God And Profanity
Carl
bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity. Leslie Trombly's
sermon centers on man's use of profanity and how we may try to better avoid
falling into that trap. I hope Dave reads this and perhaps he might find it
uplifting and edifying.
May God bless,
Carl
my website -- http://www.nettally.com/saints/
my blog -- http://www.anniemayhem.com/cgi-bin/wordpress/
---
God And Profanity
by Leslie Trombly
How many of you have ever wished you never hear a swear or profane word? How
many of you are still fighting the battle of using profanity and curse
words? If I could have one thing given or granted to me by God, I would ask
that every single curse or profane word I ever heard in my life would become
unknow to me and that my ears would never hear them again; nor the spew
forth from my mouth. I grew up in an environment where the favorite
household word was GD. (I am sure everyone know what that stands for.) Then
when I was in the Army I heard what I thought was every curse word known to
man; but I was wrong! That didn't happen until my second marriage. My ex was
a sailor and if there was a curse word I hadn't heard before, I heard it
then!
I was still a "Baby Christian" and trying very hard to become what the Lord
called me to be. Avoiding using profanity or swearing is very, very
difficult when you have been raised in that environment and then end up in a
situation albeit marriage or something where you are subjected to the daily
and consistant use of fowl words and profanity. For me it has been a life
long battle and even though I have gotten better at it and do not do it like
I used to...I still have that problem. It rears it's ugly head when I am
upset or very frustrated and it seems to come out of nowhere. When I realize
what I have done and how much I have just hurt the Lord, I start to cry and
I feel so ashamed. I love Him too much to hurt him...yet, I seem to ...no
matter how unintentional it maybe. I ask for forgiveness and strength to
keep on fighting against this. The Lord will forgive me and I will go on
trying to avoid it.
One day He said to me, "Mary,You are in human flesh and it is weak. I know
how hard you are trying and I know your heart. I will fogive you. You are
right to feel ashamed, but once you are fogiven...do not carry that guilt
around with you. There is no more guilt." I said,"But Lord I have hurt you
and your Father and I never want to do that! I am so ashamed and saddened
when I realize what I have done. Is there not some way to help me avoid this
sort of outburst as much as I can? What about these thoughts of fowl and
profane words that seem to pop into my head out of nowhere? How do I deal
with that?" Jesus replied and said, "Consider this, The world is my house.
It isn't a building such as a home or even a church or synagogue..it is the
world. Now I ask you, would you curse, swear or use profanity in my house? I
cried,"Never Lord! Never!" Then He said, but you do. The world is my house.
If you think of it in that way...it will help you to be more alert and not
say those things." Then I said, "Lord, What about those that pop into my
head out oF nowhere?" He answered and said, "When that happens think of me
or of a bible verse and say it over and over again until that thought goes
away." Then I am reminded of something in Psalms 141:1-10
"Lord, I cry unto thee: make haste unto me; give ear unto my voice, when I
cry unto thee. Let my prayer be set forth before thee as incense; and the
lifting up of my hands as the evening sacrifice. Set a watch, O LORD, before
my mouth; keep the door of my lips. Incline not my heart to any evil thing,
to practise wicked works with men that work iniquity: and let me not eat of
their dainties. Let the righteous smite me; it shall be a kindness: and let
him reprove me; it shall be an excellent oil, which shall not break my head:
for yet my prayer also shall be in their calamities. When their judges are
overthrown in stony places, they shall hear my words; for they are sweet.
Our bones are scattered at the grave's mouth, as when one cutteth and
cleaveth wood upon the earth. But mine eyes are unto thee, O GOD the Lord:
in thee is my trust; leave not my soul destitute. Keep me from the snares
which they have laid for me, and the gins of the workers of iniquity. Let
the wicked fall into their own nets, whilst that I withal escape."
When we ask the Lord to set a watch over our mouths and the doors of our
lips to guard us against saying that which is evil and profane, we are
seeking His help and strength in overcoming that which is not righteous and
holy in His sight. It is an uphill battle for those of us who live or have
lived and grew up in an environment where that was all you hear or have
heard. let me tell you something at this point. Just because you became a
Christian and/or have been one for quite some time... those bad habits or
things that you heard that were profane and ungodly..do not just
instantaneously disappear. Some do, while others take a while to overcome
and still others become a constant battle and reminder of just how much that
we are sinners that have been saved by the Grace of God, through His Son's
death on calvary and His shed blood that paid the price for it all. There
isn't one saved sould on this planet from clergy to the common man that is
totally sin-free. By that, I mean that there is no one person that can
remain sin-free. We all have a bad habit(s) or have a weaknesses that are a
constant thorns in our sides. Try as we may
to overcome them all, we never will. If we did, we wouldn't be here. We
would be with the Father in Heaven as Jesus is. Now there was a sinless and
perfect Man!
We will never be totally sin-free ! Why? Because we are in the Flesh and as
long as we are in the Flesh, try as we may, we will still sin. We may not
want to, we may try not to, and wish we didn't; but the fact remains that as
long as we are in the flesh will will be tempted, we will fall and we will
on occassion yield to that sin. Now, I know the next question is: So what is
the point of being saved if we still sin? The point is that as life goes on
and you who are truly saved by the Blood of the Lamb, have the power and the
strength to fight and overome it most of the time. The Lord will forgive you
when you fall, as long as you keep on fighting the good fight and trying not
to sin. Remember in Romans 3:23 it says, "For all have sinned and come short
of the Glory of God." As long as we are in the Flesh we will be tempted, we
will fall, we will make mistakes, but it is by the Grace of God and His
Forgiveness that we are redeemed. It is a life-long battle and will only end
when we are in the Kingdom of God, albeit by the Rapture or by His calling
you home.
Whether you are a "saved" sinner or an "Unsaved Sinner" God loves you! He
wants to forgive you and for the unsaved sinner..He wants to redeem you and
save your soul from eternal damnation. The hardest thing you have to to is
realize that you are a sinner and that you do not have to "clean up your
act" before seeking His pardon and mercy and Redemption. He will take you
just as you are..right here and right now. For those of us who have accepted
Jesus into our hearts and lives, fighting the temptations of sin is an
on-going battle. we must always fight against sin and when we fail and fall,
seek God's forgiveness and pardon.."He is faithful and just to forgive".
What He will not tolerate and continue to forgive is the "deliberate sin".
That is, a sin by a Christian or "so-called christian" that goes to church
on the Sabbath and asks for His forgiveness, then turns around on Monday
Morning or five minutes after receiving forgiveness, deliberately goes out
and sins the same sins over and over again until the next Sabbath day. God
will only be patient and forgive so much until His patience runs out and He
stops forgiving the "deliberate sinner". God will forgive - forever the
repentant sinner and those who are redeemed by the Blood of the Lamb that
are trying not to sin and overcome their sin.
Another sin that is totally unforgivable is the sin of "Blaspheming the Holy
Spirit? First, let us understand what Blasphemy is. Too often the
understanding of blasphemy is misunderstood and people are not seeing or
understanding what Blaspheming the Holy Spirit is. Blasphemy in the Webster's
dictionary is defined as: "(1) to speak in impiously or irreverantly of god
(or sacred things); utter impieties (2) to speak evil, slander or abuse. In
the bible, it also means to speak against the Holy Spirit. When we look at
Matthew 12:31, Jesus tells us , " Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of
sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven men; but the blasphemy against the Holy
Ghost (Spirit)shall not be forgiven unto men." We are told this again in
Mark 3:29. Look at Ephesians 4:30: "And grieve not the Holy Spirit of God,
whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption." Another meaning to the
word Blasphemy is this: "To have known God, the father. His son, Jesus
Christ and The Holy Spirit; yet to walk away and deny them...especially the
Holy Spirit." The Holy Spirit dwells within us (John 14:17;Romans 8:9;I Cor.
3:16,6:19;II Timothy 1:14 and I John 2:27) once we are saved and born of the
water and the spirit (John 3:5-7).To blaspheme the Holy Spirit in any way,
unfortunately and sadly comes with a very high price.
I remind all of you - we are not infallible to sin, we can deny it, cover it
up or ignore it as sin, but the fact still remains that we still sin,
because we are in the flesh. But the gift of Mercy and grace to those who
have been redeemed is that we will be forgiven when we fall, as long as (and
this bears repeating) we fight against sin and we are trying to avoid sin.
When you look in Matthew 12:5, even Jesus tells how the priests of the
temple profane the sabbath. So you see not even clergy, much as we would
like to believe, are not exempt for temptation or falling into it or
sin-free. Anyone who tells you that they do not commit any form of sin is a
liar. If they were so sin-free, they wouldn't be HERE! Once we accept the
fact that even though we are saved and that we are still on the battleground
against sin as long as we are in the flesh; when we fall, we need only to
ask for His forgiveness and it will be given to us. Remember the deliberate
sin will not always be forgiven and God's patience will RUN OUT!
Finally, look at Ecclesiastes 7:16-20
"Be not righteous over much; neither make thyself over wise: why shouldest
thou destroy thyself ? Be not over much wicked, neither be thou foolish: why
shouldest thou die before thy time? It is good that thou shouldest take hold
of this; yea, also from this withdraw not thine hand: for he that feareth
God shall come forth of them all. Wisdom strengtheneth the wise more than
ten mighty men which are in the city. For there is not a just man upon
earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not."
"There is no just man upon the earth". That means exactly what I have been
telling you. We may be redeemed in the Blood of the Lamb but no one is
sin-free all their lives. they are in human flesh and are subjected to the
fallacies of being so. do not believe anyone who say they are sinless; for
they are liars and know not the truth.
bob young
Carl wrote:
> Dave certainly likes to use profanity in his Usenet posts. That's really too
> bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
> intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity. Leslie Trombly's
> sermon centers on man's use of profanity and how we may try to better avoid
> falling into that trap. I hope Dave reads this and perhaps he might find it
> uplifting and edifying.
Does your god never show it's eternal gratitiude to you humans for doing all of
'His' work for him and for knowing so much about what 'He' thinks?
Strange isn't i? A god that created the entire universe needs Carl to do 'His'
bidding.
What a dead giveaway.
Bob
SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim
"Carl" <sai...@nettally.com> wrote in message
news:fm9n13$2hl$1...@news.utelfla.com...
> Dave certainly likes to use profanity in his Usenet posts. That's really
> too bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
> intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity. Leslie Trombly's
> sermon centers on man's use of profanity and how we may try to better
> avoid falling into that trap.
DEATH TO THE SICK, SADISTIC MOTHERFUCKER, DEATH TO THE ALL-POWERFUL ASSHOLE,
DEATH TO THE USELESS PILE OF CRAP, DEATH TO THE MASS-MURDERING, CHILD-KILING
COLD-HEARTED BASTARD CHRISTIAN GOD
Your jackass god is ONE USELESS PILE OF SHIT
SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim
"Barry OGrady" <god_fre...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:dskho3h023hno4ck4...@4ax.com...
> Fuck God!
agreed, that god idiot needs to get fucked up the ass with a 12 inch black
cock
>
> Barry
Gabriel
<alasp...@netvigator.com> wrote:
>
>
>Carl wrote:
>
>> Dave certainly likes to use profanity in his Usenet posts. That's really too
>> bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
>> intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity. Leslie Trombly's
>> sermon centers on man's use of profanity and how we may try to better avoid
>> falling into that trap. I hope Dave reads this and perhaps he might find it
>> uplifting and edifying.
>
>Does your god never show it's eternal gratitiude to you humans for doing all of
>'His' work for him and for knowing so much about what 'He' thinks?
God has indeed shown his gratitude. We see His blessings in our
life every day! If you one day repent and accept the gift of
Jesus Christ into your heart, you'll see the same blessings in
your life as well.
>
>Strange isn't i? A god that created the entire universe needs Carl to do 'His'
>bidding.
God needs nothing. It brings glory and honor to Him for us to do
so. To follow His commandments is to honor God - to worship Him -
our Creator and Savior.
Praise the Lord and give thanks for His grace!
gabriel
SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim
"Gabriel" <gabriel...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:p0qho3d0qal81g00r...@4ax.com...
> On 12 Jan 2008 03:22:02 -0600, bob young
> <alasp...@netvigator.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>Carl wrote:
>>
>>> Dave certainly likes to use profanity in his Usenet posts. That's really
>>> too
>>> bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
>>> intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity. Leslie Trombly's
>>> sermon centers on man's use of profanity and how we may try to better
>>> avoid
>>> falling into that trap. I hope Dave reads this and perhaps he might find
>>> it
>>> uplifting and edifying.
>>
>>Does your god never show it's eternal gratitiude to you humans for doing
>>all of
>>'His' work for him and for knowing so much about what 'He' thinks?
>
> God has indeed shown his gratitude. We see His blessings in our
> life every day! If you one day repent and accept the gift of
> Jesus Christ into your heart, you'll see the same blessings in
> your life as well.
what blessings do you see, do you win the lottery daily?
>
>>
>>Strange isn't i? A god that created the entire universe needs Carl to do
>>'His'
>>bidding.
>
> God needs nothing. It brings glory and honor to Him for us to do
> so. To follow His commandments is to honor God - to worship Him -
> our Creator and Savior.
he didn't create us, my parents created me when they fucked
>
> Praise the Lord and give thanks for His grace!
death to the mass murdering bastard christian god
<A John 3:16 Whosoever>
> Dave certainly likes to use profanity in his Usenet posts. That's really too
> bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
> intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity.
"Pastor" Dave is not the only one, Carl. "Bible" Bob immediately
comes to mind, although his language is more in the area of vulgar and
coarse - laden with sexual references. But you already knew that.
Your buddy Weatherly is another, even worse offender. As a matter of
fact, he defends his use of "god" and "damn" together as neither being
profanity nor taking the Lord's name in vain. He frequently calls
women "b***h" and other, similar degrading names. He uses vulgar,
profane language regularily, yet I don't see a post from you
concerning this.
Why not?
Sugien
"SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim" <kil...@killgod.com> wrote in message
news:13ohsaa...@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "Gabriel" <gabriel...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:p0qho3d0qal81g00r...@4ax.com...
>> On 12 Jan 2008 03:22:02 -0600, bob young
>> <alasp...@netvigator.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Carl wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dave certainly likes to use profanity in his Usenet posts. That's
>>>> really too
>>>> bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
>>>> intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity. Leslie
>>>> Trombly's
>>>> sermon centers on man's use of profanity and how we may try to better
>>>> avoid
>>>> falling into that trap. I hope Dave reads this and perhaps he might
>>>> find it
>>>> uplifting and edifying.
>>>
>>>Does your god never show it's eternal gratitiude to you humans for doing
>>>all of
>>>'His' work for him and for knowing so much about what 'He' thinks?
>>
>> God has indeed shown his gratitude. We see His blessings in our
>> life every day! If you one day repent and accept the gift of
>> Jesus Christ into your heart, you'll see the same blessings in
>> your life as well.
>
> what blessings do you see, do you win the lottery daily?
It constantly amazes me that not only do non-believers but most Christians
as well think that becoming a Christian gives the believer more money.
>>
>>>
>>>Strange isn't i? A god that created the entire universe needs Carl to do
>>>'His'
>>>bidding.
>>
>> God needs nothing. It brings glory and honor to Him for us to do
>> so. To follow His commandments is to honor God - to worship Him -
>> our Creator and Savior.
>
> he didn't create us, my parents created me when they fucked
Intercourse does indeed *start* the process of creating a human body; but it
is God that puts the *living* spirit into it.
>
>>
>> Praise the Lord and give thanks for His grace!
>
> death to the mass murdering bastard christian god
>
>
I find it laughable that you would purpose such a thing considering that you
are in effect purposing the death of something which you say doesn't exist
in the first place.
--
From the Desk of Paul CKC
........... /}
@###{ ]::::::Cyber Knight for Christ::::::>
-------- \}
Sugien
what would have hurt you so badly that you would feel a desire to make such
an outburst of profanity.
--
Profanity is the attempt of a weak mind to make a strong statement
SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim
"Sugien" <paulbr...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:47892c00$0$22573$4c36...@roadrunner.com...
it amazes me that chistian nuts believe in some ALL-POWERFUL ASSHOLE just
because of the horseshit ramblings overactive imaginations of some
superstitious cave dwellers and goat fuckers from a few rthousand years ago
>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>Strange isn't i? A god that created the entire universe needs Carl to
>>>>do 'His'
>>>>bidding.
>>>
>>> God needs nothing. It brings glory and honor to Him for us to do
>>> so. To follow His commandments is to honor God - to worship Him -
>>> our Creator and Savior.
>>
>> he didn't create us, my parents created me when they fucked
>
> Intercourse does indeed *start* the process of creating a human body; but
> it is God that puts the *living* spirit into it.
more bible babble bullshit, does your god not put his "spirit" all the way
in when a woman has a miscarriage ? or when a baby is borb premature and
dies?
>
>>
>>>
>>> Praise the Lord and give thanks for His grace!
>>
>> death to the mass murdering bastard christian god
>>
>>
>
> I find it laughable that you would purpose such a thing considering that
> you are in effect purposing the death of something which you say doesn't
> exist in the first place.
I find it laughable that you're believing in something that came from the
horseshit ramblings of some superstitious cave dwellers and goat fuckers
from a few thosand years ago
SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim
>>
> my my, such an outburst. I can see your pain and can only try and imagine
> what would have hurt you so badly that you would feel a desire to make
> such an outburst of profanity.
get your HORSESHIT religion out of everyday life. please let me know when te
phrase "INMASS-MURDERING, CHILD-KILLING COLD-HEARTED BASTARD christians
trust" has been removed from all money, public buildings, etc.
quit pushing your HORSESHIT, MADE UP SKY PIXIE on everyone
>
>
> --
> Profanity is the attempt of a weak mind to make a strong statement
religion is the attempt of a moron to push his or her views on the rest of
humanity
<A John 3:16 Whosoever>
> x-no-archive: yes
> On 12 Jan 2008 03:22:02 -0600, bob young <alaspect...@netvigator.com>
> wrote:
> © 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
> may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
>
>
>
> >Carl wrote:
>
> >> Dave certainly likes to use profanity in his Usenet posts. That's really too
> >> bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
> >> intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity. Leslie Trombly's
> >> sermon centers on man's use of profanity and how we may try to better avoid
> >> falling into that trap. I hope Dave reads this and perhaps he might find it
> >> uplifting and edifying.
>
> >Does your god never show it's eternal gratitiude to
>
> you would know that the
> word "it's" is not the possessive form.
> The contraction "it's", is ONLY --ALWAYS --a contraction of the two
> words: "it " and "is."
>
> So your sentence above actually says:
>
> "... Does your god never show it is eternal gratitude to..."
Interesting that in a thread about the use of profanity by those who
call themselves Christians the only comment you make is to correct
someone's grammar.
If only you cared as much about your own grammar, syntax, and English
language-use as you do about others'...
bob young
Gabriel wrote:
> On 12 Jan 2008 03:22:02 -0600, bob young
> <alasp...@netvigator.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >Carl wrote:
> >
> >> Dave certainly likes to use profanity in his Usenet posts. That's really too
> >> bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
> >> intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity. Leslie Trombly's
> >> sermon centers on man's use of profanity and how we may try to better avoid
> >> falling into that trap. I hope Dave reads this and perhaps he might find it
> >> uplifting and edifying.
> >
> >Does your god never show it's eternal gratitiude to you humans for doing all of
> >'His' work for him and for knowing so much about what 'He' thinks?
>
> God has indeed shown his gratitude. We see His blessings in our
> life every day!
You mean tsunamis that sweep thousands of children ou to sea to drown, those kind
of blessings? Or do you only want it your way and ignore children born mentally
retarded and cripped?
'In 'His own image ! ' Garbage
Man makes his god in his image and then manipulates it, loke you do, to his heart's
content
> If you one day repent and accept the gift of
> Jesus Christ into your heart, you'll see the same blessings in
> your life as well.
>
> >
> >Strange isn't i? A god that created the entire universe needs Carl to do 'His'
> >bidding.
>
> God needs nothing. It brings glory and honor to Him for us to do
> so. To follow His commandments is to honor God - to worship Him -
> our Creator and Savior.
Wrong, Carl shows otherwise along with millions of others, all speaking for a god
that cannot speak for itself.
It spoke to Moses right? why not today?
>
>
> Praise the Lord and give thanks for His grace!
Tell that to a mother that has just given birth to a blind baby
>
>
> gabriel
bob young
Sugien wrote:
Does that include the one in 400,000 fetus that arrive from the womb grossly
deformed, so gross the parents are not allowed to see it?
What is your god's rationale for that?
bob young
"john w
> x-no-archive: yes
> On 12 Jan 2008 03:22:02 -0600, bob young <alasp...@netvigator.com>
> wrote:
> © 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
> may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
> >
> >
> >Carl wrote:
> >
> >> Dave certainly likes to use profanity in his Usenet posts. That's really too
> >> bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
> >> intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity. Leslie Trombly's
> >> sermon centers on man's use of profanity and how we may try to better avoid
> >> falling into that trap. I hope Dave reads this and perhaps he might find it
> >> uplifting and edifying.
> >
> >Does your god never show it's eternal gratitiude to
>
> Gee, bobby! You're so well educated and so INFORMED, I would think
> you would know that the
> word "it's" is not the possessive form.
> The contraction "it's", is ONLY --ALWAYS --a contraction of the two
> words: "it " and "is."
>
> So your sentence above actually says:
>
> "... Does your god never show it is eternal gratitude to..."
Wow thanks for the English lesson.
Clearly you had no idea how to answer a logical question, as usual, the meaning of
which you full well knew.
Ah well, the cat is out of the bag again.
Religion is for the weak and simple minded
bob young
Sugien wrote:
He may have been raped by a priest as a young boy. It is not unheard of !
Father Haskell
> Dave certainly likes to use profanity in his Usenet posts. That's really too
> bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
> intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity.
That's not what Patton said.
Sugien
>>> Your jackass god is ONE USELESS PILE OF SHIT
>>>
>> my my, such an outburst. I can see your pain and can only try and
>> imagine what would have hurt you so badly that you would feel a desire to
>> make such an outburst of profanity.
>
> get your HORSESHIT religion out of everyday life. please let me know when
> te phrase "INMASS-MURDERING, CHILD-KILLING COLD-HEARTED BASTARD christians
> trust" has been removed from all money, public buildings, etc.
>
> quit pushing your HORSESHIT, MADE UP SKY PIXIE on everyone
>
such a thing considering that you are posting to groups that believe such
things.
Sugien
"bob young" <alasp...@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:478972F5...@netvigator.com...
courses do not even come close to my having enough expertise to render a
competent theory and as such I will keep them to myself. I will however
pray both for their enlighten and for my continued ability to not let such
remarks rile me.
Sugien
You are in error because of not knowing the truth. A baby when born has NO
spirit only a mind and soul which is the living body. God endows his
believers with *his* spirit when they are born again.
>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Praise the Lord and give thanks for His grace!
>>>
>>> death to the mass murdering bastard christian god
>>>
>>>
>>
>> I find it laughable that you would purpose such a thing considering that
>> you are in effect purposing the death of something which you say doesn't
>> exist in the first place.
>
> I find it laughable that you're believing in something that came from the
> horseshit ramblings of some superstitious cave dwellers and goat fuckers
> from a few thosand years ago
>
>
You must wear out your "CTRL+C" and then "CTRL+V", or else you must be
quite board re-typing the *exact* same line in answer to or posting about
things.
Sugien
profit above safety. Then because of such, hazardous chemicals polluting
our water and air and thus *man* not God is responsible for it. Likewise
radiation is more then likely also to blame, which of course man let loose
in his inhumanity to man along with his wanting to make more money by
creating power from atomic power plants, further polluting the air and
water. Hmm, I wonder if man irradiating food in an attempt to create more
money by allowing foods to remain on the shelves for a longer period of time
without spoilage? I say *MAN* is responsible and NOT God.
SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim
>
>
> You are in error because of not knowing the truth. A baby when born has
> NO spirit only a mind and soul which is the living body. God endows his
> believers with *his* spirit when they are born again.
that's just more bible babble horsehit, why doesn't this ALL-POWERFUL
jackass sky pixe of yours show his face? is your god a CHICKEN-SHIT COWARD?
>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Praise the Lord and give thanks for His grace!
>>>>
>>>> death to the mass murdering bastard christian god
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> I find it laughable that you would purpose such a thing considering that
>>> you are in effect purposing the death of something which you say doesn't
>>> exist in the first place.
>>
>> I find it laughable that you're believing in something that came from the
>> horseshit ramblings of some superstitious cave dwellers and goat fuckers
>> from a few thosand years ago
>>
>>
>
> You must wear out your "CTRL+C" and then "CTRL+V", or else you must be
> quite board re-typing the *exact* same line in answer to or posting about
> things.
still no answer as to why your god is such an asshole huh?
hey, let's try something new, tell your MAS-MURDERING, CHILD-KILLING
COLD-HEARTED BASTARD sky pixie to get off of his FAT, LAZY ASS FOR ONCE.
SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim
so then your god is a USELESS PILE OF CRAP, and unable to prevent that from
happening, or unable to resverse the trend? why does your god make babies
suffer?
why is there a special "DEAD BABIES ONLY" section of the cemetery? why is
the christian god such an ASSHOLE.
so, let's see, if I have the christian nutcase exscuse right, if the baby is
born and lives a normal life, it's somehow all the sky pxie's god's doing,
however if the baby dies a premature birth, then god had nothing to do with
it, right christian nutcase? so, you're in effect admitting that your god is
a USELESS PILE OF CRAP, thanks for admitting that
SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim
>
> "SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim" <kil...@killgod.com> wrote in message
> news:13oieu9...@corp.supernews.com...
>>>> Your jackass god is ONE USELESS PILE OF SHIT
>>>>
>>> my my, such an outburst. I can see your pain and can only try and
>>> imagine what would have hurt you so badly that you would feel a desire
>>> to make such an outburst of profanity.
>>
>> get your HORSESHIT religion out of everyday life. please let me know when
>> te phrase "INMASS-MURDERING, CHILD-KILLING COLD-HEARTED BASTARD
>> christians trust" has been removed from all money, public buildings, etc.
>>
>> quit pushing your HORSESHIT, MADE UP SKY PIXIE on everyone
>>
> No one is pushing anything on anyone. I find it amusing that you would
> say such a thing considering that you are posting to groups that believe
> such things.
once again, please let me know when the phrase "IN MASS-MURDERING,
CHILD-KILLING COLD-HEARTED BASTARD CHRISTIAN RETARDS TRUST" has been removed
from all money, public buildings, etc
get your HORSESHIT religion back in the dark ages and back in fairy tale
books where it belongs
SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim
>> He may have been raped by a priest as a young boy. It is not unheard of
>> !
>>
> I have an opinion as to why they say such things; but my few psychology
> courses do not even come close to my having enough expertise to render a
> competent theory and as such I will keep them to myself. I will however
> pray both for their enlighten and for my continued ability to not let
> such remarks rile me.
so you're going to pray to an ASSHOLE JACKASS christian god that sat on his
FAT, LAZY ASS AND ALLOWED 9/11/01 TO HAPPEN?
DEATH TO THE SICK, SADISTIC MOTHERFUCKER CALLED THE CHRISTIAN GOD
Bible Bob
wrote:
>Dave certainly likes to use profanity in his Usenet posts. That's really too
>bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
>intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity. Leslie Trombly's
>sermon centers on man's use of profanity and how we may try to better avoid
>falling into that trap. I hope Dave reads this and perhaps he might find it
>uplifting and edifying.
>
>May God bless,
>Carl
>my website -- http://www.nettally.com/saints/
>my blog -- http://www.anniemayhem.com/cgi-bin/wordpress/
Carl,
You have a lot of nerve, hypocrite. It is you that day after day
posts profanity. The filth you post is far worse than any profanity
that PD may use. Besides, your bed buddy says that Jesus used
profanity so its okay to do it. Stop being a feces head out of whose
mouth comes foul odors in the form of wrongly divided Scriptures.
>
>---
>
>God And Profanity
>by Leslie Trombly
>
>How many of you have ever wished you never hear a swear or profane word? How
>many of you are still fighting the battle of using profanity and curse
>words? If I could have one thing given or granted to me by God, I would ask
>that every single curse or profane word I ever heard in my life would become
>unknow to me and that my ears would never hear them again; nor the spew
>forth from my mouth. I grew up in an environment where the favorite
>household word was GD. (I am sure everyone know what that stands for.) Then
>when I was in the Army I heard what I thought was every curse word known to
>man; but I was wrong! That didn't happen until my second marriage. My ex was
>a sailor and if there was a curse word I hadn't heard before, I heard it
>then!
>
>I was still a "Baby Christian" and trying very hard to become what the Lord
>called me to be. Avoiding using profanity or swearing is very, very
>difficult when you have been raised in that environment and then end up in a
>situation albeit marriage or something where you are subjected to the daily
>and consistant use of fowl words and profanity. For me it has been a life
Nothing so completely baffles one who is full of trick and duplicity
himself, than straightforward and simple integrity in another.
Charles Caleb Colton, author and clergyman (1780-1832)
<~A John 3:16 Whosoever~>
> I know of few Christians who would not admit to the occasional
> "slip."
You mean you, don't you? Oh and how about all of those intentional
times you use profanity, JW? You have yet to admit to those.
> Thankfully, if we are born-again children of God, we have an
> advocate.
> Let's not forget that.
Yes, we do. However, you frequently forget that when condemning those
you don't like yet are born-again. Why is that?
> Too many (not you, Carl), are too quick to point fingers and judge,
Carl has pointed and judged in here; he knows it and has admitted to
it. Because you're so busy brown-nosing him at the moment, you're
willing to use your selective memory.
> and they are WAY too quick to FORGET that God is loving; He does not
> stand over us with a club, waiting for us to "screw up."
Yes, this is true, but once again, it's something you forget with
people you don't like or don't like you.
> He stands over us with a hand out-stretched, waiting to pick us up
> when we fall. Because He knows we're going to fall, and He won't leave
> us "flat on our face."
Again this is true - but be honest, you don't believe it's true for
everyone, do you? Would you say this to Elaine or Cathy or JohnH or
even me?
I seriously doubt it. The words you have for those you feel have
wronged you are much more harsh, condemning, and frequently profane
and vulgar.
ujb
He is the *SCRAMBLED ONE*!
SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim
expedient to believe that all this is not a stroke of chance...
Now, if the passions had no hold on us, a week and a hundred years would
amount to the same thing.
695. Prophecies.--Great Pan is dead.
696. Susceperunt verbum cum omni aviditate, scrutantes Scripturas, si ita se
haberent.[138]
697. Prodita lege. Impleta cerne. Implenda collige.[139]
698. We understand the prophecies only when we see the events happen. Thus
the proofs of retreat, discretion, silence, etc., are proofs only to those
who know and believe them.
Joseph so internal in a law so external.
Outward penances dispose to inward, as humiliations to humility. Thus the...
699. The synagogue has preceded the church; the Jews, the Christians. The
prophets have foretold the Christians; Saint John, Jesus Christ.
700. It is glorious to see with the eyes of faith the history of Herod and
of Caesar.
701. The zeal of the Jews for their law and their temple (Josephus, and
Philo the Jew, Ad Caium). What other people had such a zeal? It was
necessary they should have it.
Jesus Christ foretold as to the time and the state of the world. The ruler
taken from the thigh, and the fourth monarchy. How lucky we are to see this
light amidst this darkness!
How fine it is to see, with the eyes of faith, Darius and Cyrus, Alexander,
the Romans, Pompey and Herod working, without knowing it, for the glory of
the Gospel!
702. Zeal of the Jewish people for the law, especially after there were no
more prophets.
703. While the prophets were for maintaining the law, the people were
indifferent. But, since there have been no more prophets, zeal has succeeded
them.
704. The devil troubled the
SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim
"john w @yahoo.com>" <johnw<no> wrote in message
news:iieno3li3qfpl1o5o...@4ax.com...
> x-no-archive: yes
> may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
>>too
>>bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
>>intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity. Leslie Trombly's
>>sermon centers on man's use of profanity and how we may try to better
>>avoid
>>falling into that trap. I hope Dave reads this and perhaps he might find
>>it
>>uplifting and edifying.
>
> "slip."
>
> advocate.
> Let's not forget that.
> stand over us with a club, waiting for us to "screw up."
>
> when we fall. Because He knows we're going to fall, and He won't leave
> us "flat on our face."
>
> to fail. We were designed to fail so that we would be FORCED to look
> to Him for our sustenance.
why in the goddamn hell would you look to a sky pixie that sits on his FAT,
LAZY ASS, LAUGHING HIS MOTHERFUCKING ASS OFF WHILE CHILDREN ARE RAPED AND
MURDERED?
DEATH TO THE SICK, SADISTIC ASSHOLE CALLED THE CHRISTIAN GOD
bob young
Sugien wrote:
Assuming you are studying psychology to gain a degree in the subject
and perhaps become one the coupling of the subject with religious belief seems
rather strange.
I have always assumed that most psychologists are not god followers.
Would appreciate your input.
bob young
"john w
> x-no-archive: yes
> On 12 Jan 2008 20:12:04 -0600, bob young <alasp...@netvigator.com>
> :-)
>
> You're welcome!
>
> :-)
>
> Glad I could help! You did / do seem sort of... functionally
> illiterate!
>
> :-(
>
> >
> >Clearly you had no idea how to answer a logical question, as usual, the meaning of
> >which you full well knew.
>
> ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ????? You assume MUCH.
>
> That I don't choose to get into your silliness doesn't mean I can't.
>
> tsk tsk
>
> If you ever came up with anything ORIGINAL, and if you were ever
> SINCERE,
>
> that would be an entirely different matter.
>
> But when you cut and paste qusetions that have been asked and
> answered 10,000 times, it gets very boring.
>
> >
> >Ah well, the cat is out of the bag again.
> >
> >Religion is for the weak and simple minded
>
> Actually, some of the brightest, most educated people I know and
> have known -- the SCHOLARS-- are Christians.
>
> So, it seems I've caught you in a lie AGAIN!
>
> tsk tsk
Instead of spending an awful lot of time trying to be childishly cute
how about providing some proof of that deity of yours?
It seems to drive you you to pathetic extremes.
Atheists are fully aware, of course, that each time a religionists does this,
he is stumped for logical facts.
Life must be tough for you
bob young
Sugien wrote:
Groan -Puleeese do me a favour. How can man effect the actions of growth in
the womb so that a body has it's heart located on the outside with no mouth or
nose arrives?
Have you never heard of the animals on show in fun fairs ? "Come see the goat
with two heads and the rat with five legs"
> Then because of such, hazardous chemicals polluting
> our water and air and thus *man* not God is responsible for it.
Oh I see. Well history shows that freak were on show in circuses in my gear
great grandpa's days. Anyway, why does you god not prevent these horrors from
happening, after all we are 'in his image right' Is that 'HIS' image?
> Likewise
> radiation is more then likely also to blame,
See above re my grandparents
> which of course man let loose
> in his inhumanity to man along with his wanting to make more money by
> creating power from atomic power plants, further polluting the air and
> water. Hmm, I wonder if man irradiating food in an attempt to create more
> money by allowing foods to remain on the shelves for a longer period of time
> without spoilage? I say *MAN* is responsible and NOT God.
I say neither - I say it is the random process of nature [evolution] going
wrong as it so often does.
"I'm looking over a four leaf clover"
Remember that song? Look anywhere in nature and these hiccups can be found
with ease.
>
>
> --
> From the Desk of Paul CKC
> ........... /}
> @###{ ]::::::Cyber Knight for Christ::::::>
> -------- \}
I trust you are not prolonging the Crusades are you Paul?
They were a perfect example of what humans tend to do whenever their particular
belief is challenged
bob
humanist Brit.
rogue
wrote:
> On Jan 11, 10:34 pm, "Carl" <sai...@nettally.com> wrote:
>
> > Dave certainly likes to use profanity in his Usenet posts. That's really too
> > bad because he might be able to communicate more effectively and
> > intelligently if he would refrain from using profanity.
>
> comes to mind, although his language is more in the area of vulgar and
> coarse - laden with sexual references. But you already knew that.
>
> Your buddy Weatherly is another, even worse offender. As a matter of
> fact, he defends his use of "god" and "damn" together as neither being
> profanity nor taking the Lord's name in vain. He frequently calls
> women "b***h" and other, similar degrading names. He uses vulgar,
> profane language regularily, yet I don't see a post from you
> concerning this.
>
> Why not?
JERRY
Perhaps because he doesn't want to take a possible defender to task?
He has no problems taking others to task if he knows they won't defend
him and stroke his ego anyway.
I think it's called "hypocrite." ;-) (And, yes, for the most part I
have left him alone except for calling his attention to an
inconsistency, but I did it nicely. :-)
<~A John 3:16 Whosoever~>
> JERRY
> Perhaps because he doesn't want to take a possible defender to task?
> He has no problems taking others to task if he knows they won't defend
> him and stroke his ego anyway.
Maybe - like I said to you a month or so ago, I'm watching and have
seen some of the "enemy of my enemy is my friend" thing going on.
> (And, yes, for the most part I
> have left him alone except for calling his attention to an
> inconsistency, but I did it nicely. :-)
Yes you did, Jerry. ;-)
Ghamph
Are you upset now?
No?
Then shove the chair up there too, moron.
While your at it, shove those useless diplomas up too.
Isn't it easy to claim credentials, incognito.
Sugien
"Ghamph" <gha...@localnet.com> wrote in message
news:13ot8k5...@corp.supernews.com...
show you're not able to formulate a coherent argument, so your resort to
profanity and insults.
I can also see by your statements that you likewise can not read for
comprehension; because I said nothing about my having *any* credentials, in
fact just the opposite; because I said that my "*few* psychology courses do
theory "
need to do so on a mental level other then that of a school yard child
stomping the virtual playground and *trying* to taunt the other
contributors to the discussion. Otherwise your statement and or comments
will be given all the attention that they warrant, *none*.
walksalone
to waste 330 lines in his ongoing attempt to glorify himself. What
anybody else thinks about that does not matter. Or so he believes. Of
course, he is the one that claims that you did not honor your God when
you do not honor that gods creations. Or his own words:
You don't honor the God you pretend you serve when you dishonor those
He created!
john w
From: john w <johnw<no>@yahoo.com>
Newsgroups:
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tecostal,free.christians
Subject: 've Re: God And Profanity
Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2008 11:45:48 -0800
Message-ID: <apeno3pjcnsbhga69...@4ax.com>
References: <fm9n13$2hl$1...@news.utelfla.com> <4788861E.1DD609E1
@netvigator.com> <vleio3h9obrsmo6bq...@4ax.com>
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> x-no-archive: yes
> On 12 Jan 2008 20:12:04 -0600, bob young <alasp...@netvigator.com>
> wrote:
>>"john w
>>
>>> x-no-archive: yes
>>> On 12 Jan 2008 03:22:02 -0600, bob young
>>> <alasp...@netvigator.com> wrote:
>>> >Carl wrote:
snip
>>> So your sentence above actually says:
>>>
>>> "... Does your god never show it is eternal gratitude to..."
>>
>>Wow thanks for the English lesson.
>
> :-)
>
> You're welcome!
>
> :-)
>
> Glad I could help! You did / do seem sort of... functionally
> illiterate!
>
> :-(
>
>>
>>Clearly you had no idea how to answer a logical question, as usual,
>>the meaning of which you full well knew.
>
> ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ????? You assume MUCH.
And when he assumed you had a capacity for thought and coherent
conversation, he was wrong. It happens. There is no literacy test
required for using usenet, nor even though on occasion it should happen,
adult supervision. You being a case in point on the latter.
As a sidenote, if my memory is not failing me, the gentleman you are
attempting to insult is not only older than you are, but he is British
and has lived in Hong Kong for quite some years. I don't believe I'm
ever seen him state how many. You assume everybody speaks the same
variety of ignorant English which you do, they don't.
> That I don't choose to get into your silliness doesn't mean I can't.
It means you can't. You never pass a chance to glorify yourself if you
think you can win whatever it is you think is worth winning. I haven't a
clue what that is. My presumption is narcissistic supply points.
> tsk tsk
Putting on airs and affections again. Of course, you really may be
senile.
> If you ever came up with anything ORIGINAL, and if you were ever
> SINCERE,
You don't set the standard for usenet, you have yet to be original, and
sincerity, that's a joke where you are concerned. You cannot even
properly interpret the Greek Testament, and you're going to demand others
do it for you.
> that would be an entirely different matter.
No it wouldn't, you'd run like a rabbit then as well. It's one of your
trade marks. You can exceed the speed of dark in getting away from any
conversation that you know you cannot deal with, because you know the
other person cannot be snowed or bullshitted.
> But when you cut and paste qusetions that have been asked and
> answered 10,000 times, it gets very boring.
Not as boring as your canned and erroneous answers.
>>Ah well, the cat is out of the bag again.
>>Religion is for the weak and simple minded
> Actually, some of the brightest, most educated people I know and
> have known -- the SCHOLARS-- are Christians.
Which does not mean that they are neither weak nor simpleminded. Of
course giving you lore definition of a scholar, a definition that would
include you, there's no reason to believe you. There's no reason to
believe you actually know any scholars. There's no reason to believe
that you know any famous people or come from a very talented family. The
indications from your postings indicate the direct opposite.
> So, it seems I've caught you in a lie AGAIN!
And you should be able to prove that lie. You should to prove that he it
may the other individual is in fact not true. Given that you claim to be
xian, the evidence is against you.
> tsk tsk
Senility, your greatest achievement.
Snip
which wannabe this time johnny, the buffoon that attempts to dazzle
everybody with his lack of brilliance, and thinks it works. Just because
you are easily misled does not mean everybody is.
walksalone who used to wonder about johnny, but has came to the
conclusion that he really is a simpleminded as he acts, and he is
perfectly comfortable there. Wouldn't it be great if he would simply
stay there and away from Usenet. xianity would have a better reputation
on the net, and the signal to noise ratio would improve drastically.
I'm afraid so, another chapter from St. John's liar theater™.
Date: Tue, 01 Jan 2008 14:27:29 -0800
Message-ID: <3ffln3t050l6gug4d...@4ax.com>
There is an explanation for the above, if ANYBODY BOTHERED to ask,
and didn't PREFER to simply make up ugly stories.
I killfile. At least, that is my intention. However, I have not
learned to do it with the PROGRAM, so I am stuck making lists.
I either forget to put people on the list, or I forget to look at the
list.
Carl
> "Ghamph" <gha...@localnet.com> wrote in message
>
> news:13ot8k5...@corp.supernews.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> >news:478a7f6c$0$7128$4c36...@roadrunner.com...
>
> >> "bob young" <alaspect...@netvigator.com> wrote in message
> >>news:478972F5...@netvigator.com...
>
> >> > Sugien wrote:
>
> >> >> "SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim" <kill...@killgod.com> wrote in message
Gamph is just another Usenet troll. I suggest ignoring the creature.
sai...@nettally.com
Patton wasn't claiming to be a "Pastor."
walksalone
mind, decided to abuse himself and the usenet audience by wasting 209
lines of text, just to pretend he can understand his mythology.
From: john w <johnw<no>@yahoo.com>
Newsgroups:
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Subject: Re: God And Profanity
Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2008 11:41:49 -0800
Message-ID: <iieno3li3qfpl1o5o...@4ax.com>
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> x-no-archive: yes
> On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 01:34:10 -0500, "Carl" <sai...@nettally.com>
> wrote:
>>Dave certainly likes to use profanity in his Usenet posts. That's
>>really too bad because he might be able to communicate more
>>effectively and intelligently if he would refrain from using
>>profanity. Leslie Trombly's sermon centers on man's use of profanity
>>and how we may try to better avoid falling into that trap. I hope Dave
>>reads this and perhaps he might find it uplifting and edifying.
>
> I know of few Christians who would not admit to the occasional
> "slip."
In your case, only when caught out.
> Thankfully, if we are born-again children of God, we have an
> advocate.
You have a Greek substitute for personal responsibility and conduct
becoming a human being.
> Let's not forget that.
> Too many (not you, Carl), are too quick to point fingers and judge,
> and they are WAY too quick to FORGET that God is loving; He does not
> stand over us with a club, waiting for us to "screw up."
He watches everything you do, don't you remember. He knows every hair on
your head and every sparrow that falls. It's also, his way or the
highway after they break your knee caps. Commonly referred to as the
carrot and stick approach to mob control.
> He stands over us with a hand out-stretched, waiting to pick us up
> when we fall. Because He knows we're going to fall, and He won't leave
> us "flat on our face."
If he does, how come you're the only one that gets to see them. After
all, xianity has four major gods, and countless minor ones.
> I wonder how many of us think about the FACT that we were designed
> to fail. We were designed to fail so that we would be FORCED to look
> to Him for our sustenance.
I wonder how many xians consider the fact, a perfect being would not know
how to create an imperfect object. Of course, people like you cannot
comprehend a question of that nature. Or the consequences of such a
question.
> If we were perfect, we'd have no need of Him!
If you were perfect, you would not exist as a human being. I know not
what life form would have, but it would not be human. Of course, your
conduct sometimes makes one think, you're not human anyway.
Snip prior
which wannabe this time jonny, but not so great pretender who assumes
everybody will believe his bullshit, just because he does.
walksalone who has to wonder what the criteria is for Johnny's postings.
It can't be accuracy, he can be knowledge about mythology, it certainly
is not have knowledge about much of anything. Possibly it's simply a
back door for him to gather his required narcissistic points.
Carl
"sinners" came and ate with him and his disciples. When the Pharisees saw
this, they asked his disciples, "Why does your teacher eat with tax
collectors and 'sinners'?" On hearing this, Jesus said, "It is not the
healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. But go and learn what this means:
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' For I have not come to call the righteous,
but sinners."" (Matt 9:10-13)
NIV
Jesus answered, "Do you think that these Galileans were worse sinners than
all the other Galileans because they suffered this way? I tell you, no! But
unless you repent, you too will all perish. Or those eighteen who died when
the tower in Siloam fell on them - do you think they were more guilty than
all the others living in Jerusalem? I tell you, no! But unless you repent,
you too will all perish." (Luke 13:2-5)
NOSPAM
wrote:
>
> That I don't choose to get into your silliness doesn't mean I can't.
We ALL know how silly you really are, liar-johnnie... as silly as they
come. You hold the highest rank for stupidity.
Carl
you keep the following in mind:
But rejoice that you participate in the sufferings of Christ, so that you
may be overjoyed when his glory is revealed. If you are insulted because of
the name of Christ, you are blessed, for the Spirit of glory and of God
rests on you. If you suffer, it should not be as a murderer or thief or any
other kind of criminal, or even as a meddler. However, if you suffer as a
Christian, do not be ashamed, but praise God that you bear that name. For it
is time for judgment to begin with the family of God; and if it begins with
us, what will the outcome be for those who do not obey the gospel of God?
And,
"If it is hard for the righteous to be saved,
what will become of the ungodly and the sinner?"
So then, those who suffer according to God's will should commit themselves
to their faithful Creator and continue to do good." (1 Peter 4:13-19)
Bible Bob
wrote:
Carl,
What does "I desire mercy, not sacrifice" mean? How do you
practically apply the principle in your life towards others whom you
consider to be sinners?
With regard to the second set of passages, "to whom" was Jesus
speaking and "to whom" do His words apply? Was Jesus speaking to
people in Texas; or, was Jesus speaking to Jews obligated to do the
Law in Jerusalem?
Bob
Bob
Bible Bob
wrote:
Carl,
Those verses when read in context speak about what I have been trying
to tell you. Two verses up we read.
1Pe 4:11 KJV
If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God; if any man
minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth: that God
in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ, to whom be praise
and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
You began you quote with the conjunction "But". You reader needs to
know what the words following the adversative conjunction refer to in
order to understand the context. Hence, you need to supply verese 12
which speaks of the fiery trial.
The translation you used clouds a point. "But rejoice that you
participate in the sufferings of Christ" is not the correct sense. The
King James Version contains a more accurate rendering that speaks of
the present concerning what happened in the past. When Christ was
crucified we were curcified with Him and at that time shared in his
sufferings. Like as we shared in his sufferings we will share in his
glory when it is revealed. That is our hope. Our hope is not just
the return of Christ, but also all that happens after the return for
His church. As joint heirs with Christ we share in His inheritance.
We suffered with Christ, but we will also be glad with exceeding joy.
1Pe 4:13 KJV
But rejoice, inasmuch as ye are partakers of Christ's sufferings;
that, when his glory shall be revealed, ye may be glad also with
exceeding joy.
After speaking about the past and the future the passage speaks about
the present which is the point you were making. Notice the "if's".
It's not speaking about those who pretend to be Christians or who
think they are Christians. It is talking about the genuine; the real
thing. So, if one who thinks he is a Christian or pretends to be a
Christian provokes an unbeliever - then he does not meet the "if"
condition and the statements do not apply.
bob young
NOSPAM wrote:
If this is religion then I am glad I am out of it
Chief Thracian
wrote:
>--
>From the Desk of Paul CKC
>........... /}
>@###{ ]::::::Cyber Knight for Christ::::::>
>-------- \}
You know of course, Jesus is homosexual.
In fact, that's the MAIN reason he was crucified. Just as it is today.
--
Zeke Krahlin
http://www.gay-bible.org
Chief Thracian
wrote:
>Does that include the one in 400,000 fetus that arrive from the womb grossly
>deformed, so gross the parents are not allowed to see it?
We are each expected to bear our share of mysery, as well as of joy.
That is how we become mature in spirit.
There are many "good" reasons to NOT believe in a Creator. You,
unfortunately, reveal only the "bad" ones.
Chief Thracian
<kil...@killgod.com> wrote:
>so then your god is a USELESS PILE OF CRAP, and unable to prevent that from
>happening, or unable to resverse the trend? why does your god make babies
>suffer?
>why is there a special "DEAD BABIES ONLY" section of the cemetery? why is
>the christian god such an ASSHOLE.
I offer an alternative belief, which neither Christians nor atheists
(of course) have considered. For want of a better term, I called this
philosophy "NeoPositivity"...which ENTIRE 3-part essay you can read
at:
http://www.gay-bible.org/write/4_neopositivity.htm
Allow me to post MOST of Part 2 here.
--begin excerpt:
MY MESSAGE TO A WICCAN NEWSGROUP
RE. "NEOCHRISTIANITY"
On Oct. 4, 2000, Jaguar wrote:
> Would that your fantasy be true.
> Life experience tells us otherwise.
> A wyrd can not be avoided.
> None can live your life for you.
First of all, you are mixing apples and oranges. I was
originally only discussing the human spirit, not
animals...whose karma is quite different from ours.
You cannot use a bird's death as an example to prove anything
about the human condition. But since you chose a bird as your
case, I described the process. Apparantly, I need to give
further explanation:
The moment the cat started to chase the hapless bird, its soul
migrated into the body of another bird...one that already
exists elsewhere, or was instantaneously created out of your
range of site. For the remainder of the chase, an angel spirit
occupied the bird's dying body, until it was finally killed.
The difference between animal-soul migration, and that of
humans, is that an animal's soul can migrate to an existing
body, whereby two or more souls can happily coexist in the
same body indefinitely. In the case of humans, such sharing of
bodies as a result of migration, does not occur. Instead, the
person who is about to die, has his soul suddenly shunted into
the other dimension, where he can witness his own death
process as acted out by an angel now occupying his or her old
body.
If such a person is destined to be a survivor of a gruesome
experience--such as from a Nazi concentration camp--his soul
is finally returned to his original body, after the worst
agonies are over, and have been completely healed. Then, in
collaboration with the angels, he speaks to the world of his
abyssmal suffering at the hands of these evil people. He or
she has become, in essence, a Bodhisattva: one who has earned
the right to enter heaven, but instead decides to return to
earth in order to liberate more people. This is an act of
compassion, a sacrifice that only glorifies himself and God,
and the human spirit.
He has an unbreakable pact with the angels, to never discuss
the real truth: of his visit to Heaven, and return to act out
an incredible plot for the sake of humanity.
> Your explainations are CHRISTIAN ones.
> Not Wiccan, not Neo-Pagan.
False. Many Christians would see my viewpoints as
sacrilegeous.
> There are no Angel-Actors to step in to substitue for
> the unpleasant bits. There is no learning if there are
> no errors.
What is most interesting is your point of view: you cling to a
belief system that demands extraordinary suffering as a
necessary part of life, and of spiritual awakening. Now that I
have offered a much more God-loving alternative philosophy,
one wonders why you would choose to continue in your
nihilistic world view. This says a lot more about the person,
than it does the final truth.
And the final truth is this: that our Creator is far more
loving than you can imagine; than most people can imagine. He
would *never subject any of His wondrous children to such
unspeakable suffering. Instead, He contrived this grand,
incredible plot to *teach us lessons of compassion, by
witnessing the supposed suffering of others...rather than
letting *anyone go through such horrid trials.
This philosophy of such a loving God is *not part of Christian
theology, after all. It is far more in line with neo-paganism,
which has a much better grasp on the gentleness of mother
earth and her creatures.
> Life feeds on life.
Not in the way you mean it. Not at all.
> You, due to your bias, are terrified of the
> patterns of nature.
Nonsense, I hold them in great reverence. I am quite capable
of letting go of such beliefs that define nature as harsh,
suffering, and uncaring.
> Little wonder you take refuge in Christian
> myth & symbols, where nature is considered
> cursed.
Untrue, again. I see all of nature, and me along with this, as
incredibly blessed. I use many pagan and wiccan symbols in my
personal theology, which I coin "NeoChristianity".
> However, your symbols are NOT pagan ones,
> no matter how hard you try to pass them
> off as such.
A cross is not ultimately pagan? The four directions? The tree
of life? Oh, come on now. The true seed of Christianity--all
but forgotten by most Christians, but not by true pagans--is
that we are all crucified, by virtue of just being conscious.
> Joy & sadness, pleasure & pain... life covers them all.
I didn't say we don't experience suffering. What I am saying,
is that God (or Goddess, as you see fit) never lets us suffer
more than we can bear.
Many blessings to you, and all others who jump to conclusions
about my perspectives. But I do know exactly what I'm about,
and my purposes in this life...one of them being to speak out
to wiccan groups...which groups hold the truth of Christ far
better than most Christians.
--end of excerpt
Chief Thracian
wrote:
>Oh I see. Well history shows that freak were on show in circuses in my gear
>great grandpa's days. Anyway, why does you god not prevent these horrors from
>happening, after all we are 'in his image right' Is that 'HIS' image?
You ask such easy questions, Bob! I'm surprised these so-called
Christians have any difficulty answering them.
God ALLOWS certain horrors/atrocities to exist, that we may learn
compassion, toleration, and long suffering. But those SAME mutilated
humans are NOT truly humans...they are ANGELS playing these roles,
that God may teach us those valuable lessons withOUT any human
actually suffering such a horrid fate.
Likewise to answer you "why do babies suffer in war" question...the
classic question posed by ALL good atheists. It is EASY to answer:
Children's souls/consciousness are taken from their bodies PRIOR to
the commencement of such egregious suffering. In their place are
ANGELS acting out the remainder of their life...or until a time when
the cause of their misery ceases.
That is the ONLY reasoning that makes sense, if one truly does believe
in a loving God.
But even Christians miss this point, perhaps because many of their ilk
are ADDICTED to misery.
Chief Thracian
wrote:
>It spoke to Moses right? why not today?
God DOES speak to those who learn how to listen. And others, who are
blessed. It has always been so. But Christianity and other mainstream
beliefs have lost the way, with rare exception. That is why I prefer
to study shamanistic and pagan beliefs.
>> Praise the Lord and give thanks for His grace!
>
>Tell that to a mother that has just given birth to a blind baby
If the mother has a solid relationship with God, she will find a way
through this, and resume a joyful, though wiser, life. And minister
who'd say such a thing to her in her deepest grief, is a fool, and NOT
God's way.
Chief Thracian
<walks...@Spamstopper.com> wrote:
>I wonder how many xians consider the fact, a perfect being would not know
>how to create an imperfect object.
Quite true. And accurate. NO thing ever created is imperfect. It is
only HUMANS who perceive a false notion, in this case "imperfection".
YOU might see a blind or crippled baby as imperfect, but God does not,
nor do any of his MANY angels, saints and other deities.
What you refer to as Christianity--and rightfully denounce--is a
GROSSLY distorted religion, as it came MUTILATED from the hands of
Rome. The early Christians were a different matter altogether...that
is, before the Roman Empire decided to use Christianity for its own
purposes of control and manipulation of large numbers of the populace,
in their VAST empire.
You might consider the guts of a human as GROSS, even imperfect. But a
surgeon does not...he sees human insides as a glorious miracle of
nature. Likewise does God see those things that humans, in their
naiveness, perceive is "imperfect".
walks...@dastardly.dirty.deeds.done.dirt.cheap.llc
>On Sun, 20 Jan 2008 20:56:30 +0000 (UTC), walksalone
><walks...@Spamstopper.com> wrote:
>>I wonder how many xians consider the fact, a perfect being would not know
>>how to create an imperfect object.
>Quite true. And accurate. NO thing ever created is imperfect. It is only
>HUMANS who perceive a false notion, in this case "imperfection". YOU
>might see a blind or crippled baby as imperfect, but God does not, nor do
>any of his MANY angels, saints and other deities.
Unfortunately, it appears you are trying to use, probably without your
awareness, several logical fallacies to start with. Apparently you are
using a definition of perfect that I am unaware of, commonly referred to
as special pleading or special definitions. The word perfect has many
definitions, all of verifiable nature. Now you're going to tell me that
there's a god running around out there, they can use imperfections as a
perfection. In other words, in the case of humanity, piss poor design is
perfection. In the Ordinance Corps, we had what we called the six P.
program. Prior planning prevents pis poor performance. The human body
and the remainder of the universe shows no indication of that program ever
being used.
>What you refer to as Christianity--and rightfully denounce--is a GROSSLY
>distorted religion, as it came MUTILATED from the hands of Rome. The
>early Christians were a different matter altogether...that is, before the
Actually, no they were not all that different. They, like today's
xianity, were easily led by the nose and believed what their fearless
leaders told them. Like today's Islamic's & the original followers of
Allah, they considered themselves a elect society devoted to the true god.
If you are not a member of the in club, you might as well not exist.
>Roman Empire decided to use Christianity for its own purposes of control
When you have a large body of gullible people, you can count on
politicians to try to use them.
>and manipulation of large numbers of the populace, in their VAST empire.
>You might consider the guts of a human as GROSS, even imperfect. But a
I consider them less than an ideal design, much better suited to somebody
or something that walks around on four legs rather than two legs like
humans do. Like the human eye, there are better ways to have done it in
the beginning. But evolution explains the problems quite well.
>surgeon does not...he sees human insides as a glorious miracle of nature.
I've never had one described them that way.
>Likewise does God see those things that humans, in their naiveness,
>perceive is "imperfect".
Then that particular god is not one worthy of adoration or worship. From
the cancers that leaves small children, adults, as well as the elderly
screaming for mercy, to the quiet debilitating diseases such as diabetes,
to the extreme diseases such as Ebola, the human body should have been
designed against those things. And it is, up to a point. Once the immune
system starts to break down, all bets are off. So if you are saying that
my aching back is not the results of my having made money for my family a
breaking horses at five dollars a head, I'm going to say, sure, now go
ahead and pull the other one. The human body can't accept only so much
abuse before it starts to hurt you back, and I exceed my limits. Now, it
has turn to tell me all about it, and compared to many around me, I have
no aches or pains. On the personal level, the only time I pay attention
to a pain is when it is missing. Between rheumatism and a spavined back,
fading eyesight, knees, hips & ankles that are shot, I know what
perfection is not.
walksalone who does not blame any god for his physical condition, it would
be nice to be able to blame someone else, but it would be a lie.
Most people are bothered by those passages of Scripture they do not
understand, but the passages that bother me are those I do understand.
-- Mark Twain, quoted from Barbara Schmidt, ed., "Mark Twain Quotations,
Newspaper Collections, & Related Resources"
Chief Thracian
walks...@dastardly.dirty.deeds.done.dirt.cheap.llc wrote:
>Unfortunately, it appears you are trying to use, probably without your
>awareness, several logical fallacies to start with.
If you could state these fallacies in particular (say, in a brief
list), I'd most appreciate it.
>Apparently you are
>using a definition of perfect that I am unaware of, commonly referred to
>as special pleading or special definitions.
You ought to be aware of such a definition. Certain spiritual
philosophies include the belief that all is perfect as it now stands.
Whatever goes on is MEANT to happen, though we may not understand WHY.
Perhaps we will with hindsight...and depending on the incident,
hindsight could mean anywhere from a few moments to EONS. While I may
not agree with this or that religion which incorporates the belief
that ALL is perfect right now, I DO abide by that one viewpoint.
And haven't you heard the saying, "Nobody's perfect?"
THAT is the definition of "perfection" as an admirable--albeit
impossible--goal. YOUR definition of perfect is a more casual use, as
in "What a perfect day" or "I got a perfect score on my test". But you
CLAIM to NOT be familiar with those two OTHER definitions I just
described.
>Now you're going to tell me that
>there's a god running around out there, they can use imperfections as a
>perfection. In other words, in the case of humanity, piss poor design is
>perfection.
You act as judge and jury to what you deem is and is not "perfect".
What you call "piss poor design" may indeed serve a higher purpose. A
purpose which we may not comprehend at the time...but will, with
hindsight. Maybe the hindsight of a few days, maybe of centuries.
>In the Ordinance Corps, we had what we called the six P.
>program. Prior planning prevents pis poor performance. The human body
>and the remainder of the universe shows no indication of that program ever
>being used.
It does to me! DNA seems like a pretty intelligent program, for
example. The whole map, the entire memory of all life from its very
beginning contained in a single strand!
>Actually, no they were not all that different. They, like today's
>xianity, were easily led by the nose and believed what their fearless
>leaders told them. Like today's Islamic's & the original followers of
>Allah, they considered themselves a elect society devoted to the true god.
>If you are not a member of the in club, you might as well not exist.
They were also desperate times, which made people desperate for hope,
and highly gullible. Xianity is nothing more than the theft and
distortion of earlier belief systems. There WERE, however, early Xians
who DID preach humility and service to their fellow men. I'm not
speaking of the general populace, as you are, but of the occasional
exceptions to the rule of "human nature" (meaning greed and
gullibility).
But it's not important to me to argue the pros and cons of various
forms of Xianity. You can denounce it all you want, doesn't bother me
in the least. Humanity never needed another religion, and it would be
NO loss should Xianity disappear from our planet.
I am a student of world religions and world views, among other
subjects. I take an anthropological stance, along with philosophical.
>I consider them less than an ideal design, much better suited to somebody
>or something that walks around on four legs rather than two legs like
>humans do. Like the human eye, there are better ways to have done it in
>the beginning. But evolution explains the problems quite well.
Humanity has the great destiny to ultimately reshape itself, both
physcially and mentally. The keys to existence will eventually be
handed to us, as nature's greatest gift. If the creator left nothing
for us to criticize, or be unhappy about, there'd be no room for us to
PARTICIPATE in creation.
I see NOTHING wrong with your outrage, your criticism. In fact, I'm
sure God is proud of you for your honest appraisal...MUCH prouder than
he'd be over some simpering, religion-repressed dufus!
>>surgeon does not...he sees human insides as a glorious miracle of nature.
>
>I've never had one described them that way.
Perhaps you need to include more friends in your life that are
intelligent! I know I do, but it sure is HARD trying to shove away all
the idiots that stand between us.
>Then that particular god is not one worthy of adoration or worship.
Understanding how you PERCEIVE reality, I can easily grasp your take
on this matter. No, of course not. Under your set of values, such a
God is NOT worthy.
But obviously I have a DIFFERENT understanding of the purpose behind
these ugly/unfair situations you clearly describe. To me, God is like
a drill sergeant, who know you joined the Marines because you wanna be
THE BEST. What does being "best" imply? It means you'll be run through
ROUGHER boot camp than your average soldier, and expected to bear MORE
difficulities with LESS--scratch that, NO--whining whatsoever.
So the sergeant UNDERSTANDS perfectly, if sometimes you wanna choke
him to death, and stomp all over him. In fact, he'd prefer you DIRECT
all your anger and frustrations at him, the REAL cause of your pain,
than to strike out at innocent passersby.
But because the sergeant knows the ultimate REWARDS and PERFECTION of
your spirit that shall result for your long-suffering under incredible
hardship and against many odds...he will NEVER hesistate from, or
soften, the TOUGH training that he hopes you'll see through till the
final test.
>From
>the cancers that leaves small children, adults, as well as the elderly
>screaming for mercy, to the quiet debilitating diseases such as diabetes,
>to the extreme diseases such as Ebola, the human body should have been
>designed against those things.
I already explained (in Part 2 of NeoPositivity) how these EXTREMES of
suffering are an illusion. You can throw all the examples you want at
me, but the same rule applies to them all.
>So if you are saying that
>my aching back is not the results of my having made money for my family a
>breaking horses at five dollars a head, I'm going to say, sure, now go
>ahead and pull the other one. The human body can't accept only so much
>abuse before it starts to hurt you back, and I exceed my limits.
I didn't say God doesn't push the envelope with each of us, regarding
how much suffering is metered out. To each individual, we may go
through trials of fire where it SEEMS like we just can't take it any
more, we're gonna BREAK.
Each person differs in how much suffering one can bear, and in which
KIND of suffering.
>Now, it
>has turn to tell me all about it, and compared to many around me, I have
>no aches or pains. On the personal level, the only time I pay attention
>to a pain is when it is missing. Between rheumatism and a spavined back,
>fading eyesight, knees, hips & ankles that are shot, I know what
>perfection is not.
Your drill sergeant has BIG plans for you, indeed! There is a kernel
of truth in that saying, "God must love you very much." For he ONLY
brings extraordinary suffering to those from whom he expects
GREATNESS. You do not know my brand of suffering; suffice it to say
I've conquered borderline schizophrenia and manic-depression with NO
drugs whatsoever. (Well, marijuana has been a great healing aid, when
I could afford it, which is not very often.) I've had TERRIBLE bouts
with insanity, with NO ONE to guide or support me...in fact, it would
draw enemies to me, who'd HECKLE and HARASS me, in hopes it woud put
me over the edge, permanently!
What is the reward for such long-suffering? For one, it has given me a
great spirit, the gift of writing and speaking, incredible insight, a
WONDERFUL lover, about whom you can read in this book I recently wrote
about him:
The Larkin Chronicles
http://www.gay-bible.org/truetales/Larkin/LC_chapters.htm
In fact, that book, plus its accompanying novel (that sprang from that
book), "Friendly Ghost Detective Agency", discuss many spiritual
concepts, and describe how they've changed my life, and turned my
world into a Great Adventure. Much humor is in both works, BTW. Just
go here:
Steal This Blog
http://www.gay-bible.org/steal
to access either novel. They're both FREE as online works, no strings
attached. The electronic versions will ALWAYS be free.
Now, back to YOU: I am sorry for your difficult ailments, and can only
imagine how much that painful burden weighs down on your shoulders,
and makes so much of living into a grievous ordeal. I have requested
my angels if it is at all possible, to bless you with REAL relief that
is PERMANENT. You strike as a most intelligent, compassionate human
being, who could achieve so much GOOD in this world, once your painful
burdens are gone, or at least, considerably diminished.
One piece of wisdom that life has taught me:
The secrets of the universe are not handed to you on a silver platter.
They are sparsely given to you, each a priceless gift, as through your
forbearance and goodwill earns each one. (Or doesn't, if you are
particularly ornery and mean-spirited!) What wisdom I share with you,
you do not grasp at this time, because you are not SUPPOSED to.
By the same token, because we've been brought together, so I CAN
impart my philosophy, indicates you are soon READY for a greater
understanding, thanks to your heroic struggles over many years.
Likewise OTHERS fortunate enough to discover my missives herein.
I do not condemn your viewpoint, I don't even CRITICIZE it. For I KNOW
we each are at different stages of personal evolution. It would be
ARROGANT and mean of me, to lecture you, as if I were "better than
thou." I wish for you some sort of delightful SURPRISE that will not
only bring relief to your medical problems, but also provide to access
to achieve the SUCCESS you so well deserve.
>walksalone who does not blame any god for his physical condition, it would
>be nice to be able to blame someone else, but it would be a lie.
Blame the sergeant. That's what he's there for. And he'll understand.
(But probably force you to do 30 pushups for whining!)
>Most people are bothered by those passages of Scripture they do not
>understand, but the passages that bother me are those I do understand.
>-- Mark Twain, quoted from Barbara Schmidt, ed., "Mark Twain Quotations,
>Newspaper Collections, & Related Resources"
I ADORE Mark Twain. In fact, I've read MANY of his books as a
teenager. I just wrote a poem whose title is a paraphrase of one of
Twain's famous sayings:
Rumors Of My Death Are Queerly Exaggerated
http://www.gay-bible.org/truetales/Larkin/FG_06-N.htm
I want to thank you for providing me with this golden opportunity to
share my thoughts, and give you what ideas I can, in hopes they'll
relieve your suffering in some significant way. Let me close with a
passage from my book "Friendly Ghost Detective Agency," which is
actually how it ends. (The bracked lines are in place of images. If
you want to view this passage w/images, go here:
http://www.gay-bible.org/truetales/Larkin/FG_07.htm
That chapter ("Contusion", a pun on "conclusion") is a work in
progress, along with three others (out of eight). I give my readers
the pleasure of viewing my novel's progress.
--begin passage:
I feel like Anne Frank hidden away in a stuffy attic amid a City Of
Demons:
[The Flame Of Hope.]
Yet the Light of Hope burns brightly in her innocent bosom, and she
continues to take pen to her beloved blog...each and every day. And
each and every day she summons up another Positive Thought Of Most
Profound Implication. Only my attic is this: more than 22 years'
social isolation cultivated by my so-called enemies, this "Order of
The Disciples Of The Zodiac Killer".
But I take the Buddhist spin: "We have no enemies only teachers." Thus
all my enemies--even The Most Profoundly Wicked--are playing their
role as protagonists, that I may struggle mightily towards success,
and become a World Renowned Hero Of Herculean Proportion in so doing.
IOW: My Enemies are also Beloved Angels, who I'm sure grieve terribly
over Evil Wrought Upon Me by their own divine hands! But they are only
doing what needs be done for my soul to fulfill a Most Remarkable
Destiny. They nail me to the cross, and in so doing, nail each other!
(Hmmm, sounds like a sex orgy to me.) :b
So my angels are sicko's, what's a girl to do? I like to joke about My
Dear Street Buddy Jonny, who is so much like a Protector Soul to me
(or at least he was until The Big Betrayal Of January Oh-Six):
"No wonder my life is such a mess. My guardian angel's a junkie!"
If this is true, if ANY of this is true, then I'd say my life has
become one of The Greatest Stories Ever Told. But I'll let you in on a
secret:
I am AFRAID to complete this story...afraid in spite of its beauty,
its brilliance...this Holy Grail Of My Soul. Afraid because Goddess
may deem a Most Dramatic Finale To My Unbelievably Awesome Odyssey.
[Hey, ghoulfriend!]
For, like Anne Frank's sad fate, She Who Weaves Our Lives Together And
Unravels Them Too, may decide that My Sacred Message Which Will
Ultimately Free All Homosexuals Everywhere From The Chains Of Terror,
will have much more impact if I am swept from this planet by a
shockingly tragic and mortal demise. (Can you say "Harvey Milk"?)
But that's not having FAITH, is it? Shame, shame, shame on me...slap
my wrist and take a pee (I trod The Path Of Joy, you see)! Now it is
up to each of you, how you should regard my story and consequently,
me, ZEKE KRAHLIN. You may not like what phantom stirs in your heart.
And if that be the case, well: the answers to changing your life for
the better are all contained within this single, ghastly tale (with
hyperlinks to additional wisdom.) But if you conclude I am nothing
more than a crazy fag...then may Goddess have mercy on your punky,
stinky, rotten little excuse of a soul! And BTW:
Don't slam the door on your way out.
That was supposed to be the ending to my Friendly Ghost Tale, but then
whilst taking a shower down the hallway, My Angel Randolph appeared
(as he always enjoys a naked boy), and instructed me to write down a
vision he will now reveal:
I ascend to Mt. Olympus where Mighty Zeus is seated on His throne. To
the left is another slightly smaller throne, though no less
exquisitely carved. It is empty. To my right, another throne identical
to the left one. It is occupied. By an angel. Saint Michael I presume?
(He nods his head at me.) Zeus offers me the empty throne.
"But that's Jesus's place. I couldn't sit there!"
"Ezekiel, don't be silly. You're Our Most Favored Guest. My Son, were
He here right now, would consider it a great honor. Please, be seated
and ask the question for which I summoned you in the first place."
"Question? I don't remember asking you any question." I ponder.
"Yes. It was two days ago, you had a question that intrigued me very
much," He insists. "Give yourself a moment."
I lean back, caressing my chin in studious contemplation, then:
"Eureka! I DO remember."
[Whadda ya know: a green cliche!]
Here is my question: "I don't necessarily believe this guy Jesus
really exists, but if he did..."
Zeus interrupts: "Doesn't exist? INTERESTING. Do go on."
"Well, I'VE never met Him, not even in my dreams and visions. Never."
I look around. "He's not here now is He?"
"Ummm, yes and no. Please continue."
"I don't even think YOU really exist. You could simply be a figment of
my imagination, a manifestation of another dream vision...an
undigested bit of tofu, a blot of Veganaise, a crumb of rice cake, a
fragment of underdone tomacco."
"Oh that's royal!" Zeus thunders in laughter. "You're a hoot Ezekiel,
a real hoot!" He dries His Copious Tears, then settles down again.
"Interesting premise. Continue."
"Anywayz. If Jesus does exist, along with His Holy Father...Who is
Yourself, I presume."
Zeus glows warmly, and we are bathed in a shower of golden light. (A
circle of angels high above are pissing from some Damn Righteous
Nicely Cut Wangers, grasping each other's in a Divine Daisy Chain.) I
tear myself away from this unexpected distraction, to state my
premise:
"If He exists, I conclude that Christ doesn't really care whether you
believe in Him or not. What DOES matter is that you live by the Golden
Rule. Believing in Jesus or not, has no bearing on how God judges you.
Correct?"
"Uh, yes, ab-so-loot-a-men-tay, Ezekiel! Neither My Beloved Son NOR
Myself, who IS Your Creator whether you believe in Him or not," He
stifles a guffaw, "do not care a harpie's turd if you believe in
either of Us. The Golden Rule IS as you correctly surmise, THE Measure
Of All Things To Be Judged."
"Aha, I thought so," I smugly proclaim, straightening my back with
pride, smiling into the Ultimate Deity's cold, stormy eyes.
[My Randolph]
Zeus leans closer. I shiver ecstatically, He is that handsome. (Or
maybe this throne in which I'm seated is wired for electricity.)
He chooses His next words carefully: "But...there is just one
important aspect to all this, that seems to elude you."
"Okay, I'll bite. What?"
"No one really has to believe in Me OR Jesus. But if he doesn't, then
he MUST believe in one particular person above all others."
I am delightfully shocked at this declaration. "Oh?" I query. "And
who..."
He abruptly presses a glorious finger to my lips. The salt is sweet!
His scent: like tangerine musk. I drool.
"Hush, this is important! Allow me to complete my thought." Zeus takes
a moment to clear his throat (and the clouds gather, the skies rumble,
lightning bolts flash above, angels zip up their robes and swiftly
depart). He puffs up his uber-chest in a piano-grand display ("Oh
Bluto!" swoons Olive Oyl), leans even closer (cool breath cleansing my
face like well-water), then declares:
"And I make NO exceptions to that rule. Absolutely none."
--finis
walksalone
news:479a464f...@amsterdam.newsgroups-download.com
AVR training session, due to the length of posting, no proofreading.
> On Thu, 24 Jan 2008 17:02:33 -0600,
> walks...@dastardly.dirty.deeds.done.dirt.cheap.llc wrote:
>
>>Unfortunately, it appears you are trying to use, probably without your
>>awareness, several logical fallacies to start with.
>
> If you could state these fallacies in particular (say, in a brief
> list), I'd most appreciate it.
http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/
http://onegoodmove.org/fallacy/welcome.htm
There are more sites of course.
>>Apparently you are
>>using a definition of perfect that I am unaware of, commonly referred
>>to as special pleading or special definitions.
> You ought to be aware of such a definition. Certain spiritual
> philosophies include the belief that all is perfect as it now stands.
Just because others believe that, does not make it a valid concept. If
still, a plea for special exception.
> Whatever goes on is MEANT to happen, though we may not understand WHY.
> Perhaps we will with hindsight...and depending on the incident,
Karma is wonderful, for those that accept it.
> hindsight could mean anywhere from a few moments to EONS. While I may
> not agree with this or that religion which incorporates the belief
> that ALL is perfect right now, I DO abide by that one viewpoint.
Suitable for you, and I have no problem with that.
> And haven't you heard the saying, "Nobody's perfect?"
What that has to do with whether or not a god does exist, and is an item of
perfection eludes me. Nor would I be much interested in finding out the
supposed connection.
> THAT is the definition of "perfection" as an admirable--albeit
> impossible--goal. YOUR definition of perfect is a more casual use, as
> in "What a perfect day" or "I got a perfect score on my test". But you
My definition? It would appear to me that your definition is it a casual
usage. Either perfection is perfect or he does not. If a creator entity
is claimed to be perfect, and he would not understand imperfection and
could not do it. And remember, supposedly, according to the revealed gods
of the desert, man is made in his image. Perfection is the only thing that
would be allowed in that case.
> CLAIM to NOT be familiar with those two OTHER definitions I just
> described.
Why would I be familiar with something that does not make sense.
>>Now you're going to tell me that
>>there's a god running around out there, they can use imperfections as
>>a perfection. In other words, in the case of humanity, piss poor
>>design is perfection.
>
> You act as judge and jury to what you deem is and is not "perfect".
Not all, perfection does not beget imperfection, unless, the claimed
perfect entity is not perfect.
> What you call "piss poor design" may indeed serve a higher purpose. A
If you call suffering a higher purpose, so be it. I myself do not.
> purpose which we may not comprehend at the time...but will, with
> hindsight. Maybe the hindsight of a few days, maybe of centuries.
In other words, shut up and put up with it. No thanks. If it does for
you, I have no problem with that either.
>>In the Ordinance Corps, we had what we called the six P.
>>program. Prior planning prevents pis poor performance. The human
>>body and the remainder of the universe shows no indication of that
>>program ever being used.
>
> It does to me! DNA seems like a pretty intelligent program, for
DNA is not a program, and is subject to mutation by rather ordinary means.
Even pure water can cause a mutation by creating a chemical imbalance in a
solution in a strand of DNA. But really, I'm not a biologist, so if you
really want to understand DNA, go talk to some. I'm sure there is a news
group devoted to the subject. Fascinating as it is, I have a neither time
nor inclination to study it. Mythology absorbs my spare time. You may
have to get your news provider to carry that particular group.
> example. The whole map, the entire memory of all life from its very
> beginning contained in a single strand!
&?
>>Actually, no they were not all that different. They, like today's
>>xianity, were easily led by the nose and believed what their fearless
>>leaders told them. Like today's Islamic's & the original followers of
>>Allah, they considered themselves a elect society devoted to the true
>>god. If you are not a member of the in club, you might as well not
>>exist.
>
> They were also desperate times, which made people desperate for hope,
Indeed, it's historical that when times are bad enough, a new mythology
will be formulated in that region.
> and highly gullible. Xianity is nothing more than the theft and
> distortion of earlier belief systems. There WERE, however, early Xians
> who DID preach humility and service to their fellow men. I'm not
Of course there were, does not a preacher preach charity. It doesn't work
very good, he still has to have a side job unless he is employed by one of
the mega-churches.
> speaking of the general populace, as you are, but of the occasional
> exceptions to the rule of "human nature" (meaning greed and
> gullibility).
As well as decency and compassion.
> But it's not important to me to argue the pros and cons of various
> forms of Xianity. You can denounce it all you want, doesn't bother me
Why would I denounce it? I can do something even worse than that, I can
provide the history, the concepts, and the false claims made by it. As a
regular diet, I do not do these things. For certain individuals that like
to pretend they are so knowledgeable about their mythology, I do not mind.
It's almost like performing a public service at times.
> in the least. Humanity never needed another religion, and it would be
> NO loss should Xianity disappear from our planet.
Or any other mythology. There is a problem with that, if it was to occur
instantaneously. What would replace the invisible friend?
> I am a student of world religions and world views, among other
> subjects. I take an anthropological stance, along with philosophical.
And I study mythologies, the foundations in history there of. Though by no
means a professional, says the journey was began, I have come to a better
understanding of my fellow human beings. Philosophy, I'll leave that to
people that want unanswerable questions that make no sense to me. In the
US, a doctorate in philosophy is a great way to obtain a job asking, do you
want fries with that.
>>I consider them less than an ideal design, much better suited to
>>somebody or something that walks around on four legs rather than two
>>legs like humans do. Like the human eye, there are better ways to
>>have done it in the beginning. But evolution explains the problems
>>quite well.
>
> Humanity has the great destiny to ultimately reshape itself, both
> physcially and mentally. The keys to existence will eventually be
Has it, or does it have enough courage to do that?
> handed to us, as nature's greatest gift. If the creator left nothing
> for us to criticize, or be unhappy about, there'd be no room for us to
> PARTICIPATE in creation.
According to the revealed gods of the desert, your purchase patient is not
required or desired. Nor am I aware of any other mythology, that requests
or requires the input of humanity in its as destiny. Though I am aware of
several mythologies that have a council of the gods to determine what is
going to happen with humanity and in humanity's lives. Mesopotamia had
more than one of those.
> I see NOTHING wrong with your outrage, your criticism. In fact, I'm
What outrage, I'm a making a simple conservation. Granted, there medium is
the hardest to get a feeling for what the other person is saying or why
they are saying it, but long ago, I gave up my outrage, because like hate,
in day-to-day life is useless.
> sure God is proud of you for your honest appraisal...MUCH prouder than
> he'd be over some simpering, religion-repressed dufus!
I doubt Ahone, considers the question, one way or the other. Nor do I
believe Tate is interested in your conclusions. Maybe you to some other
god in mind?
>>>surgeon does not...he sees human insides as a glorious miracle of
>>>nature.
>>
>>I've never had one described them that way.
>
> Perhaps you need to include more friends in your life that are
> intelligent! I know I do, but it sure is HARD trying to shove away all
> the idiots that stand between us.
I'm rather picky about who I called friend, and I'm not real liberal to a
call a social accordance. My life is full enough that I don't need a
multitude of people to associate and mixed with. Not to mention, I'm
located in the southeastern United States, which is not exactly considered
an intellectual reservoir of the world.
>>Then that particular god is not one worthy of adoration or worship.
> Understanding how you PERCEIVE reality, I can easily grasp your take
> on this matter. No, of course not. Under your set of values, such a
> God is NOT worthy.
Worse, lacks evidence. Something I noticed since I studied mythology,
there is equal evidence for every god ever claimed by humanity. None.
> But obviously I have a DIFFERENT understanding of the purpose behind
> these ugly/unfair situations you clearly describe. To me, God is like
> a drill sergeant, who know you joined the Marines because you wanna be
> THE BEST. What does being "best" imply? It means you'll be run through
> ROUGHER boot camp than your average soldier, and expected to bear MORE
> difficulities with LESS--scratch that, NO--whining whatsoever.
Bite your tongue, I was a professional noncom in the United States Army. I
made it to the senior ranks much to my surprise. I have danced with the
elephant, and whenever the United States Army wanted me to go to Asia, I
knew I was going to encounter some interesting times.
> So the sergeant UNDERSTANDS perfectly, if sometimes you wanna choke
> him to death, and stomp all over him. In fact, he'd prefer you DIRECT
> all your anger and frustrations at him, the REAL cause of your pain,
> than to strike out at innocent passersby.
Your analogy does not work. Drill sergeants are known to exist, gods are
not.
> But because the sergeant knows the ultimate REWARDS and PERFECTION of
> your spirit that shall result for your long-suffering under incredible
> hardship and against many odds...he will NEVER hesistate from, or
> soften, the TOUGH training that he hopes you'll see through till the
> final test.
Why would a god need to test me? Especially one of the gods from the
revealed gods of the desert's trilogy? Remember, they know everything,
according to the believers. And according to their holy writs, their
knowledge is infallible. Apparently, we are not discussing those
particular gods even though this is a xian group, I am posting from. If
you're thinking of discussing something like dietist god, wrong attributes.
>>From
>>the cancers that leaves small children, adults, as well as the elderly
>>screaming for mercy, to the quiet debilitating diseases such as
>>diabetes, to the extreme diseases such as Ebola, the human body should
>>have been designed against those things.
>
> I already explained (in Part 2 of NeoPositivity) how these EXTREMES of
> suffering are an illusion. You can throw all the examples you want at
> me, but the same rule applies to them all.
I spent three years in Vietnam, don't hand me that crap about suffering
being an illusion.
>>So if you are saying that
>>my aching back is not the results of my having made money for my
>>family a breaking horses at five dollars a head, I'm going to say,
>>sure, now go ahead and pull the other one. The human body can't
>>accept only so much abuse before it starts to hurt you back, and I
>>exceed my limits.
>
> I didn't say God doesn't push the envelope with each of us, regarding
> how much suffering is metered out. To each individual, we may go
> through trials of fire where it SEEMS like we just can't take it any
> more, we're gonna BREAK.
In other words, your gods are sadistic. Thank you.
> Each person differs in how much suffering one can bear, and in which
> KIND of suffering.
Which is totally useless, and without merit. If, as it is the case claimed
by those that followed the revealed gods of the desert, we are made in
their gods image, such conduct is unnecessary. If on the other hand,
you're gods are like the Galla of Mesopotamian mythology, then your claims
make some sense. You see, the Galla are demons, which are of course minor
gods. Are you sure you want everyone to suspect that your god is a demon.
That is hostile to humanity, or like the Hebrew Bible's Satan. A god doing
the bidding of the primary god?
>>Now, it
>>has turn to tell me all about it, and compared to many around me, I
>>have no aches or pains. On the personal level, the only time I pay
>>attention to a pain is when it is missing. Between rheumatism and a
>>spavined back, fading eyesight, knees, hips & ankles that are shot, I
>>know what perfection is not.
>
> Your drill sergeant has BIG plans for you, indeed! There is a kernel
No, he does not. Absentee drill sergeants are like absentee gods, matters
of no concern. Now, if you can provide evidence for your drill sergeant,
who is also a deity, I for one would be interested. If not, I see no
reason to waste my time.
> of truth in that saying, "God must love you very much." For he ONLY
> brings extraordinary suffering to those from whom he expects
Which is a copout for explaining why bad things happen to good people, or
good people suffer more than bad people. It's called special pleading,
because you have no evidence to support your case.
> GREATNESS. You do not know my brand of suffering; suffice it to say
> I've conquered borderline schizophrenia and manic-depression with NO
> drugs whatsoever. (Well, marijuana has been a great healing aid, when
> I could afford it, which is not very often.) I've had TERRIBLE bouts
> with insanity, with NO ONE to guide or support me...in fact, it would
> draw enemies to me, who'd HECKLE and HARASS me, in hopes it woud put
> me over the edge, permanently!
And life goes on. You're not the only one as it happened to, or even a
worst-case. There are people who have had it worse than you and will
continue to have the worst thing you ever have. It's called life. Also
known as shit happens.
> What is the reward for such long-suffering? For one, it has given me a
> great spirit, the gift of writing and speaking, incredible insight, a
> WONDERFUL lover, about whom you can read in this book I recently wrote
> about him:
That's nice, what does it have to do with the existence of a god de facto
instead of imaginary?
snip
Has nothing to do with the subject, in so far as I can see.
I have a limited amount of time to waste on Usenet, so if you're looking
for somebody to banter and chatter with, I fear, I am not the one. You
might look of one John Weatherly, he certainly has enough time on his hands
according to this posting history and volume. It's quite possible. The
depth of the subject you're trying to approach is beyond him. Still,
you'll never know if you don't try.
walksalone, who is shutting down the end of the conversation, I don't see
going anywhere, nor do I see its relevance to the newsgroup I am posting
from.
Thy fear is set in all the lands by reason of thy perfect love, and they
cry out to thy name making it the first of names, and all people make
offerings to thee. Thou art the lord who art commemorated in heaven and
upon earth.
Hymn to Osiris