg:
>>>> Are you a slave? I know King David was a slave and He knew God loved
>>>> him.....and he loved God.
>>>> No The character King David was not a slave. Not up on your own myth book are
>>>> you?
>>> Pegleg:
>>> David did not have freedom under Saul...this made him a slave. When he
>>> became a fugitive and outlaw....he became a ~run away slave~. Through
>>> all of this he NEVER lost sight that God loved him and that he loved
>>> God.
>> Nonsense - you have NO way of establishing that one
>
>
>
>
> Pegleg:
>
> You don't think the Israelites had Israelites for
> slaves?!/!?!!!!!!!!! You don't think Saul had Israelites as
> slaves?!?!?!?!?
That they did - is without question
That the slave LOVED their god for it - is nonsense
>
> For that matter, you don't think King David had Israelites as
> slaves?!?!?!?!?
Again - I never said that
>
> Israelites that had been sold into slavery, for debt, to another
> Israelite were to be released in the Year of Jubilee (Lev.).....look
> it up!!!!!!!
Where did I deny it?
Do you read before YOU post?
>
> Ex.21:2 If you buy a Hebrew servant, he is to serve you for six years.
> But in the seventh year, he shall go free, without paying anything.
>
> Deut.15:12
Sorry - the BIBLE is YOUR beliefs written down - is not proven truth.
Since ALL religious scripture has equal provability - using yours is
simply dishonest circular logic - and is therefore dismissed
However - as I said - I never rejected that Israel had slaves - I reject
that they LOVED their god FOR IT.
>
>
>>> So, don't whine to me about slaves, because GOD has used slaves down
>>> through history and will do so again!
>> Humans who CLAIMED to have the authority of a god or claimed to BE
>> gods- have used SLAVES over the years.However - thing that do not
>> actually exist as defined by religion do not have that power.
>>
>> ANd yes - there will be those idiots who do not look beyond their own
>> noses - who will allow themselves to be enslaved for nothing
>> worthwhile- theists do that ALL the time!- Hide quoted text -
>
>
> Pegleg:
>
> Well, you know, Thom, you just can't get through life without being a
> ~slave~ to something. This goes for all of us.
But - you do have the ability to change that - if you just look for
PROVEN truth
Religion is not slavery any more - the time when it could be IMPOSED
upon people at the threat of death has gone in most countries.
>
> I have been through a lot with different religions....but this time
> it's different. This time it really is just me and God.
Then you are going it alone - since no god is proven to exist -no god
has proven its existence to all - and no god of the description of your
religion CAN exist. That has already been proven a number of times
>
> It's a heck of a lot harder...I have no one to tell me....I am the one
> doing the searching...the reading....the praying...8-)
And where is the PROOF then
>
Thommadura
And your real name?
pegleg
Pegleg:
You can not prove, to me, He does not exist anymore than I can prove,
to you, that He does. I have been where you are and it not so
wonderful.....being so alone and having nothing but self to depend on.
Fred, you seem like a nice man. If I could give to you this knowledge
or faith....I would, but I can not.....it really has to come from God
Fred Thomas
Pegleg:
Faith=lazy Which is why any religion relies so heavily on it, religions do not
want question askers.
I once believed the myths, then I became educated. Fact is you have no knowledge
to give me, I know this because I once believed the crap. Your god can not
provide it, it does not exist. The fact is any named deity can be proven to
exist or not. All the clues are in your myth book.
pegleg
Pegleg:
What have u become so educated in? Science? What I have can NOT be
proven to you form me!!! I have been where you are.....another ~man or
woman~ could NOT have proved God existed to me!!!! It just could not
of been done. Lazy?
Noope, faith is anything BUT lazy because it likened to a hunger that
cannot be filled. You are the one being lazy....you've been told a lie
and are sooooooooo willing to set back and believe it. The clues are
hidden so that when you find them.....you will KNOW it has come from
God and not man.
Fred Thomas
Pegleg:
Faith: belief that is not based on proof. =lazy
If you hunger, say for knowledge you study..............you
question..........you test...........get evidence which leads to proof.
To take tha fatih route, some one tells you a story, you believe it, you do not
test it, you just believe it at face value. That is lazy.
Is good friday factual?
Ike E 11/16/09
> On Nov 16, 4:44 am, "Ike E 11/05/09" <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>> "pegleg" <pegleg.dup...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
>> news:835db585-3f4f-492a...@m38g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
>
>> [snip]
>
>>> gods may need mankind.....but God does not.
>
>> Idiot: God WAS "mankind." His Name was called "Jesus."
>
>>> He created mankind, He could turn around and create mankind....BETTER!
>
>> Hmmmm.
>
>> You just implied God is incompetent.
>
>> There IS no "better." There is no "worse."
>
>> God is doing and getting precisely what He set out to do and get.
>
>> Too bad you don't have a clue as to what that is.
>
>> [snip]
>
>> Ike
> I hate to think how abusive you must be to your family.
I'm not abusive at all to my family.
Nice attempt at a dodge though.
Fact: The "stones" of God are His Children, with the chief stone being
Jesus, and these are the "stones" with which He is building His "New
Jerusalem," which isn't a building at all, but the collective body of
believers.
I don't know what Satanic rock you crawled out from under, but saying that
God doesn't need Mankind is like saying that you don't need yourself.
Now THAT'S "abusive."
Ike
Ike E 11/16/09
[snip]
> So, don't whine to me about slaves, because GOD has used slaves down
> through history and will do so again!
Nice concept of God you have there.
Too bad the God of the New Testament is about service as personal sacrifice
for the good of all, NOT about beating and oppressing people to get His
way...
"Whoever would be great among you, he must be your servant; and whoever
would first among you, he must be slave of all."
But I guess that's what happens when you come from a Gospel-less cult of
oppression--your every thought is beaten down by tyrants.
Ike
Fred Thomas
"Ike E 11/16/09" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:hdtgpp$fdj$2...@news.eternal-september.org...
>
> "pegleg" <pegleg...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:aada6a0f-d416-4c31...@a31g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
>
> [snip]
>
>> So, don't whine to me about slaves, because GOD has used slaves down
>> through history and will do so again!
>
> Nice concept of God you have there.
>
> Too bad the God of the New Testament is about service as personal sacrifice
> for the good of all, NOT about beating and oppressing people to get His way...
>
According to Jesus, how should slaves be treated?
Answer: They should be beaten for disobedience, but not more severely then they
deserve.
Jesus never denounced slavery: he endorsed it! He incorporated it into his
teachings as if it were the most natural order (which it was for the biblical
writers who didn't know any better). Why doesn't the bible--supposedly inspired
by an all-loving deity--ever hint that there is something wrong with such a
brutal social institution? If it were not for the influence of the bible, the
appalling British and American slave trade might have been curtailed, along with
the bloody Civil War.
"And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither
did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. But he that knew
not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes."
(Luke 12:47-48)
The entire context (Luke 12:41-48) shows that this is not part of a parable--it
is the explanation of a parable, after Peter asked a question. But even if it
were a parable, it would carry the same weight as a teaching of Jesus.
The word "servant" above is doulos, which means "slave" in Greek, and is
correctly rendered "slave" by the NRSV, NAS, Scholar's Version, and others.
"Shall" meant "should," as Jesus adds: "For unto whomsoever much is given, of
him shall be much required." (Luke 12:48)
Paul did urge Philemon to treat his slave Onesimus as a brother (Philemon
15-16), but he was not speaking for Jesus, and Onesimus was a special case, a
personal friend. Paul never denounced slavery.
Slavery is ordained by the Bible:
"Moreover of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them
shall ye buy, . . . and they shall be your possession . . . they shall be your
bondmen forever." (Leviticus 25:45-46) "If thou buy an Hebrew servant, six years
he shall serve: and in the seventh he shall go out free for nothing . . . And if
a man sell his daughter to be a maidservant, she shall not go out as the
menservants do." (Exodus 21:2,7) "Servants [slaves], obey in all things your
masters." (Colossians 3:22)
Ike E 11/16/09
"Fred Thomas" <fr...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:eHvMm.31877$6c2....@newsfe03.iad...
>
> "Ike E 11/16/09" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:hdtgpp$fdj$2...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>
>> "pegleg" <pegleg...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:aada6a0f-d416-4c31...@a31g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> [snip]
>>
>>> So, don't whine to me about slaves, because GOD has used slaves down
>>> through history and will do so again!
>>
>> Nice concept of God you have there.
>>
>> Too bad the God of the New Testament is about service as personal
>> sacrifice for the good of all, NOT about beating and oppressing people to
>> get His way...
>>
>
> According to Jesus, how should slaves be treated?
The way He wanted to be treated AS A SLAVE.
> Answer: They should be beaten for disobedience, but not more severely then
> they deserve.
Like I said, the way He wanted to be treated when HE served AS A
SLAVE...(and by choice at that).
> Jesus never denounced slavery: he endorsed it!
Yes, Jesus taught that the believers' job is to serve one another, starting
with Himself.
> He incorporated it into his teachings as if it were the most natural
> order (which it was for the biblical writers who didn't know any better).
No, NOT "because the biblical writers...didn't know better."
Because the biblical writers DID know better...better than you.
In the beginning, the Word was a "two-tree" story, one natural and beastly,
and one supernatural and godly.
The "beasts," of whatever type, were to be brought into servitude.
Even Jesus had to recognize that convention...until...
> Why doesn't the bible--supposedly inspired by an all-loving deity--ever
> hint that there is something wrong with such a brutal social institution?
Because there wasn't.
> If it were not for the influence of the bible, the appalling British and
> American slave trade might have been curtailed, along with the bloody
> Civil War.
Quite the opposite: If people had read their Bibles, they would have known
that there were solutions to the problem other than war.
(And the slavery that was practiced in the US South had NOTHING in common
with the proper approach described in the Bible.)
> "And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself,
> neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. But
> he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten
> with few stripes." (Luke 12:47-48)
And the trick is to receive your stripes without complaint; but better the
stripes and to live, than to not receive them and die.
[snip]
Don't presume to teach me the Bible--I'll bury you.
pegleg
Pegleg:
No, good friday is not factual. Other than the Sabbath starts at
sundown each Friday.
Good friday and easter are not factual.....Passover is. Jesus Christ
was / is the Passover Lamb for those called under the New Covenant.
Crucifixion day was on a Wednesday, ~the preparation day of that year,
John. 19:14,31 (so says the Hebrew calendar). It was the day before a
~HIGH~ Sabbath. The hight Sabbath fell on Thursday.
Resurrection was at the same time as His death, on the weekly Sabbath
(Saturday)
Friday and Sunday has nothing to do with nothing.
> > > > > (me)
> > > > > Really? Do tell!
>
> > > > > > As far as satan - just another abominable creation of your god - vie
> > > > > > the Human mind - nothing true to say otherwise.- Hide quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
pegleg
Pegleg:
I was one of those little children.....I do not blame God. Your way of
thinking God should fix everything.....make it a magical wonderland.
This way no one would be held accountable for their actions.
Even though I was on the receiving of the sin....I am still
responsible for how I handle what happened. Do I let it destroy my
life? Do I blame God? Do I behave like a child because ~poor me~ got a
bad deal? Or do I pick myself up and by God's grace go forward? Well,
with God's help I'm going forward. Infact, what happened could be one
of the best things in my life.....it has cause me to search and
prove. I would not go back and undo what happened,in trade, for the
knowledge I have today.
Fred Thomas
>
> "Fred Thomas" <fr...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:eHvMm.31877$6c2....@newsfe03.iad...
>>
>> "Ike E 11/16/09" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:hdtgpp$fdj$2...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>
>>> "pegleg" <pegleg...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:aada6a0f-d416-4c31...@a31g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
>>>
>>> [snip]
>>>
>>>> So, don't whine to me about slaves, because GOD has used slaves down
>>>> through history and will do so again!
>>>
>>> Nice concept of God you have there.
>>>
>>> Too bad the God of the New Testament is about service as personal sacrifice
>>> for the good of all, NOT about beating and oppressing people to get His
>>> way...
>>>
>>
>> According to Jesus, how should slaves be treated?
>
> The way He wanted to be treated AS A SLAVE.
>
slave..........hmmmmmmmm........so why did he let the women.......what was her
name..........wash his feet or dry them with her hair.........then his henchmen
objected and he did what? Oh yes he chastised them.......hmmmmmmmmmm
>> Answer: They should be beaten for disobedience, but not more severely then
>> they deserve.
>
> Like I said, the way He wanted to be treated when HE served AS A SLAVE...(and
> by choice at that).
>
So Jesus wanted to be beaten and treated horribly.....................so why did
he stay up all night praying to this father/god of his about it?
>> Jesus never denounced slavery: he endorsed it!
>
> Yes, Jesus taught that the believers' job is to serve one another, starting
> with Himself.
>
There is quite a bit of difference in serving some one and being a slave, you
ought to start with a dictionary.
>> He incorporated it into his teachings as if it were the most natural order
>> (which it was for the biblical writers who didn't know any better).
>
> No, NOT "because the biblical writers...didn't know better."
>
The biblical writers are as ignorant as you, you however could do better because
of the time we live in, they have a far larger excuse, you have none.
> Because the biblical writers DID know better...better than you.
>
> In the beginning, the Word was a "two-tree" story, one natural and beastly,
> and one supernatural and godly.
>
Oh boy, we got a live one here!
> The "beasts," of whatever type, were to be brought into servitude.
>
OK then.
> Even Jesus had to recognize that convention...until...
>
Untill what?
>> Why doesn't the bible--supposedly inspired by an all-loving deity--ever hint
>> that there is something wrong with such a brutal social institution?
>
> Because there wasn't.
>
Let me guess, you are a card carrying member of the KKK?
>> If it were not for the influence of the bible, the appalling British and
>> American slave trade might have been curtailed, along with the bloody Civil
>> War.
>
> Quite the opposite: If people had read their Bibles, they would have known
> that there were solutions to the problem other than war.
>
So a biblical example. Bet you can't.
> (And the slavery that was practiced in the US South had NOTHING in common with
> the proper approach described in the Bible.)
>
Owning people no matter the time in history or by what ever rules you say a
mythic logical deity places with the owning of people is wrong and will never be
right. The slavery of the early U.S, the slavery brought about by Hitler, the
slaves in biblical times had quite a bit of commonality.
>> "And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself,
>> neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. But he
>> that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with
>> few stripes." (Luke 12:47-48)
>
> And the trick is to receive your stripes without complaint; but better the
> stripes and to live, than to not receive them and die.
>
Oh that's an old trick show them YOU DONT CRY.
> [snip]
>
> Don't presume to teach me the Bible--I'll bury you.
>
I'm not "teaching" you anything, and you will bury me? That's laughable at the
highest order. Are you on the comedic tour or something? I can guarantee you
know little to nothing as to what is in the bible. What you think you know, is
pure made up B.S. by you.
Fred Thomas
Pegleg:
(me)
Close.
Thommadura
> "pegleg" <pegleg...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:e78f1174-ce07-4f90...@j4g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
>> On Nov 16, 4:44 am, "Ike E 11/05/09" <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>> "pegleg" <pegleg.dup...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:835db585-3f4f-492a...@m38g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
>>> [snip]
>>>> gods may need mankind.....but God does not.
>>> Idiot: God WAS "mankind." His Name was called "Jesus."
>>>> He created mankind, He could turn around and create mankind....BETTER!
>>> Hmmmm.
>>> You just implied God is incompetent.
>>> There IS no "better." There is no "worse."
>>> God is doing and getting precisely what He set out to do and get.
>>> Too bad you don't have a clue as to what that is.
>>> [snip]
>>> Ike
>
>> I hate to think how abusive you must be to your family.
>
> I'm not abusive at all to my family.
>
> Nice attempt at a dodge though.
>
> Fact:
SORRY _ that is BELEIF
TO call it s FACT is simply a LIE
Thommadura
> "pegleg" <pegleg...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:aada6a0f-d416-4c31...@a31g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
>
> [snip]
>
>> So, don't whine to me about slaves, because GOD has used slaves down
>> through history and will do so again!
>
> Nice concept of God you have there.
>
> Too bad the God of the New Testament is about service as personal sacrifice
> for the good of all, NOT about beating and oppressing people to get His
> way...
YOU mean like what he did to the FIG TREE,
OF course- if you believe that anything in the NT originated from the
christ - then the god of the NT was his FATHER =- not him
Thommadura
IF YOU cannot prove ANY god to exist - you cannot make a further claim
about a god until you do.
Just remember - YOU do not have any KNOWLEDGE - just belief
pegleg
Pegleg:
8-) See ya around, Thom M.
Ike E 11/16/09
[snip]
> No, good friday is not factual. Other than the Sabbath starts at
> sundown each Friday.
Nonsense. Jesus SAID how it would play out...
Lk 13:31-33
The same day there came certain of the Pharisees, saying unto [Jesus],
Get thee out, and depart hence: for Herod will kill thee.
And he said unto them, Go ye, and tell that fox, Behold, I cast out
devils [Friday night], and I do cures to day and to morrow [Friday and
Saturday], and the third day I shall be perfected [Sunday].
Nevertheless I must walk to day, and to morrow, and the day following:
for it cannot be that a prophet perish out of Jerusalem.
You misinterpret "in the heart of the earth."
"Earth" = wicked Israel.
Jesus was arrested Thursday night by the temple guards, after taking the
meal of the FIRST Sabbath. THAT'S when He entered "the heart of the earth."
He was tortured "in the heart of the earth" from then until His death before
sundown Friday.
Hence, Thursday Night, Friday Night, and Saturday Night are the three
"nights;" and Thursday morning, Friday morning, and Saturday morning started
the three "days."
And He was raised before sunrise on SUNDAY.
The churches had it right all along.
You cultists didn't.
[snip the rest of the nonsense]
Ike
Fred Thomas
nights...........hint hint.............two Sabbaths that week.....hint
hint.......the start of a new day is at sunset.....hint hint........according to
the traditional Hebrew calendar you can not have back to back Sabbaths meaning
Friday could not be a Sabbath.
Ike E 11/16/09
>
> "Ike E 11/16/09" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:hduc5i$l98$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>
>> "Fred Thomas" <fr...@aol.com> wrote in message
>> news:eHvMm.31877$6c2....@newsfe03.iad...
>>>
>>> "Ike E 11/16/09" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:hdtgpp$fdj$2...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>>
>>>> "pegleg" <pegleg...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:aada6a0f-d416-4c31...@a31g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
>>>>
>>>> [snip]
>>>>
>>>>> So, don't whine to me about slaves, because GOD has used slaves down
>>>>> through history and will do so again!
>>>>
>>>> Nice concept of God you have there.
>>>>
>>>> Too bad the God of the New Testament is about service as personal
>>>> sacrifice for the good of all, NOT about beating and oppressing people
>>>> to get His way...
>>>>
>>>
>>> According to Jesus, how should slaves be treated?
>>
>> The way He wanted to be treated AS A SLAVE.
>>
You have no clue what Jesus "was claiming."
"Whoever would be great among you, he must be your servant; and whoever
would be first among you, he must be slave of all."
God forbid you should have to put everyone else in the world before
yourself.
He did.
[snip]
Ike
Ike E 11/16/09
Let me know when you actually learn something about The Word...
Jesus put two Sabbaths back to back, celebrating Passover Thursday night (by
our reckoning), and then BECAME the Passover Lamb Friday night (by our
reckoning), and He was raised the first day of the week, just as in the
Jubilee concept.
There were 7 x 7 Sabbatical periods of seven years, each ending with a
Sabbath year, and then an extra special Sabbath year, the Jubilee (the
Acceptable Year of the Lord), to make 50 years total.
Jesus SAID that He was here to preach "the acceptable year of the Lord,"
which He did in miniature during the Passion, creating a Passover Thursday
night, BEING the "Passover" Friday night, He lay in state through the
Passover Day, and was raised Sunday (which initiated the "eighth day"
concept of regeneration).
Now, Jesus was in the "heart of the earth" three days and three nights, but
"earth" means "Semite" in general, "Israel" in thesis, and "Israel that is
not Israel" in antithesis (as John uses the terms in Revelation).
Ike
Fred Thomas
>
> "Fred Thomas" <fr...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:hdv6qa$thp$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>
>> "Ike E 11/16/09" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:hduc5i$l98$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>
>>> "Fred Thomas" <fr...@aol.com> wrote in message
>>> news:eHvMm.31877$6c2....@newsfe03.iad...
>>>>
>>>> "Ike E 11/16/09" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:hdtgpp$fdj$2...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>>>
>>>>> "pegleg" <pegleg...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:aada6a0f-d416-4c31...@a31g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
>>>>>
>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>
>>>>>> So, don't whine to me about slaves, because GOD has used slaves down
>>>>>> through history and will do so again!
>>>>>
>>>>> Nice concept of God you have there.
>>>>>
>>>>> Too bad the God of the New Testament is about service as personal
>>>>> sacrifice for the good of all, NOT about beating and oppressing people to
>>>>> get His way...
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> According to Jesus, how should slaves be treated?
>>>
>>> The way He wanted to be treated AS A SLAVE.
>>>
>> Hmmmm, Jesus who is claiming...
>
> You have no clue what Jesus "was claiming."
>
call you dishonest yet, benefit of the doubt time.
OK then.
Untill what?
>>> But I guess that's what happens when you come from a Gospel-less cult of
>>> oppression--your every thought is beaten down by tyrants.
Hmmmmm...........seems you have the oppression backwards. Slavery is the
ultimate form of oppression.
Fred Thomas
> Jesus put two Sabbaths back to back, celebrating Passover Thursday night (by
> our reckoning),
The Passover meal is not a Sabbath, the first day of unleavened bread is,
although it is the Passover season they are two different events.
> and then BECAME the Passover Lamb Friday night (by our reckoning),
By my reckoning?
> and He was raised the first day of the week, just as in the Jubilee concept.
>
That's the typical Christian custom and teaching of the myth, however a simple
read of the myth book tells a time frame.
> There were 7 x 7 Sabbatical periods of seven years, each ending with a Sabbath
> year, and then an extra special Sabbath year, the Jubilee (the Acceptable Year
> of the Lord), to make 50 years total.
>
> Jesus SAID that He was here to preach "the acceptable year of the Lord," which
> He did in miniature during the Passion, creating a Passover Thursday night,
> BEING the "Passover" Friday night, He lay in state through the Passover Day,
> and was raised Sunday (which initiated the "eighth day" concept of
> regeneration).
>
> Now, Jesus was in the "heart of the earth" three days and three nights, but
> "earth" means "Semite" in general, "Israel" in thesis, and "Israel that is not
> Israel" in antithesis (as John uses the terms in Revelation).
>
The word "earth" does not mean "Semite".
Matthew 12"
40. |5618| even as |1063| For |2258| was |2495| Jonah |1722| in |3588| the
|2836| belly |3588| of the |2785| huge fish |9999| {for} |5140| three |2250|
days |2532| and |5140| three |3571| nights, |3779| so |2071| will be |3588| the
|5207| Son |3588| of |0444| Man |1722| in |3588| the |2588| heart |3588| of the
|1093| earth |9999| {for} |5140| three |2250| days |2532| and |5140| three
|3571| nights.
Strong's Ref. # 1093
Romanized ge
Pronounced ghay
contracted from a primary word; soil; by extension a region, or the solid part
or the whole of the terrene globe (including the occupants in each application):
KJV--country, earth(-ly), ground, land, world.
Yup, got a live one here!
> Ike
>
Ike E 11/16/09
>
> "Ike E 11/16/09" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:he2ov2$4e6$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>
>> "Fred Thomas" <fr...@aol.com> wrote in message
>> news:hdv6qa$thp$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>
>>> "Ike E 11/16/09" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:hduc5i$l98$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>>
>>>> "Fred Thomas" <fr...@aol.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:eHvMm.31877$6c2....@newsfe03.iad...
>>>>>
>>>>> "Ike E 11/16/09" <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:hdtgpp$fdj$2...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "pegleg" <pegleg...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:aada6a0f-d416-4c31...@a31g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So, don't whine to me about slaves, because GOD has used slaves down
>>>>>>> through history and will do so again!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Nice concept of God you have there.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Too bad the God of the New Testament is about service as personal
>>>>>> sacrifice for the good of all, NOT about beating and oppressing
>>>>>> people to get His way...
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> According to Jesus, how should slaves be treated?
>>>>
>>>> The way He wanted to be treated AS A SLAVE.
>>>>
>>> Hmmmm, Jesus who is claiming...
>>
>> You have no clue what Jesus "was claiming."
>>
> Lets put back what you snipped out, context is soooooo important.
Why? It was stupid enough the first time.
[snip]
Ike